The value of money has dropped by two thirds in 30 years

[mashman]

I know this always seems to be hard for you to assimilate, but they earn it.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/earn

earned, earn•ing, earns
1. To gain especially for the performance of service, labor, or work: earned money by mowing lawns.
2. To acquire or deserve as a result of effort or action: She earned a reputation as a hard worker.
3. To yield as return or profit: a savings account that earns interest on deposited funds.

As for where fiat money comes from, it depends on the country but it’s always controlled by the govt.

no fuckin way man.

Some would beg to differ with you.

http://tvnz.co.nz/seven-sharp/paying...-video-5336329

So, no real help then? Just more pretend shit.

Only whilst people like yerself have yer heads up yer arses

[mashman]

So, where do the resources come from to do the research? In fact how would you even fabricate the company in the first place? Ask a bunch of really clever people around for a nice cuppa and a talk about cancer cures? I think you’d find that every single person you asked would have a dozen better offers the next day, they didn’t sweat their ring out getting those qualifications and subsequent experience for nothing and they’re not about to start because someone thinks it a nice idea that they don’t get paid.

Nope, the only system in history that’s ever been as effective in sustaining growth as the commercial competitive model is that same economy under the extreme competition of war.

My sister used to do cancer research and left due to similar feelings on the subject. The real brainy boys are like the coders in the basement. Leave them the fuck alone to produce and keep what they do away from everyone else.

Resources are born, resources are dug up, resources grow in fields, resources are manufactured etc... all of which would continue without a financial system as a financial system it not a necessity. Resources will still be born, dug up, grown, manufactured... but on a societal need basis and not coz you can fool the idiots into buying anything as long as you push the right buttons. People believe any crap apparently. I've heard tell that money can only come into existence where the govt says that it's ok.

Has any system in history not be run using a financial system? If no, then it's time to give it a whirl, coz according to some simple analysis, it'll do more for this country than money ever could.

[mashman]

And this is the sort of shit people get away with ... It's moderately amusing when scanning te web that there are specialist company's for hire that'll help you test the tax system. Those tax rules will still exist of the Gold Standard is reapplied... in fact any financially based system will encourage this sort of practice. @but but but NZ won;t be seen as business friendly and we won't attract foreign investment. Nothing like a little fear mongering and if these fuckers are gonna stiff the tax payer, I'd rather they weren't allowed to do business here. It's fraud, jail the bastards, make an example of them like the ACC guy that was recently banged up.

[Akzle]

It's an easy fix, really. Banks in NZ have to have 17% of their funds in real cash, just change the ratio slightly. To 100%.

and here's the problem with that theory:
"real cash" doesn't exist
dun.dun.duuuuun. (you know the sound...ominous)
what you're mistaking for something worth anything is legal tender or currency...

I have to laugh at the money drop idea.

someone worked out (they called it "operation penny drop") that if america hadn't bought an army and staged an occupation of iraq, instead cashing in the same budget for pennies, then flying over 'raq dropping them out of B52s they would have a) done more damage b) caused less civilian casualties c) boosted the iraqi economoney and d) saved a whole lot of derp-yank lives.

Those tax rules will still exist of the Gold Standard is reapplied... in fact any financially based system will encourage this sort of practice.

ursury, give unto caeser etc etc. it goes back to roman cannon law (ironically and relevantly, so too the census, which was for the purpose of evaluating property holdings for tax porpoises)

the problem is the scheming jews... no shit on this one, they invented interest. since then, "money" has been fucked. i think it's their revenge for us putting them on the waiwai express through the desert for 40 years. and they're jealous of bacon.

[mashman]

someone worked out (they called it "operation penny drop") that if america hadn't bought an army and staged an occupation of iraq, instead cashing in the same budget for pennies, then flying over 'raq dropping them out of B52s they would have a) done more damage b) caused less civilian casualties c) boosted the iraqi economoney and d) saved a whole lot of derp-yank lives.

ursury, give unto caeser etc etc. it goes back to roman cannon law (ironically and relevantly, so too the census, which was for the purpose of evaluating property holdings for tax porpoises)

the problem is the scheming jews... no shit on this one, they invented interest. since then, "money" has been fucked. i think it's their revenge for us putting them on the waiwai express through the desert for 40 years. and they're jealous of bacon.

ha ha ha ha haaaaaaaa... worked out by stoners, ignored by congress... now there's a bumper sticker.

Is that only as far back as it goes? I woulda thought it went back further for some reason.

I could give a fuck who is at the helm... remove their toys and it won't matter innit.

[Zedder]

And this is the sort of shit people get away with ... It's moderately amusing when scanning te web that there are specialist company's for hire that'll help you test the tax system. Those tax rules will still exist of the Gold Standard is reapplied... in fact any financially based system will encourage this sort of practice. @but but but NZ won;t be seen as business friendly and we won't attract foreign investment. Nothing like a little fear mongering and if these fuckers are gonna stiff the tax payer, I'd rather they weren't allowed to do business here. It's fraud, jail the bastards, make an example of them like the ACC guy that was recently banged up.

Hoi, don't disrespect the gold dude.

But seriously, my understanding of the article was the deal got structured using interpretation of the tax legislation by "experts". However, according to the IRD, they got it wrong. It would have happened under any system.

[Ocean1]

no fuckin way man.

Some would beg to differ with you.

http://tvnz.co.nz/seven-sharp/paying...-video-5336329



Only whilst people like yerself have yer heads up yer arses

I was explaining how private individuals acquire money, and why they bank it.

And you disagree by posting a link to seven-sharp bitching about fractional rates?

Think that's match, dude.

[mashman]

I was explaining how private individuals acquire money, and why they bank it.

And you disagree by posting a link to seven-sharp bitching about fractional rates?

Think that's match, dude.

I decided to cut it short and let the experts explain where the money came from before it becomes wages. I earn a wage, I know how "private" individuals (corporations apparently) "earn" money.

There is no match. The financial system, and by extension your team, doesn't have what it takes to make it even close to a competition. Best we just cooperate

[Akzle]

Is that only as far back as it goes? I woulda thought it went back further for some reason.

ung poke og with one stick this sun-up-downing, ung poke og with two stick next sun-up-downing. interesting eh?

[mashman]

Hoi, don't disrespect the gold dude.

But seriously, my understanding of the article was the deal got structured using interpretation of the tax legislation by "experts". However, according to the IRD, they got it wrong. It would have happened under any system.

A fool and his gold, erm, no a fool and his... ah same shit.

Not under "mine" .

ung poke og with one stick this sun-up-downing, ung poke og with two stick next sun-up-downing. interesting eh?

lolz... not really, quite uninteresting in too many ways, but mainly as it's looking in completely the wrong direction.

[jonbuoy]

Mashman - can you say why you personally are not happy with the money system we have. Is it because other people are struggling or because you personally are struggling? Or are your not struggling but don't like the fact that some people are still acquiring/acquired more wealth than you are?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17543356

[mashman]

Mashman - can you say why you personally are not happy with the money system we have. Is it because other people are struggling or because you personally are struggling? Or are your not struggling but don't like the fact that some people are still acquiring/acquired more wealth than you are?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17543356

I'm alright, I'll always be alright. If I want more, I'll try different things. Hopefully in the next wee while I'll launch one of those things that's been on the burner for a while and see iffen I can fund the assault on the financial system ... gonna have to try. I don't care what people have, not any more, maybe 18 months ago I would have answered that differently, but not any more.

Why eh. Not been asked that before, just usually labelled and that's that. Essentially I see where it's going to lead. It's everything from someone working 16 hours a day in 2 jobs and still needing assistance to make ends meet, to teachers not getting paid properly, to people harming others in the pursuit of a few $, to people warring and killing over resources for profit, to silo'd research disguised as being done for the common good, to a serious waste of resources, to poverty in general, to having enough for all but only if you have $ (where logistics solve that), to the mistrust of conspiracy, to relationships being soured by financial concerns, to teens having kids for cash, to country's being thrown into recession, to education/healthcare to a budget, to the realisation that where someone has lots someone else has to have none, to Chch still needing to be started with a vengeance, to if I want to grow my own tobacco and give it away I shouldn't face jail for wanting to share, to not being truly prepared for any disaster, to burying the future of coming generations in debt, to raping the earth for profit, to the realisation that money really isn't solving the big issues of the day and that I should actually give a shit about that etc... to where I see our generation and future generations ending up. We're headed for something really rather nasty and I believe we can avoid it, or at least make an attempt at doing things for the right reasons for a change in an effort to avoid collapse. Imagine that the financial system is turned off tomorrow and go from there. It may not happen in my lifetime, but I'd say that it's in the post somewhere along the track and I finally give a shit and am prepared to be a part of the changes that are required to give us a shot at a real future. I'm curious how many others would be too.

There's nothing doomsday about that. It's merely an observation over the last 42 years and a wake up call 4/5 years ago that that observation could well come true. I don't see why people need to be at the shitty end, even those who put in zero effort coz they are a minority. Just because we aren't equal, doesn't mean that we shouldn't be allowed to be treated that way. Equity for everyone to be the best that they can without the financial system getting in the way. blah blah blah

Hope that's an answer that you'll understand. What's the point of a financial system?

Edit: just checked your link and 2 years ago pro rata I was off the scale by a factor of just over 2. This year, pre-tax, I'm at the end of the initial scale

[Zedder]

[QUOTE=mashman;1130510392]A fool and his gold, erm, no a fool and his... ah same shit.

Not under "mine" .


In any system, whether it's based on gold/money/beads/fish, the rules or legislation are the words that describe it and provide procedures for people to follow.

So are you saying the NOW system would never have a situation whereby some rules (call them what you like) could get misinterpreted by some "rule" experts and things go wrong?

[mashman]

In any system, whether it's based on gold/money/beads/fish, the rules or legislation are the words that describe it and provide procedures for people to follow.

So are you saying the NOW system would never have a situation whereby some rules (call them what you like) could get misinterpreted by some "rule" experts and things go wrong?

I'm not saying that NOW won't have "rules"... but it won't have many. The 10 commandments would probably suffice to an extent... and to supplement that, we'd still have courts/peer groups to weigh up people's actions should they come under scrutiny. Yup there's an inherent danger there that innocent people will get shafted by nasty bastards, but some things won't change, some will.

[jonbuoy]

But you want to see everyone on the planet having the same standard of living?