Mental way to change an instrument bulb [Archive]

speedpro

22nd May 2005, 11:58

The VFR's been off the road for four days :weep: because of a blown instrument panel bulb. To replace it, I had to dismantle half the bike! It's all good now though - I've got some bulbs, and replaced a few missing fasteners in the process. :niceone:

Years ago honda got a really good deal on 2,347,286 instrument light bulbs. Ever since they have been holding up a bulb and saying to themselves "What sort of bike can we build based on this bulb?" They then started constructing the bike around the light bulb. Hence the difficulty changing them - the bulbs are piece #1 in the construction process.

This is just another reason for never buying a honda.

vifferman

22nd May 2005, 12:04

Years ago honda got a really good deal on 2,347,286 instrument light bulbs. Ever since they have been holding up a bulb and saying to themselves "What sort of bike can we build based on this bulb?" They then started constructing the bike around the light bulb. Hence the difficulty changing them - the bulbs are piece #1 in the construction process.

This is just another reason for never buying a honda.
You forgot to mention that the 2,347,286 bulbs are all peculiar 1.7W ones, so they're essentially unobtainable from anywhere except Honda. :confused:

Wolf

22nd May 2005, 12:18

The VFR's been off the road for four days :weep: because of a blown instrument panel bulb. To replace it, I had to dismantle half the bike! It's all good now though - I've got some bulbs, and replaced a few missing fasteners in the process. :niceone:
Faired bikes, BAD; naked bikes with ugly, crudely-bolted-on instrumentation that's easy to access, GOOD.

Bikes that have the spark plug hidden under the petrol tank with bolts fastening the seat and tank in place, also BAD - especially when their instrumentation is also on the petrol tank and you have to take the tank off to get at the bulbs.

It's not just Honda - Suzuki have their "moments" too.

Zapf

22nd May 2005, 15:09

XTC

22nd May 2005, 15:11

would have been easier to strap a lamp to your helmet......
I had a similar problem fixing the clock on my VFR750FL. No fairing now so no worries

Hitcher

22nd May 2005, 15:43

Jeremy

22nd May 2005, 17:25

It could be worse, it could be one of those bolts that you can only unbolt after you've unbolted it, leaving you with a paradox that requires to go and lay down somewhere.

speedpro

22nd May 2005, 20:34

Like the exhaust pipes on a Mitsi 1800 Libero. you can only swing a spanner to get the pipes off after the pipes are off.

Lou Girardin

23rd May 2005, 09:19

Ya gotta love naked (or semi naked) bikes. 15 minutes to remove the entire headlight assembly.

vifferman

23rd May 2005, 09:33

million dollar question... what sort of cage is that behind the Viffer!
Last of the Peugeot 306's. Has the goodies of the 307, without the ugly styling and poorer handling.
And in front (just out of frame): the Peugeot 205 GTi.

By the way, Lou: 5 minutes to remove the whole top fairing, instrument panel, headlights etc. from the VFR, and about 15 to put it back on. :yes: Not quite as easy as the VTR (6 screws, four connectors and the whole fairing comes off), but pretty good.
For those who rubbish Hondas, you should know that Hondas are renowned for very good panel fit and finish, so although it seems wacky having to remove all this stuff to get at a $3.71 bulb, it's a rare job, and not too irksome, and everything goes back together very nicely.

MSTRS

23rd May 2005, 09:35

million dollar question... what sort of cage is that behind the Viffer!
Bulb donor?

vifferman

23rd May 2005, 09:46

Bulb donor?
I did consider that. But Peugeots (and most cars??) are even harder to get at bits on. Plus the bulbs are different;even the headlight bulbs (on the 306) are different, some HID things, I think. Luckily, the VFR's headlight bulbs are accessible with the fairing in place, and have been swapped from the mental OEM bulbs to standard 55/60W H4s.
We recently had to do the instrument bulbs in the 205, and it took a couple of hours to get everything out. They're now LEDs, so they shouldn't need changing in a hurry.

XP@

23rd May 2005, 09:58

The VFR's been off the road for four days :weep: because of a blown instrument panel bulb. To replace it, I had to dismantle half the bike! It's all good now though - I've got some bulbs, and replaced a few missing fasteners in the process. :niceone:
I been there too...
tried to swap the bulb on my f650 without removin the plastic, dropped the bulb cos it got too slippy with all the blood on it.
got a new bulb, a plaster then removed the fairing... was not happy chappy :(

Wolf

23rd May 2005, 09:58

It could be worse, it could be one of those bolts that you can only unbolt after you've unbolted it, leaving you with a paradox that requires to go and lay down somewhere.
The LS400 has two of those holding the seat on - you have to take the seat off to get at the bolts to take the seat off...

More paradoxes than a "Star Trek Classic" episode... :devil2:

I often wonder if they have specialised tools manufactured for when they assemble these things - like a spanner with 14 bends in it to reach the bolts that they expect the owner to reach with the el-cheapo standard 12mm/10mm spanner that they include in the tool kit.

I also think that the manufacturers have skinner, longer fingers with more joints in them (with the ability to bend in any direction) than normal humans. Also longer, narrower arms (with extra "universal joint" elbows) and eyes on stalks.

MSTRS

23rd May 2005, 10:12

I also think that the manufacturers have skinner, longer fingers with more joints in them (with the ability to bend in any direction) than normal humans. Also longer, narrower arms (with extra "universal joint" elbows) and eyes on stalks.
Another thread shows an R1 as an octopus. Do not be mislead. This is the assembler subliminating.

vifferman

23rd May 2005, 10:18

I often wonder if they have specialised tools manufactured for when they assemble these things - like a spanner with 14 bends in it to reach the bolts that they expect the owner to reach with the el-cheapo standard 12mm/10mm spanner that they include in the tool kit.
I think the truth is that in Japan, the bike will never need to have anyone access any of these bits before it is 'old' and ditched.
Here's another pardoxical item: to adjust the idle mixture screws on the VTR1000, you need to remove the carbs. Unless of course, you have access to the SpecialScrewdriverThatCanScrewAroundCorners, and also have those "eyes on stalks" you mentioned, so that you can see what you're doing.

A special feature that the Japanese install on bikes is the BlackHoleThatEatsStuff. On VFRs and VTRs, it's installed in the engine V, and grabs any loosened carburettor bolts, washers, widgets, etc. Sometimes, its gravitational pull can be overcome with a powerful MagnetOnAStick, but more often than not, any object that strays into it is lost forever. :eek: So far, I've only lost one item on this bike - a clip that secures some wire harness that traverses the edge of the airbox. Being plastic, the MagnetOnAStick failed to retrieve it. I never even got to see what it looked like :weep: before it was gone forever. I had to resort to constructing a replacement from a piece cut from an icecream container lid.
Less fortunate mortals, who were foolish enough to not take note of the location of the BlackHoleThatEatsStuff on their bike have suffered more than me: a friend was working on his KLR650 with the head off, and although he stuffed all the orifices with rags, he neglected one small aperture, barely the size of a small bolt. Said small bolt was whisked into it, and he had to dismantle the crankcases to retrieve it.

MSTRS

23rd May 2005, 10:28

I think the truth is that in Japan, the bike will never need to have anyone access any of these bits before it is 'old' and ditched.
Here's another pardoxical item: to adjust the idle mixture screws on the VTR1000, you need to remove the carbs. Unless of course, you have access to the SpecialScrewdriverThatCanScrewAroundCorners, and also have those "eyes on stalks" you mentioned, so that you can see what you're doing.

A special feature that the Japanese install on bikes is the BlackHoleThatEatsStuff. On VFRs and VTRs, it's installed in the engine V, and grabs any loosened carburettor bolts, washers, widgets, etc. Sometimes, its gravitational pull can be overcome with a powerful MagnetOnAStick, but more often than not, any object that strays into it is lost forever. :eek: So far, I've only lost one item on this bike - a clip that secures some wire harness that traverses the edge of the airbox. Being plastic, the MagnetOnAStick failed to retrieve it. I never even got to see what it looked like :weep: before it was gone forever. I had to resort to constructing a replacement from a piece cut from an icecream container lid.
Less fortunate mortals, who were foolish enough to not take note of the location of the BlackHoleThatEatsStuff on their bike have suffered more than me: a friend was working on his KLR650 with the head off, and although he stuffed all the orifices with rags, he neglected one small aperture, barely the size of a small bolt. Said small bolt was whisked into it, and he had to dismantle the crankcases to retrieve it.
Don't blame the designer/manufacturer for this problem. IT IS THE FAULT OF THE IRISH in the form of Murphy and his delightful universal law.

avgas

23rd May 2005, 10:49

Years ago honda got a really good deal on 2,347,286 instrument light bulbs. Ever since they have been holding up a bulb and saying to themselves "What sort of bike can we build based on this bulb?" They then started constructing the bike around the light bulb. Hence the difficulty changing them - the bulbs are piece #1 in the construction process.

This is just another reason for never buying a honda.
Not just honda - my RG had the same prob. Took me longer to change the instrument bulbs then to strip the motor :D
And the bulbs blew quite often
Reminds me - if anyone wants some RG150 backlight bulbs PM/email me......if ya send me some nice photos of ya bike ya can have em for free :niceone:

Wolf

23rd May 2005, 11:04

Don't blame the designer/manufacturer for this problem. IT IS THE FAULT OF THE IRISH in the form of Murphy and his delightful universal law.
Actually, the "Murphy" in question was apparently an American at Edwards Airforce base. While the surname would suggest Irish ancestry calling it an "Irish" invention would be like attributing my ideas to the Cornish (or Scots, Welsh, Irish, Saxons...)

And secondly - all he did was formalise a much older observation and it's an observation of a phenomenon - he didn't actually create the phenomenon.

I think the one you want to blame for the phenomenon is whichever god/dess(s/es) you believe in or the random fluctuations of the Space-Time Continuum.

Lou Girardin

23rd May 2005, 11:11

Last of the Peugeot 306's. Has the goodies of the 307, without the ugly styling and poorer handling.
And in front (just out of frame): the Peugeot 205 GTi.

By the way, Lou: 5 minutes to remove the whole top fairing, instrument panel, headlights etc. from the VFR, and about 15 to put it back on. :yes: Not quite as easy as the VTR (6 screws, four connectors and the whole fairing comes off), but pretty good.
For those who rubbish Hondas, you should know that Hondas are renowned for very good panel fit and finish, so although it seems wacky having to remove all this stuff to get at a $3.71 bulb, it's a rare job, and not too irksome, and everything goes back together very nicely.

So it wasn't chore, you secretly enjoyed it :niceone:

MSTRS

23rd May 2005, 11:15

Actually, the "Murphy" in question was apparently an American at Edwards Airforce base. While the surname would suggest Irish ancestry calling it an "Irish" invention would be like attributing my ideas to the Cornish (or Scots, Welsh, Irish, Saxons...)

And secondly - all he did was formalise a much older observation and it's an observation of a phenomenon - he didn't actually create the phenomenon.

I think the one you want to blame for the phenomenon is whichever god/dess(s/es) you believe in or the random fluctuations of the Space-Time Continuum.
Pedant...
Albatross....fer christ's sake
2 choc ices please
Haven't got any choc ices, just this albatross
Well what flavour is it
It's not any bloody flavour mate. You don't get a strawberry albatross
It must be some sort of flavour
All right then smartarse. It's bloody seabird flavour
Do you get wafers with it
Course you don't get fucking wafers with it
..................

Wolf

23rd May 2005, 11:18

Here's another pardoxical item: to adjust the idle mixture screws on the VTR1000, you need to remove the carbs. Unless of course, you have access to the SpecialScrewdriverThatCanScrewAroundCorners, and also have those "eyes on stalks" you mentioned, so that you can see what you're doing.
GSX250 has a similar issue - air mixture screws are located in such a way that you have to remove at least the tank (which would leave you with the logistical problem of getting petrol to the carbs) to adjust them and even then they're hard to reach (inconvenient luxuries such as the frame being in the way) The expectation seems to be you set them by removing tank and carbs, screwing the mixture screws all the way in, backing them off the same number of turns for each carb, reinstalling the carbs, replacing tank, hooking up the fuel lines - all the while praying that you guessed the right mix. (And that one of the carbs doesn't require a slightly different mix for the engine to run smoothly.)

When I first put the "new" engine in that bike it took me 45 minutes to get the carbs back on - now I can remove, adjust and reinstall in under 10 minutes...

XP@

23rd May 2005, 11:29

Pedant...
Albatross....fer christ's sake
2 choc ices please
Haven't got any choc ices, just this albatross
Well what flavour is it
It's not any bloody flavour mate. You don't get a strawberry albatross
It must be some sort of flavour
All right then smartarse. It's bloody seabird flavour
Do you get wafers with it
Course you don't get fucking wafers with it
..................
Now what are you doing down there? When you should be up here starting a new spoof Now which one are you the funny man or the straight man?

MSTRS

23rd May 2005, 11:35

Now what are you doing down there? When you should be up here starting a new spoof Now which one are you the funny man or the straight man?
Yes............

dhunt

23rd May 2005, 12:07

It's not just Honda - Suzuki have their "moments" too.
I'll say :brick: Was helping my mate change the oil and filter on his GSXR400 (just bought it off KB) expecting it to be a nice easy 10 minute max job. But it so happens that to change the oil filter one must first remove half the fairing, then remove the radiator bolts and finally remove one of the header pipes before managing to squeeze the filter out from behind the next header pipe. Quick and Easy not!

vifferman

23rd May 2005, 12:13

So it wasn't chore, you secretly enjoyed it :niceone:
I think you're right. Although I'd rather have not had to do it.
But, as I said, it all turned out for the best. Not only did I find some holes with no fasteners in them (now rectified), I also now have spare bulbs, courtesy of AMPS, and my wife got the chance to ogle your stock. I thought I was getting a new Aprilia or Triumph there for a moment. Just a moment...

Paul in NZ

23rd May 2005, 13:00

GSX250 has a similar issue - air mixture screws are located in such a way that you have to remove at least the tank (which would leave you with the logistical problem of getting petrol to the carbs) to adjust them and even then they're hard to reach (inconvenient luxuries such as the frame being in the way) The expectation seems to be you set them by removing tank and carbs, screwing the mixture screws all the way in, backing them off the same number of turns for each carb, reinstalling the carbs, replacing tank, hooking up the fuel lines - all the while praying that you guessed the right mix. (And that one of the carbs doesn't require a slightly different mix for the engine to run smoothly.)

When I first put the "new" engine in that bike it took me 45 minutes to get the carbs back on - now I can remove, adjust and reinstall in under 10 minutes...

I read stuff like this and go out and look at the Guzzi...

Carbs and stuff what needs adjustin' all happily located where people can get to them... And you thought the design was crazy...

Now that oil filter inside the sump I can live without...

Biff

23rd May 2005, 13:27