ATGATT - don't knock it.

[XF650]

Another OFF topic - had a spectacular one on Thursday. Won't go into details other than some wanker had booby-trapped part of the Clarksfield Rd. The Freewind got some big air & came down on my left leg, driving my whole left side into the gravel.
Was winded & seeing stars for a while but eventually got to my feet & couldn't believe no broken bones on this unfit old git.
My Sidi Crossfire boots had instantly paid for themselves, taking the full impact weight of the bike on landing. And once again, the Thor impact shirt did a great job of protecting my upper body, which hit the ground with a hell of a whack. Incidently these are the same gear as worn & praised by ChiTown in his now famous AdvRider thread: http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=667236
Pants, jacket, helmet & gloves all stopped grazing fine but the Zeus should really be replaced:
235268
Knee is swelling up so will upgrade to better protection there, especially while I continue to be a 'crash test dummy'.

Anyway the point of this thread is to promote ATGATT - all the gear, all the time.
Also consider the standard of your safety gear, especially if you fall off as much as I do.
Ride safe.
XF

[timg]

Another OFF topic - had a spectacular one on Thursday. Won't go into details other than some wanker had booby-trapped part of the Clarksfield Rd. The Freewind got some big air & came down on my left leg, driving my whole left side into the gravel.
Was winded & seeing stars for a while but eventually got to my feet & couldn't believe no broken bones on this unfit old git.
My Sidi Crossfire boots had instantly paid for themselves, taking the full impact weight of the bike on landing. And once again, my Thor impact shirt did a great job of protecting my upper body, which hit the ground with a hell of a whack. Incidently these are the same gear as worn & praised by ChiTown in his now famous AdvRider thread: http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=667236
Pants, jacket, helmet & gloves all stopped grazing fine but the Zeus should really be replaced:
235268
Knee is swelling up so will upgrade to better protection there, especially while I continue to be a 'crash test dummy'.

Anyway the point of this thread is to promote ATGATT - all the gear, all the time.
Also consider the standard of your safety gear, especially if you fall off as much as I do.
Ride safe.
XF :shit: That's crappy mate. Is there an aggro cockie up there or something that needs a visit from a few burly bikers? See so many Idjits around town in shorts, shirt sleeves and sneekers, and it's not just the scooter brigade either. :gob: no wonder our bloody ACC fees cost a fortune.

[Night Falcon]

glad you OK....thats sacry though, that someone is willing to risk killing someone, I'd be phoning the bobbies....the next rider might not be as fortuneate as you!!

[marks]

glad to hear that you are ok

buy a set of these (http://www.torpedo7.co.nz/products/6TPRKN0FO/title/thor-force-kneeguard-2010) THOR Force Kneeguards

I have tested my set many times and I don't think you will get better protection without getting proper knee braces.

[James Deuce]

You're just lucky. ATGATT did me no fucking good at all.

[Nasty]

Yup atgatt works in some cases but James is right not in all ... but sometimes its what will happen when you were none of the gear that needs to be remembered!!

Grub was wearing all the gear and no he didn't save him ... but it limited the damage .. pity that some of the damage was fatal. but with one of his offs on the takas ... it definately did the trick ... he went partially through the fence ... in that happening the following was damaged -

helmit .. hit the fence and the mechnism on it shattered ... but no brain damage but a little concussion

trou - no cuts on his outta trou ... but the wire did cause hie thermals to be cut and his knee ... luckily no stichers if I wasn't wearing those I can't imagine the damage.

No damage to his jacket and gloves ... but yes 4 breaks in his lower arm.

So although he was damaged in that one .. I cannot imagine how much worse it would have been with none of the gear!

[James Deuce]

You need to buy gear that doesn't fail in low speed (75 km.hr) accidents too. The only things that worked well for me were gloves, helmet and boots. The rest of my gear was a mass of split seams and fractured "armour".

[Ocean1]

You're just lucky. ATGATT did me no fucking good at all.

You need a dirt bike. It's a known fact that you get far better luck in the dirt.





Oh, and a C90. They're unbelievably lucky to crash and burn.

[Nasty]

You need to buy gear that doesn't fail in low speed (75 km.hr) accidents too. The only things that worked well for me were gloves, helmet and boots. The rest of my gear was a mass of split seams and fractured "armour".

Yeah ... its a hard one ... cos I remember both his accidents will around or under 75kms ... :(

[Padmei]

Glad you're ok Struan. My lil off the other week was made pleasanter by elbow impact being taken up by my pressure suit.

As far as protective coverings go, I follow the belief that 'Let those who ride decide', however I do cringe when I see students on lil scooters with nought but a helmet on (well & clothes too).

I've been noticing that neck braces are very popular in oz & SA. I've pondered getting one but it seems that any offs I have are all low speed whereas the RRs from these countries usually include long fast passages on long gravelly , rocky, sandy surfaces. They are certainly getting cheaper in price.

[James Deuce]

Yeah ... its a hard one ... cos I remember both his accidents will around or under 75kms ... :(

I know mate :(. I still can't believe that my two worst accidents have been at 50 km/hr and 75 km/hr. If the stars ever line up and I get another bike, I'm riding everywhere at at least twice the posted speed limit. It seems to be safer.

[James Deuce]

You need a dirt bike. It's a known fact that you get far better luck in the dirt.





Oh, and a C90. They're unbelievably lucky to crash and burn.

Keep that up, I need awesome advice! :)

[cold comfort]

[QUOTE=XF650;1130020905]Another OFF topic - had a spectacular one on Thursday. Won't go into details other than some wanker had booby-trapped part of the Clarksfield Rd. The Freewind got some big air & came down on my left leg, driving my whole left side into the gravel.

Good to hear you are in one piece dude. Always need some help out of various ditches! Survived to crash another day. A cautionary tale indeed.

[Ocean1]

Keep that up, I need awesome advice! :)

... and make sure your under 18, fucking bulletproof dem young bastards.


'Course at my stage of advanced decreptitude if I trip over the cat I'm fucking history.

[Woodman]

happy that you are ok there Stru.

Gotta admit that my gear is in need for an update. Its done well with really only a twisted knee damage wise to me, although not sure what would have prevented that as I have a theory that knees are like a fuse e.g. a deliberate weak point that stops things (hips, pelvises) getting damaged further up the line. Ergo if you put a knee brace on you may break your hip if it is a twisting type injury.

But yeah good gear is good.

[marks]

You're just lucky. ATGATT did me no fucking good at all.

I think you might be comparing apples with oranges

You road guys seem to be mainly concerned with abrasion resistance and think a pair of softish leather boots and some flexible padding in jacket and pants is adequate protection.

Struan was wearing a proper solid armoured pressure suit and separate hard plastic knee protection along with rigid mx boots - That - in my humble opinion - is proper adventure riding ATGATT.

Like dirt riders most adventure bike riders are possibly a little more concerned about impact injury than abrasion injury.

[XF650]

glad you OK....thats sacry though, that someone is willing to risk killing someone, I'd be phoning the bobbies....the next rider might not be as fortuneate as you!!

I am making "enquiries" to get the (road) issue fixed & why it was there in the first place. But really this thread is about safety gear & how in this instance I reckon the better gear saved my bacon.

[James Deuce]

I think you might be comparing apples with oranges

You road guys seem to be mainly concerned with abrasion resistance and think a pair of softish leather boots and some flexible padding in jacket and pants is adequate protection.

Struan was wearing a proper solid armoured pressure suit and separate hard plastic knee protection along with rigid mx boots - That - in my humble opinion - is proper adventure riding ATGATT.

Like dirt riders most adventure bike riders are possibly a little more concerned about impact injury than abrasion injury.


I think you might be confusing me with a dickhead. I was wearing full leathers with hard Armour at knees and elbows, boots that were rigid enough to be problematic to walk in, a back protector, a carbon fibre helmet and gloves with carbon fibre knuckle protectors. Abrasion resistance at 75 km/hr would be dealt with by a pair of Draggins.

The fact I still have a right foot is entirely down to my boots, the fact I'm alive is down to my helmet. The rib injures, the internal injuries and the gouges at knee and elbow are entirely down to supposedly superior leather gear and back protector failing and the "hard" armour shattering and the resulting shrapnel violating my inner sanctum. Actual injuries from sliding down the road had nothing to do with it.

[Ocean1]

I have a theory that knees are like a fuse e.g. a deliberate weak point that stops things (hips, pelvises) getting damaged further up the line. Ergo if you put a knee brace on you may break your hip if it is a twisting type injury.

Don't know about knees being an evolutionary sacrificial structure, when you fuck 'em they're usually well fucked compared typical damage to ankles or hips. Ankles and hips articulate through any angle, up to a reasonable distance, knees simply don't. In the seventies I bought a pair of Vendraminis, essentially full MX height ski boots. They were a bloody disaster, my knees coped it something wicked.

[DrunkenMistake]

Glad your okay mate, I bet it was that Fucker Nick Smith trying to prove a point by booby trapping the road ;)
http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php/121345-ATGATT.-Why-It-doesn-t-affect-anyone-else

[bart]

Glad to hear you're OK. Good gear certainly helps, but I'm guilty of riding the 3km to work in t-shirt and shorts. I've had a shit load more close calls riding that same 3km on a push bike.

One bit of advice that's kept me alive for the last few decades is 'never outride your braking distance'. I can't say I always obey this, but the theory is sound, except when some idiot coming the other way is riding like a lunatic.:angry:

[XF650]

glad to hear that you are ok

buy a set of these (http://www.torpedo7.co.nz/products/6TPRKN0FO/title/thor-force-kneeguard-2010) THOR Force Kneeguards

I have tested my set many times and I don't think you will get better protection without getting proper knee braces.

Thanks for the link Mark. I think Nordie uses those too.

[Aslan]

Glad to hear you're OK Struan and thanks for posting the timely reminder to us all about the importance of good protective gear - cheers S

[Hitcher]

There's no such thing as "all the gear". Adequacy of gear is a matter of time and place. What may have worked for some does not mean that others will be afforded the same levels of protection.

Abrasion resistance is paramount for any motorcyclist, or scooter rider for that matter. Missing skin is quite hard to replace, as is missing flesh. Broken bones are comparatively easier to deal with.

I am constantly startled by riders who don't wear gloves, or who wear fingerless gloves. I am also startled by those who ride in short-sleeve shirts, tee shirts and shorts. I saw several such at Mt Maunganui last weekend. But hey, they're not going to fall off, so what does that matter?

Similar arguments can be raised about open-face helmets, or those stupid turtle lids that Harley riders who like their ears to flap in the wind like to wear. They are even DOT/Snell rated, more's the worry.

Every significant off that I have had has resulted in considerable grazing to the chin protection on my helmet. I would be even more chinless if I had been resolute enough to wear an openface.

I remain to be convinced about the value of armour because I'm not sure what it's supposed to protect one from. It may disperse the forces of some impacts but not others, particularly point impact sources, like posts.

So if there's no such thing as "all the gear" then it can't be worn "all the time". That's why I rail against that as I do against all similar lame cliches that have become battle cries.

[zeRax]

fark pal, glad you are ok

[NordieBoy]

Thanks for the link Mark. I think Nordie uses those too.

Yep.
Only when racing though as they don't sit well with the DR tank.
The XR and TT are much narrower and no problem with the bulkier guards.

[chasio]

Glad to hear you're OK, mon ami. What have you been doing to look after your leg since?

[NordieBoy]

What have you been doing to look after your leg since?
Keeping an eye on it by taking it with him everywhere he goes?

[Monstaman]

Keeping an eye on it by taking it with him everywhere he goes?

Wow ... now that is dedication to well being! :bleh:

[jonbuoy]

I think you might be confusing me with a dickhead. I was wearing full leathers with hard Armour at knees and elbows, boots that were rigid enough to be problematic to walk in, a back protector, a carbon fibre helmet and gloves with carbon fibre knuckle protectors. Abrasion resistance at 75 km/hr would be dealt with by a pair of Draggins.

The fact I still have a right foot is entirely down to my boots, the fact I'm alive is down to my helmet. The rib injures, the internal injuries and the gouges at knee and elbow are entirely down to supposedly superior leather gear and back protector failing and the "hard" armour shattering and the resulting shrapnel violating my inner sanctum. Actual injuries from sliding down the road had nothing to do with it.

JD, what brand of back protector and leathers did you have on? Did you contact the manufacturers? Did the back protector do more harm than good?

[chasio]

Keeping an eye on it by taking it with him everywhere he goes?

We need a smiley for a short drum roll followed by a crash cymbal!

Was thinking more of ice, elevation that kind of thing... I know some of that RICE approach has been doubted, but ice and elevation still seem to help for me!

[Padmei]

We need a smiley for a short drum roll followed by a crash cymbal!

Was thinking more of ice, elevation that kind of thing... I know some of that RICE approach has been doubted, but ice and elevation still seem to help for me!

Jeez Chasio I'd let him recover before you send him out mountain climbing...

[Toaster]

Yup atgatt works in some cases ... it limited the damage .. ... So although he was damaged in that one .. I cannot imagine how much worse it would have been with none of the gear!

Totally agree. Good gear is always going to give the rider a better chance than none, but obviously some cases will go beyond the abilities of the gear.

The day I had a big crash trying to avoid a kamakaze sheep I wore all the full gear and am thankful it limited the injuries. No road rash was a help. Didn't stop the impact head injury, broken ribs, bleeding lung, two lacerations in my liver from my broken ribs, or the massive swelling to my right side.

I am lucky I left the half helmet and jeans at home that day and wore a full Helmet and armoured gear.

[Toaster]

Nasty, to answer your question, yes I did sell the Half Helmet.

I stick with full face helmets nowdays.

[dino3310]

We need a smiley for a short drum roll followed by a crash cymbal!

Was thinking more of ice, elevation that kind of thing... I know some of that RICE approach has been doubted, but ice and elevation still seem to help for me!

thats the one mate, ICE, the ready available anti inflammatory.. works for me, but sometimes the drugs are pretty good too:innocent: