High speed racing bike vs car

[Monty69]

I wish we had roads like this in NZ, and more car drivers like this who are skilled and keen to play...:niceone:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mW9rV0z_ozc

[Ronin]

I wish we had roads like this in NZ, and more car drivers like this who are skilled and keen to play...:niceone:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mW9rV0z_ozc

I wish I had a big gun so I could shoot ignorant cunts like that. I'm not normally all PC but fuck that.

[pritch]

I guess all involved enjoyed themselves. There were a lot of things that could have turned to mud very quickly though.

The way other drivers got out of the way impressed me. Unlikely to happen in this country I'm afraid...

[onearmedbandit]

Saw that vid a couple months back, my arse puckered when he stepped it out sideways next to the two bikes.

[Flip]

Cool, love the way the guy adjusts the air con when chasing the bikes.

[Katman]

New Zealand doesn't have the monopoly on retarded road users.

[onearmedbandit]

New Zealand doesn't have the monopoly on retarded road users.

You'd almost think so, but thanks to the internet we now find it's a world wide issue.

[cbfb]

I wish I had a big gun so I could shoot ignorant cunts like that. I'm not normally all PC but fuck that.

I've got a couple, let's do it. Fucking retards.

[bogan]

New Zealand doesn't have the monopoly on retarded road users.

not a monopoly, but a significant market share :facepalm:

[gatch]

That would be fun on the nordschleife..

[tri boy]

He may have a nice Porche, but his teeth are f##ked.
No girlfriend = no root= high jizz build up obviously.
(for the record, the riders were wallies too) MHO

[McWild]

Give me 35k corners any day.

That was just retarded.



Edit: I should mention, if that guy was stepping out the back end on a GT3 while going the same corner speed as a bike that isn't even on full lean, he either isn't "skilled" or needs to spend more money on tyres.

[steve_t]

Was there a cyclist or a moped rider passed somewhere along the way?

[marty]

I'm sure I saw a child about to walk out onto the road

[st00ji]

countersteer at those speeds, that close to bikes... that gave me the shivers, and i've got no idea who those mentals are.

[Ronin]

I'm sure I saw a child about to walk out onto the road

3 puppies died.

[racefactory]

Thanks mate I enjoyed the video.

Probs to the porsche driver, not bad skills at all... he was cornering nicely on the edge trying to keep up with those bikes.

[avgas]

Pfffffttt pussies.
No corners there - its basically a drag race.
a case of who has the faster bike/car.

NZ should expect this if they keep cutting up the good roads to make way for "safer"
highways.

I am still pissed about what the K gorge now looks like.

[YellowDog]

Thanks mate I enjoyed the video.

Probs to the porsche driver, not bad skills at all... he was cornering nicely on the edge trying to keep up with those bikes.

Those 911s don't corner well. With the way he was fighting the wheel and his poor cornering lines; if it wasn't for stability controland active suspension, he'd have been off the road.

His cornering seemed to get better as the video progressed.

IMHO, probabbly a little fast given the amount of traffic on the road.

[onearmedbandit]

Those 911s don't corner well.

Really? Maybe the 993 models and prior (excluding the 4wd variants), but 996 models onwards, including the rwd models have superb handling. In fact even the early ones do, so long as you don't back off mid-corner.

Look here (http://www.ultimasports.co.uk/Content.aspx?f=record4) for skid pan test results.

[Toaster]

IMHO, probabbly a little fast given the amount of traffic on the road.

I agree totally. On a track, fine.... but on a public road where the speed differential between the traffic and this guy racing the bikes is so great? Just plain stupid.

[YellowDog]

Really? Maybe the 993 models and prior (excluding the 4wd variants), but 996 models onwards, including the rwd models have superb handling. In fact even the early ones do, so long as you don't back off mid-corner.

Look here (http://www.ultimasports.co.uk/Content.aspx?f=record4) for skid pan test results.

I'm a bit bias here as I used to drive a 928S4 very very quickly and with its 51%/49% balance, it would p!ss all over the 911s. That's until they got all the electronic management gismos :no:

[Toaster]

they got all the electronic management gismos :no:


That is one thing that takes away from the experience of driving - too many techno bits running the show, rather than the driver themselves. To me that is one of the beautiful things about motorcycling - it still feels like a raw riding experience and not by computers and gizmos.

[mattian]

Don't they have a way of tracking down morons that upload videos like this and impounding their vehicles?

[YellowDog]

That is one thing that takes away from the experience of driving - too many techno bits running the show, rather than the driver themselves. To me that is one of the beautiful things about motorcycling - it still feels like a raw riding experience and not by computers and gizmos.

100% with you on that one.

Take an 80kph bend in a Porsche 911 and the dampers stop the car leaning the opposite way to the bend. Other than the back and arm strength of the driver, there's nothing to stop the driver leaning the wrong way.

Bikes corner properly :yes:

[Flip]

That is one thing that takes away from the experience of driving - too many techno bits running the show, rather than the driver themselves. To me that is one of the beautiful things about motorcycling - it still feels like a raw riding experience and not by computers and gizmos.

Yea not like bikes have slipper clutches and traction control now days.

I think the bikers were wimps. Given the road was basically straight and the bikes had at least twice the power to weight ratio of the 911 they should have left the car in their dust.

[Dave-]

Pfffffttt pussies.
No corners there - its basically a drag race.
a case of who has the faster bike/car.

NZ should expect this if they keep cutting up the good roads to make way for "safer"
highways.

I am still pissed about what the K gorge now looks like.

yeah that was my thought exactly, NZ does have roads like that big wide pissy shitty corners.....it's called state highway 1, although their surface is probably nicer than SH1.

also agree with flip, the bikes should have smoked the porsche

[EJK]

That Porsche sounds amazing.

[Kickaha]

also agree with flip, the bikes should have smoked the porsche

On that road they might, anything with a decent amount of corners, especially slower ones the bikes would get dicked

[racefactory]

Those 911s don't corner well. With the way he was fighting the wheel and his poor cornering lines; if it wasn't for stability controland active suspension, he'd have been off the road.

His cornering seemed to get better as the video progressed.

IMHO, probabbly a little fast given the amount of traffic on the road.

Watch any nurburgring record or fast road car lap or GT500 qualifying... the wheel is all over the place. The guy was doing alright... lets see you do it better.

[Marmoot]

Those 911s don't corner well. With the way he was fighting the wheel and his poor cornering lines; if it wasn't for stability controland active suspension, he'd have been off the road.

His cornering seemed to get better as the video progressed.

IMHO, probabbly a little fast given the amount of traffic on the road.

It looks like a GT3, and what looks like a bumpy road. The suspension would be too hard as it is designed for track (or smooth Euro roads) use.
A bit like using MotoGP bike on Isle of Man TT race, I bet (oh would love to see that, wouldn't we? :) )

[racefactory]

On that road they might, anything with a decent amount of corners, especially slower ones the bikes would get dicked

Maybe with you riding buddy.

[gatch]

It's hard to argue with physics..

F1 vs motogp ? Top fuel rail vs top fuel bike ?

The deciding factor being tire contact patch and down force..

[Kickaha]

Maybe with you riding buddy.

You obviously don't have to much of a clue about fast cars

[onearmedbandit]

Maybe with you riding buddy.


Think about it for one minute. Think about the 4 large contact patches compared to our two small patches. Then think about all the electric aids a car like a late model 911 has. You'll out drag him out of a corner, maybe. You'll get him on the straight, until really high speeds are on. But you'll get destroyed on the brakes and corner speed.

[racefactory]

It's hard to argue with physics..

F1 vs motogp ? Top fuel rail vs top fuel bike ?

The deciding factor being tire contact patch and down force..

Yeah that's mad downforce don't be rediculous. Aerodynamics more advanced than fucking planes. A road car on road legal tyres will hardly pull any more lateral G than a sports bike if any. With top tyres in steady hands a sportbike will hit nearly 1.2 and sustain close to that... love cars, love bikes butplease don't get me started.

Comparing F1 to Motogp is so juvenile I don't want to even start. Motogp are barely any faster than world superbikes around most tracks with off the shelf Pirelli Diablo slicks. Compare it to something at least resembling road cars like JGTC/GT500 or FIA GT and you'll then see a reasonably fair 'comparison'. Those cars barely share any originality with their road counterparts anyway (different engines shifted rearwards, 330 section tyres, dog engagement transaxles, entirely carbon fibre body) and SBK bikes of a fraction the price will still lap the same as them.

[bogan]

It's hard to argue with physics..


Oh i dunno, it ain't too hard to get into an argument, but it's pretty fucking hard to win one :msn-wink:

[Dave-]

On that road they might, anything with a decent amount of corners, especially slower ones the bikes would get dicked

yeah the GT3's nick superbikes around ruapuna....

[gatch]

Yeah that's mad downforce you idiot. A road car on road legal tyres will hardly pull any more lateral G than a sports bike if any. With top tyres in steady hands a sportbike will hit 1.2 and sustain near that... love cars, love bikes butplease don't get me started.

Comparing F1 to Motogp is so juvenile I don't want to even start. Motogp are barely any faster than world superbikes around most tracks with off the shelf Pirelli Diablo slicks. Compare it to something at least resembling road cars like JGTC/GT500 or FIA GT and you'll then see a reasonably fair 'comparison'. Those cars barely share any originality with their road counterparts anyway (different engines shifted rearwards, 330 section tyres, dog engagement transaxle tranny, entirely carbon fibre body built for downforce) and SBK bikes of a fraction the price will still lap faster than them.

Don't be ridiculous.

Ok, all ridiculousness aside.

Fastest lap at manfield is set by a go kart..

[racefactory]

Ok, all ridiculousness aside.

Fastest lap at manfield is set by a go kart..

go karts are totally insane... awesome.

[gatch]

A road car on road legal tyres will hardly pull any more lateral G than a sports bike if any. With top tyres in steady hands a sportbike will hit nearly 1.2 and sustain close to that...

You can sustain 1.2 lateral G at 250kph plus ?

[racefactory]

What circuit could it be possible on? Not even Suzuka 130R is 250!

[onearmedbandit]

What circuit could it be possible on? Not even Suzuka 130R is 250!

Huh? Are you saying there are no tracks with corners that are taken at 250km/h or greater?

[racefactory]

Meant to say in NZ. Motegi and Assen have corners those speeds though! Insane.

[gatch]

What circuit could it be possible on? Not even Suzuka 130R is 250!

Since we aren't being ridiculous, I was assuming you were talking about being on the road here..

[Dave-]

The deciding factor being tire contact patch and down force..

not the contact patch, but the down force helps yes.

[YellowDog]

Yeah that's mad downforce you idiot. A road car on road legal tyres will hardly pull any more lateral G than a sports bike if any. With top tyres in steady hands a sportbike will hit nearly 1.2 and sustain close to that... love cars, love bikes butplease don't get me started.

Comparing F1 to Motogp is so juvenile I don't want to even start. Motogp are barely any faster than world superbikes around most tracks with off the shelf Pirelli Diablo slicks. Compare it to something at least resembling road cars like JGTC/GT500 or FIA GT and you'll then see a reasonably fair 'comparison'. Those cars barely share any originality with their road counterparts anyway (different engines shifted rearwards, 330 section tyres, dog engagement transaxles, entirely carbon fibre body) and SBK bikes of a fraction the price will still lap the same as them.

Don't be ridiculous.

This twat settles the argument quite well:

<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/ZZKRphfVHqI?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/ZZKRphfVHqI?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>

[Camshaft]

luky no1 died

[macros87]

This twat settles the argument quite well:

<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/ZZKRphfVHqI?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/ZZKRphfVHqI?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>

doesn't seem to always work out that way... I do wonder if the cbr600 was the right fit for the challenge though.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WaWoo82zNUA

<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/WaWoo82zNUA?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/WaWoo82zNUA?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>

[EJK]

<object width="640" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/KUwzXDaQgDw?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/KUwzXDaQgDw?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="640" height="385"></embed></object>

[racefactory]

doesn't seem to always work out that way... I do wonder if the cbr600 was the right fit for the challenge though.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WaWoo82zNUA

<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/WaWoo82zNUA?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/WaWoo82zNUA?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>

Please do me a favor and don't get me started mate :)

Without getting technical here... This is a horrible representation of a fair contest. As much as i love Top Gear- Clarkson is a well known big hater of motorcycles and the whole thing is really just a fun joke. If you watch this video you will see that this rider is anything but riding hard and is pootling around almost leisurely, even being held up by the Atom at points. The rider most likely does not know the circuit. I am surprised the bike was only 4 seconds behind. An educated guess would suggest CBR600RR would whoop that thing.

If Clarkson really wanted to show his point, why did they bother getting hold of a 600 instead of a 1000 and a rider of professional caliber on par with Stig. It's a joke.

If you really want to argue this one then I could give you reference to MANY serious tests from reputable car and motoring magazines such as Road and Track.

If anyone is interested I can dig out some issues of the quality car mag ''Speed'' , one in particular which took a stock 2005 ZX6R that whooped the XS engineering 589HP R34 (slicks etc etc) and a 500HP Z06 (You don't want to know what the ZX10R did). It's an extremely interesting and methodical article and they even performed SKID PAD lateral G tests with the bikes which not even the avereage biking magazine would dream of.

In a nutshell, without extreme down-force modifications (under-tray with air vortex splitters and venturis, advanced air flow management both in and outside car), rider and driver of equal ability... production road cars (including purpose built road legal track cars) will have an extremely hard time reliably beating a ''jump on and ride'' stock sports motorcycle around a circuit.

I study engineering and track performance is one of my passions that I could just go on and on with! :) .... Really though, they are just apples and oranges.

[YellowDog]

Agree with your comparison. On that track, the Atom may well be better. But the Atom isn't a road car just anyone can buy. A big bore track bike may well have produced a different result.

[Dave-]

But seriously, why is it when you talk to people about which is faster, do they start talking about the contact patchs?

[racefactory]

But seriously, why is it when you talk to people about which is faster, do they start talking about the contact patchs?

Know what you mean and it drives me nuts! Have they heard of μ me thinks?

[onearmedbandit]

So contact patch has no effect on braking performance? Or ability to get power down? Will a 155 offer as much 'grip' as a 235?

[Dave-]

Know what you mean and it drives me nuts! Have they heard of μ me thinks?

I don't think they've heard of the normal force either, which makes explaining the equation difficult.

[racefactory]

@ onearmedbandit

what that guy said ^^^

[bogan]

So contact patch has no effect on braking performance? Or ability to get power down? Will a 155 offer as much 'grip' as a 235?

depends whether you're on a bike, or in a physics 101 lecture :shifty:

[Kickaha]

or in a physics 101 lecture :shifty:

Don't people just go to shit like that so they can post big boring explanations with equations to make themselves feel superior to others on the forums?

[onearmedbandit]

Yer iz just a fick biker, tieing ma shoolazers iz hurd nuff foor me.

[Katman]

Yer iz just a fick biker, tieing ma shoolazers iz hurd nuff foor me.

You spelt 4 wrong.

[Kickaha]

Yer iz just a fick biker, tieing ma shoolazers iz hurd nuff foor me.

Buy some slip on boots

[rwh]

depends whether you're on a bike, or in a physics 101 lecture :shifty:

It's too long since I did the physics, but I remember contemplating this. I concluded that dissipating the same amount of energy over a bigger tyre won't heat it up so fast - so it's less likely to melt.

Richard

[bogan]

It's too long since I did the physics, but I remember contemplating this. I concluded that dissipating the same amount of energy over a bigger tyre won't heat it up so fast - so it's less likely to melt.

Richard

also rubber is pretty flexible, and road surface ain't too flat.

[Dave-]

But seriously, why is it when you talk to people about tyre heat, do they think it comes from the tyre touching or rubbing or contacting the road....

[Kickaha]

But seriously, why is it when you talk to people about tyre heat, do they think it comes from the tyre touching or rubbing or contacting the road....

Wot? does it come from leaving them out in the sun?

[bogan]

Wot? does it come from leaving them out in the sun?

<img src="http://www.ijdmotorsport.com/acatalog/MOTO%20GP%20TYRE%20WARMERS.jpg" />

that sorta thing might do it :msn-wink:

seriously though, it comes from flexing of the tyre wall/carcass/whatever it called, which flexes cos, well, the road init :bleh:

[Banditbandit]

You spelt 4 wrong.

You didn't spell it at all ..

[Banditbandit]

Buy some slip on boots

Zips ... Zips ...

[Matt Bleck]

<img src="http://www.ijdmotorsport.com/acatalog/MOTO%20GP%20TYRE%20WARMERS.jpg" />

that sorta thing might do it :msn-wink:

seriously though, it comes from flexing of the tyre wall/carcass/whatever it called, which flexes cos, well, the road init :bleh:

...ahhh what about friction?

[Dave-]

...ahhh what about friction?

what friction?

[onearmedbandit]

what friction?

Static friction. Unless the tyre is slipping.