Suzuki RF400 for a newbie?

[fatboy323]

Hi all,

This is my first post here, but I have certainly spent few hours just reading :yes:

My situation. Live on the Shore, work in city. Looking at mainly commuting bike, with occasional longer trips, no track time. Have one of those Cook Island licenses that I can drive on here, but only drove a scooter before. However, have been driving for the past 10 years (=getting to 30).

The choice. I was looking at this one - Suzuki RF400 2001 (http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=360773350)

Why?
1. 400cc so I could keep it for a little longer than I would've with a 250, and still be economical
2. Seems to be fairly reliable and well behaved bike from what I read
3. Reasonably priced

Questions
1. How bad of an idea to start on a 400? And this particular bike?

2. What is reasonable money to pay for it?
It's at $2700 right now, has been crashed and fixed, had a look ride - seems fine, but getting it looked at by George from MotoMD tomorrow.

3. On the point of reliability vs. cost and performance vs. my skills would I be better of sticking with your standard GPX/GSX/GT250R all 250cc

4. Any other suggestions for a 400-500cc fully faired bike under $5000?

:innocent:
:scooter:

[The Singing Chef]

There is a great Hayabusa that would see you through right till your full and beyond :facepalm:

Other than the fact that if you get pulled up you will get a nice fine and demerits, there is also riding ability, the 250cc rule is there so that you can get used to riding and traffic etc, then once you have got the hang of that you can then move up.

And driving a car makes no difference whatsoever as to your skills on riding a bike.

Stick to a 250cc bro,

Just my view though..

[marty]

get a VTR or CBF 250, or a Zeal or similar.

great bikes, do 110km/h all day, a late model low km CBF can be had for $4k. And rego/tyres/insurance is all WAY cheaper than a 10 year old 400.

[fatboy323]

There is a great Hayabusa that would see you through right till your full and beyond :facepalm:

Other than the fact that if you get pulled up you will get a nice fine and demerits, there is also riding ability, the 250cc rule is there so that you can get used to riding and traffic etc, then once you have got the hang of that you can then move up.

And driving a car makes no difference whatsoever as to your skills on riding a bike.

Stick to a 250cc bro,

Just my view though..

Fair enough, I was thinking that since performance-wise a 400 is maybe only slightly (15hp) faster it won't really matter, especially since it weighs about as much as a GT250R. So 400, definitely much harder to ride than a 250?

Re: driving a car experience - was more of a way to indicate that I'm not a teenager

[fatboy323]

get a VTR or CBF 250, or a Zeal or similar.

great bikes, do 110km/h all day, a late model low km CBF can be had for $4k. And rego/tyres/insurance is all WAY cheaper than a 10 year old 400.

VTR looks pretty good, but I'd really like a fully faired one, even though I do appreciate the risk of ruining all that in a fall :scooter:

[The Singing Chef]

Fair enough, I was thinking that since performance-wise a 400 is maybe only slightly (15hp) faster it won't really matter, especially since it weighs about as much as a GT250R. So 400, definitely much harder to ride than a 250?

Re: driving a car experience - was more of a way to indicate that I'm not a teenager

I think the RF will do about 220+ km/h which is reasonably fast to start off with, the biggest thing for me would be getting pulled over with it, i have heard of people never getting pulled over, but i wouldn't want to run the risk. And as marty said, the rego, tires etc are cheaper on a 250.

Welcome to KB btw

[superman]

1. How bad of an idea to start on a 400? And this particular bike?

In America people start on 600s... :facepalm:

[DrunkenMistake]

Feel free to comment this is just IMO,

I started out on a CBR 250 and I learnt alot of things on that bike, such as the right RPM range entering and exiting a corner etc etc, Im on a VFR 400 now.. Im still green but im almost certain if I hadn't started on the 250 I would have iced myself on a corner by now, it really is part of the learning

[marty]

and they are soooo good on them

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ut4xd9Oh0yo

[DrunkenMistake]

Haha epic fail

[jim.cox]

RF400 is NOT on any of the Aussie LAMS approved bikes lists I checked

That suggests it still wont be legal on a learner licence here after the proposed law changes

And that in turn suggests on going problems with insurance etc

I'd be going looking for something else...

[Latte]

Just because it's not a 250, or not on the lams list doesn't mean you'll automatically kill yourself (well, if you do 110kph, or 105kph on holiday weekends you will).

I started on an NSR250 (similar hp to that bike, although a bit more abrupt getting there). Then went to a thou within a week of my full. I'm still here, no crashes.

Being an experienced car driver won't give you any extra riding skills, but does mean you will be less stressed on the road than a 15 year old just learning to ride.

Don't get me wrong, more hp means things happen faster, and you will need to be on your game more. But if you know it (really) that you can control your throttle and have your wits about you, it can be handled fine. I would say more important than a specific cc or power to weight ratio is having proper training and the right attitude.

The legal issue is important though.... does the Island license give you the equivalent of a 6F ?

[fatboy323]

Just because it's not a 250, or not on the lams list doesn't mean you'll automatically kill yourself (well, if you do 110kph, or 105kph on holiday weekends you will).

I started on an NSR250 (similar hp to that bike, although a bit more abrupt getting there). Then went to a thou within a week of my full. I'm still here, no crashes.

Being an experienced car driver won't give you any extra riding skills, but does mean you will be less stressed on the road than a 15 year old just learning to ride.

Don't get me wrong, more hp means things happen faster, and you will need to be on your game more. But if you know it (really) that you can control your throttle and have your wits about you, it can be handled fine. I would say more important than a specific cc or power to weight ratio is having proper training and the right attitude.

Thanks hiss, that was more what I was thinking. But to reassure everyone else (and me I guess) I will think three times before actually getting it now. And I'm definitely getting training either way.


The legal issue is important though.... does the Island license give you the equivalent of a 6F ?

Yes, and that's what tempts me - in a sense that I won't be seen as a n00b learner (not necessarily a good thing every time), and I won't need/want to change the bike for at least a 2-3 years.

[riffer]

At the end of the day it's your choice mate, but do bear in mind that:

a) you won't be legally allowed to ride it; and
b) you won't be able to get insurance if you crash it; and
c) there's a lot of panels to scratch if you drop it.

You'll probably be okay if you ride with your brain, but why would you want to take these risks?

Bite the bullet and get the 250 and do things right.

[tigertim20]

Hi all,

This is my first post here, but I have certainly spent few hours just reading :yes:

My situation. Live on the Shore, work in city. Looking at mainly commuting bike, with occasional longer trips, no track time. Have one of those Cook Island licenses that I can drive on here, but only drove a scooter before. However, have been driving for the past 10 years (=getting to 30).

The choice. I was looking at this one - Suzuki RF400 2001 (http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=360773350)

Why?
1. 400cc so I could keep it for a little longer than I would've with a 250, and still be economical
2. Seems to be fairly reliable and well behaved bike from what I read
3. Reasonably priced

Questions
1. How bad of an idea to start on a 400? And this particular bike?

2. What is reasonable money to pay for it?
It's at $2700 right now, has been crashed and fixed, had a look ride - seems fine, but getting it looked at by George from MotoMD tomorrow.

3. On the point of reliability vs. cost and performance vs. my skills would I be better of sticking with your standard GPX/GSX/GT250R all 250cc

4. Any other suggestions for a 400-500cc fully faired bike under $5000?

:innocent:
:scooter:
You get people coming on here saying NO, 250 is all you should ride cos blah blah blah, but fact is, a 250 will kill ya if you ride i like a fucktard, so if you dont have self control, dont get a bike at all!!
the main downer with getting a 400 is that you may well get a ticket, having said that, I know of several people who have been pulled over on their L or R on 40's, and the cops didnt really care, In my experience they seem to start noticing it more (and caring more) when youre on a 600+ on your L or R. Might just be my experience, I dunno.

That aside, the riffer is a decent bike, A girl I know has one, rides it to work and back every day, goes to the rallies loaded up wih gear on it, and recently travelled the length of the south island in one day on it, and it was great. Provided you have some brains in your head and dont ride all silly like, and are happy to risk a wee fine, Then yes, as a bike, its a good bike.

[imdying]

Bike itself is no trouble, light and easy to ride. Don't know what the maintenance is like on the REVS (or whatever those things had? maybe just the late ones?), but can't be that bad. I'd let my wife learn on one in a car park without second thoughts.

Legality as explained by the others...

[Smifffy]

IMO, get your island licence transferred over to the correct NZ licence that you are entitled to first. Then all of the legalities as to what you are entitled to ride will become clear.

Once that is sorted you can get a bike suitable for your needs.

Some people have found that there is more to transferring an island licence to NZ than they first thought.

[Latte]

I think you've missed that he does have a 6f(or at least he thinks he does?). Albeit he's used a loophole to get it.




The legal issue is important though.... does the Island license give you the equivalent of a 6F ?
=======================
Yes, and that's what tempts me - in a sense that I won't be seen as a n00b learner (not necessarily a good thing every time), and I won't need/want to change the bike for at least a 2-3 years.

[Smifffy]

I think you've missed that he does have a 6f(or at least he thinks he does?). Albeit he's used a loophole to get it.

Forget the island licence, show me the 6f.

Edit: Surely it's simply a matter of going into a licencing agent, paying a fee and getting the 6f if he's clearly entitled to it? If it's that simple, why doesn't he do it?

Possibly because it isn't that simple, and in reality the island licence is much like the ones that come in weet-bix packets.

Never mind, when he gets pulled over I'm sure he can pay the fine with monopoly money.

[neels]

If you're good to go with a full bike licence, test ride it, if it fits and presses your buttons then ultimately it's your life and your decision.

There are probably some positives from starting out on a bigger bike compared to the 250 4's, at least with a bit of torque to play with you won't get in the habit of revving the snot out of it to get anywhere and then jump on a 600 and crash when old habits take over.

[Latte]

Forget the island licence, show me the 6f.

It's in your wallet, green thing. ;)

According to the OP he has the right license - so legality isn't an issue. Makes the 250cc is irrelevant. We can only go off what he's stated, not what we think is more likely.


ahah, nice edit....

[Smifffy]

It's in your wallet, green thing. ;)

According to the OP he has the right license - so legality isn't an issue. Makes the 250cc is irrelevant. We can only go off what he's stated, not what we think is more likely.


ahah, nice edit....

Yeah I got asked for it at a checkpoint in Tairua this time last week. Cop said it was nice to see someone on a full for a change. Had a reasonably good chat with him, no dramas.

[Latte]

Yeah I got asked for it at a checkpoint in Tairua this time last week. Cop said it was nice to see someone on a full for a change. Had a reasonably good chat with him, no dramas.

Still doing the checkpoints out that way? I've avoided it this summer for some reason (6F, wof and reg paid etc so not that).

Infact I've never had a "contact" with a police officer on my bike ..... what a waste of time getting my license was :D

[cowboyz]

15HP upgrade in exchange for a $400?? ticket every time you get pulled over?? hardly seems worth it really.

[fatboy323]

Thanks for all the answers, they have all been very constructive in their own ways :yes:

To clarify, my original question was a purely technical one: "Whether starting on a 400cc (and RF in particular) is noticeably harder/much more dangerous than on a 250cc for a person, who is psychologically developed and knows road code/behavior well?" The rest was just to give you some idea of my circumstances and to see if anyone had any info on the particular bike.

The legality part is fairly straightforward for me: if I'm not legally entitled to ride it I WON'T buy it. Straight and simple, can't enjoy the ride, having to worry about fines and debt. I have checked and to convert my island license is not straightforward and not 100% possible, but that's a completely different discussion.

hiss was onto this and saw right through to the root of the problem ... must be an engineer, or an architect :)

To summarize what I think of this so far:
If you're stupid no amount of restriction going to stop you from crashing.
The reverse is true to an extent.
CC rating is a flawed system to limit learners on, the coming power-to-weight is a much wiser system.

And to follow from all of the above, the RF400 is below the to-be-legal 650cc Hyosung (4.8 kg/hp vs. 3.61 kg/hp) and is slightly above currently learner CBR250RR (5.0kg/hp). (The numbers account for my weight and RF400 is 180kg 53hp bike - no rocket.) And with a little extra torque down low RF would make an OK bike to learn on.

Thanks again and keep any suggestions coming :drinkup:

[Smifffy]

The simple answer to your technical question is: "It depends"

[Latte]

The simple answer to your technical question is: "It depends"

Where's the fun in that :D

(And no architect.... I'm a council worker - just like the stop/go sign guy).

[fatboy323]

Didn't get it in the end based on the mechanical inspection. The search continues :rockon:

[Latte]

Didn't get it in the end based on the mechanical inspection. The search continues :rockon:

RF900 time :D .........

:devil2:

[fatboy323]

RF900 time :D .........

:devil2:

R1 (http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=361091125) :yes:

But seriously GS500F looks nice :D

[Jeff Sichoe]

Bro, I got a 400cc too (CBR) and Cops don't even look twice at me.

Speeding? Yeah if you get snapped, you'll get the speeding fine, and they'll probably NAIL you on overdoing your CC restriction.
If it's a random stop / checkpoint - i'd just say 'hell man look at my belly ya reckon a 250 gonna get me to work and back?' and hope for the best.

Really, if you're not speeding, you'll never get stopped, so it will never come up...
Only issue is those damn ACC checkpoints n stuff that are cropping up! but a chick chat with a few bikers who've come from the direction you're heading usually confirms the road is clear :)

[cowboyz]

thats alot of effort for fuck all advantage... I dont buy a 250 cant get you round.. how fat are you?