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erix
13th October 2007, 00:34
We've been through the Symonds St issues before. I'll restate it again.

First of all, theft is out of the equation. You're quite right. Public parking has no responsibility to protect your bike from theft, I'm sorry.

However Symonds St is bad. It's dangerous -- you may not have heard of anybody being hit, but I tell you now, it is only a matter of time before some guy gets squashed backing into a park, or turning right up towards Newton. Compared to Alfred St or Princes St it is stupid.

But most importantly there's the problem of capacity. Since Alfred St was closed, we have substantially less parking. Extra parks on Symonds St were opened, but they have not even come close to covering what was lost, and as summer rolls out and people get back onto their bikes, there's going to be a massive crisis in terms of parking availability. Already in winter we had many times where Symonds St was at capacity.

Good point! We really should do something before any of our feller rider being hit by the busy traffic on Symonds st. We should raise our voice before any bad thing happen to one of us. Using "happened accident" to convince the stupid people is really not worth it! Any one got any suggestion?

I will say state the issue in formal writing with every uni riders' support (by signing it) and send it to uni and council regularly (I seriously doubt 1 formal complains is enough for those people to really looking into the problem)

boomer
13th October 2007, 00:42
bloody lettuce eaters,, you want everything don't ya??? and for free!

move to bloody Dunedin if you don't like city life and be grateful you have free parking in central city....


harden up ya bunch of bloody lesbians

Squiggles
13th October 2007, 00:44
i like lesbians.

boomer
13th October 2007, 00:46
i like lesbians.

me too.. but like everything they have there place;

Students should stop sucking on the tit of society and eat meat!

Squiggles
13th October 2007, 00:51
Students should stop sucking tit and eat meat!

Riiiiiiight.... :blink:





:lol:

xwhatsit
13th October 2007, 13:34
I, for one, do not want to stop sucking the lesbian's tit.

Boomer, you can stick to eating man-meat.

Phurrball
13th October 2007, 17:21
me too.. but like everything they have there place;

Students should stop sucking on the tit of society and eat meat!

Nyeh! let me put it this way -

Would you really like all those precious tax-payer dollars you've put into my head and spent on surgeries in the public health system wasted because some blind retarded muppet with extra digits and chromosomes mows me down while I'm parking?

The traffic volumes in Dunnos are hardly comparable, but there's fark all bike parking around Otago university as I recall - as for going there, I did for a year or two, and it's a better university all-round than Auckland - but Auckland is its equal for teaching quality.

The issue is that both the council and Auckland University are very short sighted re planning and provision for bikes and scooters in the city - daft seeing as they'd both benefit from lessened congestion in the Auckland CBD...

(Oh, hang on, I forgot that the council likes to rape cars in town and especially round university with parking fines...damn...)

motorbyclist
16th October 2007, 16:02
Students should stop sucking on the tit of society and eat meat!

excuse me? who do you think will end up paying the most in taxes once they're sitting in the higher tax brackets?

who's going to supply everyone else with jobs?

and if wasn't for engineers, you wouldn't even have that bike, nor this forum.

then of course, by subsidising fees the govt makes it easier for people to pay for uni. that way we can all get a fair shot at it, and when we start working we don't have to charge you as much to cover our student loan.
now i'm not saying uni should be free again, cause then you get timewasters, but atleast providing safe parking for those who aren't contributing to auckland's chronic conjestion. actually, it might pay to note that they did infact supply that parking - they just took it from us for no real reason.


seriously, think about it. there's a reason the govt pays alot of our fees. it's called return on investment.

if your parking was stripped from you and you were forced to park in a dangerous place and manner, provided you can find a park, and then get a $200 ticket for not having a wof you have clearly displayed, i bet you'd be complaining too!

boomer
16th October 2007, 16:58
excuse me? who do you think will end up paying the most in taxes once they're sitting in the higher tax brackets?

who's going to supply everyone else with jobs?

and if wasn't for engineers, you wouldn't even have that bike, nor this forum.

do what.. you need to be a full time lettuce eater to become a qualified engineer or pay higher taxes..?? pllllleeeeeeeeeease. and the decently educated people who attend Uni go overseas to work...

anyhows, stop ya whinning and htf up... i never ate lettuce and i a) pay faaaar too much tax's b) never went to Uni and C) was that engineer you talk about... so no.. you don't have to have salad to eat ya cake ;)





if your parking was stripped from you and you were forced to park in a dangerous place and manner, provided you can find a park, and then get a $200 ticket for not having a wof you have clearly displayed, i bet you'd be complaining too!


No.. i'd find another job; pointless wahahing. Want something.. then do something about it.. complainingg is for vegetarians and tree huggers :bye:

motorbyclist
16th October 2007, 17:09
do what.. you need to be a full time lettuce eater to become a qualified engineer or pay higher taxes..?? pllllleeeeeeeeeease. and the decently educated people who attend Uni go overseas to work...

anyhows, stop ya whinning and htf up... i never ate lettuce and i a) pay faaaar too much tax's b) never went to Uni and C) was that engineer you talk about... so no.. you don't have to have salad to eat ya cake ;)


A:we all pay far to much taxes, but things like police, education and health are things worth paying for. "cultural enrichment" is a bit more arguable, along with generations of families on the dole

B: i can tell

C: beleive it or not, without qualified engineers, and other professions, the world would not be where it is today. as fun as serfdom was back before industrialisation, i think education is a good thing.



No.. i'd find another job; pointless wahahing. Want something.. then do something about it.. complainingg is for vegetarians and tree huggers :bye:
and what if you enjoyed your job, what if finding another would mean moving to some hole down south (or the hole up north in your case) and getting paid less?
we are doing something about it

when is that bronz meeting with the council anyway?


and what the hell do you mean by "lettuce eater"?

bomma
16th October 2007, 17:40
anyhows, stop ya whinning and htf up... i never ate lettuce and i a) pay faaaar too much tax's b) never went to Uni and C) was that engineer you talk about... so no.. you don't have to have salad to eat ya cake

:clap: well said mate, well said

"htf up"...lets examine that for a second....so you are telling us to "htf up" about being stopped perpendicular to traffic while trying to manoveur our bikes backwards into slots that are just big enough....my advice is..stay in dunedin and be glad you dont have to put up with the shit we do up here....you have no idea what traffic is friend so "stf up"

your lack of university education is prevalent in your argument, which seems to be based on the three points that you have stated.

firstly, everyone thinks they pay "faaaar too much tax's" but the fact remains that the one's who are likely to go on to provide extensive returns by way of taxes to this country's pitiful economy are us, students. so it would be in their best interests to keep us safe, ensure that we finish our studies and hopefully retain our skills.

secondly, you never went to uni.....boo-fucking-hoo, then you have no right to comment mate as you have no idea about the stresses involved in being a student. it's not all "party party party". the blue-collar worker is a diminishing species and it is us, studied and cognitively-able persons that are the future of this country, nay this world.

thirdly, you are not the engineer that motorbycyclist speaks of. the last (and probably only) thing you produced was probably brown and was flushed down the toilet.

stay down south mate. we'll make sure the human race advances and you can complain and be an anchor for the rest of your life.

cheers.

oh and some of the greatest people in history would probably be considered by your standards to be "tree-huggers" and "lettuce-eaters" (whatever the hell the latter means). puts things in perspective huh?

EDIT: You must be short lil fucker too if you never ate your vegies :lol: obviously you've never heard of the nutrients that are provided by nature's own

boomer
16th October 2007, 17:45
hook line and sinker...


and for the record I'm a qualified Radio Engineer, have managed specialists in the field and can proudly say that more than likely the radio Network you and the other blood sucking students text continuously on was built and managed by this 'southerner' ;) and if you ever travel to england the same can be said there.. :rolleyes:

ps.. something No kiwi can/could manage.. hence my specialist Visa

bomma
16th October 2007, 18:11
hook line and sinker...


and for the record I'm a qualified Radio Engineer, have managed specialists in the field and can proudly say that more than likely the radio Network you and the other blood sucking students text continuously on was built and managed by this 'southerner' ;) and if you ever travel to england the same can be said there.. :rolleyes:

ps.. something No kiwi can/could manage.. hence my specialist Visa

lol so you're replacing all the young talent leaving this country?? i agree that's pretty cool, surprised you moved to this country of all places tho....

still, im sticking to my guns. there are over 300 bikers at uni who are at risk of having their bike stolen or worse, getting taken out while trying to park their bikes, each of whom have untold potential. chances are some will end up in a specialist position in a decent company in just a few years, much the same as you.....the only way to preserve this is to ensure their safety.

p.s. you think too highly of yourself mate....who discovered the atom?? who opposed the world's superbike producers and hand-built a bike from scratch?? who founded McLaren, one of the most successful formula 1 teams in history?? who's gonna win the rugby world cup this year?? .........well not so much the last one but the rest all point toward the kiwis :)

Toaster
16th October 2007, 18:17
hook line and sinker...


and for the record I'm a qualified Radio Engineer, have managed specialists in the field and can proudly say that more than likely the radio Network you and the other blood sucking students text continuously on was built and managed by this 'southerner' ;) and if you ever travel to england the same can be said there.. :rolleyes:

ps.. something No kiwi can/could manage.. hence my specialist Visa

Certainly was hook line and sinker! Funny how these kids assume you have no education. Seems a silly conclusion for someone who purports to be educated aye.

With all these interest free loans these kids get (which we pay for) I am sure they can afford to hire a park.

I had to pay my own way through Uni and flatting and pay back the loan with interest. They have no idea how generous they get it now.

bomma
16th October 2007, 18:30
Certainly was hook line and sinker! Funny how these kids assume you have no education. Seems a silly conclusion for someone who purports to be educated aye.

With all these interest free loans these kids get (which we pay for) I am sure they can afford to hire a park.

I had to pay my own way through Uni and flatting and pay back the loan with interest. They have no idea how generous they get it now.

and its funny how these adults assume that us students with our "interest free loans" get by without TAX-PAYING jobs.....what you think our bank balance gets topped up by our parents every week??

and the loan isnt a gift. once we're outta uni, we do have to pay it back WITH interest (doubt that piece of legislation is gonna last very long once government changes)

and i didnt assume anything. he said he never went to uni which, due to societal norms, means he is less-educated than me or any other uni-student. experience and age count for a lot and i NEVER said i was smarter or more knowledgable, just more educated.

its funny you say that we have it easier coz the way i see it, society now demands that we hold a degree of some sort to be eligible to even APPLY for a half-decent position and be taken seriously. this wasnt a requirement even 20 years ago....somehow, i dont think adding an extra 3 years of compulsory study just for a shitty entry-level job is making things any easier.....

boomer
16th October 2007, 18:47
and its funny how these adults assume that us students with our "interest free loans" get by without TAX-PAYING jobs.....what you think our bank balance gets topped up by our parents every week??

and the loan isnt a gift. once we're outta uni, we do have to pay it back WITH interest (doubt that piece of legislation is gonna last very long once government changes)

and i didnt assume anything. he said he never went to uni which, due to societal norms, means he is less-educated than me or any other uni-student. experience and age count for a lot and i NEVER said i was smarter or more knowledgable, just more educated.

its funny you say that we have it easier coz the way i see it, society now demands that we hold a degree of some sort to be eligible to even APPLY for a half-decent position and be taken seriously. this wasnt a requirement even 20 years ago....somehow, i dont think adding an extra 3 years of compulsory study just for a shitty entry-level job is making things any easier.....

your wrong there mate.. on 2 accounts. Firstly i left school 20 years ago with 1 O level returnd to college to get a few more and then a diplma or two. couldn't get a job unless you had qualifications so i got pissed for a year in spain; the entry into qualified work/careers is no harder now than it was then or even earlier..

and secondly you say your more educated.... care to show me how you come to that assumtion> you know nothing of my background other than i didn't attend Uni....In my view, Uni's a waste of time and money.


still, we digress.. i was having a dig at the waahin going on about parking; i ride past that college twice a day and the only dangers are those idiots who see fit to try and cross the road without using the lights or crossing...THEY don't seem very smart to me ;)

HungusMaximist
16th October 2007, 18:49
:clap: well said mate, well said

"htf up"...lets examine that for a second....so you are telling us to "htf up" about being stopped perpendicular to traffic while trying to manoveur our bikes backwards into slots that are just big enough....my advice is..stay in dunedin and be glad you dont have to put up with the shit we do up here....you have no idea what traffic is friend so "stf up"

your lack of university education is prevalent in your argument, which seems to be based on the three points that you have stated.

firstly, everyone thinks they pay "faaaar too much tax's" but the fact remains that the one's who are likely to go on to provide extensive returns by way of taxes to this country's pitiful economy are us, students. so it would be in their best interests to keep us safe, ensure that we finish our studies and hopefully retain our skills.

secondly, you never went to uni.....boo-fucking-hoo, then you have no right to comment mate as you have no idea about the stresses involved in being a student. it's not all "party party party". the blue-collar worker is a diminishing species and it is us, studied and cognitively-able persons that are the future of this country, nay this world.

thirdly, you are not the engineer that motorbycyclist speaks of. the last (and probably only) thing you produced was probably brown and was flushed down the toilet.

stay down south mate. we'll make sure the human race advances and you can complain and be an anchor for the rest of your life.

cheers.

oh and some of the greatest people in history would probably be considered by your standards to be "tree-huggers" and "lettuce-eaters" (whatever the hell the latter means). puts things in perspective huh?

EDIT: You must be short lil fucker too if you never ate your vegies :lol: obviously you've never heard of the nutrients that are provided by nature's own

Hahaha this is gold Nish! ! ! !

bomma
16th October 2007, 19:02
your wrong there mate.. on 2 accounts. Firstly i left school 20 years ago with 1 O level returnd to college to get a few more and then a diplma or two. couldn't get a job unless you had qualifications so i got pissed for a year in spain; the entry into qualified work/careers is no harder now than it was then or even earlier..

and secondly you say your more educated.... care to show me how you come to that assumtion> you know nothing of my background other than i didn't attend Uni....In my view, Uni's a waste of time and money.


still, we digress.. i was having a dig at the waahin going on about parking; i ride past that college twice a day and the only dangers are those idiots who see fit to try and cross the road without using the lights or crossing...THEY don't seem very smart to me ;)

im putting this to bed right here

you dont represent the population. simply because your experiences differ to the ones ive stated dont make them universal. i do a management major and i study the history of jobs!!

secondly, take the time to read. you are right, i have no idea about your background other than "you did not go to uni"...there-in lies the basis for my assumption, the basis which you provided.....if someone said "ive never ridden a road bike before" and then proceeded to coach you on how to ride, you would naturally assume that you are a better rider than them.

finally try and park up there on symonds st for a week and then come and tell us that there is no problems with the current state of parking....in fact bring the flashiest bike you own/can get your hands on and park it up on symonds st and ill bet you that some moron in a hoodie and a ute's gonna drive by and try to take off with it....

which brings us back to the topic of this thread.......PARKING SHOULD BE SAFER AND EASIER AT UNI!!! all this waahaaing is simply people expressing thier disgust at the current state of affairs....would you go to a counselling program where abused women talk about their experiences and tell them to "stop waahaaaing and to htf up"??......

oh and for those who ACTUALLY matter and support us in this cause there will be a meeting with Auckland city Council sometime in summer led by Les (pressie of BRONZ) to provide more parking at uni so come along and show your support!!! :2thumbsup

Mom
16th October 2007, 19:07
hook line and sinker...


Skite!..but seriously i agree with you, I am the parent of one about to finish up her degree this year.....I am proud of her, she works hard and deserves all she gets. I have helped her out, with cars, and books, and rent, and fees, and.....but she never demands it, and now never asks for help! :sunny:


Funny how these kids assume you have no education. Seems a silly conclusion for someone who purports to be educated aye.

Now, now Mr Toast they more tout themselves as becoming educated! So they can be the better of us all!!! Personally I have some issues with the way we have leant towards tertiary education being the be all and end all of everything. Too many kids are getting sucked into the "must get a degree" propoganda that is our world today. They need a bit of life to balance the "education" IM(not so)HO!




and i didnt assume anything. he said he never went to uni which, due to societal norms, means he is less-educated than me or any other uni-student. experience and age count for a lot and i NEVER said i was smarter or more knowledgable, just more educated.


And that my dear is where you and I will not agree. What makes you so arrogant that you can say, I am less educated than you. Dont ever dismiss, life experience, job experience, sheer bloody determination to suceed, a thirst for wanting to know more, an open uneducated mind , that is not shut tight with the "norms" that all uni people know for sure. There is an enormous amount of education for you to experience after you leave school.

Call me uneducated if you will, I hold a Nursing Diploma, but am nowhere near as educated as many people I know that left school at 15!

boomer
16th October 2007, 19:15
EDIT: You must be short lil fucker too if you never ate your vegies :lol: obviously you've never heard of the nutrients that are provided by nature's own

I'm gonna jump in on the assumption game if you don't mind; I'm assuming your a short little over weight prik.. just cos you ride a kumandsukmi 700 ;)

am i right.. am i.. am i..??!!!


i agree that's pretty cool, surprised you moved to this country of all places tho....

You have no idea what other countries i've worked in other than NZ.. 'assuming' isn't knowledge mate.. and you'll soon come to learn that NZ is a beautiful place.. but the grass is always greener. .until you cut it.

ps.. buy a bloody lock or chain, if you can afford a bike you can afford some security... stop ya whinning and use the grey matter you were born with!

Luckylegs
16th October 2007, 19:15
which brings us back to the topic of this thread.......PARKING SHOULD BE SAFER AND EASIER AT UNI!!! all this waahaaing is simply people expressing thier disgust at the current state of affairs....would you go to a counselling program where abused women talk about their experiences and tell them to "stop waahaaaing and to htf up"??......

Its free, whats the f _ _ kin problem ? (That is a serious question)

Id love to get free parking... oh wait, I do... thats right... Must be a perk of having a flash job which I didnt get by going to University.


Boomer: Radio Engineer huh ?.... So how do you get the people (and all there gear) in such a small box then ? :rofl:

boomer
16th October 2007, 19:22
Its free, whats the f _ _ kin problem ? (That is a serious question)

Id love to get free parking... oh wait, I do... thats right... Must be a perk of having a flash job which I didnt get by going to University.


Boomer: Radio Engineer huh ?.... So how do you get the people (and all there gear) in such a small box then ? :rofl:

i'm a man of many talents.. i just pretend to be thick .. oh and looking and sounding it helps too :p if you try hard enough you can rearrange the box to fit anything :blink:

Luckylegs
16th October 2007, 19:27
Too many kids are getting sucked into the "must get a degree" propoganda that is our world today.

Shame a few more dont get hooked by the "Join the army, see the world" army propaganda, that'd sort em. You wanna try parking a bike on the streets of baghdad...

Luckylegs
16th October 2007, 19:28
i'm a man of many talents.. i just pretend to be thick .. oh and looking and sounding it helps too :p if you try hard enough you can rearrange the box to fit anything :blink:

Sorry, I saw the words 'Box' and 'Fitting' and it was all over.... What was it you were saying

bomma
16th October 2007, 19:59
And that my dear is where you and I will not agree. What makes you so arrogant that you can say, I am less educated than you.

lol that was the one statement i made with-holding arrogance :mellow: not to blame society but my impression of education might differ to that of yours....education = highest level of study achieved, very simple and very objective.....and as i have also stated, experience does count for a lot!!


I'm gonna jump in on the assumption game if you don't mind; I'm assuming your a short little over weight prik.. just cos you ride a kumandsukmi 700 ;)

am i right.. am i.. am i..??!!!

lol well that just has no basis....i eat my vegies thankyou very much ;) a regular "lettuce-muncher" i am so i can grow up to be big and strong :) and thats a KAWASAKI 750....dunno what kinda bikes you've owned :eek5:


You have no idea what other countries i've worked in other than NZ.. 'assuming' isn't knowledge mate.. and you'll soon come to learn that NZ is a beautiful place.. but the grass is always greener. .until you cut it.

beauty is in the eye of the beholder....being young myself, green and clean doesnt really cut it.....and i frankly am not interested in what other countries you have worked in...i am genuinely surprised you moved to nz.....


ps.. buy a bloody lock or chain, if you can afford a bike you can afford some security... stop ya whinning and use the grey matter you were born with!

and speaking of using the "grey matter you were born with" umm what on symonds st do i chain my bike to?? the non-existent rail?? a chain or lock stops them from rolling off with my bike but what happens when they rock up with a ute and make her airborne?? :bye:


Its free, whats the f _ _ kin problem ? (That is a serious question)

umm are you ACTUALLY serious?? :mellow: so you are telling me that if someone gave you something for free, a product or service, you would use it disregarding any and all safety issues?? have you not understood the REASON we are "waahaaing" for better and SAFER parking around uni??

bomma
16th October 2007, 20:09
Id love to get free parking... oh wait, I do... thats right... Must be a perk of having a flash job which I didnt get by going to University.

just a minor thought but.....isnt it free parking for bikes basically ANYWHERE for ANYONE around town and stuff?? like i can park on the foot-path out of the way of general foot-traffic and it would be free right.....whether i have a flash job or not......right??? ::sweatdrop

i dont wanna get a parking fine coz that would be a pain in da ass :mellow:

Toaster
16th October 2007, 20:12
its funny you say that we have it easier coz the way i see it, society now demands that we hold a degree of some sort to be eligible to even APPLY for a half-decent position and be taken seriously. this wasnt a requirement even 20 years ago....somehow, i dont think adding an extra 3 years of compulsory study just for a shitty entry-level job is making things any easier.....

damn right you need a degree for a shitty entry level job.... do you think you deserve more than that with all your work experience? A degree at least helps to show some form of ability to apply yourself, otherwise employer just sees a snotty nosed young person who usually have way too big an opinion of their knowledge and ability but have no real professional work experience.

bomma
16th October 2007, 20:17
damn right you need a degree for a shitty entry level job.... do you think you deserve more than that with all your work experience? A degree at least helps to show some form of ability to apply yourself, otherwise employer just sees a snotty nosed young person who usually have way too big an opinion of their knowledge and ability but have no real professional work experience.

its so funny you say that (and i completely agree btw) because either way the generation y'ers are stuffed.....if i dropped out and joined the workforce at 17, id be a manager right now somewhere but that's pretty much my career ceiling....when i finish my study, any decent employer will be looking for an experienced and qualified applicant. so for me to get a job, ill need experience, but to get experience i need a job....it truly is a vicious cycle :ar15:

EDIT: oh and i was talkin to my mum's friend the other day who owns a recruitment agency. he reckons that the way most unis are structuring their courses these days are much too theory based. most students (including myself) cram as much as they can goin into exams and the piss up following it ensures that we forget most of it. so although we may (or may not) possess the theoretical knowledge, it wont determine how well we would be able to apply that knowledge in a given situation.

Luckylegs
16th October 2007, 20:19
and speaking of using the "grey matter you were born with" umm what on symonds st do i chain my bike to?? the non-existent rail?? a chain or lock stops them from rolling off with my bike but what happens when they rock up with a ute and make her airborne?? :bye:

Apparently based on what I saw yesterday, (or was it today) around a post box (outside the Gym) I think.


umm are you ACTUALLY serious?? :mellow: so you are telling me that if someone gave you something for free, a product or service, you would use it disregarding any and all safety issues?? have you not understood the REASON we are "waahaaing" for better and SAFER parking around uni??

I am totally serious, Parallel parking on the side of the road is dangerous, but I dont hear every cage driver bitchin about it (Other than me cos I suck at it).

As you might have gathered from my comment above, working in the city I frequently (read Daily) walk past the uni and have seen the bikes. Honestly I dont see there is that big of an issue with safety (I'll give you the security one although I still dont know how they get away with it with all those people). There are other options, but I feel confident that the majority wont use them because they may have to pay or walk a little further.

Toaster
16th October 2007, 20:23
Call me uneducated if you will, I hold a Nursing Diploma, but am nowhere near as educated as many people I know that left school at 15!

mmm nursing diploma... nurses.... mmmmm (slap!!) :innocent:

Mom
16th October 2007, 20:26
mmm nursing diploma... nurses.... mmmmm (slap!!) :innocent:

You grubby thang :love: LOL go and look at the thread I have posted as an alternative to taking this one off topic even more :eek5:

Toaster
16th October 2007, 20:33
its so funny you say that (and i completely agree btw) because either way the generation y'ers are stuffed.....

Yes, it won't be easy. I would also hate to be faced with the prospect of saving for a first home. The "ideal" that kiwis all want to own their own home one days is truly dead... we have caught up with the rest of the developed world. The times I have been overseas in Europe etc showed me how so many can only ever hope to rent as home over there are ridiculously expensive.

When I was 17 my folks couldn't afford to put another son through uni, so I left home and did military service, then eventually put myself through uni (Otago - great place... many a couch burned). I have fought and scraped and worked hard to get where I am today and it was never ever easy.

What are you majoring in and what would you like to do? KB is a good place for advice - even for career hunting.

bomma
16th October 2007, 20:34
Apparently based on what I saw yesterday, (or was it today) around a post box (outside the Gym) I think.

ummm how many bikes do you think there are at uni?? (honestly)


I am totally serious, Parallel parking on the side of the road is dangerous, but I dont hear every cage driver bitchin about it (Other than me cos I suck at it).

agree on cages dont bitch about it and i also suck at parallel parking cars :sweatdrop...but
1) cars are a lot more noticable than bikes
2) get hit in a car, minor concussion?? get hit on a bike.....nuff said
3) bigger bikes = harder to park (well thats what i think anyway) ive nearly been hit by a car while trying to parallel park. small slot, got half in before i realised it was wrong angle, my bike was half on the road and half in and the cage thought i was gonna keep going back so hit the gas.....lucky for me i saw him coming and had the angle to accelerate away from him to hear screeching brakes behind me


As you might have gathered from my comment above, working in the city I frequently (read Daily) walk past the uni and have seen the bikes. Honestly I dont see there is that big of an issue with safety (I'll give you the security one although I still dont know how they get away with it with all those people). There are other options, but I feel confident that the majority wont use them because they may have to pay or walk a little further.
*shrug* guess having had to be here for the better part of 3 years now ive seen and experienced differently to you....safety not only from theives and cages either...nearly everyday for a year id come back to my bike to find a new scratch or ding somewhere so i stayed near the parks one day....guy on scooter came down symonds, backed in and hit a bike, goes forward corrects himself and backs in and hits the bike again, happened once more and i voiced my concern....he shrugged went down further and deja vu.....

bomma
16th October 2007, 20:40
Yes, it won't be easy. I would also hate to be faced with the prospect of saving for a first home. The "ideal" that kiwis all want to own their own home one days is truly dead... we have caught up with the rest of the developed world. The times I have been overseas in Europe etc showed me how so many can only ever hope to rent as home over there are ridiculously expensive.

When I was 17 my folks couldn't afford to put another son through uni, so I left home and did military service, then eventually put myself through uni (Otago - great place... many a couch burned). I have fought and scraped and worked hard to get where I am today and it was never ever easy.

What are you majoring in and what would you like to do? KB is a good place for advice - even for career hunting.

shucks man i have it a bit easier than you....(understatement of the year)!!!!

right now im majoring in management and psychology leading into human resources.....thinking about changing psychology into sport and health....post-grad is an option for me but dont think i could handle another year of uni added on to the year+ i have left......career-wise i honestly have no clue where i want to go (like every other person my age) isnt an excuse but is the truth

good to see that this thread is veering so precariously :lol:

Luckylegs
16th October 2007, 20:48
ummm how many bikes do you think there are at uni?? (honestly)

Fookin loads, I'll count em tomorrow while walking past, as long as ya dont think Im stealing em, cos I count slow :wink: I was just pointing out that I had seen one rider do this, not that it was a solution for everybody. Its like the Brown CBR which Ive seen on the other side of the road parked behind a tree and then surrounded by other two wheeled vehicular machines. Ive often wondered whether this was intentional or just bad luck


....guy on scooter came down symonds, backed in and hit a bike, goes forward corrects himself and backs in and hits the bike again, happened once more and i voiced my concern....he shrugged went down further and deja vu.....

Excellent... does this mean we can agree to disagree, join forces and agree to beat up on the scooter riders :scooter:

klyong82
16th October 2007, 20:48
:corn: ohhhh more pie.....:drool:

Toaster
16th October 2007, 20:50
shucks man i have it a bit easier than you....(understatement of the year)!!!!

right now im majoring in management and psychology leading into human resources.....thinking about changing psychology into sport and health....post-grad is an option for me but dont think i could handle another year of uni added on to the year+ i have left......career-wise i honestly have no clue where i want to go (like every other person my age) isnt an excuse but is the truth

good to see that this thread is veering so precariously :lol:

Don't worry about setting yourself into one thing... I have done lots of things over the years.

I guess we should say something about parking.... um..... we need more parking.

bomma
16th October 2007, 20:56
Fookin loads, I'll count em tomorrow while walking past, as long as ya dont think Im stealing em, cos I count slow :wink: I was just pointing out that I had seen one rider do this, not that it was a solution for everybody. Its like the Brown CBR which Ive seen on the other side of the road parked behind a tree and then surrounded by other two wheeled vehicular machines. Ive often wondered whether this was intentional or just bad luck

sorry i was just being a dick...along the same lines as the brown cbr, we were thinking of having maybe a buddy system, like chain 2 bikes together (obviously somebody who you know) just to make it safer...also want to put a proposal forward to maybe try and get a set railing on the sides of symonds so we have something to chain the bikes to


Excellent... does this mean we can agree to disagree, join forces and agree to beat up on the scooter riders :scooter:

lol shit yea!! but one problem, we cant let em know that the club had anything to do with it (more than half the club consists of scooter riders)


Don't worry about setting yourself into one thing... I have done lots of things over the years.

hehe no doubt


I guess we should say something about parking.... um..... we need more parking.

yep open up alfred st again!!! rally the troops!!!

Luckylegs
16th October 2007, 21:05
yep open up alfred st again!!! rally the troops!!!

Now that I cant argue with !!!

I had been thinking about the bar along symonds street when it was last raised. Id agree that would be a good simple solution except that presumably when the parking spaces you use, are used for cars on the weekend that could be a problem for passenger doors....

...Thus proving my point that Parallel parking is stoopid !

Squiggles
16th October 2007, 22:04
Bloody 'ell this thread veered off last page, so much for the auckland uni smc group discussing parking, looked more like bashing of students then bashing of everyone else...

Would be nice to see some way around the problems sportsbike riders have squeezing in on a busy day, but blowed if i can think of a way, cant ride along the footpath and drop in (well, ya can at the moment) but not if we get a bar for security...

Seal on the engineering side could do with repairs, last time i tried to park the gn there on main stand it rolled back down to the footpath and only then did the stand actually touch the ground :( could fit a few more bikes in there if it we didnt need to fit around those spots

xwhatsit
17th October 2007, 00:34
I am totally serious, Parallel parking on the side of the road is dangerous, but I dont hear every cage driver bitchin about it (Other than me cos I suck at it).

As you might have gathered from my comment above, working in the city I frequently (read Daily) walk past the uni and have seen the bikes. Honestly I dont see there is that big of an issue with safety (I'll give you the security one although I still dont know how they get away with it with all those people). There are other options, but I feel confident that the majority wont use them because they may have to pay or walk a little further.

I understand where you're coming from -- that's why I don't buy into the `security' issue, as although it sucks bad, it is free parking, so I don't see why they have an obligation to provide security for us. A steel bar would be cheap and nice.

The main beef, however, is that there used to be one of the best parking situations at uni of anywhere; Alfred St was open to us to park all down the side. Not sure how much capacity there was, but it was a quiet street, wide area to get in and out of, safe access from any direction (i.e. not pulling a U-turn across four lanes of mad rush-hour cagers). Then for some silly reason they decided to take that away from us, and leave the space empty. For a long time they just left it as that, until there were a few complaints and they opened up a little bit extra on Symonds St, right down the bottom before the traffic lights (the most dangerous bit).

As Ixion stated in his letter to the council, there is actually less parking available to motorcyclists now than there was a few decades ago. Despite the rising use of motorcycles, they decided to remove safe, effective parking. That same area for parking remains unused -- but we're not allowed to use it. That's why we're a bit pissed off.

We pay (well, student loans pay, but we pay eventually) sizeable amounts of money to attend a university where you expect to have decent facilities. It's supposed to be a world class university, and as part of that I expect not only to be able to take a shit on campus and not have to trek across to the public loos, but other basic facilities as well. Some of these are not being fulfilled.

motorbyclist
17th October 2007, 01:51
which is exactly the point!

we may be bitching students, but the bloody councul removed the safest, most secure parking we could ask for without paying, and now that space just sits there empty. it's not like it isn't there, and it won't cost them a cent to open it back up - so stop bitching about our bitching already!

i can see why they made alfred st bus access only, why they didn't make it a bus lane and instead closed it to bikes for parking is beyond me

motorbyclist
17th October 2007, 01:57
Students should stop sucking on the tit of society and eat meat!

what a fine example of ignorance ( or something along those lines)




churr for the red.. most people attending Uni are drop outs who think the world owes them a crust.. you sound like one of 'them'...

to the contrary, to get into engineering you need to have gotten atleast a merit average in 7th form calculus and physics, and then there's only 550 spots per year.

the world doesn't owe me a crust, but i do get irate when people rave on about things without considering the implications of what they're saying. you my friend went to the uni bike club area, full of students, and told us we're a drain on society. while for some students that IS true, for most i believe they are in the long run doing you a favour.


just like how all non-aucklanders opposed paying for aucklands roads: auckland pays for all the rest of the country (which has alot more road per person) so stop your whinging.

we just want our parking back!


i don't believe i'm whinning about anything.. and no you don't need those grades; i was a qualified Engineer.. or rather still am not practising as i manage engineers for a living.... and didnt step one foot in a Uni.

im also keen to know how they're doing me a favour...??!!! ahahhaha

well lucky for you that 20 years ago that was possible, but today's industry seems to be pretty convinced that you need a good understanding of what you're looking at before you take up the job. it's hard enough finding a decent summer job that fulfils my degree's work requirements as it is.

and auckland does the rest of the nation a favour when it pays it's taxes. population density means that each aucklander consumes less state resources, say roading, while they can produce more tax income via all the big business that centres around the city.
just like students. we're an investment the govt makes and if they didn't make a return they wouldn't be doing it.

i'll paste this on the thread as it might as well go up, i dislike pissing around with PMs for an argument

HungusMaximist
17th October 2007, 10:37
Can we all just STFU and sort out the parking problem?

Nish or whoever is doing the petition/papers just let us know when you sort it all out so I can just sign it and then gate crash the council's meeting.

There's also this strike thing being brewed up by a few fellow KB's on taking over Auckland's car parks with motorcycles during peak thour (lunch times, mornings and weekends).

Squiggles
17th October 2007, 15:03
I'm getting in touch with the council over a few things now, and for a start, if anyone recieves a ticket for not having their warrant displayed when it is could they pm me... Same goes for tickets for parking behind the trees (not on footpath)

They're going to have a look at the seal on the engineering side and our request for a bar to lock down to has been noted

avgas
17th October 2007, 15:41
i never had an issue with parking and my bike.
bike parking is like sex - you can do it anywhere.

motorbyclist
17th October 2007, 16:07
i never had an issue with parking and my bike.
bike parking is like sex - you can do it anywhere.

you would think so

avgas
17th October 2007, 16:59
you would think so
Those who know me, know i dont think very often :bleh:

motorbyclist
17th October 2007, 17:31
nor does whoever thought to close the alfred st parking :laugh:

breakaway
17th October 2007, 17:34
You guys suck at internet arguments. Taking the bait every time :third:

Makes for fun reading

Luckylegs
17th October 2007, 17:48
i never had an issue with parking and my bike.
bike parking is like sex - you can do it anywhere.

...Which for some strange reason brings me back to parallel parking, but I cant think why ? :o


I'm getting in touch with the council over a few things now, and for a start, if anyone recieves a ticket for not having their warrant displayed when it is could they pm me... Same goes for tickets for parking behind the trees (not on footpath)

They're going to have a look at the seal on the engineering side and our request for a bar to lock down to has been noted

...For all the pisstaking, And while I still like Boomers argument, I do actually hope you get somewhere, Good luck guys

bomma
17th October 2007, 20:12
I'm getting in touch with the council over a few things now, and for a start, if anyone recieves a ticket for not having their warrant displayed when it is could they pm me... Same goes for tickets for parking behind the trees (not on footpath)

They're going to have a look at the seal on the engineering side and our request for a bar to lock down to has been noted

he aint the president of this club for nothin :first:

good stuff stevo :niceone:

Hanne
17th October 2007, 21:07
i never had an issue with parking and my bike.
bike parking is like sex - you can do it anywhere.

I don't think my bike would fit in an aeroplane toilet

Luckylegs
17th October 2007, 21:15
I don't think my bike would fit in an aeroplane toilet

And unlike an aeroplane toilet............


......It doesnt SUCK ! :ROFL:

bomma
17th October 2007, 21:34
And unlike an aeroplane toilet............


......It doesnt SUCK ! :ROFL:

errrhhm ill give you an A for effort....thanks for playing :lol:

so just about parking again....the unipatrol muppets are starting to eye up the bikes parked in out-of-the way spots...aparently a bike parked between a pillar and a rubbish bin, next to a wall is an issue....that dean seriously needs a good talkin-to....

fucking muppets!!

xwhatsit
17th October 2007, 21:38
And unlike an aeroplane toilet............


......It doesnt SUCK ! :ROFL:

No, but I've got a Honda CB250RS, and it doesn't fit in an aeroplane toilet either.

Cheers, Ste(ph|v)en.

Tickler
17th October 2007, 21:40
Now that bomma and boomer have realised that their names ARE spelt differently and the tread is slightly on topic (except the flashbacks of the mile high club):

I saw some people in highly fashionable orange fluro vests on the corner of alfred st and symonds st on monday counting people. Anyway...next day they changed the light phasing!

Now i cant pull my shifty u-turn in the mornings cause the traffic is all banked up! Just as i had the system sorted, Banksie come along and buggers it all up for me!

Just another way auntie(uncle) Helen is beating us down!

Luckylegs
17th October 2007, 22:12
There was chick in a high vis vest today on the corner of (Princes Street I think, the one that runs between the uni and Albert Park) and The little road that runs parallel to Wellesley Street. She appeared to be keeping numbers as well... Although she also gave the impression she was drifting in and out of consiousness, so...

Tickler
17th October 2007, 22:43
i think its probably got to do something with the larger numbers crossing now because of the new business school. ive been down there scoping out places to park, but alas none that wouldnt "deeply offend" security.

I dont really care ive, im counting down my last few lectueres now :cry:.

bomma
17th October 2007, 22:49
i think its probably got to do something with the larger numbers crossing now because of the new business school.

the number of students crossing that road must have more than doubled since last year aye!!!

the most typical thing tho is that the university is showing their money stealing...errhhm earning prowess by poing u buildings everywher but they dont attend to the fact that they also need to improve the infrastructure for the foot-traffic that now has to travel all over uni just to get to a stupid lecture!!!

2 underpasses just doesnt cut it.....

Tickler
17th October 2007, 22:53
personally i dont see why they dont put a global crossing there (like on queen st), it means people can stand anywhere and get anywhere they want.

Only problem is most student think they dont have 2 mins to wait for the lights and if they dont see a car for 3 secs, its the perfect time to play traffic controller.

Tickler
17th October 2007, 22:56
also, i dont know if the control boxes are capable of this or not but...

they should have different crossing phasings for a 10min window on the hour, every hour between 9-4. (e.g 12:55-->1:05)

This is the peak student time between classes.

Vote Tickler for Mayor in 3 years!!!

motorbyclist
17th October 2007, 23:17
aha! i thought the lights had changed!

now that light change would probably be a good idea, but is it really neccessary? maybe if they just give an extra 5 seconds on the pedestrian green phase, but other than that it's only a minor holdup.

xwhatsit
17th October 2007, 23:46
also, i dont know if the control boxes are capable of this or not but...

they should have different crossing phasings for a 10min window on the hour, every hour between 9-4. (e.g 12:55-->1:05)

This is the peak student time between classes.

Vote Tickler for Mayor in 3 years!!!

That's a bloody fantastic idea! Has anybody thought of this before?

I'd seriously write into the council to see if they can do that. I know the boxes have some idea of time and change to suit, as late at night they switch into pressure-only mode (much to the chagrin of riders who don't know to park exactly on the sensors underneath the road), but maybe they don't support such fine resolution.

Greeeeeet! (to quote John Cleese, Scottish film director of Scott of the Sahara).

motorbyclist
18th October 2007, 01:10
haha, i remember one night about 6:30 a guy in a car couldn't figure out that by leaving a car length infront of him he wasn't on the sensor. traffic backed up for miles behind him, and it took about 4 minutes of me bouncing on my bike and waving him forward before he caught on :lol: (edit: note i had gotten infront of him after passing about 200m of parked cars, so i reckon he'd been there atleast 5 minutes waiting for a green)

i'm beginning to think a solution to auckland's conjestion (and road toll) is simply an IQ test when you sit your licence :laugh:

twinkle
18th October 2007, 07:45
I don't think my bike would fit in an aeroplane toilet

I reckon you might just be able to squeeze it in there.

avgas
18th October 2007, 09:30
i know get some flags and march around like every other group at uni.
Explain to me again why people dont just park where ever they want.
Seems to me it was more publically accepted than having sex in the open. And i know people do that in Albert park

avgas
18th October 2007, 09:35
...Which for some strange reason brings me back to parallel parking, but I cant think why ?
kinky..........but wrong

bomma
18th October 2007, 12:08
i'm beginning to think a solution to auckland's conjestion (and road toll) is simply an IQ test when you sit your licence :laugh:

the ability of an iq test to measure intelligence is questionable at best.....

most iq tests are also very culturally biased (toward the culture in which the particular test was developed)

better off just looking at the person's insurance claim history and also how many dings they have on their car and instantly disqualifying any numnuts who's proven himself or herself to be a complete munter on the road.....:rolleyes:

Tickler
18th October 2007, 16:03
the ability of an iq test to measure intelligence is questionable at best.....

most iq tests are also very culturally biased (toward the culture in which the particular test was developed)

better off just looking at the person's insurance claim history and also how many dings they have on their car and instantly disqualifying any numnuts who's proven himself or herself to be a complete munter on the road.....:rolleyes:

Nah i rekkon they flip a coin, they guess it right, you can drive, guess it wrong and its the bus for you buddy!

Probably get the same mix as the current system. and it will slash costs! but wait there's more!

ehab2weelr
18th October 2007, 20:54
I know the boxes have some idea of time and change to suit, as late at night they switch into pressure-only mode (much to the chagrin of riders who don't know to park exactly on the sensors underneath the road), but maybe they don't support such fine resolution.


there was this light some place cant recall where but i stopped for about 10min waiting for it to go green :zzzz: but wouldnt, moved my bike to find the pressure sensors, but it just would not detect me,
could be that my bike is too light, but is 160kg light??:confused: anyways i just gased it on the red and dont know if that light ever turned green sence... hahah
which show that pressure sensors are sh!t....:yes:

bomma
18th October 2007, 21:00
there was this light some place cant recall where but i stopped for about 10min waiting for it to go green :zzzz: but wouldnt, moved my bike to find the pressure sensors, but it just would not detect me,
could be that my bike is too light, but is 160kg light??:confused: anyways i just gased it on the red and dont know if that light ever turned green sence... hahah
which show that pressure sensors are sh!t....:yes:

agree....i rememba when i had my fxr (back in the day) and i was stopped at the balmoral rd, mt eden rd intersection for about 10mins before i got annoyed and ran the red.....

pain in the ass and annoying as hell :mad:

klyong82
18th October 2007, 21:01
there was this light some place cant recall where but i stopped for about 10min waiting for it to go green :zzzz: but wouldnt, moved my bike to find the pressure sensors, but it just would not detect me,
could be that my bike is too light, but is 160kg light??:confused: anyways i just gased it on the red and dont know if that light ever turned green sence... hahah
which show that pressure sensors are sh!t....:yes:


I had the same thing happened to me on the CBR 250 on Epsom Ave. traffic lights...no problems with the Fireblades.

motorbyclist
18th October 2007, 21:02
sometimes, if there's traffic or a camera, getting off you bike, putting out the stand and balacing the bike on the stand can cause enough localised pressure on the road to set off the sensor.... remember that if there's random squares on the road the sensors are under there, usually a bit back from the line by half a metre

the other option is to do a stoppie; if the stoppie doesn't trigger the sensor, you bike crashing back down sure will!

motorbyclist
18th October 2007, 21:04
agree....i rememba when i had my fxr (back in the day) and i was stopped at the balmoral rd, mt eden rd intersection for about 10mins before i got annoyed and ran the red.....

pain in the ass and annoying as hell :mad:

haha, same happened to me back on my fxr. turning right on lincon rd.

in the middle of the bloody winter in the middle of a bloody storm:buggerd:

xwhatsit
19th October 2007, 00:21
there was this light some place cant recall where but i stopped for about 10min waiting for it to go green :zzzz: but wouldnt, moved my bike to find the pressure sensors, but it just would not detect me,
could be that my bike is too light, but is 160kg light??:confused: anyways i just gased it on the red and dont know if that light ever turned green sence... hahah
which show that pressure sensors are sh!t....:yes:

For those of you who are stopped by these things, it's been discussed quite a few times on KB.

I can trigger any of them now, and I've probably got the lightest bike with the least metal out of any of you (125kgs).

The sensors are not pressure-sensitive, they rely on an inductive loop. Look on the road, and you'll see a rectangle `carved' into the road, cut in half down the middle. Get your bike directly on top of the line that cuts the rectangle in half. 95% of the time that will trigger it, but if it's been set not sensitive enough, try popping your centrestand (or sidestand if your bike is teh suck) down to get some more metal closer to it. Most of the time you don't trigger it, because if you're riding correctly you won't be in the middle of the road, especially at intersections (major oil and shit dropped there), so it's counter-intuitive.

I do probably 75% of my kilometres after the lights have switched to `trigger-only' mode and the only time I had to run a light was before I knew about this information -- and once since, as the lights were red from all directions, and weren't changing for anybody (?!).

motorbyclist
19th October 2007, 02:40
hold on.

induction requires a change in magnetic field - i'e your lump of iron has to be moving

they do detect if you're running red lights that way....

to detect a staionary vehicle you have to use weight (specially if the bike chassis is made of not steel (say magnesium or aluminium)

but i suppose to get there one has to be moving at some point, and i suppose my stoppies would have the right effect as i'm in the middle of the lane for obvious "in case of fuckup" reasons - but your stand wouldn't.

pressure is force over area: so lifting your bike on it's stand puts ALOT of force on a very small point, which deforms the road alot more than when your bike is on both wheels. lowering your stand (which i suppose is ferrous(ie steel), so it should be magnetic) wouldn't cause much...


so who was the traffic engineer who came up with the induction theory? want to be sure it isn't just blind speculation...

maybe the field generated by the spark plug / leads has an effect? i've seen it affect many bullet cams put on bikes near the engine (starter motor is especially good at it)

motorbyclist
19th October 2007, 02:46
and once since, as the lights were red from all directions, and weren't changing for anybody (?!).

in onehunga i nearly got knocked off by a guy in a holden - we were oncoming, i was tuning left and him right into the same street and i had a green light.

apparently so did he:shit:, and being a typical holden driver, didn't slow down but instead slammed his horn - as if i can stop dead mid corner.

two greens... yeah right! i don't really believe it seeing as the left turn and straight ahead/right lights were green on my side, and for him to have any green at all is just ridiculous

xwhatsit
19th October 2007, 03:15
hold on.

induction requires a change in magnetic field - i'e your lump of iron has to be moving

they do detect if you're running red lights that way....

to detect a staionary vehicle you have to use weight (specially if the bike chassis is made of not steel (say magnesium or aluminium)

but i suppose to get there one has to be moving at some point, and i suppose my stoppies would have the right effect as i'm in the middle of the lane for obvious "in case of fuckup" reasons - but your stand wouldn't.

pressure is force over area: so lifting your bike on it's stand puts ALOT of force on a very small point, which deforms the road alot more than when your bike is on both wheels. lowering your stand (which i suppose is ferrous(ie steel), so it should be magnetic) wouldn't cause much...


so who was the traffic engineer who came up with the induction theory? want to be sure it isn't just blind speculation...

maybe the field generated by the spark plug / leads has an effect? i've seen it affect many bullet cams put on bikes near the engine (starter motor is especially good at it)

I'm a classical musician/compsci student, not a physics student. I just heard the word `induction' used when this was being discussed. Loop of wires underneath that carved-out rectangle.

Perhaps it measures a difference in the magnetic field, from a normalised value to when you park over it.

They definitely don't run off pressure. That is confirmed.

At any rate the sensitive bit is bang-smack in the middle of that rectangle. You'll switch them every time.

HungusMaximist
19th October 2007, 12:08
For those of you who are stopped by these things, it's been discussed quite a few times on KB.

I can trigger any of them now, and I've probably got the lightest bike with the least metal out of any of you (125kgs).

The sensors are not pressure-sensitive, they rely on an inductive loop. Look on the road, and you'll see a rectangle `carved' into the road, cut in half down the middle. Get your bike directly on top of the line that cuts the rectangle in half. 95% of the time that will trigger it, but if it's been set not sensitive enough, try popping your centrestand (or sidestand if your bike is teh suck) down to get some more metal closer to it. Most of the time you don't trigger it, because if you're riding correctly you won't be in the middle of the road, especially at intersections (major oil and shit dropped there), so it's counter-intuitive.

I do probably 75% of my kilometres after the lights have switched to `trigger-only' mode and the only time I had to run a light was before I knew about this information -- and once since, as the lights were red from all directions, and weren't changing for anybody (?!).

Hey that's some interesting stuff bro. I'd always wondered if they were pressure or something more advanced.

Hey bro, are you able to make it to strata this afternoon around 4-5ish?

We're gonna have a few $10 dollar specials and if you do, your round is on me! That's a promise! :eek: