What's with small tanks? [Archive]

Padmei

18th October 2010, 16:54

dino3310

18th October 2010, 16:58

yes :yes:

dino3310

18th October 2010, 17:02

i think the KTMs short range tank is there to remind you that when it runs out its time for a service or preventative maintenance schedule:killingme

Oscar

18th October 2010, 17:19

i think the KTMs short range tank is there to remind you that when it runs out its time for a service or preventative maintenance schedule:killingme

Quite the comedian, aren't you?:facepalm:
But don't give up your day job...

....those floors need sweeping.

.chris

18th October 2010, 17:21

I don't know, but on the 690's there would be not much effort/cost involved in making the tank about 18-20l instead of the 12l. Would be a more popular bike if they had that kind of range I think.

Gremlin

18th October 2010, 17:39

so you're forced to stop to rest your arse?

I agree, I want a bigger tank. I disagree on reliability... Just done 2500 km without skipping a beat, when others had failures :bleh:

marks

18th October 2010, 17:44

I don't know, but on the 690's there would be not much effort/cost involved in making the tank about 18-20l instead of the 12l. Would be a more popular bike if they had that kind of range I think.

it does make you wonder how well some of these manufactures listen to what their customers want.

surely 99% of 690e owners would all want a bigger tank if offered?

wysper

18th October 2010, 17:50

Same with the DR650 crowd I would say. The 18ltr IMS tank is next on my list for the DR.

Crim

18th October 2010, 18:10

What's with small tanks?

To fight small wars?

Phreaky Phil

18th October 2010, 18:27

Not showing off or anything:yes: BUT, BIG IS GOOD

Gibbo89

18th October 2010, 18:32

Not showing off or anything:yes: BUT, BIG IS GOOD

do you work at mitre 10 mega?

CrazyFrog

18th October 2010, 18:42

It's probably so they can upsell buyers to a larger factory tank for $$$.
In all reality, I guess they make them small for the enduro market and to keep centre of gravity down with less fuel up top whilst riding the technical stuff.

Hell, most people who buy enduro bikes DON'T use them as road tourers.
Makes sense really, especially after my comments on my roadie last week. Yes, they will do the job, ya just gotta plan your route carefully.

Padmei

18th October 2010, 18:59

But are the 690s being used for enduros? Surely there'd be no advantage over a smaller bike?

Same with the XRs - seems to me the best places to race them would be the long Baja type or Aussie races.

Oh well just thinking out loud...

DR650gary

18th October 2010, 19:20

Not showing off or anything:yes: BUT, BIG IS GOOD

My my, you do have a big one. :blink:

ADVGD

18th October 2010, 19:53

Why do they manufacture bikes over 250cc with a fuel range of 100-150kms?

This one has me beat too, so many long distance tour capable bikes have small tanks. I have been doing my finalizing for selecting a new bike over the last few weeks, among many the 690 was one of the potential options but a too smaller tank ruled it out, along with many other bikes with small tanks and no suitable aftermarket options available. After enjoying the stress free trip planning of a 22 litre tank on my current bike I didn't want to go to a smaller one. Did my final visit to the Yamaha shop today and confirmed the new toy (with its factory 23 litre tank range of 460km+) will be the Tenere...

Woodman

18th October 2010, 20:04

Gotta admit that I got sick of the 160-180 km range my old xl600 had and pretty much the only reason I got the klr was because of the range. (pre internet).

I just got tired of having to turn back or not go up a new track/road because of the lack of fuel. Waste of time thinking that I could come back some other time cos I generally don't know where I am.

Love having plus 400 k range.

Phreaky Phil

18th October 2010, 20:04

This one has me beat too, so many long distance tour capable bikes have small tanks. I have been doing my finalizing for selecting a new bike over the last few weeks, among many the 690 was one of the potential options but a too smaller tank ruled it out, along with many other bikes with small tanks and no suitable aftermarket options available. After enjoying the stress free trip planning of a 22 litre tank on my current bike I didn't want to go to a smaller one. Did my final visit to the Yamaha shop today and confirmed the new toy (with its factory 23 litre tank range of 460km+) will be the Tenere...
Nice:scooter: What colour

ADVGD

18th October 2010, 20:24

Nice:scooter: What colour

Black... black looks grouse!

The XT660R was a potential candidate, but again it came down to too smaller tank and no aftermarket option available

Crim

18th October 2010, 20:25

final visit to the Yamaha shop today and confirmed the new toy (with its factory 23 litre tank range of 460km+) will be the Tenere...

Congrats Josh :woohoo: - look forward to seeing all your "improvements" - will your chains fit on? how did the start of the fishing season go for you?

ADVGD

18th October 2010, 20:41

Congrats Josh :woohoo: - look forward to seeing all your "improvements" - will your chains fit on? how did the start of the fishing season go for you?

Hey Crim, yep, sure looking forward to having some "respectable" bhp, and no frigging around with installing aftermarket tanks! A few other upgrades planned though :yes:

Challenging but enjoyable opening season mate...
Opening season (http://www.adventureguide.co.nz/articles/12/54/opening-day-2010.php)
Lake Daniells fishing weekend (http://www.adventureguide.co.nz/articles/12/55/lake-daniells.php)

Box'a'bits

18th October 2010, 20:55

Not showing off or anything BUT, BIG IS GOOD
Buuut....Mine is bigger than yours....:killingme
God you don't know how long I've waited to be able to say that...
http://lh3.ggpht.com/_OZDusBNIgW4/TLq7KILkQcI/AAAAAAAAEx8/Fuq9gda2UME/s400/DSCF1177.JPG :facepalm:

Phreaky Phil

18th October 2010, 21:11

Buuut....Mine is bigger than yours....:killingme
God you don't know how long I've waited to be able to say that...
http://lh3.ggpht.com/_OZDusBNIgW4/TLq7KILkQcI/AAAAAAAAEx8/Fuq9gda2UME/s400/DSCF1177.JPG :facepalm:
Trumped by a 43L :doh:

warewolf

18th October 2010, 21:13

Why do they manufacture bikes over 250cc with a fuel range of 100-150kms? I am referring to Crazyfrogs return trip on his 530 (ok I take it it's made for short races??), Fluffybums XR600, Umopoms 690...
Were all these bikes made for races, short trail rides?Pretty much. The EXC range as has been said are road-registerable enduro race bikes - the primary purpose is reduced weight and improved handling for short technical races not any road touring prowess. Why criticise just the tank range? The seat is the same, built for short races not touring. Fairing protection - same. Electrical output - same. etc. You want range, comfort and tourability, buy a 640A!!

20+ years ago when it was released, so was the XR600. The pinnacle of enduro race bikes, I mean. :blink:

Despite frequent claims to the contrary, the manufacturers *are* trying to make what the largest segment of the public wants - within a defined niche. Don't think for one minute the manufacturers haven't done their market research. The 690 is at first glance a bit of an anomaly, however it is the enduro not the adventure model. Compare it to say the Husky TE610/630 and see how it stacks up. The major sales area is probably Europe which doesn't demand bigger tanks.

NordieBoy

19th October 2010, 07:39

NordieBoy

19th October 2010, 07:42

You want range, comfort and tourability, buy a 640A!!

Or a Tenere or a KLR...

clint640

19th October 2010, 09:38

Or a Tenere or a KLR...

Well I guess he didn't specify performance, handling or the ability to pick it up :shutup: :sunny:

Clint

Taz

19th October 2010, 09:48

Well I guess he didn't specify performance, handling or the ability to pick it up :shutup: :sunny:

Clint

Let alone being proud to be seen in public with it...... Bit like a fat chick :lol:

dino3310

19th October 2010, 10:15

this 22ltr on the pig is the first big tank ive had, my DRs have had standard tanks my 500 only had a 9ltr tank, never worried me before now :blink:

BMWST?

19th October 2010, 11:08

even on a road bike i would not settle for less than 300 km range.The PD sold itself in that regard.You dont NEED that range but its nice being out in the middle of the rapa,and come upon a enticing road,you dont have to worry if you can make it there and back again

Phreaky Phil

19th October 2010, 11:24

Small tanks are a pain in the arse.
Even going through the Rainbow, on the Nordie there was a point of no return.

I punctured well past that.

The locked gate was well well past that...

300km range is a minimum.
20l isn't too heavy and the comfort of being able to take almost any turn and knowing you'll have enough to get back is priceless.Not many people think about "turn around range". As you've found out, it becomes necessary sometimes. In Alaska, travelling the Haul road to Prudhoe Bay, we had a point of no return, even carrying another 2gallon container. Luckilly we didnt have a problem. Even in NZ you cant always guarantee you will get through one of the remote roads or tracks. Locked gates, flooded rivers, breakdowns, weather. Lots of things to stuff you up and the last thing you want to worry about is fuel

Bliksem

19th October 2010, 12:36

Its not fun getting lost, behind the dunes and having to switch over to reserve

First thing I did was rip out the stock tank and fit the biggest Acerbus tank I could find. Was for the xr600 but a bit of fiddling made it fit on the 250

Never ran out fuel! If I remember correctly is held around 26liters.

http://web01.cits.net.nz/images/tanks.jpg

http://web01.cits.net.nz/images/xr250.jpg

Oscar

19th October 2010, 12:42

On my old LC4 with the 18l tank I found it may the front end push off road, when it was full. Most bikes with big tanks test the riders arse tolerance a long time before reserve...

dino3310

19th October 2010, 12:57

no what ya mean, i definately notice the diference between the tanks, the standard is way better handling wise, i think the smaller 18ltr would be a better allrounder (north Is) rather than the 22ltr i got

BMWST?

19th October 2010, 14:06

On my old LC4 with the 18l tank I found it may the front end push off road, when it was full. Most bikes with big tanks test the riders arse tolerance a long time before reserve...

you can always stop for a rest,you dont have to stop at a gas station!

Oscar

19th October 2010, 14:58

you can always stop for a rest,you dont have to stop at a gas station!

It's kind of a catch 22 - there is nowhere in this country where an off road bike needs a 300km range, and the even if there was, the off road handling is so compromised by that much gas, you wouldn't fill it.

Taz

19th October 2010, 16:40

Whether I need it or not I love having 28 litres. But then the 640A is not an off road bike. Even beaches and 4x4 tracks are still roads.

ADVGD

19th October 2010, 18:38

It's kind of a catch 22 - there is nowhere in this country where an off road bike needs a 300km range, and the even if there was, the off road handling is so compromised by that much gas, you wouldn't fill it.

There are a couple of situations where a large tank is essential in certain situations, one is riding very early or late hours when small town petrol stations (in the South Island at least) are all closed. One recent hunting trip (Chch to the Coast) was a classic case, rode in for a two day trip and bagged a chamois on the first day, but it was too late to head off that evening as Arthurs Pass petrol station would be closed with no other options either meaning I'd run out if I tried to make it home. I decided to stay the night and head out in the morning... was then bombarded by a nasty unpredicted southerly storm and had a pretty gnarly night of gale winds and heavy West Coast rain fly camping on a ridge line, heavy rain walking out and all the way home. A long range tank would have been mint that day!

West Coast chamois hunt (http://www.adventureguide.co.nz/articles/12/24/west-coast-chamois-hunt.php)

The other situation is long trips if you don't want to stop all the time. We have a holiday home in Karamea, about 430 odd km from Chch, with my standard tank I had to fill up THREE times to get there :blink: with the long range tank, one fill, ahhhhh that's better :yes:

JATZ

19th October 2010, 19:01

The other situation is long trips if you don't want to stop all the time. We have a holiday home in Karamea, about 430 odd km from Chch, with my standard tank I had to fill up THREE times to get there :blink: with the long range tank, one fill, ahhhhh that's better :yes:

Quick question ..... how big is the standard tank on a 250 ?
I've been looking online for a manual but havn't found one specificly for the boys bike, aparently they never made em :blink:
I have a standard 350 tank here but wonder if it's worth all the muckin about if it's only going to gain another 1 litre

ADVGD

19th October 2010, 19:17

Quick question ..... how big is the standard tank on a 250 ?

Most around a measly 10 litres

I've been looking online for a manual but havn't found one specificly for the boys bike, aparently they never made em :blink:

What's the flavour of your boys bike?

I have a standard 350 tank here but wonder if it's worth all the muckin about if it's only going to gain another 1 litre
When researching options for my long range tank I read some good reviews of the old hot water in the plastic tank and the tyre pump trick to get an extra 2 to 3 litres capacity, a no cost option that apparently works well on some tanks. I haven't done it myself, only read about it, but no doubt someone on here has done it and offer more detail

BMWST?

19th October 2010, 19:31

JATZ

19th October 2010, 19:54

Most around a measly 10 litres

Sounds about right :yes:

What's the flavour of your boys bike?

95 250 se, electric and kick start , pumper carb, twin cam head and some pretty good suspension

When researching options for my long range tank I read some good reviews of the old hot water in the plastic tank and the tyre pump trick to get an extra 2 to 3 litres capacity, a no cost option that apparently works well on some tanks. I haven't done it myself, only read about it, but no doubt someone on here has done it and offer more detail

The standard 350 tank is only 9.5l acording to the manual, I stuck it on the 250 and it looked thinner and a bit higher, about a 3rd of the tank was below the level of the carb too, so I guess we'd need a pump to use it

ftcr:blink:

warewolf

19th October 2010, 19:55

Quick question ..... how big is the standard tank on a 250 ?My DR-Z250 had a 10.5L tank, good for 200-280km to dry, road use solo depending on how hard it was being flogged. Maybe 150km in the forest.

warewolf

19th October 2010, 20:04

It's kind of a catch 22 - there is nowhere in this country where an off road bike needs a 300km range, and the even if there was, the off road handling is so compromised by that much gas, you wouldn't fill it.Yep. My 640A holds 19kg of fuel for 400-580km range. I always try to do the gnarliest stuff with less than half a tank full. Just unnecessary weight which even if the bike seems to cope reasonably well, is simply tiring to manhandle and makes the bike much less nimble.

ADVGD

19th October 2010, 20:05

Article on expanding plastic gas tanks from dirtbikeworld (http://www.dirtbikeworld.net/forum/showthread.php?t=45540)

Paraphrased:

"It works, I have done it in the past.

First up rig up a way to put air pressure in your tank, I put a tyre valve in the breather tube, make sure it is secure, you want to keep the pressure in overnight.

Boil up lots and lots of water and get it into the tank as fast as possible.

Screw the cap on tight and use a hand pump and an accurate low pressure gauge, you only want about 5 psi in there.

You can help the tank to expand in the places you want it to with gentle application from a heat gun. When you think it has expanded enough, cover the tank with heavy towels or blankets to keep the heat in and leave it overnight to cool slowly.

It will shrink a little as it cools but if needed you can repeat the process. Check very carefully that as the tank expands it is not fouling or rubbing anything it shouldn't be, as this can create problems over time."