Buying a bike. Previous owner was an insurance company? (IAG)

[sobriquet]

I've been riding a friends bike for the past year, so this is my first time buying a bike.
I decided to get an Ownership History.
There's been 14 previous owners (it's a '96), and one of them was an insurance company.



Registration Has Been Cancelled
Owned since: 2006, August 10th (for more than 1 month);

Iag New Zealand Limited trading as Do Not Use - Company Struck Off The Register
Owned since: 2006, January 10th (for more than 7 months); Location: Hataitai, Wellington 6021; Postal address: ATTN SALVAGE TEAM STATE, PO Box 5037, Lambton Quay, Wellington 6145; Status: Complete; This is a company; Prior odometer: 48,748km on 2005, October 19th


Should I assume this bike's been an insurance write-off in the past? The guy who owned it before the insurance company only had it for 4 months.
The bike's been re-registered and had 4 other owners since late 2006.
Am I looking at a lemon? How often do most people keep their bikes?

What other things should I watch out for? 14 previous owners seems like a lot.

[MSTRS]

Bikes do tend to change hands more often than cars. The history you give strongly suggests it's been written off and recomplied etc. This is not necessarily a problem. Write-offs can happen for relatively minor damage. It is the value of the repairs/value of bike that determines write-off. It could have been as simple as bolting on new fairings...or as bad as a bent frame. I doubt that there is any way to know, short of contacting the owner at time of crash and getting the story from them.

[Gman71]

it's been written off- guarantee it.

avoid it- why buy a bike that has been snotted, regardless of how good the repair might be.

[CookMySock]

I doubt that there is any way to know, short of contacting the owner at time of crash and getting the story from them.Cmon maaaaaate, if they want to ditch their lemon, why would they not lie to some buyer?

Carjam will tell you "vehicle written off by insurance company" if it has been.

@sobriquet, for your first bike you shouldn't buy something with some "history". Get yourself a modern bike thats 100% square, so you can rely on it and get on with the business of learning to ride it. You will have enough on your hands without having to deal with bikes with an unsavoury past. That said, maybe you will score a bargain from it.

Steve

[Mully]

Cmon maaaaaate, if they want to ditch their lemon, why would they not lie to some buyer?

The owner at the time of the crash has ditched the lemon already - to the insurance company.

I wouldn't bother talking to the current owner, cos they have a motive to lie about it.

If you can get hold of the guy who binned it, ask him how bad it was.

[cheesemethod]

Could also be stolen and recovered, insurance company would take possession if the police found it after they paid out.

[Zuki lover]

I wouldn't touch it - sounds like bad karma :done:

[JimO]

if its cheap buy it

[NewRob]

If you can contact the insurance company and find out the status of the bike than it will give you peace of mind about the bike. But if you have the money, it is better you get a new and better bike. Cheers.

[sobriquet]

Thanks for all the advice everyone.

Getting a new bike isn't really an option for me, as I'm a poor student.
I've been riding (and maintaining) my friends '93 ZZR 250 for the past year, and have been eyeing trademe over the last few months looking for potentials, as it's time I bought my own.

I used Carjam for the report, but I can't see anywhere that mentions it being written off. Only the Ownership info as mentioned above. Whereabouts on the page would it state that it's a write-off?

Would the insurance company still have those details? And would they be inclined to give them to me? I'll try calling them tomorrow, but I don't really know where to start.

[Ender EnZed]

:whocares:Unless it's subtly fucked and you don't discover until after you buy it then...
If it rides fine then it rides fine. It sounds very likely that it has been written off but that doesn't mean its a bad bike. Factor that into your considerations of whether or not you want that specific bike and, if you still do, raise the issue with the seller to try and get it cheaper. You probaly won't ever know exactly what happened to it but it probably doesn't matter now.

[CookMySock]

Get the VIN number and go down to VTNZ and ask them.

Steve

[MSTRS]

Thanks for all the advice everyone.

Getting a new bike isn't really an option for me, as I'm a poor student.
I've been riding (and maintaining) my friends '93 ZZR 250 for the past year, and have been eyeing trademe over the last few months looking for potentials, as it's time I bought my own.

I used Carjam for the report, but I can't see anywhere that mentions it being written off. Only the Ownership info as mentioned above. Whereabouts on the page would it state that it's a write-off?

Would the insurance company still have those details? And would they be inclined to give them to me? I'll try calling them tomorrow, but I don't really know where to start.

The fact that an InsCo is listed as an owner means it was written off. Ins Co assumes ownership when they pay out. They then de-register it and flog the wreck off at auction (or tender). The purchaser may wreck for parts or rebuild, re-vin, get a new plate and back on the road. The vin process is pretty good for determining roadworthiness, but it's not infallible.
The Ins Co is unlikely to be able to tell you anything, unless they can link the old plate # to the damage report. Usually, access to details like hat will be through the policy #, along policy owner etc.
Best bet is to pay the fee to get the full Carjam report, as long as it lists owner history details. Then track down the owner just prior to Ins Co and talk to him/her.

[sobriquet]

Thanks for the advice guys. I managed to track down the owner prior to write-off and get details about how it occurred.

[MSTRS]

Cool. And....?

[sobriquet]

It was stolen and recovered, and he warned me about the condition it was recovered in, so its history is uncertain. He's going to try and find the before/after pics.
Very helpful.

[CookMySock]

The vin process is pretty good for determining roadworthiness, but it's not infallible.Yeah you got that right.

I looked at a GT650R wreck earlier this year, and to my surprise I stumble across the said red repaired and revinned GT650R in Tauranga last month. We had the seat off it, and lo and behold the center chassis member between the two side parts of the frame is bent upwards in the center. Now theres only ONE way the center chassis member gets bent UPWARDS and that is if you press the two sides together. :pinch:

I asked the owner (a police officer) who VINned that, and he refused to tell me.

Steve

[sobriquet]

Now I'm quite worried about the percentage of dangerous bikes that might be on NZ roads.
I had a look at it today.

When I arrived, the front brake reservoir had coffee colored brake fluid, and the rear had none at all.
Nobody had replaced the key-based ignition since it got ripped out by the thief 4 years ago.
The engine seemed to sound alright, but the gearbox was trashed, making all kinds of awful noises in higher gears.
The front wheel bearings also seemed screwy, as the bike wobbled and wanted to upright itself around corners.
The newer fairing barely fit the bike, tires had flat spots (and rubber under the rear fender).
It dropped into neutral from 2nd occasionally, and wouldn't go into neutral sometimes while stationary.
Fairings were from a different model, barely fitting, and acted as a knee/leg warmer.
It had 2 right hand mirrors, one of them at an odd angle as a substitute for the left hand mirror.
The owner was also unsure when the oil was last changed, and they'd had it for 2 years.

This all surprised me, as the owner seemed quite knowledgeable about bikes, at least enough to assume they'd know about regular maintenance.

These are just some of the more obvious things that were wrong with it, and
I'm now quite worried that getting recertification and a WOF might be a bit too easy in this country.

Surprisingly, the frame/subframes seemed to be in alright condition.
With regards to cost, it was perhaps worth 10-20% of the asking price.

I hope I don't incriminate anyone if the seller posts here, but buyers beware - try before you buy.

This guide helped immensely: http://www.clarity.net/~adam/buying-bike.html. As did the comments in this thread, so thanks.
A larger percentage of the "RUN" suggestions in the buying guide occurred than I ever expected to encounter.

[vgcspares]

we write off bikes if they are old simply because we can't source original parts and then can't provide indemnity under the policy, ie: restore it to it's pre-accident glory

if a bike has been recomplied legitimately it will be a better bet (on average) than a comparable uninsured bike as that could easily have had a crash, then a botched repair and no record of either