Boo hoooooooooo - Betty has BANGED!

[Ms Piggy]

I finally got my little girl back from the fabulous BLakamin who has done a fantastic paint job on her only to have her go "BANG!" and stop tonight.

I tell ya my Honda Rescus membership is the best $35- I ever spent :niceone:

Arrrghhh - exams looming, no money, 2 x G'n'T's, fabulous timing...feeling quite relaaaaaaaxed ashually. Off to Jaz's partay so lots of peeps to gimme sympathy. :drinkup: :drinkup: :drinkup: :drinkup: :drinkup: :drinkup: :drinkup:

[TonyB]

Jeeze, you have no luck at all with that bike, do you? Maybe it's cursed or possessed? Got you around the SI OK tho I guess

[Ms Piggy]

I guess she is getting on a bit in bike years.

[ajturbo]

NNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!

hope it can be fixed!!!:grouphug: :grouphug: :drinkup:

it is just a reminder that you really want that bigger bike !!!

[crashe]

awwww ya poor wee baby....

She just needs a bit more TLC.....

Well wrap her up nice and warm tonight....
since you are leaving her behind again....hehehehe. :rofl:
:drinkup: :drinkup: :drinkup: :drinkup:

[StoneChucker]

BUGGER!!!

Is it completely dead? Are you going to try fix it at some stage?
Let me know if you are TOTALLY stranded for getting to uni...

[Biff]

How bad a bang was the bang?
Fixieupable bang? Or Itllmakeaniceornament bang?

Sorry to hear about your ongoing woes mate.

[Wellyman]

bad luck eh. Hopefully it won't cost you to much. if you need anything give me a buzz via PM because I'm a part timer at Atomic Bike Wreckers so if you need parts I can help.

[toads]

Oh bugger, I hope she's not gone forever!, let us know what happens eh!

[pete376403]

Happy to help you with it if needed. Whats really gone bad with it??

[bear]

Stink! Hopefully a quick repair and you're off again.

[Ms Piggy]

Happy to help you with it if needed. Whats really gone bad with it??
Hey Pete - I still owe you beer from the last time you helped. :D

Any and all help gratefully accepted though - I have a horrid feeling it was a BIG BAD BADABOOM BANG. It happened literally 2 minutes from home so at least they didn't have to tow me too far. :weep:

I'll worry about it after exams though...oh and when I have some pingas to actually pay for it.

[Ms Piggy]

BUGGER!!!
Thanks hun - oh and thanks for the 'sorry your bike went bang' shooter last night :niceone:

[StoneChucker]

Thanks hun - oh and thanks for the 'sorry your bike went bang' shooter last night :niceone:
My pleasure :yes: They were actually quite nice. I'd tried two other flavours of the same range, and THEY were shocking.

[Ghost Lemur]

What sort of bang CSL?

I've still got the remainents of the Rodent in my gargre if you need some more bits.

You must be awfully close to getting your full. Maybe it's just your baby being loving and making the choice of moving up to a bigger bike easier for you.

[Joni]

Oh dear... sorry to hear this Cath... :cry:
Is she repairable? Or dont you know yet?

Hope it gets sorted real soon... :ride:

:sunny:

[pete376403]

Details needed - when it went "bang" did the back wheel lock? If it did lock, did the wheel start turning again when you pulled the clutch? (ie are we looking at a motor bang or a transmission bang? Did oil come out of the motor? (This assumes there was some in there to begin with...) Will it turn over on the starter motor and, if so, does it make bad noises, that is, worse than previously? (Don't be too persistant about this, if it won't turn, don't keep trying).
Let us know, might not be as bad as you think.

[LB]

;
;
Oh dear, I hope BB will be okay.....

Please keep us posted on progress (and best of luck with the exams!!)
;
;

[F5 Dave]

‘pparently it feels ‘grounchy’ when kick lever pushed down. Needs inspection. I’d offer Cath, but I need to find a house to live first, maybe when things have settled down. Someone?

[inlinefour]

Hope the wee Honda is up and running again soon CSL.

[James Deuce]

I think I can lay my hands on an entire CB250 bottom end including gearbox. How much would you be willing to spend, or do I buy it and we pass the hat around? I think CSL deserves our support on this one,.

[Hitcher]

I think I can lay my hands on an entire CB250 bottom end including gearbox. How much would you be willing to spend, or do I buy it and we pass the hat around? I think CSL deserves our support on this one,.
Happy to help a worthy cause! Can't let that new paint go to waste...

[Paul in NZ]

I'll help!

I'm not an hexpert on Honda motors (or anything except excessive consumption and bad manners) but before purchasing a bottom end and bit of a rudimentary investigation into the problem could be in order. ie We might end up with 2 good bottom ends! (and I'm always VERY suspicious of engines missing bits as it assumes it had a problem some place / time)

If we can find a serviceable unit....

We could have a transplant-a-thon at chez Nuttridge. A round the clock spanner twirling session until the job is done. Rabid teams of KB's fuelled on pizza, coffee and beer listening to dodgy music ripping out the old donk and installing the new...

Then..

With the beast strapped to a table we wait for a thunder storm and winch it up to the tallest part of the tower (the bit the lightening always hits), practise our maniacle laughter and Igor stands by to.. oh.. hang on thats a brain transplant..

But we could do it in town at someone else place too..

Cheers

[Ixion]

Mr Paul in NZ has a point.

Most likely bang on a motor that age is probably the cam chain going, leading to the valves shafting the piston.

Bottom end could be OK in that case. (might be munted too of course. Mr Conrod often objects to Mr Valve impeding his upward progress. )

Justa pure guess of course, but cam chains are always the weak point on OHC engines.

[F5 Dave]

Or if you're real lucky the starter motor has lunched itself. Best to check.

[Hitcher]

I'll help!

I'm not an hexpert on Honda motors (or anything except excessive consumption and bad manners) but before purchasing a bottom end and bit of a rudimentary investigation into the problem could be in order. ie We might end up with 2 good bottom ends! (and I'm always VERY suspicious of engines missing bits as it assumes it had a problem some place / time)

If we can find a serviceable unit....

We could have a transplant-a-thon at chez Nuttridge. A round the clock spanner twirling session until the job is done. Rabid teams of KB's fuelled on pizza, coffee and beer listening to dodgy music ripping out the old donk and installing the new...

Then..

With the beast strapped to a table we wait for a thunder storm and winch it up to the tallest part of the tower (the bit the lightening always hits), practise our maniacle laughter and Igor stands by to.. oh.. hang on thats a brain transplant..

But we could do it in town at someone else place too..

Cheers
Well said, Igor...

[Motu]

True Ixion - the CB250RS is an XR250 motor,famous for camchain stretch and inlet valves contacting piston with lots of bent metal.Bottom ends are good,I'd say a top end is required....or a chain...or...who knows.

[Paul in NZ]

True Ixion - the CB250RS is an XR250 motor,famous for camchain stretch and inlet valves contacting piston with lots of bent metal.Bottom ends are good,I'd say a top end is required....or a chain...or...who knows.

It's an XR250 engine you say.... very hinterestin'

Would say.... a 'bigger' XR engine fit relatively easlily?? Maybe??

[F5 Dave]

Yes, that was a common mod. Had an article on it somewhere. Problem is XR500 engines aren't exactly common or cheap nowadays.

[James Deuce]

Righty ho. The CBX250RS with missing head has been sold over the past weekend. For $130. So that idea is out.

My brother in law has a line on an XL250 and an XR250, so I'll report back when I find out what state they are. He's a motorcycle mechanic btw, and the CBX250 was alright. Thanks for the vote of no-confidence.

[Ixion]

Yes, that was a common mod. Had an article on it somewhere. Problem is XR500 engines aren't exactly common or cheap nowadays.
And would Ms Celtic Sea Lily want to cope with kickstarting a 500 single ?

[Motu]

Yes, that was a common mod. Had an article on it somewhere. Problem is XR500 engines aren't exactly common or cheap nowadays.

Because there were guys who could mono an XR500 forever - but being wet sump with low oil levels they only ran a few kms before stopping.Is the RS the radial 4 valve.....I forget,an' don't want to remember....

[Ms Piggy]

Awww shucks you guys! :grouphug: I dunno what to say :o Thanks for all the offers of help. I am (once again) humbled by the helpfulness and generosity of my KB mates...makes one go all silly & soppy actually.

However...I'll get back to you after exams - Tuesday the 21st is my last 1, and that will be promptly followed by comsumption of alcohol and food with fellow students. So some time over the next week I should be in a fit state to make arrangements for transporting Betty to anywhere.

[Paul in NZ]

Righty ho. The CBX250RS with missing head has been sold over the past weekend. For $130. So that idea is out.

My brother in law has a line on an XL250 and an XR250, so I'll report back when I find out what state they are. He's a motorcycle mechanic btw, and the CBX250 was alright. Thanks for the vote of no-confidence.

Sigh!

I hope you are not serious?

[Paul in NZ]

And would Ms Celtic Sea Lily want to cope with kickstarting a 500 single ?

Nah... I wus more wonderin if a GB400/500 motor would fit? Either would offer a lot more grunt and electic start. GB400's in particular would not be expensive..

Failing that, Powerall (Powerol spelling??) used to do cheap big bore kits which gets you a piston and cylinder if the head is OK... hmmm

[James Deuce]

Sigh!

I hope you are not serious?

Deadly. Pissed me right off. It's kind of normal for me though - it always seems to turn pear shaped at just the wrong moment. Having said that, this isn't about me.

The Cibby was an ex-apprentice project so it would either be really good, or really bad, so maybe it's a good thing it's gone.

[Paul in NZ]

Hmmm

HONDA, Parts & Services XR500A motor, 1980, $800. Ash King Honda, 38 Atkinson Road, RD 1, New Plymouth, Contact Ash King, Phone 06-753-6789.

[James Deuce]

Hmmm

HONDA, Parts & Services XR500A motor, 1980, $800. Ash King Honda, 38 Atkinson Road, RD 1, New Plymouth, Contact Ash King, Phone 06-753-6789.

Hmmm - a dollar each member and we'd have the cash, plus enough left over for a mammoth piss up.

[Paul in NZ]

Deadly. Pissed me right off. It's kind of normal for me though - it always seems to turn pear shaped at just the wrong moment. Having said that, this isn't about me.

The Cibby was an ex-apprentice project so it would either be really good, or really bad, so maybe it's a good thing it's gone.

Oh well.... Genuinely sorry you feel that way as it was not intended to be anything other than conversational. I just re read my post and didn't see much except common caution which was re confirmed by others more knowledgeable than me that the top end of those motors are the weak point and thus most bits are likely to be hard to find. Then again I'm well known as an insensitive jerk so my opinion aint worth much..

Oh well... Done is done and I can't change that :devil2:

[James Deuce]

Oh well.... Genuinely sorry you feel that way as it was not intended to be anything other than conversational. I just re read my post and didn't see much except common caution which was re confirmed by others more knowledgeable than me that the top end of those motors are the weak point and thus most bits are likely to be hard to find. Then again I'm well known as an insensitive jerk so my opinion aint worth much..

Oh well... Done is done and I can't change that :devil2:

Awwww the no-confidence bit - nah just being a fek-arse troll (wrong person bit - that'll serve me right), and then I thought you were talking about the price - you insensitive jerk :)

You better buy me a coffee then :D

[F5 Dave]

To clarify a teensy bit the CBX 250 is the later version that like to crack heads, the CB250RS (Deluxe -haha) is what our young belle is in possession of, & a different beast.

[James Deuce]

To clarify a teensy bit the CBX 250 is the later version that like to crack heads, the CB250RS (Deluxe -haha) is what our young belle is in possession of, & a different beast.

Yes I know - those bloody RFV heads.

[Paul in NZ]

To clarify a teensy bit the CBX 250 is the later version that like to crack heads, the CB250RS (Deluxe -haha) is what our young belle is in possession of, & a different beast.

So do you think a GB400 engine fit in easily ?? Or is it one of dem different later thingies as well... I know the 'simple' thing to do is relace the RS donk with an RS donk but being and idiot optomist I can't help but want to give it more power...

also... Correct me if I'm wrong but an XR 250 has dual carbs????? Is the head casting the same as CSL's??

Paul N

ps we are all gunna look stupid when it turns out to be something simple like one of the flywheel gnomes has fallen off his exercycle.

[James Deuce]

ps we are all gunna look stupid when it turns out to be something simple like one of the flywheel gnomes has fallen off his exercycle.

I'm pretty sure they went with pixies in the CB. The gnomes are early XRs only.

[Paul in NZ]

So do you think a GB400 engine fit in easily ?? Or is it one of dem different later thingies as well... I know the 'simple' thing to do is relace the RS donk with an RS donk but being and idiot optomist I can't help but want to give it more power...

also... Correct me if I'm wrong but an XR 250 has dual carbs????? Is the head casting the same as CSL's??

Paul N

ps we are all gunna look stupid when it turns out to be something simple like one of the flywheel gnomes has fallen off his exercycle.

bump......

[MSTRS]

also... Correct me if I'm wrong but an XR 250 has dual carbs????? Is the head casting the same as CSL's??


Mid 80's only. One of the 'Seemed like a good idea at the time' sort. Don't touch.

[XTC]

XR250A motor is the same though I think the gearbox ratio's differ. It will be cheaper to rebuild the existing motor as ther are still plenty of parts out there. Any way it's hard to tell what's needed till she's stripped. The bike that is - not CSL....

[Ixion]

XR250A motor is the same though I think the gearbox ratio's differ. It will be cheaper to rebuild the existing motor as ther are still plenty of parts out there. Any way it's hard to tell what's needed till she's stripped. The bike that is - not CSL....

I suspect the cam profiles might be different too.(Don't know for sure though so if someone who does says I'm wrong, believe them) That was usually what they did in that era, shove a trailie engine into a road frame, and change the gearing, cam profiles (more high rev power less bottom end) , and tweak the carbs and exhaust to suit. Maybe a higher comp ratio, though the trailies were usually pretty high to start with.

Exactly the same on the Yamahas (SRX250, XT250, TT250). Suzuki and Kawasaki both did the same also, though I can't remember the model numbers.

[ManDownUnder]

And would Ms Celtic Sea Lily want to cope with kickstarting a 500 single ?

If I can paraphrase that to make it accurate...

more like the 500 would start kicking CSL (in the ankle...)

.... ouchies!

[Motu]

I suspect the cam profiles might be different too.(Don't know for sure though so if someone who does says I'm wrong, believe them) That was usually what they did in that era, shove a trailie engine into a road frame, and change the gearing, cam profiles (more high rev power less bottom end) , and tweak the carbs and exhaust to suit. Maybe a higher comp ratio, though the trailies were usually pretty high to start with.

Exactly the same on the Yamahas (SRX250, XT250, TT250). Suzuki and Kawasaki both did the same also, though I can't remember the model numbers.

I think you are right,from memory the CB250RS seemed happier to rev than the XR250,the XR was a bit asthmatic in the top end.The gearbox seemed closer ratio too.But I forgot what colour the socks I put on this morning are....(I could look,but I'm trying to improve my memory see...)

[Paul in NZ]

Yes but is a GB engine the same (mounting wise) as an XR engine?

My theory is that GB400 motors will not be hard to find as everyone wants the 500... and some folk will want to put XR600/650 engines in to GB's anyway..

But a GB400 would provide a significant upgrade to a 250 and give electric starting.

Cheers

[XTC]

Yes but is a GB engine the same (mounting wise) as an XR engine?

My theory is that GB400 motors will not be hard to find as everyone wants the 500... and some folk will want to put XR600/650 engines in to GB's anyway..

But a GB400 would provide a significant upgrade to a 250 and give electric starting.

Cheers
I think the GB motor mounts are different to the early CB/XR engines. Engine cases are definitely different. XR/CB has no oil filtration either (unless you count the mesh screen hidden behind the clutch cover) so very regular oil changes are a must on these bikes.

[vifferman]

It's an XR250 engine you say.... very hinterestin'

Would say.... a 'bigger' XR engine fit relatively easlily?? Maybe??
Indeed.
My XBR500RS Mutant was a CB250RS with an XR500 engine. The bottom is essentially the same, but the top end requires a cut'n'shut of the bottom of the fuel tank, the top engine mount on the rocker cover removed, and there isn't much rooom for the 500's carb (unless you use the twin-carb one).

And mine was OK to kickstart - even though the decompression lever was missing. Just fold the righthand footpeg up, find TDC on compression stroke, and kick it through. :yes:

[Paul in NZ]

Indeed.
My XBR500RS Mutant was a CB250RS with an XR500 engine. The bottom is essentially the same, but the top end requires a cut'n'shut of the bottom of the fuel tank, the top engine mount on the rocker cover removed, and there isn't much rooom for the 500's carb (unless you use the twin-carb one).

And mine was OK to kickstart - even though the decompression lever was missing. Just fold the righthand footpeg up, find TDC on compression stroke, and kick it through. :yes:

And was it worth the effort???? I should imagine summat like that would be a bit of fun!

[James Deuce]

If I can paraphrase that to make it accurate...

more like the 500 would start kicking CSL (in the ankle...)

.... ouchies!

You guys who haven't met her - I doubt there is an organic or mechanical construct that she can't subdue - but then I'm scared of her.

[sels1]

Ionly to have her go "BANG!" and stop tonight.
:

Oh No CSL! just caught up with the news.. the new paint and seat was too bag a shock for her eh?

[Ms Piggy]

You guys who haven't met her - I doubt there is an organic or mechanical construct that she can't subdue - but then I'm scared of her.
I knew those were the words I was looking for ;) Don't be scared Jim (much). :devil2:

Although I'll confess to being the recipient of a rather large bruise, a week ago, on my right shin...after kickstarting my little beastie successfully many times, she decided not to play along. It was that kind of pain that causes silence (yup and this me we're speaking...not silent very often!) and then it goes in waves right through your body so that you are just about hyper ventilating.

Anyhoo - as far as the bike goes, I need to pull apart the engine and take a look. And well...errr...I dunno how to do that. So after exams I'll be hoping to ellicit some assistance from the fab KB crew I have been fortuinate enough to aquant myself with (I should be a professional greaser aye!).

[vifferman]

And was it worth the effort???? I should imagine summat like that would be a bit of fun!
I inherited it when it was in a bit of a sorry state, but with the engine already installed. It needed a valve grind, rejetting, new tahrs, and a complete repaint (frame, engine, tank, guards, etc.) So, I disassembled the whole bike, sent the head off to me uncle (engineering tutor at the tech), and got busy with the sandpaper and spray cans. Cost me $600 for all of that, and then I spend quite a bit of time fiddling to get it to run right. Lotsa fun, both the fettling/fiddling and riding (good wheelie machine). Sold it after a few years for $800.

[Wolf]

So after exams I'll be hoping to illicit some assistance from the fab KB crew I have been fortuinate enough to aquant myself with
No need to break the law - else you might have to elicit the assistance of a good lawyer (if there is such a thing) :whistle:

[Ms Piggy]

No need to break the law - else you might have to elicit the assistance of a good lawyer (if there is such a thing) :whistle:
Oooppps! Thanks for that!

[Ms Piggy]

This time I have teken her to get fixed. They're going to put a helicoil in cos there is no thread left.

I guess I better go have some breakfast & go to work now...just when I thought I was gonna have a cruisey morning and the traffic was so good coming into town from my man's place in Tawa - it only took 15 minutes! Ah well, at least it didn't happen on the M/W...which is where I lost the newly painted side cover last night on my wat out to Tawa :(

Take a deep breath & think caaaaaaaalm thoughts. Ahhhhhhhhhhhh.

[Ms Piggy]

Yay! The world id perfect again. She is ready & it's only gonna be $57-. Cheers Boyles Kawasaki! :2thumbsup

[Wolf]

Great to hear, Cath.

When I first got my Zundapp it had a brass spacer around the plug - someone had drilled out the hole and threaded it to accommodate a whacking great brass plug with a hole in the centre to take the sparkplug. Obviously the original thread had stripped and this had been quickly done to get the bike running again. It wasn't working properly and the bike was running like a pig.

Someone suggested "Ashford Motors" - a one-man show just out of Hamilscum - so I wandered out there. The guy, Brent (I think), was quite young but he knew his biz. The head sat round for ages until I hit upon the tactic of turning up and not leaving til it was finished. That seemed, on observation, to be the way he preferred to work - don't just drop it off and expect it done, stick around and watch as he fixes it.


As I said, he knew his biz:

He determined that when they bored out the hole they had gone off centre. Also, the brass whatsit was a "T" cross section, the top of which rested on the outside of the head when screwed in, the sparkplug then screwed on top of that, meaning that unless the plug had the longest thread on the planet, it did not reach down into the combustion chamber and fuel-air mix had to waft up into the brass thingy before it would ignite - that kind of fouled up the firing.

Brent drilled out the hole even larger, getting it properly centred, he then drilled a counter sink hole in from the top of the head and tapped the central hole. He then lathed a piece of steel into a "T" shape and had to use the lathe to cut a thread on the thinner bit. He then drilled and tapped a hole for the spark plug. When he finally applied some loc-tite and screwed the plug into the hole it was perfect - on the outside of the head was a flat circular area with a hole in it, you had to look hard at the edge to see there was a gap between the flat bit and the rest of the head - it looked like someone had merely planed off a bit of the curved surface to create a place to accommodate the sparkplug.

Similarly, the inside of the head was a curved bowl with a flat circular area with a barely discernible gap around the edge - nowhere was it recessed into, or raised up from, the original head to suggest that it was a separate piece - it looked like the head had been machined into that shape - not quite a perfectly round bowl.

When fitted, the sparkplug protruded the proper distance from the underside of the head ensuring that a spark would be delivered straight into the mix.

Cost? I can't recall exactly, but it was certainly less than $80 and he had custom machined the damned thing, corrected two glaring faults and paid a meticulous attention to his task that I would have only expected from a much older "craftsman".

Honestly, to see such a loving attention to detail from a young-un as he made the insert was remarkable.

[sels1]

Yay! The world id perfect again. She is ready ! :2thumbsup


good to hear it CSL - going riding tomorrow?

[ajturbo]

This time I have teken her to get fixed. They're going to put a helicoil in cos there is no thread left.

I guess I better go have some breakfast & go to work now...just when I thought I was gonna have a cruisey morning and the traffic was so good coming into town from my man's place in Tawa - it only took 15 minutes! Ah well, at least it didn't happen on the M/W...which is where I lost the newly painted side cover last night on my wat out to Tawa :(

Take a deep breath & think caaaaaaaalm thoughts. Ahhhhhhhhhhhh.

ahhh bugger matey..

you will have to follow where you went and look for it.....
today i lost a cover that said "650 turbo"..NOOooooooooooooooooo...
only noticed it when i got home..... :mad:

[Blakamin]

..which is where I lost the newly painted side cover last night on my wat out to Tawa :(

Take a deep breath & think caaaaaaaalm thoughts. Ahhhhhhhhhhhh.
the good one???? oh shit..... I have about 20mls of that colour and she might be a bitch to match.... I need a drink :drinkup:

[scumdog]

ahhh bugger matey..

you will have to follow where you went and look for it.....
today i lost a cover that said "650 turbo"..NOOooooooooooooooooo...
only noticed it when i got home..... :mad:

Man, that would so gap your axe, not like the local bike wrecker will have one, - at any price!

[Bonez]

Yay! The world id perfect again. She is ready & it's only gonna be $57-. Cheers Boyles Kawasaki! :2thumbsup Cath I'm glad the bang was a wee bang and not a big BANG. I may have a spare RS side cover, blue I think, laying around in the gargre if you are interested? What side?

[Ms Piggy]

the good one???? oh shit..... I have about 20mls of that colour and she might be a bitch to match.... I need a drink :drinkup:
Oh shit alright! :( Actually it fell off on the night I picked the bike up from you and we found it again but this time I was just out of the tunnel and on the M/W - not a chance of finding it. At least she's going again. :yes: