Material selection

[imdying]

If you were getting some parts made for a bike, would these materials be suitable?

Triple clamps - 6061 aluminum
Caliper mounts (adaptor bracket type objects) - 6061 aluminum
Disc adaptor (PCD changer, 5mm thick, 2 sets of holes) - 5083 aluminum
Fork lower - 6061 T651 aluminum
Axle spacers - 6261 T6 aluminum

Construction is a mixture of water jet cutting and basic machine work.

I'm not an engineer's arsehole, I have no idea, just hoping someone in the trade would have some comments.

[Brian d marge]

Triple clamps - 6061 aluminium
Calliper mounts (adaptor bracket type objects) - 6061 aluminium
Disc adaptor (PCD changer, 5mm thick, 2 sets of holes) - 5083 aluminium
Fork lower - 6061 T651 aluminium
Axle spacers - 6261 T6 aluminium

with out checking myself . just sat down with coffee, all seems ok ( touch over kill but its not like its expensive )

I would have to check the 5083, Someone else may now better than me the reason It may get warm on or have repeated heat cycles , and I would be worried about cracking ..

My Enfield con-rod is LM2 , ie cheese and a poor quality cheese at that , its done 17 000 km

If some one doesn't come up with a more comprehensive reply , post again and I ll double check for you

Stephen

[imdying]

Thanks very much for the reply.

The disc is a 160mm x 2mm disc, so very light duty stuff (the adapator probably has twice the mass of the disc).

How about the axle spacers? Any issues with using aluminium on a part that I nomally see in steel? The size is approximately 10mm long, 16mm OD, 10mm ID, with one end with a 2mm recess, 14mm OD, to suit the bearing inner race. Basically that leaves a 2mm thick portion against the race, do you think that the 6261 will be suitable (i.e. not crush if tightened adequately).

[Brian d marge]

Thanks very much for the reply.

The disc is a 160mm x 2mm disc, so very light duty stuff (the adapator probably has twice the mass of the disc).

How about the axle spacers? Any issues with using aluminium on a part that I nomally see in steel? The size is approximately 10mm long, 16mm OD, 10mm ID, with one end with a 2mm recess, 14mm OD, to suit the bearing inner race. Basically that leaves a 2mm thick portion against the race, do you think that the 6261 will be suitable (i.e. not crush if tightened adequately).

guessing from the id of the spacer the spacer is a front wheel spacer on a small bike and the spindle is od 10mm 1.25 thread ?

so we can get a force from that, and from that see the crush, I can run it through calculix if you want,

assuming a good bearing surface it should be ok ,,, at a guess. !

Stephen

does it look like this? you made it out of steel then left it in the garden !

Stephen

i have a bit of time, tomorrow if you post sketches, if you are worried, from what I understand it should be ok !

[imdying]

Yup, just like that! And yes, I'm planning on making an axles with 10x1.25mm thread. It's really the only part I'm concerned about, whether to make it from steel or 6261 T6.

[Brian d marge]

Yup, just like that! And yes, I'm planning on making an axles with 10x1.25mm thread. It's really the only part I'm concerned about, whether to make it from steel or 6261 T6.

if you can give me an idea of the other parts ( or should I just run with this ! )

I think i understand , but its better to be sure

Do you know the torque on the nut od the axil? or hand tight plus 180?


Steel is a nice material you know ... not so heavy

Stephen

[Robert Taylor]

Triple clamps - 6061 aluminium
Calliper mounts (adaptor bracket type objects) - 6061 aluminium
Disc adaptor (PCD changer, 5mm thick, 2 sets of holes) - 5083 aluminium
Fork lower - 6061 T651 aluminium
Axle spacers - 6261 T6 aluminium

with out checking myself . just sat down with coffee, all seems ok ( touch over kill but its not like its expensive )

I would have to check the 5083, Someone else may now better than me the reason It may get warm on or have repeated heat cycles , and I would be worried about cracking ..

My Enfield con-rod is LM2 , ie cheese and a poor quality cheese at that , its done 17 000 km

If some one doesn't come up with a more comprehensive reply , post again and I ll double check for you

Stephen

Triple clamps and fork lower 7075T6

[98tls]

If you were getting some parts made for a bike, would these materials be suitable?

Triple clamps - 6061 aluminum
Caliper mounts (adaptor bracket type objects) - 6061 aluminum
Disc adaptor (PCD changer, 5mm thick, 2 sets of holes) - 5083 aluminum
Fork lower - 6061 T651 aluminum
Axle spacers - 6261 T6 aluminum

Construction is a mixture of water jet cutting and basic machine work.

I'm not an engineer's arsehole, I have no idea, just hoping someone in the trade would have some comments. Les might be the bloke to talk to mate.Besides that fwiw your making me jealous.<_<

[Brian d marge]

Triple clamps and fork lower 7075T6


eeeuuww that's a statement, statements worry me... 75 is good but it does have limitations, ( in this case not a worry )


Stephen

[imdying]

if you can give me an idea of the other parts ( or should I just run with this ! )

I think i understand , but its better to be sure

Do you know the torque on the nut od the axil? or hand tight plus 180?

Steel is a nice material you know ... not so heavy

StephenYeah, it's all teeny tiny stuff, steel wouldn't make a big difference on those spacers! If you let me know your email address, I could send you a blueprint... I wouldn't mind knowing what the most likely part to break first is :laugh:


Les might be the bloke to talk to mate.Besides that fwiw your making me jealous.<_<Don't worry, it's not for my SV, if I didn't have so many projects needing attention I'd probably just let RT sort all of that out rather than making my own... although, a custom top triple would be a nice place to start.

[Brian d marge]

Yeah, it's all teeny tiny stuff, steel wouldn't make a big difference on those spacers! If you let me know your email address, I could send you a blueprint... I wouldn't mind knowing what the most likely part to break first is :laugh:

Don't worry, it's not for my SV, if I didn't have so many projects needing attention I'd probably just let RT sort all of that out rather than making my own... although, a custom top triple would be a nice place to start.

477.racing @gmail.com

I am in the office till at least September ,,its like an oven outside. Just post up a sketch, and we can look at the stresses

now my meshing ability isn't so hot , so sometimes complicated parts are a pain to mesh , but other than that ,,feel free

Stephen

[imdying]

477.racing @gmail.com

I am in the office till at least September ,,its like an oven outside. Just post up a sketch, and we can look at the stresses

now my meshing ability isn't so hot , so sometimes complicated parts are a pain to mesh , but other than that ,,feel free

StephenCool, I'll send it through.

Nothing complicated about this, it's all very simple stuff :)

[Brian d marge]

Cool, I'll send it through.

Nothing complicated about this, it's all very simple stuff :)

using a yield of 70Mpa and a torque of 4kg.m ( from my CR250)

which really are waaay over the top and assuming I've got my units right !

u should be OK with your selection, just pay attention to the radii of spacer on to bearing , this radii can be found in any bearing book , just avoids stress raisers

Stephen

[imdying]

just pay attention to the radii of spacer on to bearing , this radii can be found in any bearing book , just avoids stress raisersThis I don't understand... You mean don't make the outside of the recessed portion bigger than the OD of the inner race?

[Brian d marge]

This I don't understand... You mean don't make the outside of the recessed portion bigger than the OD of the inner race?

I assume I have the arrangement right ... now its a tropical Monsoon ... and 33 deg ,,,

Stephen

[Yow Ling]

FFS are you guys on drugs?

just make the spacers and fit them, all this cad shit and computer modelling is just a bit over the top, they are just wheel spacers arent they?

[gatch]

Manufacturing axles from scratch ? 4340 and you will never break them, never.

Axles spacers make them from whatever you find on the floor, forget radii, not necessary. So long as the spacer doesn't push on the bearing seals you can put whatever form you like on there, the minimal torque will not crush them.

Have fun :)

[Brian d marge]

Manufacturing axles from scratch ? 4340 and you will never break them, never.

Axles spacers make them from whatever you find on the floor, forget radii, not necessary. So long as the spacer doesn't push on the bearing seals you can put whatever form you like on there, the minimal torque will not crush them.

Have fun :)

A. because I can
B. Dont ever foget stress raisers , ever . ( though in this case it wouldnt amount to much , I would still radius ..but thats just me ......)
c. 10 gallon hats blow off on the gallop

Stephen

[Brian d marge]

FFS are you guys on drugs?

just make the spacers and fit them, all this cad shit and computer modelling is just a bit over the top, they are just wheel spacers arent they?

See below

Stephen

[Yow Ling]

See below

Stephen

there is nothing below, maybe my first guess was right

[imdying]

I assume I have the arrangement right ... now its a tropical Monsoon ... and 33 degUggh, sounds horrid.

The bearing is about half that size. The OD of the recessed portion is the same OD as the inner race :) Hadn't considered putting a radius there, but can do :)

Yes for the slower bikes we have a about a 6m length (axle and head stock spacers are the same which is why we have so much of it) of 10mm ID ~1.5mm wall steel tube that we just cut portions off of with a tube cutter. The rest of this front end is billet/carbon fibre, so we'll keep putting some extra effort in these particular spacers, but thanks for the comments anyway Mike.


Manufacturing axles from scratch ? 4340 and you will never break them, never.Awesome, you answered another question I would have had! Can you recommend anyone who would stock 4340 in 10mm bar? Sadly none of the off the shelf items are suitable, as I want an extra 10mm of thread either side to screw some nylon sliders too.


A. because I can
B. Dont ever foget stress raisers , ever . ( though in this case it wouldnt amount to much , I would still radius ..but thats just me ......)
c. 10 gallon hats blow off on the gallopOk, c is a new one to me :laugh:

[gatch]

Awesome, you answered another question I would have had! Can you recommend anyone who would stock 4340 in 10mm bar? Sadly none of the off the shelf items are suitable, as I want an extra 10mm of thread either side to screw some nylon sliders too.

I'm not sure where we get ours from, I don't even know if a wholesaler would sell short lengths of such small diameter stock. Unfortunately I don't know any suppliers down south, try the yellow pages ?

Edit - How are you going to manufacture the axles ?
I'd screw cut the threads on a lathe and avoid a die-nut if possible, they make sloppy threads when used in conjunction with off the shelf nuts. Just a thought.

[Brian d marge]

Had to guess at the thickness of the brake carrier plate, 10mm ? and the forces involved, eg I assume your 90 kg !

anyway this gives you an estimate to which to work from.

One thing that worries me Carbon fibre tube over a fork bottom ? I have 0 experience with the design of cf , but I the Max bend moment of that tube worries me a bit..

Someone with more experience hopefully could set my mind at ease



Stephen

Ps if doing an axil see if there is a different bearing that has the same od and thickness but a bigger ID then you can make the axil with a larger dia and thinner walled , eg stiff but light

[LBD]

The 5083 is/was generally only available as sheet/plate and is intended for marine construction with corrosion and fatigue resistance along with strengths around the heat affected zones of welds

[imdying]

One thing that worries me Carbon fibre tube over a fork bottom ? I have 0 experience with the design of cf , but I the Max bend moment of that tube worries me a bit..

Someone with more experience hopefully could set my mind at easeHey what's the worst that could happen :D

Ps if doing an axil see if there is a different bearing that has the same od and thickness but a bigger ID then you can make the axil with a larger dia and thinner walled , eg stiff but lightI did look, but sadly no :( Now if I were to build a wheel, or even a hub for a two piece wheel...