ACC just another National agenda!

[GSXGirl]

Thanks to all those far right National Supporters, why complain? ACC is just one of many intended price hikes!! Hello!!! NATIONAL is the rich mans Government, everyone knows that so all the people who voted National (or didn't vote at all) this is the price we will all be paying and it's just one of many! Yes I know there wasn't a lot of choice when it came to voting but why on earth would someone who is not earning at least $130,000PA vote National? Do they not realise it make the lives of the poor, disenfranchised or hard-working middle to low income NZer even harder which in turn increases social problems and crime rates...DUH! At least Labour had half a conscience! Is it fair that someone like myself who owns a GSX1400 as a toy that gets rolled out of the garage maybe 8 times a year pay huge amounts of ACC $$ for the privilege of a riding a large bike on a sunny day! It is normally the incompetent car driver that causes the unsuspecting motorcyclist to come to grief anyway so they shouldn't complain about subbing the Bikers! Don't think for one minute that ACC will be the only casualty of this Government! National is for the rich remember? they think we all earn the big bucks and since the majority of the country voted them in I must conclude that is the case!! I have been riding bikes for over 25 years and I have dropped one (recently) but no insurance claims or ACC claims were involved and I have not had any ACC claims for riding my bike ever because I know I'm a target on the road and that is how I ride and that is how I stay safe! It is not fair but I suppose one could argue, what's an extra $1000 in a year when you earn $200,000pa???? Just remember to vote NATIONAL!!! Keep the working man down where he belongs!! There now that should spark a bit of healthy debate! :2thumbsup:Playnice:

[Str8 Jacket]

Why would you own a GSX1400 if you only rode it 8 times a year?!?!

[R6_kid]

Take your smear campaign somewhere else. :dodge:

I voted for National, and I can only say that we should have expected some hardship in cleaning up the mess that the Labour government created. Do you really think our situation would be drastically different had Labour stayed in power? I think not. It's hard to hide a $13b deficit, unless of course it's election time!!!

[EgliHonda]

Too busy moaning about the 'rich pricks' to get his leg over I reckon...

Please keep the pointless political drivel to the tardme opinion boards, tedious and not really the point is it...

[StoneY]

Take your smear campaign somewhere else. :dodge:

I voted for National, and I can only say that we should have expected some hardship in cleaning up the mess that the Labour government created. Do you really think our situation would be drastically different had Labour stayed in power? I think not. It's hard to hide a $13b deficit, unless of course it's election time!!!

LABOUR Created my ass.
National are heartless asswipes, they only got in because ill informed Kiwi's wanted a 'change'...bad call and we all knew it whether we liked it or not

EVERY promise they made in pre election campaigning has been broken, name ONE they have kept? Just one...go on!

I did not vote National
I actually quit from Public Service in disgust when JK became my boss

[Pedrostt500]

I was having thoughts about some of this this afternoon, it does all smell of Rodger Douglas and Ruth Richardson.

[FJRider]

Why would you own a GSX1400 if you only rode it 8 times a year?!?!

Maybe because it's a "free" country ... ??? :rolleyes:

At 8 time's a year ... thats only an extra $100 ... per ride. :(

[k2w3]

The mess we're in was/is caused by international events and Labour didn't help matters.

OP, you're assuming there are no bikers earning 200k+. I know that there are, and why would they not be equally as incensed as you over this ridiculous rise. Wealthy people hate paying over the odds too. Probably more so than your average bloke.

[Ender EnZed]

The mess we're in was/is caused by international events and Labour didn't help matters.

OP, you're assuming there are no bikers earning 200k+. I know that there are, and why would they not be equally as incensed as you over this ridiculous rise. Wealthy people hate paying over the odds too. Probably more so than your average bloke.

But as a percentage of their income its much, much less. So it doesn't hurt as much.

[SPman]

I was having thoughts about some of this this afternoon, it does all smell of Rodger Douglas and Ruth Richardson.
No, that comes later, after everyone is totally shell shocked.......

[Laxi]

just saw on the news, ACT and the maori party fighting national in parliment over acc now theres 2 parties I never thought I'd vote for, I never voted for Nat and never fucking will now, nor will i vote for goff

EDIT scratch that ACT can go suck my sweaty nut sack

[kwaka_crasher]

Load of shit

What a silly bitch. This is an ACC proposal and has yet to be approved by the Minister. But I'm sure you won't let facts get in the way of your drivel. Back to your minimum wage job at McDs.

[Winston001]

Thanks to all those far right National Supporters, why complain? ACC is just one of many intended price hikes!! Hello!!! NATIONAL is the rich mans Government blah blah.....

So.....lemme get this straight. Motorcyclists are 16 times more likely to require ACC assistance because National leads the coalition government.......??? So National are causing our accidents?!!



I learn something new and amazing every day. :D

[Dafe]

This post is Very Wrong.
This is not a result of a National Government. A rich mans Govt! WTF?

This is a result of 9 years of a Labour Government. Which drove ACC debt into the 13 Billion deficit that they've left for National to deal with.
National have to do something to defuse this massive issue and unfortunately were being targeted. Motorcyclists often require skin grafts and skin grafts cost 5-10 times the cost of most other treatments over the same duration.

You could say that National have been left to clean up the mess left by Labour yet again. National can't leave this debt to be ignored.

[Devil]

...*insert trash here*...

Wow. You sound like a real bottom feeder.

[GSXGirl]

haha actually the jokes on you 'healthy debate is what I said' I'm not making a smear campaign rather a 'think' campaign I don't actually support any of the parties and I actually do make $120,000 a year but I also know a lot of people DONT!!! Have a nice day!! Boys !! It certainly worked....think on :+)

[kwaka_crasher]

haha actually the jokes on you 'healthy debate is what I said' I'm not making a smear campaign rather a 'think' campaign I don't actually support any of the parties and I actually do make $120,000 a year but I also know a lot of people DONT!!! Have a nice day!! Boys !! It certainly worked....think on :+)

How about you think on this: everything you posted is blatant bullshit. Fuck off. :finger:

[StoneY]

haha actually the jokes on you 'healthy debate is what I said' I'm not making a smear campaign rather a 'think' campaign I don't actually support any of the parties and I actually do make $120,000 a year but I also know a lot of people DONT!!! Have a nice day!! Boys !! It certainly worked....think on :+)


How about you think on this: everything you posted is blatant bullshit. Fuck off. :finger:

FIGHT!!!!

:2thumbsup :jerry::jerry:

Payslips at 20 paces on the Domain????

[steelestring]

so is it true.... NZlders voted like blind slugs! SAid the Australian news? the headlines after the results ...WHos happy with their farken tax cuts now? Just as I was getting a huge lecture from the delivery man from one of our suppliers he said .... we'll see whos better off in 2 years time!....

[pete376403]

This post is Very Wrong.
This is not a result of a National Government. A rich mans Govt! WTF?

This is a result of 9 years of a Labour Government. Which drove ACC debt into the 13 Billion deficit that they've left for National to deal with.
National have to do something to defuse this massive issue and unfortunately were being targeted. Motorcyclists often require skin grafts and skin grafts cost 5-10 times the cost of most other treatments over the same duration.

You could say that National have been left to clean up the mess left by Labour yet again. National can't leave this debt to be ignored.
Nope - What labour did was start to move ACC to fully funded, as a precaution. It was alway intended for this to take place over many years (out to 2014 - quote Rod Oram "when Labour took office in 1999, it decided to be prudent. It set the goal of achieving full funding for all liabilities by 2014, and beefed up ACC's finances to set it on that path. From 1999 to 2008, ACC had improved from 64% under-funded to 45%."
There has been a lot of smoke and mirrors talk from ACC and National that the system is in crisis and running out of money. It is largely bullshit accounting that has arrived at the $20 odd billion number, where they have taken a whole lot of hypothetical assumptions and used them to calculate a number that is now promoted as gospel and which is being used to justify huge increases all over, not just for bikes.
I believe this is part of a strategy to get people to say "ACC is too expensive, we can't afford it, sell it off to private insurers", which National have tried to do in the past, and wil ltry to do again.
Nick Smith and John Judge are not being honest with New Zealand.

[rainman]

Nope - What labour did was start to move ACC to fully funded, as a precaution. It was alway intended for this to take place over many years (out to 2014 - quote Rod Oram "when Labour took office in 1999, it decided to be prudent. It set the goal of achieving full funding for all liabilities by 2014, and beefed up ACC's finances to set it on that path. From 1999 to 2008, ACC had improved from 64% under-funded to 45%."
There has been a lot of smoke and mirrors talk from ACC and National that the system is in crisis and running out of money. It is largely bullshit accounting that has arrived at the $20 odd billion number, where they have taken a whole lot of hypothetical assumptions and used them to calculate a number that is now promoted as gospel and which is being used to justify huge increases all over, not just for bikes.
I believe this is part of a strategy to get people to say "ACC is too expensive, we can't afford it, sell it off to private insurers", which National have tried to do in the past, and wil ltry to do again.
Nick Smith and John Judge are not being honest with New Zealand.

Bling to you, sir. The Nats (and their mindless followers) are using the old maxim, "never let the facts get in the way of a good story".

Given the current recessionary climate, there is no reason why National can't defer the deadline for full funding to some time further out. Other than wanting to break ACC and screw us taxpayers over yet again, while giving $200mil+ to their mates in the insurance industry, that is.

[GSXGirl]

:Playnice::Oi::2thumbsup

[GSXGirl]

Now now its just a blog!!! Calm down LOL:Oi::Playnice::dodge::apint:

[Pixie]

Liarbour caused the ACC fuck up.

I support private accident insurance- get some competion in the sector

[ManDownUnder]

There now that should spark a bit of healthy debate! :2thumbsup:Playnice:

...and that's why KB is full of such useful commentary. very few in here actually play the ball - not the man (or person, woman, female in this case).

I like the thread... think it's brilliant.

If I could replace the high ACC levy with private insurance making me personally responsible for things that I do wrong... then go for it. Like last year - I had an accident. Entirely my fault, my bad, my insurance preiums went up... all as it should be.

It might actually discourage bad drivers from spending time on the road if they can't afford insurance.

I predict that for the next 10 years my $750/year in ACC levies will go into someone else's pocket. I want control over that $7,500 thanks, and if I have the opportunity to reduce it while doing the things I enjoy then I expect to be able to do so. Freedom, and less social control over me as an individual.

That's why I voted for JK. Will do so again too, he's doing a brilliant job

[Mully]

I love the way people are still making this a Labour/National thing.

It's entirely irrevelant who's in the Beehive at the moment. If Labour had been re-elected last year, this same debate would be happening right now, because ACC would still be in the same state.

Remember; Labour are crying that the increase in levies this time is unfair, but they put the levies up using the same logic last time.

They would be doing exactly the same thing if they were still in power.

On this issue, we need a single voice. If we make that voice loud enough, it will still be echoing when Labour are back in the Beehive and should remind them.

By all means, play the National/Labour game elsewhere (it's interesting to read, if nothing else), but don't take your eyes off the ball with this issue.

Dividing and conquering is how this sort of shit gets through.

[Coldrider]

I am pretty sure I heard that there is an expectation that ACC will not only be self funding, but is expected to give a return.

[StoneY]

Liarbour caused the ACC fuck up.

I support private accident insurance- get some competion in the sector

When you learn to spell and proof read I might bother considering your opinion

Your too illiterate to undesrtand politics at this point so shut the fuck up
:niceone:

[kwaka_crasher]

Your too illiterate to undesrtand politics at this point so shut the fuck up

Pot/kettle much?

[pzkpfw]

Now now its just a blog!!! Calm down LOL:Oi::Playnice::dodge::apint:


1. What blog?

2. What specific thing(s) do you think would be different if Labour were still in power?

e.g.

Would they have pulled magic money from under a bush to pay for ACC?

Would they have added a different tax somewhere else?

Would they have forced ACC to implement a flat increase to apply to all vehicle types and sizes?

Would they have made ACC make fees zero for people under 18 who eat lentils?

...just what would be different?

[SPman]

2. What specific thing(s) do you think would be different if Labour were still in power?

...just what would be different?
Probably nothing - just whinging from National about how corrupt nanny labour was.
http://www.thestandard.org.nz/acc-a-good-investor/
http://www.thestandard.org.nz/spin-busting-acc-rises/
http://www.thestandard.org.nz/first-manufacture-a-crisis/

[Skyryder]

Thanks to all those far right National Supporters, why complain? ACC is just one of many intended price hikes!! Hello!!! NATIONAL is the rich mans Government, everyone knows that so all the people who voted National (or didn't vote at all) this is the price we will all be paying and it's just one of many! Yes I know there wasn't a lot of choice when it came to voting but why on earth would someone who is not earning at least $130,000PA vote National? Do they not realise it make the lives of the poor, disenfranchised or hard-working middle to low income NZer even harder which in turn increases social problems and crime rates...DUH! At least Labour had half a conscience! Is it fair that someone like myself who owns a GSX1400 as a toy that gets rolled out of the garage maybe 8 times a year pay huge amounts of ACC $$ for the privilege of a riding a large bike on a sunny day! It is normally the incompetent car driver that causes the unsuspecting motorcyclist to come to grief anyway so they shouldn't complain about subbing the Bikers! Don't think for one minute that ACC will be the only casualty of this Government! National is for the rich remember? they think we all earn the big bucks and since the majority of the country voted them in I must conclude that is the case!! I have been riding bikes for over 25 years and I have dropped one (recently) but no insurance claims or ACC claims were involved and I have not had any ACC claims for riding my bike ever because I know I'm a target on the road and that is how I ride and that is how I stay safe! It is not fair but I suppose one could argue, what's an extra $1000 in a year when you earn $200,000pa???? Just remember to vote NATIONAL!!! Keep the working man down where he belongs!! There now that should spark a bit of healthy debate! :2thumbsup:Playnice:

Not with me sweetheart. I think I've found my KB soul mate. :clap: Yep I know :dodge: Still.......................

I like the bit about National being a rich man's govt, the bit about why would anyone vote National who is not earning $130,000 PA, and the bit about Labour having half a conscience, yep in fact I like all your post, especially the bit about your own responsibility.


Skyryder

[Naki Rat]

2. What specific thing(s) do you think would be different if Labour were still in power?


They would still be trying to work out how they miscalculated the carbon credit thing :doh:

At least JK and his crew are smart enough to recognise a problem before it becomes a disaster.

[Coldrider]

When you learn to spell and proof read I might bother considering your opinion

Your too illiterate to undesrtand politics at this point so shut the fuck up
:niceone:You're too illiterate to understand politics.....
Your letter to Paul and Pippa does not follow conventions either.

[GSXGirl]

They would still be trying to work out how they miscalculated the carbon credit thing :doh:

At least JK and his crew are smart enough to recognise a problem before it becomes a disaster.

:clap: Very Good

[sinfull]

Did you see Key on the news saying, awww crikey that Rodney hyde has some good ideas, yes we will think about opening ACC up to privatisation (competition) !
And you still think we can stop this by talking !!
How far is he up the Maori parties arse, awww wait, could it be that he gave in on the .... What was that he gave them not just a day or so ago ? Crikey He gave Maori TV the world cup !!!
Obvious he has Acts vote, where is he with the Maori party ?
Last nights parliment sitting was just a handshake come piss up !!
The legislation allowing them to change the ACC levies will pass !
I'm packing my slingshot !!!

I say once more Bulls, See ya's on the bridge on labour monday Arvo at 4pm !
Have ya banner saying " No to ACC Levy hikes, No to privatisation, or, Hello Americanisation !!!
T shirts and banners welcome !
I will see all you other Davids there, i'll bring My slingshot !!!
__________________

[SARGE]

i voted for John McCain


http://scrapetv.com/News/News%20Pages/Politics/Images/john-mccain-snarling.jpg

[Bend-it]

Sorry for my ignorance... but why is privatisation (or opening ACC up to competition) a bad thing? I'm not trying to be facetious... I honestly want to know...

Most of our insurances are provided for by private companies, so what's different about accident insurance?

[NighthawkNZ]

Sorry for my ignorance... but why is privatisation (or opening ACC up to competition) a bad thing? I'm not trying to be facetious... I honestly want to know...

Most of our insurances are provided for by private companies, so what's different about accident insurance?

debatable reasons are costs of accident insurance it may cost you more than ACC... it may not, I don't know...

One advantage though is I will be able to drip feed it every pay instead of one lump sum in my rego... (if I could do that with my rego probably wouldn't be so bad) but still its that same old argument of no fault, and this price hike is saying we are at fault...

[Coldrider]

Sorry for my ignorance... but why is privatisation (or opening ACC up to competition) a bad thing? I'm not trying to be facetious... I honestly want to know...

Most of our insurances are provided for by private companies, so what's different about accident insurance?Ummm errr, maybe health providers can charge market rates like in the US.

[sinfull]

Sorry for my ignorance... but why is privatisation (or opening ACC up to competition) a bad thing? I'm not trying to be facetious... I honestly want to know...

Most of our insurances are provided for by private companies, so what's different about accident insurance?
One extra cost i could think of off the top of my head is (yes just as ignorant to be honest) i would have to have a liability insurance to ride my bike on the track !! Just one that regular insurance wouldnt cover !

[Bend-it]

debatable reasons are costs of accident insurance it may cost you more than ACC... it may not, I don't know...



Ummm errr, maybe health providers can charge market rates like in the US.


One extra cost i could think of off the top of my head is (yes just as ignorant to be honest) i would have to have a liability insurance to ride my bike on the track !! Just one that regular insurance wouldnt cover !

Hmmm... none of these are insurmountable, really... Competition means we get to choose our providers, from competing companies, which has to be a good thing right? As long as there's some government regulation to ensure that people are still covered to current levels on a no faults basis etc? Like how kiwisaver is a governement scheme, but uses commercial companies to asctually manage the money.

This way, we might get some specialist biker ACC providers that do a good deal for bikers etc, like current specialist bike insurers...

And if one company say... decides to increase premiums by 300%, we could say, "Stuff you", and switch providers... Much better, no?

[sinfull]

No !! You (while driving sedately in your familly wagon) pushed me off the road !

How many steps do you want to take in that direction ?

At the moment employers have to pay for liability insurance (property) how much is that chaps wife going to sue you for if her hubby falls off the beck your building ? AND how much extra will you have to cover yourself for !
Then Income insurance for you ya Mrs, kids Who you will have to cover from birth !
Out of breath !!!!!!

[Bend-it]

No !! You (while driving sedately in your familly wagon) pushed me off the road !

SMIDSY! :dodge: OK, seriously... huhh?? When did I push you off the road??



How many steps do you want to take in that direction ?

At the moment employers have to pay for liability insurance (property) how much is that chaps wife going to sue you for if her hubby falls off the beck your building ? AND how much extra will you have to cover yourself for !
Then Income insurance for you ya Mrs, kids Who you will have to cover from birth !
Out of breath !!!!!!

?? are you talking (typing) to me?

[sinfull]

SMIDSY! :dodge: OK, seriously... huhh?? When did I push you off the road??



?? are you talking (typing) to me? The word escapes me !!!

Ok try another way, what do you do for a living (if ya don't mind lettin on that is)

[Bend-it]

IT proj mgr

[sinfull]

Ok if i was under you as manager and had a breakdown, i'd sue you cause i could !!!
You would have to be covered for that ! and the step you took out the door, ya Mrs took out the door, ya kids .........
Oh wait your dog bit someone, crickey did your policy cover that too ?

[Coldrider]

Hmmm... none of these are insurmountable, really...

And if one company say... decides to increase premiums by 300%, we could say, "Stuff you", and switch providers... Much better, no?You mean like oil companies, electricity & phone companies ?
I think the NZ ACC system is a major fly in the ointment for insurance companies, whose internal tranacations are greater than the whole of NZ economy.

[Bend-it]

Aha, I get what you're saying... but why couldn't private ACC still function on a "no faults" basis... So your private ACC provider would pay for your nervous breakdown that I supposedly caused, not mine...

And did I really push you off the road?? Or was that part of your cryptic analogy?? On one hand, I'm thinking... how would you know it was me, on the other, I do own and sometimes drive, when I have to, a family wagon...

[sinfull]

You mean like oil companies, electricity & phone companies ?
I think the NZ ACC system is a major fly in the ointment for insurance companies, whose internal tranacations are greater than the whole of NZ economy.
Which politition used to work for a major insurance company ?? Which would love to get a foothold in the NZ insurance game !!


Aha, I get what you're saying... but why couldn't private ACC still function on a "no faults" basis... So your private ACC provider would pay for your nervous breakdown that I supposedly caused, not mine...

And did I really push you off the road?? Or was that part of your cryptic analogy?? On one hand, I'm thinking... how would you know it was me, on the other, I do own and sometimes drive, when I have to, a family wagon...

Sorry , the more bourbon i drink the more criptic i get !! No ! No-one has ever pushed me off the road !!

But do i detect guilt in your voice ?

It's one step toward privatisation (americanisation) look how easy Key (national) has his/its coalition (Ahem no fixing goes on in government aye) backing them in what they want, who are we to say how it will work !!!
ACC has worked for how long ? Mate you can walk into a physio and have a sore neck rubbed (half the problem) on ACC
(watch this space) ACC is history !!


Maybe !

[Bend-it]

You mean like oil companies, electricity & phone companies ?
I think the NZ ACC system is a major fly in the ointment for insurance companies, whose internal tranacations are greater than the whole of NZ economy.

Yup, like Telecom + Vodafone + TelstraClear + 2 Degrees = Better plans and call rates for consumers.

What are you saying with the fly in the ointment comment?

[Coldrider]

Which politition used to work for a major insurance company ?? Which would love to get a foothold in the NZ insurance game !!It will be game on!, from all sides.

[Coldrider]

Yup, like Telecom + Vodafone + TelstraClear + 2 Degrees = Better plans and call rates for consumers.

What are you saying with the fly in the ointment comment?Read sinfulls post #36, Rodney is on a mission, with a party that had a synagy policy.

[Bend-it]

Read sinfulls post #36, Rodney is on a mission, with a party that had a synagy policy.

Yeah, how could I miss that post... only on about 4 threads! So Rodney Hide is keen on privatisation, that's no secret...

but "Why is it necessarily bad?" is my question... Surely, having competition is better than the current monopoly that ACC has?

[sinfull]

Read sinfulls post #36, Rodney is on a mission, with a party that had a synagy policy. Pretty bloody obvious ! You punt the idea Rodney (how's your drink Rod) just after dick riles the bikers (how's yours Dick?)
Right down to the Bikeio would be planned !!!


But they hadn't counted on a slingshot !!!!!

[Bend-it]

Pretty bloody obvious ! You punt the idea Rodney (how's your drink Rod) just after dick riles the bikers (how's yours Dick?)
Right down to the Bikeio would be planned !!!


But they hadn't counted on a slingshot !!!!!

You and your bloody slingshot... You should make an emoticon of it...

[sinfull]

Yeah, how could I miss that post... only on about 4 threads! So Rodney Hide is keen on privatisation, that's no secret...

but "Why is it necessarily bad?" is my question... Surely, having competition is better than the current monopoly that ACC has? Fuck sake man !!!
How much profit do you think ACC Makes on covering you, your kid, your mrs and the fuck ups you make in your family wagon !!!!

I fear my neck rubs are history because of ignorance like this !!!

[Coldrider]

Yeah, how could I miss that post... only on about 4 threads! So Rodney Hide is keen on privatisation, that's no secret...

but "Why is it necessarily bad?" is my question... Surely, having competition is better than the current monopoly that ACC has?
Well we will find out. But competition is not going to run a few billion dollars for a pitiful return to the shareholders.
It will be run like US Insurance companies & banks, and their mates.

[sinfull]

You and your bloody slingshot... You should make an emoticon of it...


http://entropy.homelinux.org/blog/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/david-and-goliath.gif

[Bend-it]

Ahhhh, so the problem with privatisation is that it will stop being publically funded?

[sinfull]

Ahhhh, so the problem with privatisation is that it will stop being publically funded?
Now your on to it, it will be funded by you !!!

[Bend-it]

where do you think public funds come from??

Nice avatar, by the way... I should at least have some credit for giving you the idea... :)

[sinfull]

where do you think public funds come from??

Nice avatar, by the way... I should at least have some credit for giving you the idea... :)
I give up Bend-a !

You can have the avatar if ya want it !
Who was it you IT for ?

[Bend-it]

I give up Bend-a !

You can have the avatar if ya want it !
Who was it you IT for ?

No... you're the one with the slingshot... TelstraClear. You in IT as well?

[sinfull]

No... you're the one with the slingshot... TelstraClear. You in IT as well?
Up to the neck bro, up to the neck !!!

[Bend-it]

aren't we all... that's why we're online at 1.15am on a Sat morning...

[Spyke]

wooooooow I'm lovin it. Our countries srewed and theres nothing i can do except craw up a hole and die how sads that?

oh well, ftul fuck the useless laws.

[Sanx]

When you learn to spell and proof read I might bother considering your opinion

Your too illiterate to undesrtand politics at this point so shut the fuck up
:niceone:

That's just gold.

[Motig]

This article from the Press -

Crash figures are being wrongly used to back large ACC levy increases for motorcyclists, a leading researcher says.

Lincoln University Associate Professor Charles Lamb, who heads the Australasian Institute of Motorcycle Studies project, said ACC and minister Nick Smith were basing the proposed increases on poor facts.

ACC wants to increase annual motorcycle levies by hundreds of dollars, with owners of machines over 601cc facing a massive rise from $252 to $745.

ACC said riders were 16 per cent more likely than other road users to be involved in a crash.

It paid $62 million in motorcyclists' claims last year, while receiving only $12m in levies from users.

Submissions on the levy proposal close on November 10.

Lamb said analysis of Ministry of Transport crash data showed 67 per cent of motorcycle accidents involved other drivers, and 60 per cent of those crashes were caused by the other driver.

He said ACC also wrongly loaded higher levy increases on to motorcycles with engines over 600cc.

Lamb said 43 per cent of the 420 accidents – studied last year – between motorcycles and other vehicles in Auckland and Canterbury did not have the bike's engine size on the police accident report. The most common engine size in the remaining 57 per cent of crash reports was 250cc, which lent no weight to charging higher levies on bigger machines, he said.

Smith said even if cars caused all accidents between vehicles and motorcycles, the cost of other motorcycle accidents exceeded the proposed levy.

Lamb said last year there were 1475 motorcycle accidents in New Zealand and 50 deaths.

By comparison, 36 cyclists died in 1170 bicycle accidents but the cycling community paid no levies.

Lamb said ACC figures also included injury crashes involving unregistered, offroad motorcycles and farm bikes.

[terbang]

Yup, chuck out ACC and privatize it and I guess our insurance premiums will go up some. Does anyone realisticly reckon that taxes and registration fees will be lowered as a result?

[RiderInBlack]

Yup, chuck out ACC and privatize it This is just what Nat & ACT want ya ta do:stupid:And then we can sue each other as the Lawyers go laughing all the way ta the bank. No thanks, I don't want ta be an "Americian/NZ Idiot".


Does anyone realisticly reckon that taxes and registration fees will be lowered as a result?Of cause they do:stupid:

[kwaka_crasher]

Yup, chuck out ACC and privatize it and I guess our insurance premiums will go up some. Does anyone realisticly reckon that taxes and registration fees will be lowered as a result?

Premiums were lower for the 1 year we were allowed to choose a private insurer in '98/'99. I remember that distinctly.


This is just what Nat & ACT want ya ta do:stupid:

No. They want to open it to competition, and had in the past done so with good results. Big difference. Huge.

[RiderInBlack]

No. They want to open it to competition, and had in the past done so with good results. Big difference. Huge.Actually I would disagree as to the results being "good:oi-grr:". That's was not my experience at the time as a Self-Employed Farrier when they privatized Self-employed ACC premiums. No way do I ever want them ta go there again.

[kwaka_crasher]

Actually I would disagree as to the results being "good:oi-grr:". That's was not my experience at the time as a Self-Employed Farrier when they privatized Self-employed ACC premiums. No way do I ever want them ta go there again.

I too was self-employed at the time and still am to this day - my experience was the polar opposite. You could have chosen to stay with ACC - the premiums didn't change. Are you saying you changed provider for higher premiums?

[RiderInBlack]

Are you saying you changed provider for higher premiums?No but premiums are only a small part of the bigger picture.

[StoneY]

That's just gold.

Thank Sanx

Peace
:2thumbsup

[puddy]

Why would you own a GSX1400 if you only rode it 8 times a year?!?!
Exactly! Either start riding it or sell it, stay home, and sit in front of the radio so you can listen to/call talkback and keep complaining about how crap things are, and how much better we would have been if Helen had won (tui ad)!

[Mully]

Exactly! Either start riding it or sell it, stay home, and sit in front of the radio so you can listen to/call talkback and keep complaining about how crap things are, and how much better we would have been if Helen had won (tui ad)!

Or she could just get back in the kitchen - her man obviously needs to shorten her leash if she can get to the computer and get out on a bike 8 times a year.....

That outta do it for now

[RiderInBlack]

keep complaining about how crap things are, and how much better we would have been if Helen had won (tui ad)!Mean while ya can sit on the couch happily deluded in ta believing that the Nats are your Saviours and would never do this Country any harm (A whole truck load of Tui's on that idea:apint:).

[NighthawkNZ]

What are the bulk of the people going to listen to and care about...

Rape victims recieving help form ACC...

or

Motorcyclists have to pay more ACC...



Most people out probably think that the motorcyclist is the raper and don't care about them...

[RiderInBlack]

Now that I believe:
http://www.thestandard.org.nz/first-manufacture-a-crisis/
Thanks Ms Piggy for the link (Posted here http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showpost.php?p=1129465346&postcount=27 ).
So anyone still believe National is not upto Spin Doctoring games:oi-grr:

[GSXGirl]

What a silly bitch. This is an ACC proposal and has yet to be approved by the Minister. But I'm sure you won't let facts get in the way of your drivel. Back to your minimum wage job at McDs.
If only you could ACT like an adult!!!!

[kwaka_crasher]

If only you could ACT like an adult!!!!

As if a bint like you is qualified to judge anyone. :rofl:


Now that I believe:http://www.thestandard.org.nz/first-manufacture-a-crisis/[/COLOR][/FONT]
Thanks Ms Piggy for the link (Posted here http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showpost.php?p=1129465346&postcount=27 ).So anyone still believe National is not upto Spin Doctoring games:oi-grr:]

The No-Standards? Don't make me laugh! :rolleyes:

[Brian d marge]

How about you think on this: everything you posted is blatant bullshit. Fuck off. :finger:

Well the stuff I post sure as hell ain't , backed up with facts

Ive sure posted enough of em on here


I suspect ( and cant prove ) is that NZ has been put under pressure to pay or reduce its Debt

Largely driven by property , Here we have people with disposable income investing in an asset , for what ever reason ,,,,

Now about a year ago the great supply of investment money closed and lenders started calling in debt

The Aussie banks had a reserve to call on and did a good job , one of the reasons we didn't feel the heat to much

but , this Crisis fits nicely with the national agenda , they have always said they would open up ACC and others to err competition ,,,

Electricity any one??? ( no it wasn't )

DO NOt GO DOWN THE AMERICAN PATH ....my friend has been ruined by a bike accident , lost his house everything...... another paid US $ 1500 for a waiting room visit and a compulosry ambulance ride ....

Trust me

Stop thinking of yourselves and put the community to the fore , as its the community that will help you the most when you need it

Stephen

[RiderInBlack]

DO NOt GO DOWN THE AMERICAN PATH ....my friend has been ruined by a bike accident , lost his house everything...... another paid US $ 1500 for a waiting room visit and a compulosry ambulance ride ....

Trust me

Stop thinking of yourselves and put the community to the fore , as its the community that will help you the most when you need it

StephenWhat he said. Have been to the States & Canada. Had a off on a Canadian Motorway. Lucky for me I was OK and could turn down the Ambo wanting ta make money out of me (They are like Towies fighting over a wreck there). The car that stopped too quickly causing the accident, I had to worry about if he was going ta try and do me for whip-lash.


The No-Standards? Don't make me laugh! :rolleyes:Open ya eyes. The writer of that article had done his homework and knew want he was talking about.

[bikemike]

This is where it's at:



Trust me

Stop thinking of yourselves and put the community to the fore , as its the community that will help you the most when you need it

Stephen

"I am pretty sure I heard that there is an expectation that ACC will not only be self funding, but is expected to give a return. "

And so on.

I always viewed ACC as a state service, and with any state service, we all fund it. Directly or indirectly, flat rate or by sector. We pay.
But the bottom line is that each person does not necessarily pay their own way. In fact (just like insurance companies - some seem to miss this point - the rates are set so that the majority pay for the few, and there's some in the pot left over). But the left over sum is the key one.

If it was never meant to be fully direct funded, then I assume that the benefit to society as a whole was in plain view? I mean, the idea is that ACC support gets us back to productive capacity so that we keep making stuff, selling stuff and paying taxes. We stay involved, we retain purpose, role in society and all that stuff. We retain our sanity and our health, directly or indirectly by having access to ACC until we are on our feet again.

If that's what was intended, then rating per group and looking for fully funded scenarios misses the point.

In this way it does become political, because in the main, Nats and supporters (as seen here) do not generally want to pay en masse for societal benefit in this way. In the main they want user pays and 'personal responsibility'.

In the main, Labour/Green and their supporters have less of an issue or fully support the idea that everyone chipping in for the benefit of all is a 'good thing'.

The notion of whether we can afford it or not comes down to whether we are doing full accounting on all the benefits to society, as well as all the costs.

I don't see this discussed anywhere.

If it becomes fully funded, NZ will lose. You may gain, but then others will not. As with biking, it's not always your fault, and you can't always afford to pay.

[NighthawkNZ]

if ACC is privatised etc blah rant...

they would have to drop the ACC levy in fuel would they not???? else if I am not on ACC but privat then I still pay acc via fuel...