ADV sidecar build

[pete-blen]

Had this idea..build a light small side car for the XR250
for long back country rides.. just a alloy box 1100x400x400.
to carry camping gear ,fuel etc...
The bike will still be able to lean.. I still wanted to be able to
use the bike with out the car so its only 3 bolts to remove..
two 3/4 at the main pivot points & 1 on the slideing limiting strut.
Its all just set up to check the wheel base .. the car wheel
has to be 15% of the bikes wheel base foward of the rear axle..
As the bike leans the car also steers... The car mounting frame
on the bike has the front mount point 80mm higher than the rear
so as the bike leans the front mount arcs across fearther than the rear
mount..pulling or pushing the front of the car..changeing the track
angle to the bike...
Its all good..so now start cutting welding..

swing arm from a 91 CR250
wheel from a Suzuki FXR? 150 rear
tyre CST 110/90 x 17

[Padmei]

wait - you building this or it's someone elses?
I've always liked the idea of a Dakar type sidechair.
Looking good.

aussies are hard into sidechairs & camping boxes.

[pete-blen]

wait - you building this or it's someone elses?
I've always liked the idea of a Dakar type sidechair.
Looking good.

aussies are hard into sidechairs & camping boxes.


LOL..nar sport... me dam dogs building it to carry his kennel around..

[Underground]

246116

Awesome Pete, have you thought about this sort of idea?
Or maybe you're looking for something thats going to more sortof help keep you upright.

[pete-blen]

246116

Awesome Pete, have you thought about this sort of idea?
Or maybe you're looking for something thats going to more sortof help keep you upright.

yes I did look at a trailer stye...But I think they would be a
real bastard to get though rivers with large rocks and or
strong side water flow...... With a side car I can carry a
cable puller to winch it out/though...
Plus I need at least 1100mm long to fit a gun in for
over night hunting trips..
I think i'm pushing the limits with a 250cc bike..
but I intend to get a BMW F650, so I can adapt it to fit
or rebuilt it ...

Heres the sliding limiting strut... I'm wondering if I should
put a couple of light springs in it so it becomes self centreing...?

[thepom]

I think landrover beat you to it....:eek5:

[NordieBoy]

Wouldn't mine one of them for the DR.

I've probably got everything I need apart from skill...


It'd probably need more than zip ties and hot glue to keep it together...

[Willdat?]

Wouldn't mine one of them for the DR.

I've probably got everything I need apart from skill...


It'd probably need more than zip ties and hot glue to keep it together...

There's always those really big zip ties...

[Motu]

Have you ridden a sidecar with floating top mounts? It's far from the best of both worlds.

[pete-blen]

Have you ridden a sidecar with floating top mounts? It's far from the best of both worlds.

No havn't.... so I dear say I will fined out in time..
better drill a hole in the strut for a locking bolt ..

[Skinny_Birdman]

I think landrover beat you to it....:eek5:
Although not being manufactured in Blighty it won't leave oil marks all over his garage floor....

[cooneyr]

Interesting. I'd like to have a sidecar for the missus and sprog but dreams are free. Found pics of a KTM950 adventure (use to have one) with a side car but a shame to taint such a nice bike.

There were threads over on ADV rider about putting a sidecars on XT600's and Tenere's that were interesting.

I reckon a current model Triumph Scrambler with a side car would go nice.

Cheers R

[pete-blen]

The basic frame tack welded togeather...
steel is 25x25x3 RHS.. Once everythings
on and tacked up.. The frame will be Tig welded.
frames 900x400 with 350mm ground clearance..
Bike / car has 900mm track... after setting the car
square to the bike, final tracking of the car wheel
can be done with the swing arm chain adjuster slots..

[pete-blen]

A bit more progress...

[gav24]

Soooo curious to see how this goes....Keep us all posted:corn:
Especially with the pivoting setup of the chair.:blink:
Looks like fun anyway, building and riding the thing.
As my mate always says "Bloody Kiwi's!":facepalm:

[awa355]

Wir Winterfahrer, Sidecar - Gespann You may have seen this clip, if not, Look this up on you tube. Quite a few adventure bikes fitted with side cars. In snow fitted with snow chains.

[pete-blen]

Getting closer...
frame hacked togeather with the black
weld camo on it...stainless bumper for that bit of bling..:facepalm:

[NordieBoy]

You're an artist.

[RobGassit]

You making a bloody nice job of this project buddy. Bet you havin a real hoot building it. I saw these chairs at Phillip Island a few years back. The guys had ridden for days over any dirt they could find on the way. They swear by the modified front ends, ugly as they are.248033248034248035248036248037248038

[pete-blen]

You making a bloody nice job of this project buddy. Bet you havin a real hoot building it. I saw these chairs at Phillip Island a few years back. The guys had ridden for days over any dirt they could find on the way. They swear by the modified front ends, ugly as they are.248033248034248035248036248037248038

yes the leading link is the way to go... It reduces head shake while
still being able to have a narrow scrub channel on the side car wheel..
with the standard trail in the steering angle on the bike you can set up
for either..no head shake or narrow scrub channel..but not both..
I have set up for 50% of the zero values for each..
The car wheel/axle should be around 15 to 20% of the bikes wheel base
foward of the bikes rear wheel..
but mine has a few unknowns.. as the bike can still lean & as it dose the sidecar
turns in the direction the bike is turning.. this is acheived but putting
the front car mount higher than the rear so as the bike leans the front mount point
has a longer arc radius than the rear..so lean to the left and the front of the car
is pushed fearther out than the rear..on right lean its pulled closer to the bike than the rear.. Angles the car wheel in the direction you are turning..

wonder if its going to work???

[Underground]

If it doesnt work at least it'll have a bit of character.
I'm getting a bit interested in this 'adding a wheel' thing ,looks like a way to extend adventure riding well into old age.
This Dommie outfit is for sale in Uk ,looks a bit wide and bulky for propper adv riding tho.
248091

[RobGassit]

yes the leading link is the way to go... It reduces head shake while
still being able to have a narrow scrub channel on the side car wheel..
with the standard trail in the steering angle on the bike you can set up
for either..no head shake or narrow scrub channel..but not both..
I have set up for 50% of the zero values for each..
The car wheel/axle should be around 15 to 20% of the bikes wheel base
foward of the bikes rear wheel..
but mine has a few unknowns.. as the bike can still lean & as it dose the sidecar
turns in the direction the bike is turning.. this is acheived but putting
the front car mount higher than the rear so as the bike leans the front mount point
has a longer arc radius than the rear..so lean to the left and the front of the car
is pushed fearther out than the rear..on right lean its pulled closer to the bike than the rear.. Angles the car wheel in the direction you are turning..

wonder if its going to work???

Hopefully you will find out if it works without ending up in a ditch. Sounds like you have done all the research. I do remember the Aussie guys saying they use steampipe for the front end because it doesn't crack. Guess you already have that planned but I do remember he went through a learning curve with fractures to the fork setup. I'll be watching your progress with interest. I would love to put a chair on my Husky 610 to carry my other Huskies to the track. Impractical as hell but I thought it had huge cred riding into the pits with your racebike on a chair.

[pete-blen]

If it doesnt work at least it'll have a bit of character.
I'm getting a bit interested in this 'adding a wheel' thing ,looks like a way to extend adventure riding well into old age.
This Dommie outfit is for sale in Uk ,looks a bit wide and bulky for propper adv riding tho.
248091

The track on mines 900mm wide..
almost 400mm ground clearance under the car frame..
about 350mm when on the bike...

I do fined this concept very intresting...:yes:
prob to interesting for my own good..:facepalm:
Those Honda 900 Hornets are very cheap:shit:

[Eddieb]

If it doesnt work at least it'll have a bit of character.
I'm getting a bit interested in this 'adding a wheel' thing ,looks like a way to extend adventure riding well into old age.
This Dommie outfit is for sale in Uk ,looks a bit wide and bulky for propper adv riding tho.
248091

+1

A flat tray to bolt up to the old DR woulds be interesting to try.

I was looking at a 192something Henderson on Wednesday night that had a side tray on it, it was pretty cool. I'll post my crappy cell phone pic if I can get it off the phone.

[pete-blen]

I would love to put a chair on my Husky 610 to carry my other Huskies to the track. Impractical as hell but I thought it had huge cred riding into the pits with your racebike on a chair.

Maybe not........................................

[Eddieb]

I would love to put a chair on my Husky 610 to carry my other Huskies to the track. Impractical as hell but I thought it had huge cred riding into the pits with your racebike on a chair.

I've seen a pic here on KB of a NZ chick that used to turn up at roadrace track meets with her racebike on a chair.

[almoto]

The track on mines 900mm wide..
almost 400mm ground clearance under the car frame..
about 350mm when on the bike...

I do fined this concept very intresting...:yes:
prob to interesting for my own good..:facepalm:
Those Honda 900 Hornets are very cheap:shit:

Those 15'' wheels are the only way to go if one never takes the chair off for solo riding (not many do for obvious reasons) because now one can slide the baby through both left and right hand corners. With 15'' wheels one is faster through corners than solo bikes, offroad and onroad.

[Underground]

about 100 years ago I came south on a big adventure on an old TS250 and it siezed near Blenheim. I phoned the bike shop and some dude turned up with an outfit to pick me and the bike up, I thought that was pretty cool (not the seizing bit though)
The other thought I had about adv riding an outfit is that you can carry more people to help push :D

[Box'a'bits]

Kane from R Twin Works has used a BMW outfit to take his BMW Racer to track meets....:yes: Fairly cool

[RobGassit]

Kane from R Twin Works has used a BMW outfit to take his BMW Racer to track meets....:yes: Fairly cool

Saw that rig at Manfield I think. Uber cool.

[pete-blen]

Well its all but ready...
A few bolts/nuts and final set up...
A days work...
Had a hickcup with the bin...
Was intending to weld it..but for
some dam reason my tig has lost its
Hi fequancey pulse... so had to fold
some new ends up with lips for pop rivits..
now not enough alloy for the lid...:angry:
Better give a mudguard some thought to...

So next week end I hope first ride/crash
what ever comes first...

SO if anyones got any ideas what maybe
wrong with my tig.... don't be shy with the info...

[DR650gary]

You are the original "mad scientist" :yes:

Good luck with the test ride.

Sorry, mate who knows all about welders is away on a holiday.

[NordieBoy]

SO if anyones got any ideas what maybe
wrong with my tig.... don't be shy with the info...




Overwork ?

[gav24]

Hi, she looks good!
By the way, what tyre is that on the chair?
Maybe I've understood the whole thread wrong but is the plan that when you lean to the right the chair drops and keeps the "extra" wheel in contact with the ground? With that box on I can see an obvious problem when you lean to the left....:facepalm:
Probably got this whole thread wrong - please enlighten me!

[pete-blen]

Hi, she looks good!
By the way, what tyre is that on the chair?
Maybe I've understood the whole thread wrong but is the plan that when you lean to the right the chair drops and keeps the "extra" wheel in contact with the ground? With that box on I can see an obvious problem when you lean to the left....:facepalm:
Probably got this whole thread wrong - please enlighten me!

Yes you are sort of right...
theres only 15* lean to left
The prob in gaining more was the
rear pivot.. i would have had to put
the pivot lower to give more angle
passed the chain & side stand...
And that would decreassed the
ground clearance at the rear mount arm...
now a right side car , there would have been
no probs at all...

in that pic... the car is not been leveled yet, Its
high at the wheel side so that makes the lean
angle look less than it is...

I wanted a narrow track and high off the ground so
a few limiting factors came into play...

http://www.csttires.com/Motorcycle/Moto-Street.aspx
The tyre is a CST 110/80/17

[NordieBoy]

That would have been useful up Patriarch. You could have carried the cooker for the coffee and all the food.

[pete-blen]

That would have been useful up Patriarch. You could have carried the cooker for the coffee and all the food.

but most importantly.... I wouldn't have been picking
up the bike so often...

[NordieBoy]

but most importantly.... I wouldn't have been picking
up the bike so often...

More important than hot coffee?

:facepalm:

[pete-blen]

A few good ADV sidecar vids....
The KLR seems to go pretty good
with a car..

http://vimeo.com/702226

[Underground]

now a right side car , there would have been
no probs at all...

This left v right thing, is there some kind of rule or regulation?
Or is it like earrings, if you fuck up and put it on the wrong side you're gay :shit:

[NordieBoy]

This left v right thing, is there some kind of rule or regulation?
Or is it like earrings, if you fuck up and put it on the wrong side you're gay :shit:

Then you have to quickly build a 2nd car for the other side and pretend that was your idea all along.

[pete-blen]

now a right side car , there would have been
no probs at all...

This left v right thing, is there some kind of rule or regulation?
Or is it like earrings, if you fuck up and put it on the wrong side you're gay :shit:

No..You can put it on either side...
but imagine trying to see around a large vehicle
in front of you... You would have to stick a right side car out in
to the on comeing traffics lane..and if theres a passanger
in the car...

PS..you seem to have quite a handle on this gay thing...

[pete-blen]

Then you have to quickly build a 2nd car for the other side and pretend that was your idea all along.

:facepalm:

[Underground]

No..You can put it on either side...
but imagine trying to see around a large vehicle
in front of you... You would have to stick a right side car out in
to the on comeing traffics lane..and if theres a passanger
in the car...

PS..you seem to have quite a handle on this gay thing...

Oh... I see how that works now come to think of it :facepalm:
I was just a bit confused seing the urals imported with the car on the right.
(dont think I'd like to be riding in one of those in traffic now you mention that )
and the gayness.... well I never got the earings so it must just be a Honda thing

[pete-blen]

Took it for its first ride... NOT GOOD
The scrub channel of the side car
wheel is to wide "way to wide"
scrub channel is the amount the bike
wants to push/pull the car wheel
across the road when turning...
so the side car wheel has to be
moved rearwards about 90mm..

I took it up the Taylor pass when it
got on to the gravel it got so much better
as the car wheel could move sideways so much
easyer on the lose gravel...

I think the easyest way to sort it is to
lengthen the swing arm..

well I leant 2 things 2day...I fucked up:facepalm:
and build more adjustabilty in..

[Crim]

I fucked up:facepalm:


Isn't that "the mother of all inventions" (or was that necessity)...... whatever I reckon you are on the right track


(or 2 or 3 :killingme)

[pete-blen]

Isn't that "the mother of all inventions" (or was that necessity)...... whatever I reckon you are on the right track


(or 2 or 3 :killingme)

Sorted I hope....
I now know how I fucked up....:facepalm:
Done the numbers for a reduced trail front
end that gives a longer wheel base.. But
when I desided to stay with the standard
front end... I didn't redo the numbers...:shit:

Heres the adjustable fuck up repair...
Of course it was alway part of the design...

[Monstaman]

Heres the adjustable fuck up repair...

...its not a fuckup till it CAN'T be fixed. ... its new and improved!!

[GSers]

You mean you are supposed to use numbers when you are working on a project
Thats mine screwed then
GSers

[R6_kid]

The guy I stay with in San Remo (just off of Phillip Island) is well known off-road side car endurance racer. This setup has won a number of 24hr endurance races, with a race distance of 750km it's a well proven rig!
248929248930248931

[cooneyr]

The guy I stay with in San Remo (just off of Phillip Island) is well known off-road side car endurance racer. This setup has won a number of 24hr endurance races, with a race distance of 750km it's a well proven rig!
248929248930248931

Looks like that thing has very little of the XR600 left appart from a tank and seat. Is that a complete custom frame? So many questions that I don't need to know the answer too and don't have time to ask.

One comment though - screw standing on the side of that for 750km!!! "Shuffle up a bit mate so I can sit on the back of the seat for a bit!"

Cheers R

[pete-blen]

Ok.. Its rideable this time:yes:..
its a learnt skill.... if yer stuff
up yer run out of road real fast..
there a few grass verges in the
Taylor Pass with un-planed
wheel tracks in them:gob:..

[Subike]

Been watching this build with interest,
Could you see this same set up being used on a road bike with success?
I see the end product so far as being appealing to the eye.
Some good kiw buiding skills there.

[pete-blen]

Been watching this build with interest,
Could you see this same set up being used on a road bike with success?
I see the end product so far as being appealing to the eye.
Some good kiw buiding skills there.

For sure....
the leaning is great.. l you don't no the cars there till
yer run out of lean.. mine only has 15* either way..
For some reason right turns are a prob.. not sure if its
me or the set up.. once the lean limiter reachs the end
then yer have to lean off the bike & turn the bars...
35 years of pre progamming that yer keep the bars stright
when turning is a hard habbit to brake... I did notice that on
gravel you can also make slight corrections with the thottle..
I would say give the bike a lot more lean than I have..And
keep the side car wheel lead to NO more than 15% of the
bikes wheel base... The other point is to reduce the trail
in the front end to lighten the steering... but mines not
heavy... maybe being a light g bike to start with helped ?..

to reduce the trail.. yer move the front wheel foward till
the axle is above the point where the rake angle would
intersect with the ground..

[almoto]

good job done
sidecars have potential for all sorts of uses

<a href="http://s1140.photobucket.com/albums/n571/motoxbike/?action=view&amp;current=SIDECAR-1.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i1140.photobucket.com/albums/n571/motoxbike/SIDECAR-1.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

[almoto]

...you can put something to eat in them...or a mate...or something


<a href="http://s1140.photobucket.com/albums/n571/motoxbike/?action=view&amp;current=SIDECAR3.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i1140.photobucket.com/albums/n571/motoxbike/SIDECAR3.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

[pete-blen]

At last it works:cool:
On the road yer hardly know the car is there..
Only time it makes its self known is tight corners
to fast as yer run out of lean then it requires you to
shift weigh to the inside... normal riding its just lean as normal..
It can travel at 80/90kph quite saftely..On tighter sealed roads
you just have to be aware of its limits....
Gravel roads are where the fun is.... No worrys about the bike
slideing out from under yer... Don't need to pick clear lines of gravel..
It needs more power, the few times I have got it to slide:niceone::niceone:
On rougher tracks , The car is quite happy to go up/down over bumps
& holes with NO movement of the bike...
Even the brakeing it still straight , no pull to the left...

I think..:rolleyes:.. I,m really going to have to get a bigger bike 600/650
and build a Darka style unit...

[NordieBoy]

Before long you'll be looking for a 2nd hand v-rod engine :D

[NordieBoy]

A front mudguard on backwards? You philistine!
That's almost as bad as using a KTM rear guard as a headlight surround on a CB400!

How tough is that rear mount? It' going to cop a hammering over the triples.

Wonder how a DR650 would go with one of them hanging off the side?

[pete-blen]

A front mudguard on backwards? You philistine!
That's almost as bad as using a KTM rear guard as a headlight surround on a CB400!

How tough is that rear mount? It' going to cop a hammering over the triples.

Wonder how a DR650 would go with one of them hanging off the side?


guard mount ?... not bad but it could benifit from a brace...
Car mount ? ... The bar under the bike is 20mm solid stainless
with 3/4" cromoly rod ends....

It took a hideing up MT Pat...:mad:

Would be great on a 650.... Heres one in the making......
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=727128&highlight=DR650+hack


PS.... the mudguards one of those new fang-dangle bi-directional jobs...:eek5: