Valve springs in forks thread

[Eddieb]

Where is that thread about using Valve springs in the forks? I want to have a read and can't find it now.

Ta.

[Waihou Thumper]

Where is that thread about using Valve springs in the forks? I want to have a read and can't find it now.

Ta.


http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=91148&highlight=forks%2C+valve+springs

[Eddieb]

Nope, not that one.

I thought it was Nordie doing bodgy back yard upgrades using Mitsubishi valve springs in place of the spacer each each forkleg. I've done heaps of searches but no luck.

There's a reference to it in this this comment: http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showpost.php?p=1129273572&postcount=80
I've been right through Nordie's thread cause I thought it was there but either I'm blind or it's somewhere else hiding.

Come on Nordie, I know you have a separate monitor open on KB all day.

[Oscar]

Jeez, this takes me back.
The hot wheeze for yer XR200A was to put Ford Escort 1600 interior valve springs in the forks...

[JATZ]

Try the KLR thread, they're cheap bastards.... :niceone:

[Eddieb]

Thats where the link i posted up above goes.

Basically I want to know what effect it's supposed to have and what the opinions were of those who have done it on bigger bikes.

[NordieBoy]

Basically I want to know what effect it's supposed to have and what the opinions were of those who have done it on bigger bikes.

Preloads the forks a bit more but has a little give as opposed to solid spacers.

[Oscar]

I always wondered what happened in the Ford Factory in England.
Somewhere in Dagenham:

"...ere, Bert - ow come those Kiwi's use so any interior valve springs?"

"...just interior ones?"

?

[Woodman]

It was in the klr thread,(somewhere) I put the valve springs off my benelli in Hmine then padmei put some Diamante springs in his. He fell off twice and I thought it improved mine a lot. Took mine out when fitted the intimaterors, but am now gonna put them back in as well as i want to stiffen the front up more.
My theory is that they are only actually a spacer when fully compressed and the rest of the time they are a spring, but to be honest you could put an earwig in klr forks and it would be an improvement over stock.

[Eddieb]

It was in the klr thread,(somewhere) I put the valve springs off my benelli in Hmine then padmei put some Diamante springs in his. He fell off twice and I thought it improved mine a lot. Took mine out when fitted the intimaterors, but am now gonna put them back in as well as i want to stiffen the front up more.
My theory is that they are only actually a spacer when fully compressed and the rest of the time they are a spring, but to be honest you could put an earwig in klr forks and it would be an improvement over stock.

Cheers, I suspect the earwig would be an improvement in my GS forks as well so I might see if I can find someone with some springs lying around.

[Padmei]

I originally put some V3000 springs on top of the originals & seemed to give the front end a bit better feel.

I just replaced the cutdown spacers with the original spacers in the forks on top of the uselessnators to compress the existing springs. I'm waiting for it to stop raining to see if it makes any difference.

[NordieBoy]

Measure the diameter of the uselessnators or I'll do it one day when you're out.

[Padmei]

I measured them the other nite & they seemed the same diameter as the inside of the sleeve. The skirt slides tightly to the sleeve so I think they're the correct size. After riding last nite I can guarantee that they're not working. I'm wondering if there is a difference between different 5w oils (being a KLR owner I bought the cheapest kind)

[warewolf]

I'm wondering if there is a difference between different 5w oilsYes, and it can be huge, as in change more than 5W vs another flavour. The SAE W standard is for engines, not suspension. Although not in common retail use, the more correct rating for suspension fluid is Centistokes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centistokes).

Quite some discussion on this very point over in the Suspension forum. There was even a chart converting many common oils to centistokes, made for very interesting reading (it's in this post (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?p=1129461150)).

Or in the words of Dr Robert:

5 weight etc is an SAE ( motor oil ) rating and frankly is very misleading. For example 5 weight Silkolene has the same flow rate through a fixed size orifice at the same temperature as 10 weight Maxima. Centistroke rating at 40 degrees C is the only true flow rate indicator, the very first prerequisite for at least matching of suspension fluids. Sadly most suppliers of suspension oil do not include that on the bottle label and jolly well should.....

[NordieBoy]

I measured them the other nite & they seemed the same diameter as the inside of the sleeve. The skirt slides tightly to the sleeve so I think they're the correct size. After riding last nite I can guarantee that they're not working. I'm wondering if there is a difference between different 5w oils (being a KLR owner I bought the cheapest kind)

Could be the oil.
Would probably have the same effect you're getting if there was 2.5W (or a light 5W) in there...

[Padmei]

Thanks for the feedback.
Bugger now it's another $50 to experiment with.

What oil do you guys use with your expensivators? I've been using castrol fork oil 5 ISO15. It says on the back sae viscosity ranges vary widely and the iso relates to oil vis at 40degrees.

So does this mean the oil gets 'thicker' at 40 degrees & doesn't flow as well or the other way around & get too thin?

How long would it take to get up to temp & I assume the more they're working over rough ground the hotter they'll get with friction?

Should I just fill the buggers with more oil? What would happen - just seem harsher as WW explained above?

hmmm

[NordieBoy]

It would only feel harsher approching full travel.
I'm using Spectro 5w or something cheap from the Suzuki shop.

[Woodman]

Thanks for the feedback.
Bugger now it's another $50 to experiment with.

What oil do you guys use with your expensivators? I've been using castrol fork oil 5 ISO15. It says on the back sae viscosity ranges vary widely and the iso relates to oil vis at 40degrees.

So does this mean the oil gets 'thicker' at 40 degrees & doesn't flow as well or the other way around & get too thin?

How long would it take to get up to temp & I assume the more they're working over rough ground the hotter they'll get with friction?

Should I just fill the buggers with more oil? What would happen - just seem harsher as WW explained above?

hmmm

I used castrol 5w as well. Slightly off topic but viscosity works like this:
Oil does not get thicker as it gets hotter, basically the higher the number the thicker it will be at a given temperature, but never thicker than when cold.When there is a multigrade engine oil e.g.10w40 the first number relates to the relative thickness when it is cold so a 10w will flow faster at start up than a 15w. The second number relates to the thickness at operating temperature so a 30w will be thinner than a 40w when an engine is running at the same temperature. so a 40w offers better protection than a 30w at operating temperature cos its thicker.

Woner what would happen if you put a multigrade oil in your forks.

[NordieBoy]

Woner what would happen if you put a multigrade oil in your forks.

You'd want a 10w5 reverse multigrade oil :D

Firmer damping when you're hammering it and it's hotter. More supple when you slow down...

[dino3310]

cool now i know, always wondered what the relationship between the 2 were

[warewolf]

You'd want a 10w5 reverse multigrade oil :D

Firmer damping when you're hammering it and it's hotter. More supple when you slow down...You sure 'bout that? The numbers are cold-W-hot, surely you want 5W10.

Yes, there are multi-grade oils; IIRC I tried a 15w20 in the Triumph years ago, but it was just too damn heavy - felt like straight 20 when cold (15 is standard).

Also Castrol suggest you can mix'n'match ratings to give fine control, eg half 5 half 10 will give 7.5.

Hmmm interesting on the Castrol 5w being 'light'. That's what I'm using now, and lately I've found my forks much less harsh, much less firm, and have been able to set the clickers at close to factory settings. I used to have the clickers backed off a long way to try to get some compliance. Now I'm thinking the 'lighter' 5W Castrol suits my style.

If you look at the chart I quoted earlier, Spectro's 5W (what I used to use) has a centistoke rating at the high end for 5Ws, at 21.60, just shy of Ohlins #10. Maxima 5W is 15.90, down near Ohlins #5 at 16.50, the lower end. 15-ish to 20+ is more than 33% increase - that's a huge difference!! It's quite foreseeable that the Castrol 5W is down near 15.00.

[NordieBoy]

You sure 'bout that? The numbers are cold-W-hot, surely you want 5W10.

I don't know :confused:

Something that's thicker when it's hot.