Slagging off partners or spouses or parents

[PrincessBandit]

There has always been a degree of slagging off kb'ers family members, often in the guise of "friendly" banter.

Now, I have no problem with people here calling their friends or a person on here who they despise 'bastard', 'prick' or 'dumb shit', or whatever as matey joshing around or hostile words. What I do think is poor form is personally sledging someone's partner/spouse/siblings/parents etc. who have nothing to do with this site or nothing to do personally with the sledgee.

There seems to be a bit of it going around at the moment, noticeably when one long standing member here dredged up an old bone to have a dig at someone via a comment about their wife. You know who you are.

If you have a problem with a kber sort it out between you, but lay off family members who don't have a voice on here. I find it really offensive that people seem to think it clever or funny to attack someone by having a go at their parents or wife or kids - even more so if they are deceased. (No, this does not pertain to the above paragraph).

Slagging off "the parents", "the wife" etc. just to wind someone up stinks.

[Hitcher]

Why draw the line at family members?

Why can't we just all -- love one another?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W61Q-EZ8R7M

[Headbanger]

So...........mentioning ugly children would be poor form?:woohoo:

[Headbanger]

Like, Your kids are so ugly I thought they were going to bark.......

[Headbanger]

So.....I wasn't surprised when they did:woohoo::woohoo::woohoo:

Woof woof.

[Ronin]

Why draw the line at family members?

Why can't we just all -- love one another?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W61Q-EZ8R7M

Hug me Hitcher, hug me now.....


I had an interesting chat with my 11 year old son about a comment he posted on youtube. Never post something you would not be willing to say to someone's face. Put a lot of the posters you are talking about in the same room and I suspect there would be an outbreak of love and cuddles.

[FROSTY]

Why draw the line at family members?

Why can't we just all -- love one another?
LETS TALK ABOUT LOVE LOVE LOVE --talk about looove
Ok Howsabout a big ol group hug one and all -cept COL cos he breaks ribs :bye:
I actually figured it out.--We are all itchin to go riding and our sleeps all been ferked up by this daylight saving thingee.

[Timber020]

Harden up, this is real life, there shouldnt be cotton wool, safety nets or the false expectation that everyone plays nice and the world is fair.

[one-speed]

Why draw the line at family members?

Why can't we just all -- love one another?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W61Q-EZ8R7M

Good point:)

[Headbanger]

Harden up, this is real life, there shouldnt be cotton wool, safety nets or the false expectation that everyone plays nice and the world is fair.

No, This is the internet, If this was real life a few people would have had eaten a fist or three.

Of course I believe that everyone I debate with is quite comfortable with the play of the game.

[Mekk]

No, This is the internet, If this was real life a few people would have had eaten a fist or three.

We're seeing hordes of people "just discovering" the internet thanks to the likes of youtube and facebook.

Most of the older userbase are trying to establish order or expect to be treated the same as they would offline. They haven't grown up with it or gone through the early phases so they are having a hard time coming to grips with what people will say and do when they can be anonymous.

It's a lolocaust.

[Number One]

:sherlock: Is it ok if it is your own partner or spouse or parents that you are slagging off? :confused:

[ynot slow]

Always found slagging off a guys mum or wife/girlfriend worked really well on sports field,in fact most saw funny side of momma taunts.

[Oakie]

Even the mafia makes wives and children out of bounds.

[Blackshear]

:sherlock: Is it ok if it is your own partner or spouse or parents that you are slagging off? :confused:

It depends if you have quicker access to the high grounds.
Or a really well-padded ass. :innocent:

[Number One]

Or a really well-paddled ass. :innocent:
Yup my arse is well paddled :innocent: ;)

Seriously though - it is a turn off when you do see members making disparaging comments about their loved ones...doesn't happen much but the few I remember I have held in my head as peeps I won't bother with.

[Trudes]

It's a form of foreplay in this house!:innocent:

[SixPackBack]

It's a form of foreplay in this house!:innocent:

Hell yeah, nothing like make up sex to get the sparks flying.....I create an argument and keep it going for a few days just to get some sweet jiggy:blink:

[The Stranger]

Most of the older userbase are trying to establish order or expect to be treated the same as they would offline. They haven't grown up with it or gone through the early phases so they are having a hard time coming to grips with what people will say and do when they can be anonymous.



Oh yeah, I just wish someone would teach me how to use the internet - this shit is all new to us old cunts, I mean, it's not like we built computers or the internet or something. It was all just beamed down to earth a few weeks back and I'm still discovering it.

So tell me, what was it like in the early days?

Fuck wit.

[Taz]

Too many of you take this site and the interweb too seriously.

[_STAIN_]

another fine statement

how does one become a mentor ?

[Mekk]

Oh yeah, I just wish someone would teach me how to use the internet - this shit is all new to us old cunts, I mean, it's not like we built computers or the internet or something. It was all just beamed down to earth a few weeks back and I'm still discovering it.

So tell me, what was it like in the early days?

Fuck wit.

That kind of reaction is exactly what I am talking about, so I hope you're being ironic.

Try working on an I.T. helpdesk, you'll soon learn what a lot of "old cunts" are like.

[PrincessBandit]

Usually most people can tell the difference between the "generalisation insults" (such as the "yo' momma...." jokes) and the ones which are obviously a direct swipe and in no way could be brushed aside as a bit of a laugh.

I had plenty of HTFU pills over the weekend so there is no need to question my dosage of those. Obviously the phrase "rules of engagement" mean nothing to some on here. Sad reflection on a self centred no holds barred mentality.

[Number One]

Try working on an I.T. helpdesk, you'll soon learn what a lot of "old cunts" are like.

I'm with Stranger on this one and I am not nearly as old as I have heard he is :chase:

I spent years training (young and older people) in the call centre environment. For one role trainees needed to master over 1200 policies/processes and use 10 different specialist applications in under 6 weeks. The older workers did take longer to master some of the first lessons taught but once they did they were far better at picking up the rest of the stuff and remembered it far better also....they were much better at building frameworks and rules of thumb for future reference.

Yes the young ones (in general) had a better foundation knowledge of how computers work and though they seemed to learn quicker they were really just cocky, had a lack of detail orientation and sped through things too fast making errors aplenty.

The result? The "old cunts" out performed all the young ones by far with a much lower number of mistakes AND they had much higher call quality also....so much so that this company started to work to attract people older than 20-something. In my years at a bank it was the young ones who made the biggest and most problematic (and often simplest) of mistakes, where as the older workers took their time, got things right, would check if they were ever unsure and were much better at dealing with cutomers.

Now I don't do training but there are few of these "old cunts" around me and they don't even bother calling the helpdesk half the time when they need help. They choose instead to ask for assistance from those around them rather as they hate talking to the know-it-all "young pricks" who seem to delight in talking down to them and making them feel stupid for having to ask in the first place...half the time too the helpdesk jockeys make very little sense as they are not always so skilled at talking to non IT types.

I do agree with something I think you implied though that people's attitudes about how they should be treated need to adjust and this I think is an evolving thing...we all lament a return to 'the good old days' as have people in times gone by.



Sad reflection on a self centred no holds barred mentality.

That's life now though eh - dog eat dog, every man for himself blah blah blah

[Mekk]

The result? The "old cunts" out performed all the young ones by far with a much lower number of mistakes AND they had much higher call quality also....so much so that this company started to work to attract people older than 20-something. In my years at a bank it was the young ones who made the biggest and most problematic (and often simplest) of mistakes, where as the older workers took their time, got things right, would check if they were ever unsure and were much better at dealing with cutomers.


I think we're on different wavelengths. I am talking about the internet culture, the way people interact with other people through it, not the technical skill needed to use it.

My I.T. helpdesk response was a generalization, sorry.

The Stranger's response is typical of the kind of people I am talking about, regardless of age. Usually exemplified by people new to the internet. This includes prepubescent youtubers and ignorant "old cunts".

The people that think that talking to the anonymous is the same as talking face to face and that everything is so offensive and worth getting worked up about.

I mean is the guy sitting there balling his fists, raging out at a post he disagrees with? Shit, he'd better stay away from The Herald's "your views" section in case he has a heart attack.

[The Stranger]

The people that think that talking to the anonymous is the same as talking face to face and that everything is so offensive and worth getting worked up about.

I mean is the guy sitting there balling his fists, raging out at a post he disagrees with? Shit, he'd better stay away from The Herald's "your views" section in case he has a heart attack.

BWAHAHAHAHA.

Who's getting worked up? You is fool.
You seen fit to get stressed out (twice) and your imagination is running wild on you.

Keep it up old man.

[Headbanger]

Obviously the phrase "rules of engagement" mean nothing to some on here. Sad reflection on a self centred no holds barred mentality.

The fact that you believe your definition on the rules of engagement should be applied to everyone else is a sad reflection on....blah blah blah blah.

I don't necessarily disagree with you in regards to what maybe termed rude or offensive, I just don't believe I have any say in the matter, Every different forum attracts a different type of crowd, and people are welcome to find their own corner where the company suits them.

[Headbanger]

Oh yeah, I just wish someone would teach me how to use the internet - this shit is all new to us old cunts, I mean, it's not like we built computers or the internet or something. It was all just beamed down to earth a few weeks back and I'm still discovering it.

So tell me, what was it like in the early days?

Fuck wit.

Thats excellent work, I laughed in a jolly type fashion.

[Number One]

+1 again to The Stranger...what a dag.

That's like young Dean thinking he has upset me with his posts just because I respond...there is one but it ain't one worth telling others about :lol:

Mekk - I agree with this bit "internet culture, the way people interact with other people through it" this is not limited though to "old cunts" and yes you did make a sweeping generalisation there as there seem to be just as many 'saavy young ones' who think you should be nice to them on the internet too.

[Mom]

That's like young Dean thinking he has upset me with his posts just because I respond...there is one but it ain't one worth telling others about :lol:

I have just been catching up with that little drama, you were far too, far too easy on him m'dear, not your best work by far ;)

[Mekk]

Something important.


So anyway.

The kind of people that mistake the wonderful lolly land of the internet for real life haven't really grasped the fact that social restrictions are removed and people can say what they like. They expect royal treatment and it comes as shock when they don't get it.

Therefore slagging off a partner's spouse or parents should only really matter if you know the offender in person.

Everyone else should just relax and accept it as part of the internet. If you're really upset, you can always run to a moderator.

[Mekk]

Mekk - I agree with this bit "internet culture, the way people interact with other people through it" this is not limited though to "old cunts" and yes you did make a sweeping generalisation there as there seem to be just as many 'saavy young ones' who think you should be nice to them on the internet too.

Oh there's plenty of young people that fall into that category, most of them are in flame wars on youtube.

They may be tech savvy, but that means jack if they don't understand the culture or that they're not entitled the same kind of respect they're used (or not used) to in real life.

[Number One]

I have just been catching up with that little drama, you were far too, far too easy on him m'dear, not your best work by far ;)
Yeah, Sully one expects to be entertained some of the time while he is on holiday so not enough energy or time to bother stirring properly.

[Number One]

means jack if they don't understand the culture or that they're not entitled the same kind of respect they're used (or not used) to in real life.
It's evolving - like most things. Remember when smoking was marketted as having health benefits? I would challenge that there is only one culture online. I think KB is a good example. There are the shit stirrers and the fun police there are the kind gentle really generous and humble types who take some of the shine off the mindless attention seekers and there are the lurkers and those that only use the site for MOTORCYCLE related stuff....how the culture is perceived and or experienced is I believe more of a reflection of your own perspective.

[Mom]

So anyway.

The kind of people that mistake the wonderful lolly land of the internet for real life haven't really grasped the fact that social restrictions are removed and people can say what they like. They expect royal treatment and it comes as shock when they don't get it.

Therefore slagging off a partner's spouse or parents should only really matter if you know the offender in person.

Everyone else should just relax and accept it as part of the internet. If you're really upset, you can always run to a moderator.

See, this is where you and I will have bit of a difference of opinion. I dont expect some smart arsed, wet behind the ears little shit should think it ok to make rude and offensive comments about pictures of my kids on here. There are none btw, thanks to some sick fuck that thought it was "cute". Social restrictions do apply, it is the tiny penised members of the forum that think that sort of thing is ok.

Of course people should be able to say what they think etc, but taking the time to make seriously offensive comments about some things that include my kids is way out of line. If I am really upset mate, I wont run to a Mod, I will come and pay you a visit :yes: This place is not the annonymous place some of you think it is either, this is actually a small place.

[Mekk]

It's all evolving I guess.

That's my point.

With the advent of youtube and facebook and whatnot, there are whole hordes of new users joining the fray and getting upset with things that have been the same since "the early days".

One of those things is anonymity and what people will say with its protection.

[Mekk]

See, this is where you and I will have bit of a difference of opinion. I dont expect some smart arsed, wet behind the ears little shit should think it ok to make rude and offensive comments about pictures of my kids on here. There are none btw, thanks to some sick fuck that thought it was "cute".

There are enough avenues of protection available in forums to protect any photos you post. It's the same with youtube and facebook, there are privacy controls, moderators and group settings.

That is what I am getting at, some people expect everything they post to be celebrated, enjoyed and loved. They are shocked when someone makes rude or offensive comments.

Why should they have weight if you don't know them? They may even be a script generated by a program for all you know.

[Mom]

There are enough avenues of protection available in forums to protect any photos you post. It's the same with youtube and facebook, there are privacy controls, moderators and group settings.

That is what I am getting at, some people expect everything they post to be celebrated, enjoyed and loved. They are shocked when someone makes rude or offensive comments.

Why should they have weight if you don't know them? They may even be a script generated by a program for all you know.

Sure there are protections available, I am not arguing there are not, my point has nothing to do with "protections" it is all about the fact that some people think it is ok to do that in the first place, I have absolute clarity about whether they would say it in my company. They would not, for even though I am little I dont take shit on many levels from anyone. The kind of comments I am talking about have nothing to do with random programs, they are all about young fuckers that think it is funny to post disgusting shit for their amusement. Cowards is what they are. Complete and utter cowards. Me, I will tell you in person exactly what I say to you on here. There are a few around that can testify to that fact.

[Mekk]

Cowards is what they are. Complete and utter cowards. Me, I will tell you in person exactly what I say to you on here. There are a few around that can testify to that fact.

So what?

There are cowards in all facets of society, why do people get most upset with it on here?

It is easier to ignore people like that online than in person.

[Squiggles]

Your mother.

kthnxbai.

[SixPackBack]

Sure there are protections available, I am not arguing there are not, my point has nothing to do with "protections" it is all about the fact that some people think it is ok to do that in the first place, I have absolute clarity about whether they would say it in my company. They would not, for even though I am little I dont take shit on many levels from anyone. The kind of comments I am talking about have nothing to do with random programs, they are all about young fuckers that think it is funny to post disgusting shit for their amusement. Cowards is what they are. Complete and utter cowards. Me, I will tell you in person exactly what I say to you on here. There are a few around that can testify to that fact.

Yep you are the same online as in real life, but expecting everyone to follow your world view of the Internet and getting pissed when they don't is unrealistic.

We do not all share the same perception of what KB is or is not, how it should be used and when or if we CHOOSE to take exception to online comments. Only words and images can be conveyed by the Internet medium, neither of which can cause individuals harm. The cowards that you talk about are fishing for a bite and by grabbing the hook you accept the bait........try swimming on bye!:sunny:

[Cheshire Cat]

So...........mentioning ugly children would be poor form?:woohoo:
haha

Like, Your kids are so ugly I thought they were going to bark.......
LOL

So.....I wasn't surprised when they did:woohoo::woohoo::woohoo:

Woof woof.

LMFAO!!


and the piss taking starts!!!

isn't KB wonderful?:innocent:

[Leyton]

Hitcher, dude, I have been thinking about you for a long time now and cant get you out of my head.

Can I have your babys ?:love:

[Cheshire Cat]

Hitcher, dude, I have been thinking about you for a long time now and cant get you out of my head.

Can I have your babys ?:love:

WHAT THE FUCK MAN!!! :blink::blink::blink::shit::blink:

[Dean]

Billys at his mates birthday party



But is it ok for Billy to give his mates mum a woody?



Yes, Yes it is ok

Crack a woody

[cc rider]

Dean my sweet, you is like an automated bowling pin machine....




....you keep setting yourself up :rockon:



Leyton -STOP THAT :nono:

[SARGE]

That kind of reaction is exactly what I am talking about, so I hope you're being ironic.

Try working on an I.T. helpdesk, you'll soon learn what a lot of "old cunts" are like.

my wife manages an IT Helpdesk and im an old cunt who speaks command line as second language ..

im in yr internets :whocares:



oh .. sorry .. you young whiz kids own the interdweeb...


EVERYONE OVER 30 GET OFF THE NET PLEASE!!!

[The Stranger]

WHAT THE FUCK MAN!!! :blink::blink::blink::shit::blink:

Come on - you know you want to.

Just better hope they don't have the hitcher head is all.

[Dean]

Dean my sweet, you is like an automated bowling pin machine....




....you keep setting yourself up :rockon:

Thankyou cc rider, quite true I must say, green awarded.
Edit: you must spread some rep around bleh..meh.

[Mekk]

my wife manages an IT Helpdesk and im an old cunt who speaks command line as second language ..

im in yr internets :whocares:



oh .. sorry .. you young whiz kids own the interdweeb...


EVERYONE OVER 30 GET OFF THE NET PLEASE!!!

I'm talkin' about culture, pops.

[Mekk]

Why'd you eat your words, Bass?

[Bass]

Why'd you eat your words, Bass?

Because when I read on, it had been adequately covered and I was saying nothing new.

I still hold that being a prize prick while hiding behind a keyboard is a gutless thing to do, internet or not. What's more, in my opinion, being unsure of what or who you are targeting does not make it justifiable, it actually makes it worse.

I guess I'm a dinosaur but it seems to me that it's just another example of people trying to absolve themselves of responsibility for their actions - commonplace occurrance today I think.

[PrincessBandit]

I suppose the best thing to do might be give the impression we don't give a f*ck about anyone, least of all our families, so that slaggers don't have a perceived weak spot to gnaw away at?

Still reckon that insults intended to hurt based on (e.g.) wishing harm on someone's wife/folks/kids etc. is a pretty low form of attack. Perhaps those who indulge in it are inexplicably drawn to the "below the belt" area.

[StoneY]

I think this one relates too the topic.
It is simply easy to be 'brave and opinionated' from behind ya screen accross the safety of all that etherspace

http://www.xkcd.com/438/

:)

[SARGE]

i'm talkin' about culture, pops.

you guys have culture?.. Or just a big herd of me-too sheeple?

Now wheres my dagum ipod?.. I left it next to that whizberry contraption..

[SARGE]

yep you are the same online as in real life, but expecting everyone to follow your world view of the internet and getting pissed when they don't is unrealistic.

we do not all share the same perception of what kb is or is not, how it should be used and when or if we choose to take exception to online comments. Only words and images can be conveyed by the internet medium, neither of which can cause individuals harm. The cowards that you talk about are fishing for a bite and by grabbing the hook you accept the bait........try swimming on bye!:sunny:

i just show up at their house...


Allegedly....:innocent:

[MIXONE]

i just show up at their house...


Allegedly....:innocent:

That's fine by me just bring a bottle of Jack with ya!

[Mekk]

you guys have culture?.. Or just a big herd of me-too sheeple?

Now wheres my dagum ipod?.. I left it next to that whizberry contraption..

There is an internet culture that has existed for over a decade.

Fuck iPods.

[SARGE]

That's fine by me just bring a bottle of Jack with ya!

true sign you have a drinking problem.. when you can tell the difference between Jack D and Jim Beam by the sound the bottle makes on the back of your head....:woohoo:

[SARGE]

There is an internet culture that has existed for over a decade.

Fuck iPods.

for true?... damn.. a whole culture around the internet?...

amazing times we live in here ...next you'll be telling me we've split the atom or some nonsense like that ...


anyone else hear of this Internet culture ??.. i feel like im missing out .. :tugger:

[James Deuce]

I think we're on different wavelengths. I am talking about the internet culture, the way people interact with other people through it, not the technical skill needed to use it.

My I.T. helpdesk response was a generalization, sorry.

The Stranger's response is typical of the kind of people I am talking about, regardless of age. Usually exemplified by people new to the internet. This includes prepubescent youtubers and ignorant "old cunts".

The people that think that talking to the anonymous is the same as talking face to face and that everything is so offensive and worth getting worked up about.

I mean is the guy sitting there balling his fists, raging out at a post he disagrees with? Shit, he'd better stay away from The Herald's "your views" section in case he has a heart attack.
Hang on a minute, there isn't one single Internet culture, and you're making huge assumptions about the 40 years+ previous experience some people have on the Internet.

For the bulk of its existence it has been a forum for peer reviewing intellectual publications. The applications that run on its framework are quite seriously, secondary to many organisations who are its biggest users. Don't assume that porn, Skype, Web Browsing and email and how people use them are why the Internet is there.

Your attitude is symptomatic of the "I've always used the Internet this way and everyone else has to adapt to my perception of it" syndrome that a bunch of young cunts have dragged through the last decade's worth of "knowledge worker economy" education policies which have been foisted on a work force already short of skilled productive workers.

Something that particular group needs to get to grips with is that their anti-social approach to Internet based communication is a cultural blip that will correct itself. Courtesy and respect are what glue any culture together. The assumption that using the Internet requires a disrespectful, discourteous manner to be regarded as "hip" (get orf my lawn) is why a large number of sub-25 year olds find themselves being treated as children in a corporate environment. Making people feel good about dealing with you is paramount to successfully concluding a interaction with a person.

Just because your MO in regard to Internet communication has always been confrontational and semi-literate doesn't mean everyone else gets it, and the 5 monkeys method of education doesn't work with the "old cunts". They know how it works, and don't care what other people think about their inability to adapt to a small percentage of the general population's insistance on behaving poorly as a default setting.

In future, please refer to my signature before posting.

[MSTRS]

Courtesy and respect are what glue any culture together.

I think Mekk is referring to his sort of culture...you know, the one usually found in a petri dish.

[Mekk]

Hang on a minute, there isn't one single Internet culture, and you're making huge assumptions about the 40 years+ previous experience some people have on the Internet.

I am referring to the manner in which people communicate differently via the internet as the internet "culture". That can include any number of different sub-cultures(?) but the main thing is the avenue and the anonymity it provides.




Your attitude is symptomatic of the "I've always used the Internet this way and everyone else has to adapt to my perception of it" syndrome that a bunch of young cunts have dragged through the last decade's worth of "knowledge worker economy" education policies have foisted on a work force already short of skilled productive workers.

Is the reverse perspective any different in saying that "This is the way I've done it offline, everyone else should adapt to that perception online"?




Something that particular group needs to get to grips with is that their anti-social approach to Internet based communication is a cultural blip that will correct itself. Courtesy and respect are what glue any culture together. The assumption that using the Internet requires a disrespectful, discourteous manner to be regarded as "hip" (get orf my lawn) is why a large number of sub-25 year olds find themselves being treated as children in a corporate environment. Making people feel good about dealing with you is paramount to successfully concluding a interaction with a person.

I agree, but part of internet culture is trolls and fucktards, just as in the real world. It is unreasonable to expect it to be clean of it and lecture others.



Just because your MO in regard to Internet communication has always been confrontational and semi-literate doesn't mean everyone else gets it, and the 5 monkeys method of education doesn't work with the "old cunts". They know how it works, and don't care what other people think about their inability to adapt to small percentage of the general population's insistance on behaving poorly as a default setting.

Eh, you don't go riding and complain that you got bugs on your headlight.

[McJim]

All the world's a bastard.:bash:

[James Deuce]

I am referring to the manner in which people communicate differently via the internet as the internet "culture". That can include any number of different sub-cultures(?) but the main thing is the avenue and the anonymity it provides.

Is the reverse perspective any different in saying that "This is the way I've done it offline, everyone else should adapt to that perception online"?

I agree, but part of internet culture is trolls and fucktards, just as in the real world. It is unreasonable to expect it to be clean of it and lecture others.

Eh, you don't go riding and complain that you got bugs on your headlight.

I don't know if you're being deliberately obtuse, but I will give you one pointer.

Try to find analogies that are meaningful, because despite the lovely spelling and grammar I'm not sure that any of what you typed in response to my post was related to what I said.

[McJim]

Eh, you don't go riding and complain that you got bugs on your headlight.

I go riding and get bugs on my headlight - it's a real pain in the arse and its your mother's fault :Pokey:

:rofl:

[cc rider]

I go riding and get bugs on my headlight - it's a real pain in the arse and its your mother's fault :Pokey:

:rofl:Is that like, 'puter speek for...I wen out horing n caught sumpten - don't member doin THAT! n yeah, it's still your old ladies fault. :buggerd: :innocent:

[Mekk]

I don't know if you're being deliberately obtuse, but I will give you one pointer.

Try to find analogies that are meaningful, because despite the lovely spelling and grammar I'm not sure that any of what you typed in response to my post was related to what I said.

Hah, end-of-the-day-itis on the analogy. The worst part being that it took me a couple of minutes to think up!

The rest stands.

[James Deuce]

The rest stands.

No it doesn't because it's subjective nonsense.

[Mekk]

No it doesn't because it's subjective nonsense.

The meat of your argument, that we should all just get along falls out of line with reality.

Cultural blip that corrects itself? Like convicts, anti-social behaviour offline? Please let me know when that happens!

[Swoop]

anyone else hear of this Internet culture ??
It grows on old cheese?

[MSTRS]

The meat of your argument, that we should all just get along falls out of line with reality.

Cultural blip that corrects itself? Like convicts, anti-social behaviour offline? Please let me know when that happens!

And the meat of yours is that 'others do it, so it's ok'
You obviously weren't paying attention in nature class...the herd always protects itself (eventually, at least).

[Mekk]

And the meat of yours is that 'others do it, so it's ok'
You obviously weren't paying attention in nature class...the herd always protects itself (eventually, at least).

No, the meat of mine is that it's unreasonable to expect the same kind of treatment online as you would in the real world.

[MSTRS]

No, the meat of mine is that it's unreasonable to expect the same kind of treatment online as you would in the real world.

Much like we expect a reasonable standard of road-sharing...but we know that there are a few complete tossers out there? They can be avoided, just like the keyboard cowboys can be.

[Mekk]

Much like we expect a reasonable standard of road-sharing...but we know that there are a few complete tossers out there? They can be avoided, just like the keyboard cowboys can be.

Exactly my point.

It's no use getting all worked up over people slagging people off when it can be avoided.

I was saying earlier it seems that the naive people who get upset about it are usually the ones that are relatively new to the internet. They don't seem to grasp that people can and will say those things with the cloak of anonymity.

[MSTRS]

JD and others are merely pointing out that those little tossers need to realise that they are not as anonymous as they might think they are, that they don't have a given right to be obnoxious, and just perhaps they should grow up....

[yungatart]

No, the meat of mine is that it's unreasonable to expect the same kind of treatment online as you would in the real world.

Why is it unreasonable to expect to be treated with decency and courtesy online?
It shouldn't be!

[Mekk]

Why is it unreasonable to expect to be treated with decency and courtesy online?
It shouldn't be!

Because there's the element of anonymity as well as distance from the people you're interacting with. People can say what they like without the same consequences of the real world (ie, a slap).

The problem with enforcing strict politeness policies and whatnot, you risk interfering with the very attraction and "essence" of the internet.

Gotsta find a balance!

[yungatart]

Self discipline means that it need not be enforced as it comes from within.
You may not know anything about self discipline though...judging by your arrogance and "know it all" status, I assume you are just another young wet behind the ears whipper snapper.

[Mekk]

JD and others are merely pointing out that those little tossers need to realise that they are not as anonymous as they might think they are, that they don't have a given right to be obnoxious, and just perhaps they should grow up....

Oh, perhaps a misunderstanding on my part. That's not what I was arguing about.


Self discipline means that it need not be enforced as it comes from within.


It's still unreasonable to expect the same kind of courtesy and respect in an anonymous universe. It doesn't matter how much you want it to be so.


You may not know anything about self discipline though...judging by your arrogance and "know it all" status, I assume you are just another young wet behind the ears whipper snapper.

Shrug, I haven't tried to insult anyone.

[Maha]

It grows on old cheese?

Culture was once very ripe in good ole' NZ.

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[Number One]

The meat of your argument..


And the meat of yours is...


No, the meat of mine...

Show us ya meat!


Why is it unreasonable to expect to be treated with decency and courtesy online?
It shouldn't be!

Hey there lovely - I'll treat you any way you want me to treat you :blip:

OK leaving now...clearly I'm not serious enough for this very serious thread :whistle:

[James Deuce]

Oh, perhaps a misunderstanding on my part. That's not what I was arguing about.



It's still unreasonable to expect the same kind of courtesy and respect in an anonymous universe. It doesn't matter how much you want it to be so.



Shrug, I haven't tried to insult anyone.
Ahh yes, but you did, because you used the phrase "old cunts".

You also argued that "old cunts" should expect to be called tards and not get annoyed.

Some "old cunts" find the phrase offensive when delivered by someone they've not ever met in real life (tm).

[Katman]

I don't much give a fuck about anyone slagging off those close to me online.

As long as they don't expect me to have forgotten it (or be happy to treat it as a joke) when we eventually meet face to face.

[Jdogg]

I think this sums it all up in one short video clip.........

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c211yCCZdJY&feature=player_profilepage

[jrandom]

I don't really give a fuck about anyone slagging off those close to me online.

As long as they don't expect me to have forgotten it (or be happy to treat it as a joke) when we eventually meet face to face.

Goodness me! I just noticed all this, PB's red rep, etc.

What I'm wondering about is how on earth commenting on those events in the context of dpex's thread counts as 'slagging off'?

Comment seemed relevant, was certainly accurate, and did not refer to anything other than comments posted in previous threads and subsequent events which transpired in public, much to the amusement of the various other KBers watching, etc.

No criticism was implied or offered.

:blink:

So. 'Slagging off'? Explain plz.

[Katman]

So. 'Slagging off'? Explain plz.

I only have one big sleep left before being able to access the treasury that is PD.

I'm looking forward to a good laugh.

(My 'slagging off' comment wasn't directed at you Dan).

[jrandom]

I only have one big sleep left before being able to access the treasury that is PD.

I'm looking forward to a good laugh.

When you're done chortling, could you maybe tell your lovely sister (which she is; don't get me wrong, etc) to, y'know, calm down a bit and go easy on the misinterpretations and overreactions?

[Katman]

When you're done chortling, could you maybe tell your lovely sister (which she is; don't get me wrong, etc) to, y'know, calm down a bit and go easy on the misinterpretations and overreactions?

Hey, a cynic might be forgiven for suggesting it runs in the family.

:whistle:

[SARGE]

Because there's the element of anonymity as well as distance from the people you're interacting with. People can say what they like without the same consequences of the real world (ie, a slap).

The problem with enforcing strict politeness policies and whatnot, you risk interfering with the very attraction and "essence" of the internet.

Gotsta find a balance!

I dont say anything on the internet that i wouldnt say to your face .. ask anyone thats met me


been that way since DOS- pre-GUI computers connecting to single line dialup BBS servers on a 5.5 baud ... ( old geek representin..)

now .. besides porn, youtube, manga, shit talking teenagers and ebay .. tell me more of this great internet 'culture' you speak of...


http://i.ehow.com/images/GlobalPhoto/Articles/4504171/trustmeiknowinternets-main_Full.jpg

[Mekk]

Ahh yes, but you did, because you used the phrase "old cunts".


I used it in quotes because it was The Stranger's phrasing, not mine.



Some "old cunts" find the phrase offensive when delivered by someone they've not ever met in real life (tm).

Do those same "old cunts" get offended by their own phrasing?

[Headbanger]

Why is it unreasonable to expect to be treated with decency and courtesy online?
It shouldn't be!

You can expect anything you like, Doesn't mean its going to work out that way, Or that your expectations are to govern everybody else. I'm sure my limits are different from many others, whose to say who should set the tone?

Well, The admins and moderators have the final say of course, But everyone is free to come and go as they please, There have been many many forums I have visited and then moved on as they were just not for me, I never considered staying and trying to force the place to my expectations of what it should be.

[SixPackBack]

Ahh yes, but you did, because you used the phrase "old cunts".

You also argued that "old cunts" should expect to be called tards and not get annoyed.

Some "old cunts" find the phrase offensive when delivered by someone they've not ever met in real life (tm).

Show me something more desirable and usefull than a cunt?

[Mekk]

I dont say anything on the internet that i wouldnt say to your face .. ask anyone thats met me

Look, I'm happy for you. Are you going to deny that there is a level of anonymity present on the internet?

And if there was a level of anonymity (pending your answer), that it would maybe affect the way people act and that it may even be different from face-to-face communication?

[Kickaha]

I only have one big sleep left before being able to access the treasury that is PD.

You'll fuck that up within a day or two though:lol:

[James Deuce]

Show me something more desirable and usefull than a cunt?
Good teeth.

[James Deuce]

Look, I'm happy for you. Are you going to deny that there is a level of anonymity present on the internet?

And if there was a level of anonymity (pending your answer), that it would maybe affect the way people act and that it may even be different from face-to-face communication?

That depends entirely on the individual undertaking the communication and the recipient of the communication. Anyone using the media as an excuse for poor behaviour is simply either immature or unpleasant.

If you are bereft of the cojones to say it to someone's face then don't type it. Especially on a biker forum site for a country with the population of a medium sized European city. 2 degrees of separation in NZ on a general basis. Every KB member will have a maximum degree of separation of 1. I've never understood the lippy psuedo-tough guy crap dished out on KB given that you may find that the person you just met and are now sharing a genial coffee in some tiny, open fire warmed cafe in middle of nowhere with might actually be the psycho dishing out small minded abuse about your family members from behind the "safety" of a keyboard.

The individual dishing out the abuse has a problem, not the "Internet" or a supposed Internet-wide culture of smack talk.

[James Deuce]

I used it in quotes because it was The Stranger's phrasing, not mine.That isn't permission. The Stranger has earned that particular turn of phrase as a long-standing member of NZ Motorcycling in general. KB is a small part of what Noel contributes to NZ motorcyclists overall.


Do those same "old cunts" get offended by their own phrasing?

Dunno. Ask them. I certainly don't go out of my way to annoy them, citing my own disrespect as an excuse for hiding behind offensive patois.

[Mom]

Are you going to deny that there is a level of anonymity present on the internet?

Now that is a silly question. Of course there is anonymity on the world wide web. While this forum uses the www to exist, do not for one tiny moment think you have the same degree of anonymity on here as you might do on other forums/social networking sites. New Zealand is a tiny little country and KB is a tiny, little forum.


The stats show we have around 16000 members, with active members 4,554 in the past 60 days. Try telling me that is an anonymous place to hurl abuse from.

[Mekk]

Especially on a biker forum site for a country with the population of a medium sized European city. 2 degrees of separation in NZ on a general basis. Every KB member will have a maximum degree of separation of 1. I've never understood the lippy psuedo-tough guy crap dished out on KB given that you may find that the person you just met and are now sharing a genial coffee in some tiny, open fire warmed cafe in middle of nowhere with might actually be the psycho dishing out small minded abuse about your family members from behind the "safety" of a keyboard.

The fact that KB is not limited to people in New Zealand renders that irrelevant. New Zealand may be the size of a medium-sized European city but the internet is not.


The individual dishing out the abuse has a problem, not the "Internet" or a supposed Internet-wide culture of smack talk.

The nature of the internet makes it far easier for people like that to go about their attacks/abuse. It also allows people that wouldn't normally abuse people offline, the opportunity to be an asshole without consequence and thus it should be expected.

Their reasons for participating in flame wars/abuse are their own but it cannot be denied that it is made easier by the internet.

[Mekk]

That isn't permission. The Stranger has earned that particular turn of phrase as a long-standing member of NZ Motorcycling in general. KB is a small part of what Noel contributes to NZ motorcyclists overall.


I wasn't looking for "permission", I was linking his terms to my ideas while remaining detached from the actual words in case they distracted from my argument.


Now that is a silly question. Of course there is anonymity on the world wide web. While this forum uses the www to exist, do not for one tiny moment think you have the same degree of anonymity on here as you might do on other forums/social networking sites. New Zealand is a tiny little country and KB is a tiny, little forum.

Of course it was a silly question, SARGE seemed to think that because he talks the same way online as he does offline, that everybody does.

Don't be naive. What proof do you have that I am even in New Zealand? Sure, smart guys can check my IP and whatnot, but what difference would that make if I was in Spain?

[Hans]

If you slag your partner in public, the first question I'll be asking myself will be ''so why are you with them?'' My old man taught me not to ever complain about my dog or my wife. Your partner is supposed to be the person closest to you, right? Why should I be friends with someone who doesn't show loyalty to their partner? Do you think they'll be loyal to their friends?

[Bass]

The fact that KB is not limited to people in New Zealand renders that irrelevant.

I disagree. You are of course technically correct but the fact remains that the vast majority of KB members do actually reside in NZ and so all the comments that have been made about the likelihood of face to face encounters with someone that has been "slagged off" are correct for all practical purposes.




The nature of the internet makes it far easier for people like that to go about their attacks/abuse. It also allows people that wouldn't normally abuse people offline, the opportunity to be an asshole without consequence and thus it should be expected.

Their reasons for participating in flame wars/abuse are their own but it cannot be denied that it is made easier by the internet.

Again, I guess that you are technically correct. However, what rubs me up the wrong way is your inference is that because it is commonplace, it is therefore acceptable. (I grant that you have not said this explicitly, but it is definitely inferred.)
To many of us (perhaps even most) it simply is not acceptable.
Burglary and sexual assault are also commonplace in NZ. Sexual assault in particular has about the same risk of consequences as slagging someone on the net, if the stats are reliable.
I don't imagine that you would argue that they should be acceptable.

[The Stranger]

We're seeing hordes of people "just discovering" the internet thanks to the likes of youtube and facebook.

Most of the older userbase are trying to establish order or expect to be treated the same as they would offline. They haven't grown up with it or gone through the early phases so they are having a hard time coming to grips with what people will say and do when they can be anonymous.

It's a lolocaust.


Because there's the element of anonymity as well as distance from the people you're interacting with. People can say what they like without the same consequences of the real world (ie, a slap).

The problem with enforcing strict politeness policies and whatnot, you risk interfering with the very attraction and "essence" of the internet.

Gotsta find a balance!


If a lot of people say you are wrong, does this make you wrong?
Of course not. But it does raise 2 possibilities that you should consider.
1) You are wrong
2) You really fucked up on the communication of your ideas.
On that basis.

I would guess that what you were trying to say in the first quote is actually what you said in the second one.
If so see 2 above, if not see 1 above




"The problem with enforcing strict politeness policies and whatnot, you risk interfering with the very attraction and "essence" of the internet."

And the downside would be?
KB operates on a set of rules and this has caused what problems?

[Mekk]

I disagree. You are of course technically correct but the fact remains that the vast majority of KB members do actually reside in NZ and so all the comments that have been made about the likelihood of face to face encounters with someone that has been "slagged off" are correct for all practical purposes.

Well we're not talking about the vast majority of users slagging people off, are we?

There's nothing to stop you from maintaining an anonymous profile on here even if you do reside in New Zealand. You don't have to know someone here and you don't even have to like bikes to join.

This is largely a digression anyway, the point is that it is easier to say without consequence and thus should be expected.



I don't imagine that you would argue that they should be acceptable.

The inference is misplaced. I am arguing that you shouldn't jump up and down about it when there are easy ways to ignore it/block it that have been in place for years.

Why get upset about what an anonymous person/bot says about you or your family? Nobody gets upset about spam e-mails telling them to enlarge their cock, do they?

Trolling thrives on attention, you're only adding fuel to the fire.

[Mekk]

If a lot of people say you are wrong, does this make you wrong?
Of course not. But it does raise 2 possibilities that you should consider.
1) You are wrong
2) You really fucked up on the communication of your ideas.
On that basis.

I would guess that what you were trying to say in the first quote is actually what you said in the second one.
If so see 2 above, if not see 1 above


The second quote is a response to a different question, why didn't you include that?




"The problem with enforcing strict politeness policies and whatnot, you risk interfering with the very attraction and "essence" of the internet."

And the downside would be?
KB operates on a set of rules and this has caused what problems?

The downside is that you lose your privacy, or you lose the ability to share information quickly and easily.

[Bass]

This is largely a digression anyway, the point is that it is easier to say without consequence and thus should be expected..

Ah but my point was that on this forum at least, there is a good chance that there will indeed be consequences






Why get upset about what an anonymous person/bot says about you or your family? Nobody gets upset about spam e-mails telling them to enlarge their cock, do they?

.
Spam is one thing but what we are discussing here is quite another.
The difference is individual targeting - the blunderbus vs the sniper's rifle

[Mekk]

Ah but my point was that on this forum at least, there is a good chance that there will indeed be consequences

Only with people that interact with the community offline. If you were a troller, why would you?

Also, it's unlikely but you don't have to be from New Zealand to stir the proverbial.

Spam is one thing but what we are discussing here is quite another.
The difference is individual targeting - the blunderbus vs the sniper's rifle

This isn't like a schoolyard bully that prevents you from doing anything about it. Even if you let it bother you, there are plenty of options in dealing with it.

My question is, why would you let it bother you?

[MSTRS]

My question is, why would you let it bother you?

If you can't do anything about it, ignore.
But if you can, then organise to get 'facetime' with the cause.

[The Stranger]

The second quote is a response to a different question, why didn't you include that?

Cool, that answers it thanks.
I had hoped that it was simply that you were having trouble with communication, but I see my first point is on the mark.

The downside is that you lose your privacy, or you lose the ability to share information quickly and easily.

So KB doesn't have privacy and doesn't have the ability quickly and easily share information?

Hmm, information.
Many youf on here (and DB) come up with random confused thoughts that they mistake for information. Sorry to be the one to tell you this, but just like the dribble you have been posting in here it's not.
I for one could well get by without it and dare I say it, KB would be a better place for the lack of dribble.

Ah but this is not the Internet way is it?
This is the very "information" we would miss out on with structure.
What a shame, it would be to lose that.

[Bass]

This isn't like a schoolyard bully that prevents you from doing anything about it. Even if you let it bother you, there are plenty of options in dealing with it.

My question is, why would you let it bother you?

Because if we none of us care, it becomes acceptable and in my belief system at least, that's wrong.

Some one comes and steals your bike. Like as not, the cops don't care and you will never see it again.
All the logic about anonymity and consequences that you have espoused, applies here too.
Why would you let it bother you?

[jetboy]

People call me all sorts of names, both on the internet and too my face. If it's on the internet I really couldn't care less because hey, it's the internet. If it was too my face, well then that's a different story.

The thing is that people take it too far sometimes. Saying that someones wife is a minx or a MILF is understandable. Saying that she is a dirty, filthy ho-bag after a quick buck is probably over the line.



Because if we none of us care, it becomes acceptable and in my belief system at least, that's wrong.


True, however unfortunately the internet has given people a voice, and some people tend to excersize that voice by being a hero on the internet....forums are littered with bullshit comments like "I'll kick your ass if you were here", "my penis is bigger than yours", and "Hondas are gay".

But hey, I ride a Honda so what do I know - right? :beer:

[Mekk]

If you can't do anything about it, ignore.
But if you can, then organise to get 'facetime' with the cause.

Yup, exactly. Thing is, on here there's plenty you can do about it if you can't ignore it.


So KB doesn't have privacy and doesn't have the ability quickly and easily share information?

Hmm, information.
Many youf on here (and DB) come up with random confused thoughts that they mistake for information. Sorry to be the one to tell you this, but just like the dribble you have been posting in here it's not.
I for one could well get by without it and dare I say it, KB would be a better place for the lack of dribble.

Ah but this is not the Internet way is it?
This is the very "information" we would miss out on with structure.
What a shame, it would be to lose that.

I also mentioned being able to quickly share information.

Let's say for example the site owners decided to make it harder for jerkoffs to be able to post shit. They could make it so that you have to enter a captcha every time you post, they could make it so that you have to take an IQ test before you post. They can search for words that you're not allowed to use and stop you from posting. There's any number of restrictions they could apply that would make everyone's life more difficult and thus hinder the sharing of information.

Obviously the above examples are extreme to illustrate my point.

Something that isn't so extreme, is installing a filter that doesn't let you post anything that contains swear words.

THAT is what I am talking about.

A better solution, in my opinion, is to accept and expect there to be fucktards out there, use the moderators and ignore the rest.

[jetboy]

....installing a filter that doesn't let you post anything that contains swear words.

THAT is what I am talking about.

A better solution, in my opinion, is to accept and expect there to be fucktards out there, use the moderators and ignore the rest.

Your post would have been blocked. :whistle:

[MSTRS]

Yup, exactly. Thing is, on here there's plenty you can do about it if you can't ignore it.




We must have convinced you of the error in your earlier statements. The one where you seemed to be convinced that the power of anonymity on the internet meant no consequences for the slimy shit talkers...
The perception of anonymity remains for anyone not yet 'caught up with'.

[Mekk]

Your post would have been blocked. :whistle:

Hah, so would your avatar!


We must have convinced you of the error in your earlier statements. The one where you seemed to be convinced that the power of anonymity on the internet meant no consequences for the slimy shit talkers...
The perception of anonymity remains for anyone not yet 'caught up with'.

No meaningful consequences for the perp. Nothing to make them think shit, maybe I shouldn't do this. I believe it is still possible to remain completely anonymous, regardless of where you're residing.

Well it's not just a perception, they are anonymous if they choose to be. Because someone uses this site, doesn't mean that they must be 'caught up with'.

[MSTRS]

You have much to learn

[Sidewinder]

There has always been a degree of slagging off kb'ers family members, often in the guise of "friendly" banter.

Now, I have no problem with people here calling their friends or a person on here who they despise 'bastard', 'prick' or 'dumb shit', or whatever as matey joshing around or hostile words. What I do think is poor form is personally sledging someone's partner/spouse/siblings/parents etc. who have nothing to do with this site or nothing to do personally with the sledgee.

There seems to be a bit of it going around at the moment, noticeably when one long standing member here dredged up an old bone to have a dig at someone via a comment about their wife. You know who you are.

If you have a problem with a kber sort it out between you, but lay off family members who don't have a voice on here. I find it really offensive that people seem to think it clever or funny to attack someone by having a go at their parents or wife or kids - even more so if they are deceased. (No, this does not pertain to the above paragraph).

Slagging off "the parents", "the wife" etc. just to wind someone up stinks.

what i find even more funny is how everyone takes the internet so seresously its like omg get over it, its only the net its not the end off the fucking world. dont like it dont stay that easy.

my 5cents and more worth

[The Stranger]

I also mentioned being able to quickly share information.

-snip extraneoues PD-

Something that isn't so extreme, is installing a filter that doesn't let you post anything that contains swear words.

THAT is what I am talking about.



For fuck sake information can bloody well be quickly disseminated with courtesy and without swear words, what a load of shit dick head.

OR

Information can be quickly disseminated with courtesy and without swear words.




Yes I can really see how a swear filter would impede the progress of civilisation.

[Mekk]

my 5cents and more worth

I agree with this man.



Yes I can really see how a swear filter would impede the progress of civilisation.

You can't see anything I'm saying, and frankly you're not trying.

[Sidewinder]

I agree with this man.


what realy???
thats what ive been trying to tell people for years!

[The Stranger]

You can't see anything I'm saying, and frankly you're not trying.

Ah see post 104.
Don't blame your inability to communicate effectively on others.

[Headbanger]

This place would rock if everyone was nice and well mannered, Be about as awesome as a lukewarm cup of tea.




Bitches.



Swearing is cool, and the Road is a race track.

[Skyryder]

This place would rock if everyone was nice and well mannered, Be about as awesome as a lukewarm cup of tea.




Bitches.



Swearing is cool, and the Road is a race track.

Right on.

The most boring forums are the ones with all the rules. No politics no, religon, no slagging members, hey that one of ours............loosely applied thank god. Yep KB............thank god I'm on a decent site.:2thumbsup


Skyryder

[Headbanger]

Just don't ask for Green Day tickets, Or quote a youtube video, Then it gets real heavy,real fast.

[McJim]

Just don't ask for Green Day tickets, Or quote a youtube video, Then it gets real heavy,real fast.

Green Day? I had a green day. Caught the 'flu and sneezed a lot. Dayglo snot. was cool.:2thumbsup

[Mekk]

Just don't ask for Green Day tickets, Or quote a youtube video, Then it gets real heavy,real fast.

There's some things you just don't say on the internet man, you just don't say!