Putting clutch cover back on

[p.dath]

After binning my bike recently I had to take the clutch cover off and have a minor weld done to it (had a tiny hole in it). That's part is sorted. But I have a few questions about putting it back on (have never done it before and are of meagre mechanical skills).

It had a gasket on it. I'm starting to get the impression getting a new gasket might take a little while. How important is it to get a gasket, as opposed to using one of those "gasket goo" substances I see?

Do you need to do the bolts that hold the clutch cover on to a certain torque, or is "tight" fine?

While the clutch cover has been off I've kept the exposed area covered up with a cloth to try and prevent any foreign debry from getting in. Do you do anything special to make sure it is clean, or just give it a bit of a wipe with a clean cloth?

[quickbuck]

Okay,
Firstly, get a new gasket, or make one out of proper gasket paper.
You do this by getting the cover and running a bit of oil around it, and stamping the shape into the gasket paper.
Then you punch out the holes with wad punches.... Easy, if you have the tools.

Now, doing up the bolts.... Make sure if there are longer ones (Can't remember on the CBR myself) that you put them in the right place!
Do them up evenly in a criss cross pattern. Do Not do them up too tight. Just firm out of a standard 8mm spanner. If in doubt, find the torque, and borrow a torque wrench.

Make sure there is no foreign objects under the cover, but a little dust and grit, although not desirable, won't really matter.
Sometimes bigger flakes of metal out of your gearbox or clutch end up in the oil system on it's way to the filter.

[CookMySock]

No don't use gasket goo. Try and reuse the original gasket if you are able. Even if you ripped it, try and put it back on and see if it leaks.

Failing that, make one as qb suggests. I wouldn't be using oil on it though. Buy some gasket paper from repco and simply plonk the cover on the gasket paper, hold it down tight with something, and slice around it with the box cutter knife. The inside isn't toooo critical, so you don't need to slice it real accurately around the edge. You will need to find some way to do the bolt holes.

Assemble it absolutely clean and dry. Degrease surfaces with meths or similar. One side of the paper will tend to stick - put this side towards the cover, away from the engine. Sit all the bolts in place and arrange them so they look the same length, and then spin them ALL in finger-tight. They should spin right down and touch the cover. If one is tight before it contacts then you have the wrong bolt in the wrong hole - rearrange and try again.

You don't need a torque wrench. Use a little 1/4" drive socket set and use the following technique ;

Put the correct socket on the short extension and use it like a screwdriver. Tighten them all up in a criss-cross fashion as tight as you can using only the socket and extension without using the ratchet handle.

Now attach the ratchet handle and tighten a stage further in a criss-cross fashion. Use only one hand. Do not use both hands on the ratchet handle. Do not put your thumb out on the end of the ratchet handle to brace and amplify torque. Wrap your thumb around the handle next to your fingers. This limits your torque. Keep tightening until its nice and snug.

Consider stopping tightening at this point. It's just a little side cover - it's not like its holding the bloody swingarm on or anything. ;)

If you must go tighter, then be it on your own head. Use only one hand, and wrap your fingers around the handle and brace your thumb against the ratchet part of the tool, and tweak everything ONCE - EIGHTH TURN absolute max, and then walk away from it and don't touch it. But seriously, covers don't need to be this tight.

Never at any time put two hands on that ratchet spanner.

Steve

[onearmedbandit]

Why wouldn't you use oil to mark out the gasket shape DB?

[firefighter]

I have a torque wrench you could use.

If your going to do that much work on your bike and be that self sufficient getting one is'nt all that expensive and a real good way to ensure piece of mind.

[p.dath]

I have a torque wrench, but don't know what setting I should be tightening the bolts to, but the comments from DB I think are good enough. I'll aim to make all the bolts "firm".

[vifferman]

Remember the bolts are small, and they're going into aluminium alloy - very easy to strip threads. As longas they're tight enough to not come undone by themselves, and evenly tensioned so the cover sits flat, you'll be fine.
If the original gasket is torn, you can get away with just putting a very small smear of gasket sealant/goop just where the tear is, and leave the rest alone.

[dogsnbikes]

PD Just to confuse you even more... if your making your own gasket,take the old one in as you can get differrent types of gasket paper depending on thickness......

as for making the hole's use a punch either a nail or leather one......gasket cement is always handy too I use holts,and you dont need too use alot,best to apply with a artist paint brush(small)

and as Vifferman said you can use a silicon hi temp gasket goo,

[p.dath]

I didn't really expect to have trouble getting a new gasket, so I didn't make a very big effort to save the old one. I'll have to take another look at seeing if I can still salvage it. If I can't get a new gasket in a reasonable period of time I'll make one out of gasket paper (and take some of the old gasket in to make sure I have the same kind of paper (thanks dogsnbikes).

I've noted DB's comments about cleaning the surfaces with meths or something similar to make sure they are clean. So basically I slap the paper gasket in, and bolt it up in a criss cross until everything is firm. And I don't need to put any other substances on the gasket.

Amazing paper those gaskets.

[Tony.OK]

Don't need a gasket for clutch cover.......its not running high oil pressure in there.

Threadbond gasket cement does the job fine, just make sure the mating surfaces are clean.

8 or so pounds on the torque wrench but only if its a 1/4" drive, bigger wrenches go that low but aren't accurate and have too much leverage.

[Squiggles]

If I can't get a new gasket in a reasonable period of time I'll make one out of gasket paper (and take some of the old gasket in to make sure I have the same kind of paper (thanks dogsnbikes).

http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php/116372-CBR600-F1-F2-Parts-250RR-Clutch-cover-Freebies

[quickbuck]

Why wouldn't you use oil to mark out the gasket shape DB?


That's what I was wondering.... the whole of DB's post.... After all, what exactly does this cover contain????

As for the rest of the post. Well, it is a good explination on how to tighten things up for somebody who doesn't know how, from a man with obvious first hand experience on how not to do it... ;)

[quickbuck]

Don't need a gasket for clutch cover.......its not running high oil pressure in there.

Threadbond gasket cement does the job fine, just make sure the mating surfaces are clean.

8 or so pounds on the torque wrench but only if its a 1/4" drive, bigger wrenches go that low but aren't accurate and have too much leverage.

Umm Tony,
The gasket also prevents two surfaces contacting each other. We are talking two metals here that may not be exactly the same spec, so it can set up an area for corrosion to occur.... Got to be pretty sure the cement will be compatible too....
Now, i realise the CBR will not be flying in 50 years time, so it may sound a little anul... But, that is the way I do things when it comes to engines.

As for re-using them... Yup, don't talk to me about that at the moment either :(

[MSTRS]

Get yourself some Hylomar Blue. You'll never need a paper gasket again.

[CookMySock]

Why wouldn't you use oil to mark out the gasket shape DB?If you get oil on the gasket before they're tightened down, they usually always drip oil. It's just not what you are supposed to do. If it was a rubber valve cover gasket and you got oil on it, the damn thing will skid around everywhere and not seal.

Anyway, its piss easy to hold the fucker down and slice around it with the blade. All done in 20 seconds. Hack the middle out later.

As has been observed, there is only crankcase pressure here, so it doesn't need to be full pedant mode turned on.

All he needs, is it not dripping and no bolts broken - not actually that easy for a total newb.


Steve

[quickbuck]

Get yourself some Hylomar Blue. You'll never need a paper gasket again.

This is ALMOST true. Great stuff.... Will probably get some horrid incurable disease in the near future, as the RR Viper 680 (Aermacchi MB339 CB Engine) used the stuff in quite a few places..... and I used to have it on my fingers on a regular basis.....

Thing is though, a few bike motors are actually built to quite a high tolerance, that a missing gasket or two can lead to a bit of interference of some components.
I am not pulling the wizzer here. We had a 4 wheeler that a customer has reassembled without gaskets, and the darn thing wouldn't go to well. Yup, spinning parts actually contacting the stationary cases as they were 50 thou or so closer!

[Squiggles]

This is ALMOST true. Great stuff.... Will probably get some horrid incurable disease in the near future, as the RR Viper 680 (Aermacchi MB339 CB Engine) used the stuff in quite a few places..... and I used to have it on my fingers on a regular basis.....

Think is though, a few bike motors are actually built to quite a high tolerance, that a missing gasket or two can lead to a bit of interference of some components.
I am not pulling the wizzer here. We had a 4 wheeler that a customer has reassembled without gaskets, and the darn thing wouldn't go to well. Yup, spinning parts actually contacting the stationary cases as they were 50 thou or so closer!

Had that with a CX500 missing the gasket at the back of the crankcase, wouldn't shift properly... cant remember what it was but something was binding!

[quickbuck]

Had that with a CX500 missing the gasket at the back of the crankcase, wouldn't shift properly... cant remember what it was but something was binding!
Yup, it would be something like the shift shaft used a boss in the housing to be located.
When it was all bolted up without a gaslet, it would move squeeze the shaft up too much.....

Funny, the 4 wheeler I mentioned was a Honda too......

[The Stranger]

After binning my bike recently I had to take the clutch cover off and have a minor weld done to it (had a tiny hole in it). That's part is sorted. But I have a few questions about putting it back on (have never done it before and are of meagre mechanical skills).

It had a gasket on it. I'm starting to get the impression getting a new gasket might take a little while. How important is it to get a gasket, as opposed to using one of those "gasket goo" substances I see?

Do you need to do the bolts that hold the clutch cover on to a certain torque, or is "tight" fine?

While the clutch cover has been off I've kept the exposed area covered up with a cloth to try and prevent any foreign debry from getting in. Do you do anything special to make sure it is clean, or just give it a bit of a wipe with a clean cloth?

I wait with bated breath.

[p.dath]

Get yourself some Hylomar Blue. You'll never need a paper gasket again.

Just read up on this stuff. It sounds amazing.

Do you coat the first metal surface, apply the gasket, then coat the other surface before pushing it together?

[MSTRS]

Point taken about tolerances...
To use the stuff, though, lightly smear on ALL surfaces that are going to touch...wait until it tacks off...fit the parts and bolt up. Done.

[onearmedbandit]

If you get oil on the gasket before they're tightened down, they usually always drip oil. It's just not what you are supposed to do.


Steve

In all the times I've done it, seen my brother (A Grade Mechanic with his own sucessful business) do it, observed others do it, I've never witnessed one drip. But fair enough.

[CookMySock]

In all the times I've done it, seen my brother (A Grade Mechanic with his own sucessful business) do it, observed others do it, I've never witnessed one drip. But fair enough.Ok. A Grade mechanics are bound my little concerns such as making money for the boss, saving customers money where they can, and not breaking things - it's just a business reality. A customer complaining about a weepy gasket six months down the track can safely be ignored.

I have an engine that has the stator cover removed and refitted with the old gasket while it was sopping wet with oil. I wiped it down afterwards and its not leaking and I don't lose sleep over it at night. In time I bet it will weep though, and I'll be wiping that area with a rag before I wash it and then I'll wish I hadn't.

I also have an engine with a reused (laminated steel) head gasket (air cooled! no water jacket!) and it will probably weep before long.

The dry-fit method is just gold-plating pedanticism I'd use at home because I don't charge myself an hourly rate, so I gold-plate if I have the parts or if I'm in the mood.

Steve

[p.dath]

I got my cover back today from the engineers today and they have done such a good job I'm going to name them - Bruger Engineering on Barry's Point Rd in Takapuna, Auckland.

They welded back up the aluminium hole, but I also asked if they could do something to make it look "prettier" (as it had a lot of scratches on it). I have to say, they have done a great job! It really exceeded my expectations. And the price was very reasonable.

I think they are actually marine engineers, but I guess they are used to working with aluminium.

I don't know if they filled in the little scratches, or push polished them out, but either way it looks much better. You can still tell it doesn't look "stock", but the way they have polished it you might think from a distance that it came that way.

[CookMySock]

So bolt the fucker on already and let us know how you got on. ;)

Steve

[p.dath]

So bolt the fucker on already and let us know how you got on. ;)

Steve

I decided to be patient. I have the proper gasket coming in from Japan. About $20 from memory. Hopefully it will be here within the next two weeks. With my lack of skill if I try and "rescue" the old gasket or cut a new gasket I'll probably end up with a leaking mess of oil. Next thing it'll be on my back wheel, and I'll be making another similar post ...


When I originally started riding I didn't know anything about it, or even anyone else who even had a motorcycle. I just thought "that's a bit of me", got the BHS and started figuring it out (this was quite some time ago). Learning to ride on your own is a shit way of doing it. Wouldn't recommend it to anyone.
Anyway, have that sorted now. Have people I can turn to with lots more experience than me, and found training systems like ART and RRRS. My riding has improved more in the last 12 months than all the other time I've been riding.

But back to my original thought. Working on my bike very much has the same feeling as when I tried learning to ride way back then. I've tried asking around about basic servicing classes, but I couldn't find any that existed.

Maybe I should find a mechanical mentor.

[CookMySock]

With my lack of skill if I try and "rescue" the old gasket or cut a new gasket I'll probably end up with a leaking mess of oil. Next thing it'll be on my back wheel, and I'll be making another similar post ...Nah you worry too much. You're working on a bike, not a nuclear weapon. There's no rocket science.

You can easily boof the cover back on and torque it down, wipe the oil off, degrease and re-wipe, and warm the bike and see what's up with it. Idle it for a full ten mins, and then a quiet ride around the block. If there's no seepage after that, it is really unlikely to piss it all over your back tyre in horrific fashion etc.

Theres really only one rule, and that's "take your time - think - dont break anything." As long as things are fitted nice and square and flat, and a corner is not hooked up on something, you have the right bolts in the right holes, and you torque down evenly, theres not a lot to go wrong. That's famous last words of course, coz shit does go wrong, but hey thats par for the course, and some of us are more prone than others. Ok, so there's lots of other rules too.. :laugh:

It's important to know when to stop. "Right, this is out of my league", and either stop and look at it for a day, or ask advice here, or have someone experienced glance at it for you, or all of the above. If no one will touch it or offer advice, then it's either bike shop time, or "you're on your own - trailblaze it" time - up to you. I had an automatic trans go belly up at a critical time and no one could touch it for ten days - so against all odds I pulled the fucker out and fixed it myself. Sometimes you just bite the bullet and do it.

If you have a great trading/other relationship with just one bike shop, the possibly they will give you technical advice, but that is not usually done.



When I originally started riding I didn't know anything about it, or even anyone else who even had a motorcycle. I just thought "that's a bit of me", got the BHS and started figuring it out (this was quite some time ago). Learning to ride on your own is a shit way of doing it. Wouldn't recommend it to anyone. Anyway, have that sorted now. Have people I can turn to with lots more experience than me, and found training systems like ART and RRRS. My riding has improved more in the last 12 months than all the other time I've been riding.

But back to my original thought. Working on my bike very much has the same feeling as when I tried learning to ride way back then. I've tried asking around about basic servicing classes, but I couldn't find any that existed. Maybe I should find a mechanical mentor.Yep, you are right at the same position now with your mechanical work, but as you observe, with the right support, in 12 months time from now you will be an order of magnitude ahead. Either that, or you will be a complete fuckup haha.

That you are still considering this after your recent sump plug episode speaks volumes, so don't give up. :niceone:

Steve

[p.dath]

Yep, you are right at the same position now with your mechanical work, but as you observe, with the right support, in 12 months time from now you will be an order of magnitude ahead. Either that, or you will be a complete fuckup haha.

That you are still considering this after your recent sump plug episode speaks volumes, so don't give up. :niceone:


Lets just say that when I bought my current bike I didn't get one with pristine body work, as I was expecting a few hickups along the way.

Might wonder down to Repco then and buy some gasket paper.

[neels]

Is there anybody near you that makes gaskets? In chch we have a place where you can take in the old gasket and they make a new one for you while you wait, it costs bugger all.

If you're reasonably mechanically competent then all you really need is some good tools, if you have a manual then follow the instructions, and if something won't work stop and think before you try and force it or get a bigger hammer out.

I was trying to weld a new sidestand bracket on my trail bike the other day & couldn't get a decent weld on it, thought my welder wasn't up to the job until a mate came over, tweaked a few things & had the job done in 5 minutes. Don't be afraid to get something done by somebody more skilled than yourself, it can save you a lot of grief later.

[p.dath]

Just as a final follow up for this thread, I finished re-assembling everything on my bike this week. Everything seems to be running well, and after a week there is no signs of any leaks, so I think I have managed to get everything back together. No left over bits. That's always a good sign.
No stripped threads or anything either. :)

Had one funny instance. After assembling everything back together I went to start it for the first time. Dead. Nothing. I had the foot stand off and a few other bits and pieces as well while I was working on something else. Had to remove one earth lead as well. Instantly my mind starting thinking of the possibly more complex problems. Had I broken the foot stand switch or something. Bad earthing?
Took a breath, and thought better check the obvious things first. Key on. Check. Kill switch in run position. Doh. Then I remembered I had engaged the kill switch just to make double sure there was no way the engine would get turned over by accident.

So thanks for all the help people. Been a steep learning curve (going from zero to almost zero knowledge). After putting everything back together, slow as I was, I feel more capable of doing basic mechanical things on the bike now.