View Full Version : Internet use, responsibility?
george formby
5th May 2011, 14:48
After watching Fair Go I got to thinking about my legal standing as an internet provider ( I own an interweb cafe ) re the recent law changes.
The upshot was that the person who has the connection / pays the bills is responsible for what that connection is used for.
I cannot monitor how my computers are used & cannot stand as judge & jury over my customers.
IMHO the law is unworkable, what are KBers thoughts on this & is their really a risk of prosecution?
wysper
5th May 2011, 14:51
The public libraries have battled with this dilemma for a while too.
Not sure what the resolution will be, but in this case the law does look to be unworkable in the real world.
I guess places providing wifi hotspots will be similarly worried.
oneofsix
5th May 2011, 14:54
After watching Fair Go I got to thinking about my legal standing as an internet provider ( I own an interweb cafe ) re the recent law changes.
The upshot was that the person who has the connection / pays the bills is responsible for what that connection is used for.
I cannot monitor how my computers are used & cannot stand as judge & jury over my customers.
IMHO the law is unworkable, what are KBers thoughts on this & is their really a risk of prosecution?
If you are a registered ISP don't you just have to send the notice to whoever is on the IP address using he contact details they have provided? Does seem like a bit of a black hole :innocent:
george formby
5th May 2011, 14:59
Potentially I could get my 3 strikes in an afternoon depending on whether I have to wait for the postman or get online notification that I'm being naughty.
I will keep my fingers crossed that the first case comes from a police computer, hospital, school, council wifi spot etc.
It's bizarre but I have to take it seriously, tis my livelihood after all.
It's kinda similar to the one where if your car is snapped speeding (say) you get the ticket, and are stuck with it if you can't prove who was driving at the time.
Except in this instance, your car keys are left in the ignition so you really have no control.
george formby
5th May 2011, 15:06
It's kinda similar to the one where if your car is snapped speeding (say) you get the ticket, and are stuck with it if you can't prove who was driving at the time.
Except in this instance, your car keys are left in the ignition so you really have no control.
My sediment exactly. No doubt it's a case of guilty until proven innocent too & how can you do that?
Scuba_Steve
5th May 2011, 15:10
If our legal system was as it should be then you are innocent until proven guilty & guilt must be proven beyond reasonable doubt, unfortunately our legal system is corrupt so cross your fingers & hope for the best
george formby
5th May 2011, 15:17
Anecdotal info claims that the big corporation's are behind this (warner, sony,etc) to protect their interests, fair enough, but I shudder to think that gummints are passing this kind of legislation due to pressure from business & are prepared to put innocent or ignorant users in the firing line to appease the media & entertainment industry.
I wonder if somebody turned around & said you will have to run your campaign ads on the Maori channel if you don't play ball?
oneofsix
5th May 2011, 15:22
Anecdotal info claims that the big corporation's are behind this (warner, sony,etc) to protect their interests, fair enough, but I shudder to think that gummints are passing this kind of legislation due to pressure from business & are prepared to put innocent or ignorant users in the firing line to appease the media & entertainment industry.
I wonder if somebody turned around & said you will have to run your campaign ads on the Maori channel if you don't play ball?
more like someone said the Hobit was scouting non-NZ locations
Oblivion
5th May 2011, 19:48
This law is so full of holes :facepalm:
Why did they let the US pressure us into this :angry:
SMOKEU
5th May 2011, 21:24
That law is going to be very hard to enforce. I'm going to keep on downloading 30GB+ of torrents every month. Phuck the government and their corrupt propaganda.
Berries
5th May 2011, 23:55
I wonder if somebody turned around & said you will have to run your campaign ads on the Maori channel if you don't play ball?
I wouldn't complain. The Maori channel has gone international now Hone has gone off on another one.
I listen to a lot of death and black metal which is extremely hard to find in stores and on tardme/ebay, so illegal downloading is often the only way to get a copy, I am more than willing to pay for it but that often isn't an option. I will continue to download regardless of this bullshit law, the big mainstream record companies and their government puppets can get fucked.
ducatilover
6th May 2011, 01:42
Meh. Proxy. Solved.
Brilliant huh? :innocent:
jonbuoy
6th May 2011, 05:02
After watching Fair Go I got to thinking about my legal standing as an internet provider ( I own an interweb cafe ) re the recent law changes.
The upshot was that the person who has the connection / pays the bills is responsible for what that connection is used for.
I cannot monitor how my computers are used & cannot stand as judge & jury over my customers.
IMHO the law is unworkable, what are KBers thoughts on this & is their really a risk of prosecution?
Why canīt you monitor/control? www.untangle.com block P2P traffic, proxy sites, torrent sites etc... free edition is pretty good by itself.
NighthawkNZ
6th May 2011, 07:16
Why canīt you monitor/control? www.untangle.com (http://www.untangle.com) block P2P traffic, proxy sites, torrent sites etc... free edition is pretty good by itself.
Because people say P2P and torrent and instintly think piracy... well you can also have true freeware on P2P networks and from most torrent sites... as it is a good way to get the software out there...
Example: The last version of Open Office I downloaded was a P2P network from their OOo own site and downloaded in a couple minutes it was great.
And same goes for when you actually buy the softwaremany companys put it on a their torrent network.
I was think of making my own torrent site for my music (which is free). Southern Rider was thinking about a torrent site for videos for our members...
So just blocking them will block a lot more than just piracy
jonbuoy
6th May 2011, 07:43
Because people say P2P and torrent and instintly think piracy... well you can also have true freeware on P2P networks and from most torrent sites... as it is a good way to get the software out there...
Example: The last version of Open Office I downloaded was a P2P network from their OOo own site and downloaded in a couple minutes it was great.
And same goes for when you actually buy the softwaremany companys put it on a their torrent network.
I was think of making my own torrent site for my music (which is free). Southern Rider was thinking about a torrent site for videos for our members...
So just blocking them will block a lot more than just piracy
For a public internet cafe looking to protect themselves from liability its a small price to pay.
wysper
6th May 2011, 07:47
Because people say P2P and torrent and instintly think piracy... well you can also have true freeware on P2P networks and from most torrent sites... as it is a good way to get the software out there...
Do you know if downloading episodes of a tv show that have been shown or a scheduled to be shown on NZ tv free to air is illegal? or is it a case by case basis and each show is different?
NighthawkNZ
6th May 2011, 07:51
Do you know if downloading episodes of a tv show that have been shown or a scheduled to be shown on NZ tv free to air is illegal? or is it a case by case basis and each show is different?
illegal... it is technically illegal to even record any tv show for watching it later.
illegal... it is technically illegal to even record any tv show for watching it later.
It used to be and is no longer. This upset the Americans no end.
Scuba_Steve
6th May 2011, 09:12
It used to be and is no longer. This upset the Americans no end.
have they changed it? for at-least 4yrs after the iPods release in NZ it was illegal to use it as intended due to our overly retarded laws
NighthawkNZ
6th May 2011, 09:20
It used to be and is no longer. This upset the Americans no end.
Putting the show on a torrent site is illegal. Not that I give a shit...
As far as I know it still is illegal to record the show even for private use to watch later... but since we just do it, they turn the so called blind eye. As long as if you are no reselling and or uploading it to the net...
Hawkeye
6th May 2011, 09:33
As far as I know it still is illegal to record the show even for private use to watch later... but since we just do it, they turn the so called blind eye. As long as if you are no reselling and or uploading it to the net...
So what your saying is that sky, with their My Sky packaging, are technically encouraging illegal practices. :scratch:
Putting the show on a torrent site is illegal. Not that I give a shit...
As far as I know it still is illegal to record the show even for private use to watch later... but since we just do it, they turn the so called blind eye. As long as if you are no reselling and or uploading it to the net...
From: http://www.med.govt.nz/templates/Page____7290.aspx#P2_41
Permitted acts include:
"fair dealing" - for the purposes of criticism, review, news reporting, research or private study;
limited copying or dealing in the work for particular educational purposes;
limited copying or dealing in the work by librarians or archivists in specific circumstances;
exceptions in respect of certain activities by the Crown;
copying for the purposes of making copies that are in Braille;
subject to certain conditions, the making of a back-up copy of a computer program; and
recording a television programme for the purpose of making a complaint or for "time shifting" purposes so that a programme can be watched at a more convenient time.
There is no general exception to copyright infringement for private of domestic copying, including "format shifting", of legitimately purchased recordings from one medium to another to allow playing or viewing via other devices.
Yup, shifting formats to view/listen on another device is illegal.
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