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FROSTY
7th July 2005, 13:04
Ill start this by saying no matter what ya do one car driver in a thousand is gonna say--"sorry I diddnt see ya"
Threres lots of things that can be done to make yaself more visible -dayglow clothes.Lights on,running lights in your indicators.
paint ya bike bright yellow - or for that matter ride a big white bike with a dab of blue and red paint on the fairing. :devil2:
There are a lot of things you can do to increase ya chances of beeing seen.
Mind you also keep in mind their windows and mirrors are likely fogged up this time of year -Kinda an unavoidable hazzard.
Something to think about

XTC
7th July 2005, 13:12
Yes running lights do make a difference

Lou Girardin
7th July 2005, 14:20
Nothing will save you from the likes of the Alfa driver that didn't see the stationary bus outside AMPS this morning. He's got a great power bulge in his bonnet now. :tugger:

XP@
7th July 2005, 15:27
Road positioning
Escape routes
Horn
Bigger Horn
Lights
More Lights
Reflective Vest
Luck
A grim determination to stay connected to an upright bike even though you have just been side swiped by a car at about 20kph.
Engine bars and heavyweight pannier rack to protect you from the affore mentioned side swipe.

Ixion
7th July 2005, 15:56
Well, I sometimes ride a BMW with a big white fairing (no blue or red though) . And sometimes a little red and black bike

Now, the difference in 'idiot" behaviour is quite noticeable. Far fewer people fail to give way, tailgate, pull out without signalling, etc when I'm on the BMW

How much of this is due to better visibility (white versus red/black), how much to "Oh I'd *better* see him, cos he might be a cop" , I don't know.

And even on the Whale, there's plenty of stupidty. And I don't think any bike could be more visible than that.

But, anything that can be done helps. It may not guarantee safety, but it pushes the odds down the probability curve.

Can't really add any more to what Mr Frosty has said. Those Visilights that turn your indicators into running lights sound like a lot of extra visibility and safety for a small investment.

vifferman
7th July 2005, 15:59
Those Visilights that turn your indicators into running lights sound like a lot of extra visibility and safety for a small investment.
... so it's about time they passed a law to make them illegal.

blownae92
7th July 2005, 16:24
bit of a thread hijack here so I apologise in advance, I would really be keen on setting up the indicators on my bike to remain on when not in use..ie: flashing...how do you do this?

Motu
7th July 2005, 16:26
... so it's about time they passed a law to make them illegal.

Fear not,I have it here - page 4-4-1,reg 9.....a daytime running lamp must not opperate when a front fog lamp or a headlamp is in use.

So XTC is opperating his motorcycle illeagally,this is of great concern for all us motorcyclists if one of us takes the law into their own hands - I suggest a citizens arest is in order,we need to get this dangerous motorcycle off the road ASAP!

Lou Girardin
7th July 2005, 16:31
Fear not,I have it here - page 4-4-1,reg 9.....a daytime running lamp must not opperate when a front fog lamp or a headlamp is in use.

So XTC is opperating his motorcycle illeagally,this is of great concern for all us motorcyclists if one of us takes the law into their own hands - I suggest a citizens arest is in order,we need to get this dangerous motorcycle off the road ASAP!

What's a daytime running lamp defined as?

Motu
7th July 2005, 16:51
What's a daytime running lamp defined as?

Daytime running lamp means a lamp designed to emit a low intensity light forward of a vehicle to make it more easily seen in daytime.

A vehicle originaly manufactured with a daytime running lamp arrangment that differs from that which is required or permitted in this section may retain the original daytime running lamps provided they remain fitted in their original position and perform as intended by the vehicle manufacturer.

So,he's still guilty of an infringment - you've had more experiance than me in this sort of thing Lou...go bring him in!

surfchick
7th July 2005, 17:14
great thread frostmyster...
i saw a guy on a bland well nigh invisible bike on the motor way. he whisked past me as everyone does except skoda & fiat uno drivers... BUT he had a HOT RED helmet on. you could see nothing but the li'll red button MILES away down the road then the rest of him was invisible. Not that maroon colour but HOT BLOCK RED. was very cool. snooker-ball cool. i've opted for the white billiard-ball look. block white helmet. but i quite dug the RED

Ixion
7th July 2005, 18:26
Fear not,I have it here - page 4-4-1,reg 9.....a daytime running lamp must not opperate when a front fog lamp or a headlamp is in use.

So XTC is opperating his motorcycle illeagally,this is of great concern for all us motorcyclists if one of us takes the law into their own hands - I suggest a citizens arest is in order,we need to get this dangerous motorcycle off the road ASAP!

Yup. That's why mine turn off when the headlamps come on. I had to put in an extra relay just for that. Bonus though is that if the headlamp filiment fails the DRLs will automatically come on.

TwoSeven
7th July 2005, 18:52
I have a little green reflector strip on my lid, runs around the base. Cant see it during the day, but it shows up like the stuff on those police vests at night.

crashe
7th July 2005, 19:42
I must admit the last few days when I have been out in my car...
due to really bad weather.... I have seen a few riders out and about..
and they have been hard to see.

Wearing black gear, no lights going on the front....

So those riders should have the lights on or something so that they can be seen.

FROSTY
7th July 2005, 21:29
actually the suprise of my life was following a bloke on what turned out to be a rf900 suzuki -- Black lid black leathers and a tiny little tailight -I think one of the tailight bulbs had blown--Seems dumb to me --theyve got that huge as brake light and A TINY lil tailight

riffer
7th July 2005, 21:50
Huh. I know the feeling. My tail light's blown. And taken the instruments with it. Go figure - they must be on the same line.

Anyway, I've been lightly touching the back brake all the way to work today. Not good in the dark going to work I tell you.

I'll rip off the fairings tomorrow to have a look.

Why did Suzuki design a bike you have to remove the fairings off to change a bulb? :no:

Flyingpony
7th July 2005, 23:15
Fear not,I have it here - page 4-4-1,reg 9.....a daytime running lamp must not opperate when a front fog lamp or a headlamp is in use.

So XTC is opperating his motorcycle illeagally,this is of great concern for all us motorcyclists if one of us takes the law into their own hands - I suggest a citizens arest is in order,we need to get this dangerous motorcycle off the road ASAP!
I've had a number of cars nearly wipe me out because they didn't spot when my brake light became illuminated. All but one case had heaps of opportunity to spot it but failed to, that one case was when I suddenly discovered an extremely close tailgater was going sideways behind me despite the mirror check 10sec prior giving the all clear for a good 200m. Only possibility is they must've come from the side street I'd just passed.

Have seen in Asian countries whereby the rear indicator lights flash when the brakes are on, and it's extremely effectively I can tell you too! :yes: You can imagine my disappointment when I asked around if I could legally make this modification and they say I'll fail my WOF :no: :mad:

So unfortunately I can't make that modification, but what about red flashing lights? Is that illegal?

What about if I mount another set of orange indicator lights and use those, is that illegal?

Car's have a extra high stop light, but it doesn't flash.
I want to make the back end brighter when braking, especially after reading that another FXR got rear ended up in Auckland. Definitely don't want that to happen to me!

XP@
7th July 2005, 23:34
So unfortunately I can't make that modification, but what about red flashing lights? Is that illegal?

What about if I mount another set of orange indicator lights and use those, is that illegal?

Car's have a extra high stop light, but it doesn't flash.
I want to make the back end brighter when braking, especially after reading that another FXR got rear ended up in Auckland. Definitely don't want that to happen to me!
Cyclists have red flashing rear lights. So flashing should be ok.
I have 2 sets of orange indicators and they are wofable. I put them there because the standard pair are invisible with my panniers on.

Don't know what would happen if they flashed when you put the anchors on. There again if the light dosent flash when you get the warrent. but amazingly develops a strange bug in the electrics just after the wof...

Or you could try one of these:
http://www.challengermotors.co.nz/Web%20Pages/signalfly.htm

If there are any electronics wizzes out there is there any way of making a unit to flash a set of LED's faster based on the length of time the brakes have been applied?
edit: just found this on LED's
http://www.webbikeworld.com/Motorcycle-technical-articles/led/
http://www.webbikeworld.com/Motorcycle-technical-articles/Brake-lights.htm

Ixion
7th July 2005, 23:54
..

So unfortunately I can't make that modification, but what about red flashing lights? Is that illegal?

What about if I mount another set of orange indicator lights and use those, is that illegal?

Car's have a extra high stop light, but it doesn't flash.
I want to make the back end brighter when braking, especially after reading that another FXR got rear ended up in Auckland. Definitely don't want that to happen to me!

OK. Here ya go

First. HERE (http://www.landtransport.govt.nz/rules/vehicle-lighting-2004.html) are the RULES on what you can and can't do

(NB motorcycles are class L vehicles)

Sorry, but flashing tails lights are not legal either

2.1(3) The light emitted from a lamp must be steady unless otherwise specified in this rule or any other enactment.

(pisses me off to, LTSA claim to want to improve safety, then make things that would actually do that illegal!)

However : You can have MORE THAN ONE taillight !

7.4(3) A motor vehicle of Group L must be fitted with at least one rearward-facing position lamp that emits light that is visible during the hours of darkness from a distance of:

* (a) 100 m, for a vehicle of Class LA or Class LB; and
* (b) 200 m, for a vehicle of Class LC, LD or LE.

At least one ! Nothing about a maximum number ! (I think this is an oversight, but that's what it says. So I have three!)

AND !! You can have TWO normal height stop (brake) lights

4.3(1) Subject to 4.3(2), a motor vehicle of Class LA or Class LB may be fitted with one or two stop lamps at the rear of the vehicle.

4.3(2) A motor vehicle of Class LA or Class LB first registered in New Zealand on or after 1 January 1991 must be fitted with one or two stop lamps at the rear of the vehicle.

AND !! You can have *TWO* HIGH MOUNTED brake lights AS WELL

5.3(1) A motor vehicle not specified in 5.3(2) or 5.3(3) may be fitted with one or two high-mounted stop lamps.

5.3(2) A motor vehicle of Class MA, first registered in New Zealand on or after 1 January 1990, must be fitted with one or two high-mounted stop lamps.

5.3(3) A vehicle of Group A must not be fitted with a high-mounted stop lamp.

(Definition of high mounted stop lamp

High-mounted stop lamp
means a stop lamp that is designed to be fitted in a central, high-mounted position at the rear of a vehicle.

)


So you can have as many tail lights as you want. Plus two low brake lights, plus two high brake lights

If you can't get enough light out of that then you're hard to please indeed.

Assuming of course that your charging system can handle all this .

EDIT- Second set of orange "indicators" as running lights

Strictly, slightly dubious since the Design Approvals for the lights (those numbers on the lenses) will be for use as an indicator not a DRL.

But I doubt any WOF inspector is going to be clued up enough to pick that one up.

But ANY daytime running light MUST automatically turn off when the headlamps come on. Doesn't matter if they are doubling as indicators or not. I have actually done exactly that, fitted a second set of amber lamps. But mine go off if you turn the lights on. It's fairly trivial to do this, just need a DTSP relay, and run the feed to the DRL from the non energised side. Then feed the relay from the headlamp circuit.

Zapf
8th July 2005, 00:55
just clip the Cyclists flashing red light to a bungy cord and then hook it around your cargo hooks on the tail :)

What?
8th July 2005, 06:31
Who remenbers the Eric and Douglas cartoons? They found the answer to perfect visibilty. After trying all sorts of lights, dayglo vests etc, they fitted a sticker, about 2 inches square, to the side of their chair. The sticker read "Caution: Live AIDS virus courier" - suddenly all Volvo drivers were able to see them and keep clear...

Lou Girardin
8th July 2005, 09:43
LED bulb conversions are the way to go for brake lights. The Bandit light must be quite bright though, judging from the way tailgaters back off when I give the brake a dab.

vifferman
8th July 2005, 09:50
OK. Here ya go

First. HERE (http://www.landtransport.govt.nz/rules/vehicle-lighting-2004.html) are the RULES on what you can and can't do....
Pharking stupid, and as you say, the LTSA claims that it's continual bureaucratising of our lives is for 'safety' but is actually making things worse.
F'rinstance, there's some company that makes helmet-mounted, remotely-operated brake lights - an excellent idea to stop you being rear-ended! But probably illegal here, unless because they're neither mounted on nor attached to the vehicle, they don't count. If that's the case, then flashing bicycle lights etc. could be OK too...

XTC
8th July 2005, 11:43
I'm too scared to go out on my bike now as it's so illegal...... I'd better disconnect the running lights and remove the headlight bulb so I cannot be seen by mr Plod or anyone else :rofl:

Wolf
11th July 2005, 13:53
I think it is bloody stupid that cyclists can get away with flashing rear lights but they're illegal on motorbikes and cars - mind you, pushbikes would fail a WoF test on so many counts anyway - why shouldnt they have one more thing that's "illegal" on 'em?

OK, fair enough, no white lights to the rear or red lights to the front, but WTF is Land Transport or LTSA or the Permanent Pen Pushing Brigade thinking not allowing things that would make motorcycles more visible and less likely to be involved in an accident? Proof our road rules are written by morons.

And any time one of us emails the fuck heads with a sensible suggestion an email comes back with moronic blathering from someone who probably would be incapable of getting a bike licence.

Perhaps we need to get an action campaign, of the "refuse to pay registration fees until some of the stupid laws are redressed" variety, going.

Trucks - big and easy to see - are allowed to have more running lights on their sides than an ocean liner and we're limited by "Cosmetic lights may be fitted if the light source is not visible" - why can we not have side mounted amber lights and extra amber lights front and rear running at all times to make ourselves more visible from all angles? Why are we not permitted to have flashing lights - red ones mounted at the rear only to avoid being confused with indicators - that would make us easier to spot at night time?

If it's "confusing" or "annoying" to have flashing red lights, why are they not illegal to use on pushbikes? If it's not "confusing" or "annoying", why can we not have them?

Are they worried that cagers might think we're riding a pushbike and so behave cautiously and considerately near us?

Bnonn
13th April 2007, 10:08
Forget amber running lights. They're too dim anyway. Get a couple of $25 super-bright secondary headlights from Supercheap Auto, and a couple of super-bright LED brake lights, and hook them up as running lights. It's legal to have your headlights on at all times, and as far as I know there is no limit to the number you may have. We've already seen in this thread that you are allowed an unlimited number of red tail-lights. So stick the super-bright red LEDs on top of your rear indicators, wire them up to your existing tail-light, and do the same with your main and secondary headlights at the front. If someone still fails to see you after that, they should have their license taken away because they're legally blind.

scumdog
13th April 2007, 11:16
What's a daytime running lamp defined as?

Lou has a good point here; running lights, auxiliary lights, spot lights, fog lights etc etc are all in a grey area when it comes to a definitive description.

There's enough 4 X 4 vehicle running around with the driver blithely ignorant of exactly what lights at the front are actually on and what there purpose is that I doubt a motorcycle would be targetted for having its indicators on as marking/running (or whatever you want to call them) lights.

I have two bright-as running lights, one each each side of the headlight, I switch them off at night as then they make for one giant dazzling glare. (for me as well as others on the road).

FROSTY
24th April 2007, 22:11
HOLEY COW-- Is this thread still alive

Colapop
24th April 2007, 22:13
It is now that you dredged it's sorry arse out of the dark and murky depths....

Steam
25th April 2007, 09:35
I'm happy it has been resurrected, it gives me ideas for the next theme bike. The VISIBILITY BIKE.
That's after the Barbie Bike.

bert_is_evil
25th April 2007, 15:17
I'm happy it has been resurrected, it gives me ideas for the next theme bike. The VISIBILITY BIKE.
That's after the Barbie Bike.

Is this you Steam? I barely recognise you without your hi-vis on

sunhuntin
26th April 2007, 21:13
id like to have my front indicators as running lights... a friend who owns a steed has this, and its an awesome idea.

when i took the wrong road out of chch and ended up in lyttleton, i did find that flicking my hazards on made cagers back off quick fast. whether my tail light is hard to see or not, i dont know. might look into some LED if possible.

therealvw
10th May 2007, 17:48
HI, this thread is probably going to run a little longer! or maybe not!
ANYHOO, my two cents worth, is that there are little strips of LED's that you can buy for accent lighting in HOONS cages. I wonder if these are waterproof enough to fit on either side of the number plate so that when you brake they light up too.
This sort of thing, but for the brake ligh.
http://www.webbikeworld.com/lights/motorcycle-led-light/led-light.htm

AND think this NZ site could supply them too!!
http://www.nzled.com/ledstrips.html#strip

Roj
11th May 2007, 12:10
id like to have my front indicators as running lights... a friend who owns a steed has this, and its an awesome idea.

when i took the wrong road out of chch and ended up in lyttleton, i did find that flicking my hazards on made cagers back off quick fast. whether my tail light is hard to see or not, i dont know. might look into some LED if possible.


Fear not,I have it here - page 4-4-1,reg 9.....a daytime running lamp must not opperate when a front fog lamp or a headlamp is in use.

So XTC is opperating his motorcycle illeagally,this is of great concern for all us motorcyclists if one of us takes the law into their own hands - I suggest a citizens arest is in order,we need to get this dangerous motorcycle off the road ASAP!



As per Motu's info, seems a shame, my bike has them, but as it was made that way in pre-history it is OK:scooter:

Steam
11th May 2007, 13:06
LED bulb conversions are the way to go for brake lights.

Where'd you get that LED conversion from? I want to get me some, reduce the power load so I can use it for... more lights!

Steam
11th May 2007, 13:25
So we can have many tail lights and stop lights, but what can I have on the front of my bike? Can I have about six massive white lights?
Kinda like this mad Mercedes below?

johnnyflash
11th May 2007, 22:08
I've had a number of cars nearly wipe me out because they didn't spot when my brake light became illuminated. All but one case had CLIP....
when I asked around if I could legally make this modification and they say I'll fail my WOF :no: :mad:
I want to make the back end brighter when braking, especially after reading that another FXR got rear ended up in Auckland. Definitely don't want that to happen to me!

Ive seen Highstop add-ons available from car accessory places that pulse when applied, (chasing LED variety) so I dont see why a flashing one would be a problem.. and even ones that flash a WORD - STOP... makes one think how nice it would be to have one that could say all sorts of things doesnt it :gob:

McJim
11th May 2007, 22:56
It was about this time last year I had my first (and only) altercation with a car. Didn't actually make contact but I was a rank noobie and the emergency stop caused me to drop the bike on my leg.

I was wearing a Dayglow yellow vest with Scotchlight reflector strips all over it...

I tend to wear bright colours all the time - red and white flashes on my jacket but the main thing I always do is just assume I haven't been seen. Means I'm always covering the clutch and brake and not going really fast but it's winter and I want to get to where I'm going in one piece.

I'm quite surprised at the difference between commuting on the VTR250 and the Ducati. Cars seem to be a lot more aware of my presence with the bigger V-Twin "Bark"

sAsLEX
11th May 2007, 23:50
I'm quite surprised at the difference between commuting on the VTR250 and the Ducati. Cars seem to be a lot more aware of my presence with the bigger V-Twin "Bark"


Continual KB argument No. 1006: Loud pipes save lives...........................




I also, to go with a loud pipe, have a Halo (naturally induced of course.....) on my commuting helmet, which is a neoprene strip that sits round the base of the helmet and is covered in that Scotchlite stuff

<img src=http://www.mfiap.com/halo/hhbm75.jpg>

Hanne
13th May 2007, 19:31
That neoprene strip loks like a really good idea, where do you get one of them from?

I was wondering about that a while ago actually, thinking that if they came in blue it would be neat to put a couple more strips on the arms of my jacket.

Aside from always riding with my lights on and the small reflective patches on my jacket, I am going ot get a fluoro vest with reflectors, especially for winter. Too many cars don't see us as it is it seems, let alone in winter at night.

Disco Dan
13th May 2007, 20:04
I am going ot get a fluoro vest with reflectors, especially for winter. Too many cars don't see us as it is it seems, let alone in winter at night.

If you make it to the next AWNMR we can sort you out with a hi-vis.

Hanne
14th May 2007, 20:11
Thanks, I am doing my best to make sure next Wed is all clear...
hi-vis would be especially good now I ride home at night most days

Steam
14th May 2007, 22:08
...now I ride home at night most days
I do too, so last week I went to the safety shop and got some reflective strips and sewed big red chevrons onto my Ventura pack. Bright!

Disco Dan
14th May 2007, 22:39
I do too, so last week I went to the safety shop and got some reflective strips and sewed big red chevrons onto my Ventura pack. Bright!

Really? Do they sell it in rolls or strips or something? How much? I would like to get some self adhesive reflecto strips?

sAsLEX
15th May 2007, 04:41
That neoprene strip loks like a really good idea, where do you get one of them from?

I was wondering about that a while ago actually, thinking that if they came in blue it would be neat to put a couple more strips on the arms of my jacket.

Aside from always riding with my lights on and the small reflective patches on my jacket, I am going ot get a fluoro vest with reflectors, especially for winter. Too many cars don't see us as it is it seems, let alone in winter at night.

t r a d e m e

Steam
15th May 2007, 05:29
Really? Do they sell it in rolls or strips or something? How much? I would like to get some self adhesive reflecto strips?

They do indeed. I got 2 meters of "Shoulder Sash" strip, it cost me $10 per meter. But that was cheaper than normal because the shop guy is a biker too and gave me all sorts of discounts.

The coolest reflective stuff you can get is self-adhesive, it looks BLACK in daylight but at night it is as good a reflector as any, and looks white when you shine a light on it. Very weird. It also costs $10 per meter and is available from good Pushbike shops.

Bnonn
15th May 2007, 14:31
Such as what pushbike shops? I dunno which ones are good (: I'm trying to find somewhere in Hamilton that stocks self-adhesive reflective tape and I'm having the devil of a job. Repco sells four miserable colors, NZ Safety sells nothing self-adhesive, and Supercheap Autos sells white tape in 0.6 m lengths. Lame. Bring on the pushbike shops for some white and black by the metre...

Morcs
15th May 2007, 15:23
I find that wearing my white honda leathers and looking like a 'raving homosexual' as many have said, makes me soo visible that people stay well away from me... :yes:

wonder why...

:laugh:

But seriously, wearing anything but black is a big visibility plus.

Disco Dan
15th May 2007, 17:40
They do indeed. I got 2 meters of "Shoulder Sash" strip, it cost me $10 per meter. But that was cheaper than normal because the shop guy is a biker too and gave me all sorts of discounts.

The coolest reflective stuff you can get is self-adhesive, it looks BLACK in daylight but at night it is as good a reflector as any, and looks white when you shine a light on it. Very weird. It also costs $10 per meter and is available from good Pushbike shops.

Cheers for that, will look into it.

Bnonn
16th May 2007, 13:28
Thought people might like to see what the secondary headlights I recommended in a previous post look like. Since I ride a naked FZ6, I only have a single headlight. I always have this on high-beam, because I am painfully aware of how many accidents occur because a car fails to see a bike coming and cuts across its path. However, having had a couple of close calls already, I obviously am not visible enough! A few of the Hamilton people have added secondary headlights to their bikes so as to increase their visibility to cages, and also to give them more light at night when riding the twisties. Since these lights are only $25 a pop at Supercheap Autos, I decided to give it a go myself.

My rationale is mostly that, when it comes to visibility, more is more. The additional lights are, I believe, actually very helpful, because cagers tune out to anything which doesn't fit into their expected set of "things to see". We all know that they do not look out for motorbikes. They look for other cars, and that's it. So when they see a single headlight, either they are confused, and may react unpredictably, or they simply ignore it because "it isn't a car". This may sound stupid and irrational, but ask yourself how many cagers are not stupid and irrational? It only takes one to kill you. Therefore, multiple headlights, I believe, are a big plus when riding. Even ignoring the cager psychology aspect, I have found that the dual headlights such as those on Buells and S3s are much more noticeable, and from a greater distance, when riding. A single headlight, for some reason, confuses the eye more (perhaps because there is no parallax?) Two headlights is great; three makes you sit up and look.

Anyway, I decided it would be worthwhile to try this mod, so here are the results. Sorry for the very poor quality; my camera is very cheap!

oldrider
16th May 2007, 13:41
Thought people might like to see what the secondary headlights I recommended in a previous post look like. Since I ride a naked FZ6, I only have a single headlight. I always have this on high-beam, because I am painfully aware of how many accidents occur because a car fails to see a bike coming and cuts across its path. However, having had a couple of close calls already, I obviously am not visible enough! A few of the Hamilton people have added secondary headlights to their bikes so as to increase their visibility to cages, and also to give them more light at night when riding the twisties. Since these lights are only $25 a pop at Supercheap Autos, I decided to give it a go myself.

My rationale is mostly that, when it comes to visibility, more is more. The additional lights are, I believe, actually very helpful, because cagers tune out to anything which doesn't fit into their expected set of "things to see". We all know that they do not look out for motorbikes. They look for other cars, and that's it. So when they see a single headlight, either they are confused, and may react unpredictably, or they simply ignore it because "it isn't a car". This may sound stupid and irrational, but ask yourself how many cagers are not stupid and irrational? It only takes one to kill you. Therefore, multiple headlights, I believe, are a big plus when riding. Even ignoring the cager psychology aspect, I have found that the dual headlights such as those on Buells and S3s are much more noticeable, and from a greater distance, when riding. A single headlight, for some reason, confuses the eye more (perhaps because there is no parallax?) Two headlights is great; three makes you sit up and look.

Anyway, I decided it would be worthwhile to try this mod, so here are the results. Sorry for the very poor quality; my camera is very cheap!

Have you been for a warrant check with that set up? John.

TerminalAddict
16th May 2007, 13:46
boyds say they are illegal .. but follow up by saying its a dumb rule, and won't fail me :niceone:

of course, to remove them is pretty simple, so I might do that at WOF time just incase mr inspector is in, checking that boyds are doing a good job :D

bert_is_evil
16th May 2007, 13:49
. I always have this on high-beam

Do people get angry and flash their lights at you? I've considered it but don't want to dazzle oncoming traffic causing them to swerve into my path

Bnonn
16th May 2007, 13:57
I haven't been warranted yet, but I actually can't see how they could enforce this as being illegal. There is no limit specified to the number of headlights you are allowed to have, to the best of my knowledge. Many of the larger cruisers and tourers have three headlights in front, and they're damn bright. The total brightness of these ones would not exceed many cars' high beams, so I doubt they could make a fuss about that. And they are easily turned off since switching to low beam kills the secondary lights as well as the primary ones. The only possible problem with them could be dodgy wiring or attachment, but I am happy for my handiwork to be checked.

I got my bike from Boyd as well, so it's good to hear that, even if they think it's illegal, they probably won't fail me.

As for dazzling other drivers, I have deliberately angled the secondary lights downward and inward slightly. This gives me a better view of the road where the low-beam would usually be shining (the high-beam shines further ahead and leaves a nasty dark patch in front of my wheel), and it ensures that they aren't directed toward the windshield of a car. They are still real bright to look at; you won't miss them—but they're unlikely to dazzle you, even at night. I very, very seldom have anyone flash their lights at me, night or day. I think a lot of people just figure that since everything on a bike is more powerful than on a car, the headlights must be too!

The short of the long, though, is that I'd rather dazzle someone and have them see me, than not dazzle them and be hit by a car.

Krusti
16th May 2007, 14:01
Such as what pushbike shops? I dunno which ones are good (: I'm trying to find somewhere in Hamilton that stocks self-adhesive reflective tape and I'm having the devil of a job. Repco sells four miserable colors, NZ Safety sells nothing self-adhesive, and Supercheap Autos sells white tape in 0.6 m lengths. Lame. Bring on the pushbike shops for some white and black by the metre...

You could allways try TWL (Transport Wholesale Ltd) Specialise in truck related stuff. All sorts of shiny stuff on back of trucks!

My two cents....

Templar
16th May 2007, 14:04
I do too, so last week I went to the safety shop and got some reflective strips and sewed big red chevrons onto my Ventura pack. Bright!


Why did you use Chevrons out of interest? I think someone not paying attention is going to look up and see that and turn right. Looks like a detour type sign.:pinch:

I like what you've done with your lights Bnon. :woohoo:

TerminalAddict
16th May 2007, 14:06
Bnonn:
Maximum number of high beam head lights on a motorcycle is 2
max on a car is 4

it's in the WOF book .. I looked it up with Linden one day while mooching about at boyds

avgas
16th May 2007, 14:11
Repsol leathers do it for me, people will run for miles in fear of infection

Grahameeboy
16th May 2007, 14:21
Rermember folks that car drivers do not see cars.

I drive a People Carrier and I would say that I get just as many other road users 'not seeing' me as I do on a bike.

I think that making yourself more visible cannot be a bad thing, however, in my experience, you will only be visible if the other road user actually looks in the first place or if you are lucky the second place.

Too many road users over here either do not look or they vaguely turn their head or worse still just do not care and expect the other road user to avoid them.

The only difference is if we get hit on a bike, we come off worse.

I ride with both headlights on high beam. My Bike is red. I am 6ft tall (no this is not a lonley hearts ad!!). Around town I wear a red jacket with a graphic coloured helmet and ride close to the centre line marking so should not be easy to miss but I am still missed.

So like I said, it is because the other road user:

- Does not look at all (so no difference whether you are a christmas tree)
- Look and don't care or are going to fast upto an intersection, look and cannot stop and do not care.

It is our visible minds that keep us out of trouble

Bnonn
16th May 2007, 14:34
Bnonn:
Maximum number of high beam head lights on a motorcycle is 2
max on a car is 4

it's in the WOF book .. I looked it up with Linden one day while mooching about at boyds
Lame. I guess I'll just have to disconnect one of them before the WOF then O.o



Too many road users over here either do not look or they vaguely turn their head or worse still just do not care and expect the other road user to avoid them.

Man, you ain't wrong there. I am amazed how often someone will see me coming, look right at me, KNOW they don't have enough time to make it in front of me and up to speed, and pull out anyway. I have taken to riding up beside them and banging on their windows with my carbon-fiber knuckles now and yelling at them asking what the hell is wrong with them, are they blind or malicious or both. Given the image bikers have (rightly or wrongly) as being violent gang types, it probably will only take one such encounter before the pillock driver will think twice about pulling out directly in front of a bike doing 60 with a pillion on the back. Twats. Utter twats.

Disco Dan
16th May 2007, 14:40
these lights are only $25 a pop at Supercheap Autos, I decided to give it a go myself.


That looks fantastic!

Would love to get me some of those! Do you know if they stock them nationwide.. ie in aucks?

They look like 12v halogen bulbs like the ones used in shop windows and kitchens. If so, they are very bright! (I use three of them to grow underwater plants)

TerminalAddict
16th May 2007, 14:41
they are everywhere .. and they are those bulbs ;)

Bnonn
16th May 2007, 14:42
Thanks (: Yeah, they are; 12 V, 50 W halogen with glass lenses. I am sure they must be available elsewhere in New Zealand, given that Hamilton is hardly the place to be when it comes to buying accessories. If there is a Supercheap in Auckers, I'd be surprised if they didn't stock these lights. Even if they don't, I'm sure they'd be able to order them in.

bert_is_evil
16th May 2007, 14:47
I also, to go with a loud pipe, have a Halo (naturally induced of course.....) on my commuting helmet, which is a neoprene strip that sits round the base of the helmet and is covered in that Scotchlite stuff

<img src=http://www.mfiap.com/halo/hhbm75.jpg>

I can't find any of these on Tradme at the moment - anyone spotted them anywhere else?

Edit - in NZ that is, I've found websites offshore that sell them

Grahameeboy
16th May 2007, 15:06
Lame. I guess I'll just have to disconnect one of them before the WOF then O.o


Man, you ain't wrong there. I am amazed how often someone will see me coming, look right at me, KNOW they don't have enough time to make it in front of me and up to speed, and pull out anyway. I have taken to riding up beside them and banging on their windows with my carbon-fiber knuckles now and yelling at them asking what the hell is wrong with them, are they blind or malicious or both. Given the image bikers have (rightly or wrongly) as being violent gang types, it probably will only take one such encounter before the pillock driver will think twice about pulling out directly in front of a bike doing 60 with a pillion on the back. Twats. Utter twats.

It is because this is the way they are educated......I mean the 3 sec rule for indicating is just crap and makes drivers think they just have to indicate for 3 secs and that is it.........

Yep I get the same thing....car driver looks at me, often seems like ages, there is no one behind me and they pull out...have to say that male drivers are the worst.

You toot your horn, they look in their mirror. No apologetic hand.

The other day a guy in a 4x4 went to pull in my lane but say me just in time and pulled back. When we got to the lights he wound down his window and apologised and said he did not see me, it was his mistake.....well he was not a Kiwi driver, he was an Aussie....we had a laugh and said no way a Kiwi would have done that....sadly true.

Bnonn
16th May 2007, 15:19
Heh, that is unusual; especially for someone in a 4x4!


You toot your horn, they look in their mirror. No apologetic hand.
Yeah, but I feel that my horn doesn't have the sort of impact I'd like. This (http://www.bikerhiway.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=29&products_id=74) will be my next mod if I can find something similar in New Zealand.

Grahameeboy
16th May 2007, 15:20
Heh, that is unusual; especially for someone in a 4x4!


Yeah, but I feel that my horn doesn't have the sort of impact I'd like. This (http://www.bikerhiway.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=29&products_id=74) will be my next mod if I can find something similar in New Zealand.

Yeah but he was an Aussie.................

Disco Dan
16th May 2007, 15:49
Heh, that is unusual; especially for someone in a 4x4!


Yeah, but I feel that my horn doesn't have the sort of impact I'd like. This (http://www.bikerhiway.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=29&products_id=74) will be my next mod if I can find something similar in New Zealand.

Do a search.. there is someone on here selling them.

bert_is_evil
16th May 2007, 15:50
Perhaps this would work

Bnonn
16th May 2007, 16:00
Sweet, thanks Disco Dan.

TerminalAddict
16th May 2007, 16:11
Heh, that is unusual; especially for someone in a 4x4!


Yeah, but I feel that my horn doesn't have the sort of impact I'd like. This (http://www.bikerhiway.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=29&products_id=74) will be my next mod if I can find something similar in New Zealand.

WarlockNZ sells them (or imports them in bulk)

serach for "who wants a stebel" thread ;)

Disco Dan
17th May 2007, 14:26
Sweet, thanks Disco Dan.

...dam auckland. $30. flipping rip off. Should have ridden to hamilton just out of principle! On a faired bike, installation will be slighty tricky...

Steam
20th May 2007, 21:17
Here's another interesting bit from the Ministry of Transport rules (http://www.landtransport.govt.nz/rules/vehicle-lighting-2004.html)

10.8 Illuminated vehicle-mounted signs
An illuminated sign must not be fitted so as to dazzle, confuse, or distract other road users when operated, and must not display a variable or moving message.

It doesn't mention what classes of vehicle this rule applies to, so presumably it applies to all vehicles. Does this mean we can have an illuminated sign then saying whatever? Cool!

Steam
20th May 2007, 21:32
I haven't been warranted yet, but I actually can't see how they could enforce this as being illegal.

I see you are allowed two "Fog Lamps" on the front, but they are only allowed to be used: "in conditions of severely reduced visibility, including fog or snow but not including clear atmospheric conditions under the hours of darkness."
So you'll be sweet if you call them Fog Lamps when it comes to warrant time. (as long as they have a separate switch)
But you can't use them at night.
In the daytime you can call them "daytime running lamps".

This info is from here. Ixion have me this link. http://www.landtransport.govt.nz/rules/vehicle-lighting-2004.html

Bnonn
21st May 2007, 08:12
Thanks Steam. I don't have a separate switch wired up, unfortunately. I'll have to figure something out. It would be handy to have a separate switch, realistically, but it would be a lot more of a hassle to wire up than the current splicing with the high beam that I've done. That took long enough as it was...

Steam
24th May 2007, 11:02
So... can I wear a strobe? As long as it's not connected to the bike, it's a part of my clothing or backpack. Legal beagles, what say you?

bert_is_evil
24th May 2007, 11:04
There must be some law against impersonating a disco

moT
30th May 2007, 20:54
in situations like this its just important to be visable as audable so take off ur can

HungusMaximist
31st May 2007, 19:46
I seriously think we need some more motorbike gimmicky stuff in NZ.

If there's any suggestions please post them here.

I've seen a few stuff here and there but it's all too limited and specialised. You too often have to research long and hard for them.

And I am real keen on those reflective strips one of you guys mentioned, preferably that I can purchase at an economical price.

Cheers.

magicfairy
1st June 2007, 06:58
I can't find any of these on Tradme at the moment - anyone spotted them anywhere else?

Edit - in NZ that is, I've found websites offshore that sell them

I bought a couple last year (Helmet Halo) from an overseas web site as no one stocked them here but they lose their elasticity if you stretch them a bit much, or take if off, put it on a few times. Then you find yourself riding down the road with a wierd necklace. I don't think I'd bother again. But worked really well for visibility. I have opted for putting reflective tape on my backpack and a little bit on the back of my helmet instead.

Bnonn
1st June 2007, 10:01
An update on the spotlamps/secondary headlights I installed: they are cheap for a reason. One of them has blown already, and they both had condensation on the interior of the lens within a day or so. I'll be looking for some more hardy alternatives; preferably ones which aren't quite as bright, since my issue isn't so much with not being able to see, as not being seen by cagers—and since WOF regulations specify only two high-beam headlamps, I'd like to try to stick to the standards. Not that I agree with them, but it will make getting a WOF easier (; At the moment, I'm thinking that a superbright LED cluster on each side of the headlight would be pretty spiffy, since they use very little voltage (and once I have my air horn and radar detector and heated grips and whatnot I fear my battery may not survive), and are very visible.


And I am real keen on those reflective strips one of you guys mentioned, preferably that I can purchase at an economical price.
I have had utterly no luck tracking these down in Hamilton. I can get some short, red or white self-adhesive reflective tape strips, but that's it. No black (which is what I want for understandable reasons), and nothing longer than about 50 cm, which means I can't buy in bulk off a roll, but have to purchase separate lengths at far higher cost. It seems ridiculous that you can't find this stuff. I've been to hardware stores, cycle shops, car shops, motorcycle shops, safety shops—everyone just shrugs their shoulders and says, "yeah...dunno eh..."

If anyone can help with finding some good bulk suppliers of various colors of reflective tape I'd be very grateful.

xgnr
5th June 2007, 21:44
Thanks (: Yeah, they are; 12 V, 50 W halogen with glass lenses. I am sure they must be available elsewhere in New Zealand, given that Hamilton is hardly the place to be when it comes to buying accessories. If there is a Supercheap in Auckers, I'd be surprised if they didn't stock these lights. Even if they don't, I'm sure they'd be able to order them in.

I tracked these down and splashed out on a pair BUT after some study I worked out that you cant have more than two dipped or two high beam lamps.

Wonder if I can have one installed under the existing Main/Dip lamp (see my dodgy diagram). Issue is, can you have the running light on at the same time as the dipped beam which is what you would have running during the day? I have read the rules a few times and it sez you cannot have more than two dipped lamps.

http://www.landtransport.govt.nz/certifiers/virm-in-service/motorcycles-04-v3.pdf

Any one know if I will pass a warrant or do I have to wire into the Main only (which defeats the purpose of LOTS of light during the daytime).??? Any help gratefully received

Bnonn
6th June 2007, 08:26
I don't know; it's all too damned confusing. If you're looking for high visibility during the day, I'd seriously consider avoiding lamps altogether so as to mitigate the WOF issues, and just get high-intensity LED clusters. They're neither a dipped light nor a high-beam, since they aren't designed to cast a beam in the first place; they're just meant to be effing bright so that cars won't miss you (or will, as the case may be). Something like this maybe: http://www.dse.co.nz/cgi-bin/dse.storefront/4665c6d60067dc682740c0a87f330730/Product/View/P8634

At the moment, I have just left the one secondary light which has died, so I'm running only the remaining one plus my high-beams. But I'll get it fixed soon.

xgnr
7th June 2007, 20:42
Cool thanks for that. Was a bit of an impulse buy but nice and bright (also cheap).

Just for interests sake I upgraded the headlight from a 60/55w H4 to a 100/60 as I have a glass lens. Melts possums at 50 m lol.

Will check out the leds as an option and also leave the 55w Halogen to run when hi beam is on. One thing you can say about the Beemer is that they have plenty of electrical grunt.

cAn observation; After riding a push bike for many years as well I sometimes wonder if being "bright" means being just a better target...

Cheers