Two fingers draped over the front brake - or not?

[Tunahunter]

I've been riding for 16 mths now - done a lot of reading and a lot of talking.

One issue which confuses me is whether or not it is more effective to ride with two fingers of the right hand draped over the brake lever - or to hold the accelerator with all the fingers and move the fingers when its time to brake. Both feel pretty OK to me but I haven't experienced a hard out emergency situation yet - so I wonder about it.

I have consulted two sources, both of whom I respect - and their views are the opposite.

Anyone got a view?

:doh:

[OnCam]

usually my first finger is not tucked nicely on the grip but also not over the brake directly either feels natural to me, but they are there almost ready.. not 100% commited to the throttle.. have tried all fingers on the throttle its just not for me, guess whatever you feel comfortable with..

everyone has their style and habbits etc

[crazyhorse]

Whatever you are comfortable doing.

I do abit of both - but depends on the roads you are riding :woohoo:

[ManDownUnder]

It reduces reaction time but each to their own but I'd encourage you to put it in context.

If you're riding on the edge or at higher risk then it's more important than if you are not.

Likewise helmets in my personal opinion. What's the point in spending $1,500 on the best helmet money can buy if you only ever do 70kph? Similar logic used for both scenarios

Also if it's comfortable - do it. It does put you at an advantage in respect of braking times

[CookMySock]

I'll cover the brake where an abstacle may force me to stop or reduce my speed dramatically, otherwise I will swap to a proper bar grip in case I need it. Usually you can steer around something a lot better than you can stop before it, and that is the mode I usually operate in. There is always some space down the side of something, unless you are really unlucky. Slowing down helps too.

I don't think I could ever corner effectively with fingers over the brake lever.

Steve

[Tunahunter]

Thanks for all the comments - they all make sense to me - very helpful

Cheers

[marine0089]

What about your rear break? Do you ride with your foot just about resting on the pedal or hanging back/below/wherever it feels most comfortable. Same would apply.

[Katman]

Around town and in amongst traffic it is a good idea to have a couple of fingers covering the brake lever.

[p.dath]

With regard to holding the steering grip, I tend to vary it. If on the open road and cruising I have all the fingers the throttle.
If doing twisties I tend to have all my fingers on the throttle.
When lane splitting I have one finger around the throttle, and the rest on the brake lever.
When in 50km/h zones I tend to have one or two fingers on the throttle, and the rest on the brake.

So as said previsouly, whatever works best in the situation you are currently in - for you.

With regard to breaking.
If I'm cruising and doing 100km/h on easy roads, I rest the middle of my foot on the peg away from the brake.
If I'm going through twisties I'll put the front of my foot on each peg, and not near the brake per-see.
If I'm travelling around on 50km/h roads I'll put the middle of my foot on the pegs, and near the rear break peddle.

To be honest, I don't normally use the brakes that much unless I'm approaching an intersection or wanting to stop.

[phred]

The instructor I used said Do not cover either the brake or clutch. Both hands on the bar!

[Filterer]

When lane splitting I have one finger around the throttle, and the rest on the brake level.

That's exactly my thoughts - in any situtation where you have the ability to steer around a car go for that as a first option - but when splitting between slow moving vehicles there is often 0 room to go around them so I cover the breaks super-aggressively when there is over 20km of speed differential - otherwise it's pretty much hands on the bars

[sAsLEX]

What about your rear break? Do you ride with your foot just about resting on the pedal or hanging back/below/wherever it feels most comfortable. Same would apply.

Balls of feet on the end of the pegs during any spirited riding.

Rear brake gets touched maybe once a ride resting at the lights when I can't reach the front.

I cover the front with one finger, and tend to only use that one to brake.


The instructor I used said Do not cover either the brake or clutch. Both hands on the bar!

Wonder if he has ever ridden a two stroke?

And even when covering the brake/clutch your hands are still on the bars?!

[FJRider]

Around town and in amongst traffic it is a good idea to have a couple of fingers covering the brake lever.

I agree ... and if alarm bells are ringing in your head about the traffic/area you are in.... Then too ....

[Ronin]

I agree ... and if alarm bells are ringing in your head about the traffic/area you are in.... Then too ....

I ride gripping with all fingers on throttle, brake with two fingers and cover when the situation calls for it.

All about what feels right for you.

[Ducface]

to cover the brake or not to cover the brake...

I've being working throught the same issue.

seems to make sense when filtering, I filter the southern M everyday, you've got reduced options there so if it helps, cool, but you have to be comfortable or more importantly fully aware of what's going on around you, so DONT PRACTICE ANYTHING while filtering, do it on the sunday ride.

Hope it helps -ride safe -ATGATT [dosn't include a blaze]:rockon:

[slofox]

Around town and in amongst traffic it is a good idea to have a couple of fingers covering the brake lever.

Wot 'e said...

I don't cover the brake at all out on the highway - unless there are obvious hazards that might require some action...like fucking SHEEP running in front of you f'rinstance

[FJRider]

I ride gripping with all fingers on throttle, brake with two fingers and cover when the situation calls for it.

All about what feels right for you.

don't grip too hard ... fingers go numb ...

[jrandom]

If you gotta ride around with fingers hovering over the brake lever, you got serious observational problems hey.

[boomer]

attack is the best form of defense... use all ya fat freddies to twist it like a 7 yr old.. :wari:

[Ronin]

don't grip too hard ... fingers go numb ...

That's a whole 'nother thread there mate. My fingers are numb even with the most delicate maiden like grip ever.. :yes:

[Ronin]

If you gotta ride around with fingers hovering over the brake lever, you got serious observational problems hey.

Are you talking about all the time or covering when it's busy?

[sAsLEX]

don't grip too hard ... fingers go numb ...

Fingers ?

[325rocket]

Whatever you are comfortable doing.

I do abit of both - but depends on the roads you are riding :woohoo:

yep thats the one. personally i only ever use one finger when braking unless im on a track anyway. you want to do what feels natural to you. i figure if you have to think it through to much try something else. thats how i see it anyway.

[Katman]

If you gotta ride around with fingers hovering over the brake lever, you got serious observational problems hey.

It's a package deal.

[YellowDog]

I've been riding for 16 mths now - done a lot of reading and a lot of talking.

One issue which confuses me is whether or not it is more effective to ride with two fingers of the right hand draped over the brake lever - or to hold the accelerator with all the fingers and move the fingers when its time to brake. Both feel pretty OK to me but I haven't experienced a hard out emergency situation yet - so I wonder about it.

I have consulted two sources, both of whom I respect - and their views are the opposite.

Anyone got a view?

:doh:
If you have been riding for 16 months and not yet had to make an emergency stop; then you have been riding pretty well.

Don't change anything!

[NordieBoy]

Pointy fingers rest on the clutch and brake levers.
It feels weird to have them all around the grip.

I feel I've got far more control that way.

[george formby]

Their was a poll on how many people ride with the clutch & brake covered recently which made me pay attention to what I do. 2 fingers covering the brake..... subconsciously.

[sAsLEX]

Pointy fingers rest on the clutch and brake levers.
It feels weird to have them all around the grip.

I feel I've got far more control that way.

You ride adventure right?

I cover on the road, and avoid it off on my DRZ as the standing position puts strain on the forearsms trying to cover......

[NordieBoy]

You ride adventure right?

I cover on the road, and avoid it off on my DRZ as the standing position puts strain on the forearsms trying to cover......

Fingers are still there even at the end of a 3-hour x-country race.

[pritch]

In town, in heavy traffic, two fingers covering the brake - and the clutch.

Your undoubtedly wonderful observational skills won't protect you from 4WD mum on the rampage. Or from from the teen fuckwit driving with his glands instead of his brains. You have to do that yourself.

Good luck with that, we all need it.

[IdunBrokdItAgin]

First of all look at your gloves. Most racier (?) gloves have a grip pad on the top of the index and middle fingers. This is to grip the brake/ clutch.
They also usually have a grip pad across the top of the palm. This is to grip throttle.

These type of gloves are designed for two fingers to cover the brake/ clutch. If your gloves aren't right for you preferred style then change your gloves.

Me, I'm a relative noob and still end up covering the brake with four fingers. Trying very hard to break this habit. I am trying to teach myself to cover with two fingers on the brake.

[Thaeos]

I'm not exactly an experienced rider but I would say whatever you are most comfortable with. It would be worse to be distracted because you aren't comfortable with how you are operating the bike than to not follow someone else's opinion of the safest or best way.

[The Stranger]

Four fingers on the brake or four fingers on the throttle.

3 common problems with covering the brake with 2 fingers.
1) On many bikes the lever can be pulled back until it hits the other fingers, this limits braking.
2) Dexterity
3) People in emergency brake situations reasonably frequently just grab the brake if they have 2 fingers on it. This is good of course, what is bad that they frequently forget or omit to drop the throttle, this is bad and usually more that doubles stopping distance.

Wait for it - any minute now I will hear how no one does this.
Yet we see it frequently, invariably from people who just informed us they would never forget to drop the throttle, go figure.

[The Stranger]

I'm not exactly an experienced rider but I would say whatever you are most comfortable with. It would be worse to be distracted because you aren't comfortable with how you are operating the bike than to not follow someone else's opinion of the safest or best way.


I know a guy who spent many months recovering in hospital and has been off work for 12 months now because he did what was comfortable instead of what was right. Had he only used the front brake he would be fine now, still at least he's alive. I know of another guy who went under a truck on the rear brake and it didn't end as well for him.

Sometimes what's comfortable isn't necessarily the best thing to be doing.
In an emergency you will do what you are used to doing. Maybe it is worth learning the right way to do a thing?

[trailblazer]

around town i cover the brake with 2 fingers and on the open road i have a full grip on the throttle.

[jonbuoy]

Two on brake, two on clutch on the Z' adjusted properly the lever is never in danger of coming close to pinching my fingers for normal road riding, might be different on the track. On the CB I have to do three on the brake as the lever (un-adjustable) comes back a fair way and can pinch one of my fingers under heavy braking. I guess it depends on the bike/condition of the brakes and lever setup.

[waitup]

When I started doing Trials I learn to use 2 fingers on clutch and one finger on the brake. This has carried through to my road riding. The only time I take those fingers off and grip the bars with all fingers is on long stretches of road where the there is no need to brake or operate the clutch for a while.

[gatch]

Around town and in amongst traffic it is a good idea to have a couple of fingers covering the brake lever.


I agree ... and if alarm bells are ringing in your head about the traffic/area you are in.... Then too ....


around town i cover the brake with 2 fingers and on the open road i have a full grip on the throttle.

I agree with the above, in town, cover the brake for emergency maneuvers, open road, hold your bar with everything...

[Oakie]

I seem to have a couple of fingers resting on top if the brake in traffic and when approaching intersections but it's not a thing I do consciously. It just happens at the appropriate times without thinking about it. Also happens when the old spidey-sense starts tingling. Left hand also seems to the same for clutch but thats also an unconscious thing.

[crazyhorse]

I agree with the above, in town, cover the brake for emergency maneuvers, open road, hold your bar with everything...

It all depends on whether the open road is full of corners or straights...... its obvious what to do really :whistle:

[junkmanjoe]

im a fingers on the clutch.
as i do a fair bit of off road riding.. its the way ive been taught as a young fella..
some times i got to clutch, brake and power on in a mater of seconds..
it works for me..

JMJ

[BMWST?]

not aware of having fingers over clutch,dont ussually cover brake either,but do so when approaching intersections etc.
Its a bad habit in someways,i would think most bikes require more than two fingers to get max braking effect.If you cant lock the front wheel with two fingers(progresive application) you arent getting max braking effect from two fingers.

[Oakie]

I seem to have a couple of fingers resting on top if the brake in traffic and when approaching intersections but it's not a thing I do consciously. It just happens at the appropriate times without thinking about it.

Wow. Won't go into the details but if I didn't have two fingers resting on the lever this morning I would have been taken out by a guy who suddenly veered into my lane without indicating approaching an intersection.

[molmolmol]

After reading all of the comments here, I take it that the "right" thing to do is to cover 2 fingers over clutch and brake at all times?

When I first started riding, about 7 months ago, I used to cover both clutch and brake at all times but had noticed that it has impacted on my balance/ steering somehow... then later on I somehow felt more natural to not cover them both at all times, and only at specific places and time, e.g. busy roads, traffic lights, intersections.

I have not come across any incidents like a van pulling out from nowhere etc, so I can't really comment on the usefulness of the extra reaction that you can get from the 2 finger cover.

So all I'm asking I guess, is the 2 finger cover at all times - the "right" thing to do? Also, I'm a newbie rider (started out about 7 months ago, and not alot of K's under the belt) , so I'd really like to learn the correct thing to do, as mentioned previously in one of the posts.

Thanks in advance, all you experienced bikers! :yes:

[gammaguy]

I've been riding for 16 mths now - done a lot of reading and a lot of talking.

One issue which confuses me is whether or not it is more effective to ride with two fingers of the right hand draped over the brake lever - or to hold the accelerator with all the fingers and move the fingers when its time to brake. Both feel pretty OK to me but I haven't experienced a hard out emergency situation yet - so I wonder about it.

I have consulted two sources, both of whom I respect - and their views are the opposite.

Anyone got a view?

:doh:

unless cruising out on the open road,i always have a finger over the front brake lever.

It has saved my life before now,and also i make sure my brakes are sharp and "one fingerable"(if there is such a thing):pinch:

[Maha]

My reflex is lightning quick so dont need to drape anything.

[chasio]

Four fingers on the brake or four fingers on the throttle.

3 common problems with covering the brake with 2 fingers.
1) On many bikes the lever can be pulled back until it hits the other fingers, this limits braking.
2) Dexterity
3) People in emergency brake situations reasonably frequently just grab the brake if they have 2 fingers on it. This is good of course, what is bad that they frequently forget or omit to drop the throttle, this is bad and usually more that doubles stopping distance.

Wait for it - any minute now I will hear how no one does this.
Yet we see it frequently, invariably from people who just informed us they would never forget to drop the throttle, go figure.

I took this advice from RRRS (thanks The Stranger and all involved for this) a couple of years ago soon after I started riding. Keeping all 4 fingers together has been working for me since then and I can't remember forgetting to drop the throttle since, either.

I filter around Auckland motorways and in traffic a lot. Four fingers covering the brake and throttle under control of the fleshy base of thumb / palm works well for me. YMMV.

[sAsLEX]

I took this advice from RRRS (thanks The Stranger and all involved for this) a couple of years ago soon after I started riding. Keeping all 4 fingers together has been working for me since then and I can't remember forgetting to drop the throttle since, either.

I filter around Auckland motorways and in traffic a lot. Four fingers covering the brake and throttle under control of the fleshy base of thumb / palm works well for me. YMMV.

and yet you contradict yourself.

The RRRS quote in your reply states finger on the brake or on the throttle, yet you "cover" the brake.

[newbould]

I got a good slapping at RRRS :bash:for covering the brake with 2 fingers the logic being that you need that 1/2 second of rear brake only in emergency stop to get wieght forward and then progressively brake on front. By covering the front the danger is a snatched front only braking which is more likely to lock up the front wheel - less weight on the wheel - full braking force on the brake cf more weight on the front will increase size of contact patch with the ground increased friction mor ebraking before skidmarks.

OTOH David Hough in Proficient motorcycling recommends covering the front brake at all times because that will save you valuable time in getting on the brake.

So I guess the answer is go with what works for you and practice emergency braking lots so that you do the right thing automatically when needed.

Personally I still cover the brake. i will take on board the comment on dropping the throttle - almost failed my wobble test on that one!

[sAsLEX]

I got a good slapping at RRRS :bash:for covering the brake with 2 fingers the logic being that you need that 1/2 second of rear brake only in emergency stop to get wieght forward and then progressively brake on front. By covering the front the danger is a snatched front only braking which is more likely to lock up the front wheel - less weight on the wheel - full braking force on the brake cf more weight on the front will increase size of contact patch with the ground increased friction mor ebraking before skidmarks.




I would argue that using the rear to promote forwards transfer of weight could also lead to a snatched rear and subsequent brown pants moment......

[chasio]

and yet you contradict yourself.

The RRRS quote in your reply states finger on the brake or on the throttle, yet you "cover" the brake.

The quote from The Stranger is for four fingers on brake or four fingers on the throttle and that's what I do, depending on the situation.

What I meant by "covering" was having all four fingers ready on the lever. If by "covering" you understood me to mean two fingers on the lever, then that would seem contradictory, I agree. Thanks for pointing out the possible misunderstanding and I hope that clears up what I meant.

Like I said, the RRRS approach to this has worked well for me for a couple of years. Each to his own. I just opted to take their advice for a lot of things.

Cheers - Chasio

[sinned]

If the brain and fingers are half asleep it aint gonna make a hell of a lot of difference in stopping time regardless of where the fingers are. If you are awake, observant of the the conditions and riding defensively the fingers will move to cover the brake lever as required.

I keep my fingers curled around the heated grips so they are warm and can therefore move quickly when required. Fingers in a half frozen state over the levers are not much use.

[Usarka]

Whatever you do make sure that's also how you practice your emergency stops.

[Tunahunter]

Thanks for that

[sAsLEX]

The quote from The Stranger is for four fingers on brake or four fingers on the throttle and that's what I do, depending on the situation.

What I meant by "covering" was having all four fingers ready on the lever. If by "covering" you understood me to mean two fingers on the lever, then that would seem contradictory, I agree. Thanks for pointing out the possible misunderstanding and I hope that clears up what I meant.

Like I said, the RRRS approach to this has worked well for me for a couple of years. Each to his own. I just opted to take their advice for a lot of things.

Cheers - Chasio

Covering, with any number of fingers, to me suggests fingers out on the lever.

"Covering" with fingers "ready" on the bar, is simply holding the bar.

[neels]

Up until recently I was riding with 2 fingers on the brake (probably too much mountainbiking), but a couple of times lately I've dragged on the lever in a hurry and ended up squashing the other 2 fingers against the grip. Now it's either 4 fingers on the grip or 4 fingers on the brake lever and throttle with my thumb, seems to be working OK so far.

[chasio]

"Covering" with fingers "ready" on the bar, is simply holding the bar.

Lucky I didn't say that, eh :)

[george formby]

Just had a wee flick through the posts after a run to get some muffins this arvo. Most of the time "travelling" I have two fingers resting on the brake lever, not over it. When I'm "trying", braking & accelerating reasonably hard through a series of corners I found myself either on the throttle or on the brake. Nothing in between. I also realised that my intentions & potential hazards cause me to constantly adjust how I'm riding. Body position, covering brakes, speed, distance I'm looking ahead, focusing on areas that are in my peripheral vision, acceleration etc. Their is a lot going on when you actually think about what your doing on the bike & how the enviroment dictates to you. Phew! It's amazing what becomes second nature over the years.

[rustic101]

I've been riding for 16 mths now - done a lot of reading and a lot of talking.

One issue which confuses me is whether or not it is more effective to ride with two fingers of the right hand draped over the brake lever - or to hold the accelerator with all the fingers and move the fingers when its time to brake. Both feel pretty OK to me but I haven't experienced a hard out emergency situation yet - so I wonder about it.

I have consulted two sources, both of whom I respect - and their views are the opposite.

Anyone got a view?

:doh:

ride with one finger extended over each level almost like holding a pistol and light braking is done like that and gear changes too. Only do whole had for heavier braking

[molmolmol]

So what if... say you're going through some twisties in the mountains, do you still cover them while say, leaning the bike through the corner?

Shouldn't it be better to adjust your speed (slow down, brake, change gear) before taking the corner?

Just something that's in my mind atm....

[george formby]

So what if... say you're going through some twisties in the mountains, do you still cover them while say, leaning the bike through the corner?

Shouldn't it be better to adjust your speed (slow down, brake, change gear) before taking the corner?

Just something that's in my mind atm....

Yup, thats what I found in the twistie mountains today, one thing at a time but quickly. Not too quick though, I did'nt want to apply to much G force to my muffins. Nothing worse than blueberries smeared in the crutch of your panniers.:eek5:

[NordieBoy]

So what if... say you're going through some twisties in the mountains, do you still cover them while say, leaning the bike through the corner?

Shouldn't it be better to adjust your speed (slow down, brake, change gear) before taking the corner?

Just something that's in my mind atm....

With me it's not a concious decision to "cover the brakes". That's just what happens when I'm on a bike.
Bum on seat, feet on footpegs, hands on bars and pointy fingers on the clutch and brake.

It feels weird having all the fingers around the grip. Like I've got less control.

[Hitcher]

I always ride with both clutch and brake levers covered. Covering the brake forces me to ride with my wrist up, which stops it cramping.

[rocketman1]

I weigh what I'm doing. If I following another bike / cage a bit close them two fingers on the brake.
Any fast cornering, travelling, all fingers on the bars.
Plus it gets a bit uncomfortable for me to spend hours with fingers over the brakes.
Around the city in traffic always two fingers on the brake and rear brake ready to go and in a lower more controllable gear.

[molmolmol]

With me it's not a concious decision to "cover the brakes". That's just what happens when I'm on a bike.
Bum on seat, feet on footpegs, hands on bars and pointy fingers on the clutch and brake.

It feels weird having all the fingers around the grip. Like I've got less control.


This second nature seems to come from riders with dirt bikes experience, which I do understand that you use alot of lever controls, and of course will carry on to whatever bike you're riding regardless of the situation -

but another poster had previously mentioned- "what seems comfortable, may not be right"

So I guess, coming in as a newbie perspective, is it the right thing to cover the levers at all times or to what's more second nature to you?

I've previously mentioned that I used to cover them when I first started riding, but seemed to have lost that habit over time. I do find it that if I cover the levers at sharp corners and twisties, I dont really feel that comfortable going through it compared to if I didnt cover them.

Hmmm....I'd like to hear more suggestions/comments as to what you experienced bikers would have. :yes:

[sAsLEX]

This second nature seems to come from riders with dirt bikes experience, which I do understand that you use alot of lever controls,
\


I find I use the clutch and the front brake very seldom in a lot of off road riding...... the front brake a lot more than the clutch

[NordieBoy]

This second nature seems to come from riders with dirt bikes experience, which I do understand that you use alot of lever controls, and of course will carry on to whatever bike you're riding regardless of the situation

Actually from road experience.

[Tunahunter]

Thanks for that - I've had some great advice - all very sensible

[AxN]

Just from what I have been taught at riding courses:

Grip the throttle when riding and when braking close throttle and use two fingers to operate front brake.

[kwaka_crasher]

Generally all fingers hovering over both the levers around town. Open road - none.

[chasio]

BTW braking was covered at length in a long debate when the wiki was first going up. See the thread here. (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=105129)

It is noticeable that the resulting wiki article (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/wiki/Braking)has been pulled, however, as follows:

17:47, 6 September 2009 SpankMe (Talk | contribs) deleted "Braking" ‎ (Author request: content was: 'This article has been written with a view of braking primarily with on-road bikes. Off-road bikes may have quite a different procedure to achieve the best result (stopping in the shortest distance). == Emergency Braking)

The original thread may still be worthwhile further reading.

Cheers - Chasio

[gatch]

It all depends on whether the open road is full of corners or straights...... its obvious what to do really :whistle:

Hold your bar with everything ?

Or is that hold your bar with one hand, and two fingers draped on the

[Ducky848]

I cover the brake with two fingers at all times. Its completely natural and just happens when I get on a bike. I dont need to change this to suit cornering or fanging, I just don't need that much leverage or death-grip to control my bike effectively.
After reading this thread I tried riding with all fingers wrapped on throttle and I found it more difficult to hold a consistant throttle opening and closing throttle to reach the brake takes a lot longer.

I have significant off-road and on-road experience. On the dirt bikes I cover both the brake and clutch.....but not the clutch on road bikes.....odd but its just what I do naturally.

[PrincessBandit]

Generally all fingers hovering over both the levers around town. Open road - none.

Yeah, what he said. Fingers draped over brake and clutch while going through town or slow crawls.