Motorcycle transport dispute - advice required

[dreamR]

hey guys, i am having a dispute with the company which transported my bike to me when I bought it.

I dont think it would be in good taste to name and shame them at this point, but lets just say they're one of the main 3(ish) bike transporting companies in NZ.

This is a bit of long story but put simply, the bike turned up with a nasty gouge on the right hand side of the tank which it should not have had.

The situation is that the old owner claims the damage was not there when it left him, and that he signed a transport company document showing damage to the left side of the tank (very minor scratches in the clear coat) and that he DID NOT sign for any damage on the right hand side of the tank. I have his statement in writing(email). Needless to say the document that arrived with the bike had damage reported on both sides of the tank.

I have been trying sort this out since before xmas, with the transport company owner claiming numerous times to get back to me, without returning any calls at all. I managed to get hold him today whereby he has said that he doesn't beleive the old owners claim that the damage wasn't there, and beleives his own driver who claims the document was signed for both sides of tank. He however has agreed to pay half the amount for the damage (total repair cost about $300).

A couple of comments from members of this forum reckon the damage was most probably done from something rubbing against the paint work continuously (i.e. a fallen harley davidson riding next to it, or a tie down strap/buckle!!!!). The bike painter I took the bike to for a quote on the damage also pointed this out when assessing the it. this type of damage would be very hard to do under normal circumstances, i.e. not a single part of the bike has any damage in a region which could suggest a crash.

It is pretty clear to me that the damage has occured during transport, either way one party is lying, and logic says that it isnt the old owners. They were great to deal with during the purchase and didnt let me down in any way. I had the bike looked at by an independant party before I bought it and he said the damage was definately not there- this inspection was one week before shipping. This person also vouched for the integrity of the old owners at the time. when the bike was delivered i quizzed the driver on the damage and he denyed causing it, saying the bike was the only one in the trailor (I later found out that there was a harley in the trailor with my bike!) and that it looks like the handle bars hit the tank- they dont even reach the tank at full lock!

So where I'm at is that I dont think the damage should be on me at all, I dont want to pay anything for this! one of the factors which led me to have the bike shipped up rather than riding it myself was that it had damage cover insurance of up to $1500!

sorry for the long rant but What do you guys think about this? Small claims court? are there any details I can elaborate on?

Pics of damage below.

[Latte]

Can you track down the Harley owner? Chances are part of their bike has the matching damage.

[Crazy Steve]

Bad news dude..

I would take the $300 on offer and put some black tape on it.

And ride your new bike and enjoy it.. Theres a chance is going to get blown over in the wind this week anyway aye ? And will do more damage.

Crazy Steve.

[Cloggy]

Does the old owner have a copy of the transport document which he signed?
Does the transport document which arrived with the bike show the old owner's signature?
If the old owner has a copy of the transport document which cleary only states damage to one side, then I would hold the transport company liable.
If the transport company can produce a document signed by the old owner which stated damage to both sides, then you can't hold the transport company liable.

[Mully]

So where I'm at is that I dont think the damage should be on me at all, I dont want to pay anything for this! one of the factors which led me to have the bike shipped up rather than riding it myself was that it had damage cover insurance of up to $1500!

Claim on this.

Or, lodge a claim on the carrier (formally in writing).

[dreamR]

Does the old owner have a copy of the transport document which he signed?
Does the transport document which arrived with the bike show the old owner's signature?
If the old owner has a copy of the transport document which cleary only states damage to one side, then I would hold the transport company liable.
If the transport company can produce a document signed by the old owner which stated damage to both sides, then you can't hold the transport company liable.

The company does not give a copy to the sender. the copy they had was signed, but according to the old owner, not for all the damage. I beleive the driver has simply added the damage to the document after it happened. the company needs to give a carbon copy of the document or similar, but its to late now.

The company has offered me $150 for the damage, however I dont really feel all that confident in actually receiving it!

[dreamR]

Claim on this.

Or, lodge a claim on the carrier (formally in writing).

the company has said that the excess is $500, which is more than repair cost, so he wont help with that at all

[rocketman1]

Mate I thinks this sucks and I feel for you.
I have thought about using a motorcycle freight company in the past and have always feared this may happen.
To me this damage certainly looks like freight damage, I have seen similar damage on my motocross bikes I have trailer-ed over the last 30 years.
Whether the damage was caused prior to or during the trip is best for you to gauge as you are the one talking to both parties.
From what you have said my vote for the damage would be the freight company
Good Luck, but I think you should state the company name so as to take the blame off the others companies

[Mully]

the company has said that the excess is $500, which is more than repair cost, so he wont help with that at all

Carriage of Goods Act 1979 is your friend.

Lodge a claim in writing. And do some Googling to see the expiration time (I think you have 12 months to launch action if you've advised them within 5 days)

Make it his problem.

[dreamR]

Carriage of Goods Act 1979 is your friend.

Lodge a claim in writing. And do some Googling to see the expiration time (I think you have 12 months to launch action if you've advised them within 5 days)

Make it his problem.

thanks mate. i'll check that out. one thing that concerns me is that Im not totally sure on what i agreed to when i signed the receipt document when the bike was delivered...

[Mully]

thanks mate. i'll check that out. one thing that concerns me is that Im not totally sure on what i agreed to when i signed the receipt document when the bike was delivered...

That might have fucked you, TBH, if you signed for it clean.

But then Trucky McTruckerson wouldn't be offering to settle with you if that was the case.

Good luck

[phill-k]

As you had a good relationship with the seller ask them to complete and sign a short affidavit stating there was not damage to that side of the tank, also get the repairer to do the same stating that the damage could only have occurred by the intrusion of another bike or similar laying down on your bike.
Lodge a formal claim with the freight company and advise them that you have the said documents on hand and will make a claim through the small claims court -$20 and its good fun.
I'd say the company will probably just roll over as they will no doubt be self insuring for the $1500 liability under the carriage of goods act.

[swbarnett]

The company does not give a copy to the sender.
This is utter crap!

This is a good reason not to deal with this company.

If I sign something I fully expect to get a copy and would not accept otherwise.

Does anybody know what the legal position is? I though you had a right to a copy of anything with your signature.

[cbfb]

I'm currently going after someone via the Disputes Tribunal (I think that's what people mean by small claims court) for something non-bike. It's an easy process that does not involve lawyers. Costs $30 minimum, although costs increase slightly as value of claim increases. Go to your local court house to file the necessary paperwork. Took me about 10 mins to fill in the form (and I was slightly drunk at the time).

[NinjaNanna]

Seriously, you need to decide whether the $150 is worth your time, trouble and stress.

Don't turn a matter of principle into a full on crusade when the whole thing could have been settled for $150. That'd be my approach anyway.

[Crazy Steve]

Seriously, you need to decide whether the $150 is worth your time, trouble and stress.

Don't turn a matter of principle into a full on crusade when the whole thing could have been settled for $150. That'd be my approach anyway.

Good advise.... I would also not pay any more than $500 to repair that damage.

Or I would try and fix it myself !

Crazy Steve.

[spajohn]

Pics of damage below.

Hi, I had the exact same situation with a fridge. Basically transport are not subject to the consumer laws as other businesses. I spoke to Consumer Affairs and was lucky enough to strike someone with an interest in this flaw, and wanted to use my case as evidence to address this law. Long story short after several months, and her arguing directly with the company, I got a full refund (less gst?!) for the shipping costs...in my case it wasn't worth going down an insurance route and repair wasn't an option due to age etc, though in yours you obviously want the damage fixed.

Send me a PM with your details and I'm happy to put you in contact with her.

cheers,
John

[oneofsix]

you can do the 'kiwi thing', don't forget to grab your ankles, or you can take spajohn's approach and try to fix the system. :niceone:

[ukusa]

I'm currently going after someone via the Disputes Tribunal (I think that's what people mean by small claims court) for something non-bike. It's an easy process that does not involve lawyers. Costs $30 minimum, although costs increase slightly as value of claim increases. Go to your local court house to file the necessary paperwork. Took me about 10 mins to fill in the form (and I was slightly drunk at the time).

+ 1 for this option. Take all the evidence (sworn statement from previous owner etc) when it comes up.

[swbarnett]

Seriously, you need to decide whether the $150 is worth your time, trouble and stress.

Don't turn a matter of principle into a full on crusade when the whole thing could have been settled for $150. That'd be my approach anyway.
It's exactly because it is a matter of principle that it should be taken further. Even if one is out of pocket they should not be allowed to get away with this. At the very least they need to be told that they cannot withhold copies of signed documents from the signatory.

[North Harbour Yamaha]

The company that I use give me a copy of the signed docket when they pick the bike up so nothing could be added at a later date.

They have transported lots of motorcycles all over NZ for me and have never damaged any of them.

[dreamR]

yeah it is a matter of time and effort. i dont really want to be out of pocket but im also not sure whether i want the hassle of doing the court date etc. there is a chance that if i advise the company of going down the disputes tribunal path with a court date etc, they may pay up, but equally there is a chance that will go through with it and even if the tribunal finds in my favour, they can drag the payment to me out and make me get a court order to enforce the payment. all over $300 and taking about 3 months.

Im thinking it may be best to take the $150, but if that doesn't come through, then definately go to the disputes tribunal!

[dreamR]

The company that I use give me a copy of the signed docket when they pick the bike up so nothing could be added at a later date.

They have transported lots of motorcycles all over NZ for me and have never damaged any of them.

yeah they absolutely need to be doing this, its just bullshit the system they've got at present

[phill-k]

yeah they absolutely need to be doing this, its just bullshit the system they've got at present

I have to say this but your attitude which is typical of kiwis, shrug shoulders and walk away is why they can get away with what they have done.
If they have altered the document that's fraudulent, not owning up to what amounts as carelessness means the next member here also gets similar non caring treatment.
Get hold of the seller and confirm what they signed, call the company and make it clear there is a principle here, mention you have posted on this site and will name them, tell them that unless they put right their carelessness you will take them to the disputes tribunal do not just let it slide.

[dreamR]

I have to say this but your attitude which is typical of kiwis, shrug shoulders and walk away is why they can get away with what they have done.
If they have altered the document that's fraudulent, not owning up to what amounts as carelessness means the next member here also gets similar non caring treatment.
Get hold of the seller and confirm what they signed, call the company and make it clear there is a principle here, mention you have posted on this site and will name them, tell them that unless they put right their carelessness you will take them to the disputes tribunal do not just let it slide.

yeah i agree with what you have said. they shouldnt be allowed to get away with this type of thing, i'm just not sure i have the time or desire to go through with the court process.

[phill-k]

yeah i agree with what you have said. they shouldnt be allowed to get away with this type of thing, i'm just not sure i have the time or desire to go through with the court process.

Done the tribunal thing a few times myself and its good fun, but that not the point. The point is making / keeping a business honest, sometimes we have to go above and beyond to stop what is otherwise mediocre or poor service and performance.
You need to do this.
Also post up the name of the transporter, you are not breaking any laws doing so as its your personal experience, you are however educating those that might potentially use the services of a transporter.

[steve_t]

yeah i agree with what you have said. they shouldnt be allowed to get away with this type of thing, i'm just not sure i have the time or desire to go through with the court process.

Nor the required written evidence to allow a disputes tribunal hearing to be awarded to you. If the seller had been given a copy of the transport document, you'd probably be OK. You signing for receipt of the bike doesn't help either. I went to Disputes Tribunal years ago for a removal company who moved all my furniture. They measured how much space my stuff would take up in the truck and told me, but then billed me for nearly twice as much space. I didn't get the tribunal ruling because the removal company didn't write any number on the transport doc about how much space my stuff would take up. My missus also lost a DT hearing after a company told her one thing and then gave her another but because there was no evidence, the ruling was unable to be given in her favour. Just be aware that DT requires significant evidence. Having to take a half day off work to go to DT just isn't worth it either esp if it's a relatively low value claim

[scracha]

Request the full $300 and state you'll take no further action. Tell the transport owner his driver is a sack of lying shite (especially if you've already proven there was another bike being transported after he said there wasn't). It may be he's one of these rare employers who backs up and trusts his employees.

Otherwise take seller to small claims court. Advise transport owner of this prior as he may back down when you point out that previous owner will likely involve police if documents forged. If transport owner does not back down then in all likely hood it is the previous owner bullshitting you. One of them will back down

Otherwise take the $150. It aint worth the extra money for small claims hassle. If it's "the principle" at stake then tell transport owner and previous owner you're going to name and shame them to all and sundry. You've got nothing to fear if you stick to the facts.