Proposal: Track day "club"

[FROSTY]

I'd like to start a track day "club"
For open track (no speed groups) trackdays.
To do this I need a total of 10 dedicated trackdayers (including me) who want to do trackdays no matter what.

:innocent::innocent::innocent:
Taupo full track on a weekday costs $5000 including ambulance .(in round numbers)
So using this example eack member of the "club" pays $500.
Track is then paid for and the booking is locked down.
At that point EVERY member of the "club" is responsible for bringing up to 3 guests each.
I will promote the track day as per normal here on KB and will "steer" potential "guests" who contact me to club members who let me know they need to fill their personal quota.
What the guests pay to the member is entirely up to the parties involved.
The "club" would operate on on a trackday by trackday basis so no need to commit to events beyond the first one -- but club members who did the last day get first option on the next day, previous members would get next option etc.
With that certainty I will then feel confident booking Taupo or Hampton downs for the "club"
I know there were those of you really keen to do the cancelled trackday but I couldn't afford to risk a massive loss. By sharing the risk amongst muyself and 9 others then the individual risk is only around $500.
I'd still happily organise the day as per normal. And be proactive in advertising the day so Id happilly refer "guests" onto members who hadn't organised their own guests.
It goes without saying I hope that I will operate a 100% open book policy for all club members so if the total cost is $4850 for example then the cost per member is $485.

If there is an issue with me being the person running it I'm happy to stand to one side so the concept can take off

[FROSTY]

Anybody interested in this concept?

[Mort]

Its a good idea and spreads the risk amongst the core members. The key here is to promote what is best about these days. Unlimited track time and plenty of space. Financially of course the more people the better up to say a limit of 40 riders...

Just to work some figures....

The main variables are the number of "core" members and the number of guests. The benefit to core members will be if they can invite enough guests to reduce core members costs.

Example :

Cost of track : $5000

Number of core members: 10

Guest Fee : $200

Number of guests : 20

Total guest income: $4000

Cost to each core member: $100

See spreadsheet enclosed to fiddle with the figures.

The last day Frosty ran was one of the best track days I've done. I think a trackday club is an awesome idea and I would definately sign up. It was a real shame the last one was cancelled. I was really looking forward to it. There must be several like-minded people who think this is worthwhile. Its not all about money....

[FROSTY]

my theory is that worst case senario a 'club member" has spent $500 for a trackday using the Taupo model . But keeping in mind it is UNLIMITED track time with the only controling factor being the size of your tank.
I will still book/pay for the track on everybodies behalf and still accept responsibility for everybodies conduct on the day. (someone has to sighn the release forms)
The "rules" won't change in any way so in no way am I looking to compromise safety in any way at all

I did origonally think a maximum of 30 people which would effectively mean each member can bring along 2 guest riders. But certainly at Taupo I'd be comfortable with it being 3 "guests" per club member.-total 40 riders
And of course club members with more than three guests could "sell" places for another club member-(thats entirely between the people concerned)
Applying the same model at Hampton downs I think it would be $650 per club member -Please do not quote me on that figure It may be higher or lower.

[FROSTY]

If anybody is interested in the concept but simply doesn't like me-- hey no problem.
I'm happy to step aside to see this concept take off.

[Mental Trousers]

There are plenty of possibilities for this.

For instance, there are plenty of couples on this site who go to days together. So one of them can be the official member but they both go so it's down to $250 each. If they drag along another couple they've git their target without actually trying.

It's generally easier to get people along to something like this as it's seen as a much safer, tard free environment than the usual track days. Therefore it's much easier to fill the number of guests. Hell, with a bit of cunning spin on things you could list the places on trademe to fill your quota.

[Jacko2]

Interested Tony, how many days a year were you thinking?

[Mental Trousers]

Would be better off having, say, 15 members and only needing 10 to agree on a date.

[R6_kid]

If anybody is interested in the concept but simply doesn't like me-- hey no problem.
I'm happy to step aside to see this concept take off.

I was talking to some people yesterday who are planning a "trackday club" not sure what sort of setup they were going to run though. Great minds think alike!

[FROSTY]

Interested Tony, how many days a year were you thinking?
I hadn't thought that far ahead to be honest. Im more interested to see who would support the concept.

[FROSTY]

I was talking to some people yesterday who are planning a "trackday club" not sure what sort of setup they were going to run though. Great minds think alike!
I've discussed this idea with a couple of people so maybee its startin to go ferral :-)

[FROSTY]

Would be better off having, say, 15 members and only needing 10 to agree on a date.
I agree with ya --Im just hoping 10 peole will stand up and say --Hey I'm prepared to stand up for this

[Jacko2]

I hadn't thought that far ahead to be honest. Im more interested to see who would support the concept.

I support the concept.
That's One.

[Mort]

I support the concept.
That's One.

I do ...thats two

Plus Frosty thats three

[Mully]

If anybody is interested in the concept but simply doesn't like me-- hey no problem.

Well, now that you mention it.......

I could be keen once I have a few trackdays under my belt - I recall yours aren't for people who don't have the experience

[Mort]

Just spoke with a mate - he's keen so thats four.... plus we both know potential guest riders.

[Jacko2]

Well, now that you mention it.......

I could be keen once I have a few trackdays under my belt - I recall yours aren't for people who don't have the experience

Hey Mully, I ain't experienced, just ask Tony haha.
I actually preferred the "experienced riders" around me. Don't know that they felt the same about me though.
The day Tony arranged at Taupo was best value for money, so can recommend as "under your belt trackdays"

[FROSTY]

I try to keep the mix so its MOSTLY one type of rider. A real mix of novices and fast guys would be a disaster. One or two who everybody knows about aint an issue

[BoristheBiter]

would definitly be in thats 5, my misses would thats 6 but she is a bit slower but thats something that could be sorted out at a later date.
Also i would not be as fast as others there. maybe have a two group concept (just thinking).

[FROSTY]

boris--just to be clear you would pay the $500 up front ?

[miloking]

I would be reasonably keen but being Aucklander i would only prefer Puke and Hamptons...i guess i could be someones guest.

[MaxCannon]

Sounds pretty cool.
I'd be real interested in some firm numbers for Hampton Downs.
The ride days are $185 and you get 6 sessions (two hours track time).
Problem is there is at least an hours wait between sessions (4 groups at 20 minutes each)
If there is an incident sessions get pushed out longer (the Ride days crew are pretty on to it but breakdowns / crashes are beyond their control).

I'd prefer to get 2 or 3 hours riding in without having such a long break between sessions.

My main gripe from last time was how busy the track was. Half the time stuck between slow riders on fast bikes and half the time watching dudes thinking they were Rossi and stuffing it up the inside as I was tipping into corners.

The 5th session of the day was best as the group thinned out a bit - then I binned it and decided I was going home rather than do the last session.

[BoristheBiter]

boris--just to be clear you would pay the $500 up front ?

I had guessed that and thats fine (i had read the first post).
I still say i sounds like a good idea. i still think the two group thing would be an idea as it gives you a bit of a rest.
if you get the same riders you get to know how they ride/react on the track so both groups could be fast.
it also cuts done on the amount of bikes on the track at one time (1@30 or 2@15) just a thought.

[Mental Trousers]

Two groups is a waste of time. I pretty much only do test days now where the organisers limit the numbers to about 45. There's no problems. There's always people like me who sit and watch for the first hour waiting to see what everyone reckons of the surface then head out, or they turn up a little late and wait for the tyres to get some heat into them, or still have to change the front sprocket cos it's geared for a different track etc. So people are in and out at different times.

The busiest time is usually from 1/2 to 1 hour after the start but after that numbers on track thin out. At times you can have the entire track to yourself while everyone else is laxing out.

The problem with having any groups at all is people try to get their monies worth so they go hard. They start making mistakes but rather than coming in and thinking it through and getting their head straight they keep going. When there's no groups and as much track time as you like people feel like they're getting their monies worth pretty much everytime they're out.

[BoristheBiter]

if thats the case then one group sounds good to me.

[blossomsowner]

sounds like a good idea to me...........i'm in the same boat as mully, maybe need a day or two on track to try it out first.
But yeah........interested in taking part somehow.............specially at hampton downs.

hope it goes for you frosty.

[The Stranger]

My initial reaction is no thank you.
$500.00 (give or take), then the cost of getting there, at least a rear tyre + an old bastard like me is going to be rooted and not feeling like driving/riding back so accommodation and meals.
Contrast that with an open day at puke up to 6 sessions for $90.00 and half a rear.
Sure you get a mix of riders, but most weekdays we went last year there was no numpties (except me) and the racers never cause you any problems.
Not trying to pour cold water on it, just I don't see it in that form for me.

[sinfull]

Love the Idea/concept ! But meh, i might wait and see if i can make the move north as i'm thinking of doing, before committing ! Travel sucks !
As does Rain !

[FROSTY]

$500 up front but you can bring up to 3 other people as your guest.

[Mental Trousers]

$500 divided by 4 (you plus 3 others you drag along) is $125. You can't get any ride all day trackdays for that price. The other costs are the same for any trackday, ie fuel and accomodation split 4 ways etc.

The only risk is if you don't have any friends.

[The Stranger]

The only risk is if you don't have any friends.

I'm sure I can get BRU along. They all love me.

[BoristheBiter]

The only risk is if you don't have any friends.

Well i'm fucked then.
but maybe it will be like a corporate box at the rugby suddenly everyone is your friend.

[Bikemad]

yep totally support the concept...........just not sure i could round up 3 mates with bikes interested enough..............like stranger said...........hard to beat $90 for an empty track at puke control days

[Metastable]

Up here we have a group like this. They go by the name TGIM Thank God It's Monday. :D , because that's when they do their private trackdays. I have ridden with them a couple of times. It works out very well and to be honest you never get everyone out there at the same time, so you can probably have quite a few more than 30 people.

If riders know it is an "open track", then they are not all in a hurry to get out when they get to the track for their first session. They do take a break so the marshals can have some lunch. With these guys it is by invitation only, so like you are thinking, there are a core bunch of guys and then they put out the word about the trackday. Also, newbies are not encouraged. Intermediates and Advanced riders only. They don't care so much about your speed, but they do want you to hold your line.

Also, Tech inspection kinda goes like this. You partner up and you tech each other's bikes and then one of the guys will come around and do a quick check as well. They are great fun. Just make sure you have plenty of fuel, because you will burn off a couple of tanks at least! Also, pace yourself and hydrate, because you can get carried away and get too tired if you stay out for too long. They usually only do a couple of days per year.
Check it out here: http://www.trackday.ca/ I think your payment arrangement is a better idea, than what TGIM has set up, since they are more likely to get burned if not enough people show up.

Hopefully this post can give you some ideas to help you out. If I were down there, I'd sign up.... sorry man.... the way it is now, the commute to the track would be a b!tch. :D

[J-rod]

Mate, much respect for coming up with this idea!!

As a club member, would we be committing to entry to every event? i.e. say it was agreed that there would be 6 events throughout the year, are we then committing to $500.00 x 6 events. Myself and a couple of my friends are regulars to HD's, Taupo and Puke and i'm sure we'd be interested in some form of membership (we'd probably just split the lot).. but for those people who have insurance, would we look at trying to get some compliance to cover them?

Also, what I like about trackdays is the lack of competition... I get out, go at my pace, try to get better. What type of vibe are you looking for?

[Mental Trousers]

The way I read it things are still voluntary and you can choose to be in or not. First thing that has to happen is 10 people agree on a date and pay up. Until then nobody is committed to anything.

[FROSTY]

Mate, much respect for coming up with this idea!!

As a club member, would we be committing to entry to every event? i.e. say it was agreed that there would be 6 events throughout the year, are we then committing to $500.00 x 6 events. Myself and a couple of my friends are regulars to HD's, Taupo and Puke and i'm sure we'd be interested in some form of membership (we'd probably just split the lot).. but for those people who have insurance, would we look at trying to get some compliance to cover them?

Also, what I like about trackdays is the lack of competition... I get out, go at my pace, try to get better. What type of vibe are you looking for?
Initially Im asking for 9 people (and me) to front with $500 for a one off event.
Those 9 people would get first option to sighn up a second/third /fourth time -so theres no obligation to stay in the club but clearly its preferable.

With the couple I've already run the way it works it everybody basicly does their own thing.
Because its a small group noone really trips over anyone elses groove.
You'll get billy Dashing out for 3 fast laps and back in to twiddle with his clickers.
Youll bet bob n ben out goin round n round at med pace
You'll get joe and frank havin a ding dong battle for a few laps.
You might get a track day virgin followed by frosty
It works because EVERYBODY respects everybody elses space and because you've got all day you're relaxed about passing

[TuckerBag]

I really like the idea of the formation of a "Track Day Motorcycle Club", but I think it should be possible to get 60 or 80 riders to commit at about $100 each, (via this forum perhaps), to hiring a certain track on a certain day. Rather than have just a few people bear the brunt. Especially if it rains on the day!!

I did a little spreadsheet a few weeks ago just thinking about it. See attachment.
The $184 you have to pay for a track day at Hampton Downs does not sit all that well with me.
I'm going to give this a lot more thought, and continue to watch this thread for ideas.

http://i1006.photobucket.com/albums/af188/Tuckerbag/TrackDayMotorcycleClub.jpg

[Mental Trousers]

Good luck getting 60 (FROSTY couldn't get the 20 needed at the cut off date and had to cancel the last one) to commit weeks in advance. Bikers are farken shocking when it comes to actually fronting up. The good thing about having a core of 10 people is they each get 3 people to recoup their money from. It's not inconceivable that someone might charge the other 3 more than $125.00 and paying the balance, making for a cheap track day for that person (3x $135 = $405.00 with $95 left to pay).

It's much easier for 10 people to get 3 mates each than it is for 1 person to get 40.

Different speed groups suck arse btw. With 40 people there is absolutely no need for groups.

[TuckerBag]

For the record, the St Johns ambulance guys in Hamilton got back to me.
It costs $500 + gst for a "paramedic" grade ambulance officer for a day, say 8:30 to 4:30. ($562.50)
Apparently St Johns provide paramedic grade ambulance officers for the Honda Ride days, the guy told me.
Always nice to have an ambulance present, huh.

[FROSTY]

um tuckerbag sorry to seem to be raining on ya parade but I did the whole full on track day thing quite well a few years back trouble was that Inevitably theres a bunch of people behind the scenes busting their butts making it all happen.
If you want to go down that track I'm happy to offer advice to you -For me It stopped being fun and became pretty much a job.
The main issue I had in all honesty centered around money.
EVERYBODY thinks they are "special" and so can pay at the last minute. then there are those that despite it being clear that entry is non refundable want me to refund their payment if their life circumstances change. Then theres the whole--Ohh I won't go if XXX is there etc.
--Mon this is NOT a moan just thats the way it is with big groups.
Nowadays theres a fair few track day organisers that have well and truely picked up where I left off and doing a great job

The other thing is the "product" im keener to promote now is more the "boutique" trackday concept.
A few folks have realised that the entry fee is only a portion of the cost of a trackday and they want maximum bang for buck.
I love doing trackdays and this select/small group senario I hope might work so its only 9 people dipping into pocket for $5500

[MotoGirl]

The other thing is the "product" im keener to promote now is more the "boutique" trackday concept.
A few folks have realised that the entry fee is only a portion of the cost of a trackday and they want maximum bang for buck.
I love doing trackdays and this select/small group senario I hope might work so its only 9 people dipping into pocket for $5500

Your boutique track day is exactly why we sign up! It makes us feel all exclusive-like. :love:
Cajun and I are super keen to do more of these so you could definitely put us down for 1 of your 10 members.

[FROSTY]

ok Ive changed the first post --could those prepared to step up contact me