Riding fast in the rain

[carver]

so it seems the wet weather has set in, and so long as you take it easy in the corners, you can still hold a good pace in the rain.
so long as your tires are hot and you are gentle on the controls, everything is pretty sweet.
make sure you have good tires too!

[scumdog]

Oh, and don't forget to add: Make sure there's no sudden obstacles, no surprise puddles, no tar snakes, nobody changing lanes suddenly etc and you should be alright...

[carver]

Oh, and don't forget to add: Make sure there's no sudden obstacles, no surprise puddles, no tar snakes, nobody changing lanes suddenly etc and you should be alright...

oh, a added bonus is less police around on the main roads.
so your free to concentrate on the task at hand

[scumdog]

oh, a added bonus is less police around on the main roads.
so your free to concentrate on the task at hand
Police stop you concentrating?

SHeesh, lucky for both of us we don't ride together eh!:shit:

[JayRacer37]

Riding in the rain is certainly good for teaching you to be smooth...gotta be able to ride in all conditions to be an 'all round' rider! :)

[Highlander]

Riding in the rain is certainly good for teaching you to be smooth...gotta be able to ride in all conditions to be an 'all round' rider! :)

I agree with that, but you also need to realise that if you need to stop (think emergency situations) your brakes aren't as effective as the try to slow your wheel rotation and your tyres won't grab the road as well. Both of these will increase your stopping distance so you should probably keep your speed down.

[Big Dave]

Fucking tar snakes are getting out of control here.

[JayRacer37]

I agree with that, but you also need to realise that if you need to stop (think emergency situations) your brakes aren't as effective as the try to slow your wheel rotation and your tyres won't grab the road as well. Both of these will increase your stopping distance so you should probably keep your speed down.

Indeed. Mind you - the biggest difference is how effective your brakes are initally. If you are a bit patient, wait for the front end to load up and then PROGESSIVLY squeeze the brake harder you might be suprised how close you can get to dry weather braking distances. The biggest thing in the wet - make your transitions smooth and slow... (ie from gas to brake, tipping into corners)

[Drew]

A thread about being more of a dick, now in the rain.

I have a feeling your motorcycling career aint gonna last Carver, hope you dont fuck anyone else up in your quest to push the boundries everywhere.

And you better hope, that if you do, they are not a friend of mine.

[hayd3n]

ii actually think he has a good post this time

[carver]

Police stop you concentrating?

SHeesh, lucky for both of us we don't ride together eh!:shit:

haha, only if your plainclothes.
you can go no clothes bar the hat and shoes and baton.


Riding in the rain is certainly good for teaching you to be smooth...gotta be able to ride in all conditions to be an 'all round' rider! :)

it sure does, and teaches you how to feel the limit


A thread about being more of a dick, now in the rain.

I have a feeling your motorcycling career aint gonna last Carver, hope you dont fuck anyone else up in your quest to push the boundries everywhere.

And you better hope, that if you do, they are not a friend of mine.

there is always one person who is too one eye'd to see the point.

i love this, dont do anything stupid around me or my mates...it makes no sense!
i mean, how would i know?


ii actually think he has a good post this time

thank you

[CookMySock]

Fucking tar snakes are getting out of control here.The tar snakes are fucking again?

Steve

[justsomeguy]

If you really must know go ask White Thrash, Jimmy did consistent late 30 second laps on the old Taupo track WITH ONE INCH STANDING WATER and pretty severe rain at one of Frosty's early trackdays on a K3 thou.

The track was closed for the day as soon as that session finished.

Then practice on the track ONLY.

[carver]

Indeed. Mind you - the biggest difference is how effective your brakes are initally. If you are a bit patient, wait for the front end to load up and then PROGESSIVLY squeeze the brake harder you might be suprised how close you can get to dry weather braking distances. The biggest thing in the wet - make your transitions smooth and slow... (ie from gas to brake, tipping into corners)

i was surprised how hard i could brake on cold slicks in the wet!
learning to load up the brakes is a good way to learn, as is easing on the gas.

once it has rained for a while, and the road is clean, the grip factor aint bad, then when it dries, its pretty fucking good

[carver]

If you really must know go ask White Thrash, Jimmy did consistent late 30 second laps on the old Taupo track WITH ONE INCH STANDING WATER and pretty severe rain at one of Frosty's early trackdays on a K3 thou.

The track was closed for the day as soon as that session finished.

Then practice on the track ONLY.

were their many bins?
i did a wet track day recently.
with wets it seemed like you could still get a good pace on.
chrislost did well

[Big Dave]

The tar snakes are fucking again?

Steve


Like rabbits.

[junkmanjoe]

this may sound a bit silly, but i like to go for a ride in the wind, or windy conditions
i find its good for ballance control.

as for the rain, no trouble keeping a good speed, but yip just slow for the corners, and watch the white lines....:Oops:...that was close..

[justsomeguy]

were their many bins?
i did a wet track day recently.
with wets it seemed like you could still get a good pace on.
chrislost did well

No bins, only fellas out in that session were WhiteThrash, Drew (I think), DSS3, Loosebruce, Death_Inc, Sugilite (I think) and a few others of a similar skill level.

They're not exactly a bunch of newbies....

[justsomeguy]

Like rabbits.

As long as they don't do it like the immigrant 's you guys should be fine:innocent:

[carver]

No bins, only fellas out in that session were WhiteThrash, Drew (I think), DSS3, Loosebruce, Death_Inc, Sugilite (I think) and a few others of a similar skill level.

They're not exactly a bunch of newbies....

no, all running wets i guess?
would you agree that riding fast in the wet on a track and doing the same on a road are two very different things?

[DEATH_INC.]

no, all running wets i guess?
would you agree that riding fast in the wet on a track and doing the same on a road are two very different things?
Nope, no wets in them days, I was on a supercorsa front and bt002 rear from memory....
As for different, the only real differences are the unknowns on the road, like flying into a corner and finding a bunch of shit washed across the road, or a big fat tarsnake.....then yer in the shit, but the techniques are the same.
The Late Loosebruce taught me how to ga fast in the wet, that boy could fly...
The trick is really to keep ya pace up so the tyres stay warm, but as above it has it's risks..

[crazyhorse]

:cold::woohoo:when riding in the rain, it a:shit::sunny::whocares::scooter: it awlays pays to stay smooth, ride like normal. More practice the better, I say. Like riding on shingle. Guys are too scared ...... chicken shits!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[steve_t]

:cold::woohoo:when riding in the rain, it a:shit::sunny::whocares::scooter: it awlays pays to stay smooth, ride like normal. More practice the better, I say. Like riding on shingle. Guys are too scared ...... chicken shits!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Huh? :wari:

[MotoKuzzi]

Went for a ride in the wet today on a familiar road, and doing extremely moderate speeds ( less than 80kph ) with no severe throttle inputs. Lost traction the first time on a moderate left hander, the bike drifted sideways a foot or so and regained footing. Second time going up hill and started a moderate acceleration to change up a gear doing about 70k when the engine suddenly over reved and the rear wheel let go and spun up. I was sitting fairly upright and throttled off instinctively but thought I was gonna lose it because it was heading into a sideways drift. All of a sudden it regained grip with a bang through the driveshaft, started to wobble, shook its head a couple of times and settled down to a normal ride, all before I even had time to consciously react. Prior to today I never had any problems riding in the wet, and can only put it down to diesel / oil on the road. :sweatdrop

[justsomeguy]

no, all running wets i guess?
would you agree that riding fast in the wet on a track and doing the same on a road are two very different things?

Nope - running normal tyres. All the guys I mentioned are in my opinion some of the best non-professional riders around (anywhere). I wouldn't recommend copying them - but learning from their advice.

Riding (RIDING ONLY) on the track and road are pretty similar - in that you do similar things as far as the mechanics of riding are concerned - braking, throttle application, body movements and weight transferring. On the road you ride using similar techniques but at lower speeds for as you know there are no professional sweeper trucks, ambos, marshalls, perfect surfaces and the same corner every so many seconds - and hey?? Is that mum coming towards me in the opposite lane in that cage?

[justsomeguy]

The Late Loosebruce taught me how to ga fast in the wet, that boy could fly...

I think Loosebruce used black magic to prevent the water from touching his tyres, never seemed to matter how wet it got with that chap.


RIP mate.

[James Deuce]

i was surprised how hard i could brake on cold slicks in the wet!
learning to load up the brakes is a good way to learn, as is easing on the gas.

once it has rained for a while, and the road is clean, the grip factor aint bad, then when it dries, its pretty fucking good

You can brake just as hard in the wet as you can in the dry, you just need to know what you are doing to get there. Practice helps.

[McWild]

this may sound a bit silly, but i like to go for a ride in the wind, or windy conditions
i find its good for ballance control.

as for the rain, no trouble keeping a good speed, but yip just slow for the corners, and watch the white lines....:Oops:...that was close..

The pic in your signature gives me the impression that you're not so bothered by riding in "wet" conditions.

[carver]

Nope, no wets in them days, I was on a supercorsa front and bt002 rear from memory....
As for different, the only real differences are the unknowns on the road, like flying into a corner and finding a bunch of shit washed across the road, or a big fat tarsnake.....then yer in the shit, but the techniques are the same.
The Late Loosebruce taught me how to ga fast in the wet, that boy could fly...
The trick is really to keep ya pace up so the tyres stay warm, but as above it has it's risks..

yeah, i find you have to be very consistent and keep your cool and as always, ride by feel.
that just my way of describing it.


Nope - running normal tyres. All the guys I mentioned are in my opinion some of the best non-professional riders around (anywhere). I wouldn't recommend copying them - but learning from their advice.

Riding (RIDING ONLY) on the track and road are pretty similar - in that you do similar things as far as the mechanics of riding are concerned - braking, throttle application, body movements and weight transferring. On the road you ride using similar techniques but at lower speeds for as you know there are no professional sweeper trucks, ambos, marshalls, perfect surfaces and the same corner every so many seconds - and hey?? Is that mum coming towards me in the opposite lane in that cage?

on the road, your constantly needing to adapt, there is no real settling in.
just in my view

[Katman]

The trick to riding on wet roads - stay relaxed.

[Thunder 8]

You can brake just as hard in the wet as you can in the dry, you just need to know what you are doing to get there. Practice helps.


Hahahahahahahahahahah.......... Like fuck ya can.

[carver]

The trick to riding on wet roads - stay relaxed.

i agree with that, dont let anything upset your style

[Firefight]

Coldkiwi , that boi was dam fast, but he did have the inside edge on me and many others we rode with... those that remeber him will know what that was..



F/F

[Katman]

i agree with that, dont let anything upset your style

I have style even stopped at traffic lights.

[carver]

Coldkiwi , that boi was dam fast, but he did have the inside edge on me and many others we rode with... those that remeber him will know what that was..



F/F

what, is he dead?
he rode a K1 GSXR eh?
i beat him last year in the slow race, he got a bit shitty about it online here.


I have style even stopped at traffic lights.

its called a rolling burnout away from them

[Firefight]

No not dead, he got married, that slowed him down a bit,

don,t recall him having a gxxer 1000, he had a shitty gxxer 600 when I rode with him, wonder if were talkin about the same dude ?

was one of the most relaxed wet day riders I have ridden with ..

F/F

[roadracingoldfart]

If you want to know how to ride fast in the wet then ask Nicksta , she is awesome in the rain .
I know that several of the guys pray for a fine meeting just so they can stay infront of her lol.

[boman]

Oh, and don't forget to add: Make sure there's no sudden obstacles, no surprise puddles, no tar snakes, nobody changing lanes suddenly etc and you should be alright...

Also those lovely slick patches of road, where the tar has melted up past the chip, making the corner like riding on glass.

:gob:

[YellowDog]

I do quite like to make good progress in the wet, but only if the traffic is light.

[Indiana_Jones]

Take it real easy out there aye, my back wheel fucking slide out on those greasy roads near Mr. Merde's place! >_<

-Indy

[rosie631]

Also those lovely slick patches of road, where the tar has melted up past the chip, making the corner like riding on glass.

:gob:

Yep, think that's what I hit last Sunday. Hence my new ride - see my avatar.

[boman]

Yep, it wouldn't surprise me at all. Nasty f#!kers those patches. I hit one a couple of weeks ago. Didn't bin it, but I'm still looking for my seat. :blink::shit::sweatdrop

[Drew]

there is always one person who is too one eye'd to see the point.

i love this, dont do anything stupid around me or my mates...it makes no sense!
i mean, how would i know?

I never bothered to say dont do anything stupid, with you it's foregone. I said hope you dont nail anyone I know when ya do it.

I see though, that everyone else has taken the thread differently to me, so I'll say sorry for jumping to the wrong conclusion.

As a serious thread, my two cents is in agreement with the smooth approach. But I'm being given false credit, I sat that really wet session out at taupo.

[MarkH]

No not dead, he got married

Either way his life is now over. :lol:

In my younger days I recall having some scary moments in the wet:
Going around a corner and my front wheel sliding - rolled off the throttle and waited for grip to return, luckily it did.
Coming out of a corner and the rear drifting out on acceleration - held it but it sure got the heart rate up.
Coming up to a give way and locking the rear, it tried to pass the front - I lifted my foot of the brake and the bike just snapped straight, whew!
Taking off from an intersection and the rear took off from under me - broken clutch lever and I looked back to the bit of road to see a pretty rainbow on the surface.

Now days I ride with more caution in the wet. Brake earlier and more gently and before I get to the painted 'give way' or 'stop'. Watch out for the slippery metal manhole covers. Slower cornering speed. Easy on the throttle. But I will still ride at 100kph on the open road where it is safe to do so.

[AD345]

Pfft.

fast riding in the rain? No worries

I've gone 2 or 3 metres at a time with the throttle hard aganst the stops

[James Deuce]

Hahahahahahahahahahah.......... Like fuck ya can.
You might want to work on it then.

Get a G Meter. Attach it to your bike. Head to a dry track and measure peak G.

Wet the track. Your peak G reading should be damn near the same.

It's how you get there that is different.

[Sketchy_Racer]

You might want to work on it then.

Get a G Meter. Attach it to your bike. Head to a dry track and measure peak G.

Wet the track. Your peak G reading should be damn near the same.

It's how you get there that is different.

Yep, If you can do a stoppie in the wet, then you can brake has/near as hard in the wet as the dry. The biggest difference if the wheel momentarily locks up (over a bump or something) in the wet, you have to release the brakes much more and once the wheel is starting to gain traction again, that also takes more time than in dry conditions.

I hate riding in the wet due to the fact that I get cold and wet, but the riding side of it has grown on me quite a bit, and it's surprising how much grip there really is and lap times only drop about 8-9%

http://skachillracing.co.nz/gallery.php?display=2009-05-08

[Thunder 8]

You might want to work on it then.

Get a G Meter. Attach it to your bike. Head to a dry track and measure peak G.

Wet the track. Your peak G reading should be damn near the same.

It's how you get there that is different.
Wouldnt you say Peak G has nothing to do that. you said you can brake as hard in the wet as in the dry. Yes you probably get a similar PEAK reading but that only reflects the moment of braking not the rest of it .

[James Deuce]

What I said is completely correct. You can brake as hard in the wet as in the dry. It's how you do it that matters. You can generate the same force between tyre and tarmac. The amount of negative acceleration you generate has everything to do with braking force.

[Muppet]

Oh, and don't forget to add: Make sure there's no sudden obstacles, no surprise puddles, no tar snakes, nobody changing lanes suddenly etc and you should be alright...

Or trees falling over in front of you!:crazy:

[caseye]

Lots of good advice here for any new riders.Mainly, as always, ride to the conditions and learn how hard you can brake in the wet before you actually need to do it in a real life situation.
Nice thread carver.

[FROSTY]

What I said is completely correct. You can brake as hard in the wet as in the dry. It's how you do it that matters. You can generate the same force between tyre and tarmac. The amount of negative acceleration you generate has everything to do with braking force.
On the ROAD I try to avoid hard braking or cornering in the rain. I know full well as Jim has stated above that yep I can in IDEAL conditions stop about as fast in the rain as in the dry. To me the issue is that all the stuff that makes conditions far from ideal seem to rear their ugly heads. Like Big dave said tar snakes seem extra nasty. White lines,diesel spills, running water,manhole covers and a heap of other nastys are not so easy to spot and avoid.The worst part about em is that in the dry they pose no issue at all Loose gravel on intersections is a pet hate of mine in the wet so I'll tippy toe arount an ntersection I'm not familiar with.

[jrandom]

My main bugaboo is the surfaces other than tarmac. Tar snakes, road marking paint, etc. Like Frosty just said.

And who likes being wet and cold? Blehhh.

Working as a bicycle courier has definitely helped me to get comfy on dodgy surfaces, mind you. In the Auckland CBD, it's all diesel slicks from buses, manhole covers and road markings. Not to mention V-brakes that simply don't work on wet rims. Rainy days are hilarious.

I recommend Vittoria Randonneurs to anyone riding a bicycle throughout winter, by the way. They're good.

[James Deuce]

There's a lot of myths about motorcycle braking. The top three are:

1. The front brake will make you crash.
2. Bikes can't out-brake cars.
3. You can't brake hard in the wet.

The top myth about accident avoidance is:

1. Brake really, really hard when you see something scary.

If you ride everywhere at 200km/hr plus, you need to be able to brake hard at that speed to a complete stop, or be able to accurately steer around a hazard.

I've howled the front tyre in heavy traffic, in the wet, at an ambient temperature less than 5 degrees C, more than once without falling off.

The most important thing about braking is practice. Most riders don't know how quickly they can stop in the dry from 100 km/hr, let alone in the wet.

[jrandom]

The most important thing about braking is practice.

True dat.

One thing I've noticed is that many road riding focused 'practice and training' folk seem to be all about braking in straight lines.

Turning under hard braking is a crucial skill. Perhaps more crucial than simply standing the bike on its nose.

And trackdays are the place to learn that. Go forth and learn how not to die, folks!

[BMWST?]

What I said is completely correct. You can brake as hard in the wet as in the dry. It's how you do it that matters. You can generate the same force between tyre and tarmac. The amount of negative acceleration you generate has everything to do with braking force.

but the same force is generated over a longer period of time,so you cant stop as quickly

[BMWST?]

There's a lot of myths about motorcycle braking.


2. Bikes can't out-brake cars.



thats not a myth.Thats a fact

[James Deuce]

but the same force is generated over a longer period of time,so you cant stop as quickly


There's very little distance in it, if you know what you are doing. Single figure percentage points for people who practice consistently.

[Thunder 8]

but the same force is generated over a longer period of time,so you cant stop as quickly
Right on.:rockon:

[Thunder 8]

thats not a myth.Thats a fact
Youre probably wasting your breath.People who beleive their bike can out brake a car are apt to find out the hard way that 99.9% of the time thats utter crap.

[James Deuce]

thats not a myth.Thats a fact

Sorry, it has been repeatedly myth busted by magazines like Performance Bikes, Bike Magazine, and Motorcyclist. Accepted wisdom is not what it seems to be.

PB had a Honda Valkyrie with ABS stopping metres sooner, in the wet, than an MG TF with ABS and Yaw control. The car was piloted by Jason Plato, ex-BTCC driver and 5th Gear reporter, and the bike by one of the PB crew. They tested a range of bikes against the car and the stopping figures were all better than the car, wet or dry.

There are some cars, and some drivers who will maximise the capabilities of any vehicle they ride or drive, vastly better than the general populace. ABS has taken qualitative leaps in the last couple of years that means ABS now works better than a good driver who knows how to modulate non-brakes to produce maximum braking force without locking up.

The average rider will stop a motorcycle quicker than the average driver will stop a car. That is what matters out in the real world. Most riders are evaluating their environment and making decisions about things well before they happen, often avoiding the need for any major reaction. If I've had to brake hard in congested circumstances, a lot of my attention is in my mirrors because I know that Doris or Dudley is going to react late, and they are simply going to mash the brakes past the point of lockup, increasing their stopping distance.

[Thunder 8]

Most riders are evaluating their environment and making decisions about things well before they happen, often avoiding the need for any major reaction.
Change most to some and that may be close to the truth.

[Big Dave]

FWIW - I ride slow in the rain.

[James Deuce]

I've actually given up.

[Highlander]

FWIW - I ride slow in the rain.

Some of us just ride slow whatever the weather.

[Big Dave]

I've actually given up.

Pleasure riding - me too.
Work takes me out in the wet often enough.

[scumdog]

FWIW - I ride slow in the rain.

Likewise.

But then I always ride like a nana..:scooter:

[James Deuce]

Pleasure riding - me too.
Work takes me out in the wet often enough.

Yep, and commuting in Winter has been dropped too.

[Mikkel]

One fact that is worth remembering is that if it hasn't rained for quite a while the roads will be quite a lot more slippery to begin with as all the dust and grime is getting mixed with the water. As more water is falling on the road this slippery film will get dilluted and will eventually be washed off completely. Once it is gone you will be all good - if you stay away from flat, smooth, shiny surfaces such as road markings or tarsnakes.


What I said is completely correct. You can brake as hard in the wet as in the dry. It's how you do it that matters. You can generate the same force between tyre and tarmac. The amount of negative acceleration you generate has everything to do with braking force.

Anyone who doubts this should go and see Andrew Templeton about doing an RRRS course on a wet day and remember express a lack of confidence in using your front brake. He can make it go away :yes:

[Shadows]

Also those lovely slick patches of road, where the tar has melted up past the chip, making the corner like riding on glass.

:gob:


Yep, think that's what I hit last Sunday. Hence my new ride - see my avatar.

I'm convinced it was more than just tar bleed (although it didn't help). Judging from all of the the pretty rainbow colouring we spotted all along the downward side of the road after it had been raining for a while.

[Hiflyer]

I know he's a pro but Chris Pfeiffer can do precise stoppies on icy roads so the same results in the dry can be achieved in crap conditions, just, like it was said before, in a different way.

[justsomeguy]

The average rider will stop a motorcycle quicker than the average driver will stop a car. That is what matters out in the real world.

What one needs is a Gixxer Thou - they can stop from 400kmph to 0 in 1 metre on snow. In the wet they do it in just under a foot and in the dry in 3.278 inches.

In the latest model there is a special function that allows the bike to fly for short distances and it even makes a cup of coffee.

[Owl]

What one needs is a Gixxer Thou - they can stop from 400kmph to 0 in 1 metre on snow. In the wet they do it in just under a foot and in the dry in 3.278 inches.

In the latest model there is a special function that allows the bike to fly for short distances and it even makes a cup of coffee.

Seriously?????

An R1 must be truely awesome then!:laugh:

[rosie631]

I'm convinced it was more than just tar bleed (although it didn't help). Judging from all of the the pretty rainbow colouring we spotted all along the downward side of the road after it had been raining for a while.

Yep, definitely oil or something as well.

[carver]

i could stoppie my DRZ-SM two up on the rain on shinko's

[Drew]

i could stoppie my DRZ-SM two up on the rain on shinko's

The eight foot, of soggy suspension doing most of the "gentle" work does help. It can be done on alost anything, it's just a matter of not overloading the tyre.

[junkmanjoe]

The pic in your signature gives me the impression that you're not so bothered by riding in "wet" conditions.

mist, rain or just pissing down, dosn't bother me at all. i do get a little pissed off when my boots strat to leak, as i have to stop and put my bread bags on my feet.

i find strong wind is more fun than rain.
as you all know, you lean in to the wind to stop your self from being blowen over.

but you have to be ready for when the gust stops, aye..

other month up on the Rimutakas, i got cuaght out buy wind.

wind was blowing up the right hand side of the of hill,ok, so i lean in to it to keep ballance.
but, the wind was hitting the rock face and bounceing back on to the road.
so while i was leaning in to the wind, it was also trying to blow me over the same way..wasnt ready for that one....:eek5:

[PrincessBandit]

oh, a added bonus is less police around on the main roads.
so your free to concentrate on the task at hand

Thought you meant "the task in [your] hand".... A little bit of rain wouldn't slow you for anything would it.

[jimbo_on_travels]

I recently got caught out in the dark and heavy rain on the Rimutakas with a girl on the back riding a bike that has not much torque (my R6). Best advice is to go slow! and stop if you have to where possible to let other faster traffic past. One thing is for sure - I don't want to be a liability to other road users :)

Andrew Templeton is an absolute legend ^_^

[carver]

Thought you meant "the task in [your] hand".... A little bit of rain wouldn't slow you for anything would it.

i cant get myself off while riding.....

fuck the weather, il do what i want

[Philip Mc Cavity]

Shite - load of diesel around the Eastern burbs last couple of days.