Trackdays and wheelies

[DEATH_INC.]

What is it with trackday promoters and their anti-wheelie rules?
The motott guys are pretty reasonable about it, and don't give ya too much shit if you aren't to stupid, but the hampton guys are bloody over the top, they threatened to send me home because the front was lifting outta corners! wtf is up with that????
I'm pretty reluctant to go back now, for fear of getting kicked out.
Any one else have this problem?

[onearmedbandit]

At the last trackday down here I was at they (the promoters, not the track staff) were very firm on the 'no-wheelie' policy, with one of the organisers going as far as to say 'if you want to do that, do it on the streets'. I figure I'll use that one if I get caught doing so.

However, going to the track on either Tuesday or Friday here and you can wheelie to your hearts content. In fact I got given a years pass to the track for doing so.

[imdying]

On a ZX10R I would have thought it was your divine right! :laugh:

[Little Miss Trouble]

I was there mister Death Inc, you was being naughty!

(Wheelies are big and clever but we is told they are not allowed at those track days)

[DEATH_INC.]

I think not, the thing wheelies on it's own in the first 3 gears, and the fact that over half the corner exits are first gear means it is not possible to keep the nose down. Unless I putt round like a nana, and that's really not what trackdays are for is it.
Edit; and I'm not talking about proper wheelies, just the front coming up under power

[Maha]

Sounds a bit harsh Andy, given the controledl environment of a trackday it sounds naff to be honest.
If it seemed like you were there just to wheelie around all day them maybe.

Next time, stand on the rear set and calmly wave at the track officials as you pass them by on the front straight.
Probably bad advice eh? :shifty:

[Mental Trousers]

When was that Andy?? I didn't see you last Saturday at Hampton Downs.

[DEATH_INC.]

A couple of months ago now......but I'd kinda like to do another one....but....

[Mental Trousers]

Just have a talk to Matt. He's usually Course Controller so it's up to him. But as long as you're not doing them on purpose and don't hold the wheelie for half the straight (again on purpose) there's usually no problem.

[sosman]

puke test days are good!...you can do what ever the fuck ya want

[Mental Trousers]

Shame the place sucks though eh!!

[Gremlin]

down to each group running the day really. No group wants to get a dangerous reputation re crashes, otherwise insurance companies won't cover people for those trackdays etc...

[DEATH_INC.]

puke test days are good!...you can do what ever the fuck ya want
Yep, but no insurance for those.....

[FROSTY]

Death -mate I totally 100% get where they are coming from.If wheelies are allowed then an accident is going to happen it's just a matter of time.
Remember that f##wit on his R1 pulled a bigass wheelie right through a gaggle of 250/400 riders.
Its easier to just put a total ban on them and make it clear the concequences.
That said it seems that there may be some education needed for those policing the rule.
Question to ask them would be "would you ban stroudy,bugdon,shiriffs etc during a race for doing exactly what I'm doing ?"

[DEATH_INC.]

I had a few words with the guy, but he was pretty rigid on it. Never mind, Taupo is still there :)

[FROSTY]

And theres a six hundy in my gargre. Open trackday soon??

[Tony.OK]

Shit even the track is a pc police'd place now.................fair enough that doin a wheelie through a group of others is bloody dumb, but where is the harm in a good 'ole mono when there's no one around?
Maybe track day people should make a rule that everyone must use warmers.........from what I've seen its the muppet that goes flat stick from the start on cold rubber that causes most crashes.......hell I've even seen bikes not make it out of the pit exit from that.

A contollled power stand under accel from an apex shouldn't be even considered a wheelie, most late model litre bike's will do it without trying.

Keep danger off the track...............do it on the public road hahaa my new fav slogan.

[Little Miss Trouble]

Ah, my bad, I thought you mighta been the zx-10r that was there this month pulling wheelies over half way down the straight between turns 4 & 5, and later on amongst groups of riders.

The marshalls are pretty good at telling the difference between power wheelies (ok) and someone who is intentionally tugging it up (not ok)

[DEATH_INC.]

The marshalls are pretty good at telling the difference between power wheelies (ok) and someone who is intentionally tugging it up (not ok)
This is my point, that's all that was happening, and no, they weren't cool with it.

[DEATH_INC.]

Ah, my bad, I thought you mighta been the zx-10r that was there this month pulling wheelies over half way down the straight between turns 4 & 5,
Thinking about this, are you taking about that little uphill straight before the downhill hairpin? I come outta the turn in first and accelerate up a friken hill, and barely hook second before braking.....how the hell are you supposed to keep the front down?????
(btw, not having a go at you, just friken frustrated about this)

[Little Miss Trouble]

Oops typo, that was meant to say 5 & 6

[Quasievil]

Its because they dont want people to use a trackday as a place to learn to do wheelies, simple as that.
I would follow Death all day whilst he was on one wheel .........I have done, but fucked if I will say the same for someone I dont know.

[DEATH_INC.]

Thanks Quasi, but remember I'm not talking about long sustained wheelies here, just the sort of thing that any thou (and some 600/750's) will do if you open the throttle far enough in first, second and some of them third. What the hell are they going to say if I take the old turbo there???? I guess it won't be welcome at hampton downs, that's for sure.

[DEATH_INC.]

Oops typo, that was meant to say 5 & 6

ok, but even 5-6...1st outta the hairpin = wheelie, then second= wheelie again....this gets you over 1/2 way down the straight, then even third sometimes comes up too. Was this other 10 a first gen too? ('04/'05) Look, the damn thing even wheelies in fourth coming over the hump on the front straight, I'm surprised I didn't get ripped for that.
It really puts a damper on your day and left a bad taste in my mouth after spending so much to go there.

[Little Miss Trouble]

I'm not going to go into further detail about misbehaviors of this other rider, they may be a member on here and it is not my place to say.

You need to talk to Matt (Devil) or Darren from HDRD about your concerns, after all they are the ones that call the shots

[FROSTY]

Remember that f##wit on his R1 pulled a bigass wheelie right through a gaggle of 250/400 riders.
Gee it seems some criminal type thinks he's being picked on
to quote --"go fuck urself ya dimwit, I didn't pull no bigas wheelie through 250 riders haha ur such a fool,"

[_Shrek_]

I'm not talking about proper wheelies, just the front coming up under power

aye the pc tools are creeping in, :shit: even my tank will lift in 1st & 2nd when pushing it

[Crazy Steve]

What makes me laugh Andy is, there are people over taking me on the back straight of Taupo and im showing 285kph on the clock and theres still learners on the track with us.

Ive always done wheelies at trackday and will keep doin them untill im asked to leave.

The whole frkin trackday thing should be looked into, Like Motards in group One is STUPID ! !

Crazy Steve..

[FROSTY]

What makes me laugh Andy is, there are people over taking me on the back straight of Taupo and im showing 285kph on the clock and theres still learners on the track with us.

Ive always done wheelies at trackday and will keep doin them untill im asked to leave.

The whole frkin trackday thing should be looked into, Like Motards in group One is STUPID ! !

Crazy Steve..
I'm not taking sides on this one but theres a big difference between someone like Andy popping a wheelie on the back straight of Taupo in the fast group (ie He checks noones near him first) and some knumbnuts doing the same thing in the slow group through the middle of a bunch of trackday virgins.
BUT you watch said numbnuts come up and bitch and moan (after he's been roasted for his idiocy) when he see's Andy being allowed to "do the same thing"
--Yes this EXACT senario has happened
A simple blanket ban is unfortunately the most sensible solution.

The situation Death is describing is totally different though
Given the situation in this case is as Andy described then the person concerned (marshal) needs education on how a modern ZX10 rides.
Gosh I'm not exactly fast and I was struggling to keep the front end down at a taupo track day not so long ago.

[vifferman]

So, are they going to apply this blanket ban to all? What happens when pukka race bikes without traction control are on the track? Seems dopey to me - rather than a blanket "no wheelies allowed", it should be just "dangerous riding will not be tolerated", then at least they can kick out show-offs who endanger others, but allow unintentional and obviously well-controlled wheelies.
I agree, Mr Death - what's the point of paying for a track day if you have to ride like a nana? :crazy:

[Cr1MiNaL]

I'm not taking sides on this one but theres a big difference between someone like Andy popping a wheelie on the back straight of Taupo in the fast group (ie He checks noones near him first) and some knumbnuts doing the same thing in the slow group through the middle of a bunch of trackday virgins.
BUT you watch said numbnuts come up and bitch and moan (after he's been roasted for his idiocy) when he see's Andy being allowed to "do the same thing"
--Yes this EXACT senario has happened
A simple blanket ban is unfortunately the most sensible solution.

The situation Death is describing is totally different though
Given the situation in this case is as Andy described then the person concerned (marshal) needs education on how a modern ZX10 rides.
Gosh I'm not exactly fast and I was struggling to keep the front end down at a taupo track day not so long ago.

What you numnuts don't realise is that insurance companies come to these track days and monitor how the day is run. They hold the right to pull the plug on any company holding these track days if they see wheelies etc. Let's see how many people cry about it when you don't have track day insurance anymore. If you would like to debate sensibly for a change - approach an insurance company and ask them if they will allow wheelies and and give them the very argument you just made ... haha.

Darrin and the team at HDRD obviously recognise this. I have marshaled about 15 times for them and never has a rider been pulled where not deserved. We've got the likes of Sloan, Hayden and Robbie amongst others battling it out testing their setups and sure they wheelie because they can't help it - but never have thy been done or even warned when I was around. It's pretty obvious to most marshals what consists an unintentional wheelie and what isin't. Furthermore, a marshals call generally needs to be backed by another and yet we give it another couple of laps before course control actually issues orders to red flag a rider. They run one of the best most professional set ups I have even seen. Yet again your brilliance in understanding and evaluating a situation you weren't present for astounds me. Keep it up Frosty ! You da man!

[White trash]

The whole thing's as gay as a Honda racer winning aqt the streets, shit just aint right.

I quite like going to test days in my car, I'm allowed to drift 'till my heart's content. At the drags, I get the chance to win something for doing big fat burnouts as long as I want.

Guess bike riding's just for suckers now. Good luck with your crusade fella, you well know my thoughts on it, but I'm pretty sure you're fucked and things will only get tougher.

[puddy]

puke test days are good!...you can do what ever the fuck ya want

And you pull MINT wheelies there!:shifty: I'm guessing it was you there two weeks ago with Danger Dave.

[Devil]

Andy, I think that may have been one of the two days that I haven't been running course control for HDRD.
Perhaps whoever was on that day was a bit harsh, perhaps not. I wouldn't know but as mentioned earlier, we do make the distinction between power wheelies and taking the piss. As you say, it's hard work keeping the front down out of those corners on a big bike.

For example, I ask the marshals to follow a bike round for me on the radio if it has been reported as wheelieing so that we can gauge whether it's just power, or if they're intentionally holding it up. Sometimes its real hard to tell!

You're most welcome at Hampton Downs Ride Days, just do what you can to keep the front down. Stroud, Bugden, Shirrifs etc all ride within the rules.

Remember, if you're lifting the front everywhere, you're just wasting power. If you want a quick lap it's in your best interests to keep the front down.

[Quasievil]

For example, I ask the marshals to follow a bike round for me on the radio if it has been reported as wheelieing so that we can gauge whether it's just power, or if they're intentionally holding it up. Sometimes its real hard to tell!



Oh, so power wheelies are okay, I was deliberately keeping the front down so I didnt break the rules :innocent:

[DEATH_INC.]

What you numnuts don't realise is that insurance companies come to these track days and monitor how the day is run. They hold the right to pull the plug on any company holding these track days if they see wheelies etc. Let's see how many people cry about it when you don't have track day insurance anymore. If you would like to debate sensibly for a change - approach an insurance company and ask them if they will allow wheelies and and give them the very argument you just made ... haha.

Darrin and the team at HDRD obviously recognise this. I have marshaled about 15 times for them and never has a rider been pulled where not deserved. We've got the likes of Sloan, Hayden and Robbie amongst others battling it out testing their setups and sure they wheelie because they can't help it - but never have thy been done or even warned when I was around. It's pretty obvious to most marshals what consists an unintentional wheelie and what isin't. Furthermore, a marshals call generally needs to be backed by another and yet we give it another couple of laps before course control actually issues orders to red flag a rider. They run one of the best most professional set ups I have even seen. Yet again your brilliance in understanding and evaluating a situation you weren't present for astounds me. Keep it up Frosty ! You da man!

I don't go to trackdays to do wheelies, they can be done anywhere, anytime blah blah. Why the hell would I waste $200 to do that?
You know pretty well that if I was doing proper wheelies it'd be pretty obvious.
Your point about the insurance is well taken, and I do try to abide by the rules to the best of my limited abilities.

[FROSTY]

What you numnuts don't realise is that insurance companies come to these track days and monitor how the day is run. They hold the right to pull the plug on any company holding these track days if they see wheelies etc. Let's see how many people cry about it when you don't have track day insurance anymore. If you would like to debate sensibly for a change - approach an insurance company and ask them if they will allow wheelies and and give them the very argument you just made ... haha.

Darrin and the team at HDRD obviously recognise this. I have marshaled about 15 times for them and never has a rider been pulled where not deserved. We've got the likes of Sloan, Hayden and Robbie amongst others battling it out testing their setups and sure they wheelie because they can't help it - but never have thy been done or even warned when I was around. It's pretty obvious to most marshals what consists an unintentional wheelie and what isin't. Furthermore, a marshals call generally needs to be backed by another and yet we give it another couple of laps before course control actually issues orders to red flag a rider. They run one of the best most professional set ups I have even seen. Yet again your brilliance in understanding and evaluating a situation you weren't present for astounds me. Keep it up Frosty ! You da man!
Learn to read you fuckwit.
When you were still swaddling on your mammas Knee I was RUNNING trackdays.
For the record the KB trackdays were the FIRST to be cleared by the insurance companies for full insurance cover.
Death Inc was instrumental in ensuring that trackdays as you know them actually happened in NZ at all.
We were the first to put a blanket ban on wheelies at trackdays because of said whineing R1 riders antics.
So I think when Andy says its an accidental power stand out of corners then thats what it is.
Clearly you havent watched the riders you are quoting on an actual raceday or timed practice because if you had you would not be saying they had no trouble keeping the front down at HD

[Cr1MiNaL]

Learn to read you fuckwit.
When you were still swaddling on your mammas Knee I was RUNNING trackdays.
For the record the KB trackdays were the FIRST to be cleared by the insurance companies for full insurance cover.
Death Inc was instrumental in ensuring that trackdays as you know them actually happened in NZ at all.
We were the first to put a blanket ban on wheelies at trackdays because of said whineing R1 riders antics.
So I think when Andy says its an accidental power stand out of corners then thats what it is.
Clearly you havent watched the riders you are quoting on an actual raceday or timed practice because if you had you would not be saying they had no trouble keeping the front down at HD

I know what your saying. Sure you may be more experienced and know everything there is to know about bikes and I'm just a noob with a big mouth. And I also know Andy can well ride a bike and I wudn't be foolish enough to call his popping the front exiting a corner a wheelie - given his control on one wheel. I just think personally - your a stool and that was the point of my post.

Besides oh mighty Frosty, were talking "track-day" here as opposed to "race-day" or "timed practice". For someone who "runs" trackdays since before I was bouncing on my mommas knees, you don't really know what you are talking about do you.....AS you were.

[Quasievil]

:jerry::jerry::jerry::jerry:

[FROSTY]

I know what your saying. Sure you may be more experienced and know everything there is to know about bikes and I'm just a noob with a big mouth. And I also know Andy can well ride a bike and I wudn't be foolish enough to call his popping the front exiting a corner a wheelie - given his control on one wheel. I just think personally - your a stool and that was the point of my post.

Besides oh mighty Frosty, were talking "track-day" here as opposed to "race-day" or "timed practice". For someone who "runs" trackdays since before I was bouncing on my mommas knees, you don't really know what you are talking about do you.....AS you were.
The more you talk the more of an idiot you look like. So keep talking and you'll have the other white boot in your mouth soon enough.
Yep you are right. Andy does indeed know apropriate time and place to pull a wheelie. Ain't it a pity other gutless wonders don't have the same self control.

[Quasievil]

Yep you are right. Andy does indeed know apropriate time and place to pull a wheelie.

Yeah striaghts preferably with a small hump at the start.