Ride safe. Bollox!

[NONONO]

Coming back from Napier after Christmas.
Aware of the reduced tolerance to 104kph from 110kph.
Thought I would take it easy on the Rocket, do a bit of thinking and watch the scenery.
No chance. Even at the limit, and a bit over, every car was soon positioned right on my rear wheel.
All trying to pass at the daftest points.
On the ride in from Napier hills kept thinking bout "riding to the conditions", however the conditions kept changing as every road patch had a different surface, mostly covered in gravel.
So, this 104 bollix is just that, Bollix.
Only thing that kept me going was Fatt Max and "Equal on the Road".

[Marmoot]

I reckon you, me and Katman are the only ones doing -5 to +4 off the limit.

The others are either -20 under or +10 over.

[Virago]

I reckon you, me and Katman are the only ones doing -5 to +4 off the limit.

The others are either -20 under or +10 over.

That's what makes the lowered tolerance absolute bollocks. It doesn't affect the real speedsters at all, it simply creates a new group of "law-breakers" - the generally law-abiding responsible citizens who may have let their speed drift by a small amount.

In this regard, the lowered tolerance is like the anti-smacking laws - doesn't make a blind bit of difference to the real issues, but makes it look like the authorities are doing something.

In the recent past, the police have claimed credit for a lower road toll, on the basis of the lower speed tolerance. Do you think perhaps they might accept responsibility for "causing" the current high holiday toll...?

[FJRider]

Coming back from Napier after Christmas.
Aware of the reduced tolerance to 104kph from 110kph.
Thought I would take it easy on the Rocket, do a bit of thinking and watch the scenery.
No chance. Even at the limit, and a bit over, every car was soon positioned right on my rear wheel.
All trying to pass at the daftest points.
On the ride in from Napier hills kept thinking bout "riding to the conditions", however the conditions kept changing as every road patch had a different surface, mostly covered in gravel.
So, this 104 bollix is just that, Bollix.
Only thing that kept me going was Fatt Max and "Equal on the Road".

If you stayed within the tolerance ... and survived ... it worked. Nuff said ...

[Harry the Barstard]

If you stayed within the tolerance ... and survived ... it worked. Nuff said ...

Bollocks......Nuff said.

Although, I am glad that hey are targeting people who drive crazy slow more these days. I have no problem if people want to cruise and soak it all in, Just pull over when thee are 15 cars or bikes behind you. Courtesy is an endangered trait.

[Harry the Barstard]

That's what makes the lowered tolerance absolute bollocks. It doesn't affect the real speedsters at all, it simply creates a new group of "law-breakers" - the generally law-abiding responsible citizens who may have let their speed drift by a small amount.

In this regard, the lowered tolerance is like the anti-smacking laws - doesn't make a blind bit of difference to the real issues, but makes it look like the authorities are doing something.

In the recent past, the police have claimed credit for a lower road toll, on the basis of the lower speed tolerance. Do you think perhaps they might accept responsibility for "causing" the current high holiday toll...?

I second this man!!

[BigAl]

That's what makes the lowered tolerance absolute bollocks. It doesn't affect the real speedsters at all, it simply creates a new group of "law-breakers" - the generally law-abiding responsible citizens who may have let their speed drift by a small amount.

In this regard, the lowered tolerance is like the anti-smacking laws - doesn't make a blind bit of difference to the real issues, but makes it look like the authorities are doing something.

In the recent past, the police have claimed credit for a lower road toll, on the basis of the lower speed tolerance. Do you think perhaps they might accept responsibility for "causing" the current high holiday toll...?

+1..........

[FJRider]

Last year the speed limit on the open road was 100 Km's/hr.

This year it's 100 Km's/hr.

This week it's 100 Km's/hr.

NOTHING HAS CHANGED ...

It is up to the discretion of the officer that catches YOU exceeding the speed limit ...

What is written on the ticket that he/she may issue you .... will depend a lot (but NOT always) on the "infamous" attitude test ...

Those that did issue tickets for 104 km's and over ... will continue to do so ... if they choose to ...

But as far as the LAW goes ... NOTHING has changed.

[p.dath]

If you stayed within the tolerance ... and survived ... it worked. Nuff said ...

Does that mean if you didn't stay within the tolerance ... and survived ... that it didn't work? :lol:

[FJRider]

Does that mean if you didn't stay within the tolerance ... and survived ... that it didn't work? :lol:

The "hidden flaw" in the entire policy ... is there are not enough officers on duty ... in all areas ...

The mental anguish of those lawbreakers will be enough , that they wont consider doing it again ...

[Harry the Barstard]

I dont think anyone is debating that the law has changed. We all recognise that during the holiday seasons the poe reduce the "tollerance" for speeds above 100Kph.

I think the key aspect that is being debated is who and how this lower tollerance is effecting day to day drivers. I think the anti smacking comment was spot on. People who generally abide by the rules are going to the extreem of doing less than 20Kph below the speed limit through fair of being caught.

On the other hand the guys and girls that frequent 130 plus are still doing what they always did. All you have to do is go out on the roas to see this.

I'm not saying that speeding is going to reduce fatal accidents by anymeans........mainly due to me not being a complete idiot. But we need to be weary from saying "oh, look! This guy rode home within the limits and got home safe.....the new tollerance works!!!" Its like how the poe say that in 99% of car accidents, speed was a factor. I was a volly fireman for 4 years and a paid one for three years, in all that time i was never turned out to a motor vechile incident that involed two stationary vechiles!!! Of course speed was a bloody factor!

Just my 10c

[Jay GTI]

In the recent past, the police have claimed credit for a lower road toll, on the basis of the lower speed tolerance. Do you think perhaps they might accept responsibility for "causing" the current high holiday toll...?

Do you think they might also slip a nod of acknowledgement to the positive impacts on the road toll of ABS, air bags, side impact bars, traction control, stability control, impact zones and a whole raft of standard safety features that come with even your Mum's Suzuki Swift these days? Nah, it's all down to the anti-speeding campaigns...

[NONONO]

Does that mean if you didn't stay within the tolerance ... and survived ... that it didn't work? :lol:

Luverly logic, absolute gold.
Point is, lowering the "tolerance" has nothing to do with the risk.
Spurious logic.
Hoons still tailgaiting if I do 90 or 120. Road surfaces still piss poor and constantly changing due to piss poor repairs. Still off camber.
Hey, I know...hi vis vests, that will sort it.

[caspernz]

Luverly logic, absolute gold.
Point is, lowering the "tolerance" has nothing to do with the risk.
Spurious logic.
Hoons still tailgaiting if I do 90 or 120. Road surfaces still piss poor and constantly changing due to piss poor repairs. Still off camber.
Hey, I know...hi vis vests, that will sort it.

Speed is only the contributing factor once things go pearshaped. The tailgating thing is what gets me steamed the fastest. But modern bike gloves aren't hurt by cars' sideglass....:oi-grr:

The biggest contribution to road safety and lower road toll, apart from technology improvements, is the price of fuel. The higher the price, the fewer vehicles on the road and also fewer kilometres travelled, so naturally fewer accidents. Doesn't take all clowns off the road of course, as the road toll for the holidays to date kinda proves.

[Marmoot]

If you stayed within the tolerance ... and survived ... it worked. Nuff said ...

Post hoc ergo propter hoc (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post_hoc_ergo_propter_hoc)

[avgas]

Consider yourselves lucky.
Most of this holiday I have spent driving on 90 or 80kph speed limit roads.
10 years ago these were all 100.
I would be happy if I could do 104 on them again. Instead I get stuck at the brain numbing 80 or 90kph............I just about had and accident today simply by being bored and drifting SLOWLY off the road. Thank goodness that had than noisemaker strip painted.
If they drop it to 70........I will have to take the train and play card games so that I don't die on (errrr off) the roads.

[NONONO]

Another pisser was the law abiding car driving citizens sitting in the overtaking lane (when there was one) at the same speed as the slow lane. Well, 104 kph it was, so that's what they do, in both lanes.
As for the police, not a one spotted heading all the way north. Probably in the towns and citys eh, less hassle and therefore more revenue.
Day glo, I say, day glo.

[Viscount Montgomery]

my bikes been on hold for a fucking year, been riding the whole time, but it's just the occasional blast on backroads in weekends , maybe the odd blat once or twice during the week just before sunset, Dare these holier-than-thou arse-wipes begrudge me that. You take the risk on your own and pay if caught, so fuck off whiners. Don't give me that crap. I've paid motorbike regos without fail since 1976, but no more though you sons of fucken rip-off arseholes.

Always dicey dodging and sneaking the streets avoiding cops to get back home in town, fucking PITA, these cunts are turning bikers into criminals, 600 bucks plus 40 bucks warrant for 3 or 4000 K's per year be fucked.

I Wanna ride the fucking hiways with no hassles these holidays so one month rego will do it. Bastard motherfuckers. Hope the slimy bung-eyed fucker N.Smith dies a fucking horrible lingering painfull death very soon. Greasy cunt.

the snivelly 4Kph over crap, it's blind ignorant pig-head crap, and that smarmy female witch traffic cop you always see on TV weasel-wording the whole scurrying traffic control circus as the best thing since non-shatter windscreens, it's fucking dangerous taking eyes off road to stare at digits on a fucken speedo. Queer cunts. The roads are seething with THICK AS PIGSHIT cage drivers as it is without all this added shit

[ducatilover]

We did 400km today, saw two Police cars cruising. Didn't see too many idiots on the road, considering. Kept speed to 100-105 and all was happy, the BMW was good on gas and we still had fun when that tar seal stuff got snaky. :yes:

I still don't see the huge problem with 104km/h, it really doesn't make us any safer, nor does it extend the trip time by any noticeable amount.
The slower than slow drivers have always been there, the people with no brains/anger issues are still overtaking in silly places.
Nothing has really changed except a lower amount of traffic.

[bsasuper]

People die in motor vechicle's for many reasons, its like the old saying, guns dont kill people, people kill people.If the NZ government was serious about reducing the road toll, they would make getting a licence much more in depth.

[sinfull]

my bikes been on hold for a fucking year, been riding the whole time, but it's just the occasional blast on backroads in weekends , maybe the odd blat once or twice during the week just before sunset, Dare these holier-than-thou arse-wipes begrudge me that. You take the risk on your own and pay if caught, so fuck off whiners. Don't give me that crap. I've paid motorbike regos without fail since 1976, but no more though you sons of fucken rip-off arseholes.

Always dicey dodging and sneaking the streets avoiding cops to get back home in town, fucking PITA, these cunts are turning bikers into criminals, 600 bucks plus 40 bucks warrant for 3 or 4000 K's per year be fucked.

I Wanna ride the fucking hiways with no hassles these holidays so one month rego will do it. Bastard motherfuckers. Hope the slimy bung-eyed fucker N.Smith dies a fucking horrible lingering painfull death very soon. Greasy cunt.

the snivelly 4Kph over crap, it's blind ignorant pig-head crap, and that smarmy female witch traffic cop you always see on TV weasel-wording the whole scurrying traffic control circus as the best thing since non-shatter windscreens, it's fucking dangerous taking eyes off road to stare at digits on a fucken speedo. Queer cunts. The roads are seething with THICK AS PIGSHIT cage drivers as it is without all this added shit
There there !

[Woodman]

Drivers are driving slower.

I drive my car using the cruise control a lot, have it set at 105ish on the speedo and i hardly ever get passed, but I pass a hell of a lot of cars and usually without having to accelerate at all. maybe switch the cc off until a passing opportunity arises and then switch it on again to get passed, but I reckon most drivers are driving in the low 90s.

[Scuba_Steve]

but I reckon most drivers are driving in the low 90s.

Try low 80's

[jrandom]

It's really not that difficult to sit at 100kph. Why are you all in such a hurry?

[Marmoot]

It's not the 100/104 that I have a problem with.
It's how the logic and propaganda behind it go that irks me.

[Madness]

Too many drivers of late model four-wheeled vehicles are relying on accuracy of their speedometers, many of which are out by 10% at 100km/hr indicated. Hence the number of sheep out there doing 90km/hr on the open road. A speedo should be calibrated to read correct +/- 2% so we don't get such a variance in the speed of motorists sharing our roads.

Haven't seen many cops up SH16 last few days :whistle:

[MSTRS]

Does that mean if you didn't stay within the tolerance ... and survived ... that it didn't work? :lol:


The "hidden flaw" in the entire policy ... is there are not enough officers on duty ... in all areas ...


We did 400km today, saw two Police cars cruising. Didn't see too many idiots on the road, considering.

Thank goodness for hidden flaws? My speedo is a guide to what's legal - my actual speed is a guide as to what's sensible in any given circumstance...
Wangers and back = 492km. Saw ONE cop in all that time - GD at the BP in Dannevegas on the way home. And saw 3 prats - all on bikes - HD rider who obviously had no idea what lane markings (and the shoulder) were for, and 2 idiots passing a row of cars on an uphill lefthander with a blind crest.

[FJRider]

It's really not that difficult to sit at 100kph. Why are you all in such a hurry?

On most "good" motorcycling roads ... it's usually difficult not go under it on a point A to B trip.

On any ride, it's not the highest maximum speed that shows ability ... but the highest average speed.

[NONONO]

No probs with people taking care, not advocating speed. Just pointing out the farcical nature of this "Tolerance" bollix.
See, no matter how slow I'm moving the 4 wheel drives and the mobile discos full of hyped up teenagers still sit on my back wheel. The roads are still poorly maintained (had a massive hold up where the police had put in one lane due to the emergence of a huge pothole (not to mention the gravel on the Napier hills).
So how does this lowered tolerance make me safer?
If the road toll is lower, the revenue gathers take the credit. This gives them the mandate to do it again. If, as it's looking, the toll is up then it's simply that we did not listen, or the tolerance was still too high and they bring it in again with a lower tolerance.
Bollix.

[Harry the Barstard]

my bikes been on hold for a fucking year, been riding the whole time, but it's just the occasional blast on backroads in weekends , maybe the odd blat once or twice during the week just before sunset, Dare these holier-than-thou arse-wipes begrudge me that. You take the risk on your own and pay if caught, so fuck off whiners. Don't give me that crap. I've paid motorbike regos without fail since 1976, but no more though you sons of fucken rip-off arseholes.

Always dicey dodging and sneaking the streets avoiding cops to get back home in town, fucking PITA, these cunts are turning bikers into criminals, 600 bucks plus 40 bucks warrant for 3 or 4000 K's per year be fucked.

I Wanna ride the fucking hiways with no hassles these holidays so one month rego will do it. Bastard motherfuckers. Hope the slimy bung-eyed fucker N.Smith dies a fucking horrible lingering painfull death very soon. Greasy cunt.

the snivelly 4Kph over crap, it's blind ignorant pig-head crap, and that smarmy female witch traffic cop you always see on TV weasel-wording the whole scurrying traffic control circus as the best thing since non-shatter windscreens, it's fucking dangerous taking eyes off road to stare at digits on a fucken speedo. Queer cunts. The roads are seething with THICK AS PIGSHIT cage drivers as it is without all this added shit

Dont hold back man..........tell us how you really feel!!

[Ocean1]

And saw 3 prats - all on bikes - HD rider who obviously had no idea what lane markings (and the shoulder) were for, and 2 idiots passing a row of cars on an uphill lefthander with a blind crest.

All under 104k though, eh? Or they'd be dead, innit?

[slofox]

The "hidden flaw" in the entire policy ... is there are not enough officers on duty ... in all areas ...

Perzackerly! I rode 250km around the South Waikato yesterday (and stayed between 98 and 102 km/hr. Well...most of the time I did anyway :whistle:) Didn't see a single cop. Anywhere.

Had just one 4x4 come roaring up behind me just south of the Waipapa dam (road there is twisty and narrow). I just moved left, slowed down and waved him through. And waited for a bit for him to get out of my zone then resumed a pleasant relaxing ride.

[MSTRS]

All under 104k though, eh? Or they'd be dead, innit?

Well, of course. Which explains why they both spent soooo long on the wrong side of the line...

[Brian d marge]

amd are we heading towards a record road toll?? 7 at the moment ?

Something is clearly working ( tui)


Stephen

[Maha]

Slow speed fuckers (70-80kph) give me the fuck fuck.
Following some female in a small car just before the Mamaku's...60-70kph...I couldn't get passed due to the traffic and double yellows.
Na mind. passing lane 2 K's away sign said...
Waiting waiting..where the fuck is it?......ok its here, on the gas and out I go and pass, only to have a fucking cop car loom into view at that very moment...I check the mirrors, his break lights are on, he pulls to the left and does a U turn..
FUCK!!....fuck it, all that bloody time following that bitch and now its going to turn sour.
Arse!...I decide to find a spot and pull over, nice wide shoulder bit on the left up ahead...good as spot as any.
I indicate and wait...dont want all that flashing light bullshit.
Ok, here they come...arse bitch I just passed, another car that was behind and... the Cop...they all drive by!...:facepalm:
Well Fuck! now behind all of them and we are at least 25-30 mins out of Rotorua!
Slow speed fuckers.

[Stylo]

amd are we heading towards a record road toll?? 7 at the moment ?

Something is clearly working ( tui)


Stephen

And it looks like the 7 dead had nothing to do with speeding rather bad/ pissed driving. We drove back from Akaroa this morning and the worst drivers were the ones in the Pope-mobiles braking for 65kmh corners when they're only doing 70 to start with . Worst one was the stupid bitch who sped up to 70 on the 100 kmh straight and when we finally passed her she had the phone on her right ear and 2 kids climbing around the car ..and she was smoking.



For the record Utah has just put it's speed limit up to 80 mph and ...6 months later 0% increase in fatalities , go figure ....

[caspernz]

Yep, with you on the slow speed clowns....just as bad as the tailgating brigade...almost as bad as them clowns that only manage to do 104 in passing lanes huh? Only to resume 80 click cruising when back on the 2 lane....:weird:

[NONONO]

Yep, with you on the slow speed clowns....just as bad as the tailgating brigade...almost as bad as them clowns that only manage to do 104 in passing lanes huh? Only to resume 80 click cruising when back on the 2 lane....:weird:

Abso fukin lutely mate...what the fck is that all about?
Now that 104 KPH tolerance just means that people will not pass, it;s totaly fckd.
Maha, best not to slow down, just gives the fckers time to breed.

[misterO]

I predict that, in the not-too-distant future, speed on all vehicles will be governed by a GPS assisted limiter (installed at great cost and inconvenience to the ratepayer). When, at last, everyone is traveling at or under the speed limit- the number of people who tragically die on the open road will not diminish. I'd go so far as to wager that, in this brave-new-regulated-world, even more people will pay even less attention to the business of driving and death will tailgate us all. Mind you- I pulled this unscientific prediction right out of my bottom.

[Captain_Salty]

I could imagine not long after that, all vehicles being autopiloted all the time. If it was centrally controlled then speeds could probably be raised and instead of traffic lights you would be weaved through intersections "figure 8 racing style". :shit:

[Tink]

80km was a bit slow.... weaving and tailgating was not funny... but overall I think the road was fairly respectful the two days I was on it with Boman.... why is it on the autobahn there is no speed limit!!!

[avgas]

80km was a bit slow.... weaving and tailgating was not funny... but overall I think the road was fairly respectful the two days I was on it with Boman.... why is it on the autobahn there is no speed limit!!!

Its easier to call someone fat than to make them skinny. Likewise its easier to make stupid laws than actually train them on how to drive/ride.

[pritch]

I rode to Auckland Christmas Eve, saw a total of one Police car. Plus there was another I didn't see but which set the detector off.

On the way home I saw five HP cars on the road between Ngaruwahia and Otorohanga alone. There was another at TeKuiti..

The most dangerous driving I saw was the two cops that pulled u turns to chase hardened criminals doing maybe 106kph.

You'da thunk that the Police hierarchy might've mentioned to the troops that u turns on busy roads, or just around blind corners, were unacceptably risky?

[nosebleed]

.... why is it on the autobahn there is no speed limit!!!

Because Hitler had "wood" for cars, and German licencing requirements are tough.

(does that count as Godwins?)

[Brian d marge]

I predict that, in the not-too-distant future, speed on all vehicles will be governed by a GPS assisted limiter (installed at great cost and inconvenience to the ratepayer). When, at last, everyone is traveling at or under the speed limit- the number of people who tragically die on the open road will not diminish. I'd go so far as to wager that, in this brave-new-regulated-world, even more people will pay even less attention to the business of driving and death will tailgate us all. Mind you- I pulled this unscientific prediction right out of my bottom.

Remember its;

Community Identity and stability

Stephen

Ps as long as the eggs from the Lower IQs do not get Bokanovskified

[Berries]

If, as it's looking, the toll is up then it's simply that we did not listen, or the tolerance was still too high and they bring it in again with a lower tolerance.
As far I as understand it 104km/h is zero tolerance to take account of the +/- 3% tolerance in the speed measuring equipment. So with 104 you could be doing between 101 and 107km/h. If they started enforcing at 100km/h then they would be picking up people doing 99km/h unless the gear was 100% accurate. I might be wrong.

[Maha]

If the road toll is lower, the revenue gathers take the credit. Bollix.

It is Bollox...I would like to hear the explaination as to why the road in 1973 was three times as high as this years road?
They either take credit or lay blame :Police:
Credit where credits due...the road users are the reason for the road toll (high or low) not the police.
The Police do not make the decision for any given road user.
The road user makes a decision...wheather it be right or wrong at the time, that decision alone can be the deciding factor on the road toll.

[Yow Ling]

As far I as understand it 104km/h is zero tolerance to take account of the +/- 3% tolerance in the speed measuring equipment. So with 104 you could be doing between 101 and 107km/h. If they started enforcing at 100km/h then they would be picking up people doing 99km/h unless the gear was 100% accurate. I might be wrong.

Yea maybe. I think the allowance given is for the tiny chance your speedo overreads. Somehow I doubt that the speed measuring equipment is up to 6% out, things have moved along since the 1970's

maybe bring a speedo test in as part of the WOF/COF to calm the fears of the accidental speeders, or buy a GPS and get your speed off that.

[blue rider]

.... why is it on the autobahn there is no speed limit!!!

because you are to go fast without delay from A to Z 100km + what ever

one takes the Bundesbahn if they are afraid of the Autobahn up to 120 km or

the Land Strasse if one has a thing for scenery and sightseeing up to 100 km depending



autobahn, i so miss it.....brummmm brummmm

[NONONO]

Revenue gathering is what it's all about, blatant revenue gathering.
On my way back from Napier (boxing day, when we were assured the police would be out in force enforcing the 4KPH "tolerance") I saw no cops the whole way Napier -Auckland. I did see a few on the other side but nothing heading north...and I was looking, as the Roadster is a mite hard to keep to 100KPH at the best of times (and I'm VERY aware that Triumph have not got the best digi read outs, either for fuel or speed).
On the way to work this morning, from central to Lambie Drive....5 police vehicles, 1 bike and 4 cars. The bike had someone pulled over and all 4 cars sitting with speed guns blazing.
Now cmon, yep it's the rider/driver who makes the decision, but on an almost empty motorway, at 7.30, how many probs is a guy doing 105 KPH causing?
Not blaming the police, they are after all just street level bureaucrats, but lets call this what it is..REVENUE GATHERING.
Has nothing to do with reducing the road toll. Just more Bollix.

[davebullet]

Head on crash = you're fucked. Doesn't matter what the speed limit tolerance is on the day.

I can count at least 3 of the fatality involving accidents to be head on crashes so far this holiday period.

It's been many years since I've seen an ad campaign targetting safe overtaking.

[Brian d marge]

It is Bollox...I would like to hear the explaination as to why the road in 1973 was three times as high as this years road?
They either take credit or lay blame :Police:
Credit where credits due...the road users are the reason for the road toll (high or low) not the police.
The Police do not make the decision for any given road user.
The road user makes a decision...wheather it be right or wrong at the time, that decision alone can be the deciding factor on the road toll.
as for the road toll, the design of cars and the design and wearing of seat belts were a major factor in the reduction of the toll

Stephen

[shrub]

That tolerance is the main reason I am staying off the road during the holiday season. I can ride whenever I want and i don't have to be anywhere, so I'm mostly staying home and drinking beer.

The tolerance has no impact on speed related crashes - a car is no more likely to crash at 105 kmh than 100 kmh or 111 kmh. The speed related crashes happen when people are going a shitload over the speed limit, not a smidgen over. If it really made such a difference and they were serious about saving lives, why have they not cut the speed limit to 90kmh, or even 80kmh? Better still, 4mph and have a man walking in front with a red flag.

[Top Cat]

Slow speed fuckers (70-80kph) give me the fuck fuck.
Following some female in a small car just before the Mamaku's...60-70kph...I couldn't get passed due to the traffic and double yellows.
Na mind. passing lane 2 K's away sign said...
Waiting waiting..where the fuck is it?......ok its here, on the gas and out I go and pass, only to have a fucking cop car loom into view at that very moment...I check the mirrors, his break lights are on, he pulls to the left and does a U turn..
FUCK!!....fuck it, all that bloody time following that bitch and now its going to turn sour.
Arse!...I decide to find a spot and pull over, nice wide shoulder bit on the left up ahead...good as spot as any.
I indicate and wait...dont want all that flashing light bullshit.
Ok, here they come...arse bitch I just passed, another car that was behind and... the Cop...they all drive by!...:facepalm:
Well Fuck! now behind all of them and we are at least 25-30 mins out of Rotorua!
Slow speed fuckers.


hahaha...fcukin love it dude..:laugh:

[caspernz]

That tolerance is the main reason I am staying off the road during the holiday season. I can ride whenever I want and i don't have to be anywhere, so I'm mostly staying home and drinking beer.

Second that. Plus I find too many amateurs in/on vehicles that should have stayed at home too....in case I do have to go anywhere.

[trumpy]

Drivers are driving slower.

I drive my car using the cruise control a lot, have it set at 105ish on the speedo and i hardly ever get passed, but I pass a hell of a lot of cars and usually without having to accelerate at all. maybe switch the cc off until a passing opportunity arises and then switch it on again to get passed, but I reckon most drivers are driving in the low 90s.

I would tend to agree with you. I drive around 75,000ks a year (plus another 20,000ks+ on my bike) a lot of it using cruise control. Where I have to use main highways I set it to 105 indicated (102 true) and I very seldom get passed. The key to quick passage is not top speed but keeping speed as consistent as possible (including the twisty bits).

I rode down to Napier and back (plus a little play on some back roads, Coro be damned, you guys have some cool roads with bugger all cars down there!) a couple of days ago with most of the main highway part of the trip being being at 104KPH. I did not get passed by a single car but passed plenty (again be consistent).

[trumpy]

because you are to go fast without delay from A to Z 100km + what ever

one takes the Bundesbahn if they are afraid of the Autobahn up to 120 km or

the Land Strasse if one has a thing for scenery and sightseeing up to 100 km

Be interesting to see the road toll stats for each of those different roads. Can't remember the exact details now (and can't be bothered looking....) but I am sure that when both Montana and the Northern Territory instituted speed limits the road toll actually went up.
A couple of Psychologists did a bit of research on this and both concluded that when there is a limit in place then people try to drive to that limit whether they are "safe" at that speed or not. Many drivers interviewed would have felt more comfortable driving slower but felt "obliged" to keep up thus driving closer to the edge of their personal limits. Without a limit they had no "target" to aim for and drove within their own personal comfort zone. Has some logic about it.....

[Berries]

If it really made such a difference and they were serious about saving lives, why have they not cut the speed limit to 90kmh, or even 80kmh?
Don't worry, I'm sure you will see the speed limit reduced from 100km/h on quite a few roads in the near future.


A couple of Psychologists did a bit of research on this and both concluded that when there is a limit in place then people try to drive to that limit whether they are "safe" at that speed or not. Many drivers interviewed would have felt more comfortable driving slower but felt "obliged" to keep up thus driving closer to the edge of their personal limits. Without a limit they had no "target" to aim for and drove within their own personal comfort zone. Has some logic about it.....
This is one of the reasons I believe that putting signs up that had 100 written on them rather than the old black diagonal stripe over the white circle was a backwards step.

[BigAl]

I'm all for people driving at whatever speed they feel comfortable but when there is some ole codger doing 80k on the open road with a stream of vehicles behind with cops all over the place not pulling them up as I observed numerious times today, while in the cage.

Then this bullshit of pulling over slow drivers is just that...... bullshit.

Rant over.:angry:

[Smifffy]

They are saying that the last time the road toll was as low as the 2011 one was in 1952. The speed limit is higher now than it was in the majority of those intervening years. In that other thread about the cardboard number plates, the popo man actually said that the speed (150km/h iirc) wasn't the problem, it was the manner of driving that made the pursuit unsafe.


But speed kills.

[Ocean1]

This is one of the reasons I believe that putting signs up that had 100 written on them rather than the old black diagonal stripe over the white circle was a backwards step.

My memory's not as good as it used to be, but I think that black diagonal stripe sign was a hangover from what used to be a Limited Speed Zone, which was subtley different to the (then) 60mph open road limit.

One of the local constabulary will leap in shortly and enlighten us further...

[vifferman]

It's not the 100/104 that I have a problem with.
It's how the logic and propaganda behind it go that irks me.
Eggs Zachary. I feel the same way.

[blue rider]

The number of Accidents in which humans are harmed and or killed, has decreased steadily between 2000 - 2010, however showed an increase of 2.4% in 2010 compared to 2009. For the previous nine year there was a decrease of about 28%,

Total people harmed on Autobahns in Germany in 2010 18.829.

http://www.dvr.de/betriebe_bg/daten/unfallstatistiken-ab.htm

however it should be taken into account that Germany is a traditional transit country with high amounts of truck transport and the always dreaded Russian/Polish convey, plus the vacationeers from the nordic countries.......don't you love them caravans.
Unfortunately the stats do not show where the injured/death come from, which would be interesting.


The translation was all mine.

[Scuba_Steve]

My memory's not as good as it used to be, but I think that black diagonal stripe sign was a hangover from what used to be a Limited Speed Zone, which was subtley different to the (then) 60mph open road limit.

One of the local constabulary will leap in shortly and enlighten us further...

I'm not the :Police: but limited speed zones were red 'LSZ' signs not the diagonal line. The diagonal black line is 'open road' effectively what we have now use '100' signs for, as they were just letting you know you were hitting the "open road" and
Unless there are specific speed signs, the speed limit is 100 km/h on all open roads, including motorways and expressways.

[blue rider]

and why is SH2 a now safe zone at 90 km ? Went to Tauranga over Xmas, and could not quite understand the logic behind this.
Also cops staring at you with some sort of gun thingy pointed at one is not polite. Not at all.

in fact the only dangerous thing i cam across was a police car pulling out (there were about 4 cars and me) to put on the horns (why?) and go real fast up to the second car and pull them over from the right line to the left to the border stripe (not sure the correct term) in a somewhat risky maneuver. Sort of like road bullying. Not polite and not safe.

[Scuba_Steve]

The number of Accidents in which humans are harmed and or killed, has decreased steadily between 2000 - 2010, however showed an increase of 2.4% in 2010 compared to 2009. For the previous nine year there was a decrease of about 28%,


I think what we're starting to now is the plateau, where the number of "safety enhanced" cages is such that this speed scam will no-longer be able to ride it's success.
I also think this is why we're starting to see moves towards making money with other laws i.e. slow drivers, crossing centerlines (which as people have previously noted the crazy with the yellow paint has been hard at work setting up), red light cams, cellphones etc

[blue rider]

I think what we're starting to now is the plateau, where the number of "safety enhanced" cages is such that this speed scam will no-longer be able to ride it's success.
I also think this is why we're starting to see moves towards making money with other laws i.e. slow drivers, crossing centerlines (which as people have previously noted the crazy with the yellow paint has been hard at work setting up), red light cams, cellphones etc

this is why i think a breakdown of the nationalities involved in these accidents would be interesting to see. you would not believe what they allow on the streets in the Eastern Countries, these cars smoke.....for real.
crappy overloaded cars with tired drivers, fucked breaks, no acceleration what so ever, did I say tired drivers? bada bing bada bing......no more brummmm brummm

[The Singing Chef]

I actually got quite pissed off at the new 90km/h "Safer speed zones" throught half of SH2 down to Tauranga. It actually made me want to speed so I took some back roads to keep myself occupied and forget about the "Safer speed zone"

[SPman]

It's really not that difficult to sit at 100kph. Why are you all in such a hurry?That's on the Scorpio, right.

[Berries]

I'm not the :Police: but limited speed zones were red 'LSZ' signs not the diagonal line. The diagonal black line is 'open road' effectively what we have now use '100' signs for, as they were just letting you know you were hitting the "open road" and
What he said.

Although a (then) Transit initiative lots of Councils followed suit. Although the signs mean exactly the same thing, there is, I feel, a slight difference in the understanding of the two signs. Subtle nuance is the word I was looking for.


this is why i think a breakdown of the nationalities involved in these accidents would be interesting to see. you would not believe what they allow on the streets in the Eastern Countries, these cars smoke.....for real.
crappy overloaded cars with tired drivers, fucked breaks, no acceleration what so ever, did I say tired drivers?
But then in many countries, even those with slanty eyes or black people, the driver training is far beyond the absolute crap you have in NZ.

Is fucked breaks something to do with fatigue?

[jrandom]

That's on the Scorpio, right.

The Nightster's good like that too.

[blue rider]

What he said.

Although a (then) Transit initiative lots of Councils followed suit. Although the signs mean exactly the same thing, there is, I feel, a slight difference in the understanding of the two signs. Subtle nuance is the word I was looking for.


But then in many countries, even those with slanty eyes or black people, the driver training is far beyond the absolute crap you have in NZ.

Is fucked breaks something to do with fatigue?

if you are on a motorway going at a good 150 - 180 km - as does most around you you want to be neither tired nor have fucked breaks. This is regardless of your genetic make up and country of origin.

one of the really sick things to see is cars piled up by the twenties thirties etc., because a. drove to fast, b. drove tired, c. breaks did not work.

[MSTRS]

My memory's not as good as it used to be, but I think that black diagonal stripe sign was a hangover from what used to be a Limited Speed Zone, which was subtley different to the (then) 60mph open road limit.



I, too, thought the diagonal black line meant one and the same with 'LSZ'.
As for what it meant (either one) - (and for the young'uns who don't know them) The speed limit was the prevailing open road limit of the day, but with the proviso that in adverse conditions, the limit would alter to 70kph. Removing, or rescinding, that proviso was one of the early steps in removing the need for drivers to actually think about what they were doing...

[Edbear]

I think what we're starting to now is the plateau, where the number of "safety enhanced" cages is such that this speed scam will no-longer be able to ride it's success.
I also think this is why we're starting to see moves towards making money with other laws i.e. slow drivers, crossing centerlines (which as people have previously noted the crazy with the yellow paint has been hard at work setting up), red light cams, cellphones etc

Money making? Aren't these kinda dangerous and cause accidents?

[Ocean1]

Removing, or rescinding, that proviso was one of the early steps in removing the need for drivers to actually think about what they were doing .

...the basic human right to self determination.

[Scuba_Steve]

Money making? Aren't these kinda dangerous and cause accidents?

Cell use (talking) is a lesser danger, drinking coffee or smoking a fag poses higher risk, in-fact hands free we're allowed to use is more dangerous than talking directly on it.
Slow people in themselves aren't always dangerous but they do cause road-rage which is, if they do what they are supposed to then everything is good. But we'll see if this is enforced or inforced like da speed scam.
crossing center lines can be dangerous but I did qualify it with the "crazy with the yellow paint", if your've seen some of the places he's been out with his paint, it can only be assumed these roads are being setup for money making.
Red light runners are dangerous & if RC does what he claims this is good enforcement. Red light cameras however are also dangerous & again like speed cameras they're primary purpose is to make money this is where it steps into inforcement

it's all about wether it's enforced or inforced. these laws have been round just as long as "speed" so why is it only now they're starting to enforce/target them? (exception to cell)

[actungbaby]

I agree 110 % percent cause i cant add

this is great campain we got reduce the road toll if its your mother or realtive killed by driver
i think you can winge all you like not going make any diffrence
If you cant get where your going by averaging acceptable road speed well you not very good
whats 4 mins gained if you stop and have leak theres your gains out the window

you guys talk a load bs alot the time , if you pass you only catch up to carvans and such on hoildays times
as for that oh am scared somone tailgating me bs i have to do 140kph bollocks

Please we ride in the real world i never had problems and i ride at 100kph max , i even rode scooter from chch
to palmerston north no problem ,

heres tip for you somones up ya chuff pull over to left let them past

Last year the speed limit on the open road was 100 Km's/hr.

This year it's 100 Km's/hr.

This week it's 100 Km's/hr.

NOTHING HAS CHANGED ...

It is up to the discretion of the officer that catches YOU exceeding the speed limit ...

What is written on the ticket that he/she may issue you .... will depend a lot (but NOT always) on the "infamous" attitude test ...

Those that did issue tickets for 104 km's and over ... will continue to do so ... if they choose to ...

But as far as the LAW goes ... NOTHING has changed.

[MSTRS]

heres tip for you somones up ya chuff pull over to left let them past

Tell that to the ignorant slow pricks out there...
And while you're at it, tell them to NOT speed up in passing lanes

[Berries]

you guys talk a load bs alot the time
It is in English though.

[BigAl]

i ride at 100kph max , i even rode scooter from chch
to palmerston north no problem ,


That's why you can ride at 100k, cause you're riding a scooter.

[avgas]

It is Bollox...I would like to hear the explaination as to why the road in 1973 was three times as high as this years road?
They either take credit or lay blame :Police:
Credit where credits due...the road users are the reason for the road toll (high or low) not the police.
The Police do not make the decision for any given road user.
The road user makes a decision...wheather it be right or wrong at the time, that decision alone can be the deciding factor on the road toll.
- ABS
- Traction control
- FWD vehicles (or 4wd) vs RWD (non LSD)
- Automatic transmissions (not "glidemissions")
- Airbags
- "Control" Tarseal or even Rubberised seal on difficult corners
- Lower vehicle weights (aka lower momentum weights)
- Disc Brakes
- Anti-Drink driving culture
- Less gravel roads
- Stronger incentive for policing to monitor vehicles


Probably have missed countless more, but am raiding the spirits and having a quiet few to bring in 2012. But I recall reading something somewhere that pointed all these out.
Basically vehicle, road and policing wise the 1970's was Russian roulette. Now days most vehicles are relatively moron proof. Which is why its so shocking we still have such high stats in NZ.
They fixed everything except the morons.

[Ocean1]

Which is why its so shocking we still have such high stats in NZ.
They fixed everything except the morons.

Before you compare NZ with any other country you'd better find one with similar countryside vehicle fleet and roads. As it is I don't recall that our stat's are that different to most of the rest of the western world, certainly better than vast swathes of Europe and the Eastern block.

And the morons are everywhere else too. Better be technically correct and call 'em average drivers, eh? If you figure they're not up to your standards p'raps we could ask how they learn when their every move is managed for them.

[MSTRS]

... p'raps we could ask how they learn when their every move is managed for them.

Hence my comment about removing the need to think...

[Ocean1]

Hence my comment about removing the need to think...

Yes. It's become very easy to switch off, eh?

And it seems, perversly, that everything that's done to make us safer reduces the stimulation needed to retain focus.

If it's not obvious I believe they're on the wrong track, here...

[scumdog]

Now days most vehicles are relatively moron proof. Which is why its so shocking we still have such high stats in NZ.
They fixed everything except the morons.

Like the moron near Kapiti who decided to overtake at the last second at the end of a passing lane and 'had' to squeeze in - loosing control while doing so, crossing the centreline and hitting another vehicle head-on.

Oh well, he won't be doing THAT again...:rolleyes:

[avgas]

Before you compare NZ with any other country you'd better find one with similar countryside vehicle fleet and roads.

That would be a developed country, no?
Realistically if you were to argue against what I said you would have to compare to a country that doesn't have all the things I said.
Asia (Poor), South America, India.......would be good comparisons. When you look at the statistics its quite amazing that they have better stats or the same stats when you think that they don't even have good brakes. Or barriers.
They also have fleets of vehicles that make us look like a bunch of hicks.
VW sell a car called the Santana to the general populace of S.America's and China - no where else. It has not changed much since 1984.
Likewise Morris Ambassador in India.

Your right about people calling morons in NZ, "average" drivers. But that mantra is wrong. We should be trying to fix it. It used to be average to drink drive, it used to be average to smoke and it used to be average to beat your kids.
The problem needs to be acknowledged - and its up to the public to do so.
The whole of NZ needs to go back to road school, rewards to those that show they know how to control a vehicle, punishment that have no respect for their vehicle and the road.
Currently we only look at how road users treat other road users. There is complete disregard to weather a person can even control the vehicle they are in charge of.
If the firearms licensing was the same as car/motorbike in NZ - teenagers would have AK47's, Grannies would have RPG's and 40's year olds would have a 'weekend' arsenal that could reclaim Fiji.
But cars and motorbikes aren't "weapons" apparently.

[scumdog]

If the firearms licensing was the same as car/motorbike in NZ - teenagers would have AK47's, Grannies would have RPG's and 40's year olds would have a 'weekend' arsenal that could reclaim Fiji.
But cars and motorbikes aren't "weapons" apparently.

You've got a point there.

Look at how many guns are in NZ

Look at how many vehicles we have in NZ

Look at how hard it is to get a firearms licence & gun.

Look how hard it is to get a drivers licence and car.

Look at which was 'designed solely to kill' (according to some)

Look at what actually causes the bigger number of deaths.

[Scuba_Steve]

If the firearms licensing was the same as car/motorbike in NZ

firearms licence pretty much the same, in respect to getting it (in-fact easier), you have money you get card. The only saving grace is it's only people who want/like firearms that actually get the licence, unlike car licence where everyone "needs" one.
It'll be a good day when they perfect the self drive car

[scumdog]

firearms licence pretty much the same, in respect to getting it (in-fact easier), you have money you get card.

So when did you get your firearms licence?

I bet it wasn't by doing a 'scratchy' test and on the third attempt..

And I bet no relatives/friends were interviewed prior to you getting your drivers licence....um?

I could go on but you get the picture.

[Scuba_Steve]

So when did you get your firearms licence?

I bet it wasn't by doing a 'scratchy' test and on the third attempt..

And I bet no relatives/friends were interviewed prior to you getting your drivers licence....um?

I could go on but you get the picture.

would post the 20/20 video in response to you, but I can't find a copy. Maybee the blurb will surfice.

In a special investigation, 20/20's hidden cameras uncover disturbing evidence about New Zealand's gun licensing laws. HADYN JONES shows just how little you need to know to get a license and even worse...how examiners will give you a license even if you have failed the firearms test. Watch as we take three people who know nothing about guns through the licensing process. They were shocked. Will you be?

Aside from aviation, the licensing system in NZ is a complete joke, in-fact the whole reason the gun licence exists is kinda a joke, you should be well aware of this Scummy.

[scumdog]

Aside from aviation, the licensing system in NZ is a complete joke, in-fact the whole reason the gun licence exists is kinda a joke, you should be well aware of this Scummy.

So how old and rigged was this paragon of truthfull and unemotional reporting (20/20).:rolleyes:

And if you think the firearms licence is a joke (And I can assure you things have ratched up about ten notches in the last few months, go and make enquiries about getting one) how the hell would you describe out drivers licencing system??

Can't read?
Don't speak the language?
Never had any formal training?

Hey, we'll still give you a licence
:scratch:

[avgas]

Really? Gotta link to that 20/20 episode?
I was actually thinking of getting my firearms license in 2012. But I recall the crap they put my dad through 10 years ago when he got his renewed.
Lock this here, bolt this here, do this, do that. Re-sit this..........and that was just renewing it.

But to compare the 2 again.
Have a think about it, we test drivers against how they deal with other traffic, not actually on how they drive/ride.
Look at the 100's of threads on here about counter-steering.

People would seriously question the gun licensing system in NZ if a thread on a forum (or reg users), starting like this.
"Hi guys, just got a 243, and I want to know how to flick bullets like on that movie - Wanted"
or
"Hi guys, when I look down the barrel of my 22 I see a slight blockage, I have tried blowing down (even cut my lip on the sights)....but can't clear it"
People would cry bloody murder on the streets.
Yet I don't imagine many on NZ roads would know what to do if they started to slide on loose gravel in/on their vehicle.

[Ocean1]

Realistically if you were to argue against what I said you would have to compare to a country that doesn't have all the things I said.

No I wouldn't. I just have to note that continental roading systems tend towards cost effective straight lines, the number of corners is much lower and their motorways tend not to feature opposing traffic flows.

Not all accidents happen on corners, it's true. But most of 'em do, and with far more corners it'd be unusual if we didn't have more accidents, yes?

And if, say SH1 northbound is seperated from SH southbound by a 50 metres of shrubbery then the number of head-ons is likely to be less, no?

Our geography is a significant difference, as is the size of our roading infrastructure compared to our population.

[Scuba_Steve]

So how old and rigged was this paragon of truthfull and unemotional reporting (20/20).:rolleyes:

And if you think the firearms licence is a joke (And I can assure you things have ratched up about ten notches in the last few months, go and make enquiries about getting one) how the hell would you describe out drivers licencing system??

Can't read?
Don't speak the language?
Never had any formal training?

Hey, we'll still give you a licence
:scratch:

Rigged? no. but yes there would have been a major overhaul after this aired & it was a year old now?
As for our driver licensing system I would describe it as utter & total shit, the only obstacle to obtaining one is money.


Really? Gotta link to that 20/20 episode?
I was actually thinking of getting my firearms license in 2012. But I recall the crap they put my dad through 10 years ago when he got his renewed.
Lock this here, bolt this here, do this, do that. Re-sit this..........and that was just renewing it.

But to compare the 2 again.
Have a think about it, we test drivers against how they deal with other traffic, not actually on how they drive/ride.
Look at the 100's of threads on here about counter-steering.

People would seriously question the gun licensing system in NZ if a thread on a forum (or reg users), starting like this.
"Hi guys, just got a 243, and I want to know how to flick bullets like on that movie - Wanted"
or
"Hi guys, when I look down the barrel of my 22 I see a slight blockage, I have tried blowing down (even cut my lip on the sights)....but can't clear it"
People would cry bloody murder on the streets.
Yet I don't imagine many on NZ roads would know what to do if they started to slide on loose gravel in/on their vehicle.

Na as mentioned I couldn't find 1, TVNZ no longer has an active link, but as mentioned above they've probably had a major overhaul of the testing since the airing

I did get a chuckle outta your gun examples tho :laugh:

[avgas]

Our geography is a significant difference, as is the size of our roading infrastructure compared to our population.
So the question is left.
If something is more difficult. Does it not require more training?
Or should we simply try and cut all the corners out of the country?

NZ should be compared against the rest of the world, and then we need to acknowledge we have a problem with driving and riding here.
"She'll be right approach" is not acceptable in situations where one person can kill another.

[MSTRS]

Yes. It's become very easy to switch off, eh?

And it seems, perversly, that everything that's done to make us safer reduces the stimulation needed to retain focus.

If it's not obvious I believe they're on the wrong track, here...


So the question is left.
If something is more difficult. Does it not require more training?
Or should we simply try and cut all the corners out of the country?

NZ should be compared against the rest of the world, and then we need to acknowledge we have a problem with driving and riding here.
"She'll be right approach" is not acceptable in situations where one person can kill another.

Be all means try to engineer roads to mitigate the actions of idiots. There comes a point when all that does is create boredom for many, and allows for the development of better idiots.
We've been at the point of diminishing returns for a few years now. Surely it's time to stop doing more of the same shit, and alter the focus on what needs fixing?
But no, it seems tptb would rather we get speed control devices and other such shit to stop the carnage. Eventually, no human input will be required to move people/vehicles about. And then we can finally relax and not be concerned with idiots...

[Mogwa]

Revenue gathering indeed....

I got a camera ticket last new years eve doin 57 in a 50 for $30 buck. hardly worth the admin. does it make me go slower? NO. there has never been an accident in that area either. Not every bike has a big bright digital speedo, mine is analogue, in miles and the k's are tiny. REVENUE GATHERING. Cages annoy the shit outa me wen they sit side by side in a passing lane doin the same speed ...104 or less. Thats the sort of stupidity that causes accidents. Im Not in a rush i just got somewhere to be, and id rather do the upper tolerace of the speed limit consistently to reduce the overall time im riding, and therefore reduce the chance of an accident:niceone:

[Ocean1]

So the question is left.
If something is more difficult. Does it not require more training?
Or should we simply try and cut all the corners out of the country?

NZ should be compared against the rest of the world, and then we need to acknowledge we have a problem with driving and riding here.
"She'll be right approach" is not acceptable in situations where one person can kill another.

The difference creating that particular difficulty is the seriously wrinkley landscape. By all means offer better (or any) driving/riding training, it's a better idea than "realigning" the fuck out of everything. Be aware, though that that aproach is frowned upon by those who set policy on such things.

I went to the trouble, once of attending a very expensive driving course under the auspices of the local police force. I found for the most part it was less than helpful, wheras I wanted to learn how to handle a vehicle in a compromised situation they wanted to teach me that should I find myself in such a situation I'd be dead. Policy, see, was such that they wished to instil into everyone that such situations were to be avoided at any cost, so there was no point at all in training for such eventualities. I found a better school.

By all means compare NZ with whatever you like, it can be informitive, if one collects the data and compares it BEFORE forming an opinion on it. It can also find comparisons that reinforce a preconcieved viewpoint, in which case I'm sure you'll find exactly what you want there also, no matter what that viewpoint. just make sure you flag the differences, eh? there's little point in comparing NZ to countries with quite different conditions.

As for the aceptability of "she'll be right"? I'm afraid the term reveals the likely presence of one of those preconcieved constructs I mentioned. Personally I find the risk of dying on NZ roads acceptable. Wouldn't be doing it otherwise. And in case you're actually looking for data, rather than amunition that risk reaches parity at about one hundred and ten million kilometres. I've got some wee way to go, and who knows, perhaps if I'm real careful and very lucky I might squeeze in 2000,000,000 before I shuffle off this mortal coil.

[Ocean1]

Be all means try to engineer roads to mitigate the actions of idiots. There comes a point when all that does is create boredom for many, and allows for the development of better idiots.

Dude, I'd be happy if they un-engineered some of the latest initiatives, like any roadside furniture on the outside of corners. Including, but not limited to cheasecutters.

PS: I note mention in the Safer Roads document the liklihood of further reductions in rural open road speed limits. I see vast tracts of 90k roading in our immediate future.

[MSTRS]

Dude, I'd be happy if they un-engineered some of the latest initiatives, like any roadside furniture on the outside of corners. Including, but not limited to cheasecutters.


Roadside (and centre) barriers that can and do kill bikers. In the pursuit of making the road/s safer. Don't get me started...
I hold a patent on a brilliant road safety device. It's a big, sharp spike that's fitted to every car's steering wheel But do you think I can interest anyone in buying it.

[scumdog]

Roadside (and centre) barriers that can and do kill bikers. In the pursuit of making the road/s safer. Don't get me started...


'Cheescutters' have killed one biker so far.
(As far as I'm aware of)

How many bikers have been killed by cars crossing the centre of the road into their path? (And I'm not talking about SMIDSY incidents here)

[MSTRS]

'Cheescutters' have killed one biker so far.
(As far as I'm aware of)



A cheesecutter was involved in the death of one biker. He was not an innocent victim tho...
Armco posts have taken quite a few, and I KNOW that some of those riders were totally innocent.
But fit a bottom rail? Not on your nelly. I've had the word from 'on high'