Quick help needed - watercooled in which class?

[CookMySock]

Help!

We need to make a decision quickly. Heres the nzmmrc rules on this page.. scroll down the the "Rider and MiniMoto Classes" section.

http://www.nzmmrc.co.nz/page.php?2

Now, all the lower classes say "air cooled only". If I buy two watercooled bikes for the kids (14 and 15 y/o) what class will they race in ?


thanks,
Steve

[BASS-TREBLE]

The open class seems to be the only one....

[CookMySock]

1.02 crankcase standard air-cooled chinese only

Does this EXCLUDE the watercooled bikes from the junior classes ? or is this referring to CRANKCASES and not HEADS being watercooled ?

ta,
Steve

[BASS-TREBLE]

I know as much as you but on my watercooled motor the waterpump is in the crankcase so that may be the difference.

Someone please help.

[xtreme]

Hi Steve

What is the age of your kids ?
Under NZMMRC if they are under 15 (?) they could only ride in the
junior open class


http://minimotonz.forumup.org
http://www.xminimoto.co.nz

Cheers Greg

[CookMySock]

basically I need to know if these can be used as absolute beginners bikes, or will they class themselves out of racing by going watercooled ?

DB

[xtreme]

Hi Steve

If your running at Edgecumbe check with them , This is the kids classes they have -

Race Classes.

Children's Classes

New Bees
Kids Standard Daytona Bikes. (age 5 –9 years)
Kids Standard Daytona Bikes. (age 10—14 years)
Kids Modified Daytona Bikes. (age 8—14 years)
Kids Open (10—14 years) Please note racing in this class is only for children that have had racing experience and with there parents and the race committees approval.)

Hope this helps

http://minimotonz.forumup.org
http://www.xminimoto.co.nz

Cheers Greg

[CookMySock]

gak, I'm still a little puzzled. So they will be fine with chinese watercooled bikes like this ?

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=159109653

I don't wanna buy bikes and find we cant ride them :blink:

DB

[Aero165]

Hey DB!

Basically if your kids are under 15 the only class they can race them in would be Junior open. A bone stock B1 won't be very competitive in that class. If they are older than 15 they can come race in senior 14 and if they're fast enough senior 19, etc.

You should steal one of your kids bikes and come racing in Senior 14 with us! You'' gave a blast!!!:scooter:

Aero,

[daytona 2]

your kids would be in my class junior open, mike races a b1 in this class and its fine....dB if i was u i would buy the watercooled bike because there much more reliable and ur kids will have more fun on them :wari:


also i would race with the nzmmrc because there's more people and the tracks are better..and come to mt wellinton once a month for practice.

[CookMySock]

your kids would be in my class junior open, mike races a b1 in this class and its fine....dB if i was u i would buy the watercooled bike because there much more reliable and ur kids will have more fun on themSweet.

getting two of these ;

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Trade-Me-Motors/Motorbikes/Motorbikes/Pocket-pit-bikes/auction-160641156.htm

DB

[Gadgit]

Hi DB Please note this part of the rule....
Kids Open (10—14 years) Please note racing in this class is only for children that have had racing experience and with there parents and the race committees approval.)
That was from the EBOP club rules but also applies to NZMMRC

A the junior open class is for the kids that were getting board of the slower bikes (daytona air cooled) and had good track experrence.
The Club commitee must see the kids on the bikes before they go out and race in the Jun open class as these 5-7hp bikes with kids on will do round 70-90km/h and at a rapid pace.

The next three NZMMRC meets are non points rounds and this would be a good chance to get the kids used to the bikes and prove them selves on the track infront of the committee before the next points round.

Also the next meet for the Edgecoumbe club is a fun day so good chance there to.

Hope that was helpful to ya

Gadgit

[CookMySock]

Hi Gadgit, others,

ok two watercooled bikes have been purchased, and on their way.. hopefully have them by the weekend. We have to nylon them etc etc, so we will bring them to the track, introduce ourselves, and buy a membership and get some advice.


thanks to all!
Steve

[daytona 2]

sounds like a good plan..look forward to meeting you at the track..


which club are you going to go with?

[CookMySock]

sounds like a good plan..look forward to meeting you at the track..Thanks man. Same!


which club are you going to go with?uh, prolly Edgecumbe, coz the track is 2km away. :niceone:


DB

[daytona 2]

you should come up to auckland at mt wellinton once a month...lots of fun and an awsome track {appartently edgecumb is in bad condition} mt wellinton is a good learners track with the most riders attending meetings. it some good practice for learning though because edgecumb probualy wont lets your boys ride their bikes because the race commitee needs to see them race for a certain amount of times to let the in to junior open.....but at mt wellington they can go in either junior class or senoir class .....ur choice

[CookMySock]

edgecumb probualy wont lets your boys ride their bikes because the race commitee needs to see them race for a certain amount of times to let the in to junior open.....but at mt wellington they can go in either junior class or senoir class .....ur choiceI am pretty sure they will let them on the track is some class or other. We will be pretty fucking PISSED OFF if they don't. Can't imagine it somehow. I don't think they will be "racing" for some months.

DB

[Gadgit]

I am pretty sure they will let them on the track is some class or other. We will be pretty fucking PISSED OFF if they don't. Can't imagine it somehow. I don't think they will be "racing" for some months.

DB


Hay DB
Daytona could be right it's in the rules there for junior open but as I said get along to there fun day in two weeks and have a chat to Ken or Geoff and see where you stand... how old are your kids??
The fun day in two weeks is also the prize giving for there season so should be a good event to get along to.. got to see how I go with parts I may show as well lol.

[CookMySock]

They are 13 and 15. 15 y/o has his class 1/6 learners.

Clearly they won't be "racing" in the near future - nowhere near experienced on the track. The 13 y/o is viciously competitive and completely fearless, and the 15 y/o can already ride (has his own brand new GT250R), so I wouldn't discount them too quickly.

I cannot imagine two teenagers turn up with pocketbikes and they cant ride them. How can that be possible ? Itsa pocketbike club innit ? I'm not gunna freak out.. I'm just gunna go down there with the bikes and say hi. :calm:


DB

[daytona 2]

na that should be alright......just say youve been mt wellington a few times and if your kids are very confident they will deffently let you...by the way edgecumb is not going to turn down racers so it should be algud:rockon:


dB i think you will find that everyone at minimoto racing is very friendly and relaxed anyway..that another reason do minimoto racing is because everyone there is very helpful and nice its not like go-karting when it all about the racing and winning its also a social event....

the clubs have to make there rules for a reason though because some people as shown at mt wellinton last week break every rule and endanger everyone on the track.....saince you seem to be a motorcycle family they will take this into consideration and propualy let you into junior open....

[CookMySock]

if your kids are very confident they will deffently let you...I doubt that the 7 yearold racers were "very confident" when they started.


DB

[Gadgit]

15yo he'll be joining the senior 14 group on there B1's and racing with the adults so no problem there.

[daytona 2]

trust me some are....there is a one kid at mt wellington that crys and has a fit:angry2: if he dosnt win.....that rather confident

[Gadgit]

Back in the day when the sport was new there was a young 4 almost 5 year old running a 910 4.2 polini and he did really well... because he was light he killed the field, way out in front lol but rules are there for a reason and it's moslty to keep the clubs insurance co' happy...

[daytona 2]

back in the day....:laugh::laugh: the sport sport was new like 5 years ago....man that kid must of been preety fast gadgit.....at mt wellinton i always get to the first corner first becauss of my weight...but 3m man and alan always find ways of beating me to the second corner..:nono::nono:

[Gadgit]

Yea he was quick... I think he still shows up to the Mt welly meets now and then with his dad Phil Griffiths on the blue GP3 race number 111

[daytona 2]

... i know that kid..he races at edgecumb..his dad is awsome..he has heaps of polini's

[Gadgit]

Yea if my memory serves me right he has a GP3 (Phil's bike), GRC GPRacing (wifies bike), and a couple of 910 Carrea's for the kids...

[BigAl]

Hi Guys,

Yeah Phil and his son ride occasionally at Mt Welly, son is aged about 8 now and is pretty hard to beat. I haven't seen them for awhile.

[CookMySock]

well they turned up today. Kids suitably impressed, until one stops suddenly with a brrrrr, and won't restart ? wtf? not very funny..

It has spark and compression. Any hints ?

DB

[daytona 2]

yes i chinese bikes do give their share of annoyance...:Pokey: but its a racing sport and thats just part of it unless you want to buy a euro bike

[CookMySock]

right, so any hints ?

DB

[grantman]

If you try starting it then take the plug out
how does it look?

Maybe carb is blocked?
Chinese fuel filters are suppose to be crap

If you have 2 bikes at least you can swap parts around to test

[BigAl]

Yeah DB,

The problem will either be fuel or spark, if it has spark then look at fuel.

You did add oil? btw use a fully synthetic oil like TTS.

fuel getting through to carb, getting through to engine. Start with the easy things first; swap plug, loosen fuel cap in case of fuel lock, swap carbs (could be dirt in carb..) read through all postings on Pocket bike won't start.

Be patient, they all need sorting as you do get what you pay for compared to a multi thousand dollar euro!:cool:

[CookMySock]

Thanks grantman. Damn my ears are ringing - what an evil little engine.. I nearly looped it twice!! Sittin too far back I think :niceone:

We have quit for today - just not enough light. Tomorrow is another day!! We'll get that plug out and see whats up. Also if theres someone at the track we'll go down there and introduce ourselves.

Yeah the first one just quit like something fell off. Idling nicely and lots of power, then brrrr, stop! dead! I see its' choke is not locking on like the other one.

edit: BigAl, yeah I am thinking it is either not enough fuel in the little tank, or airlock, or goo in the filter or something. Yes, I used a non-synthetic oil at 20:1 Cough, reading the manual it says to run it in on fully synthetic.. :blink: We got some amsoil 100:1 2stroke - mix that up at 25:1 or what ?

whew!
DB

[CookMySock]

ok, plug is wet. So I cleaned it and retried - no. Check it again, wet. So we have fuel.

While the plug was out I put its lead on and gave the starter cord a pull - plug fires cleanly and brightly.

I pulled the air filter off and squirted a bit of fuel down the carby - no sign of life whatsoever.

I pulled the carby off and squirted fuel down the manifold - so signs of firing whatsoever.

Theres lots of compression, but very little suction from the inlet manifold. I wonder if its spat a reed valve. Removing engine now - gunna check the reed valves.

DB

[CookMySock]

Fixed ! swapped the plug out of the other bike and VOILA!!

Two stroke oil everywhere !!!

whew! now I know how to get the engine in and out and get the carby off.. <_<


Thanks to all who volunteered advice. :apint:

DB

[BigAl]

Good to hear Db, thanks for letting us know.

See you on the track sometime.

[Gadgit]

Hay DB swap both the plugs for some NGK ones the chineese ones are poop they run for a bit then all of a sudden ya can't start the dam thing from hot or it just won't start... I had the same problem with a few bikes I bought new... plugs still work fine out of the engine but brake down under compression

[CookMySock]

plugs still work fine out of the engine but brake down under compression:blink: So what is the hot tip on sparkplugs ? which one is best ? I heated a the dead plug read hot with the propane torch.. it started easy after that... for a bit :crazy:

Tyres - these ones are fucking nearly square.. :blink: is there something better I can swap over ? Seriously, on the stand give it a rev and the bike nearly gets airborne! Badass!


DB

[BigAl]

Plugs, just get same heat range in NGK about $5 from Repco/Supercheap.

Tyres, don't muck around with Chinese, get a set of Savas from Xtreme or PMTs from Pocket Bike Imports (see links on front page of www.nzmmrc.co.nz), they are heaps better for grip and last at least 10 times longer! :scooter:

[Gadgit]

:blink: So what is the hot tip on sparkplugs ? which one is best ? I heated a the dead plug read hot with the propane torch.. it started easy after that... for a bit :crazy:

Tyres - these ones are fucking nearly square.. :blink: is there something better I can swap over ? Seriously, on the stand give it a rev and the bike nearly gets airborne! Badass!


DB


I have fitted NGK BP9ES round $5 to some bikes but I use

N.Denso IW20 round $30 (only found at Toyota and I get them for a bit cheeper)

[CookMySock]

Ok we got a brand new NGK B8ES and put that in. pull, pull, pull, pull, pull, pull, grrrrROWL!!

Pulled it out, and its clean as a whistle ! :crazy: WTF??

Hrm, toast it with the propane torch, gap it down a bit, boof it back in and pull - YANNNNGG!!!!! woohoo!

We changed the fuel too. Amsoil 100:1 premix is the shit. I have used it every 2stroker that I have ever had. Brilliant!! NO smoke!

So the teenager rode it around for an hour and got used to it. Brilliant !!


the cool new things just never end!
DB

[BigAl]

Amsoil 100:1 premix is the shit. I have used it every 2stroker that I have ever had. Brilliant!! NO smoke!
DB

Hope you are not using 100:1! I recommend 40 to 1 max, what do you think Gadgit?

[CookMySock]

Hope you are not using 100:1!Well I might have sploshed a bit too much oil in it, and its maybe 50:1. But eventually it'll run 100:1

Yeah 100:1 really brings out the unbelievers ! LOL! Jihad!:angry2: Jihad!:angry2: Jihad!:angry2: /me fires into the air.. until they try it.. :whistle: then they are strangely quiet.

I figure a new engine is 160 bucks, so lets try it.


DB

[daytona 2]

100:1 !! :gob::gob: oh my god.. thats realy going to f*** the engine..do 25:1 FOR RUNNING IN

[CookMySock]

100:1 !! :gob::gob: oh my god.. thats realy going to f*** the engine..do 25:1 FOR RUNNING INok ok, I promise to run it in properly. sheesh. :laugh:

It's got scaredy cat kids riding it, so they wont thrash it.


DB

[Gadgit]

Well be interesting to see how it goes on 100:1.... the chineese engine torrlances are wack to say the least and then theres the high rpm these engines pull and the not so flash meatels they make there main bearings with.... but yea as you say engines are cheap. I wouldn't try it in my bike 35:1 is what it gets alittle more oil dosn't hert specialy at 17000rpm and the fact a piston barrel kit for my engine is worth $550

[daytona 2]

hae gadgit,,is the edegcumb track good? is their lots of kids there still? i might cum down for a good thrash :scooter::scooter::scooter:...lol

[Gadgit]

It's a great track there are a few bumps but the track is getting a resurface sometime... There was a few going at one point but Jun open is the same riders as the Tam meets but by the sounds there may be two more joining the class ...

[CookMySock]

We went down to the track yesterday, but it was the karts practice day. Next saturday is pocketbike practice or something so we will go introduce ourselves then.

So, in the pissing rain we put the bikes in the hilux and go down the beach - theres a nice bit of tarseal there and there should be no one around.. and wait and wait for a gap in the torrential rain! grumble..

Warmup time - choke and FIRST PULL and it bursts into life and idles smoothly. Ah yeah, we're using Amsoil, hehe, lub it.

Rain backs off and off the teenagers go - massive grins all around, and chickenstrips take a beating, and the demented little chainsaws cut the place up.

Problem! The bikes dont like the cold and the water on the ground - engine runs dead stone cold and never warms up - won't idle properly you see.. :(

Everyone very much looking forward to next saturday, Dad included! :clap:


DB

[Newblade]

Just a bit of info from an old hand.:laugh:If it rains park em up:doh:

Leggz

[Newblade]

Hiya Gadgit been too long must catch up:2thumbsup
As you can see got a new toy :2thumbsup:rockon:

[Gadgit]

Whoo Hay Leggz
Howz things?? nice new toy (bigger then the ninjer too) I haven't been through Tga for a bit but the day I do I'll sure call in for a catch up..
Gadgit

[BigAl]

Hey DangerousBastard have you had a go on the Edgecumbe track yet?

and how'd it go?

[CookMySock]

Hey DangerousBastard have you had a go on the Edgecumbe track yet? and how'd it go?Nah man, every time we been down there there was the karts or no one there. Seems August 4,5 is the "start of the new season" so maybe we'll see regular days. We have found some roads to use though - we get some funny looks :jerry: and people sitting around watching :corn: :corn: :corn: Won't be long before the feds turn up though.. :Police:

DB