Buddle Findlay prosecutes parking ticket.

[jaykay]

Well, I went to the High Court yesterday to hand in submissions about a Parking Ticket I was convicted for back in January. (The ticket itself is now a year old), the appeal is 12th May.

I was either flattered or annoyed (not sure which) to discover that the solicitor prosecuting this $40 ticket was from Buddle Findlay, which begs the question 'why'? Why employ an outside solicitor (and three other council staff) for $40? - the case ran for 2 1/2 hours and I doubt the ratepayers of Christchurch got much change out of $3000.

The answer would appear to be a major problem for the council, and therefore all other councils.

1. There was no disclosure. The prosecution have to disclose everything they are going to
prosecute with before the hearing - they didn't.
2. The Parking Attendant said from the witness stand "we're not set any targets (for tickets)". Strange how a friend of mine who was a parking attendant said they have to do 7 tickets an hour, 47 a day.
3. Lastly, and most important is the front of the Reminder Notice. Quite simply the council allows 28 days from date of printing for payment - the law allows you 28 days from the date you receive it. At first glance this may not seem important - but there have been a number of cases (which have gone high up) in the UK stating that getting these dates correct is critical. If they're not, the paperwork is deemed not to exist.

All will be revealed on the 12th - 2.15, Christchurch High Court. I'll post again if I haven't been locked up in the meantime.

[Indoo]

Unless it is some huge injustice, which it does't appear to be given your trying to get off on silly technicalities, surely your own time and money invested would vastly exceed a mere 40 dollar ticket?

[oldrider]

Tis the way of a silly world, full of silly people!

[The Pastor]

Unless it is some huge injustice, which it does't appear to be given your trying to get off on silly technicalities, surely your own time and money invested would vastly exceed a mere 40 dollar ticket?

yeah but, fighting the law is fun!

[bogan]

Unless it is some huge injustice, which it does't appear to be given your trying to get off on silly technicalities, surely your own time and money invested would vastly exceed a mere 40 dollar ticket?

Exactly, I got off one recently after parking under a motorcycle parking sign with broken yellows, had to go above the main parking guys head though.. same week I got one in welli which I paid straight away, cos it was legit.

[HenryDorsetCase]

the rule is that if you pay rates in a given city, you dont also have to pay for parking. So I pay rates in Chur chur, I can park wherever the FUCK I want to, and its OK.

Today I am parked in Bob Parkers car park and Ive left a big Cleveland Steamer on his desk.

[Max Preload]

Unless it is some huge injustice, which it does't appear to be given your trying to get off on silly technicalities, surely your own time and money invested would vastly exceed a mere 40 dollar ticket?

So we're expected to adhere to 'silly technicalities' but the Council isn't?

[Indoo]

I just don't see the point of investing so much time and effort into something so pathetically trivial as a 40 dollar parking ticket. If it was an actual injustice or something that was grossly unfair I could imagine it, but crap like this just clogs up the courts, costs us the taxpayer a shit load of money and all for someones petty personal agenda.

[Max Preload]

I just don't see the point of investing so much time and effort into something so pathetically trivial as a 40 dollar parking ticket. If it was an actual injustice or something that was grossly unfair I could imagine it, but crap like this just clogs up the courts, costs us the taxpayer a shit load of money and all for someones petty personal agenda.

Yeah, you have to wonder why the Council are pursuing it, wasting all that time and money.

[Indoo]

Yes the council should just roll over and take it everytime someone finds some obscure little loophole that they think can get them off a ticket, that would work....Plus petty little bureaucrats probably love this anal-retentive overanaylsis of rules and regulations.

[Coldrider]

Yes the council should just roll over and take it everytime someone finds some obscure little loophole that they think can get them off a ticket, that would work....Plus petty little bureaucrats probably love this anal-retentive overanaylsis of rules and regulations.Surely if the Council is to administer the law it should operate within the law itself?

[Gremlin]

think of it another way Indoo. Nobody fights a ticket, even when its wrong. Council decides to write bullshit tickets because people will shut up and pay. Where do you think this gets you?

[HenryDorsetCase]

Yeah, you have to wonder why the Council are pursuing it, wasting all that time and money.

Uh, the council workers get paid anyway, as does whichever junior litigation solicitor at BF. they welcome the change to their otherwise dull day: as will the Judge (makes a change from sentencing dropkicks, rapists and kiddy fiddlers, right?). So the only person losing out is our hero who has the stress of a Court date, takes time off work, and then probably will still lose.

Whatever floats your boat, dude, but sometimes shit is not worth getting your panties in a bunch over. Just saying.

[HenryDorsetCase]

think of it another way Indoo. Nobody fights a ticket, even when its wrong. Council decides to write bullshit tickets because people will shut up and pay. Where do you think this gets you?OOOhhhhh oooooh I know this one!!

a weeks holiday for two on the Sunshine Coast?

[firefighter]

Yes the council should just roll over and take it everytime someone finds some obscure little loophole that they think can get them off a ticket, that would work....Plus petty little bureaucrats probably love this anal-retentive overanaylsis of rules and regulations.

They put up a bigger fight and are more concerned over a $40 ticket, than the pieces of shit who get repeated warnings for assaults etc .....

You see it all the time on 10.7........where they describe the conviction and it's not even a pat on the wrist, they may has well have given the crimminal a blowjob.......this may seem off-topic but it's not. This ties in because look at the amount of armour they've used to try and make sure a $40 parking ticket sticks, which in the grand scheme of things does'nt really fucken matter, yet crimminals seem to have less of a formiddable prosecution to go up against.......

The council should'nt be allowed to dedicate such a (IMO) huge amount of resources and funds into such a minor incident.....in fact this should really be put through something like a disputes tribunal.

I personally would just pay the ticket, however I ca'nt judge as I plan to forego a $4.50 levy I am expected to pay with each Rates bill for the RWC. My money will not be extorted from me to support private enterprise, especially since they're too cunty to give me a discount for the RWC (tickets whathaveyou) i'm expected to not only pay for, cannot afford to go to and be inconvenienced by.
I wo'nt bloody help pay for it if the rest of the country does'nt have to. It's the principle of it. (until they cut off my essential services and I pay the bill lol)

[HenryDorsetCase]

Just kind of on this, I cannot believe there hasnt been blood in the streets over the gummint sacking ECan and appointing its attack drone Bazely. Just so a bunch of greedy fucking corporate farmers can rape our land, rivers and high country more effectively. Awesome.

[Max Preload]

Yes the council should just roll over and take it everytime someone finds some obscure little loophole that they think can get them off a ticket, that would work....Plus petty little bureaucrats probably love this anal-retentive overanaylsis of rules and regulations.So you think the citizen should just roll over? How about if both parties don't get it absolutely perfect it's invalid? That would be fair.

The Councils have never rolled over on my ones that I've contested, because I'm RIGHT (at least they haven't initially - it takes a few repeat letters for it to sink in, which I enjoy writing, anyway. Council workers are notoriously thick).


I just don't see the point of investing so much time and effort into something so pathetically trivial as a 40 dollar parking ticket. If it was an actual injustice or something that was grossly unfair I could imagine it, but crap like this just clogs up the courts, costs us the taxpayer a shit load of money and all for someones petty personal agenda.

Here's the injustice: You infringed a regulation. The penalty: $40. They infringed a regulation. The penalty: Nothing.


Surely if the Council is to administer the law it should operate within the law itself?

That's crazy talk! Imagine holding them to the same standard! :weird:


Uh, the council workers get paid anyway, as does whichever junior litigation solicitor at BF. they welcome the change to their otherwise dull day: as will the Judge (makes a change from sentencing dropkicks, rapists and kiddy fiddlers, right?). So the only person losing out is our hero who has the stress of a Court date, takes time off work, and then probably will still lose.

Whatever floats your boat, dude, but sometimes shit is not worth getting your panties in a bunch over. Just saying.

It's still a waste of OUR money and it's always worth it. It'll cost much more in the long run if you DON'T contest them.

[Pixie]

I just don't see the point of investing so much time and effort into something so pathetically trivial as a 40 dollar parking ticket. If it was an actual injustice or something that was grossly unfair I could imagine it, but crap like this just clogs up the courts, costs us the taxpayer a shit load of money and all for someones petty personal agenda.

You can probably get a blow job for $40,'tis no bagatelle

[HenryDorsetCase]

You can probably get a blow job for $40,'tis no bagatelle

$40 is cheap. the last one cost me half my house and my savings....

[Toaster]

Today I am parked in Bob Parkers car park and Ive left a big Cleveland Steamer on his desk.

You should run for Mayor! Love your work!

[davereid]

I just don't see the point of investing so much time and effort into something so pathetically trivial as a 40 dollar parking ticket...... crap like this just clogs up the courts, costs us the taxpayer a shit load of money....

That may be exactly the reason we should fight all tickets.

Its my view, that the invention of the ticket changed society in a massive, and harmful way.

Before the ticket was invented, the law was written and enforced to deal with real issues. But the ticket gave the small minded council or government official a economic method of creating hundreds, even thousands of new offences, that were never going to be worth having a law about if the courts were involved.

Now we are besieged with fines, for everything imaginable. Our weapon is to dispute each and every one, every time.

Even if we lose, we win.

[red mermaid]

The reason they (Christchurch CC) have probably engaged such a high profile firm could be several;

1. The are the councils retained company and on a retainer.

2. If as you say it is going to be heard in the High Court then the case may sit on a point of law with serious consequences for case law. To get a wrong decision because the council did not put all of there submissions in the strongest possible legal terms could have serious consequences way beyond this case.

[ynot slow]

The tried and heard often from cop/warden "you have 28days to pay" annoys the shit out of me,you get 56 days,because after the first 28 days or so a computer printed invoice is sent and that says 28 days to pay.

What pissed me off with my last parking ticket for $12.00 was I never had a ticket on windscreen,(is good because you move the car,and stick it under wiper and most wardens think hehe got em,so no need to pay meter,good for an hour or so),and therefor didn't pay,and the "hard" copy wasn't sent hence it went to court and $30 fees applied,when ringing council was told ring justice dept re fines,they were sympathetic(pathetic)and suggested going to council filling out xyz form blah blah,so I paid it.

[breakaway]

jaykay, what are the exact circumstances under which this ticket was issued?

[jaykay]

There isn't much dispute about the ticket, truth be known I was delayed in the accountants sorting out a six figure sum owed by an ex (very ex) business partner.

The good news from the High Court is that the council were told in no uncertain terms to fix the dates on their Reminder Notices - as far as I am aware ALL Reminder Notices from ALL councils are wrong - and I didn't have to pay any costs. However I technically lost the appeal, leaving me having to pay the $40 ticket - and the council with a bill that I suspect may run into five figures.

I'm still not sure if I should be flattered or annoyed that the council went to such lengths to be told they were wrong - and they were only saved by a law that allows them to make mistakes and get away with it.

I have belatedly worked out a better defense, which may have succeeded - and if the council try and prosecute me for a phantom $12 ticket on a scooter it could get very interesting. I doubt the council will risk court again against me, perhaps they will work out that this latest ticket is actually a mistake - the scooter has NEVER been parked in that street, or anywhere near it.

Still, it was good fun - and the third time against the council in the High Court. I've never had to pay costs, they had to pay me $50 on one occasion.

Could anyone who gets a council Reminder Notice in the near future post back here to see if they are right or wrong.