MotoGP to 1000cc in 2012 [Archive]

Crasherfromwayback

12th December 2009, 10:36

Yeah I reckon! Although I think SBK should turf T/C too.

I think it's a good thing for the factories to develop...but I'd rather see them develop it on production based bikes...not out and out racers!

What Honda V5?

Think he's referring to the now extinct RC211V

James Deuce

12th December 2009, 10:43

I popped this up this morning.

The regs are in pdf format.

http://krnewsroom.blogspot.com/2009/12/motogp-returns-to-litre-format-for-2012.html

Pussy

12th December 2009, 10:52

I think it's a good thing for the factories to develop...but I'd rather see them develop it on production based bikes...not out and out racers!

Good call! :niceone:

scracha

12th December 2009, 11:25

Max bore 81mm. Hmm...oval pistons anyone?

Would rather they sorted out a good 4 smoke replacement for the 125's meeself.

James Deuce

12th December 2009, 11:27

Max bore 81mm. Hmm...oval pistons anyone?

Would rather they sorted out a good 4 smoke replacement for the 125's meeself.

KTM are testing 450cc singles in their 125 chassis under FIM direction. Looks like KTM's reward for keeping things interesting in 125s.

I'd prefer a 3 cylinder 450cc class myself.

Fatjim

12th December 2009, 12:06

I hear they will be going to 925cc in 2014, followed by a return to 1000cc in 2020.

AllanB

12th December 2009, 12:53

I'd prefer a 3 cylinder 450cc class myself.

Shit yeah - that would be the bees. :banana:

I don't see why they are restricting the number of cylinders to 4 - Maximum of 8 would be good with V6 & V8's running at 25,000 30,000 rpms :headbang:

lostinflyz

12th December 2009, 14:10

KTM are testing 450cc singles in their 125 chassis under FIM direction. Looks like KTM's reward for keeping things interesting in 125s.

I'd prefer a 3 cylinder 450cc class myself.

arent ktm ditching there 125 program at the end of the year????

single motorcross engines would be the gayest sound on a gp grid ever.

James Deuce

12th December 2009, 14:14

arent ktm ditching there 125 program at the end of the year????

single motorcross engines would be the gayest sound on a gp grid ever.

Yes, that's what I'm saying. Looks like they will be getting ready for the replacement class rather than participating.

NZsarge

12th December 2009, 17:28

I think it's a good thing for the factories to develop...but I'd rather see them develop it on production based bikes...not out and out racers!

Race bikes are race bikes, SBK no less so. Let them develop T/C on road bikes on the road.

gammaguy

12th December 2009, 17:33

I hear they will be going to 925cc in 2014, followed by a return to 1000cc in 2020.

i hear that by 2021 they will all be electric/solar powered trikes,ridden by highly trained monkeys,will have no noise no emissions and no carbon footprint.

oh...and no spectators either.:(

Crasherfromwayback

12th December 2009, 17:54

Race bikes are race bikes, SBK no less so. Let them develop T/C on road bikes on the road.

Can't agree with you there sorry. Superbikes are a totally different animal to a moto gp bike, just as my 250 proddie race bike was a waaaaaay different animal to my Honda RS250 GP bike.

Superbikes are glorified road bikes...GP bikes of ANY type/size are race bikes.

NZsarge

12th December 2009, 18:18

Can't agree with you there sorry. Superbikes are a totally different animal to a moto gp bike, just as my 250 proddie race bike was a waaaaaay different animal to my Honda RS250 GP bike.

Superbikes are glorified road bikes...GP bikes of ANY type/size are race bikes.
I did'nt say they were'nt.
On 1000cc Production bike i'd agree but if you pulled down a road bike then the so called equivalent SBK machine I highly doubt you'd see to much in common.
Whatever, I don't think traction control should be allowed in SBK or Moto GP, that was my point. It should be up to the riders brain and right hand to control how fast the bike goes in top level racing.
Mind you when you think back to particularly Philip Island watching Rossi and some other geezer, he was Austrailian I think, you'd have to wonder if the traction control was'nt turned off.

Crasherfromwayback

12th December 2009, 18:37

Whatever, I don't think traction control should be allowed in SBK or Moto GP, that was my point. It should be up to the riders brain and right hand to control how fast the bike goes in top level racing.
Mind you when you think back to particularly Philip Island watching Rossi and some other geezer, he was Austrailian I think, you'd have to wonder if the traction control was'nt turned off.

I hear what you're saying! I think they should allow TC in Superbikes...great place to develop stuff mere mortals like us can really use..and leave the TC out of Moto GP. That way...when you're something REALLY special as a racer you can show us all how good you are without TC! I was at Phillip Island this year...only reminded me of just how good Stoner really is. He's the ONLY guy I've EVER seen wick it up through turn 3 there like that.

James Deuce

12th December 2009, 18:46

Only guy running with most of the electronics turned off too.

scracha

13th December 2009, 08:04

I'd prefer a 3 cylinder 450cc class myself.
Would have been nice but suspect it'd be too similar to the 600 4's, which were a step in the wrong direction.

imdying

15th December 2009, 14:00

Leave TC to Superbikers and let the REAL show begin.Given the years passed since the 500s and the related development time lost, they should add in 650cc V4 strokers too :D

Crasherfromwayback

15th December 2009, 14:04

Given the years passed since the 500s and the related development time lost, they should add in 650cc V4 strokers too :D

Be great to seem them back! Bigger and badder than ever.

imdying

15th December 2009, 14:24

I watched a 'best GP races of the eighties' DVD the other night, was freakin glorious watching those mad bastards with their finely honed right wrists :rockon:

Traction control... geepers, they even had to push start them early on :wacko:

javawocky

15th December 2009, 15:27

imdying

15th December 2009, 15:49

Belongs to a good mate, if I were to take a lappy to his place, shouldn't be too hard to image it. It was a vintage Duke one, and a really good watch.

Toast

15th December 2009, 16:34

And where, pray tell, does one get ones hand on a copy of that there DVD? :drool:

I bought mine from Cycletreads. Call them and see if they can get you one

Ivan

15th December 2009, 17:52

the thing is the 450 singles wouldnt be motox engines theyd be using them now but they would be proper prototype engines just like the 125 engine now its not a motox engine I think it could be pretty cool

James Deuce

15th December 2009, 17:54

Nah, refined Moto-X engines for sure, but sealed units all built by KTM would be my guess.

Looks like the hydraulically operated mechanicals ban is to prevent Honda's DCT making it to MotoGP.

gatch

15th December 2009, 18:13

Nah, refined Moto-X engines for sure, but sealed units all built by KTM would be my guess.

Looks like the hydraulically operated mechanicals ban is to prevent Honda's DCT making it to MotoGP.

That is also gay, motogp is the elite of the elite (as far as short track racing goes), they should be allowed to use the forbidden techmolojies.

Ivan

15th December 2009, 19:48

what makes me laugh Vtec is banned its such a great system i have a Vtec car and love the power it makes you have torque down low and just full on power up high and love the kick back feel you get when the Vtec opens up, Moto 2 has banned this dumb!

The engines will be based on original motox engines like the RS once was but then it will develop over time and I dont think holding onto 1 make brands sealed engines is a good idea I hate it, At this level especially GP its about the team and rider being able to all bring together one good package not everyone on the same engine no work aloud

James Deuce

15th December 2009, 20:17

At this level especially GP its about the team and rider being able to all bring together one good package not everyone on the same engine no work aloud

It was. It's now about the MotoGP brand. Get used to it. They'll still be knife-edge mofos to ride.

MotoGP faces a real problem. Their ONLY star is Rossi. when he retires the racing better be damn close or people will switch off in droves. They will anyway, but if the racing is good, then it will lessen the impact of Rossi leaving. Their only other hope is if Simoncelli and Lorenzo can increase their fruitiness factor to the point where the general media notice.

Badjelly

16th December 2009, 16:32

Hmm, if bore size is 81 mm, maximum number of cylinders is 4, so stroke is ...... 48.5 mm, implying a bore/stroke ratio of 1.67, which I think is not all that high by modern standards.

Oh never mind, Kropotkin has said it all already

http://www.motomatters.com/news/2009/12/11/new_2012_motogp_regulations_4_cylinders_.html

pritch

21st December 2009, 14:50

I think it's a good thing for the factories to develop...but I'd rather see them develop it on production based bikes...not out and out racers!

The owners of the rights to World Superbikes have already fired a legal shot across the bows of Dorna. Can't remember the exact wording but it was to the effect that any attempt to create a MotoGP formula involving "production" engines would be met with an immediate legal challenge. Superbikes, Suoersport, etc being the racing classes for production based machines.

That KTM RC4 looks a delightful little confection. A 450 single cylinder racing bike might sound odd at first but there was a time when single cylinder engines weren't just heard on trail rides.

To replace the 125 class with moto cross engined bikes of 250, or 450, or whatever, might make a good cost effective option. As long as they can avoid the use of that word "production":....

slowpoke

21st December 2009, 15:54

The owners of the rights to World Superbikes have already fired a legal shot across the bows of Dorna. Can't remember the exact wording but it was to the effect that any attempt to create a MotoGP formula involving "production" engines would be met with an immediate legal challenge. Superbikes, Suoersport, etc being the racing classes for production based machines.

That KTM RC4 looks a delightful little confection. A 450 single cylinder racing bike might sound odd at first but there was a time when single cylinder engines weren't just heard on trail rides.

To replace the 125 class with moto cross engined bikes of 250, or 450, or whatever, might make a good cost effective option. As long as they can avoid the use of that word "production":....

Interesting but it's hard to see how someone can claim the legal rights to any form of racing, production based or not. Unless it's a breach of an agreement between WSB and MotoGP organisers?

pritch

21st December 2009, 17:43

I'm sure the lawyers will be pleased to represent the various factions.
For a fee. The threat was discussed by the commentators during the running of one of this years SBK rounds.

The two MotoX engined KTM machines featured in BIKE were in all other respects pukka GP bikes. The 450 had been shoehorned into a 250 GP frame and running gear, the 250 into a 125 GP frame. They both looked the part. These bikes were apparently an exercise conducted at the request of the KTM CEO.

At least one overseas board has been discussing the bikes on the assumption that the RC4 was to be a road bike. There have previously been pictures of a sportbike using one of the bigger KTM singles. The examples BIKE rode were out & out racers though.

denill

23rd December 2009, 07:51

The Harris WCM Would be Legal:

As to why the Harris WCM was rejected in 2003 until the crankcases had been replaced with prototype cases, Ezpeleta argues that that call was made on the basis of the rules as they were written at that time, rules that have since been changed. It is his contention that the WCM as originally presented to scrutineers at the start of the 2003 season would be legal under the rules that will go into effect in 2012.

Ezpeleta has said that nothing in FIM rules or traditions requires an engine powering a prototype racing motorcycle to be a prototype.