CRF450R radiator boiling and a cost effective solution.

[socialites]

Yes I know, the CRF450R is a motorcrosser, not an enduro/trail bike and hates standing still ideling. But as many of us do, we use this bike for trails/enduros and as long as you moving, its all cool. Heaven forbid you get stuck behind a group in a bog and wait patiently ideling until a rut has cleared for you to proceed, as after about 30sec, she boils. I have tried the overflow tanks sold at Mr Motorcycles, but although they great for the 250r, the 450r simply blows the water out of the 60ml holding capacity that it offers.
Has anyone on this forum come up with a solution as yet?, I would be keen to know what you have done, and possibly share some ideas . I have mounted a overflow bottle from a very early model road bike that I found at a wrecker under the seat and tucked it into the right hand side cover and although have not yet tried it, am hoping this will help, as the steam should have enough time to condensate along the feed pipe and into the resevoir to be able to be sucked back under vacume when the level drops and the pressure subsides. Any thoughts?

[motor_mayhem]

Larger Aftermarket radiator perhaps?

[nodrog]

http://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=74&pcid=10

[raglanash]

You are on the right track all ready.
go and get lost in thumpertalk, many ways to roam by the looks.
I did a quick search.
http://www.thumpertalk.com/forum/search.php?searchid=11767038
This is the 450R specific forum, ask them anything and you will usually get an answer just make sure you search first to avoid a flaming.
http://www.thumpertalk.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=29

[green machine]

http://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=74&pcid=10
I had an EXC450 that overheated in the bush,started using this stuff and it never overheated again,you can run it just with water(as i did),or 50/50 water /water wetter and coolant.

[L Rider]

Water wetter is great stuff although we've only used it on a wee 50cc bike.
KTM mini SX 50's are prone to overheating and boiling over very quickly! our boy in the sandpit would have it boiling over quite quickly if he got slowed down in any deep sand - put water wetter in (with coolant & water) and although it didn't stop the problem it minimised it bigtime.
These wee 50's even overheat if left running on the start line.

[green machine]

Water wetter is great stuff although we've only used it on a wee 50cc bike.
KTM mini SX 50's are prone to overheating and boiling over very quickly! our boy in the sandpit would have it boiling over quite quickly if he got slowed down in any deep sand - put water wetter in (with coolant & water) and although it didn't stop the problem it minimised it bigtime.
These wee 50's even overheat if left running on the start line.
Ktm's aye,if you run the wetter wetter with straight water it might stop it boiling,as i said mine never did it again.The main reason for mixing with coolant is the water wetter only has anti freezing capabilities to -5,so unless you live in a really cold area your sweet.In winter i used to add coolant when heading to Taupo etc,just for peace of mind.

[scott411]

i have been thinking about this since you came in,

i think maybe a higher pressure radiator cap,

water wetter is a good product, engine ice was to, but no longer available here as far as i can find out,

[socialites]

i have been thinking about this since you came in,

i think maybe a higher pressure radiator cap,

water wetter is a good product, engine ice was to, but no longer available here as far as i can find out,

Hello Again Scott
Yes, I to have thought of a higher pressure radiator cap, as the Honda comes standard with a 1.1, and rule of thumb says the water would boil at 110 Deg. C using this cap and a 1.2 would mean 120 Deg. C etc. The manual gives a range of 1.1 to 1.4 as being safe to use on this motor, but does warn and logically so that the higher the pressure cap, the more load is placed on the motor cooling system eg seals etc., so am reluctant to go down that track right now.
As for products like "Mocool", "Water wetter" and "Engine ice" etc, most people seem to miss the point on these products. From my research and understanding, these products do keep the engine cooler, by accualy removing the Glycol content in the engine cooler liquid or anti freeze, but in so doing, reduces the boiling tempreture from say, in the case of a 1.1 cap and 110 Deg. C down to around the 100 Deg. C. So again, rule of thumb says that if the product boasts a reduction of temp by say 5 Deg. C, the boiling temp is also reduced by 5 deg. C. These products work well for the likes of race cars, where the aim is to keep the engine temp down to the minimum within the optimum heat range required to have the motor perform at its best, but not nesseseraly in dirtbikes, where one wants the engine hot, but not to boil. Again, I am no guru on this, but based on the research I have done over the past week or so..and it has been intence, this is my understanding.
So as I said, at this point, I have included a "puke" tank to my bike, much the same as that that you showed me in your shop and on the Kawasaki's, mounted at the rear and against the side cover. I have also changed my hoses to that of the silicone type (they recon this reduces water temp by about 2 Deg) I also only now use Distelled water mixed 50/50 with an organic Motul antifreeze. (this is said to save a few degreese based on no impurities in the water).
I guess the proof will be in the riding, and the reving it out in bogs.....

[scott411]

we have run 1.6 radiator caps on most models with no bad outcomes, Kawasaki sell the cap, but we have since found a cheaper aftermarket one,

[Crisis management]

Why not add a radiator fan, manually switched from the bars, you are trying to get the radiator to get rid of heat aren't you?

[L Rider]

Ktm's aye,if you run the wetter wetter with straight water it might stop it boiling,as i said mine never did it again.The main reason for mixing with coolant is the water wetter only has anti freezing capabilities to -5,so unless you live in a really cold area your sweet.In winter i used to add coolant when heading to Taupo etc,just for peace of mind.

Will keep that in mind (well tell hubby haha) for when my girl starts on the mini. The boy has moved up a bike & so far so good with it - although he's never going slow on it.

[scott411]

Why not add a radiator fan, manually switched from the bars, you are trying to get the radiator to get rid of heat aren't you?

problem with this is you have no power supply on the R, kick start, no battery, hard to wire in as the std electrics normally only provide enough juice to run the bike,

if you were to add the battery, fan and all the gear you need, it would be cheaper to get bigger radiators,

[green machine]

Hello Again Scott
Yes, I to have thought of a higher pressure radiator cap, as the Honda comes standard with a 1.1, and rule of thumb says the water would boil at 110 Deg. C using this cap and a 1.2 would mean 120 Deg. C etc. The manual gives a range of 1.1 to 1.4 as being safe to use on this motor, but does warn and logically so that the higher the pressure cap, the more load is placed on the motor cooling system eg seals etc., so am reluctant to go down that track right now.
As for products like "Mocool", "Water wetter" and "Engine ice" etc, most people seem to miss the point on these products. From my research and understanding, these products do keep the engine cooler, by accualy removing the Glycol content in the engine cooler liquid or anti freeze, but in so doing, reduces the boiling tempreture from say, in the case of a 1.1 cap and 110 Deg. C down to around the 100 Deg. C. So again, rule of thumb says that if the product boasts a reduction of temp by say 5 Deg. C, the boiling temp is also reduced by 5 deg. C. These products work well for the likes of race cars, where the aim is to keep the engine temp down to the minimum within the optimum heat range required to have the motor perform at its best, but not nesseseraly in dirtbikes, where one wants the engine hot, but not to boil. Again, I am no guru on this, but based on the research I have done over the past week or so..and it has been intence, this is my understanding.
So as I said, at this point, I have included a "puke" tank to my bike, much the same as that that you showed me in your shop and on the Kawasaki's, mounted at the rear and against the side cover. I have also changed my hoses to that of the silicone type (they recon this reduces water temp by about 2 Deg) I also only now use Distelled water mixed 50/50 with an organic Motul antifreeze. (this is said to save a few degreese based on no impurities in the water).
I guess the proof will be in the riding, and the reving it out in bogs.....
I did plenty of research before chucking Water Wetter in my bike ,both here and on Thumpertalk,i'm no scientist but i do know.....Water Wetter,no boil over,no Water Wetter,boil over,i know there are a few guys off here use it so will watch this thread with interest

[socialites]

Why not add a radiator fan, manually switched from the bars, you are trying to get the radiator to get rid of heat aren't you?

Yeah, a radiator fan is the answer, and easily fitted to the crf450x which has a battery installed as it is an electric start dirt bike, but the R has no battery, so a battery pack will also have to be mounted somewhere, and a "puke" tank seems an easier solution in this case.

[socialites]

we have run 1.6 radiator caps on most models with no bad outcomes, Kawasaki sell the cap, but we have since found a cheaper aftermarket one,

I must confess Scott, that if what I have already done fails, I will be looking at going to a "heavyer" radiator cap, and will come see you in this regard.

[socialites]

I must confess Scott, that if what I have already done fails, I will be looking at going to a "heavyer" radiator cap, and will come see you in this regard.

Shit, my spelling sucks...hahaha

[flyingcr250]

http://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=74&pcid=10

were do you get it from and how much?

[green machine]

were do you get it from and how much?

From BNT it's about 30 bucks....

[Jay GTI]

From BNT it's about 30 bucks....


What, Bras 'n Things????

Oh you mean the other BNT... but cheers, boiled the Kato on Sat, so need to get some.

[barty5]

Interesting reading for all the trail riding my yz450f has done and being stuck in long line waiting for people who are stuck its only ever boiled from when i myself have given it shit cause i was stuck guess they must have a better water flow/ radiators?

[flyingcr250]

Interesting reading for all the trail riding my yz450f has done and being stuck in long line waiting for people who are stuck its only ever boiled from when i myself have given it shit cause i was stuck guess they must have a better water flow/ radiators?

i remember seeing alot of water comming out your bike when mike and chris power took us on that ride at the farm

[porky]

Yeah, a radiator fan is the answer, and easily fitted to the crf450x which has a battery installed as it is an electric start dirt bike, but the R has no battery, so a battery pack will also have to be mounted somewhere, and a "puke" tank seems an easier solution in this case.

Dont need a battery to run a fan. Trials bike is the set up you want. Fan runs from thermostate (mines hard wired to a switch and by passes the thermostate) but has what i think is a capacitor ???? wired in, the fan is a 12v unit about 100mm made by matsuba. Not sure of the wiring etc on your bike or the voltage but hope this helps

[oldguy]

does any retailer here stock this stuff.

#14 Kevin Windham use it.

http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/rdcb.aspx

[CRF119]

You can also use a product called 2 Two cool oil additive reduces friction and engine temps. (Is Safe with clutches) I used it on my highly stresed CR125 with great success. I have not used it on my crf450. You must be going dam slow to boil it? I boiled mine doing the Wires loop and the problem is once it boils its very hard to get it cooled down. I use a radiator cap with a gauge on it to give an indication of heat.

Water wetter works great but only effective if you are moving still. Small thermo switch rad fans and a small battery pack would be a easy under $100 fix for stationary heat.

[pete.ktm]

my 06 ktm 450exc tends to spew some fluid out on the slow stuff.

last ride i noticed my mates 08 450exc comes with a 1.8 radiator cap, mines a 1.4.

this thread got me googling and just came across this at ktmcyclehutt.com:

Radiator Cap 1.8 BAR
Price: $13.99
KTM Part Number(s): 77335016000

This cap comes stock on all 2008-2009 bikes. Can be used to replace lower 1.4 pressure radiator caps on KTM's older than 2008 to help prevent boil overs.

[Pornstar]

2t, thats all.

[codgyoleracer]

we have run 1.6 radiator caps on most models with no bad outcomes, Kawasaki sell the cap, but we have since found a cheaper aftermarket one,

The higher pressure cap is a good cheap & long term simple solution, I have used up to 1.4 without issue.

GW