Call to WAR

[StoneY]

Ok

I spent enough time being nice
Enough time being sane
Enough time playing the mediocre line and advising calm

FUCK THAT

140, really?
Thats what we expected to cough up?

NO
FUCK NO, no WAY, no chance

ACC restored to nothing less than Sir Owens original concept
Who is in with me?

[Laxi]

that was what I went to all the protests for! we've got nothing to lose, i'm in till the end

[gwigs]

I,m still up for any action...I want the same levies as car drivers.
Fuck em it isnt good enough.

[mikeey01]

rgr rgr I hear ya and copy, over.

[Headbanger]

I would, But its past my bedtime.

Can we make war tomorrow?

[scissorhands]

I will attend further protests, bastards. Big bikes should not have to pay more, thats a faulty syllogism, heavy=4xmore accidents.

And especially unfair to those experienced bikers who have been around a while and have not binned for decades.

Meanwhile noobs on scooters and doing the 'fall of in the first year' paying a much smaller levy, then exiting biking after ruining the stats for the regulars.

Noobs should have worn the brunt of the increase, (not heavy bikes)discounted when safety course attended. They can never get it right those fuckwits in the beehive.

[Headbanger]

Well then, I guess not.

Seems my invitation to make war has been withdrawn.

[jafar]

I would, But its past my bedtime.

Can we make war tomorrow?

Tomorrow is Saturday, I have to mow the lawns then , can we make war Sunday instead ?:devil2:

[Bren]

Fuck yeah...I AM STILL WAY PISSED OFF!!!!

We have to pay more because retard car drivers are too lazy to see us...put it on the filthy fucking cars!

[Bald Eagle]

They though 6000 hairy neanderthall bikers where scary wait till we lead 20000 pissed of kiwis with a hundered bikes along Lambton Quay and straight onto that front lawn again.

ACC aint broke or broken, don;t fix it and leave it the fuck alone.

[jafar]

Fuck yeah...I AM STILL WAY PISSED OFF!!!!

We have to pay more because retard car drivers are too lazy to see us...put it on the filthy fucking cars!

Why just the cars ?

What about all the people that play contact sport?

The people that don't contribute but are happy to take the payout when they have an injury?

How about getting all the historical cases paid by WINZ ?

Have a cleanup on ACC bludgers that have milked the system for years & continue to do so.

[triumphnz]

Wtf has the cc of your motorcycle got to do with your risk equals rego hike on larger cc motorcycles they dont do it to cars on hp or kw figures so why is my 1986 triumph 750cc lucky to make 45 hp paying more than my partners suzuki 250cc bandit with 45hp and a lot faster on a L plate,and why am i paying more than a L plater on my rego after 20 plus years of riding .

[jafar]

Wtf has the cc of your motorcycle got to do with your risk equals rego hike on larger cc motorcycles they dont do it to cars on hp or kw figures so why is my 1986 triumph 750cc lucky to make 45 hp paying more than my partners suzuki 250cc bandit with 45hp and a lot faster on a L plate,and why am i paying more than a L plater on my rego after 20 plus years of riding .

The other thing I can't figure out is how come fixing a broken motorcyclists injuries is somehow cheaper than fixing a car drivers ??
Surely if you have to fix a broken arm or leg then it would cost much the same regardless of how the injury happened:clap:

[cowboyz]

Fuck yeah...I AM STILL WAY PISSED OFF!!!!

We have to pay more because retard car drivers are too lazy to see us...put it on the filthy fucking cars!


hey! im a car owner! getting back to the NO FAULT thing............. remember? ACC has forgotten,,.. time to remind them.

[spacemonkey]

Yep count me in for more putting the boot into Nick fuckwit smith. :devil2:

[Ronin]

I would, But its past my bedtime.

Can we make war tomorrow?

Was I married to you?


Oh, you said war.


As you were.

[shrub]

The other thing I can't figure out is how come fixing a broken motorcyclists injuries is somehow cheaper than fixing a car drivers ??
Surely if you have to fix a broken arm or leg then it would cost much the same regardless of how the injury happened:clap:

Car injuries usually involve being crushed by sharp pieces of metal and glass whereas a lot of bike injuries simply involved sliding along the road wearing leather.

[Kiwi Graham]

What has happened is what we expected to happen,
A proposed ridiculously high increase reduced to a very high increase.
Maintainng the Woodhouse principals with parity for road users and not 'targeting' minorities is what it should be.

I'm in.

[ajturbo]

ok boss........ lead us...

[Nasty]

Wellington has a number of actions planned ... and will continue ... posters have been changed ...

latest call for rises is already there against workers

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/3149840/ACC-levies-may-need-to-rise-again

[knuckles24]

in till the end stoney

[naphazoline]

Ok

I spent enough time being nice
Enough time being sane
Enough time playing the mediocre line and advising calm

FUCK THAT

140, really?
Thats what we expected to cough up?

NO
FUCK NO, no WAY, no chance

ACC restored to nothing less than Sir Owens original concept
Who is in with me?

I'm KEEN as,but what do you propose?

They're obviously not going to listen to "PEACEFUL PROTESTS".
If you think they're going to take notice of "RATTLING OUR SABRE'S",well WE MIGHT AS WELL CONCEDE TO THEM!

They're only going to listen,if we start to disrupt their lives,or shut/block the cities.
I reckon public support wont have waned either,seeing as they have been targeted aswell.

Someone at work suggested that a group of bikers should circle parliament constantly on the last day of their (politicians),working week so they can't go home.
As one group circles,another stands by to relieve the circulating group,so there's a constant flow of bikes.

All i know,is that it's no good sending out IDLE THREATS,that avenue has been exhausted IMO.

[Pixie]

Me..........

[duckonin]

Ok

I spent enough time being nice
Enough time being sane
Enough time playing the mediocre line and advising calm

FUCK THAT

140, really?
Thats what we expected to cough up?

NO
FUCK NO, no WAY, no chance

ACC restored to nothing less than Sir Owens original concept
Who is in with me?

My hand is up..

[Trudes]

Bring it.:2guns:

[avgas]

Well its quite simple - they want to treat this a an insurance co........then money is the only way you will make them listen.

Rego went on hold last night. Lets choke em.

[chanceyy]

still in & protest actions still organised for palmy on the 19th, actually it seems there a number of other protest around the country for this date

yes just need to change the info on the flyers & agree with ixion its still about the principal not just the money, time to change the focus, involve others who are affected

[Ms Piggy]

They though 6000 hairy neanderthall bikers where scary
Speak for yourself :p I shaved my legs especially for the occasion!

I'm with you StoneY and I am more than a little cross!

p.s Gosh you boys are up late!

[jedi]

I'm in and I think most of the public will be behind us, car owners , employees, employers are all being hit. Which just happens to make me fall into all of the above .
NZ Herald claims $1300 for each of us in their article today.

This time I'm bringing a chainsaw and petrol lol.:eek:

[twotyred]

agreed,one bike on hold alreday,other goes on hold when it runs out in a week.

I will be registering my bikes for VERY short periods(like two weeks to go away on)
I will NEVER pre-pay a years worth again... never made much sense anyway

[NONONO]

and me..fuck the Nats

[naphazoline]

Well its quite simple - they want to treat this a an insurance co........then money is the only way you will make them listen.

Rego went on hold last night. Lets choke em.

BIG +1

I'm getting a rego in march,and putting it on hold indefinately.

[BoristheBiter]

Count me in.

Should have done this in the first place.

most of use have another bike and car so we get it just as bad.

its time it was sorted out, no more pussy footing around time to let people know what it would be like if we were all in cages all the time

Now thats a horrible thought.

[short-circuit]

and me..fuck the Nats

Seconded. I'm in for the long haul.

[Mom]

I have reinforced my soap box, I am in!

[yungatart]

Sent off my first lot of emails already.

I'm in!
There are principles at stake here, Woodhouse principles!!

[Ducface]

I'm just working out my options here. [other that paying]

what's the fine for getting caught without rego.

having never been pulled over in 5 yrs.......

[BoristheBiter]

I'm just working out my options here. [other that paying]

what's the fine for getting caught without rego.

having never been pulled over in 5 yrs.......

fine is $200, no demerits.

still covered by some insurance company's

[FastBikeGear]

The increases are outrageous.

We need to send a message out that we have not won.
We have not been given a reprieve
The increases are not equitable
The increases are not fair.

I think the press and public need to see a reaction from us today!

This needs to then be followed up by some more protest action.

I think the best reaction we can manage today is for every single person who is unhappy to write a letter to the teh Dominion, The Hearld and their local paper to show that we are not happy.

Can I suggest that people post copies of their letters here.

[CookMySock]

It's unfortunate that we've already played our best card...

Steve

[Mom]

It's unfortunate that we've already played our best card...

Steve

Far out you talk some shit! We have only just begun.

[Yow Ling]

Far out you talk some shit! We have only just begun.

I think hes right, the bronz guy with bad teeth said on the news the battle was won. Everyone thinks you are happy. the ship is on its way to the bottom as far as the media is concerned.

[spookytooth]

time and place is all i need. Will be there

[naphazoline]

I think hes right, the bronz guy with bad teeth said on the news the battle was won. Everyone thinks you are happy. the ship is on its way to the bottom as far as the media is concerned.

And you believe that shit?

Well then.....If some people don't like it,they can be left behind.

We don't need BRONZ,or any other organisation to help organise protests.
We also don't need their permission.

If people haven't got the balls to stand up to the people our taxes go to,(In other words,the people who work for us!),then they might as well get prepared to get walked all over on any future issues that WILL arise.

If you believe the media,then you're already doomed!

[gwigs]

I think hes right, the bronz guy with bad teeth said on the news the battle was won. Everyone thinks you are happy. the ship is on its way to the bottom as far as the media is concerned.

Oh the media will be interested if we start clogging up the roads and bringing cities to a halt.This isnt over at all as far as I,m concerned.I,m up for causing disruption ,we asked nicely, now its time to really make our presence known.

[been_there]

Not happy and don't except the shit they are trying to pull never have and never will.
No more Mr nice guy...need to up the ante, but how?

[mashman]

Would it be worth trying to" interact" with the guy that does the live weather in the mornings on 1?

[Karl08]

The Mighty GN proudly parked alongside other marshals bikes, and will continue to "fight"

Here's hoping not too many riders just roll over and accept this latest news from ACC.

Time and Place- we will be there (plus I will drag others along).

The mighty GN is not loud bike, nor is it a high performance machine- but its owner as been on more protests (peaceful and otherwise) than Tiger has had "transgressions".

Ready and willing

[oldrider]

agreed,one bike on hold alreday,other goes on hold when it runs out in a week.

I will be registering my bikes for VERY short periods(like two weeks to go away on)
I will NEVER pre-pay a years worth again... never made much sense anyway

Interesting approach that, total number of bikes x shortest period of rego, must surely test their systems!

Bling sent for that idea! Worth a shot, just do it quietly and test the reaction! :done: as far as I am concerned anyway.

[oldrider]

and me..fuck the Nats

NONONO, the others will just try to use us for political gain and then shit on us,...... fuck them "all"! :shifty:

[duckonin]

It's unfortunate that we've already played our best card...

Steve

:doh:NOT BY A LONG SHOT STEVE!!!!!!! It is going to happen again big time :soon:

[2wheeldrifter]

ROUND TWO - Car clubs... How many cars clubs are there around?? Classic cars, Mustang, Holden, Rotaries , Hot rods etc... There must be someone here who's in or knows guys and gals in thse clubs to drum up support. And even Bikeoi sending emails to these clubs presidents?

Just throwin that in the mix, may have been siad before, but feel now with the latest news of the rise's some are willing to take it and us as a whole has weakened.

With other road user groups would just help further everyone's discontent for any acc rise.

[merlin]

I'm definitely in for some action, it just seems that there is no one who wants to/can step up to organise anything concrete...I certainly know, I'm not that person.

From the article link in a previous post:

"Peter McIntosh, president of the 4000-member Ulysses Club for motorcyclists, said the lower levy rises represented a victory.

"They're much better than we expected."

Who is this guy?....I suggest we find him and knock some sense into him! It's people like this that present a spineless picture of our motorcycle community, which in turn suggests that we are happy with the increases...

ARE WE?! I don't think so!

I believe our fight is about equality...across the board, no exceptions

[duckonin]

Oh the media will be interested if we start clogging up the roads and bringing cities to a halt.This isnt over at all as far as I,m concerned.I,m up for causing disruption ,we asked nicely, now its time to really make our presence known.

Auckland motorway and Narunga ( well Welly gorge) bloked by bikes fuck most of NZ stands still, untill it is cleared..Motorways are the ones to target and in the heat of the day ..Just take a big waterbag..

[Laxi]

It's unfortunate that we've already played our best card...

Steve

how do you figure that? at the bikeoi 7000+ bikes came off the motorway, parked nice and orderly at the stadium,9000+ walked to parliament,then got back on their bikes and 90% of them got strieght back on the motorway again! next time I say we get off at the terrace tunnel go strieght through the middle of the CBD and use molsworth street as our own bike park, I'm over this pc bull next time NO consultation with police or council and get other affected groups involved! if we can get 20'000 to parliament the CBD is coming to a stand still anyway

[Bald Eagle]

It's unfortunate that we've already played our best card...

Steve

We just sent them a polite message with lots of advance consultation, that was an old fashioned visitor calling card.

Next time we arrive on our terms and in much larger numbers.

[MSTRS]

I'm definitely in for some action, it just seems that there is no one who wants to/can step up to organise anything concrete...Are you paying attention? Who started this particular thread?


I
"Peter McIntosh, "Spouting a load of absolute bollocks"

Who is this guy?....

This is the guy that the media loves, that they believe who tacitly 'speaks for all bikers'.
This is the guy who wanted nothing to do with protests and once they were organised jumped in to grab some glory.
This is the guy that Nick the Prick refers to when he talks about having meaningful dialogue with bikers.
This guy is NOT our friend.
This guy is NOT to be trusted.

[Katman]

Oh the media will be interested if we start clogging up the roads and bringing cities to a halt.This isnt over at all as far as I,m concerned.I,m up for causing disruption ,we asked nicely, now its time to really make our presence known.

Why set about alienating the general public now?

Simply by refusing to pay our rego we can force the governments hand without losing any public support.

In fact, the public are more likely to flock to our cause by thinking "well if they're not going to pay, I'll be fucked if I'm going to".

[oldrider]

Why set about alienating the general public now?

Simply by refusing to pay our rego we can force the governments hand without losing any public support.

In fact, the public are more likely to flock to our cause thinking "well if they're not going to pay, I'll be fucked if I'm going to".

Are you a member of the AA executive or something?

No registration!

Officially no bikes on NZ roads!

AA Mission accomplished! :doh:

[Ender EnZed]

I will be registering my bikes for VERY short periods(like two weeks to go away on)

I think there's a 3 month minimum. I'll be leaving it hold.

And I'm all for further protests.

[light]

I have a question.... Why doesnt everyone go protest in their cars?

Just think... 5000 cars converge on a city center? Sure I realise it is a bike protest but imagine the Impact of driving that many cars into wellington.

Wear your leathers and take your helmuts put signs on the cars etc. Would make a huge impact imo.

[Bald Eagle]

I have a question.... Why doesnt everyone go protest in their cars?

Just think... 5000 cars converge on a city center? Sure I realise it is a bike protest but imagine the Impact of driving that many cars into wellington.

Wear your leathers and take your helmuts put signs on the cars etc. Would make a huge impact imo.

Only problem is I don't have a car.:laugh:

[StoneY]

I have a question.... Why doesnt everyone go protest in their cars?

Just think... 5000 cars converge on a city center? Sure I realise it is a bike protest but imagine the Impact of driving that many cars into wellington.

Wear your leathers and take your helmuts put signs on the cars etc. Would make a huge impact imo.

That has been suggested a number of times
Right now, while I dont feel very friendly to anyone at all (hungover sadly) I would say YEAH!

But reality is that will cause us more bad blood than good, and the public are more on our side than ever right now, so lets avoid pissing off Joe too much, hes the guy we are fighting for!

I still remain active in the regional protests, but still caution not to piss of Joe Public, we need him!

February 19 looking like a good date to hit them with 20,000 people or more

radio interview comin up....watch this space

[huff3r]

I'm in for the Woodhouse principles!

[glegge]

+1, in for the long haul..

[BoristheBiter]

Just say where, when and for how long.

[BMWST?]

i cant explain why i am so pissed off with this....I can afford it,and i know the numbers will not be in our favour...BUT i am with you all the way Mr Stone Man.When do the pollies knock of for xmas?

[riffer]

Yeah I'm not happy either. While I was worried about the level of increases, and I'm pleased they're not going to be so high (not half as pleased as Mrs riffer) it's still the small part of the picture.

ACC and Nick Smith have now introduced the concept of differential rates into ACC, based on victim-pays. And that's a major change as far as I'm concerned.

It's a complete violation of the Woodhouse principles and represents an abandonment of the original idea of ACC.

[riffer]

And as for Ulysses, I think we need to accept that they've well and truly been taken over by the affluent motorcycle crowd; the lawyers, doctors, accountants and dentists, who can afford the expensive bikes, and levies, for whom the motorcycle represents a plaything, something for recreational purposes.

And in such they've become irrelevant to the traditional bikers like myself; the ones for whom the bike is transport, it's freedom, its a lifestyle choice.

Fuck them; they don't speak for me. I was hoping that throwing my lot in with Bronz was going to make a difference, and Monday's meeting at the Parrot and Jigger was a good start.

I think that the Welly Branches ideology may not gel to well with the National Executive now Brett. Or are you suggesting we look at something different now?

[silverbak]

Im in for the long haul too. I personally feel like we will continue to be screwed and lied to so we need to be active. All fantastic and sensible ways to structure this levy have been completely ignored. At the end of the day its a political move by the nats and will continue to pushed and pushed and framed to suit them. We are just the unfortunate few at the front of the queue. Does the rest of NZ know that it is affecting everyone and not just bikers ? Any further protests need to bring in all other people and action groups.
At the end of the day, i feel let down by this govt, lied to and shat on. ACC should thank me for avoiding watching the 6 oclock news last night, if i had i would have ram raided my tv screen with my head if the dick smith appeared... war is on..

[MSTRS]

Peace in our time? Not fecking likely...this is my 'declaration of war' on the Prick.

So, our prediction is made real. Levy increases, sizeable but not as much as first mooted. Did you think that we would be happy with that?

We told you, in our thousands, on November 17th, just what we thought of any increases targeting motorcycles. We told you why we thought that way. We've told you in endless communications, direct and indirect. We told ACC in our submissions (you know, the ones you said at Tamaki Yacht Club that you "Didn't care about"). We told you that we knew about the lies you were telling the country. We told you that we knew the true figures, without statistical spin, and we told you what those figures were. We told you that we knew exactly what you were planning. We've told every single MP the same thing.

We told you that we were not fooled, and that what we were hearing from you was BULLSHIT.

You, on the other hand, have proved that you weren't listening. You've pegged back the increase in an effort to 'look good' and hope we'll go away. And yet you persist with the lies and spin doctoring.

I have always been a National/Act voter, but not any more. I never voted over any single issue. But this issue is big enough to overshadow all other considerations. With the help of your 'grey men', you have alienated me and my family. A feat that no-one in your party has ever managed. And I am but one of thousands that thinks that way.

A prediction for you: -

More, and bigger protests. Other targeted user groups are on 'our' side and will be joining with us. The public, with few exceptions, are on 'our' side, so they'll be joining us too. This country does not want what you are planning. And this country is going to make sure that you know it.

Are you ready for that?

Enjoy the brief respite the Christmas break will afford you.

[Toaster]

Fuck yeah...I AM STILL WAY PISSED OFF!!!!

We have to pay more because retard car drivers are too lazy to see us...put it on the filthy fucking cars!

Exactly!


Toaster is always up for WAR.

Has anyone seen my claymore? I left it set up in the garden somewhere......

[StoneY]

MSTRS that rocks
I have distributed this around, waiting on a radio plug too....

'My name is Brent Hutchison

A few weeks ago we helped organize getting around 9,500 bikers to Parliament to refute ACC's underhanded management of the ACC levy increases

It seems the Government did not get the message so we are going to come back and show them that we are serious in our concerns

However, this time: In February we will show this with much larger numbers
We are bringing Unions, Universities, Abuse support groups, and anyone else that wishes to come along because this is a public asset and it belongs to all of us, its not just Bikers that are being hit

I also have a few basic points to make regarding the ACC situation

Points:

ACC has blamed Motorcyclists for the car levy increase, how can they do this, when they say they are a NO Fault system ( Where do they get their information from ) Telling the public it’s the fault of bikers is an outright fabrication

ACC is not broke, it banked over a billion more than it paid out last year in claims
There is NO need for any increase at all on any motor vehicles (bikes or cars), it’s a mandate to have ACC made ready for sale

EVERY New Zealander (every worker that is) faces up to 300$ extra in workplace levy’s, employers will be hit even harder as their fund is uncapped
This is no longer about just bikers, we said, ‘who’s next’ well guess what New Zealand, …….its YOU!

ACC is unique, if we lose it we become another America full of Ambulance chasing litigators, and we lose a national treasure, fault free protection of the entire population, especially the workforce'

[MSTRS]

MSTRS that rocks...


Cheers. Yours is not too shabby either...


I have had one reply (predictably, from Chris Tremain, spouting the partyline BULLSHIT)

Thanks for your email John.
Your position is clear on this issue.
It is an issue where we will continue to differ albeit the position we have come to in my opinion shows that we have listened. Leaving levies in the position they were was not realistic or sustainable.
Kind regards,
Chris Tremain

I offered him a tailor-made serve...

Thanks for your reply. Whatever our 'differing opinion', the fact remains that your govt has chosen to separate motorcycles from the motorpool and levy them on a capacity basis that has little or no bearing on the truth of accident stats. Further to that, the fact that you continue to defend this postion in the basis that levy rates were not realistic nor sustainable...this simply says that you (Nick Smith with the backing of [all?] National MPs) were not listening. ACC is no longer what was designed and introduced in 1974. The splitting of the fund into separate pools should have had NZ seeing the writing on the wall for this unique institution. We see it now. I'm surprised that you don't see that it's strength lay in everyone 'subsidising' everyone else. But now, with smaller pools to draw off, the supposed inequities are large indeed. But using your own argument means that we'll be seeing levies for rugby, cycling, mountaineering, skiing, bowls, etc...won't we? And if not, why not? Motorcyclists have been singled out. Is that because we're an Easy Target?
I remain hopeful that some party members, you included, will see this issue for what it is, and object alongside us as a matter of conscience.
Regards

[scracha]

Nice reply mstrs. Cripes...how much was the levvy just 5 years ago? Talk about inflation.

[meowmix]

Those letters are very well written, and I agree wholly with the idea. As will many others.
Thats one for Northland, lets get this done!

[glegge]

just a quick reminder, if you have not watched this all the way through, may i suggest you do?
http://www.3news.co.nz/ACC-levy-hike-officially-announced-/tabid/370/articleID/133569/cat/67/Default.aspx

hey, know your enemy..

but honestly, i know it's boring - but it really is worth watching right through.

[Drogen Omen]

so what we gona do about it...?

1 - clog the motorways riding at 40kms all the way into town at rush hour??? i like this one...

2 - ride in force to Westfeild Queensgate on a Saturday morning and take up 1 park per bike??? i like this one also...

3 - sit artound and do nothing and bitch and moan from our pc's about acc crap and that homo Dr Nick Shitter??? i don't like this idea...

[Nasty]

so what we gona do about it...?

1 - clog the motorways riding at 40kms all the way into town at rush hour??? i like this one...

2 - ride in force to Westfeild Queensgate on a Saturday morning and take up 1 park per bike??? i like this one also...

3 - sit artound and do nothing and bitch and moan from our pc's about acc crap and that homo Dr Nick Shitter??? i don't like this idea...

Come with us to Carterton on Sunday for the Nats christmas party.

Then next saturday to the Park in at oriental parade .. both events are in the calander.

I won't get involved with pissing off the public ... but am more than happy to educate them .... they are our allys and I think now they realise it more as it is more than public that their pockets are badly affected as well.

[What?]

I'm with you all the way, Mr Stoneman.

This fight is going to get nasty now. At least, it needs to in order to achieve anything. PC and friendly just isn't going to do it, BUT I will never support closing down motorways etc; that will just piss Joe P off and do us no good at all. Closing down ACC offices... now that might be a different matter altogether.
And rego going on hold is a done deal unless the Prick comes to his senses before it expires. Tui...

And the time for writing to MP's is pretty-well over. Make an appointment to go and see your local polly, no matter what party it is a member of. Imagine how long we can book up all their constituent time for, to chew them out on the same issue!

[centaurus]

I'm with you StoneY.

I think the time for nice and peaceful meetings on the weekends by various cafes has ended. i agree that we need joe public on our side but you can't make an omlette without breaking some eggs. So far we bikers have been standing (almost) alone. The only way to get people out of their apathy is to force a wake up.

I recommend weekly actions, not to big to force the law to intervene but big enough to make into the news and to become visible by the public (meaning interfere in some way with their daily activities) - a bunch of bikers gathering in a parking lot and complaining about ACC to themselves it not gonna cut it any more. We've been nice long enough. We need to start making some moderate disturbance - riding slow on Lambton quay, slowing down the M-way at rush hour, things like this. And if it's during week days even better - more visibility.

If we wait till February, it's gonna be to late. We need to keep doing stuff until then. The Feb event shouldn't be the next event but the breaking point - a major event following a long series of small events that have increased the pressure gradually.

And regarding the arguments and our say, we should cut it short: no more numbers, no more arguing who's at fault and who isn't, what percentage and what numbers. Just "NO Fault" and "Back to the original Woodhouse Principle", so people can understand this is about all NZ, not just the bikers.

[oldrider]

Come with us to Carterton on Sunday for the Nats christmas party.

Then next saturday to the Park in at oriental parade .. both events are in the calander.

I won't get involved with pissing off the public ... but am more than happy to educate them .... they are our allys and I think now they realise it more as it is more than public that their pockets are badly affected as well.

They realise (now that they have been told this) that motorcyclists are costing "them" money! I.E. They are subsidising us and our (Katman) reckless behaviour!

Do you think they are still going to want to be our allies? :mellow:

[Vern]

I'm in to the end as well.

[Nasty]

They realise (now that they have been told this) that motorcyclists are costing "them" money! I.E. They are subsidising us and our (Katman) reckless behaviour!

Do you think they are still going to want to be our allies? :mellow:


You are right ... give up and don't bother ... No I am not going to go out of my way to cause public problems ... they think they know .. they need to be informed about the shit they have been fed by the media ...

But I don't ride with reckless behaviour ... never had an accident .. and only one acc claim and that was work related back problem from sitting at my desk ... I am happy to admit there are idiots ... but there are more idiots than motorcycle riders .. and we subsidise them.

[glegge]

They realise (now that they have been told this) that motorcyclists are costing "them" money! I.E. They are subsidising us and our (Katman) reckless behaviour!

Do you think they are still going to want to be our allies? :mellow:

But thats the whole thing, they just need re-educating.
motorcyclists are not costing anyone anymore than anyone else under a no fault system..
engage re-education gear, hoist banners..

under no fault, NO ONE CAN COST MORE THAN ANYONE ELSE!, as the levys should all be the same for everyone.
its just the way the nutters push the numbers on there calculators that makes it look bad for certain groups.

[centaurus]

I'm with you all the way, Mr Stoneman.

This fight is going to get nasty now. At least, it needs to in order to achieve anything. PC and friendly just isn't going to do it, BUT I will never support closing down motorways etc; that will just piss Joe P off and do us no good at all. Closing down ACC offices... now that might be a different matter altogether.
And rego going on hold is a done deal unless the Prick comes to his senses before it expires. Tui...

And the time for writing to MP's is pretty-well over. Make an appointment to go and see your local polly, no matter what party it is a member of. Imagine how long we can book up all their constituent time for, to chew them out on the same issue!

ACC and the Nats are ready for this and bugging them is not gonna change anything. What we need is to create visibility and a wake up call for the whole NZ. And the only way to create visibility is by getting in the news and through some mild disturbance. if it's "some bikers gathered somewhere", nobody cares. If it's "bikers blocked our way to work today" or something like that, people are gonna be forced to acknoledge us and take note of our protest. I agree, we can't just go in the street and block it - a little planning needs to happen so we can get the max effect and visibility with a relative minimum disturbance, but I think we need public disturbance. The public is who we need to influence,not ACC or the Nats. The only way the nats will be swayed is if the rest of the public starts complaining and threatening with votes loss. Just we bikers by ourselves are not enough (in numbers) to force the Nats' hand and they know it.

[idleidolidyll]

you know i'm pissed off; this 'result' is exactly what i predicted from the start

we were set up and disrespected; this is always what they intended

count me in on just about anything short of murder; i'm angry!

[Thani-B]

I'm in. <xyzxyz>

[DidJit]

Vive la révolution!

[blossomsowner]

count me in

[TygerTung]

I think it is disgusting.

It really is an insult.

I will not be buying more licensing when it runs out and I will be putting it on hold until a time when it is the same cost to licence my motorcycle as it costs to licence my car.

[StoneY]

Ok, so I have called you all to War

Doesn't mean it has to be destructive chaos, just solid, never ending actions
Something every week, something visible, keep the message live

The new message HAS to be "see we told you, and now its YOUR turn, don't blame us, do some math, you can see your being ripped off like we are
Return to the Woodhouse principles, nothing less"

You guys should have seen Kari in action at the Nats cocktail gig

Now, im down (personally) till next Wednesday regarding 'non operational orders' due to soon expire ;)

Once I can ride again....we are off
Action time!

Just have to respect Joe when we take the action, he is comin more and more onside every day
The BIG one in Feb can be when our action plans all combine, and hopefully we get the public behind us in huge numbers

Yes its war, but lets fight smart
I stand somewhere between Idyl, and Kari in intention, parts of me wanna burn effigy's to incite revolution, other parts say 'keep talking, keep negotiating'

Bottom line is, we gotta keep the pressure on
Word

[kb_SF1]

The first phase is over and time to target the pollies and educate the wider public about the ongoing impact on us all next year and every year after that until jj & smith achieve their goal.

The media won't ask the hard questions or do the research themselves, they rely on the spin doctor handouts.

acc reserves have increased to $14.3b with an increase in investment returns of $0.6b (source, The Treasury 10 Dec 09) , acc is not broke, never was, it was the right-down in investments in land, the share and bond markets that caused the fabricated budget crisis.

Stoney, I'm more than prepared to ride down again, just tell us when.

[phred]

I'm definitely in for some action, it just seems that there is no one who wants to/can step up to organise anything concrete...I certainly know, I'm not that person.

From the article link in a previous post:

"Peter McIntosh, president of the 4000-member Ulysses Club for motorcyclists, said the lower levy rises represented a victory.

"They're much better than we expected."

Who is this guy?....I suggest we find him and knock some sense into him! It's people like this that present a spineless picture of our motorcycle community, which in turn suggests that we are happy with the increases...

ARE WE?! I don't think so!

I believe our fight is about equality...across the board, no exceptions

Wasn't happy seeing him on telly. My Ulysses membership is cancelled.

[phred]

Ok

I spent enough time being nice
Enough time being sane
Enough time playing the mediocre line and advising calm

FUCK THAT

140, really?
Thats what we expected to cough up?

NO
FUCK NO, no WAY, no chance

ACC restored to nothing less than Sir Owens original concept
Who is in with me?

Thats what I signed up for.

[StoneY]

Thats what I signed up for.

And I stand by it phred, but i was RAGING as I posted post 1, and I still intend to keep the battle rolling forward, and I still insist I will settle for nothing less than no increase

Im also smart enough to know there is only so far we can go without losing public support, theres the kicker in the whole mix

Idyl.
I have a target in mind...be in touch soon

[avgas]

so what we gona do about it...?

1 - clog the motorways riding at 40kms all the way into town at rush hour??? i like this one...

2 - ride in force to Westfeild Queensgate on a Saturday morning and take up 1 park per bike??? i like this one also...

3 - sit artound and do nothing and bitch and moan from our pc's about acc crap and that homo Dr Nick Shitter??? i don't like this idea...

Err put your rego on hold - hit them in the pocket.
fire with fire

[ZephyrMark2]

acc reserves have increased to $14.3b with an increase in investment returns of $0.6b (source, The Treasury 10 Dec 09) , acc is not broke, never was, it was the right-down in investments in land, the share and bond markets that caused the fabricated budget crisis.

Um.. don't forget the $2.6b that was struck off the balance sheet due to international financial reporting standards. This is called a paper entry, meaning no change in $$ at all.

Mark

[avgas]

And as for Ulysses, I think we need to accept that they've well and truly been taken over by the affluent motorcycle crowd;
Taken over......they always were that.
But I think you will find that most in it are 'retired'.

[Mom]

Vive la révolution!


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[Pedrostt500]

I still like the idea of Bikeoi 2010, as a staging post to take all affected groups to Parliment, 20,000 on the lawns of Parliment and equal or greater numbers in other main centres, if they can't hear 100,000 + people then I wouldn't know what would work, other than bloody revolution, and I would like to not play that card.
But lets be clear what our message is, lets be clear about what we are fighting for.

[StoneY]

It is clear Pedro mate
We have coined a new name for the Feb event, saving BIKEOI for purely bike actions, and this BIG march, I have invited all the unions and such to, is been dubbed

"Damn the Levies'
March with us to save ACC from the Government

Oh and it will be led by bikers, all the way

[naphazoline]

Im also smart enough to know there is only so far we can go without losing public support,.....

The politicians know that,and it's playing into their hands,and what we've done so far,is only affecting the general public.

Do you think taking up car parks is affecting politicians?:rolleyes:
All that's doing,is pissing off other motorists.

We need to be more assertive then that,if you're going to see any results at all,otherwise the pollies will just ignore us!!!

[nothingflash]

can't hardly wait!

[sinfull]

Can i brung ma slingshot this tyme ?

[StoneY]

Can i brung ma slingshot this tyme ?

Fuck yes.

See the mad nutter out front yelling 'lets throw stooooones'?
Wondered for a moment Sinny............

:lol:

[sinfull]

Fuck yes.

See the mad nutter out front yelling 'lets throw stooooones'?
Wondered for a moment Sinny............

:lol:
Nah he was yellin lets throw Stoney !!

[StoneY]

Nah he was yellin lets throw Stoney !!

:shit:
:doh::doh::doh::doh::doh::doh:

[BMWST?]

How we gonna decide what to do...... we cannot talk about it here

[OV Lander]

Pencilled in Ink that is - we'll be there!

[sinfull]

:shit:
:doh::doh::doh::doh::doh::doh:

I was on best behavior, sittin out the front of parliment ON MY MOTORCYCLE
"ahem"

[StoneY]

How we gonna decide what to do...... we cannot talk about it here

Join the regional protest social group Beema m8
Be glad to have ya!

[mikeey01]

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[StoneY]

I was on best behavior, sittin out the front of parliment ON MY MOTORCYCLE
"ahem"

Yeah I was amazed how many bikes we squeezed into Parliaments surrounds, was over 700 at last count 3, even 4 deep some layers, was great!

[BMWST?]

Join the regional protest social group Beema m8
Be glad to have ya!
action group?already threr bro....

[wbks]

Not going to read through eight pages, soooo... Whats going on here? The title says "war" and people are talking about parliament and slingshots...

[BoristheBiter]

I hate to burst peoples bubbles about getting Joe public on side as it is never going to happen.

People in cages view us as body donners, we do get into accidents (our fault or not) and as a result we hurt, broken bones and high medical costs are an inevitable. i have seen a fair few motorbike accidents and they are not pretty and do cost money, this is the attitude that most cagers feel.

People in cars do belive they are invincible and motorbikes are dangerous and most of the time they only see us as we lane split, it is as simple as that.
joe public has been made to belive motorbike accidents cost money and that is the be all and end all of why Joe Pubilc is never going to care.

They do not ride motorbikes it does not effect them, and only when it does will they stand up and take notice. direct action is the only way to show people that if motorbikes are taken off the road then there is only going to be more gridlock.

they have to be made to belive (true or not) that if we stop riding it is going to cost them a shit load more than it does now.

"VIVA THE REVOLUTION" (better than who's next)

[Mom]

It is clear Pedro mate
We have coined a new name for the Feb event, saving BIKEOI for purely bike actions, and this BIG march, I have invited all the unions and such to, is been dubbed

"Damn the Levies'
March with us to save ACC from the Government

Oh and it will be led by bikers, all the way

Give me the name please.

BIG MARCH?

BIG - means?

Bikers Includes Generalpopulation? (Genpop for short)

[rideon]

Count us in , 19th in diary !!...........was always prepared to come down again. They were warned the first time that if we had to come again that maybe we wouldnt be so peaceful or concilatory!!
(looking towards the smokey end of the bar Stoney :msn-wink: ).
Small group of Tron riders looking for targets & actions too............

[StoneY]

We have to get the sitting dates sorted, work around a few Bike events that may cause mayhem for those with plans, but once sorted, MARCH

I have asked Westpac again, but this is more for gathering the march than a bike park


Damn the Levies
The whole damn country will come this time too

I had a lady from one group I contacted nearly in tears of gratitude that 'the Bikers who went to Parliament' were asking them to come along
:shit:

[wingrider]

I hate to burst peoples bubbles about getting Joe public on side as it is never going to happen.

People in cages view us as body donners, we do get into accidents (our fault or not) and as a result we hurt, broken bones and high medical costs are an inevitable. i have seen a fair few motorbike accidents and they are not pretty and do cost money, this is the attitude that most cagers feel.

People in cars do belive they are invincible and motorbikes are dangerous and most of the time they only see us as we lane split, it is as simple as that.
joe public has been made to belive motorbike accidents cost money and that is the be all and end all of why Joe Pubilc is never going to care.

They do not ride motorbikes it does not effect them, and only when it does will they stand up and take notice. direct action is the only way to show people that if motorbikes are taken off the road then there is only going to be more gridlock.

they have to be made to belive (true or not) that if we stop riding it is going to cost them a shit load more than it does now.

"VIVA THE REVOLUTION" (better than who's next)


Well i Hate to burst your bubble but I have spoken to about 20 people today and SHOWN them whats going on.
Finaly they accepted that the bikers have been a smokescreen.
So much attention on us they didnt see what was happening.

Two employers didnt even realise they were being lumbered with increases, Didnt even know employee levies were goin up. One guys employer levey is just over $15k now.

Somehow we gotta get it out there that every single person got shafted.

People are not happy with national at all and that includes some real diehards i spoke with.

[RDjase]

Cheers. Yours is not too shabby either...


I have had one reply (predictably, from Chris Tremain, spouting the partyline BULLSHIT)

I offered him a tailor-made serve...

Has Tremain actually turned out in public? or is he hiding in his office and sending Craig tosser out to the motorcyclists he was shitting himself at the hastings protest, it was great when Stuart Nash(labour) got on the back of nationals ute(with craig foss bleating) and got the crowd clapping and cheering

[DEVVIL]

hey! im a car owner! getting back to the NO FAULT thing............. remember? ACC has forgotten,,.. time to remind them.

HEY COWBOYZ
See you at the 2010 grand challenge.
Yes time to make some noise:angry2:

[sinfull]

Yeah I was amazed how many bikes we squeezed into Parliaments surrounds, was over 700 at last count 3, even 4 deep some layers, was great!Didn't even go near blockin that road like it should have aye, now ya think about it !


Not going to read through eight pages, soooo... Whats going on here? The title says "war" and people are talking about parliament and slingshots...
http://www.slingshots.com/ I see a radar mount comin in handyyy !!!


HEY COWBOYZ
See you at the 2010 grand challenge.
Yes time to make some noise:angry2:
Make sure you remap that thing for so many noisy miles !!

Whats wrong with tommorrow i say !!!
Coast to coast leaving from ummm somewhere north west of Foxton ending northeast of nowhere !!
But boy ya can pass some bikes !!!

[allycatz]

Well i Hate to burst your bubble but I have spoken to about 20 people today and SHOWN them whats going on.
Finaly they accepted that the bikers have been a smokescreen.
So much attention on us they didnt see what was happening.

Two employers didnt even realise they were being lumbered with increases, Didnt even know employee levies were goin up. One guys employer levey is just over $15k now.

Somehow we gotta get it out there that every single person got shafted.

People are not happy with national at all and that includes some real diehards i spoke with.


Agreed, I think the public need to be educated on the ramifications of across the board increases in levies....watch the consumer pricing rise when business has to add on ACC increases onto pricing.

[sinfull]

Agreed, I think the public need to be educated on the ramifications of across the board increases in levies....watch the consumer pricing rise when business has to add on ACC increases onto pricing.I sit here naked reading this and think fuck me ! It's cold !
Cold ya say, Why cold ? Cause the heart just aint in it no more !
NZers have been the guinee pig for the west for how many decades now ?
1st to get bombarded with cell phones
1st to get bombarded with plastic cards
1st to get many testing laws
The blood don't rush to the head like it used to !
Some say it's age, but i think it's cause of so many years, seeing kiwis bend over and take it up the arse !


This will eventually go away just like the cell towers and the eftpos machines !

I'll pay the extra to reg my bike, just like so many who have screamed it's wrong !

I'll suck it up when they say i have to insure myself incase i have an injury or injure someone !

I'll pay through the nose for everything that i enjoy because it's the NZ way !

The word leming springs to mind !

We are the experiment of the west, no choice in the matter ! They want to see just how much controll they can have over a population and we have the population base to try it all out on !

Fuck off !!! I do what i want !

Yay lets go to war ! Uhuh uhuh


Goes to youtube to find a tune, a sutible tune !

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[Laxi]

Goes to youtube to find a tune, a sutible tune !

dude!!! RAM??? :nono:
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[sinfull]

dude!!! RAM??? >Awww man you just brought back some wicked memories of wednesday night with this coool lady, but hey time and place bro ! This thread is about taking away whats mine !
My rights !
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[StoneY]

Some say it's age, but i think it's cause of so many years, seeing kiwis bend over and take it up the arse !




Bro, while you may think thats what we are gonna do, I can tell ya now, I still fart loud, and will as long as I live
MY ASSHOLE mate is a ONE way tunnel, door closed end of story!

Im gonna say this only once

I didnt see anyone else put up a hand to powwow with TPTB to get the carparks or any other shit on the day, so why the fuck cry that we didnt close it down, we were never gonna!

BIKEOI was a 100% success as far as I am concerned, and we can wish for this, wish for that, it aint a fairy tale and Cinderella's slipper isnt gonna fit my dates foot
No bin's no tickets, over 7000 maybe 8000 bikes

I will never advocate fully shutting down Wellington City, no matter how big a protest we make
The truickies are still reviled here for that, we came out as fucking HEROS last month

I constantly get told, "All them bikes were awesome, all your bikie mates were awesome"

Makin some noise and stepping it up, doesn't undo what we achieved last month

We just remind them as much as we can we aint gone away, aint GONNA go away, and I aint stoppong till the Nats are out, and we can have a government that WILL restore ACC to its intended principles

Next protest, much MUCH bigger with ALL of NZ along, now thats gonna make an impact......

The war continues (but fuck sake can we have a Christmas too?)

[sinfull]

The war continues (but fuck sake can we have a Christmas too?)
Humbug snoopy lol
All good mate, wasn't gettin at you, your organisation skills or ya rallying skills ! It's nice to see ya still keen as, to rark up the troops !

The above quote was a generalistion of how apathetic kiwis in general are !

[StoneY]

Humbug snoopy lol
All good mate, wasn't gettin at you, your organisation skills or ya rallying skills ! It's nice to see ya still keen as, to rark up the troops !

The above quote was a generalistion of how apathetic kiwis in general are !

I know bro, I know :D

Hey, hope to have ya along for the next one too, see those guys in the fuck ACC white Falcon?

I need them again, anyone know them?
Up Manawatu way somewhere I heard

[PrincessBandit]

Maintainng the Woodhouse principals with parity for road users and not 'targeting' minorities is what it should be.



Unfortunately the Woodhouse principal of ACC is what the powers that be DON"T want kept. We are pushing for this, but they want to do away with it.

Why just the cars ?

What about all the people that play contact sport?

The people that don't contribute but are happy to take the payout when they have an injury?

How about getting all the historical cases paid by WINZ ?

Have a cleanup on ACC bludgers that have milked the system for years & continue to do so.
Oh, it's far too much hard work for them to follow up on those ideas - all of which I put in my ignored submission back in November. Much more straightforward to target undesirable bikers, we've known this approach all along.


hey! im a car owner! getting back to the NO FAULT thing............. remember? ACC has forgotten,,.. time to remind them.


Well its quite simple - they want to treat this a an insurance co........then money is the only way you will make them listen.

Rego went on hold last night. Lets choke em.
Money, I think, is the only way to their brains. They really couldn't give a toss about any well thought out debate; it means that they might have to rethink their position. They are set, and $$$ is the bottom line.


I have a question.... Why doesnt everyone go protest in their cars?

Just think... 5000 cars converge on a city center? Sure I realise it is a bike protest but imagine the Impact of driving that many cars into wellington.

Wear your leathers and take your helmuts put signs on the cars etc. Would make a huge impact imo.

I like it. They think 7000 bikes were going to clog Wellington - 7000 cars will do so even more.

p.s. even injured, still count me in!

[Tink]

mm I have yet to don my ACC Protest tshirt... impatient!!!!

[sinfull]

I know bro, I know :D

Hey, hope to have ya along for the next one too, see those guys in the fuck ACC white Falcon?

I need them again, anyone know them?
Up Manawatu way somewhere I heard

Yeah he'll be there ! One of the clubmembers knows and was in the car with him, seeing he lost his licence !
He actually has a profile on here haha ya won't miss him if ya scroll the acc threads !

[MSTRS]

Has Tremain actually turned out in public? or is he hiding in his office and sending Craig tosser out to the motorcyclists he was shitting himself at the hastings protest, it was great when Stuart Nash(labour) got on the back of nationals ute(with craig foss bleating) and got the crowd clapping and cheering

If Tremain has come out with anything in public, I am totally unaware. He has been conspicuous by his absence in all approaches YT and I have made. He has done nothing in response to emails from me, bar repeat the party line (BULLSHIT!!). His only response to YT was when she emailed Craig Foss, saying that CT was 'as hard to pin down as a greased pig'...wasn't even sent to CT, but Foss obviously passed it on, and Tremain replied with an oh-so-hurt tone. Poor wee lamb....

[BoristheBiter]

Well i Hate to burst your bubble but I have spoken to about 20 people today and SHOWN them whats going on.
Finaly they accepted that the bikers have been a smokescreen.
So much attention on us they didnt see what was happening.

Two employers didnt even realise they were being lumbered with increases, Didnt even know employee levies were goin up. One guys employer levey is just over $15k now.

Somehow we gotta get it out there that every single person got shafted.

People are not happy with national at all and that includes some real diehards i spoke with.

That’s what I just said.

Joe public doesn’t care because they don’t think it is going to affect them , like the people you just spoke to didn’t care until they found out it would cost them more.

Stony was right that the bikeoi was a complete success; it showed we would not stand for the massive price rises or a change to the principles to acc,

We said it was a start and now we continue, loader and loader until the rest of NZ can see it is going to cost them a shit load more, whether in higher costs or because we are forced back into cars or that fact that we will just not get a rego.

[StoneY]

Yeah he'll be there ! One of the clubmembers knows and was in the car with him, seeing he lost his licence !
He actually has a profile on here haha ya won't miss him if ya scroll the acc threads !

Sweet, that car had an interesting....atmospheric presence when I said 'hi' to them

:niceone:

[drummer]

I'm KEEN as,but what do you propose? They're obviously not going to listen to "PEACEFUL PROTESTS".
If you think they're going to take notice of "RATTLING OUR SABRE'S",well WE MIGHT AS WELL CONCEDE TO THEM!

They're ronly going to listen,if we start to disrupt their lives,or shut/block the cities.

I reckon public support wont have waned either,seeing as they have been targeted aswell.Peaceful protests... or lawful...?

"They" (and I am unsure as to who "They" are... the Nats... ACC... Nicksta and his advisers.. the public) will not listen or have to pay attention to a few KB members talking of disruption and "War".

Dusrupting peoples lives IS NOT going to win us the so called war.. good grief... use your heads.. politics is what will win us the fight.. I have said time and time again that the way to fight party policy (and NEVER forget this IS our fight... you want to fight the whole Nat government... I hate to say this... you're dreaming) is to attack the party thinking from the weakest link... firstly..,. do you really believe for one tiny moment in your talk of disruption "shutting down cities" and public annoyance that Joe and Mary Blow will think "Oh gosh... them bike riders are right... NO they think we have won a concession... and we should be grateful.. It may be the wrong perception.. but who gives a dam about that? Its THEIR perception.

Also re the talk about unions joing our fight and marching with us.. oh give me a break... union membership is at it's lowest in years. Plus the Nats don't care about unions.. why? Because they all vote Labour anyhow! Also... want to alienate half the bikers in NZ... simple.. get unions involved... no.. this is OUR fight... let them do their thing... and have their flag waving banner bearing little shouting marches in the rain outside some place... but ever seen the numbers of people in them.. and talked with them... no Nats at all.. and numbers decreasing all the time.. the last one I saw was a group of drenched men outside some factory in South Auckland saying let us in... let us in... great protest... and not very intelligent... from what I know it failed... the factory was shut up next time and the lease up...

Fundementally what we as KB passionate motorcyclists need to do is to firstly convince ALL.. well as many as we can.. (and thats a big task) riders that we the motorcycle and scooter ridrs of NZ need to be united in a common cause... bring the groups together.. right now I know people who ride who just shake their heads when all this war and disruption is mentioned.. I was at a staff Christmas function last night.. spent half the night explaining the reality of our plight to three guys and a lady ho rode bikes... but who never protested or even knew about any actions... strange huh... NO... but to people here it would seem strange... I mean ... lets see 5000 bikes at Welly... about 100 at the important Smith meeting in Auckland... how many rego'ed bikes in NZ? A lot more I know that for sure. I also know ALL of the people I spoke with were surprised that I, a former Nat exec branch member was unhappy... and ALL of them were Nat voters.

I even see here an attack and name calling of scooter riders... give me strength... attacking the fasted growing sector of NZ transport and some very intelligent people aint going to win us those people...

There you go... some of you want war... disruption...personal attacks against Smith.. thats an uneducated illinformed way to change policy... We at the moment are lets face it are a small voting block whose members mostly are left leaning... lets get real... However.. many many many motorcyclists like myself are not left leaning... I actually like John Key as a leader... but.. and this is the crux... a few policies including this major one re ACC have me really pissed off.. for every one of "me" there are huge numbers out there from all political angles who are the same. They won't and don't support a small group of bikers who want to disrupt traffic, "close down cities", cause mayhem and annoy the great working public... these people mostly drive cars to work... I do... to carry my guitars drums and amps etc.. try that on a bike... then there are those who ride scooters to look "cool"... Guys in K road, little chickie babes who's miniskirts blow up at any speed... great look... but totally unsafe... just go round Tamaki drive on a hot summers day and see what I mean.

Do you really think that traffic disruptions, threats, declarations of war and involving left leaning unions in chanting walks down city streets is going to change the (popular.. look at the polls!!) governments policies..? You must be dreaming.

No folks... to attack a cause... stealth organisation of resources and intelligence is required... in modern warfare even... its not about dropping bombs on everyone.. its about SMART bombing and stealth..

So what do we do?... I have started a new thread (Approach to the future of our cause) to discuss this and put this post as first post... where am I coming from? I have been involved with politics and political change for nearly 30 years... 17 years in Australia.. I saw the Hanson thing happen before my very eyes... I was close to the action and didn't agree with her at all... Together with a dedicated group we totally changed the face of politics in an area of nearly 200,000 people.. and a wider region of more than a million and brought change Nationally in certain areas...

I know the National party here.. I know how they work and the structures they use... war by disruption and fuelled by emotional anger is a way to failure.. I can PROMISE you that... however.. if you want to call it war do so... but I call it pressure... put unbelieveable pressure on the weakest links by as great a number of ordinary motorcyclists and scooter riders we can muster... some of us need to embrace the concept of working within the system... and at times outiside when we face a brick wall... but if you think we are facing a brick wall now and the only way is to break it down, then sorry... you WILL NOT achieve the end result. The wall will grow far larger.

We need a goverment who thinks its very own supporters will turn... will leave the party membership... stop the donations, and essentually make the next election a tough one... the biggest thing political parties need apart from voters getting them elected is people who give their time assisting in things... putting up signs, door knocking etc... branches have a little competition within electorates to sign up the most members... and get the most money... like I said... do you really honestly think scaremongering by carpet bombing is the answer?

Lets discuss and plan a co-ordinated strong intelligent effective mature approach to our problem... lets come up with a strong co-ordinated argument that gets as many motorcycle riding and scooter riding people on board... lets attack with stealth and a groudswell of people who will eventually convince this government riding high in the polls that the ACC levies are unfair, unworkable and unjustified.. Lts convince this government and it's allies like ACT, Unied future and the Maori party that it will be if anything a minority unworkable government at the very most after the next election IF it continues its present policy lines.. and for us thats ACC levies and dare I say it the climate change issues regarding the advantage of people riding bikes.. lets get the people who matter onside by intelligent co-ordinated public debate about our nation's future and a system that has worked well for a good deal of time... let's make John Judge feel uneasy... and give the government no choice but to sack him... look at his failures... there are too many to list.

Who here wants that?

Or who here wants to disrupt, annoy and declare war on the majoirity..and truly believes it is the way...? Who wants to confront angry car drivers who just want to get to work? Who here wants to get scooterists offside by calling them names... ?

Not me!

Peter (Drummer on KB)

[drummer]

I aint stoppong till the Nats are out, and we can have a government that WILL restore ACC to its intended principlesYou are going to be waiting a VERY long time.. the Nats are riding high... they are smart... and many of us here would rather have John than Aunty Helen or Goff... but what we don't universally want is a government policy that is unfair on motorcyclists and Scooter riders whilst allowing Rugby players, bicycle riders and such to get away with paying no targeted levy IF we as riders have to...

Another thing... come on.. do you honestly believe that Labour wouldn't raise our taxes in other ways... look at the past years under Auntie Helen... it was not all beer and skittles..

Think policy change not government change... we are a minority... and getting smaller by the day... some are rolling over... but small groups can become large... by embracing ideas and putting aside party politics for the sake of policy change... its a very very important difference and one that we here need to understand...

Peter

[NONONO]

Peter.
you are sounding more and more partisan, and a bit desperate.
Chill

[drummer]

Peter.
you are sounding more and more partisan, and a bit desperate.
ChillNeither... but I am being realistic... don't you call calls for "War" desperate.. me desperate... nonono!

hehe

Peter

[Flip]

We just sent them a polite message with lots of advance consultation, that was an old fashioned visitor calling card.

Next time we arrive on our terms and in much larger numbers.

I'm in again and this time my wife will come with me which doubles the attendance from my household

[fridayflash]

im in for sure, id be happy to turn up and frisbee my number plate at
parliment house and declare motorcycles to no longer subject to
fees of any sort....5000 bikers doin that would fuck 'em

[idleidolidyll]

If all you do is watch TV and read the Herald: you'll only ever hear the propaganda, try something with balance and depth:



User-pays ACC approach picks off groups one by one
The Government’s treatment of ACC motorcycle levies is symptomatic of an increasing user-pays approach which is picking off groups of New Zealanders one by one, says Labour’s ACC spokesperson David Parker.
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA0912/S00165.htm


-------------------------------------------



National scaremongering on ACC and Super exposed
National’s scaremongering over ACC and Superannuation has been exposed by the continuing strong performance of the ACC and Super investment funds, Labour Leader Phil Goff says.
“The Budget decision to suspend contributions to the Super Fund with National saying it was losing money was stupid. All funds at the height of the financial crisis were losing money.

“That decision now looks even more short-sighted given the latest figures from Treasury show the fund bouncing back strongly with higher than forecast returns of the $1.3 billion for the four months to 31 October.
“The time to invest is when prices are low but National squandered the opportunity by suspending the payments which jeopardises the future pensions of all New Zealanders.
“It is the same situation with ACC. John Key and National used the lower returns from the ACC investment funds to justify huge levy hikes and cutting of entitlements.
“But ACC’s investment funds had returns of $600 million in the four months to 31 October. This was also higher than expected.
“National’s changes to ACC and Super funding made no sense at the time. They make even less sense now,” Phil Goff.
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA0912/S00077.htm

[idleidolidyll]

Pay-as-you-go way to go for ACC

Thursday, 10 December 2009, 11:51 am
Press Release: Green Party
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA0912/S00155.htm

[craneman]

Tell me were and when and Ill be there.

[sunhuntin]

if the war falls on a weekend, i may have a bit of hassle attending, but can always call in sick or something. during the week... no worries. just tell me where and when.

[Noidy]

Peaceful protests... or lawful...?

Fundementally what we as KB passionate motorcyclists need to do is to firstly convince ALL.. well as many as we can.. (and thats a big task) riders that we the motorcycle and scooter ridrs of NZ need to be united in a common cause...

This affects more than just motorcyclists. Lets expand the group and not limit ourselves. Target boy racing groups and convince them that they will be next and to get on the band wagon with us. A group of motorcyclists can make some noise but a group of auto enthusiasts will make more

[spacemonkey]

mm I have yet to don my ACC Protest tshirt... impatient!!!!

The protest shirt is not just for wearing at the protests..... wear it as much as you can in everyday life when your out and about, its all part of getting out message out there in full view to as many people as possible.

Get the message in peoples minds, KEEP it in peoples minds.

[Tink]

The protest shirt is not just for wearing at the protests..... wear it as much as you can in everyday life when your out and about, its all part of getting out message out there in full view to as many people as possible.

Get the message in peoples minds, KEEP it in peoples minds.

that would be great if it wasn't super huge, (so I can wear it over my jacket)... otherwise sure.... :(

[short-circuit]

Peter.
you are sounding more and more partisan, and a bit desperate.
Chill

He's a full of shit and confused Tory

[spacemonkey]

that would be great if it wasn't super huge, (so I can wear it over my jacket)... otherwise sure.... :(

:doh:
Ok.... Eat more bloody pies then! :lol::dodge:

[sunhuntin]

that would be great if it wasn't super huge, (so I can wear it over my jacket)... otherwise sure.... :(

i went op shopping and found a black shirt that fitted nicely then went and bought some tshirt transfer paper. [expensive at $25 for 5 sheets, but worth it]

i then went and got some graphics from the graphics thread, printed them on the tshirt paper and ironed them on. end result is i now have an official one to wear over the jacket [and in bed] and one to wear for everyday use. i wear it work, in town, etc.

[short-circuit]

Where the fuck is everyone for the Christmas Card protest on the 19th?

17 people? Fucken pathetic!

We're still facing a 100% levy increase as it stands and are still staring down the barrel of no ACC in the very near future.

Where the fuck are all you whingers?

[caseye]

Good question short-circuit! Come on you complacent mongrels, get your name on that list and be prepared to be at the viaduct bloody early!i'm in Stoney, but you knew that already.

[PrincessBandit]

Where the fuck is everyone for the Christmas Card protest on the 19th?

17 people? Fucken pathetic!

We're still facing a 100% levy increase as it stands and are still staring down the barrel of no ACC in the very near future.

Where the fuck are all you whingers?

Not sure if I can make that one - and certainly not on a bike wiv me arm in a sling....(i know, I just need to htfu but I lost those pills....)

Hope it is well attended though, and if there is any way I can get there I will!

[caseye]

You are officially exquweezed Princess bandit! The rest of ya's aint though. Come on get your name on that list.

[Tink]

:doh:
Ok.... Eat more bloody pies then! :lol::dodge:

haha no way! :P


i went op shopping and found a black shirt that fitted nicely then went and bought some tshirt transfer paper. [expensive at $25 for 5 sheets, but worth it] i then went and got some graphics from the graphics thread, printed them on the tshirt paper and ironed them on. end result is i now have an official one to wear over the jacket [and in bed] and one to wear for everyday use. i wear it work, in town, etc.

Ah bed shirt mmm food for thought... guess I would have to wander around the streets before I go to sleep tho...lol:2thumbsup


Where the fuck is everyone for the Christmas Card protest on the 19th?

17 people? Fucken pathetic!

We're still facing a 100% levy increase as it stands and are still staring down the barrel of no ACC in the very near future.

Where the fuck are all you whingers?

My girls come first... but thanks for the thought! ;)


Not sure if I can make that one - and certainly not on a bike wiv me arm in a sling....(i know, I just need to htfu but I lost those pills....)

Hope it is well attended though, and if there is any way I can get there I will!

What happened to you? :(

[GOONR]

Where the fuck is everyone for the Christmas Card protest on the 19th?

17 people? Fucken pathetic!

We're still facing a 100% levy increase as it stands and are still staring down the barrel of no ACC in the very near future.

Where the fuck are all you whingers?

Hopefully it gains momentum during the week, but yeah, disappointing so far.

[Nasty]

Hopefully it gains momentum during the week, but yeah, disappointing so far.

The number registered often does not correlate to the number who turn up ... get the word out there .. to others ... and they will come!

[GOONR]

The number registered often does not correlate to the number who turn up ... get the word out there .. to others ... and they will come!Unfortunately the other riders at my work (the only one's I know outside of Kb) have shown bugger all interest, even with the initial proposed rises hanging over their heads. I can't see it changing. That is disappointing.

[Indiana_Jones]

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/TIh7UPvHxAk&hl=en_GB&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/TIh7UPvHxAk&hl=en_GB&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

-Indy

[spacemonkey]

The number registered often does not correlate to the number who turn up ... get the word out there .. to others ... and they will come!

True :)

There were only what 3-4 hundy registered for the Bikeoi at Welly?
8-9 thou turned up. :2thumbsup

[Blue TLS]

Count me in ,hopefully be able to get a few more that i know as well

[kevie]

What has happened is what we expected to happen,
A proposed ridiculously high increase reduced to a very high increase.
Maintainng the Woodhouse principals with parity for road users and not 'targeting' minorities is what it should be.

I'm in.

My last registration renewal was for a due date of 07-04-2009 and the 12 month fee was $267.21 ........... looked on the LTSA site just now and its $382.67 sneeky buggers are creaping it up are they then add the proposed increase and iys a big jump in levies.

Im with you ..... they sure are shafting us and lets show them that we arent going to sit there and let them do it.

[kevie]

Where the fuck is everyone for the Christmas Card protest on the 19th?

17 people? Fucken pathetic!

We're still facing a 100% levy increase as it stands and are still staring down the barrel of no ACC in the very near future.

Where the fuck are all you whingers?

started printing some cards from the samples on site here and going it in the Manawatu .... got a few ppl I can deliver them to, one being Bronwyn Torrie the reporter that ran the awesome article in the evening standard on the manawatu group of riders in the bikeoi, and a couple politicians on the list.
Dont know if any other manawatu riders are interested, they all seem a bit quiet:nono:

[kevie]

im in for sure, id be happy to turn up and frisbee my number plate at
parliment house and declare motorcycles to no longer subject to
fees of any sort....5000 bikers doin that would fuck 'em

nah they would ticket 500 bikers LMAO

But a point I made in one other forum was about a recent 'NZ census' where one of the questions was "How did you travel to work today (Excluding motorcycle) ............ I wrote in red pen "If a motorcycle isnt a recognised motor vehicle why the F**K am I paying rego and wof?" and highlighted it, then underneath wrote in large capitals "I WENT ON MY MOTORCYCLE"

I see where Peter is comming from in his argument, logical... and yeh, we need a plan and discussion on strategy. I still have members of the public come up to me in town voicing support and we need a way to get them voicing that support to the politicians as well somehow when half the voters start getting on their case then they may start to have a rethink.
There is still a place for the 'Bikeoi' style action tho as long as its peaceful and not anything illegal that may start getting us negative coverage and play into the politicians hands to use in tarring our fight.

[drummer]

I see where Peter is comming from in his argument, logical... and yeh, we need a plan and discussion on strategy. I still have members of the public come up to me in town voicing support and we need a way to get them voicing that support to the politicians as well somehow when half the voters start getting on their case then they may start to have a rethink.
There is still a place for the 'Bikeoi' style action tho as long as its peaceful and not anything illegal that may start getting us negative coverage and play into the politicians hands to use in tarring our fight.Absolutely.. I for one tghink theres an agenda amongst some to make this a total anti government issue... its dam well not.. its an anti policy issue that can effect who is in power... one person even said that I wanted pubic onside... if she had read my post I actually said we don'r want them OFFSIDE.. also someone else suggested getting boy racers onside.. are they kidding? We need to attack policy and do it right... so people like short circuit and duecey.. you go and have your war... but don't say you represent all bikers.. some of us here use our heads as ell..

Peter

[short-circuit]

Absolutely.. I for one tghink theres an agenda amongst some to make this a total anti government issue... its dam well not.. its an anti policy issue that can effect who is in power... one person even said that I wanted pubic onside... if she had read my post I actually said we don'r want them OFFSIDE.. also someone else suggested getting boy racers onside.. are they kidding? We need to attack policy and do it right... so people like short circuit and duecey.. you go and have your war... but don't say you represent all bikers.. some of us here use our heads as ell..

Peter

Your party's agenda is (and always has been) privatising every public service, amenity and asset they can possibly get away with - Why would ACC ever have been any different? Or do you still not understand what's going on fanboi? You either support this or you don't. In many ways ACC is the least of our worries.

Now fuck off and play the drums or something

[chanceyy]

Dont know if any other manawatu riders are interested, they all seem a bit quiet:nono:

Ppl who were interested in getting involved had a meeting last monday @ cuba so there will be a continued action in Manawatu/Hororwhenua area and the original Bikeoi thread has had a name change to reflect the current protest actions, and the thread is stickied on the ACC forum page :blip: but here it is (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=110353) the first post will be modified with the current actions happening to make them easier to find

There is a parking protest organised for manawatu next sat .. meet in the square before 8.30. depending on the number of bikes attending is depending on where we are parking so that will be decided on the morning

Make sure you bring money for the meter, and your bike has rego & warrent .. after all we want to be nicely legal so parking wardens & popo do not have fun :blip:

There will be other activities planned for the new yr, leading up to febs protest march

[StoneY]

Your party's agenda is (and always has been) privatising every public service, amenity and asset they can possibly get away with - Why would ACC ever have been any different? Or do you still not understand what's going on fanboi? You either support this or you don't. In many ways ACC is the least of our worries.


Something wrong here....

I agree with SC wtf!!!! :shit:

:niceone:

It IS a National thing, no other government ever spends so much effort trying to sell government assets to the Ozzie's and Yanks!

There is a definite pattern here, been a voter 22 years and ya know....I been here before

[StoneY]

My last registration renewal was for a due date of 07-04-2009 and the 12 month fee was $267.21 ........... looked on the LTSA site just now and its $382.67 sneeky buggers are creaping it up are they then add the proposed increase and iys a big jump in levies.

Im with you ..... they sure are shafting us and lets show them that we arent going to sit there and let them do it.

Its been 382.67 for 11 months man...

Nats put it up back when they won the election......where you been hiding?

:lol:

The NEXT increase goes on TOP of the 382.67

[oldrider]

Posters on this subject will soon be required to place warning notices on their posting!

I.E. "The following is a party political broadcast on behalf of the XYZ party" :rolleyes:

Try to get your thinking up a level.

Politicians right across the political spectrum are trying to screw us one way or another on this one, that's where the divisions begin!

A and B fighting for the benefit of C!

Where A and B equals us and C equals the politicians!

ACC welfare or private Insurance...These are the choices, either way we are screwed because we pay for it!!

ACC welfare in it's purest (Woodhouse) form is obviously the choice of the majority but if it gets abused and tinkered with until it costs us more than the alternative?

What are our choices? This constant wrangling between the two ideals is killing us! While they (the politicians) live comfortably, off the fat of the land!

We encourage it all by fighting with each other over the political crumbs they toss us!....Well, that's the way I see it anyway!

[chanceyy]

Its been 382.67 for 11 months man...

Nats put it up back when they won the election......where you been hiding?

:lol:

The NEXT increase goes on TOP of the 382.67

hmm more like 6 months I only paid 267 in June .. but interested in the 382 figure because it was like 311 in July, so was the 311 figure incorrect ?? or has it gone up again since then ??

Might have to check things out with Oscarnz she will know :yes:

[Pixie]

I hate to,rudely,wake you guys up,but the only way you are going to get them to drop this course of action is if a large enough group of NZ'ers just refuse to register their vehicles.
All the "political action from inside the party",public disruption,"getting the public on our side",presenting the govt with alternative ways of operating ACC,is going to do fuck all to make them drop their dogma.
The only thing that will do that is if the system fails to work.
I'm doing my bit - no rego from me.

[MSTRS]

.. one person even said that I wanted pubic onside... if she had read my post I actually said we don'r want them OFFSIDE..

If you'd been paying attention, you would have seen that the point is...we are too small a group to fight this effectively, it is an issue that affects every NZer and if we don't have Joe Public standing WITH US, everyone loses.

[mikeey01]

if a large enough group of NZ'ers just refuse to register their vehicles.
The only thing that will do that is if the system fails to work.
I'm doing my bit - no rego from me.

Or offer to only pay the road user levy and stick the acc levy bit.
I'll be putting mine on hold too, if they want money, go and take it out of their own pockets first, they're always the last to do without.

Makes me sick seeing the pay rises they get, yet the rest of the country year on year has got SFA.

[mikeey01]

If you'd been paying attention, you would have seen that the point is...we are too small a group to fight this effectively, it is an issue that affects every NZer and if we don't have Joe Public standing WITH US, everyone loses.

If the levies slowly stopped coming in, how significant a part would that play?

[ajturbo]

Posters on this subject will soon be required to place warning notices on their posting!

I.E. "The following is a party political broadcast on behalf of the XYZ party" :rolleyes:

Try to get your thinking up a level.

Politicians right across the political spectrum are trying to screw us one way or another on this one, that's where the divisions begin!

A and B fighting for the benefit of C!

Where A and B equals us and C equals the politicians!

ACC welfare or private Insurance...These are the choices, either way we are screwed because we pay for it!!

ACC welfare in it's purest (Woodhouse) form is obviously the choice of the majority but if it gets abused and tinkered with until it costs us more than the alternative?

What are our choices? This constant wrangling between the two ideals is killing us! While they (the politicians) live comfortably, off the fat of the land!

We encourage it all by fighting with each other over the political crumbs they toss us!....Well, that's the way I see it anyway!
you oldrider!!

how dare you make it easy for us to understand..!!!!

but at the end of the day.. i'm going to do what "Pixie" is doing..

[wbks]

Posters on this subject will soon be required to place warning notices on their posting!

I.E. "The following is a party political broadcast on behalf of the XYZ party" :rolleyes:

Try to get your thinking up a level.

Politicians right across the political spectrum are trying to screw us one way or another on this one, that's where the divisions begin!

A and B fighting for the benefit of C!

Where A and B equals us and C equals the politicians!

ACC welfare or private Insurance...These are the choices, either way we are screwed because we pay for it!!

ACC welfare in it's purest (Woodhouse) form is obviously the choice of the majority but if it gets abused and tinkered with until it costs us more than the alternative?

What are our choices? This constant wrangling between the two ideals is killing us! While they (the politicians) live comfortably, off the fat of the land!

We encourage it all by fighting with each other over the political crumbs they toss us!....Well, that's the way I see it anyway!That's it, I'm starting a communist state somewhere in the coromandel, and the coro loop is my sovereign territory

[spacemonkey]

That's it, I'm starting a communist state somewhere in the coromandel, and the coro loop is my sovereign territory

With you as the "Dear leader"?
With your strangle hold over the nations dope supplies you'll be untouchable! :niceone:

[kevie]

Ppl who were interested in getting involved had a meeting last monday and the thread is stickied on the ACC forum page the first post will be modified with the current actions happening to make them easier to find



Thank you my friend .... I find the ACC forum topic is getting so full its getting hard to keep track ....... its an old age thing :cool:

will keep an eye on that topic for the happenings :) will endevour to be there too, wifey might even come for the ride (:rolleyes:shops....... hides credit cards):argue::devil2:

[kevie]

Its been 382.67 for 11 months man...

Nats put it up back when they won the election......where you been hiding?

:lol:

The NEXT increase goes on TOP of the 382.67

hahahahah OK ... my bike been in bits in the shed for a year trying to get parts (penalty for owning an old bike) got it on the road at 4pm the night before the BIKEOI in time to be there.

Going off road when I dont need it to protest so I can send carbs to England for rebuild.

[drummer]

Your party's agenda is (and always has been) privatising every public service, amenity and asset they can possibly get away with - Why would ACC ever have been any different? Or do you still not understand what's going? You either support this or you don't. In many ways ACC is the least of our worriesOK Ian.. I had a look at this post cut the swearing and will answer your (for once for you.. relatively sensible) post. Now.. read mine and finally get the message!

How can you possibly call the National Party MY party Ian? I am banned from "MY" party if you assume it is National.. let's say that again slowly so you understand

I... me.. myself am BANNED from joining the Local National party of NZ... I was tossed out...But Ian... once again... just so you understand.. YOU could join the Nats.. YOU would be accepted... IF you wanted.. and I know you don't... but.. once again.. I CAN NOT join... comprehende?

Ian... your last comment is very silly.. ACC not our target? Really? What is? Its not the members of the Nats on the ground who are your mortal enemies as you have said in the past... The ACC is the organisation who instigated the changes.. Nick Smith is the minister responsible for ACC... he is and should be our target as well... but Ian... use your head mate... even if you want to bare your biceps and declare war on people... think about it... are ALL your friends apparent haters of ALL National supporters like you... good grief... some may even be Nat voters... dread the thought ole son!

Now... get off my back... I suspect you are trolling but now... once again... just in case.. you have read this far haven't you? You do understand english? I can't join the Nats... I was TOSSED OUT... I am hated by the local Nats... hated personally and politically.. I don't respect them and they don't respect or like me...the only person I have respect for around Tamaki is Allan Peachey.. why? because hes a dam good educator..

Bye bye Ian.. I hope you now get the message... but just in case.. The Nats are NOT MY PARTY.. I can NOT join I was TOSSED OUT!! geddit!!

By the way... ever heard of Roger and David... Labour I remember... privatisation anyone?

Peter

[MSTRS]

.. ACC not our target? Really? What is?

Once more, for the hard of hearing. The Government is the target. ACC does not have a mandate to do whatever it likes. It is directed by Govt. Ergo...the Govt is the target. If Govt 'rolls over', then ACC can only do what it is instructed, or allowed by law, to do.
Capische?

[Owl]

hmm more like 6 months I only paid 267 in June .. but interested in the 382 figure because it was like 311 in July, so was the 311 figure incorrect ?? or has it gone up again since then ??

Might have to check things out with Oscarnz she will know :yes:

There's a difference between registering and licencing! Current licencing fee is $321.24 and $382.67 for registration!:msn-wink:

http://www.nzta.govt.nz/vehicle/registration-licensing/fees.html

[oldrider]

Once more, for the hard of hearing. The Government is the target. ACC does not have a mandate to do whatever it likes. It is directed by Govt. Ergo...the Govt is the target. If Govt 'rolls over', then ACC can only do what it is instructed, or allowed by law, to do.
Capische?

True!

Ultimately the government is the target but with MMP it becomes "those who would be government" and what ACC legislation they vote in favour of!

With MMP we suffer all manor of combinations, selling their soul's to the highest bidder and pretending that they are representing the wishes of the general public!

"We" have a collective focus on our welfare as "motorcyclists" and these pricks are kicking our rice bowl, they are trying to ultimately destroy us, targeted for "mission accomplished" by 2050!

We will not resist their attacks, if we allow them to divide us and control our behaviour by resorting to petty political squabbling over the titbits they try to distract us with!

We will have to bight the bullet and raise ourselves a few tiers above that and instead of the tail wagging the dog we will need to put a choker on the dog and make it sit up and beg and do "our" bidding, not their own!

Since the advent of MMP, there are almost as many politicians, as there are motorcyclists and the only difference seems to be that they have their hands deep into our pockets!

This will be a long and difficult campaign but definitely one that would be wonderful to win! :niceone:

[Ender EnZed]

I... me.. myself am BANNED from joining the Local National party of NZ... I was tossed out...

What'd you do?

[peasea]

Once more, for the hard of hearing.

Should that not be in upper case?

[Rhino]

And as for Ulysses, I think we need to accept that they've well and truly been taken over by the affluent motorcycle crowd; the lawyers, doctors, accountants and dentists, who can afford the expensive bikes, and levies, for whom the motorcycle represents a plaything, something for recreational purposes.

And in such they've become irrelevant to the traditional bikers like myself; the ones for whom the bike is transport, it's freedom, its a lifestyle choice.

Fuck them; they don't speak for me. I was hoping that throwing my lot in with Bronz was going to make a difference, and Monday's meeting at the Parrot and Jigger was a good start.

I think that the Welly Branches ideology may not gel to well with the National Executive now Brett. Or are you suggesting we look at something different now?
Sorry to say this Riffer, As I normally enjoy your posts F***IN BOLLOCKS. Most Ulyssians ride there bikes all the time. I can count on one hand the number of doctors etc in the 600 member Auckland branch.

Most of us are average workers on average salaries.

[wbks]

OK Ian.. I had a look at this post cut the swearing and will answer your (for once for you.. relatively sensible) post. Now.. read mine and finally get the message!

How can you possibly call the National Party MY party Ian? I am banned from "MY" party if you assume it is National.. let's say that again slowly so you understand

I... me.. myself am BANNED from joining the Local National party of NZ... I was tossed out...But Ian... once again... just so you understand.. YOU could join the Nats.. YOU would be accepted... IF you wanted.. and I know you don't... but.. once again.. I CAN NOT join... comprehende?

Ian... your last comment is very silly.. ACC not our target? Really? What is? Its not the members of the Nats on the ground who are your mortal enemies as you have said in the past... The ACC is the organisation who instigated the changes.. Nick Smith is the minister responsible for ACC... he is and should be our target as well... but Ian... use your head mate... even if you want to bare your biceps and declare war on people... think about it... are ALL your friends apparent haters of ALL National supporters like you... good grief... some may even be Nat voters... dread the thought ole son!

Now... get off my back... I suspect you are trolling but now... once again... just in case.. you have read this far haven't you? You do understand english? I can't join the Nats... I was TOSSED OUT... I am hated by the local Nats... hated personally and politically.. I don't respect them and they don't respect or like me...the only person I have respect for around Tamaki is Allan Peachey.. why? because hes a dam good educator..

Bye bye Ian.. I hope you now get the message... but just in case.. The Nats are NOT MY PARTY.. I can NOT join I was TOSSED OUT!! geddit!!

By the way... ever heard of Roger and David... Labour I remember... privatisation anyone?

Peter
What do you do to get banned from national?

[riffer]

Sorry to say this Riffer, As I normally enjoy your posts F***IN BOLLOCKS. Most Ulyssians ride there bikes all the time. I can count on one hand the number of doctors etc in the 600 member Auckland branch.

Most of us are average workers on average salaries.

Well that's good to hear Rhino.I was very upset at Peter Mac's comments when I posted that. I still, however, have a suspicion that a number of Ulyssians are better off than me.

Hardly surprising though - most of the population are better off than me LOL.

And hey - I talk bollocks most of the time mate.

[spacemonkey]

What do you do to get banned from national?



Politics is where the only real sin is getting caught???

[drummer]

Once more, for the hard of hearing. The Government is the target. ACC does not have a mandate to do whatever it likes. It is directed by Govt. Ergo...the Govt is the target. If Govt 'rolls over', then ACC can only do what it is instructed, or allowed by law, to do.
Capische?
disagree..

Peter

[drummer]

Ian? where art thou?

[MSTRS]

disagree..

Peter

As is your right.
You are also wrong. Or you are really working for 'them'. Or you think we are stupid.
Or all three...

[drummer]

As is your right.
You are also wrong. Or you are really working for 'them'. Or you think we are stupid.
Or all three...
1) You don't mean people have rights here do you... I do have the right ?
2) No I'm not.. you are entitled to your opinion as I am
3) Yeah... I'm actually a Russian Spy... good grief... no I am a spy from Mars... good grief man don't be so stupid! Look at my posts...
4) Do I think "we are" stupid? ummm no... a few here are... right idiots but all here definitely not... you... I don't think you are stupid... a tad silly and as this is a troll thing anyhow...

Cya

Peter

[MSTRS]

*sigh*
ACC are not, and never were, calling the shots.
Targeting ACC is pointless, except to fuck with their figures by not registering. And really, how many are going to take that action?
The only way to fight this, is to target Nick the Prick and his cronies. THEY are the ones calling the shots. THEY are the ones that have to be convinced to roll back the changes. THEY are the ones that the collective 'we' have to convince it is in no-one's (especially their) best interest to keep dicking with ACC.
THE GOVERNMENT must be made to see that NZ will not stand for what they are doing. And that to continue will be political suicide.
In fact, all MPs, of all stripes, must be made to realise that ACC is NEVER to be fucked with. EVER.
ACC is off-limits to all political agendas.
NOT NEGOTIABLE.

[Waxxa]

*sigh*
ACC are not, and never were, calling the shots.
Targeting ACC is pointless, except to fuck with their figures by not registering. And really, how many are going to take that action?
The only way to fight this, is to target Nick the Prick and his cronies. THEY are the ones calling the shots. THEY are the ones that have to be convinced to roll back the changes. THEY are the ones that the collective 'we' have to convince it is in no-one's (especially their) best interest to keep dicking with ACC.
THE GOVERNMENT must be made to see that NZ will not stand for what they are doing. And that to continue will be political suicide.
In fact, all MPs, of all stripes, must be made to realise that ACC is NEVER to be fucked with. EVER.
ACC is off-limits to all political agendas.
NOT NEGOTIABLE.

+1 National appointed the current Board on ACC.

All political parties need to realise not to mess with ACC, not only National. :spanking:

[swbarnett]

*sigh*
ACC are not, and never were, calling the shots.
Targeting ACC is pointless, ...
Exactly. It's going to take a governmental policy change to get what we're after. Not something ACC has anything to do with (besides providing data that is suspect at best).

[short-circuit]

Ian? where art thou?

Right here retard, and it seems to me that no one is buying your bullshit.

[drummer]

*sigh*
ACC are not, and never were, calling the shots.
THE GOVERNMENT must be made to see that NZ will not stand for what they are doing. And that to continue will be political suicide.
In fact, all MPs, of all stripes, must be made to realise that ACC is NEVER to be fucked with. EVER.
ACC is off-limits to all political agendas.
NOT NEGOTIABLE.

I agree with a few things here, but ACC imho are calling the shots.. it shows because John Judge will get his way, if allowed... Myth is merely a puppet.. and thats what is wrong here... Smith should tell the ACC to pull it's head in, but hes been told figures by ACC that are rong but he HAS to spout... it is Judge who first called ACC an insurance company... I believe also that the government should be targeted however my difference in opinion is that the POLICY is the problem... and the weakness of Myth... the government is popular.. the polikcy is not... therein lies another problem.. to target a popular government is harder than to attack an unpopular CEO and unpopular policy... remember that even most Nat voters (that I talk to) don't believe the government is doing the right thing with being a puppet to ACC and Judge.

I agree also that ACC should be offlimits as far as the oodhouse principles are concerned.... to ALL parties..

Peter

[drummer]

Exactly. It's going to take a governmental policy change to get what we're after. .Agree here too, however... how to get that change... do we attack a popular government or an unpopular CEO and policy?

Peter

[short-circuit]

You're brain damaged Bummer. John Judge (and the rest of the ACC board) were political appointments.

How many times does it need to be said?: The National Party plan to privatise ACC - their ideology is free-market everything. Retard.

[taff1954]

... John Judge will get his way, if allowed...

And he will get his way because he is being told what to do. Get this through your head. Judge was appointed by National. He can be sacked by National. His strings are being pulled by others. As so many have said in this thread, National has long talked about the privatisation of ACC. Judge is the puppet, not Smith.

The only valid target is the National party.

[drummer]

(Edited for the sake of sensible people here
I'm Right here -Pete-, Ahh there ya are

Seriously ...Mate... I don't care about your political beliefs.. we here and outside of our little group need to be united... not divided.. or do you disagree? Imagine.. if you would for a tad... that we could put your differences with me behind you... and embrace some logic.. I don't claim to have all the answers... no one does... but I haven't heard ANY from you... just abuse.. except for this one.. rather a nice post once edited... stop and think about it... I'm prepared to listen to YOUR ideas... but what are they? Lay them down here... lets see hat YOU would do to lead a campaign against the ACC levies?

I'm all ears...

Peter

[drummer]

And he will get his way because he is being told what to do. Get this through your head. Judge was appointed by National. He can be sacked by National. His strings are being pulled by others. As so many have said in this thread, National has long talked about the privatisation of ACC. Judge is the puppet, not Smith.

The only valid target is the National party.Hey Taff

Judge was the first to call ACC an insurance company.. that was virtually proved at the Akl meeting...

Just think about the task of attacking the Nats as a whole... I don't disagree that currently as the party in power they set policy... however surely convincing more than half the nation that National it'[s self is bad rather than the policy.. thats a far harder ask... many are like me... National leaning and voting but hate to a core the new ACC policy... policy can change quickly... look at the foreshore and seabed under Labour... b ut Goverments riding very high in the polls don't..

Its plain easier...and doesn't marginalise Nat leaning riders...not all Nat voters.. including me.. like this policy. It may even.. no probably will make me rethink my party vote... not to Labour but who knows... the Kiwi party?

We must embrace I believe the idea of policy attack and change.. not try to single handedly bring down a whole government... policy change will win our cause WITH more support...

my 5c

Peter

[spacemonkey]

The only valid target is the National party.

Umm.... I'd be inclined to add the act party to the target list personally.



Although Nick Smith will always be first against the wall! :2guns:

[sinfull]

Hey Taff

Judge was the first to call ACC an insurance company.. that was virtually proved at the Akl meeting...

Just think about the task of attacking the Nats as a whole... I don't disagree that currently as the party in power they set policy... however surely convincing more than half the nation that National it'[s self is bad rather than the policy.. thats a far harder ask... many are like me... National leaning and voting but hate to a core the new ACC policy... policy can change quickly... look at the foreshore and seabed under Labour... b ut Goverments riding very high in the polls don't..

Its plain easier...and doesn't marginalise Nat leaning riders...not all Nat voters.. including me.. like this policy. It may even.. no probably will make me rethink my party vote... not to Labour but who knows... the Kiwi party?

We must embrace I believe the idea of policy attack and change.. not try to single handedly bring down a whole government... policy change will win our cause WITH more support...

my 5c

Peter
Nah mann the marajawaaananga party, thats who to vote for they swing any which way for a bit of good shit !~

Seriously though, where was it key (note the lack of caps) made his millions ?
Where did his campaign money come from ?
Who does he owe big time ?
Who was it (just after the election) that came up with the brilliant idea that ACC should be privatised ?
I bet key slapped himself on the forehead at the time thinking "Richaaaaard, i said vote with me on everything i say, don't blow it by revealing everything i said !"
Some seem to forget !
Others stand by with a slingshot !

Who stands to make millions if ACC IS privatised ?
Those who backed key !
Who backed key ?
Insurance !
Where did key make his millions ?
Insurance !
He owes them


Do we lie down ?

[drummer]

Seriously though, where was it key (note the lack of caps) made his millions ?
Where did his campaign money come from ?
Who does he owe big time ?
Who was it (just after the election) that came up with the brilliant idea that ACC should be privatised ?
I bet key slapped himself on the forehead at the time thinking "Richaaaaard, i said vote with me on everything i say, don't blow it by revealing everything i said !"
Some seem to forget !
Others stand by with a slingshot !
OK... I disagree with your ideas re John Key... but thats not relevant to this I believe.. what I am trying to get across to all of us here is that whether you like Key or the NP or don't... we need to embrace the idea of putting personal dislikes aside... why? Because like it or not.. John Key and the Nats are hugely popular... look outside the square... imagine trying to convince all the John Key voters to vote for labour because of ACC levies... lets get real... the Kiwi way is for people to roll over and take it... surely however, a policy attack WILL win many National and Key supporters... Even Nat voters can hate a certain policy.. even MP's... look at Maurice Williamson in the last few years!!

Peter

[drummer]

Who stands to make millions if ACC IS privatised ?
Those who backed key !
Who backed key ?
Insurance !
Where did key make his millions ?
Insurance !
He owes them
Do we lie down ?For a start i believe the talk of privatising ACC is not on the table at least for this election.. and we must never forget that it was Labour who privatised all and sundry in the 80's...

No we don't lie down but we play smart...

Peter

[sinfull]

OK... I disagree with your ideas re John Key... but thats not relevant to this I believe.. what I am trying to get across to all of us here is that whether you like Key or the NP or don't... we need to embrace the idea of putting personal dislikes aside... why? Because like it or not.. John Key and the Nats are hugely popular... look outside the square... imagine trying to convince all the John Key voters to vote for labour because of ACC levies... lets get real... the Kiwi way is for people to roll over and take it... surely however, a policy attack WILL win many National and Key supporters... Even Nat voters can hate a certain policy.. even MP's... look at Maurice Williamson in the last few years!!

PeterWho the fuck is maurice williamson ? And i bet you dissagree, you went from sleeper to the most frequent poster on KB since this go to war thread !
Do you dispute what (you happen to have just quoted me on) i said re key ?
Was he not an insurance man ?
Did they not back him in his campaign ?
do you not think he owes them big time ?
Did Richarrrrd Pebble not come up with the brilliant idea that ACC should be privatised ?
Has he not been remarrrkably quiet since ?

What say you ?

[carver]

Nah, not me, you guys did not help me in my campaign of lawless use of motorcycles

[sinfull]

For a start i believe the talk of privatising ACC is not on the table at least for this election.. and we must never forget that it was Labour who privatised all and sundry in the 80's...

No we don't lie down but we play smart...

PeterWho do you think really believes that it's going to happen over night !!
Patient men these investors aye ?

[short-circuit]

(Edited for the sake of sensible people hereAhh there ya are

Seriously ...Mate... I don't care about your political beliefs.. we here and outside of our little group need to be united... not divided.. or do you disagree? Imagine.. if you would for a tad... that we could put your differences with me behind you... and embrace some logic.. I don't claim to have all the answers... no one does... but I haven't heard ANY from you... just abuse.. except for this one.. rather a nice post once edited... stop and think about it... I'm prepared to listen to YOUR ideas... but what are they? Lay them down here... lets see hat YOU would do to lead a campaign against the ACC levies?

I'm all ears...

Peter

It's a lost battle and clowns like you have made certain of that. Unlike you, I didn't contribute to the problem in the first place (with my vote) - I believe prevention is the best policy.

As far as what to do from here, as I have said continuously - the only hope is maximal distruption with maximum numbers, media exposure and political pressure. It's not popular, but I'd take the militant option every time - hence the appropriateness of my posting in this thread.

As far as I can see (and true to form), you are still trying to deflect responsibility from yourself, and the National Party. Though you claim not to be a member anymore (if you'll excuse the pun), you still seem to be in recruiting mode.

[drummer]

It's a lost battle Unlike you, I didn't contribute to the problem in the first place (with my vote) - I believe prevention is the best policy.Fair enuf... But I believe Labour caused heaps of problems for many people....thats why Labour were tossed out... but lets stick to ACC


As far as what to do from here, as I have said continuously - the only hope is maximal distruption with maximum numbers, media exposure and political pressure. It's not popular, but I'd take the militant option every time - hence the appropriateness of my posting in this thread.Ian.. you have every right to post anyhere.. just not the apparent right you think you have to abuse and condone violence...


Though you claim not to be a member anymore you still seem to be in recruiting mode.Oh really thats just stupid... or you don't believe me... but I don't mind... if you really want to believe that.. go right ahead.. I am merely saying.. lets put whatever illfeeling you have.. and I once had towards u behind us.. I don't agree with your approach.. but some do... what I am doing is trying to get you and I to understand WHY we believe our approaches although different are effective.. Give me a reason why your approach will be better or more effective than mine... or even should be tried... convince myself and others here (yes... there are MANY other people here whol voted Nat...) but first... do me a favour... read my ideas again and don't pass judgement based on your love of Labour and hatred of all things National..

Peter

[StoneY]

Fair enuf... But I believe Labour caused heaps of problems for many people....thats why Labour were tossed out... but lets stick to ACC

No, seeing as you broach it, Labour were tossed out because of APATHY, and also people disliked Helen Clark's image or the truths her cabinet forced upon us. (such as BUYING back our fuckin countries assetts, moron)
The very same reason asswipes like you belive Nix Myth, he aint Labour.



Ian.. you have every right to post anyhere.. just not the apparent right you think you have to abuse and condone violence...

Violence...where? Im a mere Labour voter I wanna bash someone :lol:


Oh really thats just stupid... or you don't believe me...
Peter

Ummmmm...... your stupid, no we dont believe you

Now be a good little National supporter, crawl into a hole and pull it in behind yourself

Your Uncle John is out next election I don't care what numbers his popularity poll shows today.
In 2 years when ACC has been shredded, and injured Kiwi's use their holiday pay when injured as ACC wont kick in till its all been used up (TRUE change under new initiatives) you will be one of the WANKERS claiming "i fought this, its unfair' when all you have done is bleat, and suck John Key, John Judge, Nick Smith and Kieth Mclea's dicks!!!

AND gargled then blew bubbles!

Piss off drummer, your either part of the solution, or you are the problem itself, right now, the latter shines out your arse

Ok Mods, send the redrep/infringements, I am openly abusing this cocksucker, but ffs, its worth 100 points let alone the 8 you will give me

More bourbon anyone?

[StoneY]

Who do you think really believes that it's going to happen over night !!
Patient men these investors aye ?

Far more patient than my slingshot wielding bruvver from the north
:)

Bring on the slingshots, Goliath who?

[Katman]

Now be a good little National supporter, crawl into a hole and pull it in behind yourself

Your Uncle John is out next election I don't care what numbers his popularity poll shows today.
In 2 years when ACC has been shredded, and injured Kiwi's use their holiday pay when injured as ACC wont kick in till its all been used up (TRUE change under new initiatives) you will be one of the WANKERS claiming "i fought this, its unfair' when all you have done is bleat, and suck John Key, John Judge, Nick Smith and Kieth Mclea's dicks!!!

AND gargled then blew bubbles!

Piss off drummer, your either part of the solution, or you are the problem itself, right now, the latter shines out your arse

Ok Mods, send the redrep/infringements, I am openly abusing this cocksucker, but ffs, its worth 100 points let alone the 8 you will give me

More bourbon anyone?

Hey, I don't think much of your delivery.

:whistle:

[sinfull]

Far more patient than my slingshot wielding bruvver from the north
:)

Bring on the slingshots, Goliath who?

So did ya get 100 points ? lol Oh wait ya won't be repling if ya do haha
You need to be more like me man and become a peace loving critter when ya drink bourbon !!! Bwahahahaha grrrr love a peace o that !

Ok so the spelling goes to shit !

[mikeey01]

I have said time and time again.... that the way to fight party policy

:corn:


We need to attack policy.....you go and have your war...

:corn: :drinkup:


...what I am trying to get across to all of us here is that whether you like Key or the NP or don't......

:corn: :drinkup:


We must embrace I believe the idea of policy attack and change.. policy change will win our cause WITH more support...


:corn: burbbbbb :thud:


Think policy change not government change...

:kick: ___ :bash: ___ :Offtopic: Call to War!

Peter you go do your thing!

Right E O folks anyone know of any good chains to rattle first?

[StoneY]

Still replying (I hope)

:lol:

Waiting for it tho...

Anyway, next step, the continuing battle

Have a wee event in Welly this Sat, and then onto the serious planning of the BIG event for Feb

Yes, too late to change thier minds, but wait, it will be fueled by the sheer OUTRAGE of the rest of NZ when they wake up and find they're 'insured' as opposed to 24/7 no fault cover they had a month before.........


30,000 at parliament, lets make it happen!

[drummer]

Ummmmm...... Your Uncle John is out next election I don't care what numbers his popularity poll shows today.?Dear me.... what a tirade... have I upset you?

"My" uncle John.. you have me in stitches... go and have YOUR war... maybe Ian will join u... and a few others...

You are wrong about one thing in particular.. Nats WILL be in after the next election whether you or I want it or not.. Labour are finished for a while now... too much Damage from Clarke.. we need to accept that. I will do my part but I don't go to war against a government who will in easily.. I will work with other decent people here who want to change the policy and restore ACC to fairness and equity...

Now.. when you've finished being an abusive alcolholic, perhaps you may want to apologise... I've never abused u... dear me you Labour people sometimes get into a frenzy!! LOL...

Peter

[sinfull]

Dear me.... what a tirade... have I upset you?

"My" uncle John.. you have me in stitches... go and have YOUR war... maybe Ian will join u... and a few others...

You are wrong about one thing in particular.. Nats WILL be in after the next election hether you or I want it or not.. Labour are finished for a while now... too much Damage from Clarke.. we need to accept that. I will do my part but I on't ho to war against a government who will in easily.. I will work ith other decent people here who want to change the policy and restore ACC to fairness and equity...

Now.. when you've finished being an abusive alcolholic, perhaps you may want to apologise... I've never abused u... dear me you Labour people sometimes get into a frenzy!! LOL...

PeterDid you set your alarm for this one ! You should be more aware, bourbon drinkers are similar to crack hoes ! We just want to fuck with someone all night rather than sleep but usually do it very badly !

Funny thing is i have never voted, but may well do next election !!

[drummer]

:corn:



:corn: :drinkup:



:corn: :drinkup:



:corn: burbbbbb :thud:



:kick: ___ :bash: ___ :Offtopic: Call to War!

Peter you go do your thing!

Cheers.. I think!
P

[drummer]

Did you set your alarm for this one ! You should be more aware, bourbon drinkers are similar to crack hoes ! We just want to fuck with someone all night rather than sleep but usually do it very badly !

Funny thing is i have never voted, but may well do next election !!Hehe

No can't sleep and having few ales whilst invoicing clients... bloody tired and a bit over the abuse really... I'll anser that other thing tomorro... can't think well at mo
cya

Peter

[sinfull]

Hehe

No can't sleep and having few ales whilst invoicing clients... bloody tired and a bit over the abuse really... I'll anser that other thing tomorro... can't think well at mo
cya

Peter Yeah you said you'd answer that other thing tommorrow in the PM you sent earlier ! When you said you were too tired to answer that other thing and were going to sleep, should i go look what time you sent that PM ?
Sleep well sleeper !
I will look forward to your posts tommorrow !~

[drummer]

Yeah you said you'd answer that other thing tommorrow in the PM you sent earlier ! When you said you were too tired to answer that other thing and were going to sleep, should i go look what time you sent that PM ?
Sleep well sleeper !
I will look forward to your posts tommorrow !~Cheers mate.. stressed out at mo.. end of term stuff and all that... couldn't sleep and an awake wife aint happy!

Must sleeeeppppp up at 5am..:yawn:

keep the head up...

Peter

[sinfull]

Cheers mate.. stressed out at mo.. end of term stuff and all that... couldn't sleep and an awake wife aint happy!

Must sleeeeppppp up at 5am..:yawn:

keep the head up...

PeterJust found your thread hahahah what a crock !

Someone said it well when they said "One must wonder who is working for whom, from the inside" I gave up a page or so after that (but i will go back) and i notice there was no repute from your corner ???
Hi to the wife !:cold:

[Conquiztador]

The Welly BIKEOI was good. (I do ride for less worthy causes and enjoy it!)

The "BULLSHIT" remarks were spot on. (Made Smittys lies drown in the noise)

Tha lack of understanding from our government was no surprise. (They are pushing on, nothing can stand in the way, after all, they know best what is good for us, we are only foolish plebs)

The "reduced" increases of the ACC fees were as expected. (They got exactley what they were always planning)

The Ulysses approach was a dissappointment. (The name will now be used by bikers when wanting to say: "Thank's for fucking me up my ass, I really liked that!")

Now the issue will be to keep the momentum going. This will be hard. Many reason that we have won; the fees are not as high as initially adviced.

But, as I have always stated, the main problem is to have one cause that all can subscribe to. Once we start to look at ideological reasons why we should keep the fight going it will fall apart. We all have different political views and we all have different results we want. Only one thing can keep us all going: One common enemy (We had that: The high levies). Some on here have a deeper conviction, they want to change things forever. Most of us just want to keep our money.

I do not have the answer where to from here. But I would like to be part of some more hard hitting action. Get some scars I can show my grandkids... ;)

[MSTRS]

Now the issue will be to keep the momentum going. This will be hard. Many reason that we have won; the fees are not as high as initially adviced.



I'm not so sure that the road will be as hard as you say. More and more people are 'getting it'. I'm doing my level best to put this stuff in front of them. An extract from my latest missive...

Barring m/c levies, car levies, earner and employer levies have been raised a small amount. Again. In 2008, an employee paid 78 cents/$100, that jumped to $1.70/$100 this year and next year it’ll be $2/$100. But no increase on the petrol levy this time. We can all be somewhat relieved at that news. Or can we? All the signs are there for us to recognise that this ‘backdown’ by the minister is only temporary. He’ll be back next year for some more. And the year after that.

[StoneY]

Now.. when you've finished being an abusive alcolholic, perhaps you may want to apologise... I've never abused u... dear me you Labour people sometimes get into a frenzy!! LOL...

Peter

For a start, im not an alchoholic, and was relatively sober

Secondly, it will be a cold day in hell before I ever apologise to a arrogant pratt like you
It was worth the infraction to post what I said

Have a great day Peter
And if you think JK is still gonna be round in 3 years, thats your privellege, I for one disagree
:rockon:

[short-circuit]

For a start, im not an alchoholic, and was relatively sober

Secondly, it will be a cold day in hell before I ever apologise to a arrogant pratt like you
It was worth the infraction to post what I said

Have a great day Peter
And if you think JK is still gonna be round in 3 years, thats your privellege, I for one disagree
:rockon:


Check out flip flop number four:

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[Conquiztador]

From http://www.acc.co.nz/PRD_EXT_CSMP/groups/external_levies/documents/faq/prd_ctrb118108.doc

"4. What is the proposed employer and self-employed levy rate for 2010/11? The combined average work levy rate proposed for 2010/11 is $1.89 per $100 of payroll or earnings from self-employment – which is 58 cents higher than the current rate of $1.31."

So that is an increase of approx 40%...


But then I find this ( at http://www.voxy.co.nz/politics/smith-government-announces-201011-acc-levy-rates/5/32788 )

"The Government has adopted the following rates:  The Earners' Account Levy (paid by all employees and self employed to cover their non-work, non-motor vehicle injuries) will increase from $1.70 to $2.00 (including GST) per $100 of liable earnings from 1 April 2010.  The average composite employer and self-employed levy will increase from $1.31 to $1.47 per $100 of payroll from 1 April 2010. This levy excludes GST and is an average rate. Individual rates for industry groups may be higher or lower.  The ACC component of the motor vehicle license fee for a petrol car will increase from $168.46 to $198.46 from 1 July 2010 while the ACC petrol levy will remain at 9.90 cents per litre."

I stand confused.

EDIT: Correction: Clearly the first was the proposded one by ACC and the second one the adapted by the gummint!

[MSTRS]

From http://www.acc.co.nz/PRD_EXT_CSMP/groups/external_levies/documents/faq/prd_ctrb118108.doc

"4. What is the proposed employer and self-employed levy rate for 2010/11? The combined average work levy rate proposed for 2010/11 is $1.89 per $100 of payroll or earnings from self-employment – which is 58 cents higher than the current rate of $1.31."

So that is an increase of approx 40%...

But the 'final' figure is only $1.47...only 11%. What's inflation running at?
Any rise is abhorrent.

[Karl08]

Thought this thread was a "Call to War"... unity, forging on against a common foe etc.

From the cheap seats, my view is this- if there are those who are not committed to the same course of action as most people seem to be, then do not waste ours and your time by trying to divide the "ranks".

Have your own opinion by all means, but once we start sniping at each other, we run the risk of causing more damage to our cause than Nick and his cronies could ever hope to do.

So start your own thread (as some have done), continue your conversations via PM (as some have done), hell- even talk face to face ; but the personal attacks of the nature we have seen run the great risk of deterring potential "recruits". Our sights needs to be set on the "common enemy", not constantly being distracted by fighting from within.

This is not a "why can't we all get along" impassioned plea- I am not that naive, nor am I a hippy. I am simply saying, we either fight the enemy or we fight ourselves.

Your choice.

[StoneY]

From todays Herald Opinion section, a nice write up by some smart people

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=10615740&pnum=0

Hes losing face....2 more years at this rate and we will win


Two issues have clearly spooked the Prime Minister.

First, leading businesspeople have made it clear they are not impressed with the quick-fire manner in which Key publicly jettisoned the recommendations that Don Brash's team rolled out in the 2025 Taskforce's first report.

While the business sector doesn't adopt Brash's report holus bolus, many are not happy that the Government's standard response to many politically unpalatable options has been to close off debate rather than engage in the substantive recommendations, many of which simply mirror suggestions by reputable bodies like the OECD.

Second, the latest TV3 poll shows nearly 40 per cent of respondents believe Key is more about "style than substance" .

The upshot is this rating on the preferred Prime Minister stakes has dropped to under 50 per cent for the first time this year.

He has also suffered a 9.4 per cent loss on the approval ratings for how he is performing his role.

[oldrider]

The Welly BIKEOI was good. (I do ride for less worthy causes and enjoy it!)

The "BULLSHIT" remarks were spot on. (Made Smittys lies drown in the noise)

Tha lack of understanding from our government was no surprise. (They are pushing on, nothing can stand in the way, after all, they know best what is good for us, we are only foolish plebs)

The "reduced" increases of the ACC fees were as expected. (They got exactley what they were always planning)

The Ulysses approach was a dissappointment. (The name will now be used by bikers when wanting to say: "Thank's for fucking me up my ass, I really liked that!")

Now the issue will be to keep the momentum going. This will be hard. Many reason that we have won; the fees are not as high as initially adviced.

But, as I have always stated, the main problem is to have one cause that all can subscribe to. Once we start to look at ideological reasons why we should keep the fight going it will fall apart. We all have different political views and we all have different results we want. Only one thing can keep us all going: One common enemy (We had that: The high levies). Some on here have a deeper conviction, they want to change things forever. Most of us just want to keep our money.

I do not have the answer where to from here. But I would like to be part of some more hard hitting action. Get some scars I can show my grandkids... ;)

I reckon that you are right on the money CQ, all the political bias will kill this initiative through division!

None of the current political aspirants (parties) will do a damn thing for motorcyclists unless they can see us as a united pressure group worthy of their attention!

So far non of our motorcycle leaders have demonstrated the ability to rise to that level IMHO but I think Les has been the most impressive so far!

He has won my respect even though we are poles apart politically!

[phred]

Thought this thread was a "Call to War"... unity, forging on against a common foe etc.

From the cheap seats, my view is this- if there are those who are not committed to the same course of action as most people seem to be, then do not waste ours and your time by trying to divide the "ranks".

Have your own opinion by all means, but once we start sniping at each other, we run the risk of causing more damage to our cause than Nick and his cronies could ever hope to do.

So start your own thread (as some have done), continue your conversations via PM (as some have done), hell- even talk face to face ; but the personal attacks of the nature we have seen run the great risk of deterring potential "recruits". Our sights needs to be set on the "common enemy", not constantly being distracted by fighting from within.

This is not a "why can't we all get along" impassioned plea- I am not that naive, nor am I a hippy. I am simply saying, we either fight the enemy or we fight ourselves.

Your choice.

Egg Zachary.
Stop bitchin and start organising.
This is a motorcycle forum not a political forum.

[StoneY]

I have been organising...another huge event coming in Feb that will dwarf the BIKEOI (not belittle it, add to its momentum I hope)

There is no possibility of this topic NOT becoming political, its politics right at its very core, and sadly yes its an us vs the Nats issue, so many Nats supporters are going to be offended, (eggs and omlettes)

Motorcycle forum or not, this is a POLITICAL battle, and I for one am just grateful Spankme and the KB web team have given us dedicated ACC Campaign (a political campaign whether you like it or not) space to post, rant, and discuss (read ARGUE) this issue

I like Oldriders post above too, nice post mate im out of bling tho, sending tomorro lol
:(

It is true to get to united views is gonna be real hard, lets try focus on the target, but even then that goes full circle and we are back to politics, because as we all know the politics are driving this issue, the attempted privatization of ACC by stealth and dishonesty

[Bald Eagle]

I have been organising...another huge event coming in Feb that will dwarf the BIKEOI (not belittle it, add to its momentum I hope)

There is no possibility of this topic NOT becoming political, its politics right at its very core, and sadly yes its an us vs the Nats issue, so many Nats supporters are going to be offended, (eggs and omlettes)

Motorcycle forum or not, this is a POLITICAL battle, and I for one am just grateful Spankme and the KB web team have given us dedicated ACC Campaign (a political campaign whether you like it or not) space to post, rant, and discuss (read ARGUE) this issue

I like Oldriders post above too, nice post mate im out of bling tho, sending tomorro lol
:(

It is true to get to united views is gonna be real hard, lets try focus on the target, but even then that goes full circle and we are back to politics, because as we all know the politics are driving this issue, the attempted privatization of ACC by stealth and dishonesty

We all have to realise that this issue is bigger than bikes or party loyalties. It's time to be bigger than 'party loyalties" and make our stand on the basis of whats best for all NZ'ers. Unlike the members of parliament who are required by their party rules to tow the party line we have the freedom off speaking and acting according to our own concsiences on this issue.

We also have an opportunity to remind politicians of all parties that the voters have a voice and we will be heard. They ignore us at their peril.

P.S bling awarded on your behalf.

[oldrider]

driving this issue, the attempted privatization of ACC by stealth and dishonesty


Personally I am a motorcyclist first and foremost!

Political loyalties or not the above is the driving issue for me and the underlying conspiracy against motorcycles, driven by the AA opportunists!

They must be made to learn not to mess with motorcyclists, full stop!

Under MMP the politicians and their particular circus are as diverse as we are, if we remain strong and true it will only be a matter of who flinches first, let it be them!

Beware of these, this is a flinch. :eek5:

[NighthawkNZ]

A call to arms...
We were practising our call to arms at Kopara (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showpost.php?p=1129571332&postcount=876) and here (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showpost.php?p=1129568008&postcount=816)

http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=96045&page=44

We should send in all images and video's to Nix myth... this us getting angry :D

[mikeey01]

From todays Herald Opinion section, a nice write up by some smart people
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=10615740&pnum=0 [/I]

Nice find Stoney... I much prefer this line 2010 "Is going to be an important year".. me thinks lets mess this up for em... How best can we be a pain in the arse for them? pointing out each lie?
Month after month, no let up and gaining momentum on each.

Behind the scenes, the Prime Minister stresses that 2010 will be a very important year for his Government. He plans to stake out an economic plan that people "can understand and buy into".

The last bit grates me "can understand and buy into" In other words more lifes, bull shit and deceit.

[Blue TLS]

This ones for drummer and all other nat supporters

http://www.thestandard.org.nz/merryl-lynch-nats-will-privatise-acc/


john key is going to privatise acc smith, judge etc are taking orders from him.

Standard national policy keep the poor people poor but smile while you're doing it

now everyone stop bitchin at each other so we can try and stop ACC becoming an australian insurance company

New slogan "Whats Next, Sell Kiwibank"

[Blue TLS]

The enemy has been identified and the battle lines are drawn, I'm digging in and then I will attempt to unleash the secret weapon. The plan is sound but relies on external influence so it could be an abysmal failure or the fastest solution to our problem, have to do a wee bit more research and get some inside info.

Timing will be critical and I'll probably need a bit of help from some of the troops, might have to bounce the idea off Stoney and Ixion first to get their opinion and maybe advice

2010 is going to be an exciting year whichever path the battle follows

"We shall fight on the beaches
We shall fight on the landing ground
We shall fight in the fields and in the streets
We shall fight in the hills
We will never surrender"

Or something like that from Churchills speech at the start of "Ace's High" by Iron Maiden

[oldrider]

This ones for drummer and all other nat supporters

http://www.thestandard.org.nz/merryl-lynch-nats-will-privatise-acc/


john key is going to privatise acc smith, judge etc are taking orders from him.

Standard national policy keep the poor people poor but smile while you're doing it

now everyone stop bitchin at each other so we can try and stop ACC becoming an australian insurance company

New slogan "Whats Next, Sell Kiwibank"

ACC (welfare) is a no choice State owned monopoly! Open to abuse and political interference, political fiddling and political price fixing! (Current situation)

Private ACCident insurance is open to competition and personal choice! Not as subject to political interference but is still open to abuse!

Competition means, if you don't like the deal you are getting, (unlike with state monopoly) you can go somewhere else!

With current ACC monopoly, you can't go to another provider! Your only recourse is to stage rallies and protests, just as we are doing at present!

These two choices are the result of political ideals being foisted onto the voting public because they are too stupid to vote for the one they want!

New Zealanders don't vote for what they want, they only vote "out" what they are sick of! (MMP makes it even worse)

Then they react to whatever the new government gives them, when, of course it's too bloody late!

MMP Governments do not fear rallies, protests etc, if they have the numbers, they just get on with it!

They know that the voters will blow themselves apart by concentrating on and defending their political persuasions, in preference to focussing on the outcome they want from their protestations!

Me, I believe the danger for the mob (us) is in the wilderness of indecision between the two extremes! (where we are currently)

If you don't decide on one or the other and go for it in a united front, the whole protest mission is doomed to failure! IMHO

This is basically a socialist country so the one most likely to succeed is ACC (welfare) monopoly!

Not my personal choice but I would run with it for the chance to win the day! Why? Because I am a motorcyclist and we are being used and lied to and about!

If you want to enter into a fight, you must know your enemy and know what it is you are fighting "for", then how well you fight depends upon how much you want the victory!

Remember that in this fight, you will be paying for the costs of both sides, your taxes are propping up the enemy to fight against you, while you scratch and scrape to finance your own efforts as well!

The odds are really stacked in the enemies (government) favour and they are only there because of public apathy in the first place!

Remember, it will be long and will not be easy! :oi-grr:

Are you ready to commit yourself to the entire "war"? :shifty:

[MSTRS]

Can you submit that post as a letter to ed in a national daily?

[Blue TLS]

Hello Oldrider, very well written post with a couple of points we should all consider. Personally I only want ACC as it was originally intended not the farce it has become and if I had to choose between privatisation or current ACC privatisation would win and a bunch of aussies would get richer.

And yes its going to be a long hard war but Ive been riding for 27 years and it'll be a cold day in hell before I let any person or party price me or legislate me off the road.

Look out john key for you have awoken the sleeping monster and he will not rest until you either capitulate or resign.

Bikoi 09 surprised everyone, we are a force to be reckoned with and our numbers and support are swelling. Me, I cant wait to get stuck in 2010 will be the year we turn that surprise into shock and horror for our enemy, if we all stick together we can make the partys understand we will not be ripped off we will not be victimized and we will not be silenced. Time to stand up and say this is our country and we will not let you sell it to the highest bidder

Time for a ride, see you all at the next protest

[DEVVIL]

And yes its going to be a long hard war but Ive been riding for 27 years and it'll be a cold day in hell before I let any person or party price me or legislate me off the road.


[/QUOTE]

See you all in Wellington Feb 2010