National Forum of Motorcycle Groups

[MAG-NZ Inc]

Clumsy name, for something that is a step in the right direction (we hope). I am delighted to announce that MAG-NZ took part in this meeting.

Here is the press release from the meeting, MAG-NZ will post the details as soon as we receive them. We value your input, so make sure you let us know what your thoughts are

6 October 2010

National Forum of Motorcycle Groups. A meeting was held on 2 October 2010 in Petone, near Wellington to consider the concept of a national forum of motorcycling groups.

Ten national level motorcycling groups were represented and after discussion, it was agreed to develop a proposal to establish such a forum.

The proposed purpose of the forum will be to advocate for the interests of on-road motorcyclists, agree on common ground and establish good communication networks.

The proposal will be available to other motorcycling groups who may share the interests and concerns of those attending the meeting.

The groups represented at the meeting were: The Ulysses Club of New Zealand Inc.; Motorcycling New Zealand Inc. (MNZ), Women's International Motorcycling Association New Zealand Division (WIMA), Motorcycle Action Group of New Zealand Inc. (MAG-NZ), BMW Owners Register Inc. of NZ (BMWOR), Buell Riders New Zealand, Gold Wing Road Riders Assn (GWRRA), New Zealand Gold Wing Riders (Inc.), New Zealand Classic Scooter Club; and Bikers Rights Organisation New Zealand (BRONZ) (Auckland) - all of whom will be consulting their respective memberships on the forum concept.

Interested groups are encouraged to contact the above for further information.

A further meeting will be convened in early 2011 to consider feedback and further action.

Ends

[Quasievil]

Gold Wing Road Riders Assn (GWRRA), New Zealand Gold Wing Riders (Inc.)

Did the "riders of gold wing NZ (ROGWNZ) " come along ?

those bastards should have been there to

oh and what about the "NZ wing of gold riders (NZWOGR)" looks like they didnt show up either ?
:innocent:

[admenk]

Did the "riders of gold wing NZ (ROGWNZ) " come along ?

those bastards should have been there to

oh and what about the "NZ wing of gold riders (NZWOGR)" looks like they didnt show up either ?
:innocent:

You've got to wonder how many Goldwing riders there are out there (and do they wave?)

Joking aside, well done to all those concerned. Let's all keep talking and direct our anger at Mr Smith and his mates.

[MSTRS]

Let's all keep talking and direct our anger at Mr Smith and his mates.

I am glad that MAG-NZ was there. The other groups appear to have lost their anger and are happy to 'work with...'. MAG-NZ will be a reminder to them of how/why this all started, and will not let the steamroller that is Nick the Prick crush the biker spirit.

[Bald Eagle]

Great news another National spokes body .

[rustyrobot]

Great news another National spokes body .

Are you being sarcastic? You forgot to use the sarcasm smiley :shit:

I think it makes sense to have these multiple groups which come together in a national forum. Each group can focus on what it is most passionate about and will attract those riders to it, then can come together to make decisions as a whole. Sure, it may pull a few riders out of one group to join another, but overall there should be a greater amount of riders able to join a group they identify with.

Surprised there are no adventure or off-road riders groups mentioned.

[Big Dave]

No he's not being sarcastic per se.

This is what BRONZ was actually set up to do all those years ago. Be an umbrella group. It has resources, a small cash reserve, the legal structures and incorporation in place - but the community continues to start new groups instead of using them - as they would be welcome to do.

The Forum is needed - If it does what BRONZ is meant to do - be an umbrella group, combined voice, weight of numbers etc etc. If it does that there is no need for BRONZ - which is a shame for the few that have put in and the goals they have kicked so far. As volunteers. And the people who have already put their hands in their pockets.

Considering 12months ago it was basically only them that gave a toss.

[phill-k]

No he's not being sarcastic.

This is what BRONZ was actually set up to do all those years ago. Be an umbrella group. It has resources, a small cash reserve, the legal structures and incorporation in place - but the community continues to start new groups instead of using them - as they would be welcome to do.

The Forum is needed - If it does what BRONZ is meant to do - be an umbrella group, representative, unifying voice, weight of numbers etc etc. If it does that there is no need for BRONZ - which is a shame for the few that have put in and the goals they have kicked so far. As volunteers. And the people who have already put their hands in their pockets.

Considering 12months ago it was basically only them that gave a toss.

Totally agree Dave, this was Bronz's role. shame those that felt Bronz didn't represent the views of the many didn't work within Bronz to bring about change.
Like confucius say many small farts in small bottles smell only a little, all farts in big bottle also make loud noise and peoples sit up and notice.:facepalm:

[Maha]

No he's not being sarcastic.

This is what BRONZ was actually set up to do all those years ago. Be an umbrella group. It has resources, a small cash reserve, the legal structures and incorporation in place - but the community continues to start new groups instead of using them - as they would be welcome to do.

The Forum is needed - If it does what BRONZ is meant to do - be an umbrella group, representative, unifying voice, weight of numbers etc etc. If it does that there is no need for BRONZ - which is a shame for the few that have put in and the goals they have kicked so far. As volunteers. And the people who have already put their hands in their pockets.

Considering 12months ago it was basically only them that gave a toss.

Basically being the operative word here, thousands actually gave a toss if the truth be known.
Bronz seized the moment (without a doubt) but failed to capitalize on it and failed to keep the momentum going. There would be no need for a National Group if in fact Bronz (as you say) were an umbrella group. That scenario will never happen. Not now.

[Genestho]

Great stuff, well overdue!! Top effort to ALL involved!! :)

[MSTRS]

What's the point of sniping at each other? BRONZ may have been 'first', and may have had the right approach in it's formative years. But motorcycle issues have moved to a whole new level, and recent months would seem to indicate that BRONZ wasn't keeping pace. That's not a criticism of the entity, but of it's member support.
Wheels DO get re-invented.

[Genestho]

What's the point of sniping at each other? BRONZ may have been 'first', and may have had the right approach in it's formative years. But motorcycle issues have moved to a whole new level, and recent months would seem to indicate that BRONZ wasn't keeping pace. That's not a criticism of the entity, but of it's member support.
Wheels DO get re-invented.

BRONZ has a significant part to play.

When you lobby - often the groups you are lobbying against are quite large - their viewpoint and representation will overshadow smaller groups - which is where a National Forum of smaller groups sharing information, and communication to the masses is really important.

Also I think alot of people need to realise - lobbying for what you want does not magically happen.

It is long hard slog, it eats into your life, weekends, nights, in the middle of holidays - for as long as it does.

It involves networking, researching, marketing, media, legalise, understanding political procedures, reviews, laws, data analysis, meetings, consultations and constant organisation. (That's just a few jobs off the top of my head)

To truly get your head around this takes time and experience in the saddle.

Lobbying itself is usually only a small part of an organisations work.

So I can relate to the work and fortitude shown by BRONZ.

I hope you will all work well together, best wishes. :)

[Big Dave]

No sour grapes here anne. just stating what I have observed.

There is no point to having two organisations doing the same 'umbrella' thing. Pick one and be done. No clingage from me.

But where does that leave Les and Stoney et al?


I was actually pointing to the fact that before the change of government the interested parties fitted at a card table.

[MSTRS]

Yep. Except BRONZ seems to have become 'just another group of motorcyclists', rather than the mouthpiece of the other groups...
I guess the hope of this National Federation is that it will be THE mouthpiece of all the disparate groups, populated by representatives from each, without being an entity in it's own right.

[Bald Eagle]

Yep. Except BRONZ seems to have become 'just another group of motorcyclists', rather than the mouthpiece of the other groups...
I guess the hope of this National Federation is that it will be THE mouthpiece of all the disparate groups, populated by representatives from each, without being an entity in it's own right.

I sincerely hope you are right , and that a truly representative organisation arises. Good luck with that.

[MSTRS]

I sincerely hope you are right , and that a truly representative organisation arises. Good luck with that.

Agreed. It's like herding cats...

[Mom]

But where does that leave Les and Stoney et al?


Well I can't answer for Stoney, he did not attend the meeting in Wellington, but I can say that Les, Finn, Howard Mansell and me and a couple of others had a nice beer together after the meeting, and then we shared a trip to the airport together after the meeting. It was a free one as it was a friend of mine playing chauffer. We seemed to be able to sit side by side at the meeting without any blood shed, so I reckon it will all be ok.

I dont know why people continue to knock this idea, who knows what the forum will look like when it is finally agreed on. If BRONZ had wanted to be that forum/umbrella group they should have got on with forming it. I can assure you that there are large issues of common ground among the parties at that meeting in Wellington, and a real desire to get something moving forward. As far as I am concerned it is a good thing, and I thank everyone for their good wishes.

[Big Dave]

If BRONZ had wanted to be that forum/umbrella group they should have got on with forming it.

It was formed. WIMA, Ulysses and several others are already affiliate members. Apparently used to attend in numbers too. It was 'the Forum' - before my time. And I'm guessing before the current bunch of committee's time.

All the articles of incorporation and stuff is still there I believe.

Actually, the new Forum was originally purported to me as somewhere to get 'calendars aligned' and was 'not going to be political'.

That was some time ago though - how it panned out?

[Mom]

Actually, the new Forum was originally purported to me as somewhere to get 'calendars aligned' and was 'not going to be political'.


I cant comment on that, but what I can comment on is what I have posted here. The official press release from the first meeting that was held, to see if it was plausible to form a representative group.

I am not sure how anyone could have purported anything, as there was no agenda etc...

Still I am not doubting what you say. It just highlights to me the reason things needed to change.

[bogan]

Whats in the past is just that, what needs doing now is what we should be focusing on, no one group was easily recognized as a national body representing all biker groups, so a forum is in the process of being established. Great :yes:, it'll have more clout on the issues that we are unified on, and simplify channels of communication between biker groups, and to the politicians and other non motorcycling groups.

[Big Dave]

Sure - my point has only ever been that there is existing infrastructure - particularly things like the articles of incorporation, insurance policies and some inventory - those are a wheel of wasteful re-invention - particularly when no-one I know is clinging ardently to ownership - beyond wanting to see what is right for it - democratically.

[NONONO]

Sorry Dave, you have obviously got an axe to grind, and the noise your making is just bloody irritating now.
You are well aware of the inactivity of the so called "Motorcycle Representative" groups, you are well aware that the recent forum was proposed and you knew Les and other BRONZ Auckland members, as well as BRONZ Wellington members planned to attend.
Stop the sodding whinging.
Piss or get off the pot.

[Hawk]

dave
if we are reinventing, maybe thats thats not so a bad thing because of the fresh minds it brings with it.
I think this group will focus those groups involved in the motorcyclist rights in more targeted action, even though we dont all share the same values we do share one thing ........an interest in motorcyclist rights and the coming together of all the interest groups in this area can only bring good.

[Mom]

Last word on this from me...

How this thread turned into an us and them scenario is beyond me.

MAG-NZ posted a press release that has been agreed on by 10 interested groups, including BRONZ Federation, and BRONZ Auckland.

At best it will galvanise some into thinking, at worst it will achieve nothing.

I cant wait for MAG-NZ to post the 2 page document that outlines a bit more detail on what was discussed. Talking about things and getting feedback on them is good IMO. Saying nothing, and not seeking opinion is not good.

Anyone wanting to give feedback off the KB forum is welcome to send an email to feedback@mag-nz.org

[Big Dave]

Apology accepted.

What I said at the last meeting I attended was that if there is to be a new functioning 'umbrella group' we may as well refocus BRONZ as a Ride Right Ride Safe training entity and let them get on with it.

Or whatever the membership decides of course. Just my suggestion.

If I have an axe to grind it's with paying for public liability insurance twice and all the other legal beagle stuff. That is all.

[Big Dave]

How this thread turned into an us and them scenario is beyond me.


It's not as far as I'm concerned - they didn't get what Finn and I were saying at the meeting either. This is Auckland only referenced.

Assume the new Forum is a rip roaring success - hope it is - BRONZ, under its charter (the way I understand it) - is essentially redundant.

The Forum is supposed to be BRONZ's function. To be that facilitator. The workings are already there. I don't know why there isn't any air in them, just they are there.

It devolved to rank and file membership over time and then sparked back into life with Nick.

Several hundred financial members currently. Stuffed if I know how they are best represented.

Will wait for the outcomes of the next forum meeting.

[Hitcher]

Childish name calling posts and peurile attempts at points scoring have been moved to Pointless Drivel.

Please keep this thread on topic and any discussion reasonably sane.

Thank you.

[Big Dave]

dave
if we are reinventing, maybe thats thats not so a bad thing because of the fresh minds it brings with it.


Gosh - I've had emails asking if I was OK. I was commenting about 'the Forum' in this thread only - I'm not pissed off about anything and I've been called a lot worse online - maybe. Politics.

I said this out loud at the last meeting attended - several months ago - My opinion only - IF the Forum goes ahead and is a success as a body of motorcycle associations - there is no need for BRONZ Akl in its current format. 'A Forum' is the job BRONZ was meant to do. No acrimony - viva enthusiasm.

My laboured point is that 'if' there is to be a transition (for want of a better word) - don't re-invent the useful stuff that is already there if you don't have to.

I'm not burying it yet or reading the eulogy either. Time will tell. Otherwise there is nothing much else I can add. Cheers.

[MSTRS]

Gosh - I've had emails asking if I was OK. I was commenting about 'the Forum' in this thread only - I'm not pissed off about anything and I've been called a lot worse online - maybe. Politics.

I said this out loud at the last meeting attended - several months ago - My opinion only - IF the Forum goes ahead and is a success as a body of motorcycle associations - there is no need for BRONZ in its current format. 'A Forum' is the job BRONZ was meant to do. No acrimony - viva enthusiasm.

My laboured point is that 'if' there is to be a transition (for want of a better word) - don't re-invent the useful stuff that is already there if you don't have to.

I'm not burying it yet or reading the eulogy either. Time will tell. Otherwise there is nothing much else I can add. Cheers.

Correct me if I am wrong...
BRONZ was originally envisaged to be a spokesgroup for motorcyclists, with the intention of the various bike clubs having a single place of representation?
Obviously, this didn't eventuate, and BRONZ devolved into another form of club, open to individual membership.
This proposed forum is the right move. It doesn't replace any existing organisation. It doesn't duplicate what anyone else is currently doing. And it would not be open to individual membership. Just a representative from any interested group that wishes to be a part of it.
So it's basically a committee of affiliated clubs?

I guess it's role would be to act as a conduit for the disparate clubs to talk to each other on issues that affect us all, and as a media go between? It wouldn't actually do anything, as such?

[Big Dave]

Correct me if I am wrong...
BRONZ was originally envisaged to be a spokesgroup for motorcyclists, with the intention of the various bike clubs having a single place of representation?
Obviously, this didn't eventuate, and BRONZ devolved into another form of club, open to individual membership.
This proposed forum is the right move. It doesn't replace any existing organisation. It doesn't duplicate what anyone else is currently doing. And it would not be open to individual membership. Just a representative from any interested group that wishes to be a part of it.
So it's basically a committee of affiliated clubs?

I guess it's role would be to act as a conduit for the disparate clubs to talk to each other on issues that affect us all, and as a media go between? It wouldn't actually do anything, as such?

I think it did eventuate in the past. Last time there was a rights crisis. Before my time in NZ.

It was where the representatives of affiliated groups - and the rank and file did meet. Prepared submissions etc.

And you are right - it devolved into half a dozen of us sitting around a card table roping people in to fill committees - a long way from the grand plan. Then there was Nick and we know that story.

The goal was to be an Umbrella group divorcing the political from the social aspect of the affiliated clubs - but open to the rank and file too.


Edit: I investigated further today - rang some folk and found out what is actually going on rather than idly speculating online - what I wrote here Mstrs had little chance of eventuating. In fact was some of my best grade-a wind pissing.

[MSTRS]

Thanks Dave. Food for thought.
Personally, I think a committee of representatives is all that is required. Could it not be that simple?

[Mom]

I'm not even sure who attended (sqiggles?) or if they are aware - or advised the Forum steerers that some of these assets are there - and the whole shootin' match maybe doesn't need to be started from scratch.

Les Mason for BRONZ Auckland and Fin Neilson for BRONZ Federation. No mention of anything from them at all.

[Big Dave]

I don't know Mstrs.

I do know I started a basketball club once. All that crap was needed for 8 year olds to bounce a ball.

[Big Dave]

Cool mom - I'll ask 'em about it next meeting I get to.

Adds: Ahhh! The Federation has happened since the last meeting I got to as well. That adds another whole new angle I hadn't considered. Ei eie ie.