$400 for no "L" plate?

[jetboy]

Well I got a ticket yesterday for not displaying an L plate - $400!!! Is this normal or am I getting ripped off?

How the hell do they justify $400? I have a license, bike's up to scratch etc.

I take responsibility for not displaying a plate, but this seems a bit excessive to me.

[Ixion]

Standard fine for breach of licence conditions. Also 25 demerits , to really make your day.

[zeocen]

If you wore an L plate it would've cost you $0.

Welcome to common sense.

[FlangMasterJ]

Did they pull you over?

Were you doing something to bring yourself to their attention?

[JimO]

there is enough threads on here from people saying they wont use a L plate.....everybody has been warned

[jetboy]

As I said I take responsibility for my actions and will pay the fine - I am questioning the amount of the fine. Considering a speeding fine is $120 and if you run a red light the fine is $150...surely a "No L Plate" fine would be lower than a colossal $400?! I don't see the sense in that.

I was turning into the street I live in when he pulled me. I was meeting a mate at mine (also not displaying an L plate) and he happened to ride past me/the cop as he was writing out my ticket, and parked at my house. The cop finished with me, pulled in behind my mate and gave him a $400 ticket too!

Again, I take responsibility for my actions, I just feel the consequences are a little high all things considered.

[Ixion]

It's the same fine for all licence breaches

Not wearing glasses if that's on your licence
Carrying a passenger on a L/R
Exceeding 70kph on a 6L
Not having a supervisor on a 1L
After hours on a L/R
No L plate on an L

Others too.

Not specific to bikes, or to Learners. You can get a breach of licence conditions fine on a full.

[red mermaid]

The fines are set by Parliament and the Police have no input to them.

[jetboy]

Thanks for the list Ixion!

I guess this is just a very expensive lesson :doh:

[White trash]

Yeah it does seem a bit harsh, but the lawmakers have really decided to crack down hard on breach of licence conditions offenders, hence the huge rise in the fine coupled with the demerit point tax.

They've got to get nastily tough and show no tolerance to the boy racers to stop them killing each other and unfortunately, aren't interested in hearing excuses.

I feel partly to blame. I spent 12 years on my learner licence. Breaching the conditions carried I think a $150 fine, that's it. People, myself included, took the micky for too long. Some 18 year old punks out there have over $30K racked up in fines.

[CookMySock]

It's the same fine for all licence breaches

...
Carrying a passenger on a L/RMy understanding is, it was $800 for pillion or L/R.

Steve

[Ixion]

Nope .

[steve_t]

I was wondering a while back, when the cop sticks your plate in their computer thingy and see the details of the bike, can they see whether the registered owner is on their 6L, 6R, or 6? Scumdog? Anyone?

[Ixion]

Not from your plate. They can from your licence . And a smart cop might run the registered owner's licence details even if he hasn't yet stopped you.

If the registered owner is on an L licence and no L plate showing, worth stopping (from his PoV). Might be the owner loaned the bike to a full licence holder - or not.

Savvy cops may also stop a "small" bike on spec, to check licence .I got stopped a couple of times on L'il Ratty, one cop (fairly friendly guy) admitted that he just stopped me because I was riding "a little bike, so I thought you might have been a learner".

[jim.cox]

I was wondering a while back, when the cop sticks your plate in their computer thingy and see the details of the bike, can they see whether the registered owner is on their 6L, 6R, or 6? Scumdog? Anyone?

Doing a QVR on a plate will give the owner's name

Usually then do a QP on the name to get the licence details

[red mermaid]

Yeah it does seem a bit harsh, but the lawmakers have really decided to crack down hard on breach of licence conditions offenders, hence the huge rise in the fine coupled with the demerit point tax.

They've got to get nastily tough and show no tolerance to the boy racers to stop them killing each other and unfortunately, aren't interested in hearing excuses.

I feel partly to blame. I spent 12 years on my learner licence. Breaching the conditions carried I think a $150 fine, that's it. People, myself included, took the micky for too long. Some 18 year old punks out there have over $30K racked up in fines.

It never was $150, you used to get your learner period extended.

There is talk at New Zealand Transport Agency, who are the people with the Ministry of Transport who actually write the laws and decide the fines, to drop the fine lower but raise the demerits to something in the region of 35-50 points.

[NighthawkNZ]

Well I got a ticket yesterday for not displaying an L plate - $400!!! Is this normal or am I getting ripped off?

How the hell do they justify $400? I have a license, bike's up to scratch etc.

I take responsibility for not displaying a plate, but this seems a bit excessive to me.


He obviously pulled you over fo something else... cop wouldn't know from the number plate if a learner is riding it or not...

[Badjelly]

I was turning into the street I live in when he pulled me. I was meeting a mate at mine (also not displaying an L plate) and he happened to ride past me/the cop as he was writing out my ticket, and parked at my house. The cop finished with me, pulled in behind my mate and gave him a $400 ticket too!

I bet that made his day. :yes:

I don't suppose that's any consolation, is it? :no:

[Bassmatt]

Shit that is a real bummer i reckon the cop must be an arsehole, i dont know anyone who has been done for that around here. I got pulled over on my 650 for doing 119k in a100k zone, cop questioned me about riding a 650 on a learners licence but didnt even mention the L plate. Got stung for the speeding and let off everything else.
Hard luck man

[White trash]

It never was $150, you used to get your learner period extended.

There is talk at New Zealand Transport Agency, who are the people with the Ministry of Transport who actually write the laws and decide the fines, to drop the fine lower but raise the demerits to something in the region of 35-50 points.
Ahhh, you're correct. That's why we never did a friggen thing about it.

[crazyhorse]

He obviously pulled you over fo something else... cop wouldn't know from the number plate if a learner is riding it or not...

If you are riding a 250 or less, than chances are, you would be on a L plate or restricted. In HB the smaller bikes do get picked on, and checks are done on those sorta things. My son was pulled over for not displaying his, however, it was under his seat and had broken - thankfully he was let off (outside our address too)

But its no different than boy racers and the likes being pulled over and ticketed for passengers etc.

Besides, the cop obviously wasn't filling his quota for the day, and it was bit rude of him to then persue your mate too :argh:

[jrandom]

I take responsibility for not displaying a plate, but this seems a bit excessive to me.

It occurs to me, y'know, that crashing while riding outside one's licence conditions might call into question the validity of an insurance claim.

:whistle:

[Ixion]

Probably difficult for an insurance company to show that lack of an L plate was material (Insurance Reform Act 1977). Other breach of conditions would be more of a risk- fairly easy to argue that riding a > 250cc bike on an L was material - manifest inexperience, lack of qualification etc . Ditto pillion.

[crazyhorse]

Probably difficult for an insurance company to show that lack of an L plate was material (Insurance Reform Act 1977). Other breach of conditions would be more of a risk- fairly easy to argue that riding a > 250cc bike on an L was material - manifest inexperience, lack of qualification etc . Ditto pillion.

yes, but if your licence dictates that you require one, and one is absent from the vehicle, they could get you on a technicality - anything to not have to pay out.........

[DingoZ]

It occurs to me, y'know, that crashing while riding outside one's licence conditions might call into question the validity of an insurance claim.

:whistle:

Certainly does. Cause all they have to do is get a hold of the police report if they attended the crash and it would show all details....

Ie rider crashed, was on such and such a license, did not have plate dispalyed etc etc etc...

[scumdog]

Thanks for the list Ixion!

I guess this is just a very expensive lesson :doh:

I'm really REALLY surprised a person of your age/licence class did not know this - most others I've spoken to seem to have absorbed that kind of knowledge..

[The Everlasting]

Upon reading this,I am actually gonna take the scooter down to the mall and get me a L-Plate right now!!!


I had no idea the fine was this harsh!!

[Maki]

Blah, $400 for not displaying L plate, and $400 for riding above 70 in a 100 zone is just highway robbery. Sorry you got victimized by revenue gatherers.

[breakaway]

Don't stop next time :)

[crazyhorse]

Upon reading this,I am actually gonna take the scooter down to the mall and get me a L-Plate right now!!!


I had no idea the fine was this harsh!!

Use the legs - no risk of a ticket..... or the bus in that case!

[jetboy]

He obviously pulled you over fo something else... cop wouldn't know from the number plate if a learner is riding it or not...

I've been pulled over so many times while minding my own business.


It occurs to me, y'know, that crashing while riding outside one's licence conditions might call into question the validity of an insurance claim.

Haha how'd I know this question would pop up!


I'm really REALLY surprised a person of your age/licence class did not know this - most others I've spoken to seem to have absorbed that kind of knowledge...

Yes ignorance is no excuse. I 'assumed' the fine would be lower and hence took the risk. My bad, and now I'm paying for it. I also assume you're a cop from previous posts, so from your perspective is it fair that the fine for no L plate higher than speeding/red light running? I am asking for a personal opinion here.

[ukusa]

If you are riding a 250 or less, than chances are, you would be on a L plate or restricted. In HB the smaller bikes do get picked on, and checks are done on those sorta things.

All the more reason to just get a big bike eh!

[YellowDog]

As I said I take responsibility for my actions and will pay the fine - I am questioning the amount of the fine. Considering a speeding fine is $120 and if you run a red light the fine is $150...surely a "No L Plate" fine would be lower than a colossal $400?! I don't see the sense in that.

I was turning into the street I live in when he pulled me. I was meeting a mate at mine (also not displaying an L plate) and he happened to ride past me/the cop as he was writing out my ticket, and parked at my house. The cop finished with me, pulled in behind my mate and gave him a $400 ticket too!

Again, I take responsibility for my actions, I just feel the consequences are a little high all things considered.
This cop will be hanging around your highly profitable street a lot more in future. Clearly there's rich pickings to be had.

What's it called 'Christmas Road'?
:rofl:

[The Everlasting]

Use the legs - no risk of a ticket..... or the bus in that case!



Hell no..:P The Scooter was 100 percent legal,that's why I used it.


Now the bike is all legit too...:D

[sil3nt]

Surprised so many people don't know the consequences! Its posted in nearly every L plate thread that comes up.

On motorway patrol the other month a cop ran the licence plate of a bike and checked the registered owners details to find out the guy was on a restricted whilst riding a 1000cc bike. Pulled him over and sure enough the owner was on the bike...

[nothingflash]

This cop will be hanging around your highly profitable street a lot more in future. Clearly there's rich pickings to be had.

What's it called 'Christmas Road'?
:rofl:

Ha - it is now. That copper would have gone back to the station and told all his copper mates. They'll be queuing tomorrow!

Hard luck though - that sucks for you especially so close to Christmas. But I just wonder if you knew the fine was $400 would you still have chosen to risk it? I maybe wouldn't have in hindsight.

[The Everlasting]

Ha - it is now. That copper would have gone back to the station and told all his copper mates. They'll be queuing tomorrow!

Hard luck though - that sucks for you especially so close to Christmas. But I just wonder if you knew the fine was $400 would you still have chosen to risk it? I maybe wouldn't have in hindsight.



I was risking it until today, but that's only because i didn't know the fine was so extreme,I then stuck one on the back asap.

Oh yeah,have some rep jetboy..:D Probably saved me a fine.

[nothingflash]

Yep - rep given too

You live and learn - it's a shame some will learn from your "mistake".

[GOONR]

Yeah $400 is a bitch but plenty mentioned on here about it. The one thing that does make me laugh is the amount of people that don't put the 'L' on the back, this poll (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=113001) shows that a lot of people don't bother and most will get away with it.

I'm still on my 'L' it's been on the back of the bike from day one. I can't afford to give away $400 and I would sooner spend that kinda $$ on my family / bike. Plus it's only 6 months of your life, no big deal really.

[jetboy]

...no big deal really.

It doesnt match my colour scheme.

If I knew the fine was four hundy I wouldnt have done it, but its my own fault for not checking. I still dont get the logic though.

[caseye]

The logic is simple. You ride without it and you get caught, IT HURTS, you go get an L plate, well all know who you are, no problem.
In the States, it's called "The broken glass policy"
The Police there react to the frist crime committed by an unknown person harshly and in cold blood they throw the book at the offender, guess what? they don't often come up again.
Here we actually let em ride off without an L plate or on that 1000cc bike
Stupid in my opinion, but there ya go.

[Fluffy Cat]

Your a very bad offender and should pay for your crimes against humanity.
Then again you could be Eric Rush...200 hours community service and $15,000 compensation .
Oooo. you are so bad.
Yes $400 is a bit out of kelter but so is our law/judiciary system...did i call it a system, haw haw.:buggerd:

[GOONR]

It doesnt match my colour scheme.

If I knew the fine was four hundy I wouldnt have done it, but its my own fault for not checking. I still dont get the logic though.

Yeah it does seem to be on the high side. It's good that your not on here bitching about being pinged for it, a fair few would be.

The funny thing is, a guy I work with has a cop as a flat mate and he told the guy at work to get ride of his "L", apparently it makes you a target. Cops words, not mine.

I guess it just's luck of the draw if you take it of.

[Tank]

What I cant see is the logic of selecting to break a law and not having made a educated decision based on the facts.

ie. If you are doing to do something - at least have a understanding of the consequences before deciding to do it - that way you can weigh up the pro's and con's.

Just riding without a "L" because you are too cool and not knowing that there are large fines is frankly stupid.

Then you wont come on hear moaning.

[GOONR]

What I cant see is the logic of selecting to break a law and not having made a educated decision based on the facts.

ie. If you are doing to do something - at least have a understanding of the consequences before deciding to do it - that way you can weigh up the pro's and con's.

Just riding without a "L" because you are too cool and not knowing that there are large fines is frankly stupid.

Then you wont come on hear moaning.

Yup, I looked it up, saw what it could potentially cost me and thought "bugger that".

[scumdog]

It doesnt match my colour scheme.

If I knew the fine was four hundy I wouldnt have done it, but its my own fault for not checking. I still dont get the logic though.

So why did you NOT have the 'L' plate on?

'Safety'?
Laziness?
Ego?
??

[ManDownUnder]

So why did you NOT have the 'L' plate on?

'Safety'?
Laziness?
Ego?
??

Couldn't spell it (yeah I know it doesn't make sense.. but not bad as an in your face comeback...)

[GOONR]

So why did you NOT have the 'L' plate on?

'Safety'?
Laziness?
Ego?
??

I can tell you why I thought about taking mine off. 70kph on the open road or motorway is a quite often a death wish. I decided to keep the L and stay (mostly) away from the 100kph area's. when I do go in to a 100kph zone that is what I ride at. I figured that way I would only get belted with 1 x $400 fine but be safer.

[scumdog]

I can tell you why I thought about taking mine off. 70kph on the open road or motorway is a quite often a death wish. I decided to keep the L and stay (mostly) away from the 100kph area's. when I do go in to a 100kph zone that is what I ride at. I figured that way I would only get belted with 1 x $400 fine but be safer.

So....how many 'L' platers have actually been physically run off the road because the had an 'L' plate on their bike?

[SilentDtH]

When the officer said "Where is your lplate"?

You should have said "On the back... oh sh*t, where is it? Maybe it fell off... "

Then show him to the broken cable ties that you 'placed' on the back of your bike...

[GOONR]

So....how many 'L' platers have actually been physically run off the road because the had an 'L' plate on their bike?

That I don't know, I bet it isn't zero though. Doing 70kph on a motorway is, in my opinion, not safe.

I've almost been run on to the wrong side of the road though. There is a road near me where two lanes merge in to one after a set of lights, people try to push past you when it merges. It happens a fair bit, but I can't say if that is because I have an L or it's just because they are impatient idiots.

[Supermac Jr]

It's the same fine for all licence breaches


Exceeding 70kph on a 6L
Others too.

Not specific to bikes, or to Learners. You can get a breach of licence conditions fine on a full.

I share your pain - made a contribution earlier this year. 98km on the motorway. proudly displaying my "L"

[duckonin]

The fines are set by Parliament and the Police have no input to them.

Tha first part says it all (set by parli) just like the proposed ACC excessive!!! to say the least...:mad:

[duckonin]

So why did you NOT have the 'L' plate on?

'Safety'?
Laziness?
Ego?
??

A couple or three times along the motorway in Auck's with a L plate would have u changeing your mind SD,:eek:, or catching the bus.:doh:.

[jetboy]

So why did you NOT have the 'L' plate on?

'Safety'?
Laziness?
Ego?
??
/\ as above - I rode with the L plate on and noticed a significant change in driver attitude when I took it off....I just left it off after that.

Im not disputing the fact that I should have got a fine - I'm disputing the amount of the fine.

[JimO]

where do u think the gummint gets the money to give to the bludgers

[red mermaid]

You will all be pleased to know that as of 1 December the fine will drop to $100.

Demerits will increase to 35.

[jetboy]

You will all be pleased to know that as of 1 December the fine will drop to $100.

Demerits will increase to 35.
That is actually good news, a far more logical approach.

[sleemanj]

It occurs to me, y'know, that crashing while riding outside one's licence conditions might call into question the validity of an insurance claim.


Cause all they have to do is get a hold of the police report if they attended the crash and it would show all details....


yes, but if your licence dictates that you require one, and one is absent from the vehicle, they could get you on a technicality - anything to not have to pay out.........


This old chestnut goes round and round and round and round.

The Law (Insurance Law Reform Act 1977) does not permit insurance companies to get out of a claim on a "technicality" like this. Any justification the insurance company gives must be directly attributable to the claim. The presence or otherwise of an L plate would be very hard to show to be a direct contributory factor, if you can come up with a way that it could be, I'd be quite interested to hear it.

If it wasn't for the law you can bet that insurance companies would find a way out of more or less every single claim without any hesitation. There is ALWAYS a technicality out there. The law is there to stamp out that practice and make insurance a service, not a scam.

As for the original poster, what you should have said was "oh officer, I did have one there, I guess it must have fallen off, I'm really sorry about that, I'll get that sorted out right away". But I suspect there is more to the story.

[jetboy]

As for the original poster, what you should have said was "oh officer, I did have one there, I guess it must have fallen off, I'm really sorry about that, I'll get that sorted out right away"

Tried that and failed. I was even courteous enough to point out that he was leaking oil AND fixed the problem for him.

[red mermaid]

This old chestnut goes round and round and round and round.

The Law (Insurance Law Reform Act 1977) does not permit insurance companies to get out of a claim on a "technicality" like this. Any justification the insurance company gives must be directly attributable to the claim. The presence or otherwise of an L plate would be very hard to show to be a direct contributory factor, if you can come up with a way that it could be, I'd be quite interested to hear it.

If it wasn't for the law you can bet that insurance companies would find a way out of more or less every single claim without any hesitation. There is ALWAYS a technicality out there. The law is there to stamp out that practice and make insurance a service, not a scam.

As for the original poster, what you should have said was "oh officer, I did have one there, I guess it must have fallen off, I'm really sorry about that, I'll get that sorted out right away". But I suspect there is more to the story.

Try lying like that in a report to an insurance company and see what happens!
What the Police can do to you, has got nothing on them. They may give you a ticket but an insurance company will stuff you round for ages, charge you the earth and then sue for you for thousands.

[sleemanj]

Try lying like that in a report to an insurance company and see what happens!

You have missed my point somewhere. You don't have to lie to the insurance company.

The insurance company has no recourse to decline your claim based on not having an L plate (or WOF, or reg, or tyres, or brakes, or red underpants with polka dots) unless they can show that it is directly related to the reasons for the claim.

You should NEVER lie to your insurance company, that is fraud. You should always be absolutely 100% honest, if you are dishonest with your insurance company, all bets are off!

[Tank]

That I don't know, I bet it isn't zero though. Doing 70kph on a motorway is, in my opinion, not safe.


If you have a need to do a lot of 100kpm zone riding - you can get dispensation to allowing you not to be restricted to 70km.

Got it myself when I had my "L" plates.

[red mermaid]

You have missed my point somewhere. You don't have to lie to the insurance company.

The insurance company has no recourse to decline your claim based on not having an L plate (or WOF, or reg, or tyres, or brakes, or red underpants with polka dots) unless they can show that it is directly related to the reasons for the claim.

You should NEVER lie to your insurance company, that is fraud. You should always be absolutely 100% honest, if you are dishonest with your insurance company, all bets are off!

So its ok to lie to the police, but not your insurance company?

[st00ji]

when did he advocate lying to the police?

[jetboy]

when did he advocate lying to the police?
yeah im not connecting the dots either

[caseye]

So....how many 'L' platers have actually been physically run off the road because the had an 'L' plate on their bike?

Hey SD, I'm currently riding TEC for my wife, every time she goes out on her bike without me I cringe.She's an L plater and slowly beginning to enjoy her time on the road, no thanks to the dickheads up here who go out of their way to make her experiences bad ones.
I've had the barstards do it all,roar past at break neck speed inches from her, tail gate so close theres no room between her and them( they're the ones I like dealing with) Of course this happens when they've pushed in between her and I , I try to maintin a resonable gap between us , so she gets an idea of how far back she should be from the car/s in front, but so many times these damnd Dorklander drivers simply take their god given bit of road, it sickens me to see it and it does make me very edgy when they get between us and start the shenanagins.
As TEC on other organised rides up here I see car drivers, mostly doing the worst possible things behind people with L plates on, it's as if that L means they're fair game for stalkers in cages.
no bull and I kid you not around this neck of the woods it happens all too often.

[peasea]

Hey SD, I'm currently riding TEC for my wife, every time she goes out on her bike without me I cringe.She's an L plater and slowly beginning to enjoy her time on the road, no thanks to the dickheads up here who go out of their way to make her experiences bad ones.
I've had the barstards do it all,roar past at break neck speed inches from her, tail gate so close theres no room between her and them( they're the ones I like dealing with) Of course this happens when they've pushed in between her and I , I try to maintin a resonable gap between us , so she gets an idea of how far back she should be from the car/s in front, but so many times these damnd Dorklander drivers simply take their god given bit of road, it sickens me to see it and it does make me very edgy when they get between us and start the shenanagins.
As TEC on other organised rides up here I see car drivers, mostly doing the worst possible things behind people with L plates on, it's as if that L means they're fair game for stalkers in cages.
no bull and I kid you not around this neck of the woods it happens all too often.

That's Auckland for ya!

It would probably be safer for your missus if you just ripped the bloody L-plate off. I never used one while going through that level of the license-gaining money-grab. Your wee tale highlights the fact that L-plates just make you a target for hoons, of which there are thousands in Auckland.

It'd be far easier to fork out for a fine than find a new missus.

[crazyhorse]

Hey SD, I'm currently riding TEC for my wife, every time she goes out on her bike without me I cringe.She's an L plater and slowly beginning to enjoy her time on the road, no thanks to the dickheads up here who go out of their way to make her experiences bad ones.
I've had the barstards do it all,roar past at break neck speed inches from her, tail gate so close theres no room between her and them( they're the ones I like dealing with) Of course this happens when they've pushed in between her and I , I try to maintin a resonable gap between us , so she gets an idea of how far back she should be from the car/s in front, but so many times these damnd Dorklander drivers simply take their god given bit of road, it sickens me to see it and it does make me very edgy when they get between us and start the shenanagins.
As TEC on other organised rides up here I see car drivers, mostly doing the worst possible things behind people with L plates on, it's as if that L means they're fair game for stalkers in cages.
no bull and I kid you not around this neck of the woods it happens all too often.

Sad to hear, but good she is out there riding and gaining experience. :yes:

[Danae]

I haven't booked my restricted test yet but I am able to if I want. I've worn my L-plate the whole time and avoided 2 possible fines after random licence checks. I haven't ridden without it so I don't know if there is any difference between the attitudes of cagers if you leave it off. However I am probably ignorant; I assume that Auckland drivers are always this bad. But when I come across a situation (almost being shunted off the road, T-boned or whatever) it is usually because I have not been seen, not simply because I have an L-plate. Because I have the "i am invisible" mentality, I can avoid being run off the road etc.

For the record, the only time I saw someone in auckland do a headcheck, they had a "think bike" sticker on their rear window.

[GOONR]

....I assume that Auckland drivers are always this bad. But when I come across a situation (almost being shunted off the road, T-boned or whatever) it is usually because I have not been seen, not simply because I have an L-plate. Because I have the "i am invisible" mentality, I can avoid being run off the road etc.

The people at the lights I mentioned earlier must have seen me, I've been in front of them but in the lane next to them. You see them coming in the mirror and by doing a head check, they just keep going till we are side by side just as the lanes start to merge. If there isn't a car in front of me then it isn't an issue, I'm off before it happens. When a car is in front you have to weigh up the options, sometimes it's safer just to let them go and pull back.

I can book my restricted in 3 weeks, I'll let ya know if it changes when I don't have the L on the back. Hope so but doubt it.

[Danae]

When a car is in front you have to weigh up the options, sometimes it's safer just to let them go and pull back.


I pretty much always just let them go. I mean, who's gonna come out better off, the car or my FXR?

[RUSS]

Pitty. I think the fine goes down to $100 from tomorrow and the demerits go up to 35 from 25.

[Patrick]

Pitty. I think the fine goes down to $100 from tomorrow and the demerits go up to 35 from 25.

Think no more. It is fact. 1st December, all graduated license breaches are $100 fines with 35 demerits.

[Cheshire Cat]

Get your restricted!!!!

The hardest part is booking the bloody test!! lol

if you dont pass then youve got something to think about dont you