'95 ZX9R oodles of issues

[EZAS]

Coolant was over flowing out of the overflow container. I've been advised that this is likely a headgasket issue.

Took it into the bike shop. Got charged $200 and they replaced the raditor cap, didn't fix it. Spoke to Skidmark, he said take the radiator cap off, run it for about a minute or two, then put it on. That seemed to do the trick a little bit, but there is still coolant in the overflow boiling. I was initially told that this is likely a fault with the head gasket, but the temperature doesn't seem to ever go past half way so I'm not sure?

Possibly a water hose related issue? where the water pump is sucking so hard the hose is collapsing?

Another issue is that it's leaking oil. Started of with just spotting around the garage. I threw a litre of oil in it, rode it 70k and it was practically empty when I go there, filled it up .. took it home and then left it in the garage. There is over a litre of oil on my garage floor :(

What options should I take from here? back to the bike store for a complete strip down? I've been advised a head will cost $150 but the labour costs are gonna get rather high (looking at around a $1,000). Which isn't too bad provided it's just the head. Then there's the oil issue :(

[bungbung]

If you have coolant escaping into the catch tank (nad your cap is good) then your system is being pressurised from within to a level higher than the cap spring in which case it is either by overheating (less likely if your temp gauge is truthful) or by combustion gases.

The new cap, is it the correct pressure rating for your bike?

Get a tk test done for easy head gasket diagnosis.

[NinjaNanna]

I had a very similar problem on my 1995 ZX9r, turned out that the thermo switch for the fan was unreliable. The first time the bike came up to temp the fan would cut in but each subsequent time it would be hotter and hotter before it came on.

End result increased temp/pressure pushing the coolant out into the overflow bottle.

Is your fan running when the coolant is boiling as you describe?

FYI: I matched the thermo switch by picture in a supercheap catalog and managed to find one in stock at Repco. I never checked it out but I'm pretty sure it would have been much cheaper than the same switch from Kawasaki. From memory I think the same switch is used in some Honda Cars.

[EZAS]

When I took it into the bike store, I told them I couldn't hear the fan kicking in at all, they said they left the bike at idle for a while and the temp gauge got up to half way then the fan kicked in.

For this reason the fan ISN'T kicking in when the water is boiling into the overflow. It's boiling into the overflow but the temp gauge isn't even at half way (it appears as being cold) about 1/4 (which is the normal running temp).

[NinjaNanna]

For this reason the fan ISN'T kicking in when the water is boiling into the overflow. It's boiling into the overflow but the temp gauge isn't even at half way (it appears as being cold) about 1/4 (which is the normal running temp).


Please clarify this, I don't understand what you are telling me

[bungbung]

It's boiling into the overflow

Just to confirm: gauge indicates cool, fan not operating and boiling hot coolant escaping from the overflow.

Does the coolant weep out or piss out? does it piss out faster when you rev the bike?

[breakaway]

hey said they left the bike at idle for a while and the temp gauge got up to half way then the fan kicked in.

Sounds like bullshit. The fan usually comes on when the gauge is close to enter the red, right?


Please clarify this, I don't understand what you are telling me

I think he's saying that the temp gauge only ever reaches 25% of the way (from left to right), due to the fact that the fan doesn't kick in. I don't understand either this because the fan thermostat and the temperature gauges are two completely unrelated bits of kit on most bikes.

[Max Preload]

The gauge won't read the correct temperature unless the gauge sender is immersed in coolant. If coolant is being pushed into the overflow (displaced by combustion gases entering the cooling system through either a cracked head or faulty head gasket) that will would explain that problem - the fan swtich is on the outlet side of the radiator because it's there to turn the fan on when the coolant isn't leaving the radiator at a low enough temperature (normally around 90 deg. C). The gauge sender is normally near the inlet end of the radiator and is there to show the coolant temperature as it's coming from the engine. But, like I've already said, they don't work unless immersed in coolant and it sounds like yours is trying to work in air.

I suspect you have a cracked head or blown head gasket but more things need to be checked before confirming that diagnosis. $150 for a head? I doubt it - more like $150 just for the gasket!


Sounds like bullshit. The fan usually comes on when the gauge is close to enter the red, right?

No - usually 1/2 to 3/4. Once you get to the red they're usually boiling.

[Madness]

If you're going to pay someone to fix it I'd reccomend you should ring George. (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=89891&highlight=motorcycle+doctors) He's great.

[EZAS]

George just finished up ... Damn that was fast.

It's the head gasket causing the cooling issue :( and the front sprocket seal that's causing the front oil leak.

Now I need to call him for a plan of attack on that head gasket. He's recommended getting one in and then having it tested (no point in paying $1,000 for something that's just going to break). So the cost of this maybe up around the $2k mark.

Looks like trademe might be getting an additional listing after I fix up the sprocket seal issue, sprockets and chain. The cooling issue will have to go with the bike :(

[Max Preload]

Your post doesn't make a lot of sense, unless George believes the head is cracked rather than just a blown head gasket - they are two completely different things.

The first order of business based on George's diagnosis would be to remove your cylinder head and have it crack tested. Cracks can be successfully repaired in many cases. If it can't in this particular instance THEN start hunting.


Took it into the bike shop. Got charged $200 and they replaced the raditor cap, didn't fix it.

BTW who are the muppets who replaced a cap at great expense when they should have tested it first and if faulty used the cooling system pressure tester in it's place to see if the problem persisted? It's ok on a car when caps are in the price zone of less than the cost of the labour to actually test them, but just replacing shit willy-nilly on bikes is just stupid given the cost of parts.

[EZAS]

Your post doesn't make a lot of sense, unless George believes the head is cracked rather than just a blown head gasket - they are two completely different things.

The first order of business based on George's diagnosis would be to remove your cylinder head and have it crack tested. Cracks can be successfully repaired in many cases. If it can't in this particular instance THEN start hunting.



BTW who are the muppets who replaced a cap at great expense when they should have tested it first and if faulty used the cooling system pressure tester in it's place to see if the problem persisted? It's ok on a car when caps are in the price zone of less than the cost of the labour to actually test them, but just replacing shit willy-nilly on bikes is just stupid given the cost of parts.
I'm not naming names on the guys who replaced the cap, because they have given GREAT and honest service in the past. 1 bad bit of service out of about 10 visits so statistically they're not bad. I'm just abit upset at the last visit.

George diagnosed it as the head gasket. Not the head (that was my noobie typo). George and the guy that came around with him are amazing, truly. He'll be my primary recommendation for anyone who asks, from now on.
This is gonna cost abit in labour and testing to get done. Given the bike is rather old now .. it doesn't seem viable to spend more money on fixing up the bike than what the bike is really worth. Although if anyone else wants to .. It'll be on trademe soon (if I can't trade it in).

[Max Preload]

I'm not naming names on the guys who replaced the cap, because they have given GREAT and honest service in the past. 1 bad bit of service out of about 10 visits so statistically they're not bad. I'm just abit upset at the last visit.

Fair call.


George diagnosed it as the head gasket. Not the head (that was my noobie typo). George and the guy that came around with him are amazing, truly. He'll be my primary recommendation for anyone who asks, from now on.

Could still be a cracked head, but is more likely corrosion due to lack of coolant changes.


This is gonna cost abit in labour and testing to get done. Given the bike is rather old now .. it doesn't seem viable to spend more money on fixing up the bike than what the bike is really worth. Although if anyone else wants to .. It'll be on trademe soon (if I can't trade it in).

I feel that course of action is rather drastic. Why not do it yourself with some expert supervision? It's not a huge job and well worthwhile.

[The Pastor]

Yeah head gaskets are pretty easy to replace and if you take ur engine out and give to a mech, the labour cost is reduced alot.