Bullshit speeding ticket from arrogant cop. Complaint

[Kiwi Graham]

After time to cool down and a letter of complaint sent about the attitude of this officer I thought I’d put it out to the masses.

It goes like this; Rush hour traffic last week;

I filter through stationary traffic to the front of the traffic lights by Pak & Save on Lincoln Road, Henderson. I see a cop car approaching 6-800meters away. Lights go green we all head of from the lights (I’m in the right hand lane), into second, into third, his lights come on (about 80-90 meters away),
Starts to execute a ‘U’ turn, wheels on full lock and crossing the hatched area separating lanes,
Thank fuck he decides he couldn’t do it and stops, we ride/drive by (me shaking my head) my fukin heart was in my mouth!!
He pulls into the traffic and follows (lights now off) through several lights, past the hospital (over a kilometre and several mins later) he sticks his lights on and a blip on his siren and points for me to pull over.
I filter into the left lane. No where obvious to stop (its rush hour!! Solid traffic etc) so pull onto the grass verge.
He pulls across a business address’s entrance and sits in his car? Another car is attempting to access the business so I get his attention and indicate he is blocking their drive. He pulls his car onto their garden!!! Address occupiers staring at him through their window.
And continues to sit in his car dark wrap round shades, watch to big for his wrist Asian dude.
When he does get out I of course ask what’s up. You were doing 80kmh. What!!!
I was stationary when I saw you and doing no more than 30-40k when you stuck your lights on and tried your ‘U’ turn!! Can I see your radar please; he glances back into his car and changes the speed he claimed I was doing to speed on the radar 74k.
That’s wrong no way was going as fast as that indicates, how do I know that was me and at this time it was recorded I ask.
Him still with his Rambo shades on (not sunny but overcast by the way) stares at me and says it was you because I said it was.
I said I was one of many vehicles all just leaving a set of traffic lights and none of us were doing anything like that speed. He said I was out on my own?? I said I will contest the ticket and feel he was picking on the motorcyclist.
All this time he had an arrogant, self important attitude about him and he was really starting to piss me off. I asked how long he was going to be. He was writing in his note book….no answer.
I am on my way home from work to collect my car to pick up my children from pre-school and had been on the side of the road for about 5 mins by now.
I asked again why he picked the motorcyclist out of all (there were lots) of the other vehicles, “I chose you”. But I thought I was out on my own, now you say you chose me (I knew a ticket was coming and it was total bullshit so I thought I would see what he had to say) he said nothing.
I said I thought he had a stink attitude and was arrogant and rude and that I would contesting the ticket, he said write your letter!!
Time was ticking away now so I said again how long is this going to take? No answer and gets in his car and shuts the door. I sit there for what felt like ages, he is just sat there writing in his notebook?
I knock on the window, ignored, I knock again, ignored. I open the door and ask again why is he ignoring me, how long he was going to be and why was he not answering any questions? Again, no answer just another stare through his shades. I called him fucking ignorant and said I’m off; my priorities are to pick up my children and not sit here being ignored by an arrogant copper. Put my helmet and gloves on jump on my bike and about to start it when he’s out of his car and shouting I’ll arrest you if you ride off!! What for I ask? Failing to stop!!
I’ve been stopped for the last 10 minuets what are you talking about, listed all his changes of events, his attitude and speeds etc I said he could post my license and ticket to me and that in two minuets I was going (to pick up the kids) and he had a choice, arrest me or write the ticket and give it to me now. I got the ticket.

I was bloody fuming, what an absolute bullshit ticket from a cop with the worst attitude I’ve ever come across.

Once I got home and sorted the children I sat down and wrote my best recollection of events and the next day (once calmed down) wrote a letter of complaint to both Henderson Police and Police NZ in Wellington and included the ticket.

I am fast loosing respect for traffic cops. I can’t believe he dreamt all this up because I shook my head at an attempted and aborted ‘U’ turn. This guy must have other complaints about him if this is how he treats people.

On reflection; I was not speeding. I could have sat there and took it up the arse. But I would have received the same ticket I got for challenging him. It was clear from the off that he was going to be a bastard by the way he presented himself (folded arms, wide stance), his attitude, the insistence of wearing and staring at me through dark shades, his treatment of other peoples property…you just know when someone is going to be a twat and he was that someone.

I will update the thread as I learn more.

[MaxCannon]

Sounds like he was being a real dick.

Id recommend going back to where he drove over the garden and seeing if the occupants would be willing to file a complaint.

A workmate years ago got off a ticket because the Cop executed a dangerous U turn and 4 witnesses wrote and complained about the officers conduct.

[firefighter]

Again, "safer Communities Together"..........pfft.

What a cunt. Cop cars should have the cameras in them that the Yank cruisers do, so it will be there for all to see when you write in your complaint. It's your word verses his unfortunately.

[The Pastor]

You only have to stop for a max of 15 mins for the sole purpose for the cop to gain your identity. State your name and address, give him your drivers licence and away you go.

It'll piss the cop of no end tho, so only use it as a last resort.

[Mully]

You only have to stop for a max of 15 mins for the sole purpose for the cop to gain your identity. State your name and address, give him your drivers licence and away you go.

It'll piss the cop of no end tho, so only use it as a last resort.

Trouble is, plod tend to hold your licence until they're finished. I suspect if you drive away, they'll pull you up and ticket you for not carrying your licence (if they're as much of a dick as this guy seems to be).

Graham - hope you get a result mate. I'd go back and talk to the people who's garden he ran over.

[Flip]

I would say go for it, but get a Lawyer

Did you see the radar?

The radars can't distingush between vehicles, it was the reason the rozzers used to get lazers.

Probably the best thing is put him on the stand and ask him how was he able to identify the speed you were going and not another vehicle, it makes them look like liars. If there is a history of this rozzer acting like this it will likely be in his record allredy and the Police won't want the officer put on the stand. Get a lawyer. Make an "official" complaint to the police complaint authority, get legal advice, then take it further. Do expect to sink a grand into legal fees.

[748south]

1) You only have to stop
2) If asked for your licence you only have to show it eg "produce it" you do not have to hand it over to them
3) Once you have stopped and produced your licence you may leave, you dont have to wait for the ticket
4) the only way they can stop you from leaving is to arrest you - which they cannot do because you have stopped for the lights - and you have produced your licence

but seriously, what a wanker

[nico]

what a cock, no wonder not many bother to stop for these dick heads, cops used to have alot of respectin the comunites now because of a few knobs ther'e haited

just the other day i watched 3 bikes pull out pull a mono past a cop and gun it cop had no chance

[red mermaid]

From what you have said I would recommend that you write in making a complaint and asking that consideration be given to having the ticket withdrawn.
Do not expect that because you have made a complaint the ticket will be withdrawn. They are treated as 2 seperate matters.

As far as some of the other comments in the thread....

Cameras would be great in Police cars but the bosses and Govt will not front with the money.
Overseas studies have shown they result in a decrease in the number of complaints because in the majority of cases back up what the officer says.
I know of a case in NZ of video surveillance of an intersection and a resulting ticket that the driver swore back and blue they did nothing wrong and why wasn't the car behind them given a ticket as well.
When the film was checked it was clearly obvious the driver was in the wrong, by a huge margin, and there was no car behind them.

The 15 minute time is for the purposes of gainning identity.

You can be held up for longer than this and the relevant case is Duff v Police, from the author Alan Duff.

And the radars used these days can distinguish between vehicles, but it comes down to the officers skill as to which vehicle it is displaying the speed of.

[Genie]

congrats on keeping your cool, your story paints a perfect picure and I can see it all. good luck.

[kwaka_crasher]

And the radars used these days can distinguish between vehicles, but it comes down to the officers skill as to which vehicle it is displaying the speed of.

That's a bit misleading and then contradictory in the second half. The microwaves can distinguish direction, the fastest (middle FAST display window) & strongest (left TARGET display window) return signals. They cannot distinguish which specific vehicle is responsible for any. Only the strongest signal can be locked and when this is done the middle window becomes the locked reading by displaying LOCK below it.

The mere presence of other vehicles with an undoubtedly stronger microwave return signal (due mainly to their size) means that it's unlikely it could be you he locked unless you were a lot closer to him than the larger vehicles. This ticket is very questionable, as is any, where there is claimed to be a LOCK on a motorcycle with microwave in the presence of other larger vehicles.

[bogan]

That's a bit misleading and then contradictory in the second half. The microwaves can distinguish direction, the fastest (middle FAST display window) & strongest (left TARGET display window) return signals. They cannot distinguish which specific vehicle is responsible for any. Only the strongest signal can be locked and when this is done the middle window becomes the locked reading by displaying LOCK below it.

The mere presence of other vehicles with an undoubtedly stronger microwave return signal (due mainly to their size) means that it's unlikely it could be you he locked unless you were a lot closer to him than the larger vehicles. This ticket is very questionable, as is any, where there is claimed to be a LOCK on a motorcycle with microwave in the presence of other larger vehicles.

yeh thats what i though too, but it still results in cops word vs yours, best option is to record the conversation I reckon, most cellphones can do this.

[JMemonic]

yeh thats what i though too, but it still results in cops word vs yours, best option is to record the conversation I reckon, most cellphones can do this.

I was about to suggest this as an option, surely it would be legal to do so and use in evidence.

[Daffyd]

I'm not sure, but I believe it's illegal to record a conversation without the permission of the other party.

[red mermaid]

yeh thats what i though too, but it still results in cops word vs yours, best option is to record the conversation I reckon, most cellphones can do this.

Didn't mean it to be contradictory.

It means you have the radar, it displays a speed, you have vehicles coming towards you and visually you can see that one vehicle is travelling faster.

[Kiwi Graham]

yeh thats what i though too, but it still results in cops word vs yours, best option is to record the conversation I reckon, most cellphones can do this.

What a good idea (smak to head for not thinking of it), recording what he said and how he said it and perhaps more importantly him ignoring my questions, a photo from the same cell phone showing him parked on the garden. Time over again eh!

Its at times like this you go away and re-live the experience over and over in your head and get more and more angry. It just piss's me off so much that when fully contested in court you know which way the judge is going to go so whats the point. Whats worse is they know it too so there is no consiquence for them.

Ive made my letter a formal complaint by stating on the top 'Letter of Complaint' and given the ticket back showing I'm not happy to just pay up and take demerit points and asked what it is they and I should do next.

Yes I did see the radar and it did show 74 (this is after he said 80) and he changed the speed after I asked to see the radar. But there is no way that was my recording or anyone else around me's speed at that time. As I said we had litteraly just pulled away from being stationary for some time at the lights and just shifted into third gear (and I dont mean a Meremere shift into 3rd either) certainly well under 50k.

I will call into the address were I was stopped and ask for a brief statement about how they feel regarding police cars parking on there front lawn after blocking their access.

This officer really needs to reflect on how he treats others and how he presents himself. he was portraying a massive 'I'm a tuff-as cop and you'll do as I say" image.

I notice another thread where bikes were getting stopped for splitting on the Northern this morning and it came out that a senior cop has asked bikes be targeted again, that would explain alot.

[bogan]

I'm not sure, but I believe it's illegal to record a conversation without the permission of the other party.

simple, just ask permission as soon as you are pulled over, chances are you will be more likely to get let off with a warning that way.


Didn't mean it to be contradictory.

It means you have the radar, it displays a speed, you have vehicles coming towards you and visually you can see that one vehicle is travelling faster.

and given the above case of a (thankfully) aborted u turn cos he didnt see the bike, I would be skeptical of his ability to judge which vehicle is faster.

[Swoop]

I know the intersection well.
If it was busy (as it normally is) and two lanes of traffic are leaving the lights, how can a radar distinguish one frontal area of bike from all of that amount of metal? Sounds suspect really.
Lincoln Rd normally has Mr Bel's finest tweeting away...

[Mully]

Yes I did see the radar and it did show 74 (this is after he said 80) and he changed the speed after I asked to see the radar. But there is no way that was my recording or anyone else around me's speed at that time. As I said we had litteraly just pulled away from being stationary for some time at the lights and just shifted into third gear (and I dont mean a Meremere shift into 3rd either) certainly well under 50k.

I vaguely recall a situation (maybe on here) were every biker who (was speeding) on a particular stretch was presented with the radar gun at XXkm/h (I don't recall the exact figure) with his ticket. Apparently, the guy kept the same reading on the gun and showed each biker if/when he was asked cos he wasn't able to get a lock on every bike.

[no_8wire]

I'm not sure, but I believe it's illegal to record a conversation without the permission of the other party.

IIRC it is illegal to record a converstation without the other persons knowlegde...eg if you are talking to them on a phone and are recording it at your end etc...So if you tell them you are recording it and they dont like it to bad for them...you keep on recording

[ukusa]

This cop sounds like a prime candidate for wanker of the year. Good luck with getting off the ticket, would be even better if this prick could be exposed for what he really is... but that's unlikely to happen.

[Mully]

IIRC it is illegal to record a converstation without the other persons knowlegde...eg if you are talking to them on a phone and are recording it at your end etc...So if you tell them you are recording it and they dont like it to bad for them...you keep on recording

I thought it was the opposite - you are allowed to record a conversation as long as you have the agreement of one of the parties.

Could be wrong, though.

[Maha]

Reads like he made such a cock of himself in front of the public and onlookers, that he was going to serve up anyone he could lay his hands on.

Good luck Graham.

[MSTRS]

So, seeing as you are now outed as a dangerous baby-killer on a motorcycle, are you now going to relinquish your mentorship?
Good luck with fighting that bullshit cop.

[Quasievil]

A few years back I got done by a asshole cop on the motorway, did me for 145kms........I was doing 120 tops......said cop was 200 mtrs behind, no radar and 3 cars between her and me, how she figured that out fuck knows, anyway I thought fuck you Im going to be a real nasty fucker so I was.
I wrote a letter asking for absolutely everything.........FULL DISCLOSURE.........I said Im defending the charge.

I asked for all the vehicles (cops car that pulled me up) info, make model service history, I asked for all of the Training records for the cop herself, speedo checks for the life of the patrol car, certificates of the technicians training I ended up with about 2 pages of line item requests, I even went so far as to ask for all the copies of the 10/7 (that wot its called) magazine with references to speed enforcement.

This letter went on for ages and guess what, they fucken hated me for it, I even got a phone call from the district commander dude at Pukekohe asking me why it was that I needed so much information, to which I replied it is my legal right to defend this charge and if he prefers he can drop it however I will be taking it through the court.(region where the ticket was issued)
In the end they gave me most of the information I wanted and I got the satisfaction of pissing of the twisted bitch who stopped me.
However I did make the mistake of saying to the cop I thought I was going no more than 120kmph tops, my Lawyer advised me to just accept the charge as the Judge would take that admission as a guilt plea and I would be fucked, so I did but I had some fun on the way!!

[Mikkel]

As has been touched upon, the radar lock doesn't clear itself. He could have left the 74 km/h sitting there since the last time he pulled someone over and then just gone for you... But why would he? What would be the motice? Surely it would be easy enough to catch someone speeding for real.

It does sound rather suspect! No matter what happened, his conduct is unbecoming of an officer and I hope your complaint doesn't just fall on deaf ears. Maybe you should send your letter to the IPCA (http://www.ipca.govt.nz/) as well.
P-dealers, dishonest politicians and corrupt cops - scum of the earth!


Overseas studies have shown they result in a decrease in the number of complaints because in the majority of cases back up what the officer says.

I've no doubt that there are plenty of unscrupulous characters out there willing to twist and lie to try and get off a ticket by misrepresenting the conduct of the officer. In my quiet mind I also believe that there are more of such characters than there are bad cops.

However, a cop would be very stupid indeed to behave inappropriately when he is on camera. And that's reason enough for having them - but it's a two-way deal really, it's to protect both the citizen and the officer.


I was about to suggest this as an option, surely it would be legal to do so and use in evidence.

I am not entirely sure. The key thing is to have it accepted as evidence in a court of law. Even if rejected as evidence the recording could still be of some interest to let's say the police... or the press.


I'm not sure, but I believe it's illegal to record a conversation without the permission of the other party.

You do not need permission from the other party.


IIRC it is illegal to record a converstation without the other persons knowlegde...eg if you are talking to them on a phone and are recording it at your end etc...So if you tell them you are recording it and they dont like it to bad for them...you keep on recording

I am pretty sure this is correct - if you want any chance of it being used as evidence. Otherwise you need a warrant of some sort to conduct clandestine surveillance and have the recordings accepted as evidence.

You can record anything you want though. It's not illegal to record or document anything that takes place in a public place. Unless there is a breach of privacy involved (spying through windows, planting listening devices in people's homes, etc.) you wouldn't be doing anything illegal. Otherwise, most tourists snapping a photo or video of Kawarau bridge would be breaking the law...

It only becomes complicated once it's to be accepted as evidence.

[steve_t]

Oh man, that sux. Legally, it doesn't sound like you can do very much :( The officer's attitude is bullshit but if he says you were speeding and has a radar reading of 74, you probably can't do a lot. If this sort of thing is happening regularly, it might be a good idea to invest in one of those video recorders that you can clip to your chest or helmet. This will attest to your innocence from your "point of view" and can also record the bollocks attitude of the officer. I don't think you even need to inform them that you're recording them otherwise hidden camera shows like Target wouldn't be around. Wasn't someone (retro?) selling camera's for $130 a while ago? Most of these cameras will clearly show the speedo as well as the road ahead. Just make sure you edit any evidential footage so you don't incriminate yourself ;)

[caseye]

Your writing dwon everything that was said by both this arsehole of a cop and your good self is all admissable as evidence in court.
Was I you, I'd definitely be making a seperate formal complaint about this police officers missuse/handling of a marked patrol car(attempted/aborted U turn)Remind them that last time one of thier own did this 2 Motorcyclists nearly died.
In this complaint tell them everything you have outlined to us here.
Point out the attitude, the use of sunglassses "to hide behind'.
The arrogance and demeanor of this officers marks him as one of the bad guys, not somoene to be respectful of, tell them that this experience has left you COLD and with a total disregard of all Police officers at this point in time. Challenge them to restore your confidence in them and also tell them that you belong to KB and have already received many replies encouraging you to fight this with everthing that you have.
Tell them this too Kiwi Gaham.
I'm happy to contribute real money to help you hire the absolute best Solicitor/Queens Couuncil that money can buy, I;m positive there isn't another KB who wouldn't put their hand in their pocket to help out as well. Don't consider this as anything other than a desire to take the fight to the enemy on all of our behalfs, not just your own. You are not alone and many make light work of a few idiots no matter what sort of title or job description they may have.

[PrincessBandit]

*555 him? wonder how many cops have had that done to them :eek: I'm sure you could have found something to lay a complaint regarding his driving (up on the garden perhaps?)

[ManDownUnder]

Cop cars should have the cameras in them that the Yank cruisers do

Now THAT's a good idea. I quite like that

[TimeOut]

It should be possible to find out what speed his last ticket was written out for ( my guess is 74kph ) maybe from his ticket book

[revlikeshit]

Had a similar thing happen to me a few months back, going round a corner 50k Zone ( real dodgee road surface so cant go fast on it anyway ) indicating 50kmh or slightly less(and i know the speedo on that bike read high, had it through the traps at meremere and on gps) copper said i was doing almost 70, shows me a lock for 67kmh.

Same sorta shit, theres a 70 zone up the road from there so im pretty sure he just left the lock on from a car up the road then pinged me because the bike draws a bit more attention than youre average people mover and because he just felt like it.

First time i had ever been ticketed which pissed me off too.

[kwaka_crasher]

I'm not sure, but I believe it's illegal to record a conversation without the permission of the other party.

Only one of the parties needs to know it's being recorded. It's there to stop 3rd parties recording conversations.

[beyond]

This sort of stuff makes me real angry. There's a whole new breed of young cop coming out of training that think they are Nazis and not upholders of the law. False accusations to make up the ticket quota just sucks big time and the targetiing of motorcyclists is giving them a bad name.

Feel for ya buddy but in court we all know who the judge listens to :(

[Mom]

Your writing dwon everything that was said by both this arsehole of a cop and your good self is all admissable as evidence in court.
Was I you, I'd definitely be making a seperate formal complaint about this police officers missuse/handling of a marked patrol car(attempted/aborted U turn)Remind them that last time one of thier own did this 2 Motorcyclists nearly died.
In this complaint tell them everything you have outlined to us here.
Point out the attitude, the use of sunglassses "to hide behind'.
The arrogance and demeanor of this officers marks him as one of the bad guys, not somoene to be respectful of, tell them that this experience has left you COLD and with a total disregard of all Police officers at this point in time. Challenge them to restore your confidence in them and also tell them that you belong to KB and have already received many replies encouraging you to fight this with everthing that you have.
Tell them this too Kiwi Gaham.
I'm happy to contribute real money to help you hire the absolute best Solicitor/Queens Couuncil that money can buy, I;m positive there isn't another KB who wouldn't put their hand in their pocket to help out as well. Don't consider this as anything other than a desire to take the fight to the enemy on all of our behalfs, not just your own. You are not alone and many make light work of a few idiots no matter what sort of title or job description they may have.


Well thats telling him! I agree with you 100% this kind of attitude is not acceptable and needs to be stamped out. KiwiGraham is just the right kind of biker to take this back to the man and ask for a please explain too :yes: I dont have any money to contribute but I have a big mouth if that helps :D

I have only caught a bad cop once, attitude all the way, hindsight says I should have done something about it, didn't at the time. Maha suggested I offer up some oral insentive for him to drop the ticket when I text him to fess up to my naughtiness. I was speeding however so can not complain about the ticket really, just the attitude.

You go get him KG!!

[shafty]

Hi KiwiGraham, in 2 words "this stinks" .

Without prattling on, some thoughts:

- Take a pic of the intersection at the same time of day
- Include a pic of where the Cop tried the "U" turn
- I would say mentioning your Occupation (assumption) and your racing (assumption) could give a good background for the Judge if it gets that far (ie I get my speed on a track)
- I was pulled up in Oz (fair cop) and the Cop was holding a dictaphone towards me as he went thru the procedure - FYI
- Take a pic of the garden and business entrance
- Am assuming the Cop was zealous due to his Boss asking them to focus on Bikes
- Pity you swore, but DO understand. May be used against you to flavour things

Good luck Mate - there is no need for Cops to do this - its stupid! For you I guess it's now a matter of Principal.

Shafty

[Muppet]

You only have to stop for a max of 15 mins for the sole purpose for the cop to gain your identity. State your name and address, give him your drivers licence and away you go.

It'll piss the cop of no end tho, so only use it as a last resort.

Just remember though, if the cop thinks you're lying about who you are and you have no ID he can arrest you if he suspects you are giving a false ID; or if you're being a asshole and do the whole 'oops I have no ID you'll just have to figure out who I am" routine, he can arrest you for "Failing to Supply Alternative Means of Identification".

And by the way, if you're on a bike and you have a load of cars right behind you and you're told you were speeding, I would defend it too, knowing what I know about microwave radar. Of course I'm assuming what you are telling us is gospel and not a load of crap. If you do defend it don't bring into court the cops attitude, the JP's aren't interested, they just want to know the facts. Which of your bikes were you on the R1 or the GSX?

[mansell]

Put in a formal cvomplaint. it may not be acted on in this case but odds are if this prick contuinues to act like this he already has some, or will get some complaints. It wont happen overnight but it is our duty to report this type of harrassment every time it happens.

[Kiwi Graham]

Just remember though, if the cop thinks you're lying about who you are and you have no ID he can arrest you if he suspects you are giving a false ID; or if you're being a asshole and do the whole 'oops I have no ID you'll just have to figure out who I am" routine, he can arrest you for "Failing to Supply Alternative Means of Identification".

And by the way, if you're on a bike and you have a load of cars right behind you and you're told you were speeding, I would defend it too, knowing what I know about microwave radar. Of course I'm assuming what you are telling us is gospel and not a load of crap. If you do defend it don't bring into court the cops attitude, the JP's aren't interested, they just want to know the facts. Which of your bikes were you on the R1 or the GSX?

Yep honest guv I tell you no lie. I was on the GSX; I tend to launch the R1 a little differently when the lights change ;)
A little bird has told me this cop has a bad rep internally and externally so I'm rolling up my sleves for a fight.

I'm calling into the address he pulled onto on Wed (just incase the same people are working as last Wed (day of the ticket) to see if they will support me with their view on how he treated their property and am going to take photos of the road at the same time to show just how bloody busy it is and to do the sort of speeds he claims I was doing would be madness.

Ran to the post box today, nothing from NZ police :(

I'm all out of bling so thanks to all who have commented. No need for a donation fund but thanks for the offers I'll persue it as far as I can before it costs any real money.

[specter]

real sorry for what happend to ya mate, and hope you get the bastard!

dont know if this is true or not but i read somewhere that because of the smallness of a motorbike the human eye percieves the object to be traveling faster than what it really is, this is also emphasised my peoples opinions of motorcyclists being hoons :shifty:

if its true can someone write up more on it as it will be very good knowledge to use when talking down angry pedestrians, cops ect.....

[MaxB]

Man that sucks.

I suspect you might have to split this 2 ways. The ticket and the bullshit behaviour may have to be dealt with as separate issues. You will need an independant witness or two for the ticket. That would add credibility to your side of things. If it is you and the cop in court they will tend to bvelieve him.

The complaint is simpler just tell the truth and give your side of things. Again a witness would come in handy. What about the people in that office? Be aware that most complaints against the police do not succeed. At least if there are enough complaints against an officer, when his mates doing the same job get none, then come performance review time maybe he's for the high jump.

[MisterD]

- Am assuming the Cop was zealous due to his Boss asking them to focus on Bikes


You what? I'm assuming he got the arse at KG's shake of the head at his aborted U-turn and decided to fuck him over.

[Pascal]

*555 him? wonder how many cops have had that done to them :eek: I'm sure you could have found something to lay a complaint regarding his driving (up on the garden perhaps?)

Yeah, I had a cop car rocket past me on Hargest Terrace, heading towards the lights. No real idea of how fast he was going, but it was enough that the wind gust was strong enough to buffet the baby's stroller. Too fast to catch a rego though, otherwise he'd have had a *555 for him. It's a very quiet, residential area with plenty of kids playing out there.

[CookMySock]

Shit like this happens all the time on KB. All the people who know exactly what to DO about it go quiet, which is why it's in rant and rave, and not the legal section.

Why not post again in the legal section, and get together and DO something instead of crying? The pigs aren't going to stop pulling stupid stunts unless the public mobilise against them. So do it.

Steve

[Toaster]

I am an ex cop and I agree. Cameras with microphones go a long way to preserve the rights of those dealt with as well as the safety and accuracy of what is done and said.... and of course can be used in evidence to support prosecutions of those who deserve all they get when they do break the law.

Far better than a "he said she said" kind of senario.


As as for this guy, if its all true.... well, what a plonker. Based on what was detailed in the 1st post he broke a fair few rules of conduct at a minimum.







Again, "safer Communities Together"..........pfft.

What a cunt. Cop cars should have the cameras in them that the Yank cruisers do, so it will be there for all to see when you write in your complaint. It's your word verses his unfortunately.

[Toaster]

They run a GPS device on cars now. COMMS knows how fast they are travelling, when lights and activated or not, and they are monitored. They are allowed to drive at a speed appropriate for the haste needed to attend the job they are going to, notwithstanding conditions/enivronment etc. Not too different to pursuit rules.


Yeah, I had a cop car rocket past me on Hargest Terrace, heading towards the lights. No real idea of how fast he was going, but it was enough that the wind gust was strong enough to buffet the baby's stroller. Too fast to catch a rego though, otherwise he'd have had a *555 for him. It's a very quiet, residential area with plenty of kids playing out there.

[Toaster]

This sort of stuff makes me real angry. There's a whole new breed of young cop coming out of training that think they are Nazis and not upholders of the law. False accusations to make up the ticket quota just sucks big time and the targetiing of motorcyclists is giving them a bad name.

Feel for ya buddy but in court we all know who the judge listens to :(

If they are indeed making up false tickets, this would be an utter disgrace. I would love to see anyone like that exited from the job asap. I loved the job. Loved catching crims and doing my bit to keep people safe on the roads too. Hated cleaning up dead people off the road and hated even more having to go tell their familes.

There was NEVER any need to be a dick with people, no matter how much of a dickhead they were, or make stuff up.

If this guy is a genuine plonker, he will eventually be caught out. From my experience, where there is smoke there is fire. Constant complaints against an individual paints a very bad picture to the bosses indeed.

[CookMySock]

They run a GPS device on cars now. COMMS knows how fast they are travelling, when lights and activated or not, and they are monitored. They are allowed to drive at a speed appropriate for the haste needed to attend the job they are going to, notwithstanding conditions/enivronment etc. Not too different to pursuit rules.Good, but whats the point if the general public doesn't access to this information? We see some idiot cop doing dangerous shit, so we report them, comms checks the GPS records and goes "ooops he did too" and then does fuck all about it.

Whats the point, except to cover their own arse?

Steve

[Toaster]

Good, but whats the point if the general public doesn't access to this information? We see some idiot cop doing dangerous shit, so we report them, comms checks the GPS records and goes "ooops he did too" and then does fuck all about it.

Whats the point, except to cover their own arse?

Steve

Mate, I never saw the bosses cover any arses. They actually deal very harshly with their own. They have to and are taught that in promotional courses. The last thing you want in your section of staff is a liability that means you get your butt kicked too.

All stuff that goes through COMMS is recorded and can be used in evidence. Especially in cases of pursuits that end badly. Timing etc is critical in those cases.

[kwaka_crasher]

Good, but whats the point if the general public doesn't access to this information? We see some idiot cop doing dangerous shit, so we report them, comms checks the GPS records and goes "ooops he did too" and then does fuck all about it.

Whats the point, except to cover their own arse?

You have to hope they're not ALL in on this conspiracy...

[mashman]

Might be worth asking him why he tried to do a U-ey up ahead... maybe to chase someone doing 74kmh perhaps... The whole thing sounds wrong. Not sure about NZ, but in the UK you can ask for a calibration certificate as all cameras need to have one. This will note when the camera was last calibrated/serviced etc... Good luck man.

[CookMySock]

Good replies. Well, we all want the same thing then. I am unable to reconcile what I am seeing. Good intent on one hand, and corrupt behaviour on another.

This is why we should start taking action against bad cops - pressure applied in the right place might afford some success. I bet the rest of the force is embarrassed by said members' bad behaviour as well.

Steve

[kwaka_crasher]

Might be worth asking him why he tried to do a U-ey up ahead... maybe to chase someone doing 74kmh perhaps... The whole thing sounds wrong. Not sure about NZ, but in the UK you can ask for a calibration certificate as all cameras need to have one. This will note when the camera was last calibrated/serviced etc... Good luck man.

Camera? :scratch:

[Jantar]

Camera? :scratch:
I believe that in the UK all radar units have digital movie cameras attched that show the vehicle speeding, the speed and the time. I wish we had that here as it would prevent any arguments as to whether or not a particular vehicle is the one speeding and it would show whether or not any other vehicles were in the beam.

[mashman]

I believe that in the UK all radar units have digital movie cameras attched that show the vehicle speeding, the speed and the time. I wish we had that here as it would prevent any arguments as to whether or not a particular vehicle is the one speeding and it would show whether or not any other vehicles were in the beam.

Cheers for that. In which case, the laser should still have a calibration certificate. Not sure how often they need the maintenance, but am sure you'd be able to find out if you wanted to pursue that avenue.

[rapid van cleef]

Take it to the press.

[mynameis]

That sucks man !! Good luck with it, hopefully justice is served without much cost.

[Flying Spanner]

In my car I had a similar experience. I have an in car GPS that records data and can be printed out on pc. I took a cellphone photo of the exact point where I was said to have been pulled over and had the gps co-ordinates for that location. And what'd ya know my speed at the time of passing the cop was 15km/hr less than what was stated. I was still speeding at precisely 102km/hr but got off the fine. I got pulled over atleast 5-10 times a week for months after that for "random" lisence and rego checks. It was like I had a huge target on my back. Such is life when you live in a small town and the local cops are arseholes.

[kwaka_crasher]

I believe that in the UK all radar units have digital movie cameras attched that show the vehicle speeding, the speed and the time. I wish we had that here as it would prevent any arguments as to whether or not a particular vehicle is the one speeding and it would show whether or not any other vehicles were in the beam.

With microwave it is physically impossible to determine which vehicle, if indeed any, is giving a reading. A camera in that circumstance could only be used to perhaps assist in arguments as to the presence of other vehicles and traffic flow, not to establish the source of the signal.

[kwaka_crasher]

Cheers for that. In which case, the laser should still have a calibration certificate. Not sure how often they need the maintenance, but am sure you'd be able to find out if you wanted to pursue that avenue.

Laser? :scratch:

[mashman]

Laser? :scratch:

ok... the doohickey fingamebob gun that was used to check your speed must require a calibration certificate i would have thought.

[kwaka_crasher]

ok... the doohickey fingamebob gun that was used to check your speed must require a calibration certificate i would have thought.

Microwave. But yes, it requires annual calibration and certification. But this can be retrospective i.e. if you're ticketed based on a reading from one and it's not at the time currently certified as accurate but subsequently passes certification as to it's accuracy without adjustment it is deemed to have been accurate at the time you were ticketed. Fucked up repugnant shit? You bet. The same consideration is not given to anyone who is caught without a current evidence of inspection (WoF or CoF).

There's still no way to prove definitively that it was your or any vehicle that gave the reading... it comes down to he said/she said. Unfortunately, the dumbass JPs who usually deal with this sort of thing have fuck all understanding of how it actually works and do not seek the knowledge. They've even been known to uphold infringement offence notices on the basis that they did not understand evidence and have stated exactly that.

[peasea]

Microwave. But yes, it requires annual calibration and certification. But this can be retrospective i.e. if you're ticketed based on a reading from one and it's not at the time currently certified as accurate but subsequently passes certification as to it's accuracy without adjustment it is deemed to have been accurate at the time you were ticketed. Fucked up repugnant shit? You bet. The same consideration is not given to anyone who is caught without a current evidence of inspection (WoF or CoF).

There's still no way to prove definitively that it was your or any vehicle that gave the reading... it comes down to he said/she said. Unfortunately, the dumbass JPs who usually deal with this sort of thing have fuck all understanding of how it actually works and do not seek the knowledge. They've even been known to uphold infringement offence notices on the basis that they did not understand evidence and have stated exactly that.

Chuck all that at a defendant, add a liar in blue and presto!

[MaxB]

Microwave. But yes, it requires annual calibration and certification. But this can be retrospective i.e. if you're ticketed based on a reading from one and it's not at the time currently certified as accurate but subsequently passes certification as to it's accuracy without adjustment it is deemed to have been accurate at the time you were ticketed.

That is a legal loophole right there. ESR who do the calibrations will not state anything in their report other than 'tested as supplied'. It is professional suicide to state otherwise.

That puts the onus back on the Police to be 100% sure that no one has dicked with the units over the calibration period. Sometimes the seals are broken or just fall off in the heat. In theory every time a unit comes apart it has to be re-calibrated but that gets expensive. A good ($$$) lawyer will use this to his client's advantage. Another example of how we only get the justice we can afford.

[kwaka_crasher]

Another example of how we only get the justice we can afford.

Exactly. And the lack of challenges to the system because "it's just not worth it for a mere $320 speeding ticket" just adds to the myth of infallible microwave speed detection.

NZers and their fucking apathy. It's been said that "countries get the government they deserve." The same applies to Police forces. Accept shit and that's what you'll be given.

And they wonder why I don't stop for their pretty lights...

[Toaster]

Good replies. Well, we all want the same thing then. I am unable to reconcile what I am seeing. Good intent on one hand, and corrupt behaviour on another.

This is why we should start taking action against bad cops - pressure applied in the right place might afford some success. I bet the rest of the force is embarrassed by said members' bad behaviour as well.

Steve

Absolutely. Most cops just try to do a good job, and get home in one piece to their families. Like any very large employer, there will always be one or two that give the rest a bad name due to their very public and often thankless difficult role.

The key to me was to be fair and reasonable in the circumstances. Having to be firm is just part of it, where appropriate (Wasn't called The Toaster for nothing). Law is not black and white and neither is the application of discretion.

[peasea]

NZers and their fucking apathy...

Absolutely. Challenge everything!

I posted elsewhere that my daughter just had a traffic charge thrown out, she stuck to her guns and bloody good on her. She beat the lying filth.

[Toaster]

And they wonder why I don't stop for their pretty lights...

"Hey officer, I thought this was a party bus with all them lights and the smell of booze.........................."

"Just blow in the tube lad".

[OutForADuck]

Hey Graham,
Sounds like you really got a good one there. I would say fight it. Your doing the right thing, get as much colaborative evidence as you can.

The big issue here is that it tends to be word on word and you need a little more to be taken seriously because there will always be those complaining. Its a cops lot to get complains, but compliants with substance do get taken seriously.

Good luck with the address he pulled you over at.

If it gets to court still fight it.... its not always a matter of win or lose as the court can decide a penalty other than the fix ticket price, based on circumstance. Plus you get to be seen and heard and this has a strong impact on credibility as opposed to a letter with an unseen writer.

Certainly consider going all the way even if you decide to represent yourself, because you get to be present, assessed and tell your own story.

[red mermaid]

There is that many urban legends and just plain crap repeated by people who know nothing about traffic enforcement in this thread that it is a huge laugh.
I can't be bothered wasteing my time trying to set the record straight.

However, in regard to the original post, as I said earlier, make your complaint be cause it sounds as if you may have grounds, from what you say.

[kwaka_crasher]

Absolutely. Most cops just try to do a good job, and get home in one piece to their families. Like any very large employer, there will always be one or two that give the rest a bad name due to their very public and often thankless difficult role.

The key to me was to be fair and reasonable in the circumstances. Having to be firm is just part of it, where appropriate (Wasn't called The Toaster for nothing). Law is not black and white and neither is the application of discretion.

If only we could distingush that sort from the OPs sort. Perhaps a different coloured hat that they have to wear when approaching the vehicle? :rofl:

For me the dilemma is that if you stop when you know you've been riding 14km/h over the speed limit there's no way you can be sure you're not going to be booked for 39km/h over the limit if you don't pass the cop's personal 'attitude test' or he simply gets it wrong, as the OP's case highlkights. It has happened to me. It took a shitload of fighting and expense to prepare for and then it was dropped at quite literally the last minute. Admittedly it was an Ernie...

It's a matter of trust. I no longer have any so now I err on the side of caution and just fuck off at warp 10 if it's looking like an invoice of any kind is coming my way. 'Clean' license for 10 years!

Oh, and for anyone who wants to question why I don't just stop 'speeding', I don't speed (except when chased for speeding). I define speed the same way as crash statistics since 2001 in that it must be "inappropriate for the conditions" to be considered. The arbitrary posted speed limit plays no part in deciding this. Good for the goose and all that... :bleh:

[kwaka_crasher]

There is that many urban legends and just plain crap repeated by people who know nothing about traffic enforcement in this thread that it is a huge laugh.
I can't be bothered wasteing my time trying to set the record straight.

Oh! Go on! You know you want to.

[Toaster]

If only we could distingush that sort from the OPs sort. Perhaps a different coloured hat that they have to wear when approaching the vehicle? :rofl:

For me the dilemma is that if you stop when you know you've been riding 14km/h over the speed limit there's no way you can be sure you're not going to be booked for 39km/h over the limit if you don't pass the cop's personal 'attitude test' or he simply gets it wrong, as the OP's case highlkights. It has happened to me. It took a shitload of fighting and expense to prepare for and then it was dropped at quite literally the last minute.

It's a matter of trust. I no longer have any so now I err on the side of caution and just fuck off at warp 10 if it's looking like an invoice of any kind is coming my way. 'Clean' license for 10 years!

Absolutely agreed, It is very much a matter of trust. It utterly disgusts me to think of cops out there litlerally making up false speeds or even charges for ANY reason. I just hope that if they are there, that they get weeded out quickly. Solid constant and consistent complaints from a range of unrelated upstanding members of society VERY MUCH get the attention of the bosses. Noone wants bad cops working for them. I sure as hell would not work with them.

But is it worth risking your life doing a runner for the sake of the remote possibility that the cop who nabbed you might be dishonest. Call me stupid, but I think it is fair to say cops that deliberately make up charges and tickets would have to be an absolutely tiny minority IMO.

[scumdog]

Absolutely agreed, It is very much a matter of trust. It utterly disgusts me to think of cops out there litlerally making up false speeds or even charges for ANY reason. I just hope that if they are there, that they get weeded out quickly. Solid constant and consistent complaints from a range of unrelated upstanding members of society VERY MUCH get the attention of the bosses. Noone wants bad cops working for them. I sure as hell would not work with them.

But is it worth risking your life doing a runner for the sake of the remote possibility that the cop who nabbed you might be dishonest. Call me stupid, but I think it is fair to say cops that deliberately make up charges and tickets would have to be an absolutely tiny minority IMO.

EXACTLY what he said, can't agree more.:yes:

[MSTRS]

EXACTLY what he said, can't agree more.:yes:

Trust you cops to stick together...:laugh:

[kwaka_crasher]

Absolutely agreed, It is very much a matter of trust. It utterly disgusts me to think of cops out there litlerally making up false speeds or even charges for ANY reason. I just hope that if they are there, that they get weeded out quickly. Solid constant and consistent complaints from a range of unrelated upstanding members of society VERY MUCH get the attention of the bosses. Noone wants bad cops working for them. I sure as hell would not work with them.

I share your vision for a better NZ. I just have no faith in it! :lol:


But is it worth risking your life doing a runner for the sake of the remote possibility that the cop who nabbed you might be dishonest. Call me stupid, but I think it is fair to say cops that deliberately make up charges and tickets would have to be an absolutely tiny minority IMO.To me it's a calculated risk, much like riding on the road at all.

I would like to think you're right, but the cynic in me says it's only getting worse with the lowering of entry standards. Don't get me wrong - I'm no saint, I'd never get accepted regardless of how low they dropped the standards and I don't believe in it anyway. But I don't put myself up as a saint either...


Trust you cops to stick together...:laugh:

So is this blue line thick or thin? :dodge:

[MSTRS]

Yes. <guygjuhjkh>

[TimeOut]

In my car I had a similar experience. I have an in car GPS that records data and can be printed out on pc. I took a cellphone photo of the exact point where I was said to have been pulled over and had the gps co-ordinates for that location. And what'd ya know my speed at the time of passing the cop was 15km/hr less than what was stated. I was still speeding at precisely 102km/hr but got off the fine. I got pulled over atleast 5-10 times a week for months after that for "random" lisence and rego checks. It was like I had a huge target on my back. Such is life when you live in a small town and the local cops are arseholes.

Had the same with my son, I complained to the cops sarg. Son was harressed for six months stopped sometimes four times in a night, usually by the same cop.

Got the last laugh though as the cop was too busy being a prick that he didn't notice that a ZX6r was bigger than 250cc

[Kiwi Graham]

Still no letter from NZ police.
However I did call into the buisness address the the cop firstly blocked and the pulled onto their garden...............Its a lawyers !!!
They remembered the spectical! They did not like the fact that he a; blocked their access (the client he blocked complained to them about it) and b; were supprised he pulled onto their garden.
Surfice to say that I explained I am formally complaining about the whole incident and wanted them to be aware that although they are not named in the complaint what this cop did at their address is. I also explained if this complaint gathers pace they may need to make a statement confirming this cops actions,This they are happy to do.

So, one week on (less a day) and still nothing from the police.

[paturoa]

I haven't read the whole thread, but the cop shop is a few hundy meters from that location, have you asked to meet said popo's boss?

[Kiwi Graham]

Have laid the complaint and sent a copy to the Henderson nick and Police NZ in Wellington. The final line being "I await your direction on what happens next" ..............so I wait.........for now.

[enigma51]

Have laid the complaint and sent a copy to the Henderson nick and Police NZ in Wellington. The final line being "I await your direction on what happens next" ..............so I wait.........for now.

I will put money on the reply letter being the generic

"We have looked at your complaint blah blah blah something about the speed is in excess blah blah fuck off pay the fine. You have 28 days blah blah the copper don't have to show you the speed."

You want it heard go to court then get fucked around for another 2 years maybe more ..... ask spb......

[scumdog]

I will put money on the reply letter being the generic

"We have looked at your complaint blah blah blah something about the speed is in excess blah blah fuck off pay the fine. You have 28 days blah blah the copper don't have to show you the speed."

You want it heard go to court then get fucked around for another 2 years maybe more ..... ask spb......

Some guys are just plain lucky I guess....:whistle:

[caseye]

Well I'm still 100% behind you and the actions you are taking with regards this matter Kevin.
I have a confession to make.yesterday afternoon while traversing the North western car park I was lazered from behind(still don't know exactly where from) I didn't know this at the time but did when some 3 K's further on I was hauled over by Mr P in their highway patrol vehicle.
I stopped, enquired as to the nature of their actions in pulling me over and was told that i had been exceeding the speed limit way back when.
I was calm and spoke politely to the officer,we had a longish discussion as to where my alledged speeding occurred and where they had been.At first they were adamant I was going to get a ticket but after sitting in their car for a good few minutes they emerged, handed back my licence and told me "to get on my bike and bugger off"
Naturally I got a bit more of a talking too than that but this was the general gist of the encounter.
This Police Officer exercised a large amount of discretion, I certainly appreciate their doing so and will make a concious effort to keep the throttle a little further forward from now on.
I can't not tell this story as it is true, it happened and it goes to show that there are in fact still some damn fine Officers out there, ones who can and do use what discretion they have and who take a chance on those of us lucky enough to encounter them.
So go on give me heaps, call me cop lover, whatever, I'm smiling today not going to the post office to pay a fine, more slowlier than normal though.

[Swoop]

while traversing the North western car park I was lazered from behind(still don't know exactly where from) I didn't know this at the time but did when some 3 K's further on I was hauled over by Mr P in their highway patrol vehicle.
NW is a bit long. Any more specifics on location involved (between x and y, locations)?

Police like to park under the Huruhuru Rd overbridge and lazer targets as they are still around the Lincoln Rd area. (Map says approx 600metres distance)

[caseye]

NW is a bit long. Any more specifics on location involved (between x and y, locations)?

Police like to park under the Huruhuru Rd overbridge and lazer targets as they are still around the Lincoln Rd area. (Map says approx 600metres distance)

You got it in one, I got on at the Lincoln rd on ramp heading to Town, never saw the car, and didn't get the disco's until I was just past the Waterview off ramp.220 metres behind me is what was on the lazers rqnge finder.

[Swoop]

You got it in one, I got on at the Lincoln rd on ramp heading to Town, never saw the car, and didn't get the disco's until I was just past the Waterview off ramp.220 metres behind me is what was on the lazers rqnge finder.
I'll guess that he was sitting under the Lincoln Rd overbridge then. Distance from there to the point where the onramp joins the M'way heading east is approx 190m.
I've seen the opposite on the Ramarama straight. Cop sits on the onramps with laser pointing at the rear of vehicles.
Always insist that a laser jammer unit is fitted to the rear of a vehicle as well as the front!

[red mermaid]

Oh, a laser jammer device?

This is a new urban legend...whats one of them?

Do you mean placing CD's in the windscreen?

[GOONR]

Oh, a laser jammer device?

This is a new urban legend...whats one of them?

Do you mean placing CD's in the windscreen?

Drive in reverse do you?

[Swoop]

This is a new urban legend...whats one of them?
Nothing. Nothing at all.
Just stick to your CD's.

[Kiwi Graham]

So, 6 more days until the 28 day threshold for fine payment and 21 days since the posting of the two letters of complaint (included in the Wellington police letter was the ticket) and I've heard................nothing, zilch, nada, not a sausage!
So by next Wednesday the 28days are up and then what?

[peasea]

So, 6 more days until the 28 day threshold for fine payment and 21 days since the posting of the two letters of complaint (included in the Wellington police letter was the ticket) and I've heard................nothing, zilch, nada, not a sausage!
So by next Wednesday the 28days are up and then what?

They fuck you up the bum, of course. Well, rape your wallet anyway.....

[red mermaid]

You will get reminder giving another 28 days to pay.

As I said in my 1st post, the police will treat both matters as separate, ie: your complaint and the alleged speeding offence.

Also they will make no decision in relation to the speeding offence without refering back to the officer who issued the notice, so before answering your query they will probably be seeking further information from him.

[mynameis]

So, 6 more days until the 28 day threshold for fine payment and 21 days since the posting of the two letters of complaint (included in the Wellington police letter was the ticket) and I've heard................nothing, zilch, nada, not a sausage!
So by next Wednesday the 28days are up and then what?

Don't worry you've got heaps of time, you've responded it's their turn now.

[Kiwi Graham]

So 28 days since the ticket, letters of complaint and return of the ticket and still nothing!
I contacted IPCA who rang me back today and are going to persue this arrogant Asian cop and have encouraged me to seek a defended hearing re the ticket (if I ever hear from them). They are pretty amazed at how this cop behaved too.

[Mully]

Do you mean placing CD's in the windscreen?

CDs??!!

Fuck, I've been using vinyl LPs - no wonder I keep getting tickets.

[caseye]

Mully ya plonka! Not Vinyls.
Plastics! oh boy it's hard to get good help around here.
Course it is necessary to make use of the plasitcs to discreetly hide the wee detector thingy's.

[kwaka_crasher]

So 28 days since the ticket, letters of complaint and return of the ticket and still nothing!

Anything yet?

[kb_SF1]

If you have not done so, ask for disclosure of the evidence of your alleged offense, if not supplied you can take an addition complaint to the IPCA and may be able to ask for the charges to be withdrawn.
If the information is provided you can see what you are facing.

[davereid]

IMHO you can win this case, and its pretty clear that the ticket is rubbish.

The policeman at best is incompetent and at worst is a liar.

You will find the NZ manual for the stalker radar posted here on KB.

The key feature is that while the radar can display the fastest and strongest targets, the NZ model can only lock the strongest target.

If the policeman showed you a locked on display, by definition it cannot be a motorcycle in traffic, it must be the strongest target, which of course will be a truck or car.

Take it to court, its a gimme, and keep the complaint going. Mr. Policeman has told easy-to-spot fibs, and should get another job.

[red mermaid]

So how many times have you operated a Stalker?



IMHO you can win this case, and its pretty clear that the ticket is rubbish.

The policeman at best is incompetent and at worst is a liar.

You will find the NZ manual for the stalker radar posted here on KB.

The key feature is that while the radar can display the fastest and strongest targets, the NZ model can only lock the strongest target.

If the policeman showed you a locked on display, by definition it cannot be a motorcycle in traffic, it must be the strongest target, which of course will be a truck or car.

Take it to court, its a gimme, and keep the complaint going. Mr. Policeman has told easy-to-spot fibs, and should get another job.

[davereid]

So how many times have you operated a Stalker?

I can do better than use em. I'm qualified to design em !

[Fatjim]

IIRC it is illegal to record a converstation without the other persons knowlegde...eg if you are talking to them on a phone and are recording it at your end etc...So if you tell them you are recording it and they dont like it to bad for them...you keep on recording

Where the fuck did you dream that up? I bet you saw it on shortland st.

BTW Graham, you got two options.

1. take it up the arse, costs less both in time, money and most importanly stress.
2. Fight it. The cop won't show, by this time you've been to court twice, probably two half days leave, a parking ticket at the court, met some intersting characters and you save yourself a fine and some demerits.

[Toaster]

So how many times have you operated a Stalker?

And he missed the bit about tracking each target visually in cooperation with each target as they come up on the radar. He wont find that in his little online manual.

[kwaka_crasher]

BTW Graham, you got two options.

1. take it up the arse, costs less both in time, money and most importanly stress.

At least in the immediate short term...

[kwaka_crasher]

I see a cop car approaching 6-800meters away. Lights go green we all head of from the lights (I’m in the right hand lane), into second, into third, his lights come on (about 80-90 meters away),
Starts to execute a ‘U’ turn, wheels on full lock and crossing the hatched area separating lanes,
Thank fuck he decides he couldn’t do it and stops, we ride/drive by (me shaking my head) my fukin heart was in my mouth!!


And he missed the bit about tracking each target visually in cooperation with each target as they come up on the radar. He wont find that in his little online manual.

There was no tracking history. The fastest signal could have come from anything as the opportunity to identify it by allowing the vehicle that the cop suspected to exit of the beam thus immediately altering the fastest signal reading was not afforded. The source of the return was not even anrrowed down much less identified.

[red mermaid]

You are possibly also qualified to breed, but that doesn't mean you know how too, or heaven help us, have done so.




I can do better than use em. I'm qualified to design em !

[caseye]

Oh Boy! Me thinks you've just boobed again there Mer!

[Pixie]

I can do better than use em. I'm qualified to design em !

You will appreciate this:
Some years ago a cop insisted that the microwave unit he was using (predating even the stalker) was undetectable by radar detectors.He insisted that the unit did not allow radio emissions to emanate from the unit.I asked him how it could work if that was the case?He answered that "the signal was held within the antenna".
I told him he should read a child's guide to how radar operates and that he was full of shit.

This is the standard of intelligence we are dealing with here.

[davereid]

....I told him he should read a child's guide to how radar operates and that he was full of shit.....

Most experienced cops, (after a beer at least,) will admit that they have had some "what the fuck??" moments with radar, where their common sense tells them the reading is simply rubbish.

Newer cops just get used to "reading the meter", and as the Stalker is very confidence inspiring they will often trust its reading above their own senses. After a while, they will have observed a few "gliches" and will tend to be more cautious about their interpretation of the reading.

This particular case IMHO is a bit of a gung-ho cop, who doesn't really understand the limitations of his equipment and is determined to "get a result", even if that means a little white lie or exaggeration is required.

Red Mermaid is just "standing up for the team", an admirable but in this case misplaced bit of loyalty.

The facts remain :

The Stalker CANNOT identify its target
The Stalker DOES NOT know how far away its target is
The Stalker ONLY saves the speed of the STRONGEST target regardless of the number of vehicles in the beam.

Its also worthy to consider how the Stalker works, particularly in mobile mode.

The doppler shift signal tells the Stalker three things...

The direction of travel of the target relative to the police car.
The speed of the target relative to the police car.
The speed of the police car

Digital Signal Processing calculates the target speed from these parameters.

The speed of the police car is an important factor. The radar takes a shot at a stationary object (the road in front of the patrol car), to determine the patrol cars speed.

What if the patrol car is doing 20km/hr, in heavy traffic towards the target which is doing 50 km/hr?

The radar will "see" a 70 km/hr doppler shift signal, and will subtract the 20 km/hr patrol car speed to get 50.

But in traffic, the patrol car speed may be wrong. The radar may be looking at the vehicle in front, and assume it has a "0" speed. In this case the radar will overestimate the speed of the target by the patrol car speed.

The cop might notice this. Then again, he might not.

[MSTRS]

Red Mermaid is just "standing up for the team", an admirable but in this case misplaced bit of loyalty.


No, he isn't. He is indulging in putdown of an individual. A world of difference to 'standing up for the team'. He is posting in here wearing the hat of a supposedly experienced officer of the law. His last post could be considered conduct unbecoming etc.

[avgas]

Trouble is, plod tend to hold your licence until they're finished. I suspect if you drive away, they'll pull you up and ticket you for not carrying your licence (if they're as much of a dick as this guy seems to be).
Ironically enough they can't.
One thing I found out recently was that if a law-holder-person puts you in a situation where you have to break the law. They can not punish you for that incident.
Mabey one of the lawyer types can tell me the technical side. Or what law it is.
Either way sounded stupid when I heard it, but makes sense now.

[Kiwi Graham]

Anything yet?
Nope, other than the reminder so have requested my day in court.


If you have not done so, ask for disclosure of the evidence of your alleged offense, if not supplied you can take an addition complaint to the IPCA and may be able to ask for the charges to be withdrawn.
If the information is provided you can see what you are facing.
Thanks for that, have asked for full diclosure of evidence relating to the alleged offence. Presumably it will be a copy of his notebook that he was so keen to keep scribbling in.


Where the fuck did you dream that up? I bet you saw it on shortland st.

BTW Graham, you got two options.

1. take it up the arse, costs less both in time, money and most importanly stress.
2. Fight it. The cop won't show, by this time you've been to court twice, probably two half days leave, a parking ticket at the court, met some intersting characters and you save yourself a fine and some demerits.
Option 2 for me, this cop is so out of order I want the opprtunity to have my say.

[kwaka_crasher]

His last post could be considered conduct unbecoming etc.

In his case I would consider it 'conduct indicative'... :whistle:

[peasea]

You are possibly also qualified to breed, but that doesn't mean you know how too, or heaven help us, have done so.

The same could be said of you.

Your arrogance destroys any credibility you MIGHT have had in any given argument to date.

[peasea]

In his case I would consider it 'conduct indicative'... :whistle:

Have some bling.

[Kiwi Graham]

>>>>>UPDATE>>>>>

I've got a preliminary hearing date, 10th May to set a hearing date !!!!????

So right in the middle of my work day I have to leave and attend court to find out when I go to court?! No doubt a time for the hearing will be fixed when I'm overseas this winter!!
I have a copy of the notes made by the police officer (term used loosley) that stopped me.
He claims to have checked my speed by radar know where near where he did the 'U' turn and in area I and all the traffic around me were very often stationary at several sets of traffic lights. His lies are mounting up!!!!!

He did the 'U' turn thing just after Universal Drive but claims to have 'Radared' me at Woodford Road almost a kilometer away!!! there was a car between us for the vast majority of this time and I was in a line of traffic all doing below the speed limit due to the fact that at 4pm on Licoln road its like a moving carpark.

I havent heard how the IPCA investigation is going but will advise them of the latest developments and see what they say. It seems a bit bizzar they are going to stand up in court with the officer still under investigation.

[kwaka_crasher]

He did the 'U' turn thing just after Universal Drive but claims to have 'Radared' me at Woodford Road almost a kilometer away!!! there was a car between us for the vast majority of this time and I was in a line of traffic all doing below the speed limit due to the fact that at 4pm on Licoln road its like a moving carpark.

1km away, on a busy road, picking out the smallest target, among other larger targets and without establishing a tracking history...

The guy's guessing. There's no way in the world he could have identified you as the source of any reading under those conditions at that distance especially as you stopped at the lights in the meantime meaning the fastest signal would have been coming from something else for that time.

[p.dath]

Hey mate, I don't want to throw cold water on you, but don't go to court with a view of achieving the righteous or moral outcome. Court doesn't work that way. Just aim for the best outcome.

Also note that JP's rarely find against the Police (you may not get heard by an actual "Judge" because the charge is minor). You'll need some actual hard evidence, like witnesses, to stand any chance.

If it comes down to a JP choosing between your version of the story, and the Police's version, and you only have hearsay (aka, your opinion and explanations) then the outcome wont be happy for you.

Just warning you that the Justice system is not a place to go to when you want justice.

[oldrider]

Hey mate, I don't want to throw cold water on you, but don't go to court with a view of achieving the righteous or moral outcome. Court doesn't work that way. Just aim for the best outcome.

Also note that JP's rarely find against the Police (you may not get heard by an actual "Judge" because the charge is minor). You'll need some actual hard evidence, like witnesses, to stand any chance.

If it comes down to a JP choosing between your version of the story, and the Police's version, and you only have hearsay (aka, your opinion and explanations) then the outcome wont be happy for you.

Just warning you that the Justice system is not a place to go to when you want justice.

Well, in New Zealand, justice is for criminals, law abiding citizens are just expected to "abide"! :yes:

[caseye]

Nevertheless go with head held high look that old Legal beagle right in the eye and tell the truth.
That is all you can do.
Any witnesses, sttements from business owners, workers in the stretch of road concerned who could say the whole road was moving at a snails pace, etc is all good stuff.
Good luck.

[red mermaid]

You will need to have any of your witnesses at court so that they can give evidence in person and be available for cross examination by the prosecution.

[Kiwi Graham]

Ooops forgot to post a bit of an update;

Went along to a preliminary hearing and have a date set for the 26th July for a 1 hour hearing.
Almost the next day the cops 'brief of evidence' came in the post contradicting his own note book (I have copy's of his notes made at the time).
He also claims to have been able to see me at nearly ¾ kilometer away in heavy traffic "travelling at high speed". I saw him at about 400 meter's away while I was stationary at a set of red traffic lights (it was as I pulled away from these lights that his lights went on and this whole farce started)

So the end of July should see this matter done and dusted one way or another.
I believe I have several areas of defense, from the time he claims to have stopped me I was still at work through to several factual errors in his notes and that where he claims to have first seen me to where I was would take the eyes of a bionic man.

The problem I will have will be the word of a police man verses my word. so I'll have to wait and see what happens.

The result of the Independent Police Conduct Authority's investigation was that this police officer did breach several areas of policy and has been disciplined on these matters, I'm sure he is now reflecting on them ...........not!
However all of that is a separate issue to the speeding claim which has to follow its course through court.

Continue to watch this space.

[Indoo]

The result of the Independent Police Conduct Authority's investigation was that this police officer did breach several areas of policy and has been disciplined on these matters, I'm sure he is now reflecting on them ...........not!.

Good for you on following it through, very much unlike a few of the whingers on here who wouldn't have done jack. Certainly a result and I wouldn't underestimate the impact it would have on the cop involved especially having his behavior brought to the attention of his superiors.

[caseye]

Ooops forgot to post a bit of an update;

Went along to a preliminary hearing and have a date set for the 26th July for a 1 hour hearing.
Almost the next day the cops 'brief of evidence' came in the post contradicting his own note book (I have copy's of his notes made at the time).
He also claims to have been able to see me at nearly ¾ kilometer away in heavy traffic "travelling at high speed". I saw him at about 400 meter's away while I was stationary at a set of red traffic lights (it was as I pulled away from these lights that his lights went on and this whole farce started)

So the end of July should see this matter done and dusted one way or another.
I believe I have several areas of defense, from the time he claims to have stopped me I was still at work through to several factual errors in his notes and that where he claims to have first seen me to where I was would take the eyes of a bionic man.

The problem I will have will be the word of a police man verses my word. so I'll have to wait and see what happens.

The result of the Independent Police Conduct Authority's investigation was that this police officer did breach several areas of policy and has been disciplined on these matters, I'm sure he is now reflecting on them ...........not!
However all of that is a separate issue to the speeding claim which has to follow its course through court.

Continue to watch this space.

Whether you are supposed to or not, use his being disciplined as evidence of his ability to Fudge/lie about what he saw you doing. For crying out loud take just one,or as many as you can get to go with you, witness/es if you can then it's two or more ordinary people against one mildly bent/incompetent copper.Good Luck mate.
PS in view of his being disciplined for not doing what he should, have you written back to the Police re your court case and asked for it to simply be kicked out on the grounds that "He did wrong things" ? just another avenue worth following up.

[scumdog]

Take any witness you can and any documantation that may be useful

Dress repectably

Be respectful

Don't make up anything - if you don't know? - say so.

[Kiwi Graham]

Oh well today was the day;

$170 fine & $130 court costs.

The Police prosecutor spent Half an hour detailing all the training the police officer has had all the equipment the vehicle has and how it worked, produced certificates of same and records of maintenance.

Surprisingly he didn't mention the number of times this police officer has had disciplinary process against him (I'm told he has a few) and he even moved to seek inadmissible any evidence or comment relating to the latest disciplinary process relating to this incident that I may use.

He put the officer on the stand (who didn't take an oath but made a statement of honesty?!) who recalled the event somewhat differently to me. A different part of the road a different time, different traffic conditions. He omitted to mention the severity of the attempted and aborted 'U' turn, claimed I was threatening and intimidating once stopped (I wasn't allowed to talk about what happened after I was stopped because it is subject to the complaint.......nice and fair eh!) this inter-mated I was unwilling to stop. Stated I was the only vehicle on this bit of road....at 4pm on Lincoln road!!!!.

Anyway when it was my turn I was reminded what I could not talk about and that the police prosecutor would object if it was encroached on. So simply put I stated my recollection of events, speeds, traffic conditions, where it was and the police officers initial actions, basicly a totally different story to that told by the policeman that stopped me.

The two judges/magistrates adjourned for five mins and returned. Their statement was basicly its your word against that of a highly trained police officer, the differing recollection of events mean we have to go with the police officers because we have evidence of his training and certificated equipment he used.

I cant believe a police officer can 'sit' (I stood) and give such false evidence. He couldn't look me in the face, he fidgeted and twitched in his chair constantly sniffing and fiddling with his watch. This man lied today. His body language screamed 'I'm lying' yet their was nothing I could do to prove it.

I was fully convinced it would be a his word against my word scenario and the outcome of that would be a forgone conclusion. I was totally surprised at how different sides were allowed to speak on some areas but not others, They were allowed to build a (inaccurate) picture covering the whole scenario, I wasn't allowed to talk about anything after him signalling to pull me over.

The prosecuting sergeant led his boy well, shutting him up when he was going wrong and leading him to say the right things when he messed up. He presented as a very unsure nervous little Asian man, not the sunglass wearing, little man syndrome'd, arrogant, rude, chip on his shoulder type that pulled me over in January.

Anyway I had my day in court......................lost................... . lost a little more respect for the police and will live in wonder as to when this officer will stray from his code of ethics again and how long much longer the police force will support him for.

Its been an eye opener for me and I don't regret pursuing it, its just a little shocking how the police can get away with saying what they like and the judges having to believe them.
Its cost me the prob entry fee for the HD nationals next season so will have to start saving again.

Thanks for everyone's support and encouragement over this.

Cheers

KG

[red mermaid]

I thought you were going to take witnesses along who saw what happened and could give evidence in support of yourself?

[maxlev]

Buy a digital recorder and carry it with you when out and about.
(also handy when dealing with govt depts)
Why?
Well you were initially told you were doing 80 kph.
Then you were told the speed on the radar was 74 kph.
You can then ask in court, why the lie?
Plod discreditted, case dropped.

[red mermaid]

Excellent idea.

A few police officers are doing this as it helps to kill the B/S complaints dead in the water.

[bogan]

He put the officer on the stand (who didn't take an oath but made a statement of honesty?!) who recalled the event somewhat differently to me. A different part of the road a different time, different traffic conditions. He omitted to mention the severity of the attempted and aborted 'U' turn, claimed I was threatening and intimidating once stopped (I wasn't allowed to talk about what happened after I was stopped because it is subject to the complaint.......nice and fair eh!) this inter-mated I was unwilling to stop. Stated I was the only vehicle on this bit of road....at 4pm on Lincoln road!!!!.

shit result dude.

I'm probably stating the obvious here, but doesn't the ticket have the place/time written on it? so if he says a different one...

also whats the story with the disciplinary process, you gotta go back to account your side of the story for that I'm guessing?


Buy a digital recorder and carry it with you when out and about.
(also handy when dealing with govt depts)
Why?
Well you were initially told you were doing 80 kph.
Then you were told the speed on the radar was 74 kph.
You can then ask in court, why the lie?
Plod discreditted, case dropped.

most cellphones will do this now too, may have to download an app though, or just bluff it at the time and he may be more reasonable.

[scumdog]

Surprisingly he didn't mention the number of times this police officer has had disciplinary process against him
KG

Sortalike any Court - even a person who has been to jail 10 times never gets that mentioned anywhere until after he is found guilty for the offence he is currently appearing in Court for.

[yachtie10]

Sortalike any Court - even a person who has been to jail 10 times never gets that mentioned anywhere until after he is found guilty for the offence he is currently appearing in Court for.

Yes but he is not the defendant. He is a trained expert witness whos credibility should have been able to be tested.

bad luck
just shows how far the system will go to protect their own (and there revenue)

[scumdog]

Yes but he is not the defendant. He is a trained expert witness whos credibility should have been able to be tested.

bad luck
just shows how far the system will go to protect their own (and there revenue)


You REALLY have NO idea how Courts work, do you?:blink:



Or are you a troll??

[yachtie10]

You REALLY have NO idea how Courts work, do you?:blink:



Or are you a troll??

obviously I dont as I stand by what I said, you want to explain your reply? or just wind up drongos

[Swoop]

Sounds like you were in front of JPs?


They never go against the prosecution. Get a real judge instead.




Stated I was the only vehicle on this bit of road....at 4pm on Lincoln road!!!!.
That is an outright lie. Much like saying Queen St was completely empty at 9pm on a Friday night.

[Patrick]

Buy a digital recorder and carry it with you when out and about.
(also handy when dealing with govt depts)
Why?
Well you were initially told you were doing 80 kph.
Then you were told the speed on the radar was 74 kph.
You can then ask in court, why the lie?
Plod discreditted, case dropped.

One can have the speed show up as 80, clear tone etc etc and the driver hit the picks because the detector went off/he saw the cop car whatever, and lock the speed as he was braking by now... locked at 74 (as an example....). Can still ticket for 80, or for 74. One has a choice.

No "lie" needed. Personally, locked is easier.

[Patrick]

Oh well today was the day;

$170 fine & $130 court costs.

The Police prosecutor spent Half an hour detailing all the training the police officer has had all the equipment the vehicle has and how it worked, produced certificates of same and records of maintenance.

He has to... it's part of the evidence....

Surprisingly he didn't mention the number of times this police officer has had disciplinary process against him (I'm told he has a few) and he even moved to seek inadmissible any evidence or comment relating to the latest disciplinary process relating to this incident that I may use.

...."alledgedly" is a word you might be looking for here. Or "hearsay....." as you were "told he has a few..."

He put the officer on the stand (who didn't take an oath but made a statement of honesty?!)

Athiests who refuse to "swear on the bible" or other religions take an oath.... some Asian folk for example.....

who recalled the event somewhat differently to me. A different part of the road a different time, different traffic conditions. He omitted to mention the severity of the attempted and aborted 'U' turn, claimed I was threatening and intimidating once stopped (I wasn't allowed to talk about what happened after I was stopped because it is subject to the complaint.......nice and fair eh!) this inter-mated I was unwilling to stop. Stated I was the only vehicle on this bit of road....at 4pm on Lincoln road!!!!.

Only one at 4pm??? TUI......

Anyway when it was my turn I was reminded what I could not talk about and that the police prosecutor would object if it was encroached on. So simply put I stated my recollection of events, speeds, traffic conditions, where it was and the police officers initial actions, basicly a totally different story to that told by the policeman that stopped me.

The two judges/magistrates

JP's

adjourned for five mins and returned. Their statement was basicly its your word against that of a highly trained police officer, the differing recollection of events mean we have to go with the police officers because we have evidence of his training and certificated equipment he used.

I cant believe a police officer can 'sit' (I stood) and give such false evidence. He couldn't look me in the face, he fidgeted and twitched in his chair constantly sniffing and fiddling with his watch. This man lied today. His body language screamed 'I'm lying' yet their was nothing I could do to prove it.

I was fully convinced it would be a his word against my word scenario and the outcome of that would be a forgone conclusion. I was totally surprised at how different sides were allowed to speak on some areas but not others, They were allowed to build a (inaccurate) picture covering the whole scenario, I wasn't allowed to talk about anything after him signalling to pull me over.

Sometimes a lawyer can be helpful.... If they raised issues after the stop, then it's fair game... you could too.....

The prosecuting sergeant led his boy well, shutting him up when he was going wrong and leading him to say the right things when he messed up. He presented as a very unsure nervous little Asian man, not the sunglass wearing, little man syndrome'd, arrogant, rude, chip on his shoulder type that pulled me over in January.

Can't "lead"..... Again, a lawyer might have been the wiser move.....

Anyway I had my day in court......................lost................... . lost a little more respect for the police

all of them?

and will live in wonder as to when this officer will stray from his code of ethics again

time will tell. Hard to get rid of dead wood sometimes......

and how long much longer the police force will support him for.

They won't......

Its been an eye opener for me and I don't regret pursuing it, its just a little shocking how the police can get away with saying what they like and the judges having to believe them.
Its cost me the prob entry fee for the HD nationals next season so will have to start saving again.

Thanks for everyone's support and encouragement over this.

Cheers

KG

Bummer. Was legal aid not an option?

[BevanPT]

Oh well today was the day;

$170 fine & $130 court costs.

Anyway I had my day in court......................lost................... . lost a little more respect for the police and will live in wonder as to when this officer will stray from his code of ethics again and how long much longer the police force will support him for.



That result really sucks. Was really hoping common sense and honesty was going to win this time.

[Kiwi Graham]

I thought you were going to take witnesses along who saw what happened and could give evidence in support of yourself?
The only witness I had available was one of the people in the address who's garden he parked on and couldn't be used because this was part of the complaint against him.

Buy a digital recorder and carry it with you when out and about.
(also handy when dealing with govt depts)
Why?
Well you were initially told you were doing 80 kph.
Then you were told the speed on the radar was 74 kph.
You can then ask in court, why the lie?
Plod discreditted, case dropped.
I've been reminded about the 'use the cell phone to record the event' thing, just wish like hell I'd thought of it at the time. If it could have been used in court it would have proved so much in my defence.

Excellent idea.

A few police officers are doing this as it helps to kill the B/S complaints dead in the water.
I'm guessing a 'few' members of the public will be doing the same if they aren't already.

shit result dude.

I'm probably stating the obvious here, but doesn't the ticket have the place/time written on it? so if he says a different one...

also whats the story with the disciplinary process, you gotta go back to account your side of the story for that I'm guessing?



most cellphones will do this now too, may have to download an app though, or just bluff it at the time and he may be more reasonable.

The ticket said "Lincoln Road", its 2.4 kilometres long and the time stated was almost the same time I left work at Point Chevalier (a good few minutes away)He chose to claim it was one end when in fact it happened at the other end and me mentioning the time error didn't appear to register with them. The ticket does say approx time but I would say he was about 10-15 mins out.
The disciplinary has been taken 'in-house' I was asked by the independent police conduct authority if I would be happy for that to happen on the understanding he had breached rules and regulations and there would be corrective actions required by him.

[bogan]

The ticket said "Lincoln Road", its 2.4 kilometres long and the time stated was almost the same time I left work at Point Chevalier (a good few minutes away)He chose to claim it was one end when in fact it happened at the other end and me mentioning the time error didn't appear to register with them. The ticket does say approx time but I would say he was about 10-15 mins out.
The disciplinary has been taken 'in-house' I was asked by the independent police conduct authority if I would be happy for that to happen on the understanding he had breached rules and regulations and there would be corrective actions required by him.

That stinks that it has been taken in house yet you couldn't use that to get off the ticket. Sounds a lot like they just closed ranks, and I can see why you would lose faith in not just that cop, but the system as well.

[Rogue Rider]

1) You only have to stop
2) If asked for your licence you only have to show it eg "produce it" you do not have to hand it over to them
3) Once you have stopped and produced your licence you may leave, you dont have to wait for the ticket
4) the only way they can stop you from leaving is to arrest you - which they cannot do because you have stopped for the lights - and you have produced your licence

but seriously, what a wanker

Sounds to me he is a complete proverbial waste of space like the 80% of popo I have met policing our roads. They are a new breed of wanker, deficient in personality, respect and integrity.
NZ police are recruiting pathetically insufficient stereotypical dip sticks, who are young and educated but lack any practical communication ability. I make no apology as I base my conclusion on personal experience and credible evidence from others. It is consistent and credible to conclude that our traffic law enforcement agency is less useful and respectful as most of the criminal population in prison. Thank God they aren't armed, can you imagine what would happen then, bloody idiots.:shutup::shutup::shutup::shutup::shutup::sh utup::shutup::shutup::shutup::shutup::shutup::angr y::angry::angry::angry::angry::angry::angry::angry :..
.
.:scooter::scooter::scooter::scooter::scooter::sco oter::scooter::gob:

[Jantar]

....The ticket said "Lincoln Road", its 2.4 kilometres long and the time stated was almost the same time I left work at Point Chevalier (a good few minutes away)He chose to claim it was one end when in fact it happened at the other end and me mentioning the time error didn't appear to register with them. The ticket does say approx time but I would say he was about 10-15 mins out.....
Another good reason to have a GPS. It shows the speed the location, and the EXACT time. GPS time is internationally recognised as the world standard.

[Damantis]

A disappointing result Predictable though.
Pay it off at $5/week.
If you are still pissed, stalk him and let down two of his tyres.

[imdying]

Sortalike any Court - even a person who has been to jail 10 times never gets that mentioned anywhere until after he is found guilty for the offence he is currently appearing in Court for.You and I both know that that is not always the case :no:

[Swoop]

... on the understanding he had breached rules and regulations and there would be corrective actions required by him.
So he has to buy the entire station their morning smoko of donuts then?
Another wet bus ticket punishment.

[scumdog]

Sounds to me he is a complete proverbial waste of space like the 80% of popo I have met policing our roads. They are a new breed of wanker, deficient in personality, respect and integrity.
NZ police are recruiting pathetically insufficient stereotypical dip sticks, who are young and educated but lack any practical communication ability. I make no apology as I base my conclusion on personal experience and credible evidence from others. It is consistent and credible to conclude that our traffic law enforcement agency is less useful and respectful as most of the criminal population in prison. Thank God they aren't armed, can you imagine what would happen then, bloody idiots.:shutup::shutup::shutup::shutup::shutup::sh utup::shutup::shutup::shutup::shutup::shutup::angr y::angry::angry::angry::angry::angry::angry::angry :..
.
.:scooter::scooter::scooter::scooter::scooter::sco oter::scooter::gob:

Wow, sounds like you've met me....:mellow:

I guess you've met every copin the country???

[caseye]

Sorry to hear that Kiwi!
It seems that those of us left,who have or had a shred of respect for our law enforncement are getting more and more prejudiced.
My own experience of our road policing types of late is 50/50 but i can't disagree with the notion that our perception of those being given expensive equipment and "training" are coming across as rude, arrogant, lying little Hitlers.
No Scummy, I haven't met you, I'd like to though just so i can say i know a good bugger who's still in the job.Ditto the others around here who have the wherewithall to post sensible and sane things.

[Gremlin]

Don't take it too hard mate, unfortunately, you were in front of JPs. You really need something concrete (not just your word vs cops word - GPS, pictures, video, audio etc) in order to beat a cop in front of JPs.

Friend fought a ticket that wasn't his in court against JPs, wrong lane on motorway, wrong colour bike, hadn't received a ticket in years (5+). Still lost. JPs went off to confer and came back basically saying, sorry, no choice.

Judge is your only shot really. They will dress down whomever they like, whenever they like, and everyone says Yes your Honour, My apologies your Honour. :yes:

[SS90]

Sortalike any Court - even a person who has been to jail 10 times never gets that mentioned anywhere until after he is found guilty for the offence he is currently appearing in Court for.

This brings up a good point.

So many times a crappy piece of society gets off charges because of due course (innocent people benefit too), and it is correct for a Police officer to receive the same treatment.

Roll back to Clint Rickards mates...... 2 ex coppers doing time for unlawful sexual contact, which was suppressed from the Jury, while at the same time up in court for historical unlawful sexual contact....... in the eyes of the law, that (could) infulence a Jury desision on the new case............

The conservative in me thinks that in cases such as this one, and the Louis Nicholls saga, perhaps certain situations (such as disciplinary action for actions taken during the ticketing incident) should be admissible (I see it as material to the case), when dealing with anyone, be they Police or civilian.

As the law stands, 5 times rapist up (again) in court, the Jury can't be told he has 5 convictions for the same thing, because it may influence their decision, because he (may) be innocent...... ok, innocent until proven guilty, and that is paramount to our justice system (by the way in Germany it is guilty till proved otherwise), but there needs to be a "special circumstances" law (such as kiddy fiddlers, rapists and so on)

I'm sorry you did not receive what you would consider justice, but that would seem it was because the system works both ways.

[Katman]

Don't take it too hard mate, unfortunately, you were in front of JPs. You really need something concrete (not just your word vs cops word - GPS, pictures, video, audio etc) in order to beat a cop in front of JPs.



I defended a speeding ticket in front of a couple of JPs a couple of years back.

The cop blatantly lied under oath and the JP's swallowed every bit of it. Needless to say I was found guilty.

I appealed and the judge who heard the appeal agreed that the cop had lied (although he was careful not to use those words) and that the JP's had performed their role badly. He ordered a re-hearing which was subsequently dropped.

JP's are a fucking joke in a court situation. They should stick to being marriage celebrants.

[Swoop]

JP's are a fucking joke in a court situation. They should stick to being marriage celebrants.
I find myself agreeing with you.

They are merely a small cog in a larger machine, which would still function quite well without them.

[DougieNZ]

I find myself agreeing with you.

They are merely a small cog in a larger machine, which would still function quite well without them.

I think you are being quite harsh there. Being a JP isn't just about taking abuse on the KiwiBiker site......

There are also ministerial functions to being a JP which involves helping the community with statutory declarations, certified photocopies and all sorts of statutory documentation. They often can be found giving up their own time unpaid in a community service role. They assist people in their workplace, home, and local community centre on countless occasions. That is without even taking in to account the countless hours they spend supporting the judicial system. They are giving up a lot of of time to help the community out.

And just to sort out another small myth - being a JP does not automatically make you a marriage celebrant. There is a separate application process to follow - and JP's have no preference over anyone else.

I will not comment on individual cases - but I happen to know that JP's go through extensive and ongoing training to sit on the bench. Without them hearing matters there would be a LONG wait for many cases to be heard. I think you would find that without them, the "machine" would fall over.

There are always two sides to every story...

[Swoop]

Their other community work is fine. Being involved in the judicial system however, is nothing more than rubber stamping cases to go forward to a judge.

[oldrider]

I defended a speeding ticket in front of a couple of JPs a couple of years back.

The cop blatantly lied under oath and the JP's swallowed every bit of it. Needless to say I was found guilty.

I appealed and the judge who heard the appeal agreed that the cop had lied (although he was careful not to use those words) and that the JP's had performed their role badly. He ordered a re-hearing which was subsequently dropped.

JP's are a fucking joke in a court situation. They should stick to being marriage celebrants.


I think you are being quite harsh there. Being a JP isn't just about taking abuse on the KiwiBiker site......

There are also ministerial functions to being a JP which involves helping the community with statutory declarations, certified photocopies and all sorts of statutory documentation. They often can be found giving up their own time unpaid in a community service role. They assist people in their workplace, home, and local community centre on countless occasions. That is without even taking in to account the countless hours they spend supporting the judicial system. They are giving up a lot of of time to help the community out.

And just to sort out another small myth - being a JP does not automatically make you a marriage celebrant. There is a separate application process to follow - and JP's have no preference over anyone else.

I will not comment on individual cases - but I happen to know that JP's go through extensive and ongoing training to sit on the bench. Without them hearing matters there would be a LONG wait for many cases to be heard. I think you would find that without them, the "machine" would fall over.

There are always two sides to every story...

With all due respect DougieNZ, four out of five JP's that I have known (very well) are complete idiots and absolutely the wrong choices for the job but there they are!

Pillars of the community? Yeah, right. :mellow:

[jahrasti]

The disciplinary has been taken 'in-house' I was asked by the independent police conduct authority if I would be happy for that to happen on the understanding he had breached rules and regulations and there would be corrective actions required by him.

Now if I am reading your quote correctly, you were asked by the IPCA if it could be taken in house.
Did you say yes? If you did that is am important point.

You don't say what you said.



That stinks that it has been taken in house yet you couldn't use that to get off the ticket. Sounds a lot like they just closed ranks, and I can see why you would lose faith in not just that cop, but the system as well.

If he agreed for it to be delt with by the dept then that makes a difference as they didn't close ranks. And why would you lose faith in a system if you were happy for Police to deal with it.

[The Pastor]

Oh well today was the day;

$170 fine & $130 court costs.

The Police prosecutor spent Half an hour detailing all the training the police officer has had all the equipment the vehicle has and how it worked, produced certificates of same and records of maintenance.

Surprisingly he didn't mention the number of times this police officer has had disciplinary process against him (I'm told he has a few) and he even moved to seek inadmissible any evidence or comment relating to the latest disciplinary process relating to this incident that I may use.

He put the officer on the stand (who didn't take an oath but made a statement of honesty?!) who recalled the event somewhat differently to me. A different part of the road a different time, different traffic conditions. He omitted to mention the severity of the attempted and aborted 'U' turn, claimed I was threatening and intimidating once stopped (I wasn't allowed to talk about what happened after I was stopped because it is subject to the complaint.......nice and fair eh!) this inter-mated I was unwilling to stop. Stated I was the only vehicle on this bit of road....at 4pm on Lincoln road!!!!.

Anyway when it was my turn I was reminded what I could not talk about and that the police prosecutor would object if it was encroached on. So simply put I stated my recollection of events, speeds, traffic conditions, where it was and the police officers initial actions, basicly a totally different story to that told by the policeman that stopped me.

The two judges/magistrates adjourned for five mins and returned. Their statement was basicly its your word against that of a highly trained police officer, the differing recollection of events mean we have to go with the police officers because we have evidence of his training and certificated equipment he used.

I cant believe a police officer can 'sit' (I stood) and give such false evidence. He couldn't look me in the face, he fidgeted and twitched in his chair constantly sniffing and fiddling with his watch. This man lied today. His body language screamed 'I'm lying' yet their was nothing I could do to prove it.

I was fully convinced it would be a his word against my word scenario and the outcome of that would be a forgone conclusion. I was totally surprised at how different sides were allowed to speak on some areas but not others, They were allowed to build a (inaccurate) picture covering the whole scenario, I wasn't allowed to talk about anything after him signalling to pull me over.

The prosecuting sergeant led his boy well, shutting him up when he was going wrong and leading him to say the right things when he messed up. He presented as a very unsure nervous little Asian man, not the sunglass wearing, little man syndrome'd, arrogant, rude, chip on his shoulder type that pulled me over in January.

Anyway I had my day in court......................lost................... . lost a little more respect for the police and will live in wonder as to when this officer will stray from his code of ethics again and how long much longer the police force will support him for.

Its been an eye opener for me and I don't regret pursuing it, its just a little shocking how the police can get away with saying what they like and the judges having to believe them.
Its cost me the prob entry fee for the HD nationals next season so will have to start saving again.

Thanks for everyone's support and encouragement over this.

Cheers

KG

unfortunately, this has also been my experience of the nz police force. They will lie in court to save their own skin. Luckily for me the JP caught the cop out in his lies.

The cops always win in court - they are paid to be there!

[The Pastor]

Oh well today was the day;

$170 fine & $130 court costs.


Thanks for everyone's support and encouragement over this.

Cheers

KG

unfortunately, this has also been my experience of the nz police force. They will lie in court to save their own skin. Luckily for me the JP caught the cop out in his lies.

The cops always win in court - they are paid to be there!

[bogan]

If he agreed for it to be delt with by the dept then that makes a difference as they didn't close ranks. And why would you lose faith in a system if you were happy for Police to deal with it.

It depends on the outcome, if you are given the impression that dealt with will actually involve some action, then they close ranks and support the cop once you agree to it, then yeh, I would lose faith in it.

[Kiwi Graham]

Now if I am reading your quote correctly, you were asked by the IPCA if it could be taken in house.
Did you say yes? If you did that is am important point.

You don't say what you said.




If he agreed for it to be delt with by the dept then that makes a difference as they didn't close ranks. And why would you lose faith in a system if you were happy for Police to deal with it.


It depends on the outcome, if you are given the impression that dealt with will actually involve some action, then they close ranks and support the cop once you agree to it, then yeh, I would lose faith in it.

Yes I was asked by the IPCA if I was happy for the police to manage the diciplinary process of this officer having found he was culpable for several breaches of protocol. and was assured this would include corrective actions, evidence from him (presumably to them) of reflection and assurance it would be dealt with in a proper manner.

Didnt stop the charade that happened yesterday.

[jahrasti]

It depends on the outcome, if you are given the impression that dealt with will actually involve some action, then they close ranks and support the cop once you agree to it, then yeh, I would lose faith in it.

Oh so it is IF. What experience do you base this on?

I know plenty that have had their pepe smacked from internal hearing. But wait you are right the popo wrong and life will go on as normal.

[bogan]

Oh so it is IF. What experience do you base this on?

I know plenty that have had their pepe smacked from internal hearing. But wait you are right the popo wrong and life will go on as normal.

I'm not basing it on any personal experience, just what kiwigraham has told (hence my use of if, sounds like, etc). ie, it sounds like kiwi graham got shit deal here when he let the cops deal with it internally, and i can see how this would make you lose faith in the system.

[Madness]

So, another case of "Applied Justice" in the Waitemata Policing District. Go Kelly, Go.

Pricks

[cowboyz]

Another good reason to have a GPS. It shows the speed the location, and the EXACT time. GPS time is internationally recognised as the world standard.


actually.. no!

the ticket that lost me my licence I was alleged to be doing 111km/hr on Sh1. I was carrying a GPS at the time and recorded the previous 20 mins from being pulled over showing my speed never exceeded 106km/hr

I got a nice generic letter back saying .. Its not uncommon for offenders recollections to differ from the officiers.. give us your licence.

I have zero respect for the police. absoultely nil.. They are one step away from lawyers in my book. The final straw for me was when I was assualted at work by my employer resulting in 9 days off work and subsenquently being fired and the police saying... well.. we dont want to do anything about it cause it might have been an accident. This was after they waited 6 whole days from me laying the complaint to interviewing the offenders who had plenty of time to make up a new story. NZ cops suck. End of story.

[Patrick]

You and I both know that that is not always the case :no:

For EBA 3rd and subsequent, DWD 3rd and subsequent.... because it is their third time, or more on like charges.....

What others are you referring to then?

[yachtie10]

For EBA 3rd and subsequent, DWD 3rd and subsequent.... because it is their third time, or more on like charges.....

What others are you referring to then?

I think the issue I was trying to point out originally is that the defendants past convictions are generally not allowed to be heard before sentencing. but the question asked by op was about the cops history.
he was presented as an expert trained witness but that was not allowed to refuted by the defendant. that is a crock of shit which if he had a decent lawyer I suspect he may have had a different outcome
BTW I am no lawyer but have been on a few juries plus watched court many times so I may be wrong. Happy to have a real lawyer point out where I am incorrect

[Gremlin]

actually.. no!

the ticket that lost me my licence I was alleged to be doing 111km/hr on Sh1. I was carrying a GPS at the time and recorded the previous 20 mins from being pulled over showing my speed never exceeded 106km/hr

I got a nice generic letter back saying .. Its not uncommon for offenders recollections to differ from the officiers.. give us your licence.
well... that sucks if it pans out like that. I've been merrily carrying it, using it etc, and recommending others use it, as its realistically the only independent party to the claim... Did you send the data in as well? I'd certainly be looking at it as solid proof.... :blink:

[scracha]

Oh well today was the day;
$170 fine & $130 court costs.


Could be worse mate, had similar happen in the UK and ended up with equivalent of about $1800 to pay.

It pains me to say it, but most cops aren't arseholes; it's just the one or two lying sacks of shit that tend to stick in your memory.

Magistrates/JP's on the other hand. Most magistrates/JP's are fuckin busybodies on an ego trip who in no way accurately represent a normal cross section of society.

[cowboyz]

well... that sucks if it pans out like that. I've been merrily carrying it, using it etc, and recommending others use it, as its realistically the only independent party to the claim... Did you send the data in as well? I'd certainly be looking at it as solid proof.... :blink:

yes. full data sheet on a printout from the GPS unit with an invitation to the source files... and its still not good enough to nudge the word of a cop who can pick out one speeding biker in a group of 10 cars.

[Max Preload]

Oh well today was the day;

$170 fine & $130 court costs.

And people wonder why so many don't stop.


One can have the speed show up as 80, clear tone etc etc and the driver hit the picks because the detector went off/he saw the cop car whatever, and lock the speed as he was braking by now... locked at 74 (as an example....). Can still ticket for 80, or for 74. One has a choice.

No "lie" needed. Personally, locked is easier.But that doesn't work in the case of a bike among cars because you can't lock the FASTEST, only the STRONGEST.

[Crazy Steve]

After time to cool down and a letter of complaint sent about the attitude of this officer I thought I’d put it out to the masses.

It goes like this; Rush hour traffic last week;

I filter through stationary traffic to the front of the traffic lights by Pak & Save on Lincoln Road, Henderson. I see a cop car approaching 6-800meters away. Lights go green we all head of from the lights (I’m in the right hand lane), into second, into third, his lights come on (about 80-90 meters away),
Starts to execute a ‘U’ turn, wheels on full lock and crossing the hatched area separating lanes,
Thank fuck he decides he couldn’t do it and stops, we ride/drive by (me shaking my head) my fukin heart was in my mouth!!
He pulls into the traffic and follows (lights now off) through several lights, past the hospital (over a kilometre and several mins later) he sticks his lights on and a blip on his siren and points for me to pull over.
I filter into the left lane. No where obvious to stop (its rush hour!! Solid traffic etc) so pull onto the grass verge.
He pulls across a business address’s entrance and sits in his car? Another car is attempting to access the business so I get his attention and indicate he is blocking their drive. He pulls his car onto their garden!!! Address occupiers staring at him through their window.
And continues to sit in his car dark wrap round shades, watch to big for his wrist Asian dude.
When he does get out I of course ask what’s up. You were doing 80kmh. What!!!
I was stationary when I saw you and doing no more than 30-40k when you stuck your lights on and tried your ‘U’ turn!! Can I see your radar please; he glances back into his car and changes the speed he claimed I was doing to speed on the radar 74k.
That’s wrong no way was going as fast as that indicates, how do I know that was me and at this time it was recorded I ask.
Him still with his Rambo shades on (not sunny but overcast by the way) stares at me and says it was you because I said it was.
I said I was one of many vehicles all just leaving a set of traffic lights and none of us were doing anything like that speed. He said I was out on my own?? I said I will contest the ticket and feel he was picking on the motorcyclist.
All this time he had an arrogant, self important attitude about him and he was really starting to piss me off. I asked how long he was going to be. He was writing in his note book….no answer.
I am on my way home from work to collect my car to pick up my children from pre-school and had been on the side of the road for about 5 mins by now.
I asked again why he picked the motorcyclist out of all (there were lots) of the other vehicles, “I chose you”. But I thought I was out on my own, now you say you chose me (I knew a ticket was coming and it was total bullshit so I thought I would see what he had to say) he said nothing.
I said I thought he had a stink attitude and was arrogant and rude and that I would contesting the ticket, he said write your letter!!
Time was ticking away now so I said again how long is this going to take? No answer and gets in his car and shuts the door. I sit there for what felt like ages, he is just sat there writing in his notebook?
I knock on the window, ignored, I knock again, ignored. I open the door and ask again why is he ignoring me, how long he was going to be and why was he not answering any questions? Again, no answer just another stare through his shades. I called him fucking ignorant and said I’m off; my priorities are to pick up my children and not sit here being ignored by an arrogant copper. Put my helmet and gloves on jump on my bike and about to start it when he’s out of his car and shouting I’ll arrest you if you ride off!! What for I ask? Failing to stop!!
I’ve been stopped for the last 10 minuets what are you talking about, listed all his changes of events, his attitude and speeds etc I said he could post my license and ticket to me and that in two minuets I was going (to pick up the kids) and he had a choice, arrest me or write the ticket and give it to me now. I got the ticket.

I was bloody fuming, what an absolute bullshit ticket from a cop with the worst attitude I’ve ever come across.

Once I got home and sorted the children I sat down and wrote my best recollection of events and the next day (once calmed down) wrote a letter of complaint to both Henderson Police and Police NZ in Wellington and included the ticket.

I am fast loosing respect for traffic cops. I can’t believe he dreamt all this up because I shook my head at an attempted and aborted ‘U’ turn. This guy must have other complaints about him if this is how he treats people.

On reflection; I was not speeding. I could have sat there and took it up the arse. But I would have received the same ticket I got for challenging him. It was clear from the off that he was going to be a bastard by the way he presented himself (folded arms, wide stance), his attitude, the insistence of wearing and staring at me through dark shades, his treatment of other peoples property…you just know when someone is going to be a twat and he was that someone.

I will update the thread as I learn more.

And now we know why Nz Police are currently being Shot/Stab and BEATEN with there own radio's.......

Crazy Steve.

[TimeOut]

And people wonder why so many don't stop.

But that doesn't work in the case of a bike among cars because you can't lock the FASTEST, only the STRONGEST.

They don't have to have a lock to write a ticket, they can guess (sorry make an educated guess) as to who the fastest is:innocent:

[Max Preload]

They don't have to have a lock to write a ticket, they can guess (sorry make an educated guess) as to who the fastest is:innocent:I'm aware of that. They can also not even turn it on and still write you an infringement offence notice. But I was simply commenting on the locking aspect and the situation in which it can't be done.

[caseye]

Well Kiwi Graham, i'm sorry that it did not go the way it clearly should have.
You did your best and now all of us out here know it's pointless trying to get justice from our judicial system.
It also highlights an unwillingness on the part of the ranked Police who should have investigated your claims more thoroughly and overturned/nullified their officers infringement notice(something that they can do) before it got to the court room.In my humble opinion that arsehole of a Hitler youth leader should not have the privilage of wearing the uniform.
Sorry it didn't work out mate. Because it damnd well should have.

[scumdog]

And now we know why Nz Police are currently being Shot/Stab and BEATEN with there own radio's.......

Crazy Steve.

You take that back - I've never been Shot/Stabbed with ANY radio - let alone been beaten with one...

(BTW: it should be 'their' radio...)

[Crazy Steve]

You take that back - I've never been Shot/Stabbed with ANY radio - let alone been beaten with one...

(BTW: it should be 'their' radio...)

Your right Scumdog it should be their :yes:

But I won't take it back...I heard of a case in Ngaruawahia recently where the officer was beaten with his own radio...Very sad that Police officers can't handle thems selfs with basic self defence anymore..And it dosn't give me ANY reasurance that they can Protect me and my Family....So they can't protect me and they are giving us shit....

I say if they (The Nz Police) get in your way push them over and keep going ! !

Crazy Steve.

[Crazy Steve]

Time and time again...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYZWQuEb5sM

Crazy Steve.

[Smifffy]

Time and time again...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYZWQuEb5sM

Crazy Steve.

This video has been removed by the user.

:angry:

[Tone165]

Graham,

I feel for ya bro...had exactly the same experience here in Qld twice!

It shits me to tears that ppl choosde to bend over and pay unjust fines because after all in the long run....it's just easier/cheaper/less stressful.

Would they be so blase accused of Peadophelia? Er..whats the fine...may as well pay it...save a day off work etc...

Good for you having a go, and especially for sharing your experience..it my prod the next guy into action, and eventually when this rogue copper appears in court for the thjousanth time...the system may have to acknowledge that it is fucked.

I no longer adhere to the normal conventions re Police...There may be a good un here n there..but I can't afford to give the benefit of the doubt.

They are just another road hazard.

[morsedog]

Again, "safer Communities Together"..........pfft.

What a c**t. Cop cars should have the cameras in them that the Yank cruisers do, so it will be there for all to see when you write in your complaint. It's your word verses his unfortunately.

I was visiting some family of mine in the States, I was riding my cousin's bike at a reasonable speed. The same thing happened to me. A cop pulling out from a fuel station pulls me over before I could even get up to speed. He says I was doing twice the speed limit when I never even came close to the speed limit. I asked to see his radar and camera, no luck. Since I am not registered to the bike, or have an yank license I am getting a large ticket and I had to wait for hours (http://www.chacha.com/topic/hours). I have to go back home and cannot stay until the court date to fight it. I called the cops there and they don't have cameras in their cars (or at least not all of them). I never paid the thing, they can come over here and get me if they want the money. Cameras would be a great idea, I may write a letter right now to Wellington.

[caseye]

I was visiting some family of mine in the States, I was riding my cousin's bike at a reasonable speed. The same thing happened to me. A cop pulling out from a fuel station pulls me over before I could even get up to speed. He says I was doing twice the speed limit when I never even came close to the speed limit. I asked to see his radar and camera, no luck. Since I am not registered to the bike, or have an yank license I am getting a large ticket. I have to go back home and cannot stay until the court date to fight it. I called the cops there and they don't have cameras in their cars (or at least not all of them). I never paid the thing, they can come over here and get me if they want the money. Cameras would be a great idea, I may write a letter right now to Wellington.


"DO IT" it might not sound like much, but that letter might be the ten thousandth and it may tip the balance, go write it mate. Kwi G should not have gone down on this particular charge.
Our law enforcement has boobed! Don't evne think about it you two!

[Expert]

I got pulled by the cops a while back and was treated like shit, i should have complained and didn't, and then regretted it.
I was in a car and the passenger couldn't believe the cop had spoken to me like he had. i felt it was unfair, he was an indian guy, very arrogant.
I was pissed off and when the cop had handed me over a ticket ($650) i took it and said "thanks..for nothing."
He lent into the car, snatched the ticket out of my hand and dissapeared back to his car. returned about about 5 mins later and told me with a grin that now i was banned too and he would arrest me if he saw me driving again.
i had to get my passenger to drive me home.

What had i done? run over a nun? sold drugs to kiddies?
My english licence was 9 days over being changed to a kiwi licence, i had the form in the car, all filled out and had booked the test. i showed this to him and he called me a liar.
welcome to nz.

[Smifffy]

I got pulled by the cops a while back and was treated like shit, i should have complained and didn't, and then regretted it.
I was in a car and the passenger couldn't believe the cop had spoken to me like he had. i felt it was unfair, he was an indian guy, very arrogant.
I was pissed off and when the cop had handed me over a ticket ($650) i took it and said "thanks..for nothing."
He lent into the car, snatched the ticket out of my hand and dissapeared back to his car. returned about about 5 mins later and told me with a grin that now i was banned too and he would arrest me if he saw me driving again.
i had to get my passenger to drive me home.

What had i done? run over a nun? sold drugs to kiddies?
My english licence was 9 days over being changed to a kiwi licence, i had the form in the car, all filled out and had booked the test. i showed this to him and he called me a liar.
welcome to nz.

That's ok on motorway patrol last night they showed a guy whacked out on P, who had hit a number of cars on the motorway, and his total fine was in the order of $400-$500.

Another guy driving erratically with a strong smeel of cannabis in the car and a used bong. They didn't test him for dope, confiscated his bong and sent him on his way with a $300 odd fine.

Whatever you do, don't exceed the limit by 4km/h this weekend!!

[KiWiP]

To be a cop. These are the entry requirements for the Police force (according to their own website)WE TAKE ANYONE (http://www.newcops.co.nz/GetStarted/Requirements/DoYouQualify)

1. New Zealand resident [obvious]
2. Have a visual standard of 6/12 [you're not legally blind]
3. Asthma is not too bad
4. Not crippled by significant operations [can leg it after perps]
5. Full class B or class 1 New Zealand Drivers Licence [reasonable, don't want the cop pulling you over to rear end you]
6. Do you have any previous criminal or traffic convictions - including warnings, court appearances and diversions? [this funnily enough doesn't seem to preclude you from applying?]
7. Can you swim
8. Drink driver? This is a no no the big one - no exceptions
9. Can you speak fluent English?
From their website "No : Things you could do to improve your English: undertake English classes, watch New Zealand TV shows to increase your level of conversational English and kiwi jargon, listen to National Radio."

Now to be clear here I am in awe of GOOD policemen, they keep me safe, they catch the bad guys before they catch me. They work in an environment which bounces between abject boredom and extreme stress. It is not a cushy number.

I am dismayed however at crap little hitler policemen who bring the rest of a good bunch down. But is it not surprising that a really well paid job which requires zero qualifications to enter a $57K job attracts some complete wankers.

But from their website it appears they will employ anyone who is not a drink driver. How about raising the bar to get rid of the bottom feeders?

[Gremlin]

they lowered the bar to get more cops. Read into that what you will...

[Scuba_Steve]

But from their website it appears they will employ anyone who is not a drink driver. How about raising the bar to get rid of the bottom feeders?

Once your a cop however drink driving isn't such a problem it seems...

[scumdog]

Once your a cop however drink driving isn't such a problem it seems...


Perks of the job sonny, - nobody else can get of like that eh:woohoo::wings:

[Scuba_Steve]

Perks of the job sonny, - nobody else can get of like that eh:woohoo::wings:

I don't know judges, lawyers & politicians do a decent job getting off too & "famous" people well they do alright just every so often one of them lucks out & becomes "the example"

[Max Preload]

Once your a cop however drink driving isn't such a problem it seems...Nah. You don't have to actually BE a cop yet. Just expressing an intention to join is enough (http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10476741). :facepalm: