People interested in responding to MNZ about F3 proposed changes?

[neil_cb125t]

Some of us have seen them, many have opinions. Reguardless on your veiw on the changes - submittions actualy need to be sent in to MNZ.

I will throw up a 'cut and paste-able" letter and attach it on this thread - you can be pro or against all, some or none of the changes that MNZ are offering. The letter will be setup so you can say YES great because...... or NO WAY because...... But at least F3 riders will have a say.

Letter to be up soon!!

My email dets are neil.chappell@nzdf.mil.nz or neil_cb125t@yahoo.com for offline dicussion.

[crazy man]

thanks will keep a eye out

[Billy]

Some of us have seen them, many have opinions. Reguardless on your veiw on the changes - submittions actualy need to be sent in to MNZ.

I will throw up a 'cut and paste-able" letter and attach it on this thread - you can be pro or against all, some or none of the changes that MNZ are offering. The letter will be setup so you can say YES great because...... or NO WAY because...... But at least F3 riders will have a say.

Letter to be up soon!!

My email dets are neil.chappell@nzdf.mil.nz or neil_cb125t@yahoo.com for offline dicussion.

If you read Maartys post,It states,Constructive submissions are welcome through MNZ.Having spoken too Peter Ramage on the matter,I can tell you,They dont want too hear whats fair and whats not,Good constructive ideas will be considered,Whining and bleating its not fair will no doubt be deleted

[Shaun]

Some of us have seen them, many have opinions. Reguardless on your veiw on the changes - submittions actualy need to be sent in to MNZ.

I will throw up a 'cut and paste-able" letter and attach it on this thread - you can be pro or against all, some or none of the changes that MNZ are offering. The letter will be setup so you can say YES great because...... or NO WAY because...... But at least F3 riders will have a say.

Letter to be up soon!!

My email dets are neil.chappell@nzdf.mil.nz or neil_cb125t@yahoo.com for offline dicussion.

Why not just respond the way Marty has asked us to? Lets keep this focused and on track team.

[roadracingoldfart]

I tend to agree with the above posts Neil , form letters or similar will be discounted as just that , a blanket "i dont want " format isnt whats needed or in fact wanted.
I am in the middle of penning a submission and im happy to let you use it as i am no longer a member of MNZ so its more from a heart felt appeal from me personally.

My main gripe is the frame rule , i helped build so many bikes back in the day and we did serious frame work to proddy models as the spirit of F3 (as we knew it ) was all about outside the square thinking and frames are a good place to start.
I had started to build an Egli replica for my 455 but i ran out of talent lol , i have that aspect now so its nice to think i could use it.
Several bikes are around now with special frames and i would hate to see the experimental appeal of F3 go by the wayside because its how it should be.

Paul.

[neil_cb125t]

If you read Maartys post,It states,Constructive submissions are welcome through MNZ.Having spoken too Peter Ramage on the matter,I can tell you,They dont want too hear whats fair and whats not,Good constructive ideas will be considered,Whining and bleating its not fair will no doubt be deleted

So what your saying is that doesn't matter what the riders in F3 think MNZ say this.... or that .....and say we want responses.... but nothin negative??? and then it gets changed??- so i can get someone from MNZ to say SVs are gone and it happens with no argument?? NO

End of the day MNZ is there for us - not the other way around - if i put forward the recommendation to take multi's out to 500cc can no one complain??? - even then my bike wont get near a GP bike

[Shaun]

So what your saying is that doesn't matter what the riders in F3 think MNZ say this.... or that .....and say we want responses.... but nothin negative??? and then it gets changed??- so i can get someone from MNZ to say SVs are gone and it happens with no argument?? NO

End of the day MNZ is there for us - not the other way around - if i put forward the recommendation to take multi's out to 500cc can no one complain??? - even then my bike wont get near a GP bike


Wow, sit down and relax sport, you come across as firey as I do, and that is not good.

Just go through the channels that our Road Race commision has asked us to.

Having No Name No License holders sending them WANKER messages is just a waste of there good time, WHICH THEY GIVE FOR FREE!!!!!!

[codgyoleracer]

Definatly send in your thoughts , the commison (whilst not voted in by the members) will still listen to constructive ideas for sure and will submit them to the powers to be. Just keep in mind the sport as a whole and the benefit or detractions you feel that the mooted rule changes may have on the various competitors, its spectators, and whether they will grow the sport overall by bringing in new members/competitors.

Mines done ! :-)

[lostinflyz]

yea i agree with most posts, appeal to logic not belief. If there is solid logic behind an argument it is much harder to ignore.

i've got a couple of things i want to point out so im slowly plotting out my own submission (superbike/supersport/sportbike even im confused). I think it best to pen something constructive rather than a simple petition document.

[Billy]

yea i agree with most posts, appeal to logic not belief. If there is solid logic behind an argument it is much harder to ignore.

i've got a couple of things i want to point out so im slowly plotting out my own submission (superbike/supersport/sportbike even im confused). I think it best to pen something constructive rather than a simple petition document.

well said Tim,Thats exactly what they want

[neil_cb125t]

Yes i did fire up a bit, i just hate that the words fly on sites such as this but nothining gets put down formally - proffessionally. I was contacted via email last night by MNZ and i replied...... being a bit less firey :shutup:

My response;

Hi XXX,

I do hear what you and many are saying – I also understand that MNZ must get so many “NA!!!! I don’t like that….,” types of correspondence.

I totally agree that submissions need to be just that, submissions, i.e. a proposal from an individual showing their interests in the class and its development. They are useless if they are simply a bleating session.

I understand that the intent of changing the F3 rules is to try and bring more F3 entrants to the party…… I TOTALLY agree. I can’t quite see how F3 is over subscribed to at Wanganui, Paeroa and most club level events all around the country. But when it comes to national’s time you can’t entrants if you tried. So I applaud MNZ’s intent.

I have never entered a round of the nationals, this year I have taken off racing to completely rebuild my F3 bike (444cc multi) and save to compete in the 2011 series, after doing very well at club level last year I quickly realised that National level is where we need racers to aim for. Club level racing is great and serves a good purpose, however classes need to foster more club level “ legends “ and convince them into giving nationals a go. I believe the ‘F3 and Pro twin’ level is the ‘vessel’ for it. I also believe there are the right people within those classes to mentor people this way… most of them already do.

talk to you soon

Chappy

What is good is that there is a HIGH level of experience within this post ALONE that have good solid veiws on the future of racing. im sure MNZ will get good submissions.:yes:

[Shaun]

Yes i did fire up a bit, i just hate that the words fly on sites such as this but nothining gets put down formally - proffessionally. I was contacted via email last night by MNZ and i replied...... being a bit less firey :shutup:

My response;

Hi XXX,

I do hear what you and many are saying – I also understand that MNZ must get so many “NA!!!! I don’t like that….,” types of correspondence.

I totally agree that submissions need to be just that, submissions, i.e. a proposal from an individual showing their interests in the class and its development. They are useless if they are simply a bleating session.

I understand that the intent of changing the F3 rules is to try and bring more F3 entrants to the party…… I TOTALLY agree. I can’t quite see how F3 is over subscribed to at Wanganui, Paeroa and most club level events all around the country. But when it comes to national’s time you can’t entrants if you tried. So I applaud MNZ’s intent.

I have never entered a round of the nationals, this year I have taken off racing to completely rebuild my F3 bike (444cc multi) and save to compete in the 2011 series, after doing very well at club level last year I quickly realised that National level is where we need racers to aim for. Club level racing is great and serves a good purpose, however classes need to foster more club level “ legends “ and convince them into giving nationals a go. I believe the ‘F3 and Pro twin’ level is the ‘vessel’ for it. I also believe there are the right people within those classes to mentor people this way… most of them already do.

talk to you soon

Chappy

What is good is that there is a HIGH level of experience within this post ALONE that have good solid veiws on the future of racing. im sure MNZ will get good submissions.:yes:

Good on ya

[Billy]

Yes i did fire up a bit, i just hate that the words fly on sites such as this but nothining gets put down formally - proffessionally. I was contacted via email last night by MNZ and i replied...... being a bit less firey :shutup:

My response;

Hi XXX,

I do hear what you and many are saying – I also understand that MNZ must get so many “NA!!!! I don’t like that….,” types of correspondence.

I totally agree that submissions need to be just that, submissions, i.e. a proposal from an individual showing their interests in the class and its development. They are useless if they are simply a bleating session.

I understand that the intent of changing the F3 rules is to try and bring more F3 entrants to the party…… I TOTALLY agree. I can’t quite see how F3 is over subscribed to at Wanganui, Paeroa and most club level events all around the country. But when it comes to national’s time you can’t entrants if you tried. So I applaud MNZ’s intent.

I have never entered a round of the nationals, this year I have taken off racing to completely rebuild my F3 bike (444cc multi) and save to compete in the 2011 series, after doing very well at club level last year I quickly realised that National level is where we need racers to aim for. Club level racing is great and serves a good purpose, however classes need to foster more club level “ legends “ and convince them into giving nationals a go. I believe the ‘F3 and Pro twin’ level is the ‘vessel’ for it. I also believe there are the right people within those classes to mentor people this way… most of them already do.

talk to you soon

Chappy

What is good is that there is a HIGH level of experience within this post ALONE that have good solid veiws on the future of racing. im sure MNZ will get good submissions.:yes:

Well done Neil,Thats what theyre looking for

[FROSTY]

ok clearly im just stupid. --MNZ introduce a class that is basicly the poor mans F3 (Pro twins)Has them on the track at the same time as F3 then wonders why theres not so many entries in F3 at national level. For gosh sakes it aint rocket science.
(no disrespect to PT guys intended in any way)

[Kickaha]

ok clearly im just stupid. --MNZ introduce a class that is basicly the poor mans F3 (Pro twins)Has them on the track at the same time as F3 then wonders why theres not so many entries in F3 at national level. For gosh sakes it aint rocket science.


Correct you are

Even taking that into account the level of entries in F3/Pro Twin was well below what it should be from a class which is the most popular at club level

[FROSTY]

but add the two classses together and you have a Motogp size grid.
I think MNZ miss the point really. The very reason for the popularity is that weekend warriors with 2.5 kids can afford the time and money to go to the local track once a month for a day on his $3000 machine. Nationals means time away in a close together chunk of time.

[FROSTY]

It looks like the main thrust of the changes is aimed fairly and squarely at the two stroke production bikes with the aim perhaps being to prevent TZ250 frames being used with TZR engines etc. --or maybee I'm reading it wrong.
I feel that the 250 race machines should be in with the 600 proddie bikes as they turn that sort of lap times

[roadracingoldfart]

but add the two classses together and you have a Motogp size grid.
I think MNZ miss the point really. The very reason for the popularity is that weekend warriors with 2.5 kids can afford the time and money to go to the local track once a month for a day on his $3000 machine. Nationals means time away in a close together chunk of time.


And thats why i want to see a North Island and South Island champ series with a N.Z. champ title contested over a round or 2 alternately hosted between the North and South annually.
That way you dont have to travel at great cost to another Island .
I would come out of retirment to contest a North Island cup , but have no incling to spend 3 weeks in the South Island as its just too bloody expensive.
If you want to be the N.Z. champ , you travel every 2 years to the other Island for a much cheaper series , or just be happy with an Island champ cup.


Ok , im dreaming again , its far too simple.

sits in corner and :shutup: :bye:


Paul.

[FROSTY]

I dunno but I bet if you ask the people currently filling the manfeild F3 grid they will answer as I posted.One day off yes --but three weekends in a row--let alone 6 just wont happen. Why not accept it and adjust the race classes at nationals to suit.
I wonder if F3 at nat level could include PT and 125 GP if the feilds sighned up at start of nats are say sub 8 per class.
The way I see it Its a win/win situation --either all the nats riders get more races per day or the meeting becomes a two day event--saturday practice and sunday racing instead of NEEDING friday for practice. 2x 10 lap races per class on sunday.
I mean why does Club level racing have to line up with nat level racing?

[Kickaha]

but add the two classses together and you have a Motogp size grid.

Not at Nationals you don't


I dunno but I bet if you ask the people currently filling the manfeild F3 grid they will answer as I posted.One day off yes --but three weekends in a row--let alone 6 just wont happen. Why not accept it and adjust the race classes at nationals to suit.


The Tri Series blows your three weekends in a row argument out of the water (although it was more like two weeks this year)

I understand some date changes are being looked at which would see North and South rounds further apart which should make it easier


but have no incling to spend 3 weeks in the South Island as its just too bloody expensive.


Plan it right and you don't have to spend more than 5-6 days over three weekends, but you need to be organised and book well ahead to get the price down and have some Southern friends to drive your gear around

[FROSTY]

Not at Nationals you don't
I must be counting wrong--I thought I saw a total of 18 bikes on the grid



The Tri Series blows your three weekends in a row argument out of the water (although it was more like two weeks this year)

I understand some date changes are being looked at which would see North and South rounds further apart which should make it easier

Yep--2 weeks and 3 days racing all close to home for Ni folk

[lostinflyz]

it is a national level class, it does require some commitment. If its just a race weekend sometime whats the point. The funnest part about doing nats is going outside your comfort zone and racing in different places with different people. Don't knock it till you try it.

Going round nats i heard a million different excuses to not to nats, and i might have heard one or two that were even half reasonable, but most are just excuses for people who simply don't wan to do nats (which is fine). Sure you won't win, but you never know (i got 5th on a fundamentally fairly stock 400)

At every round this year, virtually no one entered f3 for their local club round only, which to me says having a single event still wouldn't make a lick of difference to the numbers.

[Kickaha]

Yep--2 weeks and 3 days racing all close to home for Ni folk

Chris Lawrence suggested 2 rounds on consecutive weekends with a mid week meeting in between for the South island rounds several years ago to make it easier for the NI guys