Who is in the AA ?

[Voltaire]

Just a thought, I'm in the AA and I have asked them to clarify their position on the proposed ACC increases.
Have they actually made any statement?
I know a lot of bikers think the AA is if not anti bikes but pro car it might be worth it if there are enough biker members to get them on side, after all the car levies are going up too.

I'm thinking we need legal types on board here.

[EgliHonda]

Yep, been a member over 20 yrs. They have been consistently anti-bike, or maybe that's a bit harsh and they just ignore the fact that many people choose to ride...

I took part in a survey recently run by AA, and was amazed the questions on how many vehicles at home, cost of vehicles etc excluded motorcycles. I filled out their stupid survey, and in the comments section let them know in no uncertain terms that the results wuld be skewed as I preferred to spend money on bikes, so the car section contained only my work/dog/surfing hack, and ignored the $20,000+ bike, plus the wife's vespa, vintage jobs etc...

Good thought though, as occasionally the AA has thought-provoking articles on the real cause of 'accidents' etc, just can't see them rallying to the cause. I often wonder what I pay my membership fee for to be honest, haven't used them since I was a stringy student with a Morrie...

[Mom]

They have been consistently anti-bike, or maybe that's a bit harsh and they just ignore the fact that many people choose to ride......


They are anti bike, make no mistake about, would not be a member if they paid me.

Seeing as you have sausages for fingers I thought you might like this thread :D


http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?p=1129460040#post1129460040

[Swoop]

Been a member for 30yrs.

Recently renewed my house, contents and car insurances with them, BUT am now in the process of getting quotes for changing ALL of them to another insurer because of their anti-bike activities.

They have changed from being a representative of the motorist, into a political home for crackpots and window lickers.

[PrincessBandit]

We are members of the AA (been one myself since 1980) and have insurances with them. Tbh, have just filled in our membership renewal form and I will be attaching a letter to them outlining our feelings and that we are seriously considering taking our insurance away.

I know the insurance side of it is separate, but a well worded letter might not go astray. Even if it makes no difference (and we will definitely be checking out insurance choices) if every AA member on here includes them in their "submissions" address list it could be worth it.

[ckai]

Just a thought, I'm in the AA and I have asked them to clarify their position on the proposed ACC increases.
Have they actually made any statement?


I could be totally wrong but I thought I read the AA recommended ACC levies for bikes to go up - to this same margin. I thought that do some analysis or some shit and said it should be done bla bla love car bla bla bikes devils bla.

Like I said, could be wrong.

I'm a man so I don't need the AA. It's in my genes to be able to:

- Break into cars with my curling iron when the keys are locked in
- Crash start the car (by myself) in my heels if the battery is dead
- Piss in the tank if I run out of fuel since I'm still pissed from the night before
- Read a map

It is the 2000's, us males have to adapt a little ;)

[Pampera]

From TV3:
'“What you’ve got here is a recognition that motorcycling, in terms of ACC, is a very high risk, and the injuries are severe because you are exposed on a motorcycle,” says Mike Noon from the Automobile Association.'
[when I put this on another thread another poster who had SEEN the piece commented that Mike Noon was smirking]

Here is the Automobile Association official position on the matter:

http://www.aa.co.nz/about/issues/road-safety/Pages/Motorcyclists-and-motorists.aspx

They are and have been pushing for the levy increase.

This should not be news to any motorcyclist but emphasises why you should not be a member of the AA. This is what your subscription is used for - supporting this levy increase and general lobbying against motorcyclists in the corridors of power. I quit some years ago.

In my view:
Any of you who are members should voice your concerns as to, after taking your subscription money, how well they are looking after your interests as a member, make as many call outs as you can, get as many free maps as possible and then quit when your subscription next comes due (or sooner if you can get a refund). In my view you certainly should consider not insuring (anything) with AA insurance or supporting any of their financial products and the AA and their subsidiary companies should know why you are removing your support.

Over to you.
Regards,
Michael

[oldrider]

I am anti AA and support any action against the pricks! :headbang:

[sunhuntin]

only thing i use the aa for is license tests. otherwise i dont get near them.

[Mully]

Perhaps it's worth hinting that your membership will not be renewed depending on their position on the levy increase.

State have Roadside Rescue as part of their insurance.

[pzkpfw]

State have Roadside Rescue as part of their insurance.

...and State Roadside assist has always been good to me. No need for AA.

(Though I admit I live in a "main" centre, which might make a difference.)

[jim.cox]

I haven't been a member of the AA for years

Got fed up with them spouting off and claiming to represent my views

Plus the amount of junk mail they, and the people they sold their address lists to, sent.

They have became a marketing organisaton, nothing more...

[howdamnhard]

I've been with AA for 10 years, when I got a bike and wanted them to insure it they were not interested. Bunch of closed minded anti-bike wankers. Little do they realise it may one day be there turn to defend themselves from beaurocratic madness and then it will be too late.

[modboy]

I have no interest in the AA because they are simply in existence to forward the myth that the only people with rights on the road are automobile users and everyone else can get fucked. If they can convince government to tax everyone else of the road that's only gonna be good for their smalled dicked, narrow minded members.

They are an organisation that might have been appropriate in the good old happy motoring days of the 1960s. Today - they are irrelevant.

[Trudes]

I've been a member of the AA for about 12 years and I've used them 4 times in that time..... to help other people get their keys out of their cars and flat batteries. Hubby called them once when we first started riding when the bike got a flat battery, they came, shrugged and left him there. So after all that and all this ACC shit I don't think I'll be renewing my pointless membership when it rolls around and I will be telling them why and that they can kiss my arse.

[phoenixgtr]

Hmmm...I knew they didn't care about bikers, but I didn't realise how anti biker they were. I'll be cancelling my membership and I'll let them know why too

[StoneY]

Just a thought, I'm in the AA and I have asked them to clarify their position on the proposed ACC increases.
Have they actually made any statement?
I know a lot of bikers think the AA is if not anti bikes but pro car it might be worth it if there are enough biker members to get them on side, after all the car levies are going up too.

I'm thinking we need legal types on board here.

Im in the AA but mate...one of THEIR spokesmen was on the TV3 story beside the ACC fat cats agreeing with them, stated we are reckless road users

I wrote a FORMAL complaint to the CEO about that statement as I am a long standing member, no fines in 6 years, no crashes in 23, and owned big bore bikes for many a year

Bastards- diss us like that when SOME of us are members, hell my GSXR is insured with them FFS (not much longer mind you)

[Ixion]

AA have been pushing for this behind the scenes.

They are sereiously ideologically opposed to bikes, want them off the roads.

I regard them as bigger bastards than ACC, ACC at least have a valid reason for wanting to shaft us.

[light]

LOL had to post this from this source:

http://www.aa.co.nz/about/issues/road-safety/Pages/Motorcyclists-and-motorists.aspx

I could be not reading this correctly but check this out.

"Motorcyclists are vulnerable road users. According to the Ministry of Transport, the risk of being injured or killed in a crash is a staggering 14 times higher for a motorcyclist than a car driver over the same distance"

then down the bottem:

"Did you know?

Motorcycles make up 2% of the vehicles on New Zealand roads, but:

are seven times more likely to be injured than other road users
account for 17% of road-related injury costs to ACC"

[riffer]

I was a member of AA for over ten years until about 3 years ago when I made a callout for my bike.

The guy arrived and said "we don't do bikes".

Cancelled my membership that day.

[Swoop]

...hell my GSXR is insured with them FFS (not much longer mind you)
My bike might have been insured with them, but the cost was exhorbitant.

Kiwibike Insurance were substantially cheaper!:first:

[Maki]

Im in the AA but mate...one of THEIR spokesmen was on the TV3 story beside the ACC fat cats agreeing with them, stated we are reckless road users

I wrote a FORMAL complaint to the CEO about that statement as I am a long standing member, no fines in 6 years, no crashes in 23, and owned big bore bikes for many a year

Bastards- diss us like that when SOME of us are members, hell my GSXR is insured with them FFS (not much longer mind you)

It's up to you to decide who you do business with. By all means spend your money with people who see eye to eye with you and don't stab you in the back.

[Mekk]

We are members of the AA (been one myself since 1980) and have insurances with them. Tbh, have just filled in our membership renewal form and I will be attaching a letter to them outlining our feelings and that we are seriously considering taking our insurance away.

I know the insurance side of it is separate, but a well worded letter might not go astray. Even if it makes no difference (and we will definitely be checking out insurance choices) if every AA member on here includes them in their "submissions" address list it could be worth it.


Perhaps it's worth hinting that your membership will not be renewed depending on their position on the levy increase.

State have Roadside Rescue as part of their insurance.

I work for AA and can soundly advise you that these forms of protest won't do jack.

Membership renewals go to 5 ladies in Wellington who will read your notes, shrug and put them aside as they process a thousand other transactions.

If you want to submit your opinion, I would suggest e-mailing instead. Go here:

http://www.aa.co.nz/Pages/emailus.aspx

E-mails received will usually be forwarded to Mike Noon or Mark Stockdale who are the AA's policy/media spokespeople.

[Mekk]

The guy arrived and said "we don't do bikes".


Sounds like a crock. The AA does't fix motorcycles generally, but they will put them on a truck to the nearest point of safety or repair.

Maybe you should have read the terms and conditions or rung up?

[vifferman]

I emailed in my thoughts to the AA, for all the good it will do.
They're a bunch of nanas, with the second most boring magazine in the universe.

[Sanx]

... with the second most boring magazine in the universe.

And the first is?

[SMOKEU]

I don't think I need to be a member of Alcoholics Anonymous, some other people may beg to differ though.

[Reckless]

I'm a 25 year plus member. When I've lost my keys or had a flat battey they have been good!
But I never realized they where so anti bikes! Never put two and two together really!
Well I have now and I don't think I will renew in fact I'll email them now!

Edit Done it:

Hi
I'm emailing to advise due to your supportive stance on the unfair Motorcycle ACC levy increases that The National Government is proposing.
As a 25+ year AA member and with Vehicle insurance with AA. I will not be renewing my policy or AA membership in future!!

Regards Name added and membership #

[StoneY]

Sounds like a crock. The AA does't fix motorcycles generally, but they will put them on a truck to the nearest point of safety or repair.

Maybe you should have read the terms and conditions or rung up?

When I renewed last year I made SURE the mebership covered my Bikes at roadside as well

They do bikes at the level of:

Jumpstarts (rider to expose battery)
Towing/recovery
Out of Fuel top up once a year(10 free bucks of gas)
Fuses

I have that in writing somewhere too.....ill check my files at home

[Pampera]

Sounds like a crock. The AA does't fix motorcycles generally, but they will put them on a truck to the nearest point of safety or repair.?

My only experience of AA motorcycle recovery was when another ride in our group broke down in Featherston. He called AA and we left him to be recovered. After we had completed our ride (and lunch) we came back through Featherston to find him still by the side of the road some 4 hours later. Trucks had been sent and were unable to deal with his bike and he was waiting for his wife to collect a trailer and drive from Wellington to recover him. That was the point when I realised being without the AA recovery service would be no different from having it - either way it was up to my resources to recover the bike.


I work for AA and can soundly advise you that these forms of protest won't do jack.



Advice to e-mail sounds good - thanks - but the point of the "protest" is not necessarily that it changes anything at AA. The individual withdrawing their business are no longer funding a lobbying organisation opposed to their interests. This was important for me and I am sure is important for some others.
Regards,

Michael

[Voltaire]

Thats a no then.
I'm only in it for the Missus...and the Work Van....but I thought roadside recovery would be useful...me being a Ducati owner and all :rolleyes:

From the sounds of it on the news it doesn't sound like the gumment will get the support for the big increase only the less bif increase.

[ready4whatever]

I don't think I need to be a member of Alcoholics Anonymous, some other people may beg to differ though.

damn you bet me to it. bling served

[candor]

AAs Safer Journeys submission - :ride:what are airbag jackets?

3.3 Improving the safety of motorcyclists
AA Recommended Policy Responses:
1. We support improving rider training and licensing and incentivising riders to undertake advanced riding courses.
2. We support a specific programme for treating motorcycle blackspots.
3. We support mandatory ABS for sport or touring ‘bikes.
4. We support promoting high visibility and protective clothing, including the uptake of ‘air bag’ jackets.
5. We support investigating development of a differential ACC levy system that recognises risk due to type of ‘bike or rider profile.
6. We would support moped riders obtaining a motorcycle licence but are unconvinced of the merits of requiring mopeds to undergo a Warrant of Fitness.

Discussion

Improve rider training and licensing
The NZAA wholly supports improving rider training skills, not only whilst obtaining a motorcycle licence, but also refresher courses for experienced riders. We commend initiatives offered by some motorcycle groups, like Ulysses, and retailers, to offer instructional courses, and believe these should be incentivised further. Options are to seek the insurance industry’s
support to lower premiums for customers who have undergone advanced training, and likewise for ACC levies to recognise rider skill levels and risk. Advanced riding courses should also be mandatory for riders issued with speed infringements or other riding offences, with the incentive that the fine be waived if the course is completed.
Similarly, we believe there is some merit in requiring moped riders to obtain a Class 6 motorcycle licence rather than the Class 1 default as present, which currently is one of the low-cost attractions of owning a moped. We believe there are particular handling and observation skills that can only be learnt from motorcycle courses, and not from inside a car.
The NZAA also supports revising the Driver Licensing Rule to replace the 250cc engine restriction for Learner riders with a power-to-weight ratio limit.
Require all new large motorbikes to have ABS by 2015
As with ESC for light vehicles, the AA would support making ABS mandatory for certain new motorbikes, although instead of the proposed 600cc threshold, perhaps this requirement could be based on a minimum power-to-weight ratio, or alternatively all sports or touring ‘bikes.

Introduce a differential levy system based on engine size

The current ACC levy only differentiates between mopeds and motorbikes, and in the case of the latter, the motorcyclists ACC levy is subsidised by light passenger vehicles to the tune of about $1200 a year, and does not reflect the true cost of motorcycle crashes on the health system. A major risk group appears to be European men over the age of 40, particularly those on powerful machines, and so a differential ACC regime recognising such ‘bikes and/or rider profile would be supported, although may not act as much of a deterrent for this group who have no shortage of cash for their new-found hobby. But a higher ACC levy closer to the actual cost sends an important signal to motorcyclists about the risk they face riding. This may cause pause for thought for new or returning riders.
However, instead of being based on engine size, a power-to-weight ratio may be a better tool to distinguish from older ‘bikes with large engines but relatively modest power output and which are not over-represented in motorcycle accidents.
In support of differential ACC levies there should be advertising campaigns illustrating the risk and motorcyclists contribution to the road toll, who are in denial of their level of fault.
According to the Crash Analysis System, there were 34 fatal crashes in 2008 involving a motorcycle at fault, and only 9 where they were innocent victims. In 21 of the 34 at fault crashes it was a single vehicle crash.

[5150]

I've been to an AA meeting once..... :drinknsin

ooops, wrong forum . duuh!!!

[kave]

According to the Crash Analysis System, there were 34 fatal crashes in 2008 involving a motorcycle at fault, and only 9 where they were innocent victims. In 21 of the 34 at fault crashes it was a single vehicle crash.
Interesting, so of the 13 motorcycle fatalities that were not single vehicle crashes the motorcyclists were only at fault in four of them. Thats less than a third.

[EgliHonda]

Actually just reminded me, only time in recent years we had reason to call on AA breakdown service was when driving a freshly imported 50's Dodge to an upholsterers. We had called LTSA ahead to get clearance for this as it was not yet warranted or rego'ed, and they were fine as it was being moved to have seat repaired for warrant. We ran out of fuel due to sticking fuel gauge in the wops somewhere, and dutifully called AA for an emergency top-up. (3 full paying members in the vehicle).
Breakdown crew arrived and promptly said as it didn't have NZ plates they wouldn't help. Any protesting that we had clearance from the authorities to be on the road was ignored, so similar to above stories we arranged our own rescue and carried on, wondering what we were actually paying for...

Will seriously re-think my continuing membership here...

[Pampera]

I've been to an AA meeting once..... :drinknsin

ooops, wrong forum . duuh!!!

Hey its meant to be alcoholics ANONYMOUS!

M:)

[Mekk]

When I renewed last year I made SURE the mebership covered my Bikes at roadside as well

They do bikes at the level of:

Jumpstarts (rider to expose battery)
Towing/recovery
Out of Fuel top up once a year(10 free bucks of gas)
Fuses

I have that in writing somewhere too.....ill check my files at home

Correct!


My only experience of AA motorcycle recovery was when another ride in our group broke down in Featherston. He called AA and we left him to be recovered. After we had completed our ride (and lunch) we came back through Featherston to find him still by the side of the road some 4 hours later. Trucks had been sent and were unable to deal with his bike and he was waiting for his wife to collect a trailer and drive from Wellington to recover him. That was the point when I realised being without the AA recovery service would be no different from having it - either way it was up to my resources to recover the bike.

I think there is a key issue missing from that story. It sounds like a miscommunication to me.




Advice to e-mail sounds good - thanks - but the point of the "protest" is not necessarily that it changes anything at AA. The individual withdrawing their business are no longer funding a lobbying organisation opposed to their interests. This was important for me and I am sure is important for some others.
Regards,

Michael

From my perspective, the main problem is that the AA doesn't receive enough fuss from bikers to take our issues more seriously.

[Fluffy Cat]

Same as above will terminate insurance at next renewal. Had no idea they were so anti bike.

[nrc]

Same as above will terminate insurance at next renewal. Had no idea they were so anti bike.

Totally agree, my annual AA bill just arrived in the mail the other day. Just going to rip it up this time and look elsewhere. I've heard much better user stories about State anyway.

NRC.

[Mom]

So after all that and all this ACC shit I don't think I'll be renewing my pointless membership when it rolls around and I will be telling them why and that they can kiss my arse.

Cancel it now and ask for a refund of your premium.


AA have been pushing for this behind the scenes.

They are sereiously ideologically opposed to bikes, want them off the roads.

I regard them as bigger bastards than ACC, ACC at least have a valid reason for wanting to shaft us.

Plus one from me on that sentiment. Having had the "pleasure" of talking at length with Mr Noon about motorcycle safety on the roads, I came away with a very bad taste in my mouth, and was left with the totally overwhelming knowledge that AA is anti bike :yes:


Same as above will terminate insurance at next renewal. Had no idea they were so anti bike.

Terminate it now, get a refund, there are cheaper insurers out there anyway :yes:


Totally agree, my annual AA bill just arrived in the mail the other day. Just going to rip it up this time and look elsewhere. I've heard much better user stories about State anyway.

NRC.

Write to them and tell them why!

[Ender EnZed]

I'm a member. They took me and my bike home on a truck when it stopped and wouldn't start. I only had to push it about 50m to get to the free tow side of the bridge.

[Mekk]

The only way the AA will support motorcyclists is if they get off their arses, make complaints and submit feedback.

Individual stories where people are astray of one of the Terms & Conditions don't get recognised but hundreds of them do.

I agree, the AA is very anti-bike, or rather doesn't acknowledge bikers as much as it should but they also get sweet fuck all complaints from them. Cancelling in a big hissy fit doesn't actually register because the operators just think they're one off crazies that don't read the rules of the Membership.

Submit feedback en masse and you'll get somewhere.

[Pampera]

I think there is a key issue missing from that story. It sounds like a miscommunication to me.

.

There sure was. He rung the AA and explained the situation, which was straightforward and a request for the simple recovery service he had been paying a subscription for. Two vehicles arrived over the four hours, neither of which could handle his bike. It was the AA and their contractors that failed to communicate and deliver the service.

Michael

[Paul in NZ]

I've had professional and private dealings with them...

We are no longer members.

[Mekk]

There sure was. He rung the AA and explained the situation, which was straightforward and a request for the simple recovery service he had been paying a subscription for. Two vehicles arrived over the four hours, neither of which could handle his bike. It was the AA and their contractors that failed to communicate and deliver the service.

Michael

So what happened with the complaint? There's usually decent compensation for any major screw ups.

[Pampera]

So what happened with the complaint? There's usually decent compensation for any major screw ups.

Dunno. He was a friend of a friend so have no idea where it went for him.

All I know is that I had been telling myself for some years that I would be "cutting my nose off to spite my face" to quit an organisation I had joined simply to make sure I had an option to turn to, if I found myself stranded by the side of the side of the road, but caused me concern because it seemed to think that it had a right to take political positions on behalf of all the people who joined it for no such reason and gave them no such mandate.

However, as soon as I saw in front of my own eyes that in fact I had been paying this "insurance" money for 21 years but if I ever needed the help it would probably not be forthcoming - what was the justification to stay a member of an organisation with a political position opposed to my interests?

Anyway, praise the lord for cell phones - almost the most useful item in a motorcycle toolkit, after all else has failed!

Regards,
Michael

[Mekk]

However, as soon as I saw in front of my own eyes that in fact I had been paying this "insurance" money for 21 years but if I ever needed the help it would probably not be forthcoming - what was the justification to stay a member of an organisation with a political position opposed to my interests?

It is the part in bold that I take exception to. A hazy anecdote from a friend of a friend that apparently didn't get the service once is a very weak reason to end something. I mean there are stories for things like that for most, if not all products and services.

People complain about everything.

--

It amazes me that people will join an organisation to represent their interests and sit there without actually sharing their interests or being a part of it. It's like they expect everything to be done for them.

One would also expect bikers wanting representation would join BRONZ. But of course there are complaints for that too.

[Pampera]

It is the part in bold that I take exception to. A hazy anecdote from a friend of a friend that apparently didn't get the service once is a very weak reason to end something. I mean there are stories for things like that for most, if not all products and services.

People complain about everything.--



I was THERE. THERE when he broke down. THERE four hours later when we found him at the side of the road still not recovered. THERE when he explained first person what had happened to him. This was not some rude and aggressive young man in a hurry but a late fifty something year old on a BMW F650!

I get it you believe your employer delivers a great service to motorcyclists. That is fine. But understand that the customers may (and are allowed to) see it otherwise, they don't have to wait until the service fails for them personally and that it is not their responsibility to improve things. They can decide to simply cease buying the service and make other arrangements.

It is up to the individual to chose - pay their subscription to the AA (who will use it to help lobby against motorcycling and point to the size of the membership as a mandate when influencing politicians) and try and change the organisation from inside, or to make the call that it would be better not to provide financial and numbers support for these activities. I chose the second.

Regards,
M

[Mekk]

I was THERE.

That's irrelevant if you don't know the reason for the delay or anything else about it.



But understand that the customers may (and are allowed to) see it otherwise, they don't have to wait until the service fails for them personally and that it is not their responsibility to improve things.

Of course they're allowed to see otherwise, plenty do! What I am questioning is the logic behind basing everything on what other people have experienced, a mob mentality type of thinking. Especially without the full story.

It doesn't personally affect me whether you're a Member or not, this is not about employer loyalty because I agree their policies are or at least seem quite anti-bike.



This decision for me was even simpler as the organisation concerned was using the money I paid to lobby against my interests. Without any trust that I would be recovered after a breakdown, why would I keep paying to do this!

Regards,
M

I agree with the lobbying part, but I am also saying that not enough people complain about it.

The second part I'm not so sure about. The AA's reputation is built around trust and they're very paranoid about it. There is no way they would have as many Members as they do without the trust.

[cs363]

AA have been pushing for this behind the scenes.

They are sereiously ideologically opposed to bikes, want them off the roads.

I regard them as bigger bastards than ACC, ACC at least have a valid reason for wanting to shaft us.

I agree.

Never had a great opinion of the AA and hearing/reading some of the tripe that George Fairbairn and more recently Mike Noon have trotted out over recent years has only reinforced that opinion.
As has my brief though less than impressive dealings with them through the Holden Roadside Assistance program and now their vehemently anti-bike stance.
I cannot for the life of me understand why any right thinking motorcyclist would have anything to do with them, let alone contribute to their coffers.

That's my opinion to which I'm entitled, and I don't give a rats arse what any of their misguided supporters on here think.


Rant ends.