Do firefighters deserve a raise?

[Slicksta]

Do firefighters deserve a pay raise? Fairly simple poll yes and no?

[enigma51]

Fairly simple poll yes and no?

Damn it failed on the poll mod please add yes and no

whats a rase?

[Slicksta]

Fucked up on that one

[p.dath]

The economy is not in a great shape. People are loosing their jobs. People are working 4 day weeks. A lot of people are taking a reduction in income.

I vote no.

[Flatcap]

Only if they stop creating their own work

[enigma51]

Fucked up on that one

thought as much

[enigma51]

The economy is not in a great shape. People are loosing their jobs. People are working 4 day weeks. A lot of people are taking a reduction in income.

I vote no.

Do you have any idea how much they get paid? or are just saying no cause its a recession

[YellowDog]

Are you talking about a raise like everyone gets annually or are you talking about a realignment of their pay scale?

[rainman]

Do firefighters deserve a pay raise? Fairly simple poll yes and no?

Dunno, what are they paid now?

[firefighter]

Do firefighters deserve a pay raise? Fairly simple poll yes and no?

Perhaps your wording is'nt quite the way you meant it be?

Do firefighters deserve a pay raise?

Would this be more what you were meaning;

Should firefighters get a raise?

There's a difference between deserving one and whether it's realistically possible.

I have my own views which would get me into trouble, so i'll keep em' to meself. Although they'd surprise most of you i'd say.

I'm really legitimately not into it for the money, I love my job, and the work I get to do in the community (really). I'm not into the politics or the other crap. But as I said the rest i'll keep to myself.

[Dave Lobster]

What do they get paid now?

Are there people queuing round the block to replace those that leave?

[SMOKEU]

Firefighters deserve a pay rise. If a skinhead on P throws a molotov cocktail through your bedroom window, who you gonna call?

[firefighter]

What do they get paid now?

Are there people queuing round the block to replace those that leave?

Actually yes.

Try and apply and see how many you compete with.

[sil3nt]

Firefighting is something that you have to really want to do and is not something you do for the money. I think they do deserve a raise with the cost of living on the rise and what not.

Here is what they get paid now (per week) http://www3.fire.org.nz/recruit/job-information/remuneration.html

Could be old info though?

[sil3nt]

Are there people queuing round the block to replace those that leave?I was told there was a 2 year waiting list to join! That was bullshit as there is no waiting list but hundreds apply and not many get through! Decided to wait until i pack on a bit more muscle before i even bother applying. Even considered joining the Army to do firefighting.

[p.dath]

Do you have any idea how much they get paid? or are just saying no cause its a recession

Somewhere around $50k, unless they are of a senior rank. They also get the option of earning more with additional shifts. So the actual pay could be quite a bit more.

And "no" because it is a recession. The country doesn't really have spare cash to throw around. Wait till we are into positive growth. I'd prefer to spend the money on policing and health care at the moment, like the Government already is.

[Headbanger]

They deserve better pay then bastard politicians.

Whose going to turn up and save your bacon when you go to sleep with the chips frying?

Ghostbusters?...The Maori Party?....John Keys press sectary?

Fuck no.

Fire fucking fighters.

Champions.






mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm............bacon.

[AllanB]

Max pay of $59k for a Station Manager - someone who has probably spend years as a FF and then got promoted. Bugger that.

Yes.

[Slicksta]

Perhaps your wording is'nt quite the way you meant it be?

Do firefighters deserve a pay raise?

Would this be more what you were meaning;

Should firefighters get a raise?

There's a difference between deserving one and whether it's realistically possible.

I have my own views which would get me into trouble, so i'll keep em' to meself. Although they'd surprise most of you i'd say.

I'm really legitimately not into it for the money, I love my job, and the work I get to do in the community (really). I'm not into the politics or the other crap. But as I said the rest i'll keep to myself.

My apologies. My grammar sucks esp after a busy week at work and not much sleep..

Personally I voted yes they deserve (in my opinion) to be paid the same as a police officer.

[p.dath]

How about this for an interesting question. Completely forget what they get paid now. Lets say were were employing our first professional firefighters, and starting again.

The new applicants would have to be preppred to do shift work, work in a dangerous environment, be physically fit, already experienced in fire fighting, and prepared to undergo a lot of training.
The advantages are a lot of job satisfaction from saving people, building strong relationships in your team and keeping fit.

What should this person be paid?

Comparitive numbers:
* Average NZ Wage $46k (http://theyworkforyou.co.nz/portfolios/finance/2007/oct/09/taxation)
* Teachers who have done a 3 year degree get around $45k (someone correct me if I'm way out - I used to be married to a senior teacher who got paid around $50k in a public school)
* Federated Farmers says 1 farmer dies every two weeks (so higher risk than a fire fighter I would think) (http://www.fedfarm.org.nz/eventsandtraining). A Dairy farm assistant earns $34k (http://www.careers.govt.nz/default.aspx?id0=60103&id1=J67110).

[Hitcher]

Four days on, four days off. Most firefighters I suspect have another business or a job that they work at on their days off.

I lost a lot of respect for firefighters when they (their union) wasted taxpayers' money on a citizen initiated referendum on what was an matter best addressed directly with their employer.

[p.dath]

I was just listening to the voices in my head again. Is it just me, or do a lot of the better paid jobs tend to be Government paid?

e,g. Police, Fire fighters, public sector doctors, armed forces, public sector nurses, zillions of management and consultants, etc.

I wonder what the average wage would become if you removed all public sector jobs from the equation. I wonder if it would go up or down.

[Maha]

I think the money gets better the higher up the ladder they go.

[dogsnbikes]

I was told there was a 2 year waiting list to join! That was bullshit as there is no waiting list but hundreds apply and not many get through! Decided to wait until i pack on a bit more muscle before i even bother applying. Even considered joining the Army to do firefighting.

or the Airforce

yeah they do deserve a pay increase....regardless of what there shift's are anyone know?? 4 on 4 off ?? hitcher has answer dial up takes so dam long at times

Maybe just maybe everytime polliticions get a rise the emergancy services get a rise.....

[allycatz]

Well I think yes and how about the volunteer firefighters, mostly self employed that leave their jobs for callouts getting paid as well.....perhaps part of our fire levies on insurance can go towards it instead of the coffers of overseas based insurance companies. I don't envy them scraping road victims up off the highways

[coffeejunkie]

Of course they deserve a payrise.....

They run into burning buildings to save ppl with out thinking of themselves, Thats gotta take guts or a big set of man nuts thats for sure.

Balzys bro is a vollie and i know afew full timers.....they earn their money hard out

:woohoo::woohoo:go the firefighters

[Hitcher]

I was just listening to the voices in my head again. Is it just me, or do a lot of the better paid jobs tend to be Government paid?

e,g. Police, Fire fighters, public sector doctors, armed forces, public sector nurses, zillions of management and consultants, etc.

I wonder what the average wage would become if you removed all public sector jobs from the equation. I wonder if it would go up or down.

Give those voices in your head some medication. You worry about some strangely odd stuff.

Despite the best efforts of the politically correct, pay equity is dead and buried. And thank goodness for that. The thought of some taxpayer-funded tribunal deciding whether or not nurses should be paid more or less than teachers relative to police or drainlayers beggars belief.

The market has many failings. Deciding the relative values of different professions isn't one of them.

[sil3nt]

Volunteers are just that..volunteers. They do it because the love it. They get paid petrol money they do not need to get paid for the job they want to do. My girlfriend is a volunteer firefighter and not once has she ever complained about not getting paid!

[bsasuper]

They get plenty of overtime and perks now, no need to get greedy.

[Dave Lobster]

Any profession that has a queue of people for each application is never going to be paid more, is it?
What's the point, from the employer's point of view?
Any disgruntled staff that leave can be replaced within seconds.

I deserve a payrise. I haven't had one for three years. But then, I don't work for the government.

[allycatz]

Volunteers are just that..volunteers. They do it because the love it. They get paid petrol money they do not need to get paid for the job they want to do. My girlfriend is a volunteer firefighter and not once has she ever complained about not getting paid!

I just dont see why we have volunteer firefighters....there is no need for people to have to do it for free though

[Pedrostt500]

Yes they deserve a pay rise, dealing with bad motor vechicle accidents would not be plesant, ie cutting some kid out of a car wreck.

[sil3nt]

I just dont see why we have volunteer firefighters....there is no need for people to have to do it for free thoughWe have volunteers because there is not enough call outs to justify having full time staff employed in the small towns. Sometimes they get a call out a couple of times a day other times it could be two weeks between a call out. If people are happily doing it for free i fail to see the problem! If you want to get paid to do it then apply as a career firefighter or don't join the volunteers!

[firefighter]

I was just listening to the voices in my head again. Is it just me, or do a lot of the better paid jobs tend to be Government paid?

e,g. Police, Fire fighters, public sector doctors, armed forces, public sector nurses, zillions of management and consultants, etc.


You put doctor in with armed forces? Hardly a comparable pay scale.

And no. Armed forces are NOT better paid.


I deserve a payrise. I haven't had one for three years. But then, I don't work for the government.


You both have completely un-educated opinions of gobbernment employ.

I've been in two of the armed services, neither has had any great payrises you for some reason think has happened.

Don't confuse these departments with councellors and politicians.

Really........don't.

[firefighter]

I just dont see why we have volunteer firefighters....there is no need for people to have to do it for free though

Because they are not only needed, they really really enjoy it, and take it pretty seriously.

It would cost a fortune to replace them with permanent staff.

Why take that away from them, and from the people who need them?

I'm sure you'd want a truck to your house within 8 minutes, if not sooner......

[sil3nt]

Cost of living is a lot less while in the Armed Forces as well.

I have a mate in an internship as a government legal advisor and if he makes it through he starts on $80K :dry:

[hospitalfood]

Volunteers are just that..volunteers. They do it because the love it. They get paid petrol money they do not need to get paid for the job they want to do. My girlfriend is a volunteer firefighter and not once has she ever complained about not getting paid!

mate, I'm a dedicated member of the local volunteer fire party and i don't love it at all. some of us do it because we live in small rural towns and if we don't local property is a lot worse off. I'm not asking to be paid for it but don't think I do it for love, it is fucking hard to love going to a car crash or fire at three in the morning. we do it because it has to be done. my favorite call-outs are false alarms because at least they are over quickly.

as far as full time firemen getting more money, HELL YEAH ! all NZ manual workers should get more money.

[allycatz]

Because they are not only needed, they really really enjoy it, and take it pretty seriously.

It would cost a fortune to replace them with permanent staff.

Why take that away from them, and from the people who need them?

I'm sure you'd want a truck to your house within 8 minutes, if not sooner......

Sorry, dont get me wrong, im not saying they shouldnt be there, i was meaning I dont see why a job so important should be done for free. I realise its because people want to, just like volly ambulance but when we have some of the exhorbitant politician perks going on, why should people be expected to do it for free

[firefighter]

Cost of living is a lot less while in the Armed Forces as well.

I have a mate in an internship as a government legal advisor and if he makes it through he starts on $80K :dry:

If your happy to spend all your time ON BASE. Wow what a life..........

You get free gym, pool, and a cheap 6x8 room-smaller than a cell, the single bed fills 90% of the room. That's all you have before you compare it to a flat, that's it. A room.

You don't use these facilities all that much to justify it.

99% of the time the medical you use is caused by the job and covered by ACC, and the dental is a yearly checkup where they don't do anything unless you really really need it.

When was the last time you used all these facilities?

Having them free make your life alot cheaper?

Answer-No.

[firefighter]

Sorry, dont get me wrong, im not saying they shouldnt be there, i was meaning I dont see why a job so important should be done for free. I realise its because people want to, just like volly ambulance but when we have some of the exhorbitant politician perks going on, why should people be expected to do it for free

I hear you, but until the vollys stop doing it, they will always be there.

(which is cool with me/ex volly myself/except I loved it)

[Timber020]

Give me a break, I have family and friends who are firefighters. They do SFA at least 80% of the time. They watch TV, sleep, game, surf the net, take the fire appliance out to look at women or pick up lunch, they keep second jobs (I know one that has built his own house in less than a year) and their job isnt even that dangerous statistically. They loose one guy on the job in 25 years, in my industry we loose a guy every 25 months, and theres less of us.

Firefighters have a great romantic attraction for the public, but they actually do very little most of the time and get paid well for it.

Vollys do more for less and dont whine about it all the time. Send more funds there way.

[IdunBrokdItAgin]

I think the question should be: Do the fire fighters deserve a pay rise in line with inflation - answer yes.
Do the fire figthers deserve a pay rise above inflation - answer no.
Will the fire fighters get a pay rise in line with inflation - expecting a no.
Will this be rectified in future years (outside of a recession) - probably.

Bit of quick economic thinking would say that public service pay rises will not be in line with inflation but at a crunch point in future years a catch up to inflation will take place (due to strikes or such like).

Personaly I think that the original question is as biased as you can get - "Should firefighters get a pay rise?" (hell yeah!) "Do I have to pay for it with higher taxes?" (hell no!).

Get a grip. As we all know: Emergency services are the heroes (you only truly realise this when you need them) that is a certainty. That they aren't always properly renumerated for their sacrifices is also (unfortunately) a certainty.

[Dave Lobster]

You both have completely un-educated opinions of gobbernment employ.

I've been in two of the armed services, neither has had any great payrises you for some reason think has happened.

Don't confuse these departments with councellors and politicians.

Really........don't.

No, I don't.

I've spent many years in the armed services myself. After spending most of the nineties in the Balkans, I left and got a proper job.

I can't think of many jobs where the employees are forced to stay. Something I learned early on in the army - if you don't like it, leave. (or if you're a fireman, strike.. and the 18 year old lads in the army will do your job for you - for half the cash)

[ynot slow]

I know a few vollunteer f/f in small towns,most are self employed.My old boss was chief and had been in force as volunteer for years,at the time he had 2 or 3 guys on the brigade,these guys were part of the rural community,towns like Okaiawa,Kaponga,Opunake,all at least 20 mins from main stations of Stratford and Hawera.

I know of at least 4 guys at Hawera who are self employed,and drop work if required,as an idea if the alarm at Kiwi dairies (Fontera)went they sent 2 trucks,reason was 2 roads to factory,if one road closed for any reason the truck could get through,assertain the damage and call for backup.

Also worked with a guy who was volunteer,he had joined almost as soon as he started work,a few times was called out,used to piss a dept manager if he was called out,mostly because the manager had not allowed his workers allowance for breakdowns,customers not on time,faulty product etc,let alone a fire call out.Happened one day a call out,and the guys were behind by a half day,the manager wasn't happy to get a call saying one guy was required to fight a fire.The rest of the team said go,we'll carry on,they finished about 8.00pm.We all asked the manager what if it was your home,enough said we told him.

[taff1954]

Have to say yes, have done heaps of training over the years, hot-fire, confined space rescue and so on (petro-chem industry), and it's bloody hard work. I've also been first on-scene of a fatal car crash and an industrial fatal. Think of how much training these guys have to do to stay on top of the job. One of the main reasons we don't see too many get killed on the job is all the training they do. It's not just about hourly rates - you've got to be pretty dedicated to do some of the shit these guys have to deal with.

[enigma51]

Give me a break, I have family and friends who are firefighters. They do SFA at least 80% of the time. They watch TV, sleep, game, surf the net, take the fire appliance out to look at women or pick up lunch, they keep second jobs (I know one that has built his own house in less than a year) and their job isnt even that dangerous statistically. They loose one guy on the job in 25 years, in my industry we loose a guy every 25 months, and theres less of us.

Firefighters have a great romantic attraction for the public, but they actually do very little most of the time and get paid well for it.

Vollys do more for less and dont whine about it all the time. Send more funds there way.


You friends/ family must be some of the lucky once silverdale is the second busiest and they had over 1000 trucks out the door over the last year. I think your right they are doing sweet fuck all must be the fire fairies doing the work.

[p.dath]

You friends/ family must be some of the lucky once silverdale is the second busiest and they had over 1000 trucks out the door over the last year. I think your right they are doing sweet fuck all must be the fire fairies doing the work.

Not wanting to support the line they do nothing ...

But that's only an average of less than 3 call outs a days. One job every 8 hours or so. It sounds like Timber020 is right, they must have a lot of time to kill.

And your saying that's second busiest station? What is a quiet station like?

[enigma51]

Not wanting to support the line they do nothing ...

But that's only an average of less than 3 call outs a days. One job every 8 hours or so. It sounds like Timber020 is right, they must have a lot of time to kill.

And your saying that's second busiest station? What is a quiet station like?

house fires are an average of 4 hours on site. Car crash maybe 2 maybe 3. Fatal that can be all bloody day. Now dont know if you have been to a fatal crash lately but they are as nice as vomit in a tumble dryer.

It might not seem that they are very busy but i dare you to run around for 4 hours in level 2's (that brown fire proof stuff they wear)

[enigma51]

The stranges thing to me is that people that gives the most critic about the fire service are usually the once who expect the most when they are in a car crash or there houses are burning down.

So when they dont need them they moan and when they do need them they moan

[p.dath]

house fires are an average of 4 hours on site. Car crash maybe 2 maybe 3. Fatal that can be all bloody day. Now dont know if you have been to a fatal crash lately but they are as nice as vomit in a tumble dryer.

It might not seem that they are very busy but i dare you to run around for 4 hours in level 2's (that brown fire proof stuff they wear)

Assuming mostly house fires, that's a maximum of 12 hours work per 24 hour day, in the second busiest station.
I imagine the vast majority of stations then work far fewer hours.

I try to avoid fatal car accidents, but I can easily believe that you would be correct. I can see a lot of mental toughness would be required.

And I bet your right, that it is physically very draining. But this is one of the busier stations. I assume most other stations have a lot more time to recover between incidents.

[p.dath]

The stranges thing to me is that people that gives the most critic about the fire service are usually the once who expect the most when they are in a car crash or there houses are burning down.
...

Ah, now that's just human nature. Will always be like that.

[enigma51]

Ah, now that's just human nature. Will always be like that.

Just like tax and death?

[jetboy]

The economy is not in a great shape. People are loosing their jobs. People are working 4 day weeks. A lot of people are taking a reduction in income.

I vote no.
Sorry mate fail to agree with you.

A firefighter risks his/her own life to save others and gets paid bugger all. I've always been surprised at what they earn. I did a year's volunteering because I enjoyed it (am looking to go career sometime) and was blown away with what career firefighters earn...less than I do sitting behind a desk.

I think it's poor that frontline emergency services staff get peanuts.

[Forest]

Personaly I think that the original question is as biased as you can get - "Should firefighters get a pay rise?" (hell yeah!) "Do I have to pay for it with higher taxes?" (hell no!).


The NZ Fire Service isn't funded out of general taxation.

It is mostly funded through the Fire Service Levy. The levy is applied to fire insurance policies at a fixed rate (it used to be charged at 7.6 cents per $100 of insurance cover per year, but may have changed).

If you don't have an insurance policy for fire damage, then you don't directly contribute to the NZ Fire Service.

[Patrick]

yeah they do deserve a pay increase...

Toatally agree.... for sure!!!

regardless of what there shift's are anyone know?? 4 on 4 off ??

Ones I know run 4 on, 4 off, 12 hour shifts. Two day shifts then two night shifts. 0700 to 1900 and 1900 to 0700. But the night shifts are sleepytime, unless called out....? (Some training and maintenance, but mostly sleeping....). But hey, pay rise for sure.


.......We all asked the manager what if it was your home,enough said we told him.

Always the answer to shut the managing moaners up, ay?


One of the main reasons we don't see too many get killed on the job is all the training they do.

Quoted for truth! Well done , that man.....

[JimO]

Four days on, four days off. Most firefighters I suspect have another business or a job that they work at on their days off.

I lost a lot of respect for firefighters when they (their union) wasted taxpayers' money on a citizen initiated referendum on what was an matter best addressed directly with their employer.

i know a few dunedin firefighters they are mostly tradesmen and they all work on their days off, their shifts are 2 days, 2 nights on 4 days off, some of them manage to squeeze a few hrs perking on their nightshift days, one of my best mates joined years ago for the good money and time off now he spends his days moaning about not getting paid enough, when they arnt driving about the university area perving at young girls they are back at the station sitting on their arses

[Manxman]

Perhaps your wording is'nt quite the way you meant it be?

Do firefighters deserve a pay raise?

Would this be more what you were meaning;

Should firefighters get a raise?

There's a difference between deserving one and whether it's realistically possible.

I have my own views which would get me into trouble, so i'll keep em' to meself. Although they'd surprise most of you i'd say.

I'm really legitimately not into it for the money, I love my job, and the work I get to do in the community (really). I'm not into the politics or the other crap. But as I said the rest i'll keep to myself.

Agree.....