Scooterazzi Easter Challenge - Advance Warning!

[Skunk]

The Easter Challenge is on again!
Two days of racing at the Kaitoke track Saturday and Sunday Easter Weekend (3-4 April 2010).

Details to come but the aim is MNZ permit (you will need to be a member of a MNZ affiliated club) and a about $40 per day entry.
Please register your interest by PMing me.
One Event Licence $15. Special discount to VMCC members.

Supported by:
Scooterazzi - Corner of Victoria and Ghuznee Streets, Wellington. Phone: 04 978-7388
Boyle Kawasaki - 24-26 Adelaide Rd, Wellington. Phone: 04 384-6824
Victoria Motorcycle Club - www.vicclub.co.nz

Keep an eye on the event page at www.bucketracing.co.nz for the lastest info.

[Trudes]

:niceone::Punk:
Looking forward to it already, this year's one was awesome, sure next year's will top it.
Would be nice to see some more 'out-of-towners' again!!:sunny:

[hmurphy]

Keeeeeeeeeeen - PM SENT

[nudemetalz]

Yup, count me in too (but you knew that already :) ).

[NOID]

YES ILL BE THERE :done: JUST GOTA GET BIKE SORTED :2guns:

[Skunk]

OK, counting all the registrations of interest I have 1 person keen.

Cool, thank goodness Bucket Racers are as good at following directions as Road Racers! :killingme

[Trudes]

Whatever smelly.

[Pumba]

Please register your interest by PMing me.

Fine I will send you a PM, but for the public record in the forum, last year was great and I plan on being there again :2thumbsup

[gav]

hmmm Easter you say?

[Trudes]

That's right Easter. So you can either stay home, eat chocolate and get fat, go to Church and celebrate the birth of JC and watch real shit TV... OR you could get yourself and all your bucket buddy's to sunny Wellington and have your arses handed to you (Silver platter optional) :done:

[Slingshot]

That's right Easter. So you can either stay home, eat chocolate and get fat, go to Church and celebrate the birth of JC and watch real shit TV... OR you could get yourself and all your bucket buddy's to sunny Wellington and have your arses handed to you (Silver platter optional) :done:

You're not religious are you :)

And I'm keen, but do I really have to join a MNZ affiliated club to race?

[Sketchy_Racer]

You're not religious are you :)

And I'm keen, but do I really have to join a MNZ affiliated club to race?

Yeah you just need to send a membership form from www.vicclub.co.nz to them along with $35 for a years membership.

[Trudes]

You're not religious are you :)


hahaha, good spotting! That's right, that would be Xmas eh! :lol:

[ajturbo]

cooooolllll

[Skunk]

cooooolllll
Hopefully warm actually.

[all4A50s]

Yeah you just need to send a membership form from www.vicclub.co.nz to them along with $35 for a years membership.

Why the need for this as we didn't have to last time? And what about having a day licence option, like they have at Taupo?

[Sketchy_Racer]

Why the need? Well accidents can happen (just imagine if you had a collision with someone when you ended up on the wrong side of the track on sunday) and if they are serious, OSH will get involved and who ever is organising it (Skunk) will end up in the deep end, not the riders. To protect his arse, if you run a MNZ permit with a MNZ steward, it is MNZ's responsibility to provide liability insurance (Which pays for any lawyers fees if is things turn to shit)

Skunk is running day licences and he is running them free of charge if you become a member of the Victoria Motorcycle Club for the meeting (Although you can become a member of any club, but then you'll also have to pay a $15 day licence fee.)

You can't get (well, you shouldn't be able to) get a day licence without a MNZ affiliated club membership.

[Str8 Jacket]

I do see where George is coming from. That $35 is just another expense for those that are only joining Vic Club just to enter a 2 day race and never use their membership again that year...

[Sketchy_Racer]

I do see where George is coming from. That $35 is just another expense for those that are only joining Vic Club just to enter a 2 day race and never use their membership again that year...

Yes your right Hels, I did mention that people wouldn't be keen on the idea to Skunk when he suggested it, but would you want to take the risk of a major OSH lawsuit against YOU if something went bad? Something like that could devastate someone's life if you were not financially covered.

The other thing to remember is that Welly buckets are the only group who have NOT being using MNZ affiliation until this event. 90% of people coming out of town are likely to have a MNZ licence as they have to have it for their meetings and I would say that 50% of people down here will have them to.

Frankly, it is a case if that you want to come to a 2 day awesome easter meeting on arguably one of the best bucket tracks in NZ, you need harden up and accept that it will cost an extra $35 which really is not a huge investment. :2thumbsup

[Str8 Jacket]

Yep, I see both sides of the argument. It doesn't effect me either way as I have a race licence and club membership but I have to admit that one of the things I did enjoy about Welly buckets was the way it was not affiliated with MNZ and all the baggage it brings with it...

Either way its going to be a great weekend and I will be there. Here's hoping that the Welly people do actually 'suck it up' and come along! :)

[fi5hy]

Yep, I see both sides of the argument. It doesn't effect me either way as I have a race licence and club membership but I have to admit that one of the things I did enjoy about Welly buckets was the way it was not affiliated with MNZ and all the baggage it brings with it... :)

This is why we are still running buckets in Wellington (no add on bullshit that does nothing for our sport what so ever) most of us are not a member of a club or hold a race licence for the same reason. In the past when we run events the only time we had liability insurance was for the street races we done and that was only if someone parked their bike on some old Lady's roses. With a track like Kaitoke you can run a disclaimer on the entry from the same as everyone else has that would cover your ass just as well.

[Trudes]

My understanding is that with things like this, the onus is on the organiser if anything goes wrong, so this would be the easiest (and cheapest) way for the organiser (Skunk) to cover his (and our) arses should anything happen. At the end of the day, this is for our enjoyment and one person shouldn't have to pick up the cost of liability insurance etc, so if it's in some way shared amongst us, the riders, then that sounds fair. Like Sketchy says, Welly is probably the only place that doesn't run MNZ meets, which is cool, but for this event where we want to attract out of towners (who will most probably be a member of a club/and or have a race licence anyway) and where we will be running the day not the Kart club where we would normally fall under their liability, I think we could suck it up for this. Correct me if I'm wrong.
It is an extra cost, but it's still cheap fun really and like most things these days, it's user pays and if you can't afford it then :crybaby::crybaby: for you.... plenty of time to save your $$ for it.

[Skunk]

Why the need for this as we didn't have to last time? And what about having a day licence option, like they have at Taupo?
The day licence option at Taupo requires you to be a member of a Club as well... It's an MNZ permit event.

I'm covering my arse. Two days racing for $115. I thought that was a good deal. My bad and tough shit. :lol:

[nudemetalz]

So when we run the bucket-only one-dayers at Kaitoke, then this should also apply? I'm beginning to think so.

[quallman1234]

So when we run the bucket-only one-dayers at Kaitoke, then this should also apply? I'm beginning to think so.

I'd say we would be heading that way, and fair enough too.

[Skunk]

So when we run the bucket-only one-dayers at Kaitoke, then this should also apply? I'm beginning to think so.
That's up to whoever organises it. I'm not taking the risk for the Easter Challenge. Roy's Hill, Taupo, Christchurch etc all need Club membership and a 'one event' licence.

[ajturbo]

i am a member of the vic club AND have a full race licence... i have ONLY raced at the slipway and kaitoke ONCE in the last year....

it just means that i can race anywhere i choose....

[Geriatric]

Hi, Adrian here. Just wanted to say that I fully support Skunk on this one. I'm sure the last thing he wants is to impose extra costs on any one, but we need the indemnity.

Some of you might remember a women in Christchurch a few years ago who organised a cycling event and was unfairly prosecuted following a fatality in the event. By the time she won on appeal she had lost her house and had two years of hell.

I know some will struggle with the cost but can't see a way round it.

[hmurphy]

Totally fair amount to pay and HUGE warning in advance for us all to get sorted for it. It is a LOT of track time at a high quality track and a really good bunch of people to have a laugh with.

[Sketchy_Racer]

Hi, Adrian here. Just wanted to say that I fully support Skunk on this one. I'm sure the last thing he wants is to impose extra costs on any one, but we need the indemnity.

Some of you might remember a women in Christchurch a few years ago who organised a cycling event and was unfairly prosecuted following a fatality in the event. By the time she won on appeal she had lost her house and had two years of hell.

I know some will struggle with the cost but can't see a way round it.

This is exactly the sort of situation that Andrew is backing himself against.

And Fishy, it's all good and well if you sign your life away on a disclaimer paper, but if you die or get seriously injured out there, OSH (or what ever it's called) will hunt someone's arse regardless of any paper work that has been put in place. The arse they will hunt is the organisers.

OSH is a bunch of bullshit that wont let people take personal responsibility, and will do their best to rape some money out of someone if it goes bad.

[fi5hy]

Where does it all end ????? First Kaitoke then the slipway then every meeting? The cost of MNZ will mean for most a $65.00 day all the time. I for one will not be bothered buying a race license ever time i ride my bucket and I'm sure as hell not going to buy one for a year. We have kept the buckets running down here for over 10 years with no need for the MNZ side of things so why start now? I might be wrong and I hope I am but all I can see is the Fields getting smaller and smaller as people can't be ass-ed with every thing that goes with riding their once fun bucket.
just my two cents. Just remember this is buckets we are not roaring around Manfield at a 200 km + we a riding around with our mates for a laugh at well under half that speed at the most.

[Skunk]

Who said anything about Slipway?

I'm doing it for this event. Out of towners will already have theirs sorted anyway which is why I've done it as cheap as possible for this one event.
I don't see this sort of issue when anyone goes to Roys Hill. Why is it such an issue here?

Please everyone - stop moaning and just tell me if you're keen to race.

[Sketchy_Racer]

Where does it all end ????? First Kaitoke then the slipway then every meeting? The cost of MNZ will mean for most a $65.00 day all the time. I for one will not be bothered buying a race license ever time i ride my bucket and I'm sure as hell not going to buy one for a year. We have kept the buckets running down here for over 10 years with no need for the MNZ side of things so why start now? I might be wrong and I hope I am but all I can see is the Fields getting smaller and smaller as people can't be ass-ed with every thing that goes with riding their once fun bucket.
just my two cents. Just remember this is buckets we are not roaring around Manfield at a 200 km + we a riding around with our mates for a laugh at well under half that speed at the most.

Nah mate, when I started racing we had race licences, that is why I became a member of the Vic club back then. It was only once we went to slipway did we remove the licence part.

The only way we used to be able to run at Kaitoke (way back when) was because VMCC paid a huge amount of the track fee, and this time round they are being good enough to say if you are not a club member, become one for this meeting and they will give you a day licence free. Remembering the day licences cost the club, so they will make a loss at it.

I do agree with you, I feel the same and that it is just buckets and it's all a pain in the arse and I surely hope that slipway does not become a MNZ affiliated meeting, but I'm not organising it. I've made my opinion clear but now I will shut up and let those who are doing it make the call.

The other option Skunk could have is to purchase personal liability insurance, and add that to the cost of the entry fee? How ever I would say that there would be a very high chance that to offset those costs, it would take a great deal more than $35 from each person added to the entry fee so were back to square one with MNZ being the most cost effective means of liability insurance for the organisers.

[Kendog]

With a track like Kaitoke you can run a disclaimer on the entry from the same as everyone else has that would cover your ass just as well.
If only that was true, but no, I can't say I take responsibility for myself and my actions. Just like my drivers licence says I am a Donor but that still needs to be confirmed with next of kin if I die.


Some of you might remember a women in Christchurch a few years ago who organised a cycling event and was unfairly prosecuted following a fatality in the event. By the time she won on appeal she had lost her house and had two years of hell.
Exactly.


I might be wrong and I hope I am but all I can see is the Fields getting smaller and smaller as people can't be ass-ed with every thing that goes with riding their once fun bucket.
I hope that doesn't happen as well. But we are one serious accident away from potential losing Kaitoke or Slipway. Club membership and a licence is a small price to pay to protect what we have.


Two days racing for $115. I thought that was a good deal.
It's a great deal.


Please everyone - stop moaning and just tell me if you're keen to race.
Keener than a keen thing.

[fi5hy]

But we are one serious accident away from potential losing Kaitoke or Slipway. Club membership and a licence is a small price to pay to protect what we have.
.



And MNZ will protect us from what?????? the track? the pain? the blood?

[Trudes]

Please everyone - stop moaning and just tell me if you're keen to race.

Just did it ;)

[koba]

so when we run the bucket-only one-dayers at kaitoke, then this should also apply? I'm beginning to think so.

fuck no!!!!!!!

[Skunk]

And MNZ will protect us from what?????? the track? the pain? the blood?
Lawyers fees. Police etc... Remember Jarrods experience when it all went so wrong at Manfeild...

[Kendog]

And MNZ will protect us from what?????? the track? the pain? the blood?

The two strokes?

[Skunk]

Are you coming?...

...or just breathing hard?

[Kendog]

Are you coming?...

...or just breathing hard?

I will be there.

[fi5hy]

fuck no!!!!!!!

second that

[Slingshot]

Lets move this discussion to the social group (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/group.php?groupid=106), it's probably better that we argue in there rather than putting a negative slant on what's going to be an awesome event.

[Skunk]

This event now needs an organiser. Too much shit over $35 for me to be interested in this any longer.

[nudemetalz]

I did the last one, so gladly let someone else do the next one.


I went to a lot of trouble to secure the track for both days.
Please don't let this go down the gurgler, peoples !!

[ajturbo]

This event now needs an organiser. Too much shit over $35 for me to be interested in this any longer.
what do we need to do matey....?

i see it that IF you want to complain about anything..

DON"T FUCKIN COME...

if you want to race tell skunk and pay ya money.. i will be!!.. and if the bikes blow up before then, i will be waving a flag!!!

[Mudflaps]

what do we need to do matey....?

i see it that IF you want to complain about anything..

DON"T FUCKIN COME...

if you want to race tell skunk and pay ya money.. i will be!!.. and if the bikes blow up before then, i will be waving a flag!!!

I agree completely

As a new comer to the sport, I don't understand what the fuss is to cover ourselves and the organizer (of which we used to have one).

When I stated to find out about buckets, I was told all the safety equipment I would need to race...A helmet, back brace leathers etc etc. Isn't having insurance just one more FUNDAMENTAL piece of safety equipment needed?!! It's prob more important as it covers everybody.

I am a poor bastard, and would have to cut something out in my budget to pay the extra $35, by I would/will HAPPILY do it so that I can race. I would hate to crash and have it ruin bucket racing and people as well for that matter.

And if everyone else (Auckland, Hastings, Christchurch) does it and has great events, why should we be any different?

It's still motor sport, which has accidents, but let's not wait for one to happen to ruin it for all of us.

This is unbelievable that people who were happy to run an event are now getting hassled to the point of not wanting to do anything for the sport at all. What the hell??

That's my newbe two cents worth.

[Kendog]

It is amazing how a couple of people on this site can get themselves so wound up about the inclusion of MNZ in a bucket event, that they discourage those willing to put in the hard yards to set it up.

Nice work, not!!!!!

[Str8 Jacket]

It is amazing how a couple of people on this site can get themselves so wound up about the inclusion of MNZ in a bucket event, that they discourage those willing to put in the hard yards to set it up.

Nice work, not!!!!!

If you have something to say then say it to me straight. I offered to help out with the Easter Challenge and I have said my piece to Skunk about manning up and running an event the way he wants to and let the people turn up.

What I have done to piss people off is disagree about the direction Welly buckets is heading. If people want to end friendships over something like this than so be it but dont for a second think that I made that decision. I have voiced my opinion on matters but hold no personal vendetta's against anyone. If people want to do that with me than so be it my life will still go on.

[Trudes]

Settle petal. I don't think anyone is holding any personal vendettas here. We are all entitled to voice our opinions and it would be sad if people can't get over themselves enough to be able to just get on with it and ruin friendships over a common interest that we should all be able to enjoy together.
How about we all just take a deep breath, nobody needs to be right or wrong about it, it's merely a difference of opinion.

I'm dictating this for Nigel "all I wanted to know is why shouldn't we use MNZ for the bucket only days? And cost is not the answer"

[Pumba]

:corn:

I have plenty to share, any one want some

[hmurphy]

:corn:

I have plenty to share, any one want some

Agreed.

Seriously though I think this event for $115 is a complete deal. Awesome racing, awesome people, awesome track and a shitload of fun. Over 5 months warning to make that kind of money, pfft even I can do it on my shitty income.

Fair call if Skunk wants to play it extra safe for this event, it is likely to attract a much larger crowd than normal and more track time. There will be more crashing than usual most likely.

I haven't read it anywhere yet where it has said we will be introducing this to every bucket meeting here in Welly. So no need to fight. We should look forward to this event, I sure as hell am.

I think a disclaimer would be appropriate for each round and fun day we do if people are starting to get worried about lawsuits. Isn't it as easy as signing a form saying you yourself are responsible for any stupid shit that happens? Hell I have no problem being responsible for my own injuries. And if someone slams into me and hurts me, it's all part of racing. (If there isn't already one for each bucket event we do, I just sign my life away where I'm told because I just want to race)

[Skunk]

I think a disclaimer would be appropriate for each round and fun day we do if people are starting to get worried about lawsuits. Isn't it as easy as signing a form saying you yourself are responsible for any stupid shit that happens?Unfortunately, no. What happens is the Police will investigate and decide if the event was being run as it should. If it was (or wasn't) they then decide whether to press charges. Then Lawyers string it out as long as possible to make as much money as possible. This is the bit I was concerned about; for me.

OK, a death is really, really, really unlikely. But so is my house burning down and I insure that. We already run the events much like they would under MNZ already so there really isn't any change to the event itself.

[hmurphy]

Ok. Well I have no problem at all doing the MNZ thing for this one event. But this cotten wool bullshit everything is coming to drives me crazy.

[all4A50s]

Why the need? Well accidents can happen (just imagine if you had a collision with someone when you ended up on the wrong side of the track on sunday) and if they are serious, OSH will get involved and who ever is organising it (Skunk) will end up in the deep end, not the riders. To protect his arse, if you run a MNZ permit with a MNZ steward, it is MNZ's responsibility to provide liability insurance (Which pays for any lawyers fees if is things turn to shit)

Skunk is running day licences and he is running them free of charge if you become a member of the Victoria Motorcycle Club for the meeting (Although you can become a member of any club, but then you'll also have to pay a $15 day licence fee.)

You can't get (well, you shouldn't be able to) get a day licence without a MNZ affiliated club membership.

Ta for that. You gotta love bureaucracy. And thanks to Skunk for taking on the challenge of this event

[Buddha#81]

Welcome to our world guys,(and you're starting to bicker like us too). Trust me on this, Skunk is on the right track with this one. Short of dragging the body out to the main road and ringing the cops there this is the only sensible way to do it.

If the worst happened, everyone on here would be giving the smelly one electronic support but who would be standing beside him in court? I'd say fook all.

This is what happened down here a few years back and its part of the popularity growth that buckets are enjoying, sorry to the knockers of this "change" of your future........Get the fook over it!

[b1kerb0b]

So when we run the bucket-only one-dayers at Kaitoke, then this should also apply? I'm beginning to think so.

I've been racing road and velodrome (2 wheel pedal power) for years, and club membership/day license and subsequent national body coverage is important for insurance and OSH liability reasons. You are not permitted to race unless you have this national, club or day license, and we race every week for 2/3 of the year, sometimes 2 or 3 times a week in peak season.

IMHO it is necessary to have at minimum day licenses, if you as a participant do not want to purchase this then you should not be racing.

To do otherwise is to put the event organizer at considerable legal and financial risk, and you're being selfish to assume the event organizer(s) should be happy to expose themselves to this.

There is legal precedent set in a Christchurch bike race, fortunately overturned on appeal but the event (Le Race) was not run for several years after, and it financially ruined Astrid Anderson as well as her event management company.

my 2c from sunny Toronto, Canada...

Hopefully see you guys out on the track early November :)

[b1kerb0b]

Just remember this is buckets we are not roaring around Manfield at a 200 km + we a riding around with our mates for a laugh at well under half that speed at the most.

Stupid stuff happens when the red mist comes down. The issue is OSH and I for one would be happy to fork out the $35 extra for the 2 day event if it indemnifies the event organizer.

We'd need to address the "season" membership/indemnity separately I think.

FWIW a BikeNZ "club" level license was only about $40 / year, national license was only about $100, and I think an international license was well under $200.

[b1kerb0b]

Are you coming?...

Damn straight.

[saxet]

Would it be worth talkin to the kart oranizers to see what they need to do legally. They don't seem to charge us for a day licence and i wonder what thier conditions are. Might be a cheper way to look at it...maybe.

[nudemetalz]

Would it be worth talkin to the kart oranizers to see what they need to do legally. They don't seem to charge us for a day licence and i wonder what thier conditions are. Might be a cheper way to look at it...maybe.

Working on it.

[F5 Dave]

I would guess they are just ignoring us a bit. The alternative would be to do what they do, which I bet is joining a kart club affiliated with their sanctioning body & then getting a race licence from their sanctioning body.

This would raise some eyebrows but oreso would have extra expense & no benefit to race in other events that an MNZ licence does.

[Skunk]

I'm getting quotes on 'one event sporting and legal defence liability cover' just to confirm the info I've already had.

Chris is checking with the Kart guys on options.

I still working at this...

[quallman1234]

You could talk too CliffHanger Productions. They do private insurance instead of MNZ way for the Hill Climb. However they run MNZ for the sprints. Could be worth a call =).

[Skunk]

Yeah, I got a quote: it's posted here (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/group.php?do=discuss&gmid=44239#gmessage44239) for privacy. Kinda out of the question for so few entries.

[Bert]

I commend your efforts Skunk. But I’m not really sure of any gain to what MNZ offer for both you and the riders. I personally would encourage any rider to join a club and get a MNZ licence, especially if they look at travelling to other meetings.

On the side, how many riders know if there current life insurance, income protection and health insurance policies cover them for motor racing ??? I’m currently having an argument with mine again, esp with having a sidecar…

[Kendog]

On the side, how many riders know if there current life insurance, income protection and health insurance policies cover them for motor racing ??? I’m currently having an argument with mine again, esp with having a sidecar…

That is a good question.

[F5 Dave]

I have an exemption for mine. as in they wouldn't pay out. sigh.

[Bert]

I have an exemption for mine. as in they wouldn't pay out. sigh.

Yes, that's what I have agreed to with my life insurance (not insured when on the track, though for some reason dirt and road riding is ok??? go figure).... But people should think about checking up on it.

more reason to be a MNZ licence holder; even if it is a token amount $$. unless that has changed now as well ???

End of that conversation. :slap:

[Buddha#81]

On the side, how many riders know if there current life insurance, income protection and health insurance policies cover them for motor racing ??? I’m currently having an argument with mine again, esp with having a sidecar…

My Insurance is signed off for racing, BUT only for buckets the motard at club level...... step outside that and its not covered (life insurance, income protection and health insurance). Its a battle but worth pursuing, it is a curly as I could own a 1k sportsbike and roadride (which I consider more dangerous)with them not even being worried.

[Skunk]

This will be an MNZ meeting. Permits will be applied for on Wednesday 16 September.
$40 per day entry fee. $20 late entry fee.
One event licence fee TBA.
MNZ Bucket rules will apply.
Bikes will need to be nyloned.
F5's will run with F4's.
There will be three grades - A, B, and C. This will be sorted in Qualifying on Saturday.
Sponsors have been arranged - Thanks go to Scooterazzi and to Boyle Kawasaki.
Entry forms available soon.

[Trudes]

:banana:
Good work Skunk!!!:niceone:

[b1kerb0b]

:banana:
Good work Skunk!!!:niceone:

I agree :)

Oh man I am SO looking forward to getting back to the track once I'm back in the country... All they seem to ride is Harley's over here in Canada, then again there's no corners to keep one entertained.

[ajturbo]

wow matey, YOU have been working hard....

[nudemetalz]

Well done, Skunk. :)