Apologies if I woke you. A big bike tale

[paddy]

Well, it's been an interesting Christmas for me. My wife and I recently separated and this was the first Christmas where I wasn't there when the kids got up in the morning. A pretty sad morning to be honest. I'm hoping that I can make boxing day "my tradition" for the kids at Christmas. Tomorrow we are driving out to Borders so that they can spend the "book" money I gave them as one of their presents. Yes kids, it will be the biggest book store you have EVER seen!

Anyway, moving on to bikes. Me Da used to ride back home - in fact we never really owned a car until coming to New Zealand (we bought a car just before we left so that Dad could learn to drive). Around the same time Dad did a decent superman impression over the top of a car that pulled out in front of him. The net result: has hasn't ridden in 20 years.

Now, the kids are all grown up, the mortgage is basically gone, and Dad is starting to look at things for himself again. He bought a Jaguar (not a crazy expensive one, but nice enough). He definitely deserved that, he spent enough time in the machine shop in Coventry machining the wooden dashboards for them. Now he's decided it's time to get a bike again. So he's bought a Suzuki GSF1200S (2007). The nutter.

I "escorted" him on his first ride the other day. Just a short 20 minute run along urban roads. I think it's going to take a bit of getting used to. It's a lot of machine. It was great to be able to get out and share that with him though. I'm hoping that we can do some more riding together in the future. I'll be pushing him along to RRRS and NASS. I am very concious of the statistics on returning riders with big bikes.

Getting to the point of my post, given everything, I was sitting alone on Christmas Eve. Dad's bike was sitting in my driveway (his is a 40 degree tee-tree lined slope that he is - rightly - not planning to attempt yet). I am covered by his insurance, and the invitation was there to take the bike for a spin. Incidentally, while I am talking insurance, I pointed Dad at www.kiwibike.co.nz and let him go off and do his own due diligence. He looked at State, AMI, and KiwiBike. KiwiBike were able to produce the best policy and deal. Good on them.

I headed off toward Gulf Harbour/Army Bay. That's a 10 minute ride from my house along pretty much urban roads with a single 70 KM/H section. So apologies if you live in that area and were awakened on Christmas Eve around 2115 hrs by a 1200 CC "burble". I was probably in the area for around 10 or 15 minutes. :-)

Now, you must understand that I ordinarily ride a DR250. The biggest bike I've ever ridden was the BMW F650GS. This thing is essentially twice as big again. It was an interesting experience. I have to be honest though, it didn't really do it for me. It has a relatively upright seating position, although not quite as upright as my DR. I found the steering VERY heavy with a lot of "push" pressure required to hold the bike into corners (whereas the DR tends to flop into corners and require the opposite). I did notice that it tended to feel lighter on tighter radius corners as the speed increased - so perhaps I was just traveling well below the "design speed" of the geometry. (Yes I made that phrase up - but I think you all know what I meant.)

The engine is nuts - although it seems to be capable of safe. I pretty much road everywhere at 2-3K revs. The bike red-lines at 11k, but I can't for the life of me figure out how you would use it. I pulled away in first, accelerated to around 3K RPM, changed up into second and opened the throttle - maybe a quarter turn, perhaps slightly more. The front wheel was definitely not on the ground and, when I glanced down, I was going 80 KM/H. Seriously, how do you use the engine? Seems to me like it's encumbered with three more cylinders than it needs! :-)

There were some speed-bumps along the way. Normally I would clear these quite happily at the speed limit on my DR. In fact I get the impression they could probably be cleared WELL above the speed limit, but I haven't bothered trying - you never know, I could be wrong. The GSF doesn't do speed bumps in quite the same way. It felt very much like 30 KM/H was really the practical limit, perhaps a little more depending on how much throttle you apply to get the front wheel over the bump.

I don't think sports (or sports tourers) are for me. They just don't quite compute in my head. On the plus side, the brakes work a whole lot better and the seat is considerably more comfortable than my DR.

So there we go - verdict: great bike - yes; do I want one: not really; Christmas: could have been better. Now I need to try the 1200GS to get a decent frame of reference.


Don't forget to register for a fun afternoon of medical exploration: http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/calendar.php?do=getinfo&day=2010-2-6&c=0

[Yow Ling]

Hey Paddy, I hope tomorrow is better for you

[shrub]

have fun with your kids tomorrow and good on you for making boxing day your special day. My kids now live with me, and after present opening my son went for a ride on his Street Triple (I would have joined him, but first Xmas with my new partner), so I don't doubt the day will come when you wake with your kids on Xmas day.

I have ridden a heap of big bikes - if you think the 1200 was big, try a 2300cc Rocket 3, and I enjoyed hearing about your experiences of a modern muscle bike. I guess I have forgotten just how quick they really are.

Have fun tomorrow mate.

[paddy]

. . .I have ridden a heap of big bikes - if you think the 1200 was big, try a 2300cc Rocket 3. . ..

Thanks for your encouraging words. A 2.3L bike is just nuts. Really. Totally mad. That's a bigger engine that my 5-series and that weighs 1.3 tonnes!

[Tone165]

I would reccomend that you check tyre presure..the GSF is quite light handling with correct tyre pressure.

Or perhaps just the normal result of going from light bike to heavy bike.

Your Dad's story is very common among my age group...please encourage him to do some training with BRONZ or anyone else that is available, I read somewhere here about mentoring programmes...that would be great for your Dad.

You are also right about the big power available from modern bikes, considering that the bike your Dad rode last was probably under 50hp...the 1250 is around 140 if memory serves.

Perhaps encourage him to ride with Ulysses Club for a bit..to get back up to speed.

Most of us old farts learned to ride "by the seat of our pants" on small low powered bikes and worked our way up to the big bikes that never even existed in the day...I have done several lessons, and although I would say I am above average in riding skill...I have learned something useful on every course.

Hope the new family situation sorts itself out OK, been there also and feel for you.

Opportunity to get out n about with your Dad is great, you two could do the courses together....I wish I had more in common with my Dad sometimes!

[paddy]

Opportunity to get out n about with your Dad is great, you two could do the courses together....I wish I had more in common with my Dad sometimes!

Yeah, I was wondering about both doing the RRRS (BRONZ) course together. I've been wanting to do it for a while now. It's good value too - I think around $50 which really isn't much. My Dad and I get along well, but we don't really have any things that we do together - our interests are fairly divergent. That's probably why I really enjoyed riding with him. It's a part of him that I couldn't really share when I was growing up - so it's special to be able to do that now.

[shrub]

Thanks for your encouraging words. A 2.3L bike is just nuts. Really. Totally mad. That's a bigger engine that my 5-series and that weighs 1.3 tonnes!

but you really need to know what you're doing with that much power and weight (320 kgs).

[CookMySock]

It's just inexperience, bro. My first time on a FJ1200 I was very surprised by its massive sea of torque, but not overwhelmed by it.

There is little to be gained by learners riding such a massive machine, except to prove to themselves that its rediculous. Theres a long way to go before you will be comfy on such an animal, but reassure yourself that thousands of others do ride them every day.

Thanks for the write up. That was quite cool to read. ;)

Steve

[MSTRS]

First Xmas day apart from your kids is the hardest one. Sorry that you've joined that club. It does get better.

As for the Bandit...excellent, torque-ey comfortable mile-eater. And yes, you can use that engine for what you did :lol:

[DEATH_INC.]

The 'heavy' steering is just the different weight and geometry between a road and trail bike. It took me a bit to get used to it when I first rode roadies.

[p.dath]

Well, it's been an interesting Christmas for me. My wife and I recently separated and this was the first Christmas where I wasn't there when the kids got up in the morning.

It's probably not much consolation, but the first Christmas is by far the worst. The rest are much easier.

Perhaps you two could alternate Christmas day - that's pretty common.

[p.dath]

The engine is nuts - although it seems to be capable of safe. I pretty much road everywhere at 2-3K revs. The bike red-lines at 11k, but I can't for the life of me figure out how you would use it. I pulled away in first, accelerated to around 3K RPM, changed up into second and opened the throttle - maybe a quarter turn, perhaps slightly more. The front wheel was definitely not on the ground and, when I glanced down, I was going 80 KM/H.

I think you'd find you would adjust pretty quickly to how the throttle operates. :)

I do like sports bikes, but not keen on something like that either.

[yachtie10]

I think you'd find you would adjust pretty quickly to how the throttle operates. :)

I do like sports bikes, but not keen on something like that either.

Phillip what is your bikes HP
The bandit 1200 is just under 100 HP and a great bike although a little heavier than I would like.

I thought my previous bandit 1200 was a hand full when I got it (sometimes wish i still had it)

now on the 1250 (which is smother bike to ride) I have a few more HP (98 Stock) but I am starting to see where I could use more HP. I am happy as I am as I value my health. Sometimes I think 100 HP should be a practical limit for road bikes.( I await the comeback)

[p.dath]

Phillip what is your bikes HP
The bandit 1200 is just under 100 HP and a great bike although a little heavier than I would like.

I thought my previous bandit 1200 was a hand full when I got it (sometimes wish i still had it)

now on the 1250 (which is smother bike to ride) I have a few more HP (98 Stock) but I am starting to see where I could use more HP. I am happy as I am as I value my health. Sometimes I think 100 HP should be a practical limit for road bikes.( I await the comeback)

I'll say around 90hp. Most tests I have seen gives answers within 5 HP of this.

Its a bit difficult finding an answer I trust. The CBR600F uses a ramjet air intake. So a stationary dyno tests deliver less power than when accelerating on the road, because no air is being forced into the intake.

[kwaka_crasher]

Or perhaps just the normal result of going from light bike to heavy bike.

Or he's a scrawny pipsqueak.

[paddy]

Or he's a scrawny pipsqueak.

I don't know that I would call myself scrawny anymore, but lets just say my power to weight ratio isn't what it once was.

[paddy]

Hey Paddy, I hope tomorrow is better for you


Hope the new family situation sorts itself out OK, been there also and feel for you.


First Xmas day apart from your kids is the hardest one. Sorry that you've joined that club. It does get better.


It's probably not much consolation, but the first Christmas is by far the worst. The rest are much easier.

Perhaps you two could alternate Christmas day - that's pretty common.


I just wanted to thank you all for your support and advice. We've been separated for around five months now. I still figuring out how it will all work and how I can still be really active in my kids lives - so I definitely appreciate the advice of those who have been there and figured out what worked for them and what didn't.

P.

[paddy]

I would reccomend that you check tyre presure..the GSF is quite light handling with correct tyre pressure.

Or perhaps just the normal result of going from light bike to heavy bike.

I'll get Dad to check the tyre pressures next he goes out, but I'm thinking it's probably the latter based on what others have said. It wasn't unmanageably heavy, just much heavier than what I am used to.


There is little to be gained by learners riding such a massive machine, except to prove to themselves that its rediculous. Theres a long way to go before you will be comfy on such an animal, but reassure yourself that thousands of others do ride them every day.

Thanks for the write up. That was quite cool to read. ;)

Thanks Steve, I'm glad you enjoyed it. Just to clarify though, I certainly wasn't trying to prove anything - I was just taking the opportunity that presented itself - to experience something different to my bike. So far, I much prefer the way the F650GS rides, the GSF1200 sure vibrates a lot less though... :-)


The 'heavy' steering is just the different weight and geometry between a road and trail bike. It took me a bit to get used to it when I first rode roadies.

Yup - that seems to be the common consensus.


I think you'd find you would adjust pretty quickly to how the throttle operates. :)

To be honest, I'm not entirely sure I'd want to get used to it. I didn't do any overtaking while I was riding it (i.e. I was riding even more Granny like that usual). I did get the sense you could get into real trouble with it though. On my DR you have to really pick your times to overtake. Overtaking is an entire procedure, assess the situation, create some space to accelerate in before moving out, change down several gears, begin accelerating, pull out, constantly re-access...... You get the idea. On the GSF, you could pretty much just open the throttle and blip around someone in a very small gap. Except that you would end up going very fast. A little too easy and too tempting for my tastes.

[cc rider]

Hey paddy, glad to hear Borders went well with the kids, amazingly big stores, aye...do you guys have coffee/eatery bars in them too. They're incase you get lost amongst the books ;)

You're on the right track with the kids....just by the sheer fact that you want to be with them and are trying to do your best by them. Still early days, patrick, so there will always be someone here to talk to when needed.
...and don't forget to be good to yourself, ok.
:hug:
cc

[paddy]

[FONT="Comic Sans MS"]Hey paddy, glad to hear Borders went well with the kids, amazingly big stores, aye...do you guys have coffee/eatery bars in them too. They're incase you get lost amongst the books ;)

It sure does. It makes me wonder actually, I can clear a novel in a day happily enough. When the lastest Lee Child, Clive Cussler, whatever, comes out in the library and I am hold number 748 of 890. Why don't I just grab the one off the shelf in borders, take it to the cafe. Read it. Maybe move around the store a bit over the course of the day, and then return it to the shelf. Makes me wonder how many of the other people I see in there reading are actually doing that.

[cc rider]

It sure does. It makes me wonder actually, I can clear a novel in a day happily enough. When the lastest Lee Child, Clive Cussler, whatever, comes out in the library and I am hold number 748 of 890. Why don't I just grab the one off the shelf in borders, take it to the cafe. Read it. Maybe move around the store a bit over the course of the day, and then return it to the shelf. Makes me wonder how many of the other people I see in there reading are actually doing that.Haha! Now who would do that :whistle: let alone sit & listen to a whole CD of their fav music while having a nice hot long black. Do you have a music/entertainment section? The first Borders I went to was in Singapore yrs ago, 3 floors :gob: but now that's common here. If you're an avid reader too, join up on their discount email list...sometimes up to 40% off. You can also get them to order in most books world wide. You buy the coffee, I'll get the cake ;)

[cc rider]

Lee Child & Clive Cussler... that's a freakin lot of books. No wonder you use the library :shit: :lol:

[paddy]

Lee Child & Clive Cussler... that's a freakin lot of books. No wonder you use the library :shit: :lol:

I've just recently started all of the Child's from the beginning actually. Cussler's getting difficult to be comprehensive with as he branched out a lot. I'm not sure I like all of the branches but The Oregon Files are good. They are in keeping with his original design patterns. Indestructible protagonists. That sort of thing. Now we're getting off topic though.... :-)

[cc rider]

not really mate, is your thread

....so know any good m/c off road adventure books?? :)

[kevfromcoro]

not really mate, is your thread

....so know any good m/c off road adventure books?? :)

Hot.. just read the thread about hot.. its hot here...........about 25 at the moment..

Anyway.. back on topic....

M/C off road adventures....

Have a look at Twisted Throttle.

African odissy.

course... long way down.. and long way round....

All come out on DVD....

Just joined the libary here.. so will sort a few more out.....

[cc rider]

Hot.. just read the thread about hot.. its hot here...........about 25 at the moment..

Anyway.. back on topic....

M/C off road adventures....

Have a look at Twisted Throttle.

African odissy.

course... long way down.. and long way round....

All come out on DVD....

Just joined the libary here.. so will sort a few more out.....is you pychic kev....was just in the middle of a PM reply to you when the power went out :angry2:
So will write to you tomorrow if that's alright hun, much to catch up on.
Ta for book ref/s.
We need to start a library/book thread :woohoo:
I got some old triumph manual/workshopy books brought in by the Vic State Library. Ones that were out of print. Since I don't think there was a manual for my old thing, I've been using what ever I can find.

Tis 16deg here...

cc

[paddy]

not really mate, is your thread

....so know any good m/c off road adventure books?? :)

I quite enjoyed the Long Way Round and Long Way Down books. They expand quite a bit on the TV series. Twisting Throttle and the Gary Morgan series are also worth ready but I didn't find them quite as well written (probably because the McBoorman books are ghost written by a professional author).

[paddy]

Thought I would add some pics of Da's first day out.

[paddy]

I think Dad's planning on riding into work tomorrow - or was it the 3rd - I can't seem to remember. Anyway, I thought I would head out and fill the tank for him so that he is ready to roll in the morning. Obviously I went the long way (via Army Bay) to the petrol station. I have some more observations:

You definitely do start to get used to the power - although I am still not sure what you would do with it all. The engine really starts to smooth out around 7K or so but even in first gear you are going quite fast then. I think I would prefer more torque and less revs. Perhaps I need to get out on a DL1000 and see how they compare.

Dad checked the tyre pressures the other day - both wheels were at 33 PSI. He bought them both up to 36 PSI as that is what's printed on the plate for the bike. I think I was getting used to the weight a little more. One thing that I did notice is that the throttle has a much great affect on the steering that on my DR. I have always read about people doing things like "trailing" the rear brake to tighten their line in the corner. I've experimented on the DR and it doesn't seem to make any difference at all. On the GSF I was quite surprised - throttle/brake control makes a significant difference to the way the bike handles/steers. I especially noticed that the bike felt a lot better if you were accelerating out of corners reasonably positively whereas on the DR you can be fairly neutral the whole way around. On the DR I might be riding at 50, brake down to 40, ride with corner with a neutral throttle and accelerate back up to 50 KM/h post apex. On the GSF, it felt a lot better to decelerate down to 20 so that I could have a 30 KM/h acceleration post apex rather than a 10 KM/h acceleration. Altogether too much braking and accelerating for my tastes though. :-)

It was nice riding back from Gulf Harbour. The sun was setting and I was really starting to feel comfortable on the bike. I could have kept going all the way to Hamilton. Not really sure what I would have done when I got there. Probably eaten McDonald's and ridden back up I suppose. Anyway, just thought I would add to my earlier observations.

[Ratti]

First...Hang in there with Christmas. its been our first one since my hubby died, messy too as his first wife served me papers on the 23rd. she wants me to sell our home and give the money to his young adult sons...go figure...sigh.Firsts of anything are the worst, good on you to stay positive with your kids. They learn from our example and we owe it to them to teach 'em well.

second...thats one heck of a big bike your Da has bought. I joined up with Ulysses recently and am delighted to find they have several mentors in the branch that are keen and able to assist in a spot of retraining. Perhaps something to check out in your part of town? If nothing else, a great bunch of folk on the whole and its nice to hang out with bikers who are pretty much over the testosterone fueled riding style of our mis-spent youth.

third...yes yes yes to library book title thread. dvd's too please? the only one Ive watched was something about Che Guevera and a ride through South America. Cant recall the title but I enjoyed the flick.

take care Paddy and take the bad days with the good, it'll even out eventually.

[yachtie10]

Those pics looks like you have the new bike (1250) with the old motor (1200 oil cooled)
It was a transitional thing they did

I would recommend going up on the rear tyre pressure to 40-42 or you will go through the rear pretty quickly

Its interesting you say you want more torque as most people I ride with say i need to change gears more (as they do on their sportier bikes) One the great things about the bandit is you dont really need to use the gearbox much unless you want to

have a happy New Year

[paddy]

Those pics looks like you have the new bike (1250) with the old motor (1200 oil cooled)

Interesting. Actually, the whole bike has me a bit confused - the information I found somewhere on the internet (which I'm sure I'll never find again) suggested that it should have six pot callipers up front (it has four). It's a 2007 by the way. Still, Dad didn't buy it based on what it should have - he bought it based on what it was and the price - $8000 I believe. It has 20k on the clock.


I would recommend going up on the rear tyre pressure to 40-42 or you will go through the rear pretty quickly

I'll mention that too him. Thanks. Any downside to going up to that sort of pressure?

[yachtie10]

yep 2007 was the changeover year
I was told that they used up the old engines in the new frames until they ran out of the old engines
The old bike was good (had one for a while) and the new bike is good so you shouldn't have any major issues

On the tyres
There are better experts than me but basically
within a range of safe pressures for a tyre/bike the higher the pressure the better the tyre wear, a lower pressure gives more grip
a lot of factors come into it such as weight of rider/s and how hard you ride
if you ride hard with a low pressure the tyre can get too hot and wear fast.

Im now on my 5th set of tyres on Bandits and they have always recommended 36/42 as the right pressure. The manual also states this for both the 1200 and 1250 model

From the manual below

Tire Pressure
If the tire pressure is too high or too low, steering will be
adversely affected and tire wear increased. Therefore,
maintain the correct tire pressure for good roadability or
shorter tire life will result. Cold inflation tire pressure is as
follows.
Cold inflation tire pressure
! CAUTION
The standard tire fitted on this motorcycle is
120/70 ZR17 M/C (58W) for front and 180/55
ZR17 M/C (73W) for rear. The use of tires
other than those specified may cause
instability. It is highly recommended to use
the specified tires.
Tire type
DUNLOP
• Front: D218FT
• Rear: D218N
I310G1020068-01
Solo riding Dual riding
kPa kgf/cm2 psi kPa kgf/cm2 psi
Front 250 2.50 36 250 2.50 36
Rear 290 2.90 42 290 2.90 42

[cc rider]

Paddy, I hope you & the kids had a great xmas.

And nice to see you let your Da have a ride of his bike :whistle:

[Conquiztador]

Life. It goes on and never stops. just when you think you have it sussed something else is thrown in.

After 7 years as a single parent the best advice I can give are the following words of wisdom:

- Never talk shit bout your ex to the kids. It is their mum/dad and they have the right to love him/her.
- The past is the past and can not be changed. Compromising and giving in to your ex is not a sign of weakness, it is a sign of intelligence and maturity.
- Expect your plans to change on a very short notice when kids are part of the equation.
- You will believe to 100% that your version on what went wrong is right, but she will believe her's is 100% right. The truth is somewhere in-between.

And it is not end of the line. It is only a new chapter in your book that gives you new opportunities.

Re the bike: Now when you go back to your own she will feel in-adequate. You will start to consider upgrading. Life will never be the same again...

Have a safe and happy New Year!

[slowpoke]

Kinda funny what's happened to Bandit's over the years. They started out as a real badass bike, something that helped spawn the whole streetfighter genre, doubling the sales of Renthal's overnight. The bovver boy's steed of choice.

Now they are almost the labrador of motorcycling, something that the original bovver boys' dispairing dad would ride. Nothing against the bike, it's a good solid labrador of a thing, but it's just weird the way it or we have mutated over the years.

[Tink]

Life. It goes on and never stops. just when you think you have it sussed something else is thrown in.

After 7 years as a single parent the best advice I can give are the following words of wisdom:

- Never talk shit bout your ex to the kids. It is their mum/dad and they have the right to love him/her.
- The past is the past and can not be changed. Compromising and giving in to your ex is not a sign of weakness, it is a sign of intelligence and maturity.
- Expect your plans to change on a very short notice when kids are part of the equation.
- You will believe to 100% that your version on what went wrong is right, but she will believe her's is 100% right. The truth is somewhere in-between.

And it is not end of the line. It is only a new chapter in your book that gives you new opportunities.

Re the bike: Now when you go back to your own she will feel in-adequate. You will start to consider upgrading. Life will never be the same again...

Have a safe and happy New Year!

Good Advice Conq... I do year about with xmas, but to me xmas can be any day I choose, so if I am alone on christmas day, I relish the sleep in, the non fatty breakfast, and to ride my bike if I can :)