Do V-twins have attitude and are inlines boring?

[rocketman1]

I have taken a few bikes for test rides lately, thinking maybe about another inline 4.
But tell me if I'm silly, but although these bikes seem to run smoother than the SV and idle more sensibly, they lack the attitude and character that a V twin has.
In fact after riding them for while I get a bit bored.
They just purr along smoothly doing everything as a good motorbike should, no lumpy gear changes, no lurching/ chugging on slow tight corners, no engine braking, no throbbing roar up steep hills, they go just fine- beautiful in fact, but its all just a bit boring.
Motorbikes are not supposed to be like cars are they.
Dont get me wrong , I have a GSXR as well, but if wasn't for the superb handling it would be boring too.
Anyone else feel this way, or am i just a little strange.

[CookMySock]

Agree completely. IL4 = sewing machine - whirrr whirr howwwl.. Vtwin = demented rocking horse, karrrumpkarrrumpkarrrump!!:blink:

It's important that vtwins are jetted near-stoich on the pilots so they can crackle and bang real loud on the overrun, and grrrrrrRRRRRowwwwwwlSNARRRRLbooma-booma-booma quietly to themselves on coasting. Often mine will give a loud POP with a blue flame on the transition from coast to overrun too. And lets not forget the huge backfire and blue flame on cold starting. So my neighbors hate me? Shrug.

Steve

[Batcerb]

All depends ...

Have had a twin and a 4 now ( TL1000 and ZX7R), on the twin it was more obvious, but the 7 was no way lacking character or attitude :)


On a triple now, really is the best of both worlds!

[=cJ=]

To my mind nothing beats the scream of a poorly-muffled inline four getting its neck wrung.

[Lurch]

How about a two stage drive system with the twin powering the 0-6k rpm and the i4 picking up the top end.

[Little Miss Trouble]

Pfft! The R6 that I'm riding now has way more attitude than any V-Twin I've ridden so far, including a couple of Ducati Monsters

[Gubb]

Each to their own. As said above, I'd take a triple over both, then again, add a V4 into the mix and you've got a whole different ballgame.

[Little Miss Trouble]

Each to their own. as said above, i'd take a triple over both. then again, add a V4 into the mix and you've got a whole different ballgame.

I've been told that the Scorpion exhaust makes my bike sound like a V4 :2thumbsup

[Motu]

Inline 4's sure are boring,I've only had one,and have no desire to have another.Sure they are fast and all that stuff,but being fast and all that stuff has never been that important to me in 40 years of riding,there are better ways to have more fun.V twins,of all angles - from 0 degree to 180 degree are fun for me.

[SPP]

I love the lazy way v-twins make power :headbang: and the sound of a screaming IL4 :2guns:

[CookMySock]

Gotta admit an unmuffled IL4 has a wicked scream... :drool:

Steve

[PirateJafa]

IMO, the large v-twins I've ridden have far less "attitude" than the large IL4's.

The flat torque curves give you no fun feeling of winding the bike out as you hammer it along. And while v-twins sound great as they idle along around town, when you rev 'em out, you just find yourself wishing for that juicy howl of a large IL4 with a quality (not necessarily noisy, but quality) exhaust.

Let's face it, v-twins are dull and soulless.

[Cayman911]

For me, the Roar of a V-twin is just.....sex, rough dirty sex. enough said.

[Warr]

Each to their own. .............add a V4 into the mix and you've got a whole different ballgame.

I'm with you there Grubb ... IL4 + V2 = Boring both ways ... You need to get on a V4, best all round :)

[rapid van cleef]

ive never ridden a twin. but man ducatis sound like they are falling to bits, like a bag of hammers. i love me IL 4

[onearmedbandit]

My IL4 doesn't lack attitude. In fact it drips pure attitude from its teeth of attitude that live in it's attitude infested jaw.

[MaxCannon]

You've all got it wrong.

Flat twin is where it's at.
Power everywhere, great manners and it keeps your legs warm on cold mornings.

[DesmoDAZ]

Love the vee's myself, own two, both Italian,
Attitude, you gotta get hold of one if it's an american vee, LOL
Lets not forget the attitude and sound of the 4 cylinder 500cc 2st GP bikes.

[LBD]

Pfft! The R6 that I'm riding now has way more attitude than any V-Twin I've ridden so far, including a couple of Ducati Monsters

Not my monster it don't

[Little Miss Trouble]

Not my monster it don't

Well if you want to loan it to me so I can compare...

[LBD]

Well if you want to loan it to me so I can compare...

I would be into a swap...I have alway wondered what it feels like, riding a sport bike as hard and fast as possible and being passed by my monster....

[Marmoot]

IL4s are so easy to ride fast. Smooth, easy to handle, abundant power even from 600s, and the modern versions are so light and relatively slimmer.

But Vtwins are much more satisfying when you know how to ride it fast. Slim in nature, feels compact and rigid, and the fact you are relatively underpowered gives that 'hero' feeling when you're running rings around the bigger brothers.
Just make sure you get your tyres, suspensions and handling right on these things and they give back dreams.

I owned both of them.
In my opinion, you would want an IL4 for what it can do. But for a Vtwin, you should only get one if you want it just for what it is.

[LBD]

But Vtwins are much more satisfying when you know how to ride it fast. Slim in nature, feels compact and rigid, and the fact you are relatively underpowered gives that 'hero' feeling when you're running rings around the bigger brothers.
Just make sure you get your tyres, suspensions and handling right on these things and they give back dreams.
.

And HP is over rated...its the torque and nimbleness (As you say) that presses my buzzers....enough to buy a second Vtwin 2 weeks back.

The right tires and setup makes for some very surprised "other " Bikes

[Little Miss Trouble]

I would be into a swap...I have alway wondered what it feels like, riding a sport bike as hard and fast as possible and being passed by my monster....

Huh, how quickly this thread turns into a 'mines bigger than yours' pissing contest, I have no doubt that an S4RS has bucket loads of attitude, you will note I said "...than any V-Twin I've ridden so far..." (650-800cc) My derision was more directed at DB's comments than the Duke's I've ridden.

In saying that, the R6 (two up!) did walk all over a Duke 848 through some fun corners last weekend... :whistle:

[Marmoot]

And HP is over rated...its the torque and nimbleness (As you say) that presses my buzzers....enough to buy a second Vtwin 2 weeks back.

The right tires and setup makes for some very surprised "other " Bikes

True, passing bigger bikes round the outside on Puke's first, 2nd, 3rd, and last corners is always enjoyable.

Although there's something about smoking someone's exhaust as they zoom past you exiting Castrol on the newest CBR1K. Those are monsters, really.

[Berries]

From a spectators point of view, if you are walking around town then a twin sounds better, it has character. But there is nothing that sounds better than a big four having its neck wrung on the open road. At high revs/speeds twins sound boring IMO.

[Marmoot]

In saying that, the R6 (two up!) did walk all over a Duke 848 through some fun corners last weekend... :whistle:

848 can be quite awkward on public road. The suspensions are so difficult to set up, for a start. This includes the fact fronts are underdamped/undersprung and rear is oversprung (i think the rear is default to riders around 100kg). Then the sensitivity to tyre pressures, where even 2psi off the recommended mark can upset the handling very much. Then the stiffness, which makes it very difficult to handle in very tight twisties at low speed (cue hairpin style corners). Then the ultra short gearings, or what seems to be (difficult to wheelie....damn italians have no taste).

It's happiest on the track though. Totally a different beast on smooth tarmac and at medium-fast sweepers, especially with good tyres. I've owned a few bikes and I've never had that much pleasure.

I'm curious on how 1098 goes. I heard they are different, not just a "simply larger 848".

R6s are very capable bikes, including the version you have. I wouldn't be surprised if it can go round the 848.

P.S.
Japanese Vtwins (including VTR SP1) with standard exhausts sound like sewing machines :p

[LBD]

Huh, how quickly this thread turns into a 'mines bigger than yours' pissing contest, I have no doubt that an S4RS has bucket loads of attitude, you will note I said "...than any V-Twin I've ridden so far..." (650-800cc) My derision was more directed at DB's comments than the Duke's I've ridden.

In saying that, the R6 (two up!) did walk all over a Duke 848 through some fun corners last weekend... :whistle:

is all in friendly jest...and lots come down to riders abilities not the bike..I dare say swap the r6 and the 848 riders and the same riders would have been in front...

And charactor is an individal taste...I think mine has more charactor than yours...you think the opposite

But if your in Chch in Sept.....

[Marmoot]

is all in friendly jest...and lots come down to riders abilities not the bike..I dare say swap the r6 and the 848 riders and the same riders would have been in front...

I beg to differ. Stiff Vtwins take a lot of getting used to.
It would be like a relearning process.

Ask my brother. He's as fast as me on his CBR1K.
And we are as slow as each other when we swap bikes :) Only I relearn to go faster on his much quicker than he can on mine.

[LBD]

I'm curious on how 1098 goes. I heard they are different, not just a "simply larger 848".:p

Just cause I owns one does not mean I have ridden one....my next trip home is September (sob) and a full riding impression will be posted soon after

[Marmoot]

Come up to Auckland, bro. So I can borrow yours for a wee bit.

[Little Miss Trouble]

is all in friendly jest...and lots come down to riders abilities not the bike..I dare say swap the r6 and the 848 riders and the same riders would have been in front...
There *may* be some truth in that comment :shifty:



And charactor is an individal taste...I think mine has more charactor than yours...you think the opposite
This ladies & gentleman is why this arguement is futile, everyone has different taste...

IF I were in the position to fill a garage with bikes - money no object etc I would own several Ducati's, several Trumpy's as well as several IL4's from the various Japanese makers. However, since I didn't even buy a lotto ticket last weekend its rather lucky that I have a bike that I :love: to bits



But if your in Chch in Sept....

Probably not, I guess I'll just have to suck up to the guys at Bayride instead!

[Sable]

Parallel twin piston port 2 strokes have more character than all the engine configurations previously mentioned. Eat it

[Marmoot]

IF I were in the position to fill a garage with bikes - money no object etc

- Ducati 1098 + 848 (Vtwin)
- CBR1000RR 2009 ABS (IL4)
- CBR900RR 1999 light blue colour (IL4)
- VTR1000SP1 Red/Black (Vtwin)
- Suzuki Hayabusa 2005 (IL4)
- Honda Goldwing (Flat6)
- Kawasaki ZX7RR (IL4)
- Ducati Desmosedici (V4)
- NSR500V4 (V4 2-stroke)

in that order :)
Hmm....I see 3 Ducatis, 4 Hondas, 1 Suzuki and 1 Kawasaki.

[LBD]

And to prove I am not unreasonably too biased...a Brutale 1078 would be on my list

[Marmoot]

I'd rather a KTM supermotard....

[CookMySock]

From a spectators point of view, if you are walking around town then a twin sounds better, it has character. But there is nothing that sounds better than a big four having its neck wrung on the open road. At high revs/speeds twins sound boring IMO.Agreed, but with a wikid loud zorst on them and they get really violent. The thunder from them goes right through ya. Give it a hard BLAP indoors and it nearly blows the walls off the shed. Nice.

The best thing about twins is you don't have to cane them to have fun. IL4 do sound great at top whack, but you just cant do that everywhere coz you are gunna go to jail.

Steve

[onearmedbandit]

The best thing about twins is you don't have to cane them to have fun. IL4 do sound great at top whack, but you just cant do that everywhere coz you are gunna go to jail.

Steve
Same can be said for IL4's as well however. The torque curve in the pic is my bike, max of 81.4ft/lb at 8000rpm (redline at about 12,200). Granted it is from a thou, but still it's an IL4 that doesn't need to be raped to have fun.

[Gremlin]

Well, lets clarify things. When we are drooling about twins, we're thinking ktm, ducati etc, non-jap :P Had a thou IL4, fun was well into license loss. Thou twin, barely get into license loss, and having more fun than ever!

[LBD]

Big difference to my torque curve...nearly flat from 4K to 10K ...one mad rush, no need to work to stay in the "Zone" (83 foot lb but thats crank, yours is rear wheel ...so yours is bigger than mine)

[Urano]

mmmhhhh....
it's a hard talk.
it's more or less as the "better diesel or gasoline" question...

to me i have to admit that, at the end, i'm probably more on the 4 side. I'm one who use the engine to go and the brake to stop, so the twin's engine brakin really annoy me.
beside that, i ride bikes on the precision, something as "bikes on street, cars on dirt", so i greatly appreciate the smoothness of 4s, and i can handle the "disappointment" of having not so much result in twisting the throttle below rpm.
after all, if i'm going quietly, it's good to have a quiet response, if i need power, i know where to get it.
i understand that all of this is probably the result of the "2 stroke school", and when i used the in line twin (which is actually a little bit more similar to an il4 than a v) i passed all the time trying to get rid of all the twin characteristic...

i only love twin dimensions and frugality: low fuel cons, low plugs costs, less oil...

probably the best solution for me would be the v4, a bit more torque friendly than the inline and narrower...
but i've never tested one, nor a triple. and i'm really curious... ;)

[Toaster]

ive never ridden a twin. but man ducatis sound like they are falling to bits

That's because they are!

[Toaster]

Agreed, but with a wikid loud zorst on them and they get really violent. The thunder from them goes right through ya. Give it a hard BLAP indoors and it nearly blows the walls off the shed. Nice.

The best thing about twins is you don't have to cane them to have fun. IL4 do sound great at top whack, but you just cant do that everywhere coz you are gunna go to jail.

Steve

Agreed. I have had 5 inline 4s and 2 V-Twins over the years I have been riding. Both the Firestorm and M109R had seriously grunty exhausts added and they sounded fabulous much to the neighbours disgust. Both had good low down torque but both are budget bikes one way or another and that was manifest in the finish and feel. Sound certainly begats an aggressive attitude.

The IL4's - all GSX or GSXRs are much smoother, best of undoubtedly being the 09 Hayabusa with aftermarket chimneys.... these sound great when wound up and easily done at open road speed limits or around town with a lower gear selected for the fun and horsepower factor without the fear factor... so in this vein I say IL4s can have just as much fun, legally, as the thumpy V-Twins.

I would love a decent high-end V-Twin with that devine sound again, but it needs to have the balls to thrill after riding a rocketship. In a perfect world, one of each would be great.

[LBD]

That's because they are!

Bollocks...in years gone by there was truth in that, but not today...

Busa huh...there were a few of those that I kept overtaking on the TT2000..... Whenever there was more than one slight bend in the road...

[Toaster]

Bollocks...in years gone by there was truth in that, but not today...

Busa huh...there were a few of those that I kept overtaking on the TT2000..... Whenever there was more than one slight bend in the road...

It was a joke you twit. Get over yourself!

[LBD]

It was a joke you twit. Get over yourself!

Yea...I was only joking too:yes:.... my humor is the same as yours.....I was only joking about the busa handling......:Pokey:

[Toaster]

Yea...I was only joking too:yes:.... my humor is the same as yours.....I was only joking about the busa handling......:Pokey:

Bollocks!!

.... just joking!

[LBD]

QUOTE=Toaster;1129741191]Bollocks!!

.... just joking![/QUOTE]

That is the one thing I hate about e-mails and posting on forums like this...you don't hear inflections in voices or see twinkles in eyes....its just words ...makes it very hard to judge sentiment behind comments at times. I guess that is where the emoticons are handy...you can add a little feeing....:shifty:

[Toaster]

True.... but I have no emotions.....

..... oh, you said emoticons! I like this one..... reminds me of a Ducati! :scooter:

[LBD]

True.... but I have no emotions.....

..... oh, you said emoticons! I like this one..... reminds me of a Ducati! :scooter:


These ones paint a good picture too :kick: :motu: :msn-wink:

[DMNTD]

Have had a 'couple' of IL4's and V2's....prefer the V's for fun factor on the roads full stop.
I LOVE the sound of any of my IL4's when being screamed out, however I do find them lacking in yee ha otherwise.
The only inline I have enjoyed 100% was my '09 R1...the noise was superb at any speed!

Haven't owned any V4's (yet) but have ridden the RSV4 Factory (20+ times) and also a Desmo....farking drooll!

[imdying]

Try a GSXR1000 or a Blade... SV1000 boring and slow, the mighty thou, WHEY HEY!!!!!! :D

[Pixie]

no
..........

[onearmedbandit]

no
..........

Oh come now, they're not that intimidating.

[Dooly]

I got a twin/triple/four.

The one I have the most fun on is the triple, real closely followed by the twin. When its cruise, smooth and pillon, its the 4.
The sound of my Termi Ducati is awesome, mind you the triple is pretty good tho.
If I had to choose one only.........

Triumph triple.

[javawocky]

Surprised no one's mentioned the R1 yet...

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[Ixion]

I dunno why you need all those cylinders. One's enough for anyone, if it's big enough. All got too many useless wasted bits that go round n round n round n up and down n up and down , anyway.

[Flip]

I love to see the faces on the sports bike riders when I pull up beside them and my rubber mounted Harley motor is jumping around in the frame doing about 700rpm. A couple have asked me is it meant to do that.

IL4's are just are not tactile enough for me anymore. In any measureable way the IL4's I have owned have been a better more powerful, smoother motor. Having said that I had a 1200 Triumph Trophy and some days I really miss its power and torque, especially 2 up with a bit of gear on board.

I have just got a new old bike with a 750cc boxer motor, It is actually surprisingly nice to ride, motor wise. It could just do with twice the horse power.

[The Pastor]

I have taken a few bikes for test rides lately, thinking maybe about another inline 4.
no wai, an il4? goodness me! this shit is CRAZY!

But tell me if I'm silly, but although these bikes seem to run smoother than the SV and idle more sensibly, they lack the attitude and character that a V twin has.
In fact after riding them for while I get a bit bored.
so you're saying motorbikes are boring and that there are different engine characteristics?


They just purr along smoothly doing everything as a good motorbike should, no lumpy gear changes, no lurching/ chugging on slow tight corners, no engine braking, no throbbing roar up steep hills, they go just fine- beautiful in fact, but its all just a bit boring.
somehow i think your doing it wrong, try a race track, or excessive speed

Motorbikes are not supposed to be like cars are they.
yes they are just like cars. thanks captain obvious!


Dont get me wrong , I have a GSXR as well, but if wasn't for the superb handling it would be boring too.
Anyone else feel this way, or am i just a little strange.

You are retarded.

[onearmedbandit]

You are retarded.

Hey Pot, Kettle called for you and wants to know if you are wearing black tonight as well. I'll let him know you are.

[BuzzardNZ]

Try a GSXR1000 or a Blade... SV1000 boring and slow, the mighty thou, WHEY HEY!!!!!! :D

Can I quote you on this at sv-portal.com ? ;)

[DMNTD]

Surprised no one's mentioned the R1 yet...

I did below....I had 2 Bro's cans as they are a bit throatier than the others I've seen and heard.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cuyUWHozAvM

[javawocky]

I did below....I had 2 Bro's cans as they are a bit throatier than the others I've seen and heard.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cuyUWHozAvM

Yeah, it would be a perfect combination if only it has an Suzuki symbol on the side. It was fun watching (that guy) at the nationals at HD putting that R1 through its paces.

[imdying]

Can I quote you on this at sv-portal.com ? ;)Sure, compared to a fireblade, the SV is both boring and slow.

[DMNTD]

Yeah, it would be a perfect combination if only it has an Suzuki symbol on the side. It was fun watching (that guy) at the nationals at HD putting that R1 through its paces.

But it passed quality control!

"That guy"? Yes he certainly has some skills does Mr Rees

[shrub]

a triple. They have power everywhere from idle to redline, they're smooth and an angry triple is a soul stirring sound. Having said that, there is something kind of cool about the lumpy vibration of a big twin, but I like smooth, and I love the power delivery that a triple has - crack the throttle and it launches.

If it ain't got 3 cylinders it will never belong to me.

[dogsnbikes]

Love the triple its has everything and more I need,wouldn't say a V twin has attitude more likely the rider epecially when you meet a V-twin rider who's convinced his harley has a inline motor,so I Had too put a sign on his bike saying (this inline was made in japan) :lol:

oh and 2 months on he is still sulking about it

[Maha]

V twins sound like Subaru's.

[Flip]

V twins sound like Subaru's.

Really:puke:

[AllanB]

It's important that vtwins are jetted near-stoich on the pilots so they can crackle and bang real loud on the overrun, and grrrrrrRRRRRowwwwwwlSNARRRRLbooma-booma-booma quietly to themselves on coasting. Often mine will give a loud POP with a blue flame on the transition from coast to overrun too. And lets not forget the huge backfire and blue flame on cold starting. So my neighbors hate me? Shrug.

Steve


Ah Steve - I'd give that bike a good tune-up if it is behaving like that all the time!

In my perfect garage I'd have lots of different engine configurations as they all have their own special and unique character.

It is a ignorant individual who believes only one form of engine configuration can have 'character'.

I also find it interesting that often 'character' is mistaken for poor or faulty engineering (more so in the past).

[LBD]

You know....reading this thread we are only comparing V2 and IL4 bikes...I think we need to include the owners as well....

The short fall in IL4 attitude is more than compensated for by the owners.....

[AllanB]

a triple. They have power everywhere from idle to redline, they're smooth and an angry triple is a soul stirring sound. .

I am genuinely surprised that none of the big 4 Japanese bike builders have not recently built a big bore triple - they all have the past triple heritage to fall back on.

[AllanB]

You know....reading this thread we are only comparing V2 and IL4 bikes...I think we need to include the owners as well....

The short fall in IL4 attitude is more than compensated for by the owners.....

:corn::corn::corn::corn::corn::corn::corn::corn:

[BuzzardNZ]

I am genuinely surprised that none of the big 4 Japanese bike builders have not recently built a big bore triple - they all have the past triple heritage to fall back on.

Bring back the old Kawasaki H2 750 Mach IV triple 2 stroke I say!

[98tls]

Bring back the old Kawasaki H2 750 Mach IV triple 2 stroke I say!

Yea but some brakes and a frame that works would be handy.

[shrub]

I am genuinely surprised that none of the big 4 Japanese bike builders have not recently built a big bore triple - they all have the past triple heritage to fall back on.

I have often wondered why they leave triples to Triumph and Benelli, especially seeing every road test of a Triumph triple I have read raves about the engine. I've ridden a lot of modern Triumphs (used to sell them) and their engines really are something special.

And did I mention the sound?

[R-Soul]

From a spectators point of view, if you are walking around town then a twin sounds better, it has character. But there is nothing that sounds better than a big four having its neck wrung on the open road. At high revs/speeds twins sound boring IMO.

My twin has a rough growl to it until 5k rpm, and then it adds a tone of determined steel to its voice, and starts kicking into stride, feeling agitated and ready to bolt. Half a chance, thats all it needs... just half a chance.

If you listen carefully you can hear a commanding, dominating,"get-the-fuck-out-of-the-way" repeating over and over.

[R-Soul]

Well, lets clarify things. When we are drooling about twins, we're thinking ktm, ducati etc, non-jap :P Had a thou IL4, fun was well into license loss. Thou twin, barely get into license loss, and having more fun than ever!

Aint nothing wrong with the fun on my japper... grins galore!

[bones135]

After riding the 900ss for a couple of years & now on the Fireblade, i think its far better, as much fun & the noise it makes when it revs over 4k is kinda cool too.
Well folks thats my 2 cents worth

[bones135]

I do not know what happened there but i was replying to a post by98tls, my internet shut down & now his post is gone, sorry dude....not intentional at all

[98tls]

I do not know what happened there but i was replying to a post by98tls, my internet shut down & now his post is gone, sorry dude....not intentional at all

Spooky eh:shifty:

[bones135]

Yea lil futhermucker gremlins, anyhoo it was a 2000 model, good but way prefer the blade

[98tls]

Yea lil futhermucker gremlins, anyhoo it was a 2000 model, good but way prefer the blade

I deleted my post mate,i had some experiance way back with the 89 750 and 90 900ss,both utter shite as i posted but then deleted as its only my opinion,someone out there probably likes em.

[bones135]

Fair enough, were all entitled to our opinion. I liked...well loved the Duc but having now got the Honda, i love that too now, wjo knows may be a moped next, lol HELL NO

[98tls]

Fair enough, were all entitled to our opinion. I liked...well loved the Duc but having now got the Honda, i love that too now, wjo knows may be a moped next, lol HELL NO

To be honest i wish i still had the 750,my urge for new bikes has long since gone and would rather piss about wasting money on old ones (hey i enjoy it) and the 750 would have been a fun thing to muck about with.

[bones135]

To be honest i wish i still had the 750,my urge for new bikes has long since gone and would rather piss about wasting money on old ones (hey i enjoy it) and the 750 would have been a fun thing to muck about with.
So long as you enjoy it then all good, wish i could do up an old one too but too busy paying for the new one,lol

[steve_t]

Why do twins and triples sound so lumpy and cool while 4's sound so blah? My ZX6R isn't as cool sounding as I'd hoped it'd be except when up high in the revs where it sounds like a race engine. It can't be that there are less cylinders cos V8's and V6 engines also sound better than 4 cylinders. Actually, thinking about it, my bike sounds a bit like an Evo with a big bore :(

[slofox]

Swapping from a V2 to an IL4 tomorrow morning. I'll let you know...

[98tls]

Swapping from a V2 to an IL4 tomorrow morning. I'll let you know...

So ya got the 600 mate,good for you.Enjoy your new ride and post up all about it eh.

[Maha]

a triple. They have power everywhere from idle to redline, they're smooth and an angry triple is a soul stirring sound. Having said that, there is something kind of cool about the lumpy vibration of a big twin, but I like smooth, and I love the power delivery that a triple has - crack the throttle and it launches.

If it ain't got 3 cylinders it will never belong to me.


Love the triple its has everything and more I need,wouldn't say a V twin has attitude more likely the rider epecially when you meet a V-twin rider who's convinced his harley has a inline motor,so I Had too put a sign on his bike saying (this inline was made in japan) :lol:

oh and 2 months on he is still sulking about it

So this sound will do it for ya?

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[raftn]

a triple. They have power everywhere from idle to redline, they're smooth and an angry triple is a soul stirring sound. Having said that, there is something kind of cool about the lumpy vibration of a big twin, but I like smooth, and I love the power delivery that a triple has - crack the throttle and it launches.

If it ain't got 3 cylinders it will never belong to me.


have to agree completely with you on that. Just something about that sound.

[98tls]

have to agree completely with you on that. Just something about that sound.

Reminds me of the listening to the old mans Trident with an amusing excuse for a 3/1 going through the Hundalees at speed,sounded glorious indeed,could sit outside the house and still hear the thing miles away.

[raftn]

So this sound will do it for ya?

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MAde me very horney.............

[tigertim20]

In a way, you dont make sense. you dont like inlines because they are a pleasure to ride with their smoothness etc etc, but you love your inline gsxr because the handling is wonderfull and smooth etc etc etc

[dogsnbikes]

So this sound will do it for ya?

Nah Needs a decent exhaust,but your getting there

[slofox]

So ya got the 600 mate,good for you.Enjoy your new ride and post up all about it eh.

I should've had it today but the shop hadn't finished swapping over the goodies...I waited around for two hours then cleared off to work. It's ready now so I get it tomorrow morning...hurhurhur - watch this space.

[crazyhorse]

I should've had it today but the shop hadn't finished swapping over the goodies...I waited around for two hours then cleared off to work. It's ready now so I get it tomorrow morning...hurhurhur - watch this space.

So! Maybe you can get more sleep tonight - as you were up at 4.30 am wanting to go down :whistle:

[crazyhorse]

I love both - they have different goodies about them both :)

[98tls]

as you were up at 4.30 am wanting to go down :whistle:

Err ummm,so howd that work out for ya then?:mellow:

[crazyhorse]

Err ummm,so howd that work out for ya then?:mellow:

COuld hear him rattle around in excitement from Hawkes bay - even felt the ground move at lunchtime as he couldn't pick it up today

[shrub]

So this sound will do it for ya?



Shivers up the spine material...

[eelracing]

I likes two strokes coz a diesel...sorry 4 stroke just does not compare when a smoker is on the pipe.

As for sounds...If a two stroke can be compared to an electric guitar then the equivalent for a four stroke would be an electric bass.

Choose your instrument to suit ya purpose.

[Elysium]

My first three bikes were eithier a single or IL4. Now I ride a Vee Twin I will most likely never go back to an IL4.

[scumdog]

I love to see the faces on the sports bike riders when I pull up beside them and my rubber mounted Harley motor is jumping around in the frame doing about 700rpm. A couple have asked me is it meant to do that.

IL4's are just are not tactile enough for me anymore. In any measureable way the IL4's I have owned have been a better more powerful, smoother motor. Having said that I had a 1200 Triumph Trophy and some days I really miss its power and torque, especially 2 up with a bit of gear on board.

I have just got a new old bike with a 750cc boxer motor, It is actually surprisingly nice to ride, motor wise. It could just do with twice the horse power.

Yep, if you need any more the 700rpm to move off from a stand-still it means you over-revving - and you need to 'over-rev' most IL4 motors.

But they ARE smooth.

[rocketman1]

In a way, you dont make sense. you dont like inlines because they are a pleasure to ride with their smoothness etc etc, but you love your inline gsxr because the handling is wonderfull and smooth etc etc etc

I am thinking is I would love to buy a newer GSXR1000 or 750, but like my old inline 4 I use to own, I'm worried I will get bored without all the V twins idiosyncrasies, then not ride it much.
I dont ride my old GSXR much, but still like the occasional blat on it.
Its not speed I'm after: its the joy of riding, the bike, the attitude, the cruising sound, the engine braking, exhaust popping, in all the narly characters of the beast.
Unless you have owned both bikes you wont know what I'm on about.

[98tls]

I am thinking is I would love to buy a newer GSXR1000 or 750, but like my old inline 4 I use to own, I'm worried I will get bored without all the V twins idiosyncrasies, then not ride it much.
I dont ride my old GSXR much, but still like the occasional blat on it.
Its not speed I'm after: its the joy of riding, the bike, the attitude, the cruising sound, the engine braking, exhaust popping, in all the narly characters of the beast.
Unless you have owned both bikes you wont know what I'm on about.

Jesus,after 38 years of owning plenty of both i still have no idea what your on about though sealing the end of your cans properly does away with the popping.

[Mooch]

speaking of emotiicons , looking for a bus one ... Yet to see a busa or bus enter the Clifhanger Hill climb , you could be the first to enter give us regular vtwin riders the show .....:whistle:

[v8s&2wheels]

Agreed, but with a wikid loud zorst on them and they get really violent. The thunder from them goes right through ya. Give it a hard BLAP indoors and it nearly blows the walls off the shed. Nice.

The best thing about twins is you don't have to cane them to have fun. IL4 do sound great at top whack, but you just cant do that everywhere coz you are gunna go to jail.

Steve

Agreed.

My IL4 has a 4into1 racing yoshi shorty exhaust, standard is a 4-1-2 system with a cat and 2 big mufflers (and ugly). I cant get enough of the sound of my bike at say around 9000rpm or higher.. but in any gear that is illegal speeds and its a love hate, love to hear, hate to worry about cops..

I would say v twins sound better in legal conditions.. take it to the track and the IL4 will always sound better going down a straight.

[Urano]

when you meet a V-twin rider who's convinced his harley has a inline motor

some people are dangerous on a bike: for themselves and for the others...


I am genuinely surprised that none of the big 4 Japanese bike builders have not recently built a big bore triple - they all have the past triple heritage to fall back on.


I have often wondered why they leave triples to Triumph and Benelli

have to agree with you both.
but don't confuse triumph with benelli: the first spent a planet of money in r&d for their triple, and the results are awesome; the latter tried to make something fancy, but there's nothing to compare... benelli was conducted as the too often seen italian industrial plan: "yea, let's do something strange. somebody will buy that"... it's a shame... :(

[NighthawkNZ]

I find this thread has no attitude and boring....

Simply put, each to there own...

[LBD]

[QUOTE=NighthawkNZ;1129742283] I find this thread has no attitude and boring....QUOTE]

Boring post!...If you want to liven it up....insult someones choice of bike....kick sand in the face of a busa rider type thing....

Jap IL4 bikes may be technologically advanced...QA may fall within 6 sigma limits....but that is just souless refinement. The Japanese approach to QA and business efficiency is stifling the artistic flair that creates the attitude, passion and feeling found in many european (read Italien) bikes

[Maki]

There are boring V twins and boring IL4s and then there are interesting ones. If you think all IL4s are boring try this on an R6. Pootle around a bit to warm it up. The find a nice long open section and give it full gas in 2nd keep the throttle fully open until you change up to 3rd at 16000 rpm or so. Then rev it up to 16000 in 3rd with the throttle wide open. If you are still bored must be stone cold dead. Just the scream that thing makes at high revs is incredible and the violence of the acceleration is amazing.

What happens if you ride at less than 6000 rpm? Absolutely nothing. If you ride like that get a V twin, you will find it a lot more interesting...

Have a look, the speedo on that thing is in mph:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIksIZArqeI&feature=related

[Urano]

i think that "boring" was not referred to the reachable top speed, or the overall performance.
i understood "boring" for the lack of "character", probably due to the smoothness and the pretty plain behavior an il4 has and a v twin has not.

[mrchips]

This does it for me everytime...... Sweet jebus (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DQrT_Q0UDWk)

[imdying]

There are boring V twins and boring IL4s and then there are interesting ones.That's a really good point. The MV 312R, IL4, I've never ridden one, but I'm guessing boring isn't a word I'd use when I got off.

[Buddha#81]

Just to throw some else in the mix, Big bore singles have plenty of attitude. Nothing like setting off car alarms at idle!

[R-Soul]

There are boring V twins and boring IL4s and then there are interesting ones. If you think all IL4s are boring try this on an R6. Pootle around a bit to warm it up. The find a nice long open section and give it full gas in 2nd keep the throttle fully open until you change up to 3rd at 16000 rpm or so. Then rev it up to 16000 in 3rd with the throttle wide open. If you are still bored must be stone cold dead. Just the scream that thing makes at high revs is incredible and the violence of the acceleration is amazing.

What happens if you ride at less than 6000 rpm? Absolutely nothing. If you ride like that get a V twin, you will find it a lot more interesting...

Have a look, the speedo on that thing is in mph:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIksIZArqeI&feature=related

Yep with the V-twin- you get that same "violence of acceleration" from 2500rpm to 9500rpm, instead of starting at 6000 and carrying on to 16000. I find the Vtwins more usable and thrilling in everyday situations 9i.e. below the speed limit), but having said that I do love the sounds of a shrieking IL4 too. I used to ride a CBR250RR with aftermarket pipes. And while it was nowhere as fast (esp. at accelerating) as my current Vtwin, the sound that it made was enough to make me want to ride it around in first gear all day...

[dipshit]

Yep with the V-twin- you get that same "violence of acceleration" from 2500rpm to 9500rpm, instead of starting at 6000 and carrying on to 16000.

I actually found the torque of my SV1000 boring after a while. There was no challenge in riding it. Just twist the throttle and go. :zzzz:

Now my GSX-R600 is much more fun and challenging to ride! Made my old SV feel like a tractor in comparison.

[SPP]

The sound from an IL4 being given some. Attitude, yes. Everyday attitude, no. Can't ride to the shops like this (even in my dreams)... well you could but the locals would torch you and your bike when you got there :laugh:

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[onearmedbandit]

My 1000cc IL4 accelerates with intensity from 2500rpm right through to its 12200rpm limit. Not all IL4's need to be thrashed.

[DMNTD]

That's a really good point. The MV 312R, IL4, I've never ridden one, but I'm guessing boring isn't a word I'd use when I got off.

Having ridden the 312R and also a Senna at pace I can assure you that they are far from boring.
The only thing is that (IMO) you need to give it some juice in order to appreciate it...to get a true kick from them.

[SPP]

My 1000cc IL4 accelerates with intensity from 2500rpm right through to its 12200rpm limit. Not all IL4's need to be thrashed.
Oh yeah, my bad. When I think IL4 I think 250-600. In my mind I put litre bikes in a whole other category altogether (even though they are obviously IL4 as well).


Having ridden the 312R and also a Senna at pace I can assure you that they are far from boring.
What’s it like living a privileged life? :D


[B]The only thing is that (IMO) you need to give it some juice in order to appreciate it...to get a true kick from them.
And that sums it up for me as well. The excitement is in the wringing. I watch sportbike vids and dream about getting to a track.

After only a little blat on Boomers KTM got me wanting a naked and twin again (yes, bleating about that again). It was raw and awesome. Didn't matter whether it was 50kmh or :whistle: You feel like King-f'n-Kong.

[R-Soul]

I actually found the torque of my SV1000 boring after a while. There was no challenge in riding it. Just twist the throttle and go. :zzzz:

Now my GSX-R600 is much more fun and challenging to ride! Made my old SV feel like a tractor in comparison.

You are right - all that lubbly torque available everywhere, whenever you want, in any gear makes (everyday) life such a drag. I would much rather have to wring the neck of my engine to find it. Yeah right.

I also found that the same torque makes for wonderful corner exits on the track too, giving me a massive thrill. I just get passed on the straights after that... yawn...

[DMNTD]

What’s it like living a privileged life? :D

Oh it has it's moments!! ;)

Most dribbly moment to date...accidently doing an 11 o'clock wheelie in a new Ducati Desmosedici!

[onearmedbandit]

Oh it has it's moments!! ;)

Most dribbly moment to date...accidently doing an 11 o'clock wheelie in a new Ducati Desmosedici!

You were in the Desmosedici?

By the way, you are a very lucky man (otherwise known as a right cunt).

[DMNTD]

You were in the Desmosedici?

By the way, you are a very lucky man (otherwise known as a right cunt).

Yes...I entered her with brtute force!

Me a cunt? Nah...they are useful!

[dipshit]

You are right - all that lubbly torque available everywhere, whenever you want, in any gear makes (everyday) life such a drag. I would much rather have to wring the neck of my engine to find it. Yeah right.

I know I would much prefer to be riding this bike (http://youtube.com/watch?v=qui4nBT9oRQ) as opposed to this bike (http://youtube.com/watch?v=_uoewoBI984) regardless of how much torque they may or may not have. :oi-grr:

[aff-man]

Well having owned my first proper v-twin for about a month (I think) now I would have to say this...

IL4's are fun and have thier own little characters but they are like a featherweight, fast light and nimble but on the whole only get fun when they start screaming like DumTed's mum
V-twins (and I mean decent ones not the fartstorm/monster 600's out there) are like a heavyweight. not as much finess but they do sure as hell pack a decent wallop.

[Kiwi675]

Try 2009 R1, best of both worlds!

[imdying]

I know I would much prefer to be riding this bike (http://youtube.com/watch?v=qui4nBT9oRQ) as opposed to this bike (http://youtube.com/watch?v=_uoewoBI984) regardless of how much torque they may or may not have. :oi-grr:Goodness, an example that shows his comment up to be narrow minded, what will we do!

[Elysium]

You are right - all that lubbly torque available everywhere, whenever you want, in any gear makes (everyday) life such a drag. I would much rather have to wring the neck of my engine to find it. Yeah right.

I also found that the same torque makes for wonderful corner exits on the track too, giving me a massive thrill. I just get passed on the straights after that... yawn...

Yep, the Firestorms are pretty much at home on the long sweepers.

[Laava]

Is it OK if I like them all, for their different ways? Or will that upset too many people?

[Elysium]

Is it OK if I like them all, for their different ways? Or will that upset too many people?

No you have to pick a team to go with.

[aff-man]

No you have to pick a team to go with.

What happens if you have one of each??

[dipshit]

What happens if you have one of each??

I think that makes you bi or something.

[beyond]

Ya want an IL4 that has the torque and fun of a Vtwin then go and get a GSX1400 while there are still some new ones around. The only motorbike you can buy in the world for less than $10.00 a CC!!! OH... with a aftermarket can they sound bloody nice too :)

[Dare]

Ya want an IL4 that has the torque and fun of a Vtwin then go and get a GSX1400 while there are still some new ones around. The only motorbike you can buy in the world for less than $10.00 a CC!!! OH... with a aftermarket can they sound bloody nice too :)
What bout a gsf 1200? They seem like pretty good bang for buck too... Just sayin ;)

[robertvi]

Nothing beats the "Rhinoceros fart" of a pulsejet...

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[george formby]

I really enjoy my twin, loads of character & easy to ride quick without risking my licence. It makes a really nice noise too. Riding a 1000cc IL4 recently was startling, astonishing performance but it felt like a turbine in comparison. Also pretty bland at sensible speeds. I would definitely have a 4 on the track.

[LBD]

Ya want an IL4 that has the torque and fun of a Vtwin then go and get a GSX1400 while there are still some new ones around. The only motorbike you can buy in the world for less than $10.00 a CC!!! OH... with a aftermarket can they sound bloody nice too :)


What bout a gsf 1200? They seem like pretty good bang for buck too... Just sayin ;)

Plenty of torque okay....But at 220 kg or more dry all that torque is needed to haul that Lard arse assembly along?

[kermitt]

well itd been damn boring if all bikes sounded the same, personally i love the sound of an unmuffled v twin flat out on the twisties but a vfour is probly the coolest sounding.

[slofox]

Having just swapped out a V2 for an IL4, I hafta say I like the IL4 better. But it has nothing to do with the engine and everything to do with the fact that the gixxer pisses all over the SV650S in all other departments. Like handling especially...and I do like the lunatic power available as well...

[madbikeboy]

The howl of an IL4, stuffed with Yoshimura goodness, versus the sound... Wait a minute. Let me pull over... hmm. Ahem... Hmm dee da de da do... <looks at wristwatch impatiently>... Oh, let me check my phone, 24 texts, oh good, something to do while we wait... ... .... VRrrrrrrrrrmmmmmmmmmmm! Yeah, twins sound neat, but how can you ride something so slow???

[peasea]

The howl of an IL4, stuffed with Yoshimura goodness, versus the sound... Wait a minute. Let me pull over... hmm. Ahem... Hmm dee da de da do... <looks at wristwatch impatiently>... Oh, let me check my phone, 24 texts, oh good, something to do while we wait... ... .... VRrrrrrrrrrmmmmmmmmmmm! Yeah, twins sound neat, but how can you ride something so slow???

And you wonder why ACC is up your arse?

[peasea]

Having just swapped out a V2 for an IL4, I hafta say I like the IL4 better. But it has nothing to do with the engine and everything to do with the fact that the gixxer pisses all over the SV650S in all other departments. Like handling especially...and I do like the lunatic power available as well...

"Lunatic power"......geez, more fodder for the ACC spies.

[peasea]

Great sound (from a V, but not a twin, sure) and lunatic power?

Go get one of these. 2mins 30 is the spot.

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[onearmedbandit]

"Lunatic power"......geez, more fodder for the ACC spies.

Ha, I see more Harley riders in jeans, a light jacket, some 'riding' boots and open face helmets than sportsbike riders. Now that's real ammo for ACC lmao.

[peasea]

Ha, I see more Harley riders in jeans, a light jacket, some 'riding' boots and open face helmets than sportsbike riders. Now that's real ammo for ACC lmao.

I would suggest that both are.

[javawocky]

Having just swapped out a V2 for an IL4, I hafta say I like the IL4 better. But it has nothing to do with the engine and everything to do with the fact that the gixxer pisses all over the SV650S in all other departments. Like handling especially...and I do like the lunatic power available as well...

Yeah, I have recently followed slofox's lead and gone from a SV1000s to a GSXR 600 k7.

Once I get some decent picks I will write a full comparison between the two. Power deliver of the SV if far more satisfying for normal road rideing. Thumping past a cars is simple, hooking up our of corners is shear delight. The Gixxer is another beast - pussy cat at normal commuting stuff, but once you show it a little RPM your licence starts to vanish like the photos in Back to the Future (got my first speeding ticket on day 2 of new bike >_< ).

But back to the point, the SV with aftermarket pipes sounds much more manly than the 600. But - I do like the gurgling of the IL4 and the snarl when you give it stick. My final opinion, its just a differnt sound track from another CD.

[Dare]

"Lunatic power"......geez, more fodder for the ACC spies.
The ACC have enough spare money to hire spies? That's news.

[peasea]

The ACC have enough spare money to hire spies? That's news.

They've got plenty of cash, don't be fooled.

[onearmedbandit]

I would suggest that both are.

Yes, but you have a particular bee in your bonnet with sportsbikes. But it's amusing to read your rants.

[slofox]

"Lunatic power"......geez, more fodder for the ACC spies.

You don't have to USE that lunatic power y'know...well, not all of it anyway...

[peasea]

Yes, but you have a particular bee in your bonnet with sportsbikes. But it's amusing to read your rants.

Actually, it's less about the bikes and more about the tossers that (tend to) ride them.

I really enjoy watching superbike racing, it's all about cutting edge motorcycles, always got time for it. What I do is try to balance the scales, you know, making up for all the HD jibes on here.

[peasea]

You don't have to USE that lunatic power y'know...well, not all of it anyway...

...and not always......mate, you should write Tui ad's, you'd make a bundle.
What's the sportsbike rider's mantra? ATGATT, All The Grunt, All The Time.

[slofox]

Actually, it's less about the bikes and more about the tossers that (tend to) ride them.

No rider's experiences of motorcycling would be complete without riding a sportsbike at some time or other. Same goes for other styles. I've ridden all sorts of stuff over the million years I have been into it. The current gixxer is the first true sportsbike. I am delighted to experience one before I am too old and fucked to enjoy it...

(Saving the Harley experience for my dotage, by the way...:whistle:)

[onearmedbandit]

Actually, it's less about the bikes and more about the tossers that (tend to) ride them.

Now that much is very true. Can't blame the tool, just the tool riding it.


I really enjoy watching superbike racing, it's all about cutting edge motorcycles, always got time for it. What I do is try to balance the scales, you know, making up for all the HD jibes on here.

'fairy nuff. I must say, I kinda of enjoyed taking my brothers tricked up 1340 a number of years back. He reckoned it would have my GSXR750's number in a straight line race to 130mph, so of course I couldn't refuse the chance. Got a letter from him the other day, said he should be home in time for christmas next year.

[slofox]

...and not always......mate, you should write Tui ad's, you'd make a bundle.
What's the sportsbike rider's mantra? ATGATT, All The Grunt, All The Time.

I am very constrained in my use of the lunatic power :whistle: I've only hit the rev limiter once and that was in third...:blip:

[onearmedbandit]

To answer your rep peasea, yes it was. Not saying it was a good one lol.

[peasea]

I must say, I kinda of enjoyed taking my brothers tricked up 1340 a number of years back. He reckoned it would have my GSXR750's number in a straight line race to 130mph.

When we used to build Triumph twin engines to run hard they would show a clean set of heels to many a jap four, the thing was....they didn't last. It's just the prehistoric engineering; you can make anything go fast (ask a sidevalve V8 racer) but you're flogging a dead horse. I'd never make any claim to fame on my chubby lollipop other than in the style stakes. It's reliable because it's unstressed and it'll last for years because of that. Also, even though they may be over-priced when new, you get a bunch more back when you sell.

I just like engines that go 'chug'.

[peasea]

To answer your rep peasea, yes it was. Not saying it was a good one lol.

Yeah, I chuckled, all good.

[peasea]

I am very constrained in my use of the lunatic power :whistle: I've only hit the rev limiter once and that was in third...:blip:

Refer to post #155

[imdying]

I just like engines that go 'chug'.Thomas the Biggus Blockus?

[peasea]

Thomas the Biggus Blockus?

Perhaps. I did think about painting it tartan and calling it Rupert.
If gas prices continue their upward spiral steam might not be such a bad option; then who'd be laughing?

[imdying]

With ya man, not at ya :lol:

[slofox]

steam might not be such a bad option

Mmmmm - steam turbine mo'bike, huh?...could be fun.

[peasea]

Mmmmm - steam turbine mo'bike, huh?...could be fun.

You could tow a caravan!

[slofox]

You could tow a caravan!

You'd probably need a caravan to tow all the fuel you'd need...like a coal tender on the old steam locos...

[peasea]

You'd probably need a caravan to tow all the fuel you'd need...like a coal tender on the old steam locos...

Nah, you could have biker-way stations where you get lattes, coal, water and a packet of Wet Wipes to rid yourself of all the smuts.
(Ah smut, my fave...)

[DarkLord]

V-twins do have a lot of character. They are noisy as hell, vibrate the bolts out of everything and are cantankerous to try and get going in the morning. However they also set off car alarms (hee hee!), are great in terms of power delivery, and nothing compares to the sound of a de-baffled V-twin rumbling along at 100kmph.

Bliss.

[slofox]

noisy as hell, vibrate the bolts out of everything and are cantankerous to try and get going in the morning.

You talking about me again huh?

[scumdog]

Ha, I see more Harley riders in jeans, a light jacket, some 'riding' boots and open face helmets than sportsbike riders. Now that's real ammo for ACC lmao.

Sounds like my XN85 riding gear...

[Elysium]

However they also set off car alarms (hee hee!).
Gods..I love doing that when riding in town or parking at The Plaza car park.

[onearmedbandit]

Sounds like my XN85 riding gear...

I'm kinda scared to ask what your attire on the HD is...

[R-Soul]

Well having owned my first proper v-twin for about a month (I think) now I would have to say this...

IL4's are fun and have thier own little characters but they are like a featherweight, fast light and nimble but on the whole only get fun when they start screaming like DumTed's mum
V-twins (and I mean decent ones not the fartstorm/monster 600's out there) are like a heavyweight. not as much finess but they do sure as hell pack a decent wallop.

The firestorm was the fastest accelerating bike 0-100 when it came out - nothing not decent about that. There are youtube vidoes with exhaust tuned 'Storms doing 0-100 in 2.50 seconds - beating some Busas in fact. Its just that after 100kph, they run out of revs a bit and need to change gears at 10,000rpm, while IL4's can keep accelerating to 14,000 (although mine was still pulling like a freight train at 220kph at Puke...).