Saturday's accident (20 June)

[DEATH_INC.]

Where do I start.....
I saw it happen, I ran back and with a couple of others tried like hell to keep him alive, I felt the deep feeling when someone passes away, I wiped his blood from my hands. I see the accident and the results in my head every time I close my eyes.

Don't you lot think I feel guilty as hell?

BUT I really don't think I could have prevented it, apart from not 'organizing' it, but even that may not have prevented it from happening if he chose to go on his own.
There was no-one else involved. He wasn't 'racing' or even going fast.
Yes it was not terribly well organized, but the route was clearly stated in the first post of the ride, along with the fact that we'll wait for slower riders, no pressure to keep up.

No-one had to come.

Despite all this I still have that sick feeling in my stomach, and will live with this for the rest of my life.

And don't worry, it won't happen again.

R.I.P Disturbed (Micheal Lagore)

[Maha]

Good onya Andy, alot has been said about it but you say it best.

[White trash]

Mate, I'm felling for all that were on the ride and witnessed what was seen. I can't begin to comprehend what you're all going through. The fact of the matter is these accidents happen, regardless of group riding or otherwise.

It's a tragic event that can not be undone.

R.I.P Michael.

[Headbanger]

Mate, I'm felling for all that were on the ride and witnessed what was seen. I can't begin to comprehend what you're all going through. The fact of the matter is these accidents happen, regardless of group riding or otherwise.

It's a tragic event that can not be undone.

R.I.P Michael.


I wrote out and deleted 4 or 5 posts trying to say exactly that, But yours does it better.

[YellowDog]

Look mate, there is no point beating yorself up over this. I don't know you or him, but it made me quite sick reading what happened.

We have all made mistakes on the road. We all know exactly what was going trough his mind just before he died. The fact is that we have all learnt from our mistakes, he just never got the chance to learn from it as his number was up. Very very sad, but life must go on.

My advice to you is to get some councelling over this. It is a very serious thing to get your head around and to try and do it on your own will be tougher than you could imagine. I'd start by changing your Handle/Avatar.

Take it easy. I wish you all the best for the coming months.

[BarBender]

Ditto with Trashy on those who saw and went through the young riders last moments.

You're still an awesome guy in my books Andy. Be strong and take heart that there are those around who are there for you at this time.

RIP Disturbed

[dogsnbikes]

Its Always a gut wrenching situation regardless of how hard you try..was in the same situation last year and it took a while too sink in but we came too terms with the fact that there was nothing more we could have done so we honor them and remember them..I Don't know Micheal but thoughts are with you all,support each other I'm sure he would want that

R.I.P Micheal

[Edbear]

Mate, I'm felling for all that were on the ride and witnessed what was seen. I can't begin to comprehend what you're all going through. The fact of the matter is these accidents happen, regardless of group riding or otherwise.

It's a tragic event that can not be undone.

R.I.P Michael.

+1 and if what you say is true, it is simply that, a tragic accident that you could not have done anything about.

I hope I never have to experience what you and other riders have in this regard. My deepest sympathies and condolences to all involved.

[rachprice]

Where do I start.....
I saw it happen, I ran back and with a couple of others tried like hell to keep him alive, I felt the deep feeling when someone passes away, I wiped his blood from my hands. I see the accident and the results in my head every time I close my eyes.

Don't you lot think I feel guilty as hell?

BUT I really don't think I could have prevented it, apart from not 'organizing' it, but even that may not have prevented it from happening if he chose to go on his own.
There was no-one else involved. He wasn't 'racing' or even going fast.
Yes it was not terribly well organized, but the route was clearly stated in the first post of the ride, along with the fact that we'll wait for slower riders, no pressure to keep up.

No-one had to come.

Despite all this I still have that sick feeling in my stomach, and will live with this for the rest of my life.

And don't worry, it won't happen again.

R.I.P Disturbed (Micheal Lagore)

This is in no way your fault, I know it will be hard to think that but you have to try, because it is the truth

I feel for you and the feelings you must be having, I hope it gets easier soon :hug:

[Shaun S]

Andrew you are a good man - and this thread proves it! You did your best and tried to organise a ride that people would enjoy, the young mans passing was not your fault, it was not preventable (from your side anyway).

I have been reading some of the shit people have been spouting at you and you do not deserve it mate. You organised a ride - you did not pull a trigger. That guilt can be crippling, I really hope it starts to diminish at some stage for you.

Take care of yourself - I can see you have good friends around these parts - use them! They will carry you through.

RIP to the fallen rider.

[R1madness]

Mate, you are not to blame despite how you feel. Do not take ownership of other peoples errors. We all make our own decissions and mistakes in life. The accident is a tragedy, the loss of a life unforgetable.
I agree that some councilling (its just talking about how you feel) will do you a lot of good (think of it a soap for your mind). ACC will fund it if you talk to your GP about it and get a referral. In fact everyone that was on the ride should be entitled to funded councilling.
I feel for you buddy.

[Crisis management]

Despite all this I still have that sick feeling in my stomach, and will live with this for the rest of my life.


I was involved in an accident similar to this a few weeks ago and understand how you feel, hopefully my 2c worth might help.
# It's called an accident because its accidental, shit happens and we are unfortunately left to deal with it. It wasn't your fault.
# It will take time to get over those memories, no they won't go away but they will not haunt you forever. Talk to your mates and keep working the pain out of your system, it is the only solution.
# Turn the net off, the keyboard heroes always have 20/20 hindsight and we all know what we would do if we had the foresight to match but we don't. We do the best we can and then have to muddle through whatever happens.

I don't know you but you've always seemed like a reasonable man on here, hang in there and my thoughts are with you.

Iain

[icekiwi]

It's a tradgedy what happened forsure...
There's no way you can blame yourself for what has happened...
We started the ride with you guys and hooked a left at Kopu instead of going up the coast,real glad we did now I'm not sure I would have liked my partner or myself to have witnessed the aftermath.
Hang in there and I hope all that have been affected by this get through it with the passing of time..
Big heads up for your post it must have been a hell of a thing to go through...


Icekiwi..aka Phil

[MSTRS]

I know nothing bar what I've read. That said, it is clear from that reading that this is/was a terrible accident, that no-one could have realistically foreseen and therefore could not have done anything to prevent.
Our sport does carry it's risks, and even the most responsible riders can sometimes find themselves in the wrong place at the wrong time.
Take care, all.

[SPman]

Don't blame yourself Andy - it's not your fault!

When you ride with a group, as on a "KB website suggested ride", (not organised, because they aren't - they are a loose knit collection of riders who want to ride the same roads at the same time), the dynamics of the group make it impossible to know what's going to happen. Even if they are all experienced mates who always ride together!

When mistakes are made ( and they always are, no ones perfect) and the results are tragic, everyone feels bad, some feel angry, - understandable, but blame shouldn't be an issue unless people are riding 10/10ths with no regard for the road, traffic or anyone else's safety - which was apparently not the case here.

I've ridden with you on Coro rides - I know what you're like - a quick smooth competent rider who doesn't like people to over ride themselves when riding with you (or at all), and one who makes allowances for all riding levels. Plus you're a nice guy. Don't blame yourself!

We are all, ultimately, however, responsible for ourselves, never more so than when we ride - which is surely, one of the reasons we do ride.
You can't control what happens on someone else's bike, any more than someone else can control yours.
It's a shit thing to happen, but it has.

My sympathies to all involved.

[Nasty]

Where do I start.....
I saw it happen, I ran back and with a couple of others tried like hell to keep him alive, I felt the deep feeling when someone passes away, I wiped his blood from my hands. I see the accident and the results in my head every time I close my eyes.

Don't you lot think I feel guilty as hell?

BUT I really don't think I could have prevented it, apart from not 'organizing' it, but even that may not have prevented it from happening if he chose to go on his own.
There was no-one else involved. He wasn't 'racing' or even going fast.
Yes it was not terribly well organized, but the route was clearly stated in the first post of the ride, along with the fact that we'll wait for slower riders, no pressure to keep up.

No-one had to come.

Despite all this I still have that sick feeling in my stomach, and will live with this for the rest of my life.

And don't worry, it won't happen again.

R.I.P Disturbed (Micheal Lagore)

There is so much in this post, that I have lived through myself with Grubs death - the questions I pressed on myself. Its hard Andy, but the reality is that you have no guilt to bear, it was a tradgic accident ... a horrible outcome for a young man. The sick feeling with lessen, but its a time thing and acceptance of what has happened, and knowing/learning/accepting that it was not your fault, not anyone elses on the ride.

My heart goes out to you and your partner at the moment ... as those images are ones which don't easily erase.

RIP Disturbed ... my thoughts are also with you and yours.

Nasty

[Quasievil]

Hell Andy, you know I understand what youre going through mate, no words can bring comfort, just be around friends and those that love you, not even time hells that shit.
Im here for you mate and happy to talk about it with you.

[smoky]

But do we really need 3 or 4 threads on this subject ????

[thecharmed01]

I dont know the exact story here, but as an organiser of any event there will always be those thoughts of 'what if I didnt organise it' going through your mind....

My 2c though, is that you organised it, but the riders chose to attend, the riders chose to ride their bikes and while I have the deepest sympathy to the loved ones he left behind, you need to remind yourself that at the end of the day, he was riding the bike and not you.
There is nothing you could have done more than you did as you didnt have the ability to climb on the bike, take control of the bike and prevent the accident happening.

It was a tragedy, and it is something you will never forget, but you are still here, and if counselling isnt an option for you, maybe use the grief and guilt you feel to do something to help prevent something like this happening again?
Maybe involve yourself in some kind of rider training so other riders can learn how to improve their skills and maybe avoid it happening to them.

I think when we get onto a motorcycle we accept that there is an inherent risk associated with riding it that is much greater than say climbing in a car.
We know it.... but we get on anyway because we value the enjoyment over the risk. We are all adults, and no one forces us to ride motorbikes so you cant go thinking that
Hopefully this rider, will have at least passed doing something he enjoyed and had been having a great day until the end.

*hugs* for you though as you still have a long way to go before you start to put this in perspective in your own mind.
There are 7 stages of grief and you will need to pass through them all, there are no shortcuts.
I do hope you consider the counselling option as I think that could help you a lot.......

[Laxi]

you have nothing to feel guilty about, we are all responsable for ourselves on any ride, if anything ever happened to me on a ride I would not want anybody else to feel guilty for somthing they had no control over

[Genestho]

It will be natural to feel how you do. But you were not riding his bike.

The images you saw will not erase, time does not heal these things.
But you will adapt.
You may even embrace the changes this will bring to your life.

Let this change you.
If you can, find a focus to help you cope through the grief.
Grief is a long hard journey, 7 stages that aren't in any particular order, and there is no time box to say it's over, you go backwards and forwards through the stages, but accept it's a journey that will change you forever.

Take a "mental health break", maybe even from KB, so you don't have to read the "whose fault was it?" Threads?

Just be with those that love you.

I'm not trying to be disrespectful here to what you saw dude, but try to think also, of the family who now face a great, deep crevace that will be never be filled.
Councelling is good if you feel you need to get the "black" thoughts out, that you can't share with most people.

Take care of yourself and your lady :hug:

[Boosted]

Dude big ups on the ride, was awesome even for my first time, but like everyone says, its not your fault, can't control what other people do... Even I feel pretty shity for whats happened and havent riden my bike since sat... but time will heal itself.

[GOONR]

.....the reality is that you have no guilt to bear, it was a tradgic accident ...

I, like many other have read about this accident and wasn't going to post anything as I wasn't there and didn't know the person. As I have quoted Nasty, this was an accident, you cannot blame yourself for the sad outcome of an event that you had no control over.

Take up the offers from your close friends, it’s times like this that the outstretched hand should be taken hold of.

Take care.

[scracha]

FWIW mate, turn off the Internet as it'll just make you angrier. Keep seeing ya friends and keep getting out of bed in the morning. The sleepless nights will pass and you'll start to deal with all the nasty images in yer head.

[steve_t]

Deepest condolences to everyone involved, especially close friends, family, and anyone who saw the accident.

[Matt Bleck]

It's very sad that you feel you have to post this thread Andy, but after seeing some of shitty posts on here I can understand why you have.

kia kaha bro!

[Mom]

Where do I start.....
R.I.P Disturbed (Micheal Lagore)

You start with forgiving yourself for any guilt you are bringing on yourself about the fact that a young man lost his life on a ride that you posted here on KB.

Notice I said posted too. We both know the difference between an organised ride and a group ride posted here on the forum. Last Junes Cheesecutter/Westpac Helicopter Ride was oragnised for example, hells teeth we even had a friggen time keeper to keep us on target times, wore fluro vests, the whole nine yards. A few weeks ago we all went on a group ride up to Mangawhai, it was posted on here and we went on a ride. The destination was known and while some of us did not know the exact route that was being taken we all stuck together until we did not need to. Some of us rode much quicker than others but we all ended at the pub in one piece and enjoyed a chin wag and something to eat and drink. We all rode home too as I recall.

At any time on either of those occasions something could have gone wrong for one of us and a tragedy could have happened. It didn't. There by the grace of God go we.

I am really sorry that you witnessed what must have been a truely horrendous thing to see. Comfort yourself with the fact that you were there and were able to offer some comfort to the young man that died. That on it's own take some stupendous balls and I salute you for it!

Go easy on yourself mate. There have been some negative posts on here since this happened, take them for what they are, people venting their own shock about what happened. There has been some truely appalling shit posted on here today, just shows the character of the person posting I guess, dont let someone elses mental illness creep in to your mind AT ALL!

Take the time to talk to your friends and family about it, take time to recover from something like this. Let those close to you love you and care for you. Come for a pootle up this way soon so I can give you in person the hug I am giving you on here now.

Take care mate.

[MIXONE]

It's very sad that you feel you have to post this thread Andy, but after seeing some of shitty posts on here I can understand why you have.

kia kaha bro!

+ 1.
Grief affects people in so many different ways.

[MyGSXF]

I don't know anything about this tragic event.. but my deepest condolences to all those involved..

Andy.. please get yourself some Bach "Rescue Remedy" from a chemist or health shop.. & use it lots!! It will help!! :yes:

:hug:

[paulmac]

here by the grace of God go we.

Come for a pootle up this way soon so I can give you in person the hug I am giving you on here now.

Take care mate.

Thats it in a nut shell, thanks MOM.

Do not mourn the death but celebrate the life that was !

Paul.

[idleidolidyll]

As the other eye witness who gave a statement to police, I totally support Andy.

We tried hard both to keep Michael with us and to make him think of friends and family.

As Andy says, Michael was riding slow, much slower than us when he crashed and I managed to stop on the corner just 10-15 metres past where he lay.
The cops have said speed was a major factor; that's bullshit and I'm disgusted that they would ignore the two eye witness statements. Michael left Whitianga well before us and we had just caught him when the accident happened. I estimate I was doing maybe 70-80 around that corner and he was significantly slower. I intend to head to the site and with my GPS, measure the markers as I believe the media and the police owe his family an apology.

I've spoken to Michaels mum and been in contact with Michaels fiancee: He was no noob, Michael was an experienced rider and that was noted by a few riders who rode quite a way in his company and by seeing his perfect entry and exit lines in several photos I took (much better lines than 75% of the rest of the bikes in my pics).

I don't believe Michael would be laying guilt on Andy and I'm saddened and ashamed that others are.

Andy, his wife and I will share this memory forever as will a few others who were close to the scene. We don't need those who were not there and didn't see the circumstances speaking without thinking or using this sad accident to push their personal barrows about group rides, organisers or the Coro loop; we get enough crap from the police without having it from our own.

Michael, I hope you and your Dad are smiling together now.

[CookMySock]

Andy.. please get yourself some Bach "Rescue Remedy" from a chemist or health shop.. & use it lots!! It will help!!Another really good one is Omega3 essential fatty acids (fish oil and others.) Take six grams morning and night and watch stress vanish completely. Ask at your health food shop. DO IT.

Sorry to hear you guys went through this. I haven't had the misfortune to see that, and from what I have read here, I will make damn sure I don't.

best,
Steve

[chanceyy]

Andy deepest sympathy to yourself and to others who wittnessed the accident .. and echo others regarding councelling

I too agree with mom by the grace of god I go ... I never posted on the other threads as I was not there did not see first hand (although I have been busy moderating) .. I appreciated the posts from III, which clearly stated that it was no ones fault, so please stop feeling guilty .. its simply a tragic accident..

I know from his mothers blog that she appreciated everyones efforts and please take some small comfort he did not die alone, because you guys were there. It will take time and the pain will ease however there is no guilt to be felt for posting a ride.

:hug: to everyone involved

[Paul in NZ]

I wasn't there but.... I've been there and yes, it definately changes you and it changes everything and somehow it seems, nothing changes... Sometimes it will seem like no one else understands but unfortunately some do...

The sense of guilt, the grief, the questioning is a mark of your decency and humanity and it does all involved some credit. Shit does happen and when serious shit happens there are serious questions. If there was no out pouring of grief and emotion I would be vastly more concerned...

People talk about your brothers riding at your shoulder as if it's all some kinda wierd 'nice' movie like ghost or a david mann painting, even a cool thing. But first those brothers have to pass the veil and thats never easy, it's not a movie its REAL. Big tough 1% types cry and bleed just like the rest of us and like I said it aint easy.

Fault, blame, guilt and anger changes nothing, living and adapting, remembering and learning does change things... No blame here for you, just some understanding.

[Tink]

Where do I start.....
I saw it happen, I ran back and with a couple of others tried like hell to keep him alive, I felt the deep feeling when someone passes away, I wiped his blood from my hands. I see the accident and the results in my head every time I close my eyes.

Don't you lot think I feel guilty as hell?

BUT I really don't think I could have prevented it, apart from not 'organizing' it, but even that may not have prevented it from happening if he chose to go on his own.
There was no-one else involved. He wasn't 'racing' or even going fast.
Yes it was not terribly well organized, but the route was clearly stated in the first post of the ride, along with the fact that we'll wait for slower riders, no pressure to keep up.

No-one had to come.

Despite all this I still have that sick feeling in my stomach, and will live with this for the rest of my life.

And don't worry, it won't happen again.

R.I.P Disturbed (Micheal Lagore)

I was like a fly on the wall this day.. only wishing Geordie and I could be with you all... tears and thoughts... your a good person.. never blame yourself.. we all take risks in life... on two wheel.. or on wings.. or more. x


As the other eye witness who gave a statement to police, I totally support Andy.

We tried hard both to keep Michael with us and to make him think of friends and family.

As Andy says, Michael was riding slow, much slower than us when he crashed and I managed to stop on the corner just 10-15 metres past where he lay.
The cops have said speed was a major factor; that's bullshit and I'm disgusted that they would ignore the two eye witness statements. Michael left Whitianga well before us and we had just caught him when the accident happened. I estimate I was doing maybe 70-80 around that corner and he was significantly slower. I intend to head to the site and with my GPS, measure the markers as I believe the media and the police owe his family an apology.

I've spoken to Michaels mum and been in contact with Michaels fiancee: He was no noob, Michael was an experienced rider and that was noted by a few riders who rode quite a way in his company and by seeing his perfect entry and exit lines in several photos I took (much better lines than 75% of the rest of the bikes in my pics).

I don't believe Michael would be laying guilt on Andy and I'm saddened and ashamed that others are.

Andy, his wife and I will share this memory forever as will a few others who were close to the scene. We don't need those who were not there and didn't see the circumstances speaking without thinking or using this sad accident to push their personal barrows about group rides, organisers or the Coro loop; we get enough crap from the police without having it from our own.

Michael, I hope you and your Dad are smiling together now.

Faith is in knowing...


I wasn't there but.... I've been there and yes, it definately changes you and it changes everything and somehow it seems, nothing changes... Sometimes it will seem like no one else understands but unfortunately some do...

The sense of guilt, the grief, the questioning is a mark of your decency and humanity and it does all involved some credit. Shit does happen and when serious shit happens there are serious questions. If there was no out pouring of grief and emotion I would be vastly more concerned...

People talk about your brothers riding at your shoulder as if it's all some kinda wierd 'nice' movie like ghost or a david mann painting, even a cool thing. But first those brothers have to pass the veil and thats never easy, it's not a movie its REAL. Big tough 1% types cry and bleed just like the rest of us and like I said it aint easy.

Fault, blame, guilt and anger changes nothing, living and adapting, remembering and learning does change things... No blame here for you, just some understanding.

Good words... you ride in safety .. 11 Sept 2001 I flew across the world .. we all take steps in life... in safety of our own expectations.. go with the wind.

[YellowDog]

Mate, we wern't there and can only go on what was reported. Thank you for the info.

You guys don't need to convince anyone you are not guilty. You know you are not and that should be enough. If you are not careful this will take over your lives.

Like has already been said, you have been through a terrible trauma and need to have supporting friends and family around you.

Take care and good luck.

[gunnyrob]

Condolances & best wishes for all involved.

I did the Coro loop in concert with Pumbaa, Ninja Nana & Greg on Saturday too. We were about 2 hours behind you lot, but we stayed in Whiritoa that night & heard the news there.

Up till that point, all we could say was that it was one of "those days", as in one of those days where it was perfect, the weather, the roads, the company, all of it.

It's a tragedy that your guys ride ended the way it did, I can't comment about the incident as I wasn't there, but as the others have said, you can't shoulder the blame. Get help, & you'll get through it. Ride on, shiny side up.

[dpex]

Mate, you are not to blame despite how you feel. Do not take ownership of other peoples errors. We all make our own decissions and mistakes in life. The accident is a tragedy, the loss of a life unforgetable.
I agree that some councilling (its just talking about how you feel) will do you a lot of good (think of it a soap for your mind). ACC will fund it if you talk to your GP about it and get a referral. In fact everyone that was on the ride should be entitled to funded councilling.
I feel for you buddy.

What he said. Best advice yet.

[Paul in NZ]

As the other eye witness who gave a statement to police,

Sorry if this is inappropriate but.... Are those poor officers getting the counselling they need after one of your statements? :crazy:

[davereid]

RIP Disturbed.

Any time we do something for pleasure, we take a risk. Sometimes we misjudge something, and get to look back at it, other times we don't.

You were not riding for him, you can't take responsibility.

Saying to yourself "should I have organised this ride ?" "Should I have ridden more slowly ?" and the hundreds of other things that go through your head are not helpful.

Its the great kiwi way to shoulder blame or responsibility, and to try and conjure up ways of making sure things dont go wrong again. Often its to be admired. But in this case it's not needed.

I understand Mike misjudged a corner.

Thats one of the reasons we ride, for the pleasure of not doing something entirely within our skill set, something that leaves us a little wound up as we take a little risk.

[RT527]

Good luck Death All the advice given will be helpful to you.

Get Well soon Andy and all others Involved in this incident, you all should get in touch with Thames victim support and see if they can point you in the right direction for help failing that your GP as has been suggested can help you with any problems you are having.

Things for partners to look out for, Any mood swings both ways , any headaches, not sleeping, things out of the norm for your partners usual habits.
Another thing no one can force anyone to get help so just support them and guide them eventually they will need and seek it.

Good luck Guys and Girls

[cowpatz]

Is there a thread with the accident details anywhere? All I have read is that a respected rider has tragically lost his life during an organised ride on an otherwise "perfect day". I'm just wondering about the reason he came off as from what I have read he was a confident rider, taking good lines, and at "normal" speeds. Was this a low or high side drop or was another vehicle or object involved? Was the bike handling OK? I am just trying to gain a mental picture of what happened and why. No judgements just the observed facts and prior comments made that may help understand. For all of us this is our worst nightmare and anything that can come of this that can help us understand what happened and even perhaps help us improve our own riding would be most beneficial.
My deepest condolences to partner and family.

[Nasty]

Is there a thread with the accident details anywhere? All I have read is that a respected rider has tragically lost his life during an organised ride on an otherwise "perfect day". I'm just wondering about the reason he came off as from what I have read he was a confident rider, taking good lines, and at "normal" speeds. Was this a low or high side drop or was another vehicle or object involved? Was the bike handling OK? I am just trying to gain a mental picture of what happened and why. No judgements just the observed facts and prior comments made that may help understand. For all of us this is our worst nightmare and anything that can come of this that can help us understand what happened and even perhaps help us improve our own riding would be most beneficial.
My deepest condolences to partner and family.

No there is not a thread on details.

[MSTRS]

No there is not a thread on details.

And it's not needed.
There are enough facts scattered through the threads that do exist to work out (as much as it is possible) what happened. Even the riders who were there don't really know, for sure.

[Max Preload]

I wasn't there but it seems to me there is a lot of bullshit being bandied in this and the other thread regarding riding mob mentality causing people to ride beyond their own limits. However, the actual witnesses say otherwise.

Might I suggest they get the fuck off their soap boxs and just see it for what it is - a tragic accident caused by a momentary lapse of judgement of an individual. There is no blame to be apportioned to other riders who happened to be along for this ride.

[Quasievil]

Might I suggest they get the fuck off their soap boxs

No Soap Box = No KB :crazy:

[Max Preload]

No Soap Box = No KB :crazy:

You win THIS round!

[cowpatz]

Part of the problem is that it is scattered amongst many threads and I dont have time to trawl thru everyone or guess which might be applicable. I just really wanted to know essentially what happened and if I can learn anything from it.
If those that were there did not see or hear anything then I guess we will never really know what happened and that is the end of the matter.

[davereid]

Part of the problem is that it is scattered amongst many threads and I dont have time to trawl thru everyone or guess which might be applicable. I just really wanted to know essentially what happened and if I can learn anything from it.
If those that were there did not see or hear anything then I guess we will never really know what happened and that is the end of the matter.

Those who were there have decided that its better not to comment, possibly out of respect for Michael.

You will have to form your opinion based on media reports.

[Zapf]

Andy, it has nothing to do with you. And what has been is in the past and none of us can do anything to change it. And nothing you know now can change anything similar in the future, unless we all sit and wait till the time of our end.

I have known you long enough, since I was learning on my 250 and the good number of rides out 22 and Coro we have done together. And I know I will always be in good company when you and Draco is around.

Regards. and RIP to the fallen.

[Marmoot]

I don't think there is a better person in here to comment than Zapf.

[Virago]

Part of the problem is that it is scattered amongst many threads and I dont have time to trawl thru everyone or guess which might be applicable. I just really wanted to know essentially what happened and if I can learn anything from it...

You have NO right to be privy to the details of the accident.

An accident involving death will be under police investigation, and this site is not the place for the public dissemination of and speculation about eye-witness accounts.

There are firm Site Rules regarding the posting of accident details, and also speculation about the accident causes. I suggest you familiarise yourself with those rules, before making further demands for information that is none of your business.

[idleidolidyll]

<!-- / icon and title --> <!-- message --> I've just added 3 photos to the 20th June Coro Loop ride album: http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/al...p?albumid=2272 (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/album.php?albumid=2272)

Michaels' funeral was yesterday and about 10 KB Riders attended.
Motorcycles were a big part of Michaels' life and in the images shown on the screen at the service, his earliest ride looks to have been about the age of 5 on a small off road bike.
Michaels' father was a keen motorcyclist and many of the friends and family are part of New Zealands' motorcycle community.

Michaels' friends and family thanked us for the friendship and companionship Michael had with us and thanked some for specific help. They hold nobody responsible for Michaels accident and offer us only the best.

Shannon, the guy driving the 4WD Michael hit, also attended and Michaels' entire family opened their arms and hearts to all of us who were there.

In return we were able to tell them of the joy and excitement Michael had on his last day riding and showing off his pride and joy; that new Triumph.

The three pictures added all are of, or include, Michael.

[margy]

Hi Andy,

It's Margy here, Michael's mum. It has been nearly three months now since Michael's accident. I have only just now opened this website to read what has been said. I had no idea you have been going through all this and feel I must let you know just how I feel.

Truely, you must get help from someone to cope with this as what your friends are telling you is true - IT WAS NOT YOUR FAULT - Michael was riding the bike - he was responsible. I firmly believe - we are all on this earth for a certain time and when our time is up - well, we all move on to the next adventure whatever that may be.

Michael was not a novice rider. He had been riding for 10 years and had attended several rider training days with the Waikato/BOP Harley Davidson group - generally blowing the tutors away with his skills. He inherited his dad's '97 Heritage Springer and led Mark's memorial ride back in 2005. He rode that bike just like his dad did - hard, but skillful - he was a competant rider in all respects.

As Michael had two small children to care for and a mortgage around his neck he decided he didn't need this HD in his life at the moment and his uncle Karl had always dreamed of owning one... Michael gave it to Karl to use as he wished until Michael turned 40 - so if any of you guys see or hear (because you will hear it) a white ol'boy down in Taranaki - give Karl the thumbs up.

Michael eventually got the money together for his Triumph and he was just buzzing. Andy, there were other things happening in Michael's life at the time that were giving him stress - his own emotions would have been in turmoil. We all know that it takes time to get to feel part of a new bike - Michael had only owned the bike for a few weeks - he had not come to that point where we feel completely comfortable and confident with the bike we are riding. That said, it was Michael who was riding. I could blame myself just as much as you do - it was Mark and I who set the example to Michael - as we both always ran on adrenalin - Michael grew up with this.

The photo from Mike Breen - it's wonderful - I can see Michael smiling under his helmet. He was having "the time of his life" just as the song suggests. Michael was doing what he loved most.

Andy - I would love to talk to you if and when you are ready. (021 071 0387) I know Michael's time was up - I know he is in a good place now and from all accounts he is doing amazing work where he is. He has always made me proud - every moment of every day. Heaps of people have had messages from him and several of these have been about the people who were with him in the end. He said they were wonderful, especially the lovely lady, and he was at peace. I don't know if you believe in this stuff....... but I certainly do.

Margy

[ynot slow]

Margy what a mum you are.

I think I've seen the bike back in the naki,very bloody impressive too,was at Whanga pub with a few of us there.

[thecharmed01]

*hugs* Margy....
Wonderful words, from a wonderful person. I am sorry for your loss, but your post is so from the heart that I can't help but want to give you a huge hug and tell you that from all I have read and heard, your family are a very lovely lot who are now missing a gem!
As a mum who rides, with a partner who rides and a 1 year old who loves motorcycles, I have the same fears about my son riding, but at the end of the day it will be his choice... all I can do is what you did : educate him and then PRAY that he heeds the advice given and doesnt strike it unlucky out there.
My thoughts are still with you....

[Crazy Steve]

Very sad....:crybaby:

Crazy Steve.