Your ideas please

[Foxzee]

Hi all,

As most of you will be aware Round 4 is the one day long track. We have a few options for the race format for the day however would like to get your feedback on what you would like to see.

[Drew]

A wet T-shirt competition!

10 minute qualifying, a 10 lap race and a 5 lap race.

[lukemillar]

Hi all,

As most of you will be aware Round 4 is the one day long track. We have a few options for the race format for the day however would like to get your feedback on what you would like to see.


Clear skies and sun! ;)

Personally, I'd rather have 1x practice/qualify and 2x longer races rather than 3x shorter ones.

[White trash]

A wet T-shirt competition!

+1 <tenchars/>

[Shaun]

I would like to see some one set up with a roaming Microphone, that walk around the pits, and do little LIVE interviews with riders for the Public to here.

You guys would NEED TO INSTRUCT Ray to work in with this plan, as he believes he is GOD

Ray is NO GOOD and Boring with his dribble, incorrect names and machine brands, he is DONE!

[gixerracer]

I would like to see some one set up with a roaming Microphone, that walk around the pits, and do little LIVE interviews with riders for the Public to here.

You guys would NEED TO INSTRUCT Ray to work in with this plan, as he believes he is GOD

Ray is NO GOOD and Boring with his dribble, incorrect names and machine brands, he is DONE!

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLO LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh ::laugh::laugh::jerry::jerry::jerry::jerry::jerry: :jerry::jerry::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:: laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::l augh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::la ugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:
Best comment on KB in a long time

[discodan]

The way I see it, short races have pros and cons.

Pros:
- Exciting for the spectators
- Shorter waits between races for competitors

Cons:
- Difficult to make up for bad qualifying / race start
- Riders could potentially take more risks in such a short race
- More time spent forming up the grid etc

As a rider, I would also prefer to have longer races that test your concentration and make you ride smarter... But spectators can get bored when there isn't much passing and everyone is just waiting for the laps to tick down.

Perhaps one short and one long race is the answer? It would be interesting to see what the riders think - I must admit that 3 races in one day went incredibly smoothly at round 3 so credit to the club for making it happen.

[CHOPPA]

Dont put superbikes last on the menu!!

I think 2 longer races would be good.

Do the races on a time limit though, no one want to wait 30 mins for the streetstock to do 10 laps.

Make it 2 20min races plus 1 lap that way you can plan your time better. Dont pick bikes up after every race unless someone is hurt maybe every second or third race pick up a few or pick them up if someone is unlucky enough to need an ambo.

If 3 year olds can read a board at MX to say check helmet and in our case back protector im sure we can take some responsibility and check out own bloody helmet

[cowboyz]

i like the idea of a 20 min race + 1 lap.. means I have to sit around on the outfield for 18 mins though..................

First time out on long track ever so that should be interesting.. overall I think R3 went awesome so more of the same really. 2 races on the long track would be more realistic I would think.

[Ronin]

Dont put superbikes last on the menu!!

I think 2 longer races would be good.

Do the races on a time limit though, no one want to wait 30 mins for the streetstock to do 10 laps.

Make it 2 20min races plus 1 lap that way you can plan your time better. Dont pick bikes up after every race unless someone is hurt maybe every second or third race pick up a few or pick them up if someone is unlucky enough to need an ambo.

If 3 year olds can read a board at MX to say check helmet and in our case back protector im sure we can take some responsibility and check out own bloody helmet

So you would be happy to be left out there when you bin?

[cowboyz]

So you would be happy to be left out there when you bin?

i know there are safety procedures and stuff. but why does the track have to be completely cleared before sending out recovery? surely bikes on the other side of the track are safe from a recovery vehicle following the field on the warm down lap?

[jellywrestler]

A wet T-shirt competition!

pole dancing too

[Str8 Jacket]

Don't penalise the Streetstockers just cause everyone else hates them. Afterall they do have the FULLEST grids!! :yes:

[KS34]

Don't penalise the Streetstockers just cause everyone else hates them. Afterall they do have the FULLEST grids!! :yes:

Not penalising my dear, if its a timed race (20min) everyone gets the same track time even more for streetstock cause that last lap will take longer.:yes:

[Mental Trousers]

A wet T-shirt competition!

Would you win though?

Timed races rock.

Two longer races are better (besides everyone gets to have a sleep down the straights eh ...... )

[Str8 Jacket]

Not penalising my dear, if its a timed race (20min) everyone gets the same track time even more for streetstock cause that last lap will take longer.:yes:

Sorry, wasn't talking about the tmed racing , I thnk that is a good idea! I mean street stock is often dropped or laps shortened when time is short... ;)

[Drew]

Haven't made up my mind on this timed races lark. I'd get fewer laps but the way I rode last round that might just save me from being lapped.

I'll give two minutes away from each race happily, for a wet T-shirt comp at lunch time though. Just so it looks like I'm making some effort.

No Shane, you'd smoke me in that!

[fossil]

I would like to see some one set up with a roaming Microphone, that walk around the pits, and do little LIVE interviews with riders for the Public to here.

You guys would NEED TO INSTRUCT Ray to work in with this plan, as he believes he is GOD

Ray is NO GOOD and Boring with his dribble, incorrect names and machine brands, he is DONE!

Bloody hell Shaun I am impressed and never a truer word said, this is after all the 21st century. Maybe one of Ray's "nephews" could do it? No not that, I mean do roving interviews.

[jellywrestler]

I would like to see some one set up with a roaming Microphone, that walk around the pits, and do little LIVE interviews with riders for the Public to here.

You guys would NEED TO INSTRUCT Ray to work in with this plan, as he believes he is GOD

Ray is NO GOOD and Boring with his dribble, incorrect names and machine brands, he is DONE!

Fairs fair on the man, As someone who manages other riders and also have this opinion of Ray Whitham how often have you made a point of sending your riders up to the box for an interview?
The stairs work both ways Shaun.
I have been up in that position and it's not any easy task and I welcome anyone to come and tell their story. It doesn't matter how good any commentator is it's good to hear a different voice.

[Tony.OK]

Haven't made up my mind on this timed races lark. I'd get fewer laps but the way I rode last round that might just save me from being lapped.



Timed races sound a whole heap better than a 5 lapper on the short track too.......6 whole minutes of track time seemed very skimpy last round, especially given qual was 10 min.
18 min for 3 races hardly makes F1 worth the effort IMO.......(but then I am known to be a lazy bastard)........easy to see why F2/3 are so popular aye.

[Norton54]

I like the idea of two long races by time, or one long and one short if we're running out of time at the end of the day, gives everyone equal time on track. I also like the changing race order so everyone gets to go first, last and in between, that way we all take turns waiting to the end of the day for the final race.

[Kickaha]

Are you allowed to run reverse circuit at Manfeild?

[Drew]

Are you allowed to run reverse circuit at Manfeild?

Not anymore bro. Guy died on the start line a few years ago when the red flag rule was to come back round and grid up, couple riders hadn't seen the flag or the bikes stopped on the straight...Fuckin BANG. Hasn't been done since.

[Dogboy900]

I am also in favour of two 20 min races. I think trying to fit in 3 races for all the classes on the long track is a little unrealistic.
It is a little unfair when some classes get time cut.

Organisation and picking up of crashed bikes has been done well for the last couple of rounds so i think stick to whats working :)

[CHOPPA]

If I crash and have to stay on the infield and watch the next race id be happy with that, give me time to figure out the best excuse maybe let the tyre down or something.

Are you guys gonna mix around the race order like promised?

[Ronin]

Not anymore bro. Guy died on the start line a few years ago when the red flag rule was to come back round and grid up, couple riders hadn't seen the flag or the bikes stopped on the straight...Fuckin BANG. Hasn't been done since.

Or... It could be the ripple strips :yes:

[Ivan]

Or... It could be the ripple strips :yes:

Nah I was on the commitee at the time and remember manfield has now banned it

But also that was one problem with Manfield reversed is the decreasing radius corners wide entry tight exit I hated reversed circuit

[Shaun]

Fairs fair on the man, As someone who manages other riders and also have this opinion of Ray Whitham how often have you made a point of sending your riders up to the box for an interview?
The stairs work both ways Shaun.
I have been up in that position and it's not any easy task and I welcome anyone to come and tell their story. It doesn't matter how good any commentator is it's good to hear a different voice.



Yes, even that has been tried, and Ray forgot the riders name during the Interview, as well as saying he was on a different brand bike than what he was riding.

I APOLOGISED to the SPONSORS for him

His roll is VERY Important for the riders and sponsors, and he IS NOT doing it well at all.

This is NOT just a club scene race meeting, it is part of some riders 12 months of planning, and things like miss naming brands etc does NOT help with obtaining and keeping sponsors happy

[Drew]

But also that was one problem with Manfield reversed is the decreasing radius corners wide entry tight exit I hated reversed circuit

Aye, me and everyone I know love running Manfield backwards. I would wager a supersport bike could lap it quicker than a super bike too. Johan Brunns was talking about having done the long track backwards too, that'd be soooooo mint.

[Marknz]

Not anymore bro. Guy died on the start line a few years ago when the red flag rule was to come back round and grid up, couple riders hadn't seen the flag or the bikes stopped on the straight...Fuckin BANG. Hasn't been done since.

Yep, remember it well. That was a big suck day for sure.

I'm happy running my real slow times within whatever programme the club comes up with. However, it's not clear to me why can't we get a meeting running on time from the get go? When was the last time a riders breifing was held at the advertised time, and therefore we were on track at the right time? I know Rd3 ran really well and all classes got all their races in to the schedule, but.... i don't know, i've not tried to run a meeting so don't know the in's & out's.

[MSTRS]

As a non-racer (marshal), I'd like to see timed races as well.
With the mix of classes within each race category, the longer the time, though, can lead to anxious moments with lapping, so can I suggest the following...

10 mins scrub/qualifying
Race 1 15 mins
Lunch
Race 2 15 mins
Race 3 could extend to 20 mins, if the day has gone smooth.

Bike pickup every other race, or whilst ambos are out

[wharfy]

I think the idea of timed races ( for timid racers - like me ) has some merit.
Two longer races provides more track time (less "overhead" on warm up, griding up, return after chequered flag etc.)
I look forward to being lapped by Choppa and Scketchy etc. :)

At < 2 min per lap for the fast guys thats approx 11 laps for F1 & F2 and maybe 7 or 8 for some of the slower classes.

So when 20 min is up flag marshal waits for lead bike to come onto start/finish straight then give them the white flag and everyone is on the last lap ?

Sound reasonable to me :niceone:

[CHOPPA]

As a non-racer (marshal), I'd like to see timed races as well.
With the mix of classes within each race category, the longer the time, though, can lead to anxious moments with lapping, so can I suggest the following...

10 mins scrub/qualifying
Race 1 15 mins
Lunch
Race 2 15 mins
Race 3 could extend to 20 mins, if the day has gone smooth.

Bike pickup every other race, or whilst ambos are out

3 15min races would be 3x more racing then we got last round so that would be plenty. If they were gonna do 3 races have the last race 10mins but put the F2 or F3 last and put classes then cant cross enter near the start like streetstock and F1 so we have a fair shot at 3 races instead of us doing 2 and the other guys doing 5!

[Str8 Jacket]

If they were gonna do 3 races have the last race 10mins but put the F2 or F3 last and put classes then cant cross enter near the start like streetstock and F1 so we have a fair shot at 3 races instead of us doing 2 and the other guys doing 5!

Now that's a good idea! :yes:

[Ivan]

there is also a problem of facing walls etc If I can remember rightly have to admit it was a few years back now and my mind was abit a woll during that time but I specifaclly remember Manfield saying it will never be reversed again

[Ronin]

3 15min races would be 3x more racing then we got last round so that would be plenty. If they were gonna do 3 races have the last race 10mins but put the F2 or F3 last and put classes then cant cross enter near the start like streetstock and F1 so we have a fair shot at 3 races instead of us doing 2 and the other guys doing 5!

Remember you have to deal with a 4:30 cut off for racing.

6 classes @ 15 min = 90 mins to get all classes through with one race each. Thats 270 minutes of race time at 3 races each.

Clock time so far... 4.5 hours

Add to that 6 classes scrub in at 10 minutes = 1 hour

Clock time 5.5 hours

Add 5 minutes to each class race for warm up/down track exit and times that by 3.

Clock time 6.95 hours

Lunch 30 minutes

7.45 hours... call it 8

Thats not allowing for Crash/ Ambo/ Recovery/Red flag/ Riders who can't be assed getting to the grid on time.

Thats the simple version of the process for working out the timing for the meeting and there is a great deal missing. The first time I sat through it my head hurt.

Oh and I forgot when working the above out that it was long track so the warm up figure is waaaaaay out.



NOTE: The above is me showing a simple example of how the race timings can be figured and have nothing to do with the format of the next meeting nor the opinion of The Vic Club who do such a great job working it all out.

Honestly, if you ever have a chance to see what goes on in the back ground you would have a new appreciation for it all.

[Deano]

Bike pickup every other race, or whilst ambos are out

The only issue with that is people who have cross entered and might miss out on their 'second' class.

[MSTRS]

The only issue with that is people who have cross entered and might miss out on their 'second' class.

Um.... don't crash in your first race? :innocent:

[cowboyz]

would there be a big objection to using the short track to warm up to grid? How much time would that save?

[MSTRS]

would there be a big objection to using the short track to warm up to grid? How much time would that save?

Using the slip road wouldn't be enough warmup time. And using the 'standard' track could prove confusing for some. We don't want convergence issues over the back. Or anywhere, for that matter.

[CHOPPA]

there is also a problem of facing walls etc If I can remember rightly have to admit it was a few years back now and my mind was abit a woll during that time but I specifaclly remember Manfield saying it will never be reversed again

The long track is bloody dangerous imo when you come back on to normal track if you crash you will be straight into the wall!!


Remember you have to deal with a 4:30 cut off for racing.

6 classes @ 15 min = 90 mins to get all classes through with one race each. Thats 270 minutes of race time at 3 races each.

Clock time so far... 4.5 hours

Add to that 6 classes scrub in at 10 minutes = 1 hour

Clock time 5.5 hours

Add 5 minutes to each class race for warm up/down track exit and times that by 3.

Clock time 6.95 hours

Lunch 30 minutes

7.45 hours... call it 8

Thats not allowing for Crash/ Ambo/ Recovery/Red flag/ Riders who can't be assed getting to the grid on time.

Thats the simple version of the process for working out the timing for the meeting and there is a great deal missing. The first time I sat through it my head hurt.

Oh and I forgot when working the above out that it was long track so the warm up figure is waaaaaay out.



NOTE: The above is me showing a simple example of how the race timings can be figured and have nothing to do with the format of the next meeting nor the opinion of The Vic Club who do such a great job working it all out.

Honestly, if you ever have a chance to see what goes on in the back ground you would have a new appreciation for it all.

Good call, 2x 20min sessions would be a good test of endurance

[CHOPPA]

What if we combine F2 and F1? and just say no cross entry for this round

[MSTRS]

Remember you have to deal with a 4:30 cut off for racing.


I think (prolly wrong) that can extend to 5pm. But in winter, that is dangerous due to bad light.
I took a stab at times, without adding it all up. You are right, in so far as at the end of the day some miss out.
The idea is always? to have each rider get 4 sessions (Qual, Race 1, 2, 3) - forgetting for a moment that some cross-enter - so maybe 15 min races are too long. Perhaps 10 mins would be more realistic?

[Ronin]

I think (prolly wrong) that can extend to 5pm. But in winter, that is dangerous due to bad light.
I took a stab at times, without adding it all up. You are right, in so far as at the end of the day some miss out.
The idea is always? to have each rider get 4 sessions (Qual, Race 1, 2, 3) - forgetting for a moment that some cross-enter - so maybe 15 min races are too long. Perhaps 10 mins would be more realistic?

Pretty certain that no matter which way you dice it 4 sessions at a one day on the long track is a big ask.

Best Format I can think of is 1 enduro of say 20ish and then a 10 minute sprint :yes:

That way we are only staging the bikes twice on the grid so cuts down dramaticly on the associated race time if you know what I mean.

[CHOPPA]

I think (prolly wrong) that can extend to 5pm. But in winter, that is dangerous due to bad light.
I took a stab at times, without adding it all up. You are right, in so far as at the end of the day some miss out.
The idea is always? to have each rider get 4 sessions (Qual, Race 1, 2, 3) - forgetting for a moment that some cross-enter - so maybe 15 min races are too long. Perhaps 10 mins would be more realistic?

Im sure people would be happier to have 2 races even at 15mins then have 2 races at 10mins because there wasnt enough time for the last race

[froggyfrenchman]

I have never done a round of the winter series, but agree with the theory of setting the race order so that if time gets short, Street Stock, Clubbies and F1 still get their full track time. Its frustrating enough not being able to cross enter, and becomes a bit of a sore spot when you get one full length race and one very short one while your mates on F3/F2 bikes get 4 or 5 full length races in.
Top points to all you guys and gals that put in the hard yards in organising and marshaling these events. Cheers for your efforts.

[Ivan]

Using the slip road wouldn't be enough warmup time. And using the 'standard' track could prove confusing for some. We don't want convergence issues over the back. Or anywhere, for that matter.

Weused to do this move the cones aside warm up lap use normal circuit and race on the full circuit its not that confusing if you get confused with that you shouldnt be riding

[MSTRS]

There's no manned marshal point at the turn after Higgins.
If Quaddie can move the cones, I guess it'd work.
Or just trust that the riders don't cock it up. Unfortunately, all it takes is one.

[Ivan]

There's no manned marshal point at the turn after Higgins.
If Quaddie can move the cones, I guess it'd work.
Or just trust that the riders don't cock it up. Unfortunately, all it takes is one.

Also do not get me wrong I am not criticising just suggesting on how we used to run it.

It was very quick and effective as the long circuit adds about 40 seconds on doesnt sound much but add that up over the day.

Also could we have Final call as Final call as at the momment the Final Call is made and you still sit on the grid for sometime the FInal call should be as the gates are due to be open.

[Ronin]

Also could we have Final call as Final call as at the momment the Final Call is made and you still sit on the grid for sometime the FInal call should be as the gates are due to be open.

Do that and half of you will sit on the grid with your tyres cooling down while others are still putting their leathers on. Dummy grid is the buffer (which some still can't get to on time)

[Drew]

Do that and half of you will sit on the grid with your tyres cooling down while others are still putting their leathers on. Dummy grid is the buffer (which some still can't get to on time)Be better if CJ would just say final call, not switch back and fourth between "third call", and "final call". Third call sounds like first call half the time.

[ajturbo]

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Best comment on KB in a long time


+1.....................

[Ivan]

Do that and half of you will sit on the grid with your tyres cooling down while others are still putting their leathers on. Dummy grid is the buffer (which some still can't get to on time)

1st call should be you are almost ready to go out start making your way down
2nd call should be gates are near opening be here
final call should be GATES ARE OPENING NOW

As at the momment final call we are waiting and there are others who are sitting there since 2nd call some even on 1st call and there tires have lost most of there heat and as we run such short distance races our tires dont get up to optimum temperature and you do see alot of crashes due to cold tires

Has anyone noticed the most crashes are in the left handers as we only have 2 it does make our tires colder any way on this side but if we have been stuck on the dummy grid for a long time then the left hand side is almost lethal there will be others who will agree with me

As stated I am not being a cock and having a cry

It was asked for our ideas that is my idea.

[ajturbo]

i reckon we have an all-in for 35min... no transponders... and the winner would be the one who can prove they were in front... bourbon will be expected at any hearing/disputes... the more bourbon, the the bigger the chance of you winning....:Punk::shifty:


Ivan.... thanks for this...i think we have some positive things to talk about with the other here... ta man

[Shaun]

[QUOTE=CHOPPA;1129821952]The long track is bloody dangerous imo when you come back on to normal track if you crash you will be straight into the wall!!



100% agree with this Choppa, and have bought it up a few times, they need the Air fence from the Wanganui club to very safely run the long track

Just can the long track, makes for an easier day to run time wise also

[CHOPPA]

[QUOTE=CHOPPA;1129821952]The long track is bloody dangerous imo when you come back on to normal track if you crash you will be straight into the wall!!



100% agree with this Choppa, and have bought it up a few times, they need the Air fence from the Wanganui club to very safely run the long track

Just can the long track, makes for an easier day to run time wise also

Yeah the long track is terrible for spectators, I dont really care to run it cause I just want to practice the national track and it wastes lots of time

[Ronin]

1st call should be you are almost ready to go out start making your way down
2nd call should be gates are near opening be here
final call should be GATES ARE OPENING NOW

As at the momment final call we are waiting and there are others who are sitting there since 2nd call some even on 1st call and there tires have lost most of there heat and as we run such short distance races our tires dont get up to optimum temperature and you do see alot of crashes due to cold tires

Has anyone noticed the most crashes are in the left handers as we only have 2 it does make our tires colder any way on this side but if we have been stuck on the dummy grid for a long time then the left hand side is almost lethal there will be others who will agree with me

As stated I am not being a cock and having a cry

It was asked for our ideas that is my idea.

Ta for that Ivan. I don't think your being a cock at all and it's great that you are posting your ideas. They do all get discussed in the back ground.

[Biggles08]

I think working out how many laps each class should race based on time on the track is a good idea BUT NOT A RACE BASED SOLELY ON TIME. In other words, as a racer I would like to know before the race how many laps I have to formulate some sort of attack plan while on the track. I didn't like R2 (I think) where it was only based on time and we had to work out how many laps that was going to be...spent half my time watching for the white flag....then I got shown it twice in one race!!!

Its not that hard to work out laps each class should run before the meeting based on how long that class takes to do a lap.

Personally I would rather x2 longer races in each class as opposed to x3 shorter races...this helps improve race craft as you have more time to play on the track with your competition.

[MSTRS]

Just can the long track, makes for an easier day to run time wise also

Better for everyone, actually. Never enough marshals, so they're thin on that section. And flag calls at Start/Finish become much harder, because the lead bikes go out of sight and are really hard to pick up again. Which can (and did last time it was used?) lead to cockups. Chews up a lot of time with crash recovery too.
Not to mention Drew's liking for the other side of the tyres....:shifty:

[CHOPPA]

Better for everyone, actually. Never enough marshals, so they're thin on that section. And flag calls at Start/Finish become much harder, because the lead bikes go out of sight and are really hard to pick up again. Which can (and did last time it was used?) lead to cockups. Chews up a lot of time with crash recovery too.
Not to mention Drew's liking for the other side of the tyres....:shifty:

More expensive to hire as well? Just flag it save the hassle and run the short track :)

[Shaun]

More expensive to hire as well? Just flag it save the hassle and run the short track :)



Again I agree with you dude, this is getting sick

[discodan]

Keep the long track. It may be a bit rough but the short track gets pretty dull on smaller bikes after a while.

[Ivan]

Again I agree with you dude, this is getting sick

I do have to admit that last round there I was shitting myself coming back onto the old circuit just for the fact if you lost it there theres nothing between you and a concrete wall

As said a air fence would be brilliant we havent had any crashes there that I know of but you dont want your first one to be a bad one

[slowpoke]

Glad I can't make it so I can sort of think about it dispassionately.

As said previously that left hander back onto the old track is the first time I noticed that blardy concrete wall, it was a fairly sobering realisation at at the time.

As far as race format you have to make a decision about who you are going to appeal to: spectators or riders. Spectators are bored shitless by longer races, whereas riders seem to prefer them. We simply don't have the depth of field to support a close longer race, the field stretches out and it's just a case of waiting for someone to fall off or the race to finish to finalise the finishing order.

And the race order should at least favour those who can't cross enter. A lousy $20 to sit on the same grid as someone who's paid $100 shouldn't gain you equal weight and the race order should not be formated in favour of cross entrants. For $20 you should be grateful of the chance to enter another class, not cry foul because you are finding that second class a lil' difficult.

Looking at the last round, I would have got 15 odd laps (and they are odd when I'm riding) for over a hundy $$$. It makes it kinda hard to justify when I can do a track/test day for a similar amount and get half a dozen sessions of doing that amount in every single session. I wasn't home at the time but if I was I would have been a non-starter as a result, and that's another hundy less in the pocket of Vic Club. I know of at least two other entrants who didn't show because of exactly that reason.

Some basic rejigging is required, because as it stands I'd rather save my pennies and put them towards National/Street meetings/travel where I get better value for my money.

[scracha]

As said previously that left hander back onto the old track is the first time I noticed that blardy concrete wall, it was a fairly sobering realisation at at the time.

Think we all agree on that. Watched Johnny Wanger smack into it pretty hard. At the very least it needs a few metres of kiitty litter.



As far as race format you have to make a decision about who you are going to appeal to: spectators or riders. Spectators are bored shitless by longer races, whereas riders seem to prefer them. We simply don't have the depth of field to support a close longer race, the

I enjoy both, however it should be said that most of the positions are decided by about lap 4.

Realistically, spectators are not worth considering as our primary focus (free entry and there's still only a handful of them*). Our own enjoyment and industry/sponsors should be our focus. For that we need video coverage, photographers, rider profiles and good write-ups in the press (not just motorcycle magazines either).



Some basic rejigging is required, because as it stands I'd rather save my pennies and put them towards National/Street meetings/travel where I get better value for my money.
That's a bit harsh. Maybe it's just me but 3 x 5 laps RACING is much better than going round in circles all day on a track day.

Street meeting good value for money....were you at Paeroa or Wanganui ?

A few folk have mentioned combining F1 and F2 and giving them more races. Not sure why this hasn't been tried at club level. Would certainly give guys like Chopper a fuck load more tracktime and incentive to get guys like Stroudy and Shirrifs at more than just the last couple of rounds.

Lunchtime:
Prize giving (previous round)
Raffle(s)
Slowish Pillion laps by pre-selected "sensible" riders (subject to gear, indemnity form....)...slow to us but would scare bejeezus out of 90% of spectators.
Vote for best photo (previous round) etc. that sort of shit would be good.
Invite go cart club or summit...$hit...I dunno?


Moan at track hire peeps to get decent food. Moan at track hire peeps to get the cars to fuck on the previous days test day (from purely economic point of view it makes no sense to have 20 bikes waiting on 1 or 2 bloody cars). I'm sure they'd tell me to fuck off if I was the only bike the day prior to a car event.

*that's not to say there's not a fuck load more we could do for them.

[Ivan]

we used to have go carts they could fly impressive lap times aye

[Kickaha]

A few folk have mentioned combining F1 and F2 and giving them more races. Not sure why this hasn't been tried at club level.

Down here they run "senior class" which is basically F1 and F2 together


we used to have go carts they could fly impressive lap times aye

Bike guys generally don't like the Karts as they make the bikes look a bit slow

[Biggles08]

Sidecar guys generally don't like the Karts as they make the sidecars look a bit slow
there fixed it for you Kickaha....thank me later :yes:

[White trash]

I think working out how many laps each class should race based on time on the track is a good idea BUT NOT A RACE BASED SOLELY ON TIME. In other words, as a racer I would like to know before the race how many laps I have to formulate some sort of attack plan while on the track. I didn't like R2 (I think) where it was only based on time and we had to work out how many laps that was going to be...spent half my time watching for the white flag....then I got shown it twice in one race!!!

Its not that hard to work out laps each class should run before the meeting based on how long that class takes to do a lap.

Personally I would rather x2 longer races in each class as opposed to x3 shorter races...this helps improve race craft as you have more time to play on the track with your competition.

You can't calculate how many laps you can do at 1:10 per lap in ten minutes?

[Biggles08]

You can't calculate how many laps you can do at 1:10 per lap in ten minutes?
nope...dumb-arse I am:innocent:

the point is, without a fixed lap count things like being shown the white flag twice can happen....comprehendo?

[MSTRS]

the point is, without a fixed lap count things like being shown the white flag twice can happen....comprehendo?

Nah! The Start/Finish guys show you the white to tell you that you need to up the pace to get a better placing. In your case, you probably didn't up the pace enough for their liking, so they thought they'd give you a second chance...
:innocent:

[wharfy]

Down here they run "senior class" which is basically F1 and F2 together


The Winter series on more than one occasion last year was oversubscribed (we are only allowed 35 on the grid)
in the F2 class people who didn't qualify got to race in clubman's.

The F1 class was also oversubscribed a couple of times, but no "superbikes" were bumped those that cross entered and didn't qualify got their $20 back (I believe).

I must say I enjoyed the bracket racing at the Sound of Thunder - where riders are grouped by lap time (a, b or c).

[flame]

Cheers for the chance for us to have a say Dee :)
Just my 2c worth. Or 1c as some may see it since Im back to being a 'newby' racer LOL....

Rather do the short track personally.
A) Less stress for the hard working organisers...
B) long track has that hidious concrete wall coming back into the sweeper which i believe is rediculously dangerous.....
C) we only ever get to practice on the 'short track'.....
D) Potentially takes too much time to get the crash crew/marshalls in and out etc.
E) And its not the Nats track.

I know many people love the long track, but we also LOVE track time. Short track means potentially more ride time :)

oh year........and BRING IN A BEARS CLASS.......gotta give them Euro jockey F1 boys a bit more time to entertain us ;)

[Drew]

Only running the short track means an entire series on the same seven corner though. The long track mixes it up.

It does mean fewer starts, but that can also mean more seat time because of less gridding up.

It's only been recent times that I've heard any of this safety talk about where the back circuit rejoins the back straight, and I dont see the issue. Exiting the sweeper onto the front straight is far more dangerous given the white lines painted on the track, the speed, and if it does go tits up you're just as likely gonna hit the end of a wall rather than hitting a flat surface at quite a steep angle, like you would where the tracks meet.

And the long track has a nice soft landing if you're skilled enough to convert your bike into the cow paddock.

[Kickaha]

there fixed it for you Kickaha....thank me later :yes:

They actually make every class look slow



But also that was one problem with Manfield reversed is the decreasing radius corners wide entry tight exit

Best you don't ever come to Levels then



I dont really care to run it cause I just want to practice the national track and it wastes lots of time



E) And its not the Nats track.

I would think the majority of riders at these rounds wouldn't race Nationals anyway



the point is, without a fixed lap count things like being shown the white flag twice can happen....comprehendo?

Happened at least twice during the nationals this year, pretty sure they run a fixed lap count :bleh:



I know many people love the long track, but we also LOVE track time. Short track means potentially more ride time :)

I would have thought even with doing less laps the amount of actual track time would work out the same because of doing longer laps?

Personally I think you're damn lucky you have the option of running the long track and having a bit of variation at different rounds instead of the same track each time

[Drew]

there fixed it for you Kickaha....thank me later :yes:Have a look at the 250 times round Manfield mate. You'd get lapped if they ran a full length nats race.

[Biggles08]

Have a look at the 250 times round Manfield mate. You'd get lapped if they ran a full length nats race.

I know...my mate used to race them....they simply don't brake for the corners!:gob:

[Ronin]

I know...my mate used to race them....they simply don't brake for the corners!:gob:

Didn't you try that at Dunlop last round?

Sorry... I couldn't resist

[Biggles08]

Didn't you try that at Dunlop last round?

Sorry... I couldn't resist
Ahhhahahaaa....what are you saying? I should be in a superkart!!!! bastard!:innocent:

[scracha]

Ahhhahahaaa....what are you saying? I should be in a superkart!!!! bastard!:innocent:

I don't think you can get ugly chavtastic gold wheels for them though

[Biggles08]

I don't think you can get ugly chavtastic gold wheels for them thoughfuckin aye I can! Its all about the bling bro!

[Racey Rider]

I support 2 longer racers (not many spectators there anyway, and would most of them be supporters of the riders?), which must reduce time on the day sorting out race starts.

Use long track - (more fun / makes better use of our tyres)

Streetstock & F1 at beginning of day so they don't miss out.

F1 given slightly Longer races. - They should be the Flagship.

Shaun Harris as commentator. (When the flag drops, the Bullshit Starts!)

GP125's in F3 is GOOD. (from a streetstocks point of view) :yes:

Save the Wet T-shirts for prize giving at the end of the year. (might get more people attend)($5 cover charge if you didn't attend last year!)

A little thing, but....
I don't see the need for 1st / 2nd / 3rd certificates at each round. Ok, it doesn't cost much, but someone still has to organize it on the day, and to me .... it doesn't mean much after each round, but the Championship ones do at the end of the series.
Bit like my daughters netball. She might get a certificate for 'player of the day'. Nothing wrong with that, but she would also get a Trophy for 'player of the day'. That's a bit much, and makes the end of year trophies less significant.
Why not just give the Vic club Champion certificates at the end of the season? It's only club racing... but at 'Nationals' rounds I would feel differently and support 'Each Round' certificates.

Just my view.
Racey

[Shaun]

I support 2 longer racers (not many spectators there anyway, and would most of them be supporters of the riders?), which must reduce time on the day sorting out race starts.

Use long track - (more fun / makes better use of our tyres)

Streetstock & F1 at beginning of day so they don't miss out.

F1 given slightly Longer races. - They should be the Flagship.

Shaun Harris as commentator. (When the flag drops, the Bullshit Starts!)

GP125's in F3 is GOOD. (from a streetstocks point of view) :yes:

Save the Wet T-shirts for prize giving at the end of the year. (might get more people attend)($5 cover charge if you didn't attend last year!)

A little thing, but....
I don't see the need for 1st / 2nd / 3rd certificates at each round. Ok, it doesn't cost much, but someone still has to organize it on the day, and to me .... it doesn't mean much after each round, but the Championship ones do at the end of the series.
Bit like my daughters netball. She might get a certificate for 'player of the day'. Nothing wrong with that, but she would also get a Trophy for 'player of the day'. That's a bit much, and makes the end of year trophies less significant.
Why not just give the Vic club Champion certificates at the end of the season? It's only club racing... but at 'Nationals' rounds I would feel differently and support 'Each Round' certificates.

Just my view.
Racey


Haha Like your sense of humour Racey:Punk:

[Marknz]

http://www.vicclub.co.nz/tiki-view_events.php

Round 4
Manfeild Long Track
Sat 14th August

Enduro race and a sprint race. Races will be a timed format.

Race order:
Clubmans
Post Classics
F2
Streetstock/Production Light/Mini Lites
F3/ProTwin/125GP
F1

[CHOPPA]

http://www.vicclub.co.nz/tiki-view_events.php

Round 4
Manfeild Long Track
Sat 14th August

Enduro race and a sprint race. Races will be a timed format.

Race order:
Clubmans
Post Classics
F2
Streetstock/Production Light/Mini Lites
F3/ProTwin/125GP
F1

Good to see F1 last as per usual!!

[Kickaha]

Good to see F1 last as per usual!!

What do you expect?, they always run the premier classes first

[Ronin]

What do you expect?, they always run the premier classes first

Note to self: Vote for Sidecars up first next round.

[Shaun]

Good to see F1 last as per usual!!


Email being sent RE SAFETY issues there, and you know what I am talking about!

[Ronin]

Email being sent RE SAFETY issues there, and you know what I am talking about!

You don't think Choppa is safe?

[Foxzee]

Hi All

Thank you all for your awesome contributions to this thread. I however am in two minds about the wet T-Shirt competition only because of the contenders that maybe we will have to endure while digesting our lunch…lol, but in saying that lunchtime entertainment is not to be ruled out.

It’s almost impossible to please everyone and run a format that will actually work so we can deliver the whole Programme without chopping classes and reducing races, we try very hard to minimize this when considering the format.

Please don’t feel that your comments, discussion, or general banter has been in vain, it has not been and a lot of the ideas put forward will be discussed further to enhance the Winter Series at future meetings. As racers participating your input and feedback is needed and shouldn’t be just contained to a thread either. I am, along with the rest of the Committee always approachable for you to share experiences and ideas, yes we will take the good with the bad and wear it on the chin.

Through some of your suggestions I hope that you will see changes at the next meeting albeit small ones but overall should make the meeting flow so we can achieve the format that we propose to run which I might add has been back and forth through the wonderful timing machine.

We have a great bunch of people supporting us, our present and past Committee, dedicated experienced Volunteers that succumb and work through trying situations, now hopefully the continued and valued feedback/support from the people that give us the awesome racing action.

Shaun…I got your PM re long track and again this has not fallen on deaf ears…Choppa you are not last because you are superior…this is Club level racing and the amount of cross entry that goes between classes has to be considered, some of which are racers that are wanting to be in your position and are fighting hard to achieve this dream. The September meeting will bring new dynamics again to the format with the dear I say it Sidecars in the mix......:shit: :yes:

[Kickaha]

You don't think Choppa is safe?

That's a bit harsh, he isn't that bad


The September meeting will bring new dynamics again to the format with the dear I say it Sidecars in the mix......:shit: :yes:

Could we be out just before F1 :whistle:

[Shaun]

Thanks Foxzee, Clive has contacted also, good on you all

[Shaun]

You don't think Choppa is safe?




No Ronin, I do not think that, and Choppa Know,s what I was typing about. He may be a PUDDLE Jumper really, but looks Dam safe to me:sunny: Even if he lives in Hamilton

[CHOPPA]

Choppa you are not last because you are superior…this is Club level racing and the amount of cross entry that goes between classes has to be considered, some of which are racers that are wanting to be in your position and are fighting hard to achieve this dream. The September meeting will bring new dynamics again to the format with the dear I say it Sidecars in the mix......:shit: :yes:

Why put more emphasis on cross entered classes for riders that potentially run 6 races when we can only run 3. Shouldnt your aim to be to try give everyone a fair shot at getting atleast 3 races?

You have promised that the order was going to be changed throughout the rounds but we have been last every round.

Tell me why this race order wouldnt work?

Clubmens
F1
F3/ProTwin/125GP
Streetstock/Production Light/Mini Lites
F2
Post Classics

[Biggles08]

Tell me why this race order wouldnt work?

Clubmens
F1
F3/ProTwin/125GP
Streetstock/Production Light/Mini Lites
F2
Post Classics

That will never work because F1 isn't last Choppa! :shifty:

[Marknz]

I don't really have a dog in this one, but what is the perceived benefit of having F1 run earlier in the schedule rather than later?

[CHOPPA]

I don't really have a dog in this one, but what is the perceived benefit of having F1 run earlier in the schedule rather than later?

Cause if the day runs late as per usual then we are the first race to get cut and F1 bikes cant cross enter.

At the first round F2 riders were going out for there 6th race of the day there unfortunetly was an accident and we only ended up getting 2 races.

At round 3 we had our last 3rd race while it was getting dark while the F2 riders had 6 races in the good conditions. We are limited to only one class we should be given priority just like clubmens and streetstock.

[Marknz]

Fair points me thinks, but I'm not running the event. :innocent: Maybe you could go first and clean the track for clubbies? :shutup:

[cowboyz]

well, Im in clubmns and beign as there is such a large gap between clubmans and F1 and plenty of time to repair all the damage I could cause... how bout lending me the BMW for 20 mins or so.................?

[slowpoke]

http://www.vicclub.co.nz/tiki-view_events.php

Round 4
Manfeild Long Track
Sat 14th August

Enduro race and a sprint race. Races will be a timed format.

Race order:
Clubmans
Post Classics
F2
Streetstock/Production Light/Mini Lites
F3/ProTwin/125GP
F1


Good to see F1 last as per usual!!


Why put more emphasis on cross entered classes for riders that potentially run 6 races when we can only run 3. Shouldnt your aim to be to try give everyone a fair shot at getting atleast 3 races?



Exactly, it's painfully obvious why no-one races a superbike in NZ......

Why is someone who's only paid a fraction of an entry fee to do a second class being catered for when folks who have paid full entry fees get shafted? The argument that "this is Club level racing and the amount of cross entry that goes between classes has to be considered, some of which are racers that are wanting to be in your position and are fighting hard to achieve this dream" doesn't hold water: suprise suprise there are also some superbike racers who want/need to improve and with the dearth of track time have virtually no opportunity to do so.

Fuck it, I'll be entering Clubman's at Round 5. I'll get guaranteed races and will be packed up nice and early watching the shortened F1 race with a beer in my hand. Sorted.

[lukemillar]

Could we be out just before F1 :whistle:

How about Sidecars can cross enter in F1... :whistle:

[Shaun]

VMCC Shaft NO ONE!
There YA go TRASH EEEEEE

[CHOPPA]

Exactly, it's painfully obvious why no-one races a superbike in NZ......

Why is someone who's only paid a fraction of an entry fee to do a second class being catered for when folks who have paid full entry fees get shafted? The argument that "this is Club level racing and the amount of cross entry that goes between classes has to be considered, some of which are racers that are wanting to be in your position and are fighting hard to achieve this dream" doesn't hold water: suprise suprise there are also some superbike racers who want/need to improve and with the dearth of track time have virtually no opportunity to do so.

Fuck it, I'll be entering Clubman's at Round 5. I'll get guaranteed races and will be packed up nice and early watching the shortened F1 race with a beer in my hand. Sorted.

Could agree more. From the format there is no encouragement for anyone to ride a superbike

[White trash]

And NOT everyone works on rigs, so have a gret income tospend on a Superbike

Bit presumptuous there mate, I wouldn't go commenting on others personal circumstances with regards to their jobs or earning potential. Might wanna retract that one big fella.

On another note, see ya next weekend :Punk:

[MSTRS]

*small voice pipes up in the background*
I get what is being said re F1. Being last in the race order, round after round, and having their last race cut short doesn't seem fair. SS often have their last race cut altogether to allow time for the F1 boys and girls - so they have a genuine gripe as well.
Is there any reason why the order can't be rotated? The order of classes stays the same except - round one F1 is last, round two they run first, round three they run second. IE just put the class at the bottom of the order to the top at the next round. Then, as the season progresses, everyone gets their turn at maybe a shortened race 3.
Cross-entered riders may get extra races - good for them - but unless the other riders in whatever class are also cross entered, then why should they miss out to 'make it fair' on those who can't cross enter in other classes?

[Tony.OK]

Would you prefer that our club scene catered for you first, and oldish man, or cater for the future of our sport and growth first, ie, club mans etc?



Whats age, job and income got to do with anything?
Some people can only get to very limited events because of such jobs so perhaps would like a fair stab at the sausage Shaun.
Can't see the amount of work or effort being greater just by swapping the race order around, its been done in the past with no drama's.

[wharfy]

Fuck it, I'll be entering Clubman's at Round 5. I'll get guaranteed races and will be packed up nice and early watching the shortened F1 race with a beer in my hand. Sorted.

You will not be able to go under 1:18 or you will get bumped into F1 anyway :)

[scracha]

I still can't understand why they're not just running F1 and F2 simultaneously and just give them say, 4 races....it's not like there's a full grid and I've not seen anyone arrive with a 6 hundy and a thou?

Used to be streetstock who got a bum deal so perhaps the club have responded.

No point whining about it here guys and it's probably just an oversight at the Vic club. Have emailed Mr Banks to request F1 be put out first or second at the last two rounds as they do seem to be getting a $hitty deal this year.

Chopper...posties have already been sent out last this year mate...must be the 125's or clubmans turn.

[Ronin]

*small voice pipes up in the background*
I get what is being said re F1. Being last in the race order, round after round, and having their last race cut short doesn't seem fair. SS often have their last race cut altogether to allow time for the F1 boys and girls - so they have a genuine gripe as well.
Is there any reason why the order can't be rotated? The order of classes stays the same except - round one F1 is last, round two they run first, round three they run second. IE just put the class at the bottom of the order to the top at the next round. Then, as the season progresses, everyone gets their turn at maybe a shortened race 3.
Cross-entered riders may get extra races - good for them - but unless the other riders in whatever class are also cross entered, then why should they miss out to 'make it fair' on those who can't cross enter in other classes?

Let's not forget that the last 2 rounds have delivered the full program

[Matt Bleck]

ummm, I have one small request, can we have a gap between F3 and F1 pretty please? :D

[Str8 Jacket]

ummm, I have one small request, can we have a gap between F3 and F1 pretty please? :D

They will. While they clean up Dunc.... oh I mean Splash.... :whistle:

[Matt Bleck]

They will. While they clean up Dunc.... oh I mean Splash.... :whistle:

Stop stalking me!!!!!! :love:

[scracha]

ummm, I have one small request, can we have a gap between F3 and F1 pretty please? :D
But you called me a Scots pooftah when I said I wasn't doing back to back racing in F2 and posties this year.

[Matt Bleck]

But you called me a Scots pooftah when I said I wasn't doing back to back racing in F2 and posties this year.

The truth is I couldn't understand you and just called you a poofter anyway....... :yes:

[slowpoke]

VMCC Shaft NO ONE!
There YA go TRASH EEEEEE

WTF? Not only are you talking shit regarding something you know absolutely nothing about (my circumstances) but you're also missing the blindingly obvious. I can only make 1 club round this season so encouraging me is neither here nor there. Besides it's not worth encouraging old buggers like me is it? I mean, it's only putting money into the coffers of the Vic Club..................

Nah, I'm more concerned with encouraging the likes of Sketchy, Sam Love, Jamie Rajek, Jamie Galway etc. As it stands they don't have a viable club superbike field to step up to and their track time halves when they do, hence Choppa has to go to Oz to get a decent race outside the National's. But hey, I'm sure you know what you're doing, I mean there are heaps of young blokes rising to the standard set by Stroudie and Craig eh? And we've got lotsa racers doing well overseas eh? Oh wait, that would be no....and no.

Contrast our Superbike National's scene with BSB, AMA, Oz and WSB with young champions like Leon Camier, Ben Spies, Josh Waters taking over from the established stars and it seems to me that NZ is struggling big time in developing and advancing riders. But you're far more knowledgeable than a burnt out late starter, so if you're happy with a skinny entry list and no new challengers for years who am I to argue.

Despite Shauns comments my personal racing position has got nothing to do with my comments. Even if I did like everyone else and avoided Superbikes to ride a cross entry capable class I'd still think the same way: VMCC do a good job with very limited resources but there are some simple fundamental changes that could be made to improve the sport in general.

[Shaun]

WTF? Not only are you talking shit regarding something you know absolutely nothing about (my circumstances) but you're also missing the blindingly obvious. I can only make 1 club round this season so encouraging me is neither here nor there. Besides it's not worth encouraging old buggers like me is it? I mean, it's only putting money into the coffers of the Vic Club..................

Nah, I'm more concerned with encouraging the likes of Sketchy, Sam Love, Jamie Rajek, Jamie Galway etc. As it stands they don't have a viable club superbike field to step up to and their track time halves when they do, hence Choppa has to go to Oz to get a decent race outside the National's. But hey, I'm sure you know what you're doing, I mean there are heaps of young blokes rising to the standard set by Stroudie and Craig eh? And we've got lotsa racers doing well overseas eh? Oh wait, that would be no....and no.

Contrast our Superbike National's scene with BSB, AMA, Oz and WSB with young champions like Leon Camier, Ben Spies, Josh Waters taking over from the established stars and it seems to me that NZ is struggling big time in developing and advancing riders. But you're far more knowledgeable than a burnt out late starter, so if you're happy with a skinny entry list and no new challengers for years who am I to argue.

Despite Shauns comments my personal racing position has got nothing to do with my comments. Even if I did like everyone else and avoided Superbikes to ride a cross entry capable class I'd still think the same way: VMCC do a good job with very limited resources but there are some simple fundamental changes that could be made to improve the sport in general.


You are Correct, I am WRONG! APPOLOGIES

[slowpoke]

You are Correct, I am WRONG! APPOLOGIES

No problem..........would now be a good time ask about swapping my munted 25 year old home built trailer for your mobile pleasure palace? No? Bugger.

[Shaun]

No problem..........would now be a good time ask about swapping my munted 25 year old home built trailer for your mobile pleasure palace? No? Bugger.


My mobile plessure palace is on trade me for sale as of yesterday, I have realised that there is no point in having it, as I do NOT earn any money from it by just helping people with spare parts etc, So from now on, I take care of ME only, I have tried to help a lot of riders with things, but it is getting me know where trying to pretend to be a nice guy, so back to the old Shaun! And he WILL be racing the NZ Champs this coming season after a trip to the UK to a training camp for fitness and bike Dirt riding at a good friends place, and may even do the last 2 rounds of the BSB superstock series on my BMWS1000RR that is over there with my friend crew chief and all good to go for the TT next year.

A couple of things that have gone down lately, ( Including my own BAD actions, ie, my piss poor reply to your post) has shown me it is time to get out of helping race/riders (and trying to tell the world how to run there lives) before I totally spin out. I am Technically over my Brain injury, but still show signs of it, although I did before I Technically had one hahaha) I will still be an agent for the products I am, but that is it now.

I am here to awnser Questions from people still, as I believe in what goes around comes around, but that is it. And KB has been a good place for me.

So to all I have been involved with, thanks for the trust in me, and now please exscuse me.



http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=308544362

[Ivan]

good on you Shaun,
And our family thanks you for all the years you have helped us
I personally wish your future well and cant wait to see you back on a bike again we know how good you are

Regards

Ivan Juggins

[Shaun]

good on you Shaun,
And our family thanks you for all the years you have helped us
I personally wish your future well and cant wait to see you back on a bike again we know how good you are

Regards

Ivan Juggins


IVAN. Your Family is the exception to my post mate!

Re This bit

I personally wish your future well and cant wait to see you back on a bike again we know how good you are------- SHOULD READ WAS, I have to prove it to myself again, and I think I can, even though I am a silly old -ucker

Joey D won his last TT at the age of 48, I still have 2 years to go woo hoo:yes:

[Drew]

Joey D won his last TT at the age of 48, I still have 2 years to go woo hoo:yes:

How old was Mike "the bike" when he went back to the Isle? He was older than almost any two other riders I heard, but shit does get a bit exaggerated second hand.

[wharfy]

How old was Mike "the bike" when he went back to the Isle? He was older than almost any two other riders I heard, but shit does get a bit exaggerated second hand.

From the official Mike Hailwood website...
...his motor racing career ended abruptly in 1974 when he crashed his McLaren on Germany's daunting Nurburgring.

Disabled by his leg injuries, he retired to New Zealand, where he quickly became bored, and by 1978, at the age of 38, he was back at the Isle of Man, the scene of so many of his earlier triumphs, not only to race bikes once again, but to take on and beat the entire field. His victorious return to 'The Island' has been described as one of the most emotional moments of 20th century sport.

[slowpoke]

...... he retired to New Zealand, where he quickly became bored......

:shutup::shutup::shutup: So many lines, so little time.........

[Clivoris]

Shit, nine pages is a bit of a read. Thanks for the input people and it's good to know that even if there are things you don't like about the race meetings, you still appreciate the effort we put in.
We use the long-track to add some variety to the season. If we can, we will continue to do this. Yes, it's harder and longer but I understand that some ladies prefer it like that:gob:. The concrete wall issue has been reconsidered thanks to Shaun, and in response we will be using an airfence there. The club carries the expense for this and we appreciate Shaun bringing the issue back into focus for us.
Longer races versus more shorter races has been knocked around for as long as I remember. We find ourselves trying to balance things over the season.
Race order? You probably wouldn't believe the number of requests we get from different classes to shift the race order around. We do the best we can with this. Our emphasis has to be on getting through the day's program, rather than getting tied up in knots over who is going to miss out if there is a problem. I know F1 have missed out, I also know that at different times, the non-formula classes have missed out so F1 could get a race.
We also like the idea of combining F1 and F2 for more races and just separating the points out. We will be looking at this more closely after this weekend.
I'm also really sorry for bikes that don't get to cross enter. This isn't designed as a personal insult. Just because someone else gets a break doesn't mean your missing out.
While I'm at this I should probably let those reading know that we will have someone at the track specifically to do spot scrutineering of bikes. It is unlikely that we will return to the days of every bike being scrutineered during sign-on but in the future we may try to get one or two classes through during sign-on, with spot checks during the day.
Please bear with us. There are a lot of us in new roles at the track and if we can manage to keep them on board and get some experience happening, things will get a lot smoother.

[CHOPPA]

Shit, nine pages is a bit of a read. Thanks for the input people and it's good to know that even if there are things you don't like about the race meetings, you still appreciate the effort we put in.
We use the long-track to add some variety to the season. If we can, we will continue to do this. Yes, it's harder and longer but I understand that some ladies prefer it like that:gob:. The concrete wall issue has been reconsidered thanks to Shaun, and in response we will be using an airfence there. The club carries the expense for this and we appreciate Shaun bringing the issue back into focus for us.
Longer races versus more shorter races has been knocked around for as long as I remember. We find ourselves trying to balance things over the season.
Race order? You probably wouldn't believe the number of requests we get from different classes to shift the race order around. We do the best we can with this. Our emphasis has to be on getting through the day's program, rather than getting tied up in knots over who is going to miss out if there is a problem. I know F1 have missed out, I also know that at different times, the non-formula classes have missed out so F1 could get a race.
We also like the idea of combining F1 and F2 for more races and just separating the points out. We will be looking at this more closely after this weekend.
I'm also really sorry for bikes that don't get to cross enter. This isn't designed as a personal insult. Just because someone else gets a break doesn't mean your missing out.
While I'm at this I should probably let those reading know that we will have someone at the track specifically to do spot scrutineering of bikes. It is unlikely that we will return to the days of every bike being scrutineered during sign-on but in the future we may try to get one or two classes through during sign-on, with spot checks during the day.
Please bear with us. There are a lot of us in new roles at the track and if we can manage to keep them on board and get some experience happening, things will get a lot smoother.

Sounds like some good ideas. Thanks for the air fence too that is great!

When you have a meeting could you consider rolling the race order each round, If F2 are first race then next round they are second and so on. 6 classes 6 rounds it should be a fair way.

The combined F1 and F2 makes sense!

[Str8 Jacket]

I don't envy you or any of the volunteers Clive. Vic Club put on an awesome event year after year and I think that the numbers speak for themselves. Every sport has its politics and this is no different so good on you and Dee for your responses ti this thread and your willingness to be frank and open about the situation.
It's nice to see a thread on KB that for once did not turn into a shit slinging match but actually a healthy discussion! :eek:

[lukemillar]

The combined F1 and F2 makes sense!

Only if it doesn't get oversubscribed! Would really suck to be in no man's land where you're too fast for clubbies but too slow for F1 + F2 combined. Maybe do bracket racing if the field gets too big?

[slowpoke]

The concrete wall issue has been reconsidered thanks to Shaun, and in response we will be using an airfence there. The club carries the expense for this and we appreciate Shaun bringing the issue back into focus for us.

Great intiative folks. It's not one of the crash hotspots but if/when it does turn to custard someone will owe you big time for the investment.

We also like the idea of combining F1 and F2 for more races and just separating the points out. We will be looking at this more closely after this weekend.

Brilliant! I might have to reconsider my Clubman's entry....aaah, who am I kiddin' Clubbies and me are perfect for each other.

I'm also really sorry for bikes that don't get to cross enter. This isn't designed as a personal insult. Just because someone else gets a break doesn't mean your missing out.

I know what ya mean mate, and if it wasn't the same people getting a break at every single race meeting you'd be right. But when it's the same people being short-changed at every single meeting then sorry, but they are missing out. "A break" implies a sort term stroke of luck or advantage, whereas cross entrants enjoy permanent favouritism. They should at least have to pay full entry fee for their cross entered class, to sit next to another entrant who has paid full wack while they've paid just $20 simply isn't fair.


As far as race order: draw it out of a hat/helmet on the morning. Can't be fairer than that.



Only if it doesn't get oversubscribed! Would really suck to be in no man's land where you're too fast for clubbies but too slow for F1 + F2 combined. Maybe do bracket racing if the field gets too big?

Nah, no biggie, Clubbies cutoff isn't set in stone and provided it too isn't oversubscribed I don't see the problem.

Even then if the clubman field is huge, would it be a bad thing to encourage extremely slow people to do a few more track days before racing? Is it right to let absolutely anybody who wants to race have a go with no standard set? Minimum standards, realistic for beginners, are set at other clubs I know of.

Depending on numbers an A and B grade could be the go. Might even be a good thing, giving folks who ordinarly never get to see a podium a chance to race for something shiny in B grade. Even if it's just aiming to step up to A grade or avoiding dropping to B grade or Clubbies would give folks a lil' extra something to race for, other than just the fun factor.

[cowboyz]

I actually thought there was a cutoff being the normal 115% which assuming at least one person is touching the 1.18 cutoff would make it 1.30 being the cut off. Or is there really none?