Internet and networking Gurus [Archive]

Reido

19th January 2012, 12:24

steve_t

19th January 2012, 12:30

I'd ring Chorus and ask. I guess all they need to say is that more equipment was loaded into the same cabinet as yours and now the connection rate is lower.

Also, if you use www.speedtest.net, you'll generally get a lower number than if you use the ookla speed tester on the telecom website. Scammers

Scuba_Steve

19th January 2012, 12:31

Hi guys

Moved house on the 6th, Guys from Chorus came around to check my internet was getting connected to the right place etc.
Got connetected at 15.3mbps, says so on the invoice they left me. woohoo.

Had that speed for a week, then suddenly it drops down to 4mbps.. called vodafone and they tell me thats the line speed and basicly tell me im lying about have 14-16mbps connection before.
The did some tests or what ever and told me thats all I can get.

So currently my connection speed is jumping around between 2 and 6mbps.

Anyone have any experience with this?

Cheers
Reido

Problem = Vodafone, get off them as fast as poss IMO. Mate had the same probs every time he rang up they put him through excessive "tests" bumped up his speed for a week then it always dropped back down. They kept saying "it's the line speed" "that's all you can get" (despite the fast weeks) finally convinced him to switch companies, he's never had a problem since...

steve_t

19th January 2012, 12:33

Problem = Vodafone, get off them as fast as poss IMO. Mate had the same probs every time he rang up they put him through excessive "tests" bumped up his speed for a week then it always dropped back down. They kept saying "it's the line speed" "that's all you can get" (despite the fast weeks) finally convinced him to switch companies, he's never had a problem since...

Oh shit, is that true? I'm thinking of changing to Vodafone from Telecom this month cos Telecom give you way less for the same $$ and I also have Sky so want the subsidy from Voda. I only get 4-6mbps anyway and was hoping a move to Voda would make this faster!

Reido

19th January 2012, 12:34

Vodafone had been great up intill now.

Im on their naked broadband, $65 for 60gb or $95 for 120gb. which is perfect for my flat...

However im pissed about this...

Im pretty sure im stuck in a contract for another 12 months. And theres not much around to match pricewise.

Im not using speedtest, just looking in the router for the connection speed.

steve_t

19th January 2012, 12:36

Oops. Just spotted that speedtest.net also uses Ookla

Scuba_Steve

19th January 2012, 12:50

Oh shit, is that true? I'm thinking of changing to Vodafone from Telecom this month cos Telecom give you way less for the same $$ and I also have Sky so want the subsidy from Voda. I only get 4-6mbps anyway and was hoping a move to Voda would make this faster!

yep 100%, 1st we thought (due to it starting at decent speed but dropping after about a week) it was his router, so tried resetting, no luck. Brought a new one, still no luck. Went through months of ringing up only to have them put him through massive diag tests just to up his speed for the week following to have it drop again a week later always using the same "it's the line" excuse. Eventually after months of doing this over & over (might have been a 12month contract delay too?) we finally convinced him to switch companies (he's now on Orcon FWIW) & he's never had a problem since, speed has stayed high where it should be.

Tho if your only getting 4-6 you might not notice too much speed diff (I think he got down to 2mbps tho), he also had massive lag (if your into gaming) so that might still be a prob. Vodafone jumped all over the place, Think it took a world trip everytime it wanted to go somewhere

SMOKEU

19th January 2012, 13:04

If you can get Telstra cable broadband in your area, then do it. I get a constant 15mbps, no matter what time of day I test it. It's expensive, but the service is excellent.

iYRe

19th January 2012, 13:05

2 things affect your connection speed on ADSL, generally;

1. Distance from the exchange or DSLAM (the telecom equipment - sometimes in roadside cabinets). Not the distance by road or as the crow flies - the length of the cable.
2. Things causing "noise" on the line (induction, insulation faults, etc).

Make them get the line looked at.

First thing you should ALWAYS do when having speed/connection issues if you are not a gazillion miles from the DSLAM, is remove any thing else plugged into the phone lines, change your filter if you have one.

Then get the line tested and so forth.

The speed that you connect is negotiated by your ADSL router and the DSLAM. If you are using an ADSL2 router you should in theory be able to connect at up to 24 MB/S. If your splitter is faulty, it causes "noise". If you have an insulation fault in your cable (a green connector or joint, an earth, loop, or short circuilt (HRLoop for those in the know)) it causes "noise". If you have power or radio induction, then these can also cause "noise' (noise is a generic term from the old days, fwiw).

If you were able to connect fast, and then over time your speed has slowed, it suggests there is an insulation fault which is degrading due to the circuit now being active (its gone from being a dead cable to having a constant 50v DC on it now, which then goes up when the phone rings).

Hope that helps.

(edit: the ISP has no control over the speed that you connect, only throughput once connected - vodafone, orcon, telecom, slingshot, and a few others have their own equipment in some exchanges, but mostly it is still Telecom DSLAM's that you connect to)

Scuba_Steve

19th January 2012, 13:10

Vodafone had been great up intill now.

Im on their naked broadband, $65 for 60gb or $95 for 120gb. which is perfect for my flat...

god thought that sounded cheap... Seems someone has an on-account cell

steve_t

19th January 2012, 13:33

Do all NZ ISPs have the same contention ratio? Obviously this will affect speed too

iYRe

19th January 2012, 13:55

Do all NZ ISPs have the same contention ratio? Obviously this will affect speed too

I think so - or pretty close.

These things affect the speed you can browse at, but nothing much to do with the speed your router connects at.

If you are next door to the exchange, you could get 24 mb/s, because line conditions allow. But you have a sucky ISP, so actual download speeds are .5 mb/s.

I connect to my DSLAM at 14MB/s most of the time, but I have never managed more than 6mb/s downloading - at least, any time i have checked anyway.

ISP = responsible for internet bandwidth
Telco = responsible for connection speed.

Gremlin

19th January 2012, 14:06

Im not using speedtest, just looking in the router for the connection speed.
Ok, so you're looking at the line stats in the modem? It will report the theoretical maximums possible, but you won't achieve that.

Now if that does change (and I've had a churn before, went from a high speed to a low speed, just with change in ISP) then it's the ISP, but there's nothing you can really do about it, other than change ISP.

This assumes you've done isolation tests etc as per iYRe's post.

yachtie10

19th January 2012, 14:33

im with vodafone and they have just mucked be about for the second time

but pretty cheap so there fast becoming just like like telecom to me
Are you on there red network or a standard customer?

I have never got gret performance (even before i went to vodafone) as I am a good dsitance from the exchange. But when the performance got really bad in december, I chased them up about it.
15th december
Got the usual runaraound from the monkeys on the help desk and then saying it would take 2 days for chorus engineer to have a look. I got a call from a chorus engineer an hour later (I was a bit pushy). Who basically said I wasnt connected in the right place and should have been moved to a roadside cabinet ages ago. he said he needed Vodafone to request the change before he could do it.
16 December
Talked to vodafone and that will now take 7 working days as thats how long chorus takes. Was asured that I wouldnt be disconected until they were fixing it.
19th december 9am
Conection goes down and wont reset. Rang Vodafone and they assured me I hadnt been disconnected (yeah right) and they would monitor it and look into it and give me a vodem if they couldnt fix it.
20th december
talk to a new person was told it would be fixed on 28th december and I should wait for that. Got a quite pissed at them and got nowhere.
21 december find out they closed my original call as a fault and made it a move/change call. this annoyed me a lot so wanted action from a manager. Got a $100 credit and a vodem which i had to use until 6pm on the 28th december.

So i wouldnt recomend vodafone and i certainly wouldnt sign up a contrat with them.

I can go on about other shit but i have probably bored you already

Vodafone provides a cheap solution but always blames you or chorus for the issues.
I now get a 6.5Mbps on there speedtest but less than 1 Mbps up
Talk to another

avgas

19th January 2012, 14:44

If you are using an ADSL2 router you should in theory be able to connect at up to 24 MB/S.
I think you will find its 24 Mb/s
Not 24 MB/s which equals 192 Mb/s.........also you will probably find if a DSLAM is split up over a street these speeds are significantly lower when everyone uses it.

VDSL is great if you can afford it.......but to be honest most can't.

To the OP, chances are they gave you a good burst when they connect you because they 'dedicate' your line on DSLAM when they are doing config testing.......this all changes when your just a schmuck like everyone else. So expect a dramatic speed drop. To be honest anything over 4 Mb/s is good in NZ.

iYRe

19th January 2012, 14:47

I think you will find its 24 Mb/s
Not 24 MB/s which equals 192 Mb/s.........also you will probably find if a DSLAM is split up over a street these speeds are significantly lower when everyone uses it.

VDSL is great if you can afford it.......but to be honest most can't.

To the OP, chances are they gave you a good burst when they connect you because they 'dedicate' your line on DSLAM when they are doing config testing.......this all changes when your just a schmuck like everyone else. So expect a dramatic speed drop. To be honest anything over 4 Mb/s is good in NZ.

sticky shift key :P

They don't increase your connection speed at any time - what ever you sync at is what you sync at, and that is determined by the things I mentioned.. The installers dont have that much power...

p.dath

19th January 2012, 15:55

Have you plugged in anything extra to any telephone jacks, like phones, faxes, alarms, extension cords, etc?

If so, try unplugging them again.

Reido

20th January 2012, 00:40

p.dath

20th January 2012, 06:42

Has it been raining in your area? Perhaps water is getting into the lines or joints and degrading the connection.

If it has been raining, see if it improves after a week of warm weather.

avgas

20th January 2012, 07:32

sticky shift key :P

They don't increase your connection speed at any time - what ever you sync at is what you sync at, and that is determined by the things I mentioned.. The installers dont have that much power...
Never said anything about increasing speed :shifty:

But 'dedication' to a connection basically means prioritizing packets/ports. While you correct most installers don't have the know how (let alone power).......people above them can ;)

I have found some very strange little things talking to the right people and mucking around with things. Anyone checked the speed on their xbox live? I downloaded a 1gb file recently on there in about 15-20 minutes.

But as mentioned before a consistent 4Mb/s connection is worth gold on ADSL in NZ.

steve_t

20th January 2012, 08:32

I only have 1 phone socket at my place.

Its naked broadband so the router is the only thing connected to it.
I have changed the filter and tried a different router.

Got home from work connection speed was 7500kbps.

Rebooted the router and now its 2700kbps....

*Sigh* wish I could afford VDSL2...

If you're still looking at the number on the modem's menu display, that's just the speed at which it initially syncs. It's not an accurate representation of your connection speed. Go to speedtest.net and run that a few times at different times through the day. It'll give you a better indication of what you're actually connected at

Gremlin

20th January 2012, 14:57

I have found some very strange little things talking to the right people and mucking around with things. Anyone checked the speed on their xbox live? I downloaded a 1gb file recently on there in about 15-20 minutes.
Quite possible your ISP is caching that file. Not sure how xboxs connect, but also possible they can detect that traffic and prioritise it, making it look better, etc, trick people.

iYRe

20th January 2012, 15:32

Quite possible your ISP is caching that file. Not sure how xboxs connect, but also possible they can detect that traffic and prioritise it, making it look better, etc, trick people.

All the big ISP's and many of the smaller ones cache content. People complain when it takes a long time to download - which it _has_ to from overseas.

One ISP I worked at, we were building a torrent caching system, so that if someone else had downloaded a torrent already, it would be cached and you were get it REALLY fast, and saves the ISP bandwidth. It was deemed too dodgy so they canned it and went with a different proxy system.

Oblivion

20th January 2012, 15:32

Vodafone also do VoiP Traffic prioritization eg, things like streaming are at the bottom of the list while, gaming and other such things are at the top. This affects your speeds if you have multiple tabs open at once. Youtube+Facebook+ Some online game

I would also try to test your internet connection at some of the ungodly hours of the morning. During the day we get a relatively consistent 40-70 ping, while at night its around 30. See if that helps you get better speeds. If not, just say to them, I'm not getting the speeds that I was promised when I signed up to this. If not, I may consider switching services to someone that treats there customers better. Rage at them. Politely of course :innocent:

iYRe

20th January 2012, 17:50

just remember that the speed you connect at (the ADSL line speed) is not the same as the speeds you get downloading stuff from your ISP..

The ADSL line speed is what you connect to the ADSL network at (ie, the open road speed limit), and the speed that you get from your ISP is like congestion on the motorway. You might get 15 mb/s but your ISP may or may not be able to supply that kind of speed back to you.. for many reasons, for example, most of them have to connect to telecom to get your connection handed off to them, and this is usually restricted by telecom (unless you are using something like VF red zone, which is their own network and doesnt go through telecom).

The speed your modem reports you connect at is not the same..
Mine says:

Line Rate - Upstream (Kbps): 1017
Line Rate - Downstream (Kbps): 20787

I have never downloaded anything at 20mb/s (its actually not possible in a single threaded download anyway in NZ).

Ronin

20th January 2012, 17:56

iYRe

20th January 2012, 17:58

Naked ADSL with a filter? The internet, your doing it wrong.

yeah.. filters are for phones..

steve_t

20th January 2012, 20:22

yeah.. filters are for phones..

But the ADSL socket of the filter is unfiltered right? And most modems now only come with an RJ11-RJ11 cable so you have to use the filter unless you have a BT-RJ11 cable from a phone or something. Surely the filter being in situ would make 3/10ths of F-all difference?

Ronin

20th January 2012, 21:24

But the ADSL socket of the filter is unfiltered right? And most modems now only come with an RJ11-RJ11 cable so you have to use the filter unless you have a BT-RJ11 cable from a phone or something. Surely the filter being in situ would make 3/10ths of F-all difference?

You would be amazed at the amount of people who use the wrong plug...

iYRe

20th January 2012, 21:36

But the ADSL socket of the filter is unfiltered right? And most modems now only come with an RJ11-RJ11 cable so you have to use the filter unless you have a BT-RJ11 cable from a phone or something. Surely the filter being in situ would make 3/10ths of F-all difference?

only if you plug the router into the filter.. I have naked adsl and VOIP.. it rocks.. (it also helps having worked in the network engineering dept of the ISP I use lol)

steve_t

20th January 2012, 22:12

You would be amazed at the amount of people who use the wrong plug...

Yeah, nothing with what people do with computers amazes me any more. It's little wonder that IT personnel make so much money. So many people can barely manage to turn their computers on :blink:

iYRe

20th January 2012, 22:19

Yeah, nothing with what people do with computers amazes me any more. It's little wonder that IT personnel make so much money. So many people can barely manage to turn their computers on :blink:

errr.. some make lots of money.. I was self employed for a few years, but I got sick of dealing with, and being treated like scum by people who had been ripped off by all the cowboys out there..

People giving bad advice, people charging for stupid things like powering off an one a router (yes sir, I can fix that for you, thats a 30$ call out fee and a minimum of one hour labour at 125$/hr - instead of power it off and on and call me back if that doesnt work THEN you can pay me to fix it).
Most of them are worse than used car salesmen.. I had a franchise with a group whom shall remain nameless for legal reasons, but whom demanded I charge people for stuff I didnt do, or they didnt really need.. it was sick.

Gremlin

21st January 2012, 04:15

The speed your modem reports you connect at is not the same..
Mine says:

Line Rate - Upstream (Kbps): 1017
Line Rate - Downstream (Kbps): 20787
Correct... but if the sync rate changes with a change in ISP....

Yep, had that before, of course it was down... it never goes up <_<

iYRe

21st January 2012, 06:44

Correct... but if the sync rate changes with a change in ISP....

Yep, had that before, of course it was down... it never goes up <_<

That should never happen, because unless you are changing to an ISP that has their own hardware (there's only a few who do and only in some areas, like vodafone, telstra, telecom, slingshot, orcon, for example), then the equipment you are syncing with never changes, and its probably just co-incidence.
I would expect your sync speed to remain the same but your browsing/downloading speeds to change.

If say, you were connected with orcon in Auckland on the north shore (so on orcon's own "telephone exchange" hardware (DSLAM)) and you moved to telecom, your sync speed would change, because you would be changing physical ADSL hardware (DSLAM) at the "telephone exchange" (and you would know because there would be additional charges to be reconnected to the "telecom" infrastructure). Not only does the hardware change, but the type of hardware changes, as different providers use different DSLAMS (nokia, huawai, alcatel lucent, etc).

If your sync rate changes when you change ISP, and its not hardware related, its just coincidence. Probably just because your router was disconnected and reconnected

avgas

21st January 2012, 09:18

But the ADSL socket of the filter is unfiltered right? And most modems now only come with an RJ11-RJ11 cable so you have to use the filter unless you have a BT-RJ11 cable from a phone or something. Surely the filter being in situ would make 3/10ths of F-all difference?
Filter is band-pass. So won't affect operation one bit (ok I didn't plan that joke :laugh:)
So naked with filter = naked without filter. Speed won't change as ADSL is within bandwidth of bandpass.

Ronin

21st January 2012, 11:13

Filter is band-pass. So won't affect operation one bit (ok I didn't plan that joke :laugh:)
So naked with filter = naked without filter. Speed won't change as ADSL is within bandwidth of bandpass.

Unless you get the moran who uses his old dialup cable and plugs it into the filtered side of the equation.

Or the sky techs who NEVER filter their gear behind the TV.

Or the people who think that one filter does the whole house.