Are you experienced? [Archive]

Maki

10th October 2009, 09:28

A while ago someone call me an "experienced biker". I have to admit I was taken aback and this has got me thinking. What is an "experienced biker"? Do you have to have ridden more than a certain numer of kilometres? Ridden regularly for a number of years? Been on a certain number of KB group rides? Crashed a certain number of times?

So, are you experienced, and what do you think makes an "experienced biker"?

Am I experienced? Hell no, im just a noob who rides around on a stupidly powerful bike...

Drew

10th October 2009, 09:34

I've done a few K's, crashed a bunch, been on some rides organised on here.

Dunno if that makes me experienced, but I would call myself experienced all the same.

Don't know that it really matters though. Others perception of me, (which is kinda what you're asking), might just see me as some idiot that's ridden and crashed a lot.

There's no answer to it really, people who have others looking up to them, and asking advice hopefully have the brain to know that everyone rides differently, and there are no hard and fast rules.

Jantar

10th October 2009, 09:35

Aha... The proverbial question like how long is a piece of string?

An experienced biker? I wish there was a set standard or definition for such an animal, but unfortunately its all comparitive.

Compared to someone on their learner licence a rider on his/her restricted could be termed as experienced. Probably anyone who has ridden a greater distance, a greater variety of bikes, and tried a greater number of challenges than oneself is experienced, whilst anyone who has ridden a lesser distance, a lesser variety of bikes, and tried a smaller number of challenges than oneself is still learning.

Sidewinder

10th October 2009, 09:35

I've done a few K's, crashed a bunch, been on some rides organised on here.

Dunno if that makes me experienced, but I would call myself experienced all the same.

Don't know that it really matters though. Others perception of me, (which is kinda what you're asking), might just see me as some idiot that's ridden and crashed a lot.

There's no answer to it really, people who have others looking up to them, and asking advice hopefully have the brain to know that everyone rides differently, and there are no hard and fast rules.

well ya good at crashing drew

Owl

10th October 2009, 09:41

Experienced biker no, but I've had some experiences:eek5:

Maki

10th October 2009, 09:43

What about more than 5 years and more than 50.000km? Does that make you an experienced biker?

McJim

10th October 2009, 09:47

gijoe1313 - 3 years and prolly 250,000+km.

He's experienced AND a n00b all rolled up in one. Rides loadsa different bikes too.

It's a good thing to keep some humility even if you think you are experienced. I always assume I am an idiot.....prolly coz I am!

Owl

10th October 2009, 09:52

What about more than 5 years and more than 50.000km? Does that make you an experienced biker?

More than some, but less than others!

I started riding in 94 with a 6 year break from 2001 and have clocked up plenty more than 50,000km in that time. I still consider myself a turkey, but hopefully I'll stay alive.:baby:

Morepower

10th October 2009, 09:53

Been riding for more years than I have fingers and toes , so cant tell you exactly how many ( started at 13 ) . Experienced .. yes .. any good ??? who knows , probably have a lifetime of bad habits .. still walking so cant be too bad.

Bronson

10th October 2009, 09:59

I would say the more years you have been riding & more k's you've clocked would mean more experiences you have had & therefore the more experienced you are. ?????

Jantar

10th October 2009, 10:03

What about more than 5 years and more than 50.000km? Does that make you an experienced biker?
If that 5 years is mainly on a single type of bike (eg sports, cruiser, etc) and the 50,000 km is only on a certain type of road (eg highway) then it wouldn't make one an experienced rider.

If that 5 years was on a large variety of bike types, and that 50,000 km was spread over all types of road from motorway through to highway, back country, gravel, remote areas, inner city etc then it could make one a very experienced rider.

Drew

10th October 2009, 10:10

Compared to someone on their learner licence a rider on his/her restricted could be termed as experienced. Probably anyone who has ridden a greater distance, a greater variety of bikes, and tried a greater number of challenges than oneself is experienced, whilst anyone who has ridden a lesser distance, a lesser variety of bikes, and tried a smaller number of challenges than oneself is still learning.

Yep, and yet there are those who've ridden more than me, on more types of bike. Who I consider to not have a clue.

ukusa

10th October 2009, 10:33

So, are you experienced, and what do you think makes an "experienced biker"?

I have though about this long and hard and come up with a complex mathmatical formula to explain ....

years riding + kms + posts on KB + speeding tickets + no. of bikes owned + length of beard + length of longest scar - crashes - loss of licences - $ spent on repairs = experience
eg. 25 + 100,000 + 400 + 3 + 5 + 3 + 8 - 2 - 1 - 2000 = 98,436.

James Deuce

10th October 2009, 10:39

Murray

10th October 2009, 10:39

NighthawkNZ

10th October 2009, 10:58

Aha... The proverbial question like how long is a piece of string?

An experienced biker? I wish there was a set standard or definition for such an animal, but unfortunately its all comparitive.

Compared to someone on their learner licence a rider on his/her restricted could be termed as experienced. Probably anyone who has ridden a greater distance, a greater variety of bikes, and tried a greater number of challenges than oneself is experienced, whilst anyone who has ridden a lesser distance, a lesser variety of bikes, and tried a smaller number of challenges than oneself is still learning.

I'm still learning and always will...

carver

10th October 2009, 11:14

A while ago someone call me an "experienced biker". I have to admit I was taken aback and this has got me thinking. What is an "experienced biker"? Do you have to have ridden more than a certain numer of kilometres? Ridden regularly for a number of years? Been on a certain number of KB group rides? Crashed a certain number of times?

So, are you experienced, and what do you think makes an "experienced biker"?

Am I experienced? Hell no, im just a noob who rides around on a stupidly powerful bike...

yes i am.......

its a bit like gay sex, you dont know how much further you can take it untill you do.

smoothness and accident avoidance as well as being capable in various conditions would rank high for me

NighthawkNZ

10th October 2009, 11:16

If that 5 years is mainly on a single type of bike (eg sports, cruiser, etc) and the 50,000 km is only on a certain type of road (eg highway) then it wouldn't make one an experienced rider.

But he becomes experienced (ish) for a cruiser rider which have there own characteristics compared to a sports... but not for a sports bike... and vise versa

Aha... The proverbial question like how long is a piece of string?

An experienced biker? I wish there was a set standard or definition for such an animal, but unfortunately its all comparitive.

Im still learning after lord knows how many years of actual riding... (not just road). Like you said, it is a very difficult question to answer...

the word;
experienced made skillful or wise through experience.

experience;
1 a : direct observation of or participation in events as a basis of knowledge b : the fact or state of having been affected by or gained knowledge through direct observation or participation
2 a : practical knowledge, skill, or practice derived from direct observation of or participation in events or in a particular activity b : the length of such participation <has 10 years' experience in the job>
3 a : the conscious events that make up an individual life b : the events that make up the conscious past of a community or nation or humankind generally
4 : something personally encountered, undergone, or lived through
5 : the act or process of directly perceiving events or reality

Those that have many crashes are experienced at crashing I guess... those that been riding along time but have bad habbits are experienced riders with those bad habbits...

CookMySock

10th October 2009, 11:49

I'd hazard a guess, that an experienced biker is a person who had a good grasp on how the bike would behave on all road surface conditions, and how far he could push any particular manoever before he had a high chance of provoking some disaster. He might also be able to respond to urgent situations with calm and deliberate actions, rather than panic and lock up.

All the rest of "the science of roadcraft" is applicable to cars as well, so it's taken as read that it is there.

I'd say the only thing that would make an experienced rider is time in the seat, and an inclination to persue perfection.

Steve

Big Dave

10th October 2009, 12:13

Yes. I am.

carver

10th October 2009, 12:14

Yes. I am.

typical journo......

Big Dave

10th October 2009, 12:19

typical journo......

No no, let's talk about me.

carver

10th October 2009, 12:25

No no, let's talk about me.

oh, right, il nominate you for bike journo of the year...

Motu

10th October 2009, 12:38

Experienced is about all I am.Does all that experience make me a good rider? No,it makes me realise I am not a good rider.

98tls

10th October 2009, 12:40

Pride comes before a fall so i will just :shutup:

Ocean1

10th October 2009, 12:42

Does all that experience make me a good rider? No,it makes me realise I am not a good rider.

Didn't take me anywhere near that long to figure that out...

Big Dave

10th October 2009, 12:46

Pride comes before a fall so i will just :shutup:

This is wise, but not whence the good comedy cometh.

bogan

10th October 2009, 12:50

lots of bikes, 10-ish years, heaps of hours riding (dirtbikes dont have an odo), lots of 'moments', few crashes, still on restricted (and stuck to conditions). So bit of yes and no, I think my level of experience will soon warant an upgrade from my vt250.

Only one thing is for certain about a true bikers experience level, its always gonna increase :ride::scooter:

Headbanger

10th October 2009, 13:23

I'm awesome, especially on the straight bits of road.

Motu

10th October 2009, 13:33

Didn't take me anywhere near that long to figure that out...

There was never any ''figuring'' to be done - I have just never achieved a mistake free existence.

Pogo2

10th October 2009, 14:09

Surely has to be a mix of both experiences and attitude combined to provide longevity.

MarkH

10th October 2009, 20:43

So, are you experienced, and what do you think makes an "experienced biker"?

Am I experienced? Yes & No - It's all relative innit! I am very experienced compared with a cager with a desire to ride that has never actually been on a bike. But compared to someone that has been riding for many years and has clocked up many hundreds of thousands of kms then no, not at all.

It's like sex - to a virgin someone that has had sex a dozen times is an experienced lover, to Hugh Hefner someone that has had sex a few hundred times is an inexperienced novice.

98tls

10th October 2009, 20:55

Am I experienced? Yes & No - It's all relative innit! I am very experienced compared with a cager with a desire to ride that has never actually been on a bike. But compared to someone that has been riding for many years and has clocked up many hundreds of thousands of kms then no, not at all.

It's like sex - to a virgin someone that has had sex a dozen times is an experienced lover, to Hugh Hefner someone that has had sex a few hundred times is an inexperienced novice. For many years Hugh Hefners ridden nothing but GN250s powered by avgas or similar,hard:rolleyes:ly
an experiance worth noting.

ManDownUnder

10th October 2009, 21:02

Yes - I've seen over 300,000kms in the saddle, seen guys fall off, done it myself. Known people that have died, seen some amasing successes on the track, and some pitiful failures hit the road.

But... the thing that makes qualifies me to say it... I have nothing to prove. I leave my ego at the door.

Flip

10th October 2009, 22:13

I am not experienced I am a leather clad tinker bell.

Cr1MiNaL

10th October 2009, 23:39

I'm the shit around these parts.

James Deuce

11th October 2009, 05:57

crazyhorse

11th October 2009, 06:00

......

OMG!!! that is not a good picture................. hope all is ok with the rider, as the tree looks ok

Owl

11th October 2009, 06:03

Who put that god damn mother fucken tree in the middle of the god damn mother fucken grass?:rolleyes:

StoneY

11th October 2009, 06:05

$0.02
I would say i was experienced, yes

But that experience is what tells me I cannot take that corner as fast as (foe example only) ScuzemE or KGB who easily beat me up the taka's with no effort spent (or needed) ;)

Despite over 200 thou at the handlebars, im only JUST experienced enough to have discovered MY limits, and to realize both my rides have far more ability than the current owner has when riding them
:apint:

Ms Piggy

11th October 2009, 12:38

So, are you experienced, and what do you think makes an "experienced biker"?
As someone else has said: how long is a piece of string. I don't consider myself an experienced rider even though I've ridden a few thousand km's in the 6 years I've been riding and that's included a couple of trips to the South Island and daily commuting on and off (on at the moment).

For me I'll always be learning. I know I am definitely a much better rider now that I was the 1st time I slung my leg over but I also recognise my limitations...it really like the song that never ends.

I remember a friend of mine who I consider a very experienced rider saying to me 1 day that if you're not a little nervous when you're riding over somewhere like the Rimutaka's then you're taking riding for granted - basically he was saying that even with all his years of riding he never took for granted that being an experienced rider made him less vulnerable. That makes sense to me!

mansell

11th October 2009, 19:56

Been riding over thirty years, seen more of this country from a saddle than most and still don't consider myself an experienced rider. I have too many (some would say way too many) bad habits that too many years and too many miles have ingrained into my soul. Mind you I was in Otago yeaterday and theres an intersting training day coming up in Dunedin.

None of us can answer a question about how experienced we are.

Keep on riding :apint:

P38

11th October 2009, 20:37

I've been riding bikes since the late 70's

Am I experienced?

Dunno!

I'm still learning every day.

gatch

11th October 2009, 21:13

I'm experienced enough to know that falling off hurts.

But stupid enough to keep falling off.

It sucks being retarded.

Insanity_rules

11th October 2009, 21:37

I'm an experienced pisstaker does that count?

Rodney007

11th October 2009, 21:42

i thought it was based on how much you can rape a bike ?

Drew

11th October 2009, 22:01

i thought it was based on how much you can rape a bike ?

Gotta be part of it.

Perhaps how much you can rape it without fucking it at the same time?

Kwaka14

11th October 2009, 22:09

It seems to me theres usually quite a difference between levels of experience and ability to ride or to teach and level of safety. These all seem to be mixed up and labelled as experience by most posts.

IMO an "experienced" rider would be one who has been on many different bikes and situations for a reasonable distance - say at least 100000km maybe - someone like Lee Rusty - or pretty well any of the Rusty Nuts guys. A safe rider on the other hand would be someone who uses what experience they have to introduce a level of confidence in the situations they ride in without pushing their boundaries. On the other hand a good rider may not neccesarily be greatly experienced and may be quite adept at pushing the boundaries, but they know where and when to do that appropriately. Someone who was suitable to give instruction could be any 1 or more of these 3.

Experience really means nothing without the attitude and willingness to learn from it and apply it.

Just my thoughts.

Maki

12th October 2009, 03:04

Thanks all for contributing to the discussion, it is very interesting. One thing I would like to say is that being experienced does not neccesarly mean being skilful. You can ride many different bikes and more than 100.000km but if you are a klutz, you are a klutz and there is not much you can do about it.

On the other hand, if you are talented you may reach a level of skill that most others can only dream about with a relatively small amount of experience....

I guess the answer to the question, "are you experienced?" is highly subjective. Someone who never rode a bike might think a person who has ridden regularly for a year or more is experienced. People who have ridden for decades may have a totally different view. Me? I would say 5 years or more of reasonably regular riding, that's spending some time on the bike more days than not.

PeteJ

12th October 2009, 09:50

Yeah, repeating the same mistakes for a million km over 25 years might make you experienced, but not necessarily expert.

So the description "experienced" doesn't really mean a lot.

And even "expert" needs to be broken down - expert where? on what? in what context? etc.

george formby

12th October 2009, 10:52

Are you experienced? That was a Jimi hendrix album i think.... I've been riding for decades so I have had experience, then again I know riders with a similar time on two wheels who I would call lucky with their experience, they scare me. I am very interested in riding. I have done courses, read books, magazines & spent a fair bit of time talking too & listening to other riders. Consequently my knowledge & road craft is still increasing. I suppose that would make me knowledgeable. Would you call a car driver who has been driving obliviously with no thought on improving their ability for 50 years experienced? Their are plenty out there. Being experienced may be defined as learning & improving from your time on a bike?<_<

vifferman

12th October 2009, 11:48

No.

After 36 years, I'm still learning, just a bit more slowly than I used to.

_Shrek_

12th October 2009, 16:00

And even "expert" needs to be broken down -

X = unknown quantity
spert = drip under pressure

No. After 36 years, I'm still learning, just a bit more slowly than I used to.

:yes: me to

Maha

12th October 2009, 16:06

I cant answer the question, all I know is, that there will always be someone better and someone worse than me......always.

MarkH

12th October 2009, 17:01

I cant answer the question, all I know is, that there will always be someone better and someone worse than me......always.

Many may not want to admit it - but that statement can accurately be used to describe all but 2* people in the world.
But if you keep riding you can keep learning and become more experienced, naturally there will still be those who are more experience than you and those that are less experienced.

* For the slow thinkers - the 2 people that this doesn't apply to would be the worlds worst rider and the worlds best rider.

gatch

12th October 2009, 17:18

X = unknown quantity
spert = drip under pressure

Nice one, though I heard a slightly different version..

Ex = a has been
Spert = drip under pressure.

My boss thinks hes an expert.. I tend to agree with him..

carver

12th October 2009, 18:34

Thanks all for contributing to the discussion, it is very interesting. One thing I would like to say is that being experienced does not neccesarly mean being skilful. You can ride many different bikes and more than 100.000km but if you are a klutz, you are a klutz and there is not much you can do about it.

On the other hand, if you are talented you may reach a level of skill that most others can only dream about with a relatively small amount of experience....

I guess the answer to the question, "are you experienced?" is highly subjective. Someone who never rode a bike might think a person who has ridden regularly for a year or more is experienced. People who have ridden for decades may have a totally different view. Me? I would say 5 years or more of reasonably regular riding, that's spending some time on the bike more days than not.

mate, thats a pretty queer avatar

Mom

12th October 2009, 18:42

Just a quick response to the thread title here...

maybe :confused:

It does not spell out in what :innocent:

carver

12th October 2009, 18:50

Just a quick response to the thread title here...

maybe :confused:

It does not spell out in what :innocent:

nothing beats it

PeteJ

13th October 2009, 09:07

So, leaving aside the 200-year-old joke definition of "expert", who here would claim expertise in motorcycling, then?

Headbanger

13th October 2009, 09:31

So, leaving aside the 200-year-old joke definition of "expert", who here would claim expertise in motorcycling, then?

This guy?

http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showpost.php?p=1129450159&postcount=5

Seems to be an expert at telling people they are doing it all wrong.

avgas

13th October 2009, 09:47

yes - and its one of those things.
Your experienced when you understand that you are in control of the bike and your fate.

Sharry

13th October 2009, 17:19

Me thinks it's realive.
I did 34,000kms on my 250 in 17 months so I might be a little experienced with a 250.
But I have only done 3,500 in 4 weeks with my 600, so no I am not experienced with this bike.

It's probably got a lot to with what you do with the experience. As in are you collecting and fine tuning riding skills or are you riding around like a jack ass learning nothing from your hair raising momments.

crash harry

14th October 2009, 11:39

So, leaving aside the 200-year-old joke definition of "expert", who here would claim expertise in motorcycling, then?

Skidmark?

Not me anyway. Maybe an expert at falling off and going slow, but I'm no expert rider that's for sure. Lots of ks under my belt but I still fuck up constantly.

Big Dave

14th October 2009, 15:49

So, leaving aside the 200-year-old joke definition of "expert", who here would claim expertise in motorcycling, then?

Present. <tenchars> </tenchars>

carver

14th October 2009, 19:33

Present. <tenchars> </tenchars>

present too

PeteJ

15th October 2009, 08:28

OK, so how do we assess true expertise?

eg 2 million road kilometres without ever falling off or hitting/being hit by another vehicle?