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View Full Version : Eric Buell Racing 1190RS first look!



Reckless
18th February 2011, 14:55
For all you Buell Fans out there!!

I get the cycle-world Mag from the USA therefore get their email Or did I click the Kiwirider link on Facebook??
Can't remember! Ah well enjoy!!

Nice bike! Good to see the HD thing hasn't put Eric Buell off!

here http://www.cycleworld.com/motorcycle_news/first_looks_articles/11q1/erik_buell_racing_ebr_1190rs_-_first_look

Click on the slide show some good shots!

blackdog
18th February 2011, 15:12
nice to see he's finally gone to a chain drive

not a bad lookin' machine by all accounts

EJK
18th February 2011, 15:54
Buell? I thought they were dead? Nice looking tho. Reminds me of Bimota.

Reckless
18th February 2011, 16:14
Buell? I thought they were dead? Nice looking tho.

Yeh mate different but not so different it ugly! Not sure about the immediate WOW factor but I think this would grow on me! Well if I won Lotto that is LOL!!

HenryDorsetCase
18th February 2011, 16:58
How much is a Duc 1098R? (just for reference)

James Deuce
18th February 2011, 17:00
It's not a Buell, it's an EBR. He's not allowed to use Buell as a brand.

Big Dave
18th February 2011, 17:13
It's not a Buell,

Yeah it is. To anyone but a lawyer.

vifferman
18th February 2011, 17:18
Whelp, it might be good, but it looks cobbled together, rather than designed. The nose is rather weird - kinda raptor (as in 'bird of prey') looking, and what's with the stays for the mufflers?
But I'm glad it exists. We can't have too many bike models, eh?

Latte
18th February 2011, 17:24
Looks awesome :D

Mom
18th February 2011, 17:30
Does not ring bells for me and I am a Buell fan. Forgetting the obvious argument for a moment, that is a huge leap of faith for Buel fans :yes:

Or certainly this one anyway.

nallac
18th February 2011, 19:59
http://www.jsonline.com/business/116281784.html


I do likey this...............

Maha
18th February 2011, 20:08
Nose cone is a bit Thunderbird 2ish ...:corn:

Big Dave
18th February 2011, 21:40
I vote KR Facebook.

I needs the friends :-)

http://www.facebook.com/KiwiRiderMagazine

Big Dave
18th February 2011, 21:42
But I'm glad it exists. We can't have too many bike models, eh?

He's already designed the best cornering mass produced motorcycles and now he has a blank canvas.

I sent congratulations, celebrations and a demand for a new dual sport.

Spyke
20th February 2011, 12:15
very tasty

White trash
20th February 2011, 15:24
I just grew a great big chubby when I clapped eyes on that rear subframe. If that's exactly how the production model will be, it'll be the best fricken V-Twin ever built.

onearmedbandit
20th February 2011, 15:32
That definitely looks the part. I would say I 'like' it but that's now a facebook trademark.

imdying
20th February 2011, 17:38
Already produced the best handling mass produced motorcycles... interesting theory :laugh:

Big Dave
20th February 2011, 18:20
Already produced the best handling mass produced motorcycles... interesting theory :laugh:

First google listing C&P - there are plenty.

BIKE MAGAZINE has listed the top 50 cornering bikes, ever, snip....

1. Buell XB12R Firebolt

2. Aprilia RS125

3. Triumph Daytona 650

4. 1956 BSA Gold Star

5. BMW R1200GS

6. GSXR600 ('05)

7. 1975 Ducati 900SS

8. Buell XB12S Lightning

9. Aprilia Pegaso Strada

10. Husaberg FS Supermoto 650e

Big Dave
20th February 2011, 18:25
http://www.motorcyclenews.com/MCN/News/newsresults/First-rides--tests/2009/May/may2109-top-5-handlers-according-to-you/

EJK
20th February 2011, 18:34
I vote KR Facebook.

I needs the friends :-)

http://www.facebook.com/KiwiRiderMagazine

Free 6 months subscription thrown in and I'm in.

Big Dave
20th February 2011, 18:37
Blackmail is an ugly word.

Hitcher
20th February 2011, 18:51
This is going to be the Thermos of motorcycles. Everybody will call it a Buell even though it isn't, won't have that word stamped on it anywhere, and never will be.

Big Dave
20th February 2011, 19:06
Put that on your Tannoy.

http://thekneeslider.com/images/2010/09/1190rs-logo.gif

The flag was in my early logo design submissions - close as I got to the gig though.

Hitcher
20th February 2011, 19:11
Who's supplying the V-twin for it? Rotax?

Big Dave
20th February 2011, 19:16
Huh - I'd have to check - I *think* its the 1125 rotax breathed on heavily.

Buyasta
20th February 2011, 20:33
Blackmail is an ugly word.
Don't be silly, that's not blackmail, it's solicitation of bribery... how do you feel about the aesthetics of those words?
Also, obligatory Bender quote: "Blackmail is such an ugly word... I prefer extortion - the x makes it sound cooler"

Big Dave
20th February 2011, 20:36
Don't be silly, that's not blackmail, it's solicitation of bribery... how do you feel about the aesthetics of those words?
Also, obligatory Bender quote: "Blackmail is such an ugly word... I prefer extortion - the x makes it sound cooler"

xxxxcellent.

But how do you know I didn't mean I was blackmailing him? :sunny:

dangerous
20th February 2011, 20:47
http://www.jsonline.com/business/116281784.html


I do likey this...............
hmmmmm... farking horid pipe set up same with the head light, I prefure the earler design ---> 232737

HenryDorsetCase
21st February 2011, 11:00
Put that on your Tannoy.

http://thekneeslider.com/images/2010/09/1190rs-logo.gif

The flag was in my early logo design submissions - close as I got to the gig though.

dont suck it up with the Hoover.

White trash
21st February 2011, 11:09
First google listing C&P - there are plenty.

BIKE MAGAZINE has listed the top 50 cornering bikes, ever, snip....

1. Buell XB12R Firebolt

2. Aprilia RS125

3. Triumph Daytona 650

4. 1956 BSA Gold Star

5. BMW R1200GS

6. GSXR600 ('05)

7. 1975 Ducati 900SS

8. Buell XB12S Lightning

9. Aprilia Pegaso Strada

10. Husaberg FS Supermoto 650e


http://www.motorcyclenews.com/MCN/News/newsresults/First-rides--tests/2009/May/may2109-top-5-handlers-according-to-you/

Maybe on biliard table like surfaces, but throw some decent bumps or corrogations mid turn, as per Rimataka or Pie Cock Hill road and I'll take a decent wheelbase, less radical geometry bike like a GSXR/R1/CBR/ZX every day of the week thanks. Also, I would be interested to know how EBR have addressed the overheating and warping of the ZTL, rim mounted brake disc. I note the ZTL2 on later Buells are an eight piston caliper. Maybe the theory is that if you clamp it all the way round, the disc wont be able to warp lol.

That being said, the disc on the 1190RS APPEARS to sit more proud of the wheel rim and hopefully will get some cooling to it. Also makes it more vulnerable in an accident though.

HenryDorsetCase
21st February 2011, 11:12
the one I really like is the German one where they had tidied up the rads and had a shroud that morphed into the bellypan, and the riding position was like a Lightning: sit up.

think I can find it now? not so much. It was on the Kneeslider too IIRC.

buellbabe
21st February 2011, 11:22
Ok...
Firstly this is not a big leap of faith for Buell riders, having already embraced the 1125 R and CR its not that far removed...

The exhaust pipe, if you look closely you will see that its a mere bolt on that is only there to please the authorities who otherwise say its too loud. That awful 'extra' bit of pipe comes straight off and you have the clean line of the base underslung unit.

And as far as the best cornering bikes are concerned.
The XB12R definately holds that crown.
Firebolts absolutely ROCK! So aggressive and such fun to ride.

Oh and for those who thought Buell was dead. Keep up will ya? LOL. Less than 2 months after HD shafted Buell, Erik was up and running with Erik Buell Racing. He has always maintained that there would be more street bikes cos he knows his loyal fans want them and he really listens and takes that stuff on board. He is a real man and not a faceless corporation.

Getting back to the newest kid on the block tho...I will be very interested to see who puts their hand up for an Australian dealership.

My 2c...can't wait to see it in the flesh....oh yea baby...

Big Dave
21st February 2011, 11:34
Maybe on biliard table like surfaces, but throw some decent bumps or corrogations mid turn, as per Rimataka or Pie Cock Hill road and

I'll take my XB12X and its longer travel suspension and upright ergonomics. Any day. The sports bike crouch and forward bias is crap for unreliable surfaces too.

buellbabe
21st February 2011, 11:52
[QUOTE=White trash;1129992679]Maybe on biliard table like surfaces, but throw some decent bumps or corrogations mid turn, as per Rimataka or Pie Cock Hill road and I'll take a decent wheelbase, less radical geometry bike like a GSXR/R1/CBR/ZX every day of the week thanks. QUOTE]


I have ridden the Rimatakas MANY times (yep! I live in Aucks and I can honestly say that!) and 'Pie Cock" hill not quite as much but still enuf to know that the X1, XB12R AND the CR just eat those roads and I have had absolutely NO issues with less than perfect road surfaces!

Actually the very first time I did the Rimas I was on the CR following AJ on his XB and trailing a long way behind was my other mate on his gixxer... ho hum

White trash
21st February 2011, 12:25
Oh I'm the first to admit, the Buell sports bikes handle well, just not the best on the planet in those conditions. I've done various trips on both roads riding an XB9R, 12R and a 12S. At full flight, the XB9R was by far the best if a little hard on its tyres. I'm not keen on the pitchyness the short wheelbase agravates when you encounter a decent bump, full lean at speed. But my real concern is the front brake discs which are either made of chocolate, or simply overheat too easily. That's a real pain in the arse.

Big Dave
21st February 2011, 19:23
Actually the BIKE article was about cornering - and made some distinctions that it wasn't about handling. 'Handling' included braking and other factors.

I also asked some of the guys that race 1125s to comment on the ZTL brake. I'll paste any replies.

Ocean1
21st February 2011, 20:33
hmmmmm... farking horid pipe set up same with the head light, I prefure the earler design ---> 232737

Me also. :yes:


Who's supplying the V-twin for it? Rotax?

It's the same engine, H. The 1125, bored a tad.


But my real concern is the front brake discs which are either made of chocolate, or simply overheat too easily. That's a real pain in the arse.

I still haven't worked out why some have trouble and some don't. My XB12R was good, once I worked out what pads to use. I had hard-to-isolate harmonics with the XB12X, changed everything except the disc to no effect. I normalised and surface ground the disc, which cure the bitch... for exactly one front brake application. It got a nice new disc courtesy of teh scooter centre, which worked fine.

The 1125 has been abused on Manfeild until it was visibly straw yellow and and I had no problems with it. The only bitch I've got is a minor one, the often reported low initial bite on the road. You get used to it.

The problem is with either the particular bit of disc material or it's first few heat cycles, p'raps a combination of both. Either way it seems you get various levels of performance depending on the disc itself, change it and the performance often changes.

slowpoke
21st February 2011, 22:28
It looks a shitload better than the 1125R that's for farkin' sure!

But for 1098R money? With zero racing pedigree? With no mention of the 1098R's traction control or quick shifter? A brake system that the half dozen or so serious racing Buell's I've seen have junked? And I'd nearly bet the house that the donk won't rival the Duc's.

It may well be a quick road bike but it'll sell on exclusivity and point of difference, not the outright performance that a 1098R provides. But good luck to him.

dangerous
22nd February 2011, 05:10
I still haven't worked out why some have trouble and some don't.same, I have heard of a few discs warping, been waiting for it to happen but with 40+k on the 12R ridden hard including raced several times... disc is mint.

ajturbo
22nd February 2011, 05:21
same, I have heard of a few discs warping, been waiting for it to happen but with 40+k on the 12R ridden hard including raced several times... disc is mint.

"MY" XB is clocking over 35,000 MILES... nothing wrong with the disc, it has been around Manfeild a bit.. and soon it will be at Pookie and shortly after Hampton...(track days) and i have no worries about the disc.... may need new pads though:facepalm:



I also asked some of the guys that race 1125s to comment on the ZTL brake. I'll paste any replies.

will be keen to hear

Grubber
22nd February 2011, 05:45
At 40g a pop i can't see anything that would make me want to buy it.
Brand loyalty may make you head that way but sheesh....$40g. She'll be right...i'll g buy 2 or 3 other bikes that go just as well thanks.
Looks nice though!

Big Dave
22nd February 2011, 09:04
With zero racing pedigree?

'Similar' bike won the AMA series.

Big Dave
22nd February 2011, 09:07
At 40g a pop i can't see anything that would make me want to buy it.
Brand loyalty may make you head that way but sheesh....$40g. She'll be right...i'll g buy 2 or 3 other bikes that go just as well thanks.
Looks nice though!

It's $US40k too - It is the all carbon, all unobtainum, hand built, racer - with the stuff on it (lights) to get 'homogenized' for AMA.

The plan will be for an affordable street machine - eventually.

Big Dave
22nd February 2011, 09:10
"MY" XB is clocking over 35,000 MILES... nothing wrong with the disc, it has been around Manfeild a bit.. and soon it will be at Pookie and shortly after Hampton...(track days) and i have no worries about the disc.... may need new pads though:facepalm:



will be keen to hear

Yeah - I like the brakes on mine too. It's nothing special - except for being 2.5kg of un-sprung mass lighter than a GSXR setup - but have no issues with it either - and I do a lot of stoppies.

Only criticism I have is the rear is a bit woody.

No replies as yet.

Grubber
22nd February 2011, 09:32
It's $US40k too - It is the all carbon, all unobtainum, hand built, racer - with the stuff on it to get 'homogenized' for AMA.

The plan will be for an affordable street machine - eventually.

Which makes a lot of sense. Tend to sell after they do well on the big circuit.
Anything similar on the road would look mean, but not sure about the brakes either. they kinda look a bit ugly and have heard they not so great to use. Depends somewhat on how you use them off coarse.

avgas
22nd February 2011, 09:51
Buell? I thought they were dead? Nice looking tho. Reminds me of Bimota.
And for that reason I WILL buy one.
Can't wait to see the nekkid one

ajturbo
26th February 2011, 07:23
Like Big Dave said... the 40k (US) is for the 1st limited edition race bikes.. and I bet they are ALL pre-sold
The ACTUAL street version for mere mortals will be more affordable....I just hope it will sound just as great as the CR.....:scooter:

slowpoke
26th February 2011, 08:39
'Similar' bike won the AMA series.

Dave, I know you always look at Buell through a rose tinted visor but you know as well as I do that "Daytona Sportbike" class is/was a joke. Jacking the rules so that the latest and greatest 1125cc twin from Buell only had to compete against 600cc IL4's and ancient 1000cc Aprilia RSV1000R's did nothing except prove it couldn't compete against all the other open class bikes that weren't allowed in.......

.....which is exactly why you didn't mention which series it won. A win for the ages it was not.

I've nothing against Buell's (sorry, EBR's) but just wish Eric Buell would put his ego in his back pocket and show a bit more common sense. But once again the buying public will be left kinda confused, kinda interested and kinda buying something else.

Big Dave
26th February 2011, 09:49
Dave, I know you always look at Buell through a rose tinted visor but you know as well as I do that "Daytona Sportbike" class is/was a joke. Jacking the rules so that the latest and greatest 1125cc twin from Buell only had to compete against 600cc IL4's and ancient 1000cc Aprilia RSV1000R's did nothing except prove it couldn't compete against all the other open class bikes that weren't allowed in.......

.....which is exactly why you didn't mention which series it won. A win for the ages it was not.

I've nothing against Buell's (sorry, EBR's) but just wish Eric Buell would put his ego in his back pocket and show a bit more common sense. But once again the buying public will be left kinda confused, kinda interested and kinda buying something else.

I have no rose coloured anything, nor loyalty to any brand. There are products I like because they work well or suit my requirements, but if someone else makes a better one - I'm there.

All I have stated is fact. A similar machine won AMA races. Your opinions on personalities and the merits of handicap racing are your opinions.

And his name is Erik. Having hung out with the guy I can assure you that ego is not his issue. I'd call it steadfast belief in his designs and research.

Not a win for the ages I do partially agree, but then substitute Britten and BEARS in the same argument and you could start a fight with most Kiwis.

Big Dave
26th February 2011, 10:27
Best non-ego moment for me was in the Australian Alps and we stopped for a photo shoot.

I was looking down the Snowy River Valley away from the bikes when Boris from AMCN pokes me in the ribs and points at Erik filling my bike from a Jerrycan.

'Betcha Tamburini wouldn't be filling your bike on an Agusta launch hey Dave'.

My ego however - sheeesh.

Big Dave
26th February 2011, 11:54
http://www.motorcycle.com/manufacturer/buell/2011-erik-buell-racing-1190rs-preview-90439.html

Big Dave
26th February 2011, 18:14
<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="560" height="349" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/hA0UoHYPOA0?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

HTML code is Off?

slowpoke
27th February 2011, 00:05
I have no rose coloured anything, nor loyalty to any brand. There are products I like because they work well or suit my requirements, but if someone else makes a better one - I'm there.

Haha, I reckon what you've already written about American bikes in general speaks volumes for where your heart lies. Not that that's a bad thing, considering your job it's actually kinda cool that you are still passionate about any bikes.

All I have stated is fact. A similar machine won AMA races. Your opinions on personalities and the merits of handicap racing are your opinions.

And his name is Erik. Having hung out with the guy I can assure you that ego is not his issue. I'd call it steadfast belief in his designs and research.

Fair comments, but it beggars belief how the 1125r looked the way it did and why the ZTL brake is persisted with other than the fact Erik (oops!) likes them, and despite road tests/opinions to the contrary. And belt drive for a sports bike? How expensive/inconvenient is it gonna be to change the gearing on that?

Not a win for the ages I do partially agree, but then substitute Britten and BEARS in the same argument and you could start a fight with most Kiwis.

C'mon Dave, you're a smart guy: a Buell beating up on bikes half it's size in a lower tier national series is hardly the same as beating Factory WSB Ducati's ridden by World Champions. It's not even the same as the current restricted Ducati's beating the unrestricted 1000 IL4's. The Britten was one of the fastest bikes in the world at the time, and no Buell (or EBR) is anywhere near that. I think you need to go back and revist that first paragraph big fulla...........

My apologies for ranting but Buell just frustrates me with making some really cool bikes, with some clever engineering that I'd be very interested in if he just followed a bit more of the KISS principle. This latest thing is no different: lose the carbon fibre frippery, bolt on some tried and true brembo monoblocks, sell them for half reasonable money and his solvency worries would be cured as he'd sell 'em as fast as he could make 'em.

Big Dave
27th February 2011, 10:30
Nothing to revise. It's handicap and class racing. The rest is relative and the merits are a matter of personal opinion.

FWIW I am equally as enthusiastic about the Concours 14, the R 1200 GS, the Yamaha Tenere and the new Triumph Tiger XC - and a Dozen others.

I gave my personal bike of the year to a BMW. My heart lies with vehicles that are fit for purpose.

I report my own observations and don't accept unsubstantiated statements contrary to those experiences. That's not carrying any torches.

The brakes - I'm happy with the brakes on my Uly, the reason he sticks with it is it's 2.5kg of un-sprung mass lighter than a GSXR set up and reduces wheel flex under load.

My guess is the the belts are Harley's idea. It was entirely their company. No longer though. I still like them for street use.

The Britten analogy is that everything I've been presented states that its most notable achievement was it won the BEARS World Championship - which is a limited/class race. The 1125R won a AMA limited class championship. I don't think they are of equal merit either, but nor do I think Buell's is without. Relativity.

Erik and his people consider John an inspiration too.

AllanB
27th February 2011, 11:25
I like the stance and the nose. Otherwise I yawned as I do on most new releases and especially every time I hear Erics name. I see he is still pissing around with the same old tart - interesting how the only other division of motorcycledom to embrace the front brake layout is the TV chopper builders!

Big Dave
27th February 2011, 11:41
But conversely to choppers his designs are relatively cheap to manufacture. Usually due to the one component-two jobs where possible mantra.

Ocean1
27th February 2011, 12:16
My apologies for ranting but Buell just frustrates me with making some really cool bikes, with some clever engineering that I'd be very interested in if he just followed a bit more of the KISS principle. This latest thing is no different: lose the carbon fibre frippery, bolt on some tried and true brembo monoblocks, sell them for half reasonable money and his solvency worries would be cured as he'd sell 'em as fast as he could make 'em.

Buell's an engineer. Expecting a good engineer to do it the same way everyone else has always done it is expecting too much.

WRT the inside out brake, every iteration since the original XB variant has shown improvement. If that system can be developed to, say 95% of the performance and capacity of the current benchmark then it wins by virtue of it's secondary design intent: reduced unsprung mass.

Given it's performance as measured directly against traditionally armed and lighter competition in both braking and handling related to front end mass I'd say they're at least on par. How much more development is there in Buell's front brake? Dunno, but 5% will see them clean up that particular arguement.

I don't see you're kiss analogy, they're not complex machines by comparison to most, and I bet there's fewer components on my CR than any comparable Japanese machine. As for carbon, it's not an expensive option for some parts, and if you always do what you've always done...

ajturbo
27th February 2011, 13:10
i have my blinkers firmly on.. i love the buell...
i took a 675 for a test run late last year for the day, loved the sound.. but i am the first to admit, i couldn't ride it properly... revved tooo much..
so i know now that the low revving bike is for me... :bleh:

Drogen Omen
9th March 2011, 13:46
I love the new bike, and its great that Erik is inovative and resoursfull enough to keep his business going even though the idiots at Harley Davidson closed him down.

i cant beleive those idiots at Harley owned a majority share of Agusta and didnt even crossblend any of the tech into their vintage bikes...


Harley Davidson 1940's technology at 2011 prices... lol that always cracks me up...

theseekerfinds
5th May 2011, 21:56
I reckon it looks pretty fucken neat!!
I love carbon on bikes and I have had a hard on for perimeter brakes since the early 90s when I first saw it on a bike at some Japanese or Euro bike show..
I would buy one of these for the same reason I'd buy one of them flash as Ducati reps like the one in the window at Motomart, because it'd be cool to own one no matter how it rode cos if you could afford one you could also afford a bike to ride that was more real world friendly.. nothing wrong with a bit of posing now is there folks.. well there isn't.. is there? c'mon guys don't leave me here it was just a question.. guys.. c'mon this isn't funny.. guys.. shit!!