Horsepower ratings?

[Stylo]

Why don't the HP/ PS /KW figure at all in any review on a new Bike in the Dirt Bike mags , all you get is rhetoric which means nothing ie " It's got plenty of power up top and the midrange is good " etc and blah blah ...Boring and wank wank.

I want to know how much power/torque it makes !

Road Bike Mags/reviews always detail HP ( KW ) specs as do in all write-ups as do cars and etc .....why not the Dirt Bike mags too ?

[Motu]

When they decided that 2 strokes were not good for the universe and they started to push 4 strokes as the New Hope, the HP figures look so damn puny compared to 2 strokes,they just stopped giving them out to the public. Why would you buy a 4 stroke if it only put out half the HP of a 2 stroke ? Selective information.

[Stylo]

When they decided that 2 strokes were not good for the universe and they started to push 4 strokes as the New Hope, the HP figures look so damn puny compared to 2 strokes,they just stopped giving them out to the public. Why would you buy a 4 stroke if it only put out half the HP of a 2 stroke ? Selective information.


I must have hit a nerve Motu , ha ha ...nice repy :yes:

[p.dath]

Unless how they say how it is being measured its difficult to use for comparitive purposes anyway.

It sounds like you'd prefer they publish torque/power curves anyway than the peak figure.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Because nobody could figure out why 450 four strokes were faster than 500cc two strokes if they listed the HP and torque figures.:innocent:

[andy 101]

As above. you guys never know what ya talking about.

[CRF119]

Its a bit of a pain to get it done. If you use the factory Specs from each brand then its still not fair because the dyno Honda used may be different to the dyno Yamaha used. For testing them here in NZ for bike mag reviews it gets even harder because you would need all the bikes on the same day all with motard tires and same gear ratios or the figures would be wrong. All the bikes would have to be similar in hours of use, plus same weight rear wheel setup and same chain.

[honda_power]

why? motard tyres yeah, but chain, gear ratios etc should be straight from the factory, say if suzuki for example runs a chain that saps 2hp then so be it?

[Pierce]

Unless how they say how it is being measured its difficult to use for comparitive purposes anyway.

It sounds like you'd prefer they publish torque/power curves anyway than the peak figure.

I agree here, I think peak power doesn't really mean THAT much when it comes to dirt bikes. You've gotta be able to get that power to the ground and the whole CR500 vs CRF450 test proves that power doesn't really mean that much if you can't get it to the ground.

[Stylo]

Because nobody could figure out why 450 four strokes were faster than 500cc two strokes if they listed the HP and torque figures.:innocent:

You missed the point Crasher , they used to always publish HP figures in the DB mags so it all made more sense when you were looking at buying a new bike. Even new Chainsaws publish their power figures , as does my new Hedgetrimmer.

My bloody vacuum cleaner has a sticker on it telling how powerful it is .

So...If I were thinking about buying , say , a new 450 ...I want to know it's HP's so I can compare with what's on offer elsewhere ...

And I'm thinking about a 450 but, keeping the 500 ...of course :yes:

[Jay GTI]

Some of the American dirt bike mags still do put the bikes on a dyno as part of their 450/250 MX/Enduro what-ever shootouts. Makes for interesting reading if you're a stats kind of guy (which I am to a point), but doesn't mean much in the real world to most people.

Due to a well-developed lack of talent, most bikes currently on the market make way more power than I can effectively use, 99% of the time. So if the '12 RMZ450 makes slightly less peak power than the '12 KX450F, it really isn't going to make any difference to me. However, if the article says the RMZ is buttery smooth in it's power delivery and the KXF is an arm-stretching animal, then I take note, as I know I'll be able to ride the yellow bike much harder and will probably be scared of the green one.

If you feel knowing the HP rating is necessary to be able to make a purchase, then you can still find out, but will it really make that much difference to your riding pleasure when you've made your decision?

[CRF119]

why? motard tyres yeah, but chain, gear ratios etc should be straight from the factory, say if suzuki for example runs a chain that saps 2hp then so be it?

Because we are trying to compare HP from the stock engine not other parts on the bike so it all has to be even. Gear ratios affect overal torque and power output but can be compensated for on most dynos. Motard wheel for grip

[Crasherfromwayback]

. Motard wheel for grip

Or just use our dyno as we take the back wheel out and drive a hydraulic pump.:Punk:

[F5 Dave]

Stick to ya tarmac roadies, and stay there.


As above. you guys never know what ya talking about.

Yeah I'm with this intelligent response. :facepalm:


although bear in mind more boost bottles, oversized powervalve covers, fuel additives, carb dividers, crazy reed setups, sticker sets & lurid clothing have been sold into this market than even the Live to Ride, Drive to Work belt buckle & T shirt market.

Most of us here will have dirtbikes & some will have road ones as well.

Getting several test bikes dyno'd is a logistical exercise & a hassle & expense for a magazine, which is why the bigger better funded ones only seem to do it.

Further the numbers & curves don't look particularly impressive even if they are effective in the dirt. Heck at the other end of the scale, my Trials bike which is only a 200 drags me up silly places & feels like it has a good bit of go for the type of riding we do. Apparently it puts out ~10hp. Won't be popping that figure out in the pub to try & impress. We Dyno'd a 250 Beta & got 12hp.

[Brian d marge]

Or just use our dyno as we take the back wheel out and drive a hydraulic pump.:Punk:

To get the beer from the cellar ???

Stephen

[jasonu]

Due to a well-developed lack of talent, most bikes currently on the market make way more power than I can effectively use, 99% of the time.

I remember Show Time McGrath saying in an interview a few years ago that a stock 450 makes more power than 90% of riders can fully make use of. That was in regards to people buying brand new bikes and promptly bolting on $1000's of dollars of 'go fast' goodies.

[Stylo]

Its a bit of a pain to get it done. If you use the factory Specs from each brand then its still not fair because the dyno Honda used may be different to the dyno Yamaha used. For testing them here in NZ for bike mag reviews it gets even harder because you would need all the bikes on the same day all with motard tires and same gear ratios or the figures would be wrong. All the bikes would have to be similar in hours of use, plus same weight rear wheel setup and same chain.

True but each manufacturer always used to publish the KW/Ps figures in their brochures along with the other specs and magazines did the same , So why can't they do it these days , even the YZ400 from way back had a HP rating in it's brochure etc.

Then it stopped - No more power specs hence I don't buy the mags anymore , just read 'em and put them back in the rack and I walk out none the wiser

If I was going to buy, say, a new 450 I've got a few Bikes to choose from so ..as part of the equation I'd like to know which one's got the most power/torque etc ...not Rocket Science ..if I don't get the numbers I won't buy the Bike

[noobi]

If I was going to buy, say, a new 450 I've got a few Bikes to choose from so ..as part of the equation I'd like to know which one's got the most power/torque etc ...not Rocket Science ..if I don't get the numbers I won't buy the Bike

Why would the 2 peak hp difference between the brands make a difference?

[Stylo]

Why would the 2 peak hp difference between the brands make a difference?

Because I don't have the numbers to start with to be able to make the choice.

Read the thread

[Rupe]

Because I don't have the numbers to start with to be able to make the choice.

Read the thread

this thread is retarded

[bogan]

Personally I'd choose a bike with suitable power delivery when riding, not so I can play top trumps with the hp figure. Minor HP differences just don't reflect how fast a bike is anymore, that's why they dropped it.

[Stylo]

Personally I'd choose a bike with suitable power delivery when riding, not so I can play top trumps with the hp figure. Minor HP differences just don't reflect how fast a bike is anymore, that's why they dropped it.

You missed the point mate, completely, the thread was only asking why the Hp/KW figures are'nt figured in any current Dirt Bike mags and/.or Brochures ....

I'm still none the wiser

My last new Dirt Bike ...had all the figures in the brochure and the 'Mags ...still waiting to hear why we're not allowed to know what sort of Hp and torque comes out of these supremo machines I'm reading about ...waiting :yawn:


256083

[bikaholic]

HP is kept a secret from the EU pollies that want any form of enjoyment restricted.
Anyone who wants to know the actual HP of various models will find it.

[bogan]

You missed the point mate, completely, the thread was only asking why the Hp/KW figures are'nt figured in any current Dirt Bike mags and/.or Brochures ....

I'm still none the wiser

My last new Dirt Bike ...had all the figures in the brochure and the 'Mags ...still waiting to hear why we're not allowed to know what sort of Hp and torque comes out of these supremo machines I'm reading about ...waiting :yawn:


256083

Are you a bit impaired? :thud: my second sentence ends with 'thats why they dropped it', is that not an answer?

[Stylo]

Are you a bit impaired? :thud: my second sentence ends with 'thats why they dropped it', is that not an answer?

Yep, That's an answer and I've read it four times now...still not sure where you're tracking ?

[bogan]

Yep, That's an answer and I've read it four times now...still not sure where you're tracking ?

Surely after reading it four times now, you'll be a bit wiser as to why they dropped em then?

But if you just want some ratings, here's a few:

32
25
41
41.5
3
54
112

[CRF119]

Read this if you want to look into 2011 Bikes even lists some HP figures. It has some HP figures found is using google in under a min.

http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/11/8773/Motorcycle-Article/2011-450-Motocross-Shootout.aspx

[Stylo]

Surely after reading it four times now, you'll be a bit wiser as to why they dropped em then?

But if you just want some ratings, here's a few:

32
25
41
41.5
3
54
112

Thanks for the random numbers , have no idea what they mean ..take it easy Bogan

You've done well making a fool of yourself , no doubt and not for the first time ...

[bogan]

You've done well making a fool of yourself , no doubt and not for the first time ...

You say that like it is a bad thing, and like I'm the only one :wavey::shake: This site has gotten too sensitive, people keep having hissy fits when someone takes the piss :sweatdrop

[avgas]

Strangely enough I was reading quite a few motocross mags as this went down in a massive letter war.
People were writing into the magazines complaining that their KX actually was better in the dirt due to mid-power band even though it was 2-stroke and that the peak power was never used.
Turned into a massive flamewar for the magazines. Easiest way out was to not publish KW figures but simply describe how the power felt and how the bike rode. Strangely enough the flamewar stopped and everything went back to life as usual.

Which when you think about it makes sense. I know from personal experience that while HP helps in some occasions in dirt, if you have lower HP you get more consistent.
Interesting (yes I know its a car, but its a cool car) fact, Monster Tajima decreased his horsepower when he changed from his Escudo (990hp) to the SX4 (920hp) to improve his time on Pikes Peak. So I guess in the slippery stuff HP isn't everything.

[avgas]

Surely after reading it four times now, you'll be a bit wiser as to why they dropped em then?

But if you just want some ratings, here's a few:

32
25
41
41.5
3
54
112
Thanks for the random numbers , have no idea what they mean ..take it easy Bogan

You've done well making a fool of yourself , no doubt and not for the first time ...
I can help.
One is the standard HP of the CBR250, next is NM of GB400, next is RGV250 HP, NSR250 HP, HP of the original 125cc motorbikes that hit mass production, 1979 Harley Sportster HP, GSXR1100W HP.

Hope that helps. But remember kids just because you don't know something doesn't make you look the fool, assuming someone else doesn't makes you look very foolish.

[Rupe]

Thanks for the random numbers , have no idea what they mean ..take it easy Bogan

You've done well making a fool of yourself , no doubt and not for the first time ...

go and wank over this

http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/11/11858/Motorcycle-Article/2012-450-Motocross-Shootout-Conclusion.aspx

get the husky!!

[jt119]

go and wank over this

http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/11/11858/Motorcycle-Article/2012-450-Motocross-Shootout-Conclusion.aspx

get the husky!! bit of a dry spell at home is it grump

[blackdog]

I too must know the hp figures of any bike I intend purchasing, as this is the only accurate way to gauge the length that my penis will be extended by whilst riding it.

[noobi]

this thread is retarded

I think it's about to go full retard.

OP is probably just looking for another reason to try and justify his ancient 500 2T as a better machine.

The point I was trying to make before was that all bikes of the same capacity and designation make around the same HP and torque figures, maybe 2 or 3 HPers/torques separating them. So what is the point in stating that one makes 1HP more than the other when its not like that is ever going to make a difference. I wouldn't ride a bike that didn't handle even if it had the bestest most powerful engine in the world.

[eelracing]

Live to Ride, Drive to Work.

Haha love it.




I wouldn't ride a bike that didn't handle even if it had the bestest most powerful engine in the world.

So your not a Kawasaki fan then?

[TrentNz]

You say that like it is a bad thing, and like I'm the only one :wavey::shake: This site has gotten too sensitive, people keep having hissy fits when someone takes the piss :sweatdrop

I think hes just hurt that his precious kx500 gets owned by kx450F's :killingme

[F5 Dave]

True but each manufacturer always used to publish the KW/Ps figures in their brochures along with the other specs and magazines did the same , So why can't they do it these days , even the YZ400 from way back had a HP rating in it's brochure etc.. . .

And here's the rub

What you read in a brochure is marketing hype. If they publish a curve it will be a fair representation of the power curve shape but the numbers aren't apples with apples.

Like cars the manufacturers publish hp at the crank. Which is silly 'cause you don't use the crank to lay drive down to the road. But if one manufacturer does it at the crank then anyone who did it at the rear wheels may lose 15-20% in the HP war & people believe that shit.

So how do you get a hp reading at the crank on a bike? Kawasaki had explained some long winded explanation in a mag in the 80s that they dyno'd it then removed the top end & rods & drove it with a motor to work out the mechanical losses through the gearbox (still drive chain to wheels that you would see on a rolling road dyno, but they would have used a chassis dyno).

Also dynos vary in reading & that war can go on forever.

Further brochure manipulation includes other specs like weight.

I don't have any dirtbike examples but the argument goes that if a bike has a bigger fuel tank it is penalised for being heavier so they weigh them without gas. Further the retarded logic says weigh them dry, therefore you don't include any oil, battey fluid. Things got so silly a decade ago they must have just collected a frame a tank some random engine parts & shuffled them all onto the scales, declared 'that's our YamaKazooma 1000' & claimed that weight.

An example is the 166kg GSXR750s. Wow screamed the magazines, these feel so much lighter & people were throwing that figure around. Some mags later aimed them at the scales & with a tank of gas nudged 208 kg. Didn't sound as impressive. A 748 was 213kg so they were in good company.

No reason to think they would have been more honest with dirt bikes, esp as they were trying to push the new 4 stroke range which inevidebly had more parts than the 2 strokes, you can't deny that simple fact & there is only so much metal you can remove & withstand power. titanium valves compared with no valves. Big head with ports cams & all sorts compared with simple cover with spark plug.

Best just claim that they are real light & progress is being made.

So playing top trumps (a card game I remember as a nipper) with manufacturers specs is a total waste of time.

[Stylo]

Looks like this thread has missed the Grin factor that the 2ts have when the the powerband knocks on the door. I don't race anymore but I love it when the big 5 lifts the wheel in top at over 100kms . 65Hp and 100 dry

Too much power does'nt make a race winner but it's a lot of fun anyway ..is'nt that what it's all about ?

[jonbuoy]

Time on the dyno costs money? No idea, seems like a reasonable request to ask for HP and torque figures.

[Brian d marge]

Honda read the Hp figures from the other side of the room using special; equipment

and I KNOW they do ....

if fact I have a photo of a friend of mine who does the dyno runs for the press256144

he also claims to be Lawrence of Arabia , but I put that down to his fondness of hallucinogenics

anyway you fellas might know him

Stephen

[Crasherfromwayback]

Looks like this thread has missed the Grin factor that the 2ts have when the the powerband knocks on the door. I don't race anymore but I love it when the big 5 lifts the wheel in top at over 100kms . 65Hp and 100 dry



A KX500 on std gearing will maybe hit 70mph as it only revs to 7500rpm. A 450 will do 90mph and roost in your face on one wheel.:Punk:

[F5 Dave]

I don't think anyone is trying to argue the fact that 2 strokes are more fun to ride, the point of the thread, hmm, hold on yes that was the point. They are more fun.

Well glad that's cleared up.


Now what about the long term consequences of the recent history of Sarajevo? That's a real ball twister. Its looking stable now, but who really knows? Panel is open.:confused:

[Crasherfromwayback]

I don't think anyone is trying to argue the fact that 2 strokes are more fun to ride, :

I'd have to argue that point too. I reckon a 450 is more fun than a 5 hundy. Better wheelies, better slides and far less vibration. They just cost a shitload more to maintain.

[Jay GTI]

I'm with Crasher on that one...

My old RM250 is faster than my 350SXF... on paper. On dirt, with me on board, slower. The SXF is more fun cos I can ride it faster and I get to think that it makes me a better rider. For the most part, the RM was just pissed off at me about something (or that's how it rode anyway).

[jasonu]

A KX500 on std gearing will maybe hit 70mph as it only revs to 7500rpm. A 450 will do 90mph and roost in your face on one wheel.:Punk:

My 81 Maico 490 did 80mphish with 52 rwhp. Early to mid 80's KTM495's did 100+mph, I think the 86 495 was/is the fastest MXer ever

[Crasherfromwayback]

My 81 Maico 490 did 80mphish with 52 rwhp. Early to mid 80's KTM495's did 100+mph, I think the 86 495 was/is the fastest MXer ever

Only 500cc two stroke dirt bike that will run to 100mph is either a wide ratio model with six gears or has huge sprockets on it. Trust me. I've beach raced them all.

[Stylo]

Only 500cc two stroke dirt bike that will run to 100mph is either a wide ratio model with six gears or has huge sprockets on it. Trust me. I've beach raced them all.

Of course you have Crasher ....<_<

[Crasherfromwayback]

Of course you have Crasher ....<_<

Just like you've dusted off 450's on ya 5 hundy eh??

[Stylo]

Just like you've dusted off 450's on ya 5 hundy eh??

Only on long bits ...bit hard to wave at them as you go past them on the back wheel mate ...haha

[jasonu]

Only 500cc two stroke dirt bike that will run to 100mph is either a wide ratio model with six gears or has huge sprockets on it. Trust me. I've beach raced them all.

http://www.off-road.com/dirtbike/review/vintage-the-fastest-stock-dirtbike-ever-built-23650.html

123.75mph KTM 495

[Stylo]

http://www.off-road.com/dirtbike/review/vintage-the-fastest-stock-dirtbike-ever-built-23650.html

123.75mph KTM 495

Good read , nice one ....

[Crasherfromwayback]

http://www.off-road.com/dirtbike/review/vintage-the-fastest-stock-dirtbike-ever-built-23650.html

123.75mph KTM 495


Good read , nice one ....

Yeah I had that Dirtbike mag as a youngin from the time. Interesting to see the gearing they were running. I used 16/38 or 16/36 on my KX's depending on the circuit. The 36 had the chain touching the sprocket mounting lugs on the hub.

But then again...I could be making it all up eh Stylo.

[CHOPPA]

I used to beat KX500s on my KX80. The 80 must be faster!

[TrentNz]

I used to beat KX500s on my KX80. The 80 must be faster!

thats strange i used to beat the kx500s on my cr50f hmmm...

[CHOPPA]

500cc 2 stokes dont have a power band either. They are just like a big lazy 4 stroke but they dont they dont rev. They dont feel fast to ride

[SMOKEU]

500cc 2 stokes dont have a power band either. They are just like a big lazy 4 stroke but they dont they dont rev. They dont feel fast to ride

Try turning the engine on next time.

[flyingcr250]

All of you are wrong, my dicks bigger<_<

[Crasherfromwayback]

Try turning the engine on next time.

Think you'll find he can ride anything way harder than you'd ever dream of doing Sonny...

[Blagger]

Crasher, don't feed the trolls - Stylo's only on here cos his missus left him.
Look closely at those VMX pics and you'll see wankstains on his KX - of course these are only visible cos it never leaves the garage.

I've seen this carrotspanker pretend to post thoughtfully when all he wants is to start an argument about how great his old big 2Ts are.

5 bucks says he wears Lacoste shirts and pops his collars

[Crasherfromwayback]

Classic. I simply enjoy seeing how much plop one individual can spout though.

[green machine]

Crasher, don't feed the trolls - Stylo's only on here cos his missus left him.
Look closely at those VMX pics and you'll see wankstains on his KX - of course these are only visible cos it never leaves the garage.

I've seen this carrotspanker pretend to post thoughtfully when all he wants is to start an argument about how great his old big 2Ts are.

5 bucks says he wears Lacoste shirts and pops his collars
There was a guy on here before called Armitage Shanks that used to roll out a pic of his KX500 any chance he got,it was the same photo Stylo always puts up......are these people one in the same,or 2 people that use the same photo on here?,if Stylo is the former Armitage Shanks,at least put a different photo up you've used that same one for years............

[Crasherfromwayback]

There was a guy on here before called Armitage Shanks that used to roll out a pic of his KX500 any chance he got,it was the same photo Stylo always puts up......are these people one in the same,or 2 people that use the same photo on here?,if Stylo is the former Armitage Shanks,at least put a different photo up you've used that same one for years............

Same 'person'.

[jasonu]

500cc 2 stokes dont have a power band either. They are just like a big lazy 4 stroke but they dont they dont rev. They dont feel fast to ride

What a load of bollocks!

[Crasherfromwayback]

What a load of bollocks!

Hate to say it mate, but as far as a KX500 goes, he's on the button. A CR500 hits a little harder, as they don't use power valves to smooth things out. But years ago at the Masterton Street races, after the F2 race (which I'd just won), a guy came up and told me I wasn't revving it hard enough as it didn't sound like it was in the powerband! They sound flat as a turd.

[Pornstar]

I raced a 1997 kx 500 in on a very muddy day once, it just massacred the 250's in the deep mud, it just went bauuaurrppp past them, the first start i tried 2nd gear as i would on my 250, she just sat and spun whilst the others took off, so after hookin 3rd then 4th it just reeled them in to holeshot,(what a cheat). They must be nuts out in the dry. all this talk of 5hundys prompted a trade me search, wish i hadn't, those AF500's, sigh.

[Crasherfromwayback]

wish i hadn't, those AF500's, sigh.

Yeah they're pretty cool for sure. I'd quite like one.

[CHOPPA]

What a load of bollocks!

I have owned a CR500 and a KX500 and they were powerfull but they didnt have a 'powerband' they are just like a big diesel tractor. Its not some insane arm ripping power like most people make out.

I have some pictures of mine on here somewhere, I could still clean up club days on them. I even did the nationals in the Pro Open class at Huntly in about 2005 on the CR500, crashed at the start and still managed a top 15 finish didnt race the rest of the weekend cause it was mud hole

[CHOPPA]

I hate it when I start reading the dirt section! Time for another dirt bike haha

[Pornstar]

very nice pics, yes, it looks as though you should have another dirt bike, ya big talent waster.

[Crasherfromwayback]

I hate it when I start reading the dirt section! Time for another dirt bike haha

How to fly lesson 1!

[scott411]

i have raced and won on kx500's, we used to run them a bit fat in the middle part of the power bandwith a pro circuit mx pipe (not the full horsepower desert pipe) and std silencer, fly wheel weight and the optional thick headgasket, i think at one stage i had abotu 20 holeshots in a row on it, and i started them in 3rd gear, in a straight line they are amazing,

imo there is no one that would do a faster laptime around a mx track on a 500 2 stroke than a current 450 mx bike (even a service honda built one) and even in motard the 450's kick them because of power band the new age 450's have,

500's got slower since the mid 80's when people realised you do not win races off road with massive horsepower, but with useable power bands, about 83/84 where the peaky 500's started to get mellowed out, and the same has happened with 450f's, they are getting mellower,

[Crasherfromwayback]

i have raced and won on kx500's, we used to run them a bit fat in the middle part of the power bandwith a pro circuit mx pipe (not the full horsepower desert pipe) and std silencer, fly wheel weight and the optional thick headgasket, i think at one stage i had abotu 20 holeshots in a row on it, and i started them in 3rd gear, in a straight line they are amazing,

and even in motard the 450's kick them because of power band the new age 450's have,

,

I used to tune my 500's the other way when road racing 'em. And I certainly went faster on my RMZ450 (even my early 4 speeder) round Wanganui.

[scott411]

I used to tune my 500's the other way when road racing 'em. And I certainly went faster on my RMZ450 (even my early 4 speeder) round Wanganui.

agreed, the 4 speed rmz could be geared not to bad, but esp at pearoa you were really wishing there was a 5th gear there, (even with the extra 1000rpm i had with a yoshi japan motard cdi

[Crasherfromwayback]

agreed, the 4 speed rmz could be geared not to bad, but esp at pearoa you were really wishing there was a 5th gear there, (even with the extra 1000rpm i had with a yoshi japan motard cdi

I mashed my ankle to a pulp on my 4 speeder, and never road raced my injected 5 speeders. They'd be great though I reckon.

[scott411]

I mashed my ankle to a pulp on my 4 speeder, and never road raced my injected 5 speeders. They'd be great though I reckon.

i have not motarded a injected one yet, not to sure if the over rev is as good as the carb'd ones, be interesting tho, i did not like the sit around all day for 2 or 3 short races, and with not many true motard events (wiht a dirt section in) i sold all my stuff,

[CHOPPA]

i have not motarded a injected one yet, not to sure if the over rev is as good as the carb'd ones, be interesting tho, i did not like the sit around all day for 2 or 3 short races, and with not many true motard events (wiht a dirt section in) i sold all my stuff,

Woodville was great on the weekend from a spectator point. Lots of races and in the 2hrs we were there we got to watch the river race twice and the other classes 3x!

[Crasherfromwayback]

Woodville was great on the weekend from a spectator point. Lots of races and in the 2hrs we were there we got to watch the river race twice and the other classes 3x!

I got side tracked and didn't make it. Who won what mate?

[CHOPPA]

I got side tracked and didn't make it. Who won what mate?

BT and Burga. Coops won one of the races when BT stalled it

[eelracing]

Just like you've dusted off 450's on ya 5 hundy eh??

Only if the fat-assed 450 could get out of it's own way...


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...bye bye fatboy:woohoo:

[tinytoolmans274]

The straight line racer , they always were legends

[jasonu]

Hate to say it mate, but as far as a KX500 goes, he's on the button. A CR500 hits a little harder, as they don't use power valves to smooth things out. But years ago at the Masterton Street races, after the F2 race (which I'd just won), a guy came up and told me I wasn't revving it hard enough as it didn't sound like it was in the powerband! They sound flat as a turd.


I have owned a CR500 and a KX500 and they were powerfull but they didnt have a 'powerband' they are just like a big diesel tractor. Its not some insane arm ripping power like most people make out.

I have some pictures of mine on here somewhere, I could still clean up club days on them. I even did the nationals in the Pro Open class at Huntly in about 2005 on the CR500, crashed at the start and still managed a top 15 finish didnt race the rest of the weekend cause it was mud hole

Then I will reword my post as follows.
Big bore MXers have a powerband that starts from just off idle to redline which makes them feel 'flat'.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Then I will reword my post as follows.
Big bore MXers have a powerband that starts from just off idle to redline which makes them feel 'flat'.

Hence no real powerband at all! Just power (and lots of it) everywhere.:bleh:

[Crasherfromwayback]

Only if the fat-assed 450 could get out of it's own way...





...bye bye fatboy:woohoo:

Now we know it's a setup! A poxy old YZ490!!?? Biggest pile of shit made.:bleh:

[scott411]

Now we know it's a setup! A poxy old YZ490!!?? Biggest pile of shit made.:bleh:

but Broc Glover beat a factory CR500 ridden by one of the best riders ever (David Bailey) to win a US 500 title on one,

[F5 Dave]

What about that Brad Lackey dude, he even managed to make one of those Suzuki things win a real title & they even forgot to bolt the forks on the right way up?!

[ducks for cover]

[Crasherfromwayback]

What about that Brad Lackey dude, he even managed to make one of those Suzuki things win a real title & they even forgot to bolt the forks on the right way up?!

[ducks for cover]

Tried for a bloody long time on Honda's and Kawasaki's too!

[Crasherfromwayback]

but Broc Glover beat a factory CR500 ridden by one of the best riders ever (David Bailey) to win a US 500 title on one,

This guy is pretty handy on his YZ490 too!! It's well worth watching the clip...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lmb2k-qGQ8Y&feature=related

[Jay GTI]

This guy is pretty handy on his YZ490 too!! It's well worth watching the clip...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lmb2k-qGQ8Y&feature=related

Awesome clip!

[Crasherfromwayback]

Awesome clip!

Yeah the boys were going hard out eh! Eddie Lawson has always been one of my heroes! Great to see him stuff Jeff Ward in the dirt section...although Eddie was a good flat tracker anyway.

[Stylo]

This guy is pretty handy on his YZ490 too!! It's well worth watching the clip...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lmb2k-qGQ8Y&feature=related

That's a good clip , nice one

[Crasherfromwayback]

That's a good clip , nice one

So are the other 'Superbikers' ones. Check them all out. It's what made me take up road racing on KX500's.

[Jay GTI]

Yeah the boys were going hard out eh! Eddie Lawson has always been one of my heroes! Great to see him stuff Jeff Ward in the dirt section...although Eddie was a good flat tracker anyway.

When I was a youngster, my two heros were Eddie Lawson and Alain Prost.... so it was hardly surprising that when I smoked, my ciggy of choice was Malboro Reds....

[Stylo]

So are the other 'Superbikers' ones. Check them all out. It's what made me take up road racing on KX500's.

Will do now... Cheers

[scorry]

anyone want to explain why the hp has dropped by 10hp from 2011 - 2012?

[scott411]

it hasn't,

Dyno's vary their readings, and also the air temp makes a huge difference, Dyno's are good for tuning as they give a base rate, and you can change things to see what happens, but you need to keep all the other variables the same, inlc air temp and pressure, etc

[Crasherfromwayback]

it hasn't,

Dyno's vary their readings, and also the air temp makes a huge difference, Dyno's are good for tuning as they give a base rate, and you can change things to see what happens, but you need to keep all the other variables the same, inlc air temp and pressure, etc

Next time you're in Welly come by and have a perv at our dyno Scott. We take the rear wheel out and drive a huge hydraulic pump. No wheelspin and slippage here!

[scott411]

Next time you're in Welly come by and have a perv at our dyno Scott. We take the rear wheel out and drive a huge hydraulic pump. No wheelspin and slippage here!

will have to do that, it wasn't because harleys were to gutless to sping the drum???? :laugh::laugh::laugh:

but you would agree taking one person's dyno and comparing it to yours would not be a fair representation always

[eelracing]

Now we know it's a setup! A poxy old YZ490!!?? :


anyone want to explain why the hp has dropped by 10hp from 2011 - 2012?


Jap snake oil sales have come a long way in the last 30 years.And that uphill sand blast has more real world relevance than any dyno.

In 30 years youd think MX hp would have improved the same amount as roadbikes have by now.Can anyone explain that?
Oh that's right controllable power to the ground is the catchcry of the masses...so lets add valves,cams, chains and other expensive and overweight crap to "slow them down"and be able to be ridden by the average joe.

Shit!! pass the smelling salts next they'll be selling us traction control.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Jap snake oil sales have come a long way in the last 30 years.And that uphill sand blast has more real world relevance than any dyno.

.

Did the 450 have a paddle tyre on it like the 490?

[Crasherfromwayback]

will have to do that, it wasn't because harleys were to gutless to sping the drum???? :laugh::laugh::laugh:

but you would agree taking one person's dyno and comparing it to yours would not be a fair representation always

Some do mate!

Yeah...gotta always compare apples with apples!

[eelracing]

Did the 450 have a paddle tyre on it like the 490?

Could'nt tell ya Pete but it's fat ass still dug in and lost power...hence the downchange.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Could'nt tell ya Pete but it's fat ass still dug in and lost power...hence the downchange.

Yeah he certainly got a bit bogged down there for a while.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Shit!! pass the smelling salts next they'll be selling us traction control.

Think this might be a bit of you mate...

http://www.bikeexif.com/honda-cr500

[scott411]

Jap snake oil sales have come a long way in the last 30 years.And that uphill sand blast has more real world relevance than any dyno.

In 30 years youd think MX hp would have improved the same amount as roadbikes have by now.Can anyone explain that?
Oh that's right controllable power to the ground is the catchcry of the masses...so lets add valves,cams, chains and other expensive and overweight crap to "slow them down"and be able to be ridden by the average joe.

Shit!! pass the smelling salts next they'll be selling us traction control.

there has been passive traction control in dirtbikes since the late 90's, built into the cdi, throttle postion sensors started out on 2 strokes around the same time

the reason we have not had massive power increases in dirtbikes is because of traction, we only have so much, I love 2 strokes as much as the next guy, but around a mx track the fourstrokes are faster, deal with it,

[Crasherfromwayback]

, I love 2 strokes as much as the next guy, but around a mx track the fourstrokes are faster, deal with it,

And I love 'em even more. But I'm with you there. Don't see too many smokers lining up for GP's these days. And I'm sure they're still allowed ain't they?

[scott411]

yep they are still allowed, a US guy qualified for a national on a YZ250 last year at washougal, it blew up in the first moto,

the CC gap should be changed IMO, but you would not see any 2 strokes in teh big class, but a few in the 250 class, i still think a full factory 250F would win tho

[eelracing]

Think this might be a bit of you mate...

Hell yeah!




but around a mx track the fourstrokes are faster, deal with it,

Fuck off they are,stop hiding your head in the sand and wake up.The day a privateer can turn up and race a world championship on a two stroke cc for cc with a four strokes will be the day I will be over it.

Until then and factory involvement ceases to write the rulebooks of so called championships I aint buying it.

[scott411]

Hell yeah!





Fuck off they are,stop hiding your head in the sand and wake up.The day a privateer can turn up and race a world championship on a two stroke cc for cc with a four strokes will be the day I will be over it.

Until then and factory involvement ceases to write the rulebooks of so called championships I aint buying it.

IN NZ, since the 250 class has been all in (07), there has only been one champ on a 2 stroke, and thats DK, because everyone else is faster for 20 minutes on a 250F, 95% of people are faster on a 250f than a 250 2t, you have to be twice as fit to ride a 2t, DK does not win because he has more hp, he wins cause hes fitter and more focused than anyone else in the class, everyone races very stock bikes in NZ, with a few bolt on mods,

when was the last time you raced a natioanl level MX?

you want to know why the japenese stopped making and selling 2 strokes, because they 4 strokes out sold them 10 to 1, and they still do

[scott411]

and, teh last 2 stroke to win the 500 GP class was only 360cc (shayne king 1996) big bore 2 strokes do not make the power spread you need to be fast around a modern motocross track,

[Jay GTI]

DK does not win because he has more hp, he wins cause hes fitter and more focused than anyone else in the class, everyone races very stock bikes in NZ, with a few bolt on mods,



Yep even DK has freely admitted that he would be faster on a 4T on a lot of the tracks, but conceeds that occasionally, when the conditions are right, the 2T is better. But he has said he wins because he has race experience and stamina well beyond most of his competition and that is what gives him the advantage, not the bike.

[eelracing]

IN NZ, since the 250 class has been all in (07), there has only been one champ on a 2 stroke, and thats DK, because everyone else is faster for 20 minutes on a 250F, 95% of people are faster on a 250f than a 250 2t, you have to be twice as fit to ride a 2t, DK does not win because he has more hp, he wins cause hes fitter and more focused than anyone else in the class, everyone races very stock bikes in NZ, with a few bolt on mods,

Thanks for that

you want to know why the japenese stopped making and selling 2 strokes, because they 4 strokes out sold them 10 to 1, and they still do

No the japs stopped developing them...hell Honda Kawasaki and Suzuki don't even sell them anymore...but you already know that.



and, teh last 2 stroke to win the 500 GP class was only 360cc (shayne king 1996) big bore 2 strokes do not make the power spread you need to be fast around a modern motocross track,

And if I remember correctly the 500 class was not even considered the "Blue Riband" class by then.In fact the 250 class was the more important one at that time.And please remember 4 strokes were'nt banned then either.

[jasonu]

This guy is pretty handy on his YZ490 too!! It's well worth watching the clip...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lmb2k-qGQ8Y&feature=related

Real men, nice clip.

[Jay GTI]

No the japs stopped developing them...hell Honda Kawasaki and Suzuki don't even sell them anymore...but you already know that.


The "why" can be debated until the moon crashes into the sun, I've heard all sorts of reasons, from manufacturers worried that world-wide emmissions regulations would kill the sport and 4Ts were seen as more green, to it being a conspiracy by Honda, who successfully lobbied the various MX governing bodies for the 125 2T/250 4T and 250 2T/450 4T class regs because they didn't own any of the important 2T patents and knew the odds were stacked against the smokers. Add that to the fact marketing departments of all the big manufacturers were suddenly screaming at you that your 2T was seriously uncool and the fast guys all rode 4Ts...

Regardless, there is no one reason for the 2T demise from top level MX.

[F5 Dave]

The real reason, that despite thier inbreed culture to favour the 4T over the 2T, Honda could & have built some of the best 2T engines.

Unfortunately they are seriously Evil.

and Ghey, obviously.

[Crasherfromwayback]

I think anyone that's owned and loved two strokes would like to see them survive and make a comeback. It'd just be unwise to hold your breath.

[Crasherfromwayback]

And if I remember correctly the 500 class was not even considered the "Blue Riband" class by then.In fact the 250 class was the more important one at that time.And please remember 4 strokes were'nt banned then either.

Just like you need to remember that a guy can rock up to a open class GP on his 500 smoker if he wants. But he won't win.

[Jay GTI]

I think anyone that's owned and loved two strokes would like to see them survive and make a comeback. It'd just be unwise to hold your breath.

I have to say that even though I'm a 4T convert, there is a small part of my brain (the part that makes me do naughty things) that misses the slightly unhinged way my old RM made power. More hassle than it was worth for 99% of the time, cos I can't ride very well, but just every now and then I'd snap open the throttle and... well it was enough that I kept the bike for 2 1/2 years, despite it putting me in hospital twice.

But no, I won't be holding my breath. My breast, yes, but my breath no... (damn man-boobs, I need to stop eating so much).

[eelracing]

Add that to the fact marketing departments of all the big manufacturers were suddenly screaming at you that your 2T was seriously uncool and the fast guys all rode 4Ts...

Marketing and snake oil mean the same thing in my book.Those self same company drones just wan't to sell you (expensive)bullshit.

Those fast guys race 4Ts because they are payed to,and winning sells motorcycles.Unfortunately average joe is paying for it in his pocket with having to have the latest and greatest...there's a shit load of overpriced second hand 4ts that nobody want's out there at the mo.

It's just sad that as MX sales go increasingly down the gurgler the two stroke is being ignored by the very companies that they built up.
With todays tech and the equivalent 4T development a smoker would of been value for money,relatively cheap to maintain and still kick a 4Ts arse around a race track.

But theres no resale/parts raping money to be made in that.

[eelracing]

Just like you need to remember that a guy can rock up to a open class GP on his 500 smoker if he wants. But he won't win.

But that's my point Crasher,you can't it has to be a 250 2T.

And despite the fact we hav'nt seen one for nigh over 10 years now an equivalent 2T has a bucketload more torque than a 4T.All it requires is where you want that torque,todays technology can put it where its needed and you don't need cams,valves and related expense to do it.

[Pornstar]

Same goes for jet skis i reckon, i used have a 750 2t twin cyl that was basic easy to work on and effective, these days they'e huge boats with turbo 4ts, yes they're faster, but I wouldnt want to try and work on one. I'm a bit of a pureist i guess. to me a 125 2t is the purest form of off road fun, no valves, cams, efi/oxygen sensors, just a powerful little engine in a lightwieght frame.

[Crasherfromwayback]

But that's my point Crasher,you can't it has to be a 250 2T.

And despite the fact we hav'nt seen one for nigh over 10 years now an equivalent 2T has a bucketload more torque than a 4T.All it requires is where you want that torque,todays technology can put it where its needed and you don't need cams,valves and related expense to do it.

That's poos then. You should be allowed to run a 500 smoker against a 450 in the world moto-x circus if you want.

And depsite me preferring to ride a 450 compared to a 500 smoker, THE most fun/best experience I've EVER had racing a motorcycle was an RS250 GP bike. Something I'll never forget.

[eelracing]

I'm a bit of a pureist i guess. to me a 125 2t is the purest form of off road fun, no valves, cams, efi/oxygen sensors, just a powerful little engine in a lightwieght frame.

Hell it sounds like a privateers dream...oh yeah it used to be.





THE most fun/best experience I've EVER had racing a motorcycle was an RS250 GP bike. Something I'll never forget.

Same here,altho I did'nt race it just a couple of memorable sessions on a 94 TZ250 that blew my socks off.My gixxer today feels like an overweight slug in comparison.

[Jay GTI]

I think this is the best summation of equal capacity 2T vs 4T, as lack of development from other manufacturers makes this too difficult to compare otherwise.

http://motocrossactionmag.com/Main/News/TWOSTROKE-VERSUS-FOURSTROKE-2012-KTM-250SXF-VS-201-8417.aspx

But despite what they conclude overall, I know I'd be faster on a 250 4T.... but then I'd also probably be faster on a 125 2T than a 250 2T, due to previously mentioned talent deficit meaning essentially the easier it is to ride, the faster I'll be.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Same here,altho I did'nt race it just a couple of memorable sessions on a 94 TZ250 that blew my socks off.My gixxer today feels like an overweight slug in comparison.

Unreal eh. I'd give my left nut to ride an NSR500 etc...

[Pornstar]

I was just reading an article about Loris Capriosi's honda ns 125, it reached a top speed of 225kph, WTF.

[Pornstar]

Oh yea, ive just put an FMF gnarly to my exc 250, sounds fookin ace.

[Crasherfromwayback]

I was just reading an article about Loris Capriosi's honda ns 125, it reached a top speed of 225kph, WTF.

And I think a certain young Mr Rossi managed to squeeze 249kph out of his Aprilia one time?

[Pornstar]

thats nuts aye, espesially when you concider the size of that little piston/s.

[Crasherfromwayback]

thats nuts aye, espesially when you concider the size of that little piston/s.

Sure is. Having seen the 250's scream by at around 300 a few times...it's a sound I'll miss for sure.

[Pornstar]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=doLDgX5f3Qg
you tubes the best

[Pornstar]

Oh dear, listen to his comments and the end of vid. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=6nmmh67R6_E

[Crasherfromwayback]

Says it all really I guess...

[Pornstar]

Says it all really I guess...yea, unbelievable what he said about being tapped out down a straight and feeling slow.

[t595]

yea, unbelievable what he said about being tapped out down a straight and feeling slow.

Cant really compare an old yz250 with his mega $$$ factory 450 tho.... be something seriously wrong if the 250 felt just as fast.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Cant really compare an old yz250 with his mega $$$ factory 450 tho.... be something seriously wrong if the 250 felt just as fast.

Can't actually compare any 250 stroker to a 450 mate.

[raglanash]

You nutbars will like this. http://www.bikeexif.com/honda-cr500#ixzz1l5TQCsls
Licence wouldn't last long I recon

[SMOKEU]

Can't actually compare any 250 stroker to a 450 mate.

I thought top end power was similar.

[Crasherfromwayback]

I thought top end power was similar.

Not even close.

[Jay GTI]

Not even close.

The '12 Kato 250SX makes approx 50hp peak, the '12 450SX-F makes approx. 53hp peak, so they aren't miles from each other.

But generally, it's around the 50 mark for 250 2Ts, around the 55 mark for 450 4Ts, give or take a model year or two.

[Crasherfromwayback]

The '12 Kato 250SX makes approx 50hp peak, the '12 450SX-F makes approx. 53hp peak, so they aren't miles from each other.

But generally, it's around the 50 mark for 250 2Ts, around the 55 mark for 450 4Ts, give or take a model year or two.

Maybe so...but the numbers are kind to the 250 in the way they feel. As JS said...you think you're flying on the 250, but you're not.

A 450 tapped in the dirt is a near terrifying thing to be on.

[motor_mayhem]

I think with the 2t / 4t debate there are a couple of important points re which is faster

Assuming you're not just wanting to be a straight line warrior..

1. As the weight goes over a point it becomes much less manageable no matter how much more power you're getting.

2. As the engine gets bigger it requires a bigger frame to accommodate it which can also make it harder to ride.


For the 2T fans, IMO the 450 is round about optimum size for 4T for a pro racer (probably closer to 350 for an amateur), being as much power as possible without a weight that's too hard to handle, what would the optimum size cc 2T be (existing measures or otherwise)?

[ktm84mxc]

At the height of the 500 MX GP's in the mid 80's a factory 500 would make 65+ horse power , very few riders were capable of riding these monsters to there limits, Joel Smets 570 KTM wud produce similar power same prob not many could ride it esp a 40 min moto.

[Crasherfromwayback]

esp a 40 min moto.

I can't ride any dirtbike for 40 mins!

[ktm84mxc]

Yes Crasher the term Rock Ape cud apply to the riders of those mighty 500's , the likes of Caroli etc wud just be a flag hanging on to one. Bobrashev and a few of the Belgium riders wud b of similar build to those Gp heroes.
Carlquist was the ultimate rock ape he just beat the bike and track into submission.

[Jay GTI]

Yes Crasher the term Rock Ape cud apply to the riders of those mighty 500's , the likes of Caroli etc wud just be a flag hanging on to one. Bobrashev and a few of the Belgium riders wud b of similar build to those Gp heroes.
Carlquist was the ultimate rock ape he just beat the bike and track into submission.

I remember reading and hearing stories about the huge rocks and crap that the old 500s would chew up and spit out over any poor sap silly enough to follow one closely. Apparently racing them was as much as about being able to handle being beaten up by the roost of the guy in front as much as handling the bike...

[green machine]

Since the topic is horsepower,do you think this one would smoke a 450?,hahahahaha256539

[Pornstar]

I remember reading and hearing stories about the huge rocks and crap that the old 500s would chew up and spit out over any poor sap silly enough to follow one closely. Apparently racing them was as much as about being able to handle being beaten up by the roost of the guy in front as much as handling the bike...I have experianced this to a degree, years ago circa 1990 a cr 500 went flying past me on a trail ride,, the rock it launched at me hit my scott lexan lens goggles and smacked the bridge of my nose hard, lexans pretty tough stuff. Respek

[Pornstar]

Since the topic is horsepower,do you think this one would smoke a 450?,hahahahaha256539
Who? and Why?, really.

[green machine]

Who? and Why?, really.
I don't know,found it on another site.....come on Pornstar where's ya sense of humour.....i thought it was a bit of a laugh...

[Pornstar]

I don't know,found it on another site.....come on Pornstar where's ya sense of humour.....i thought it was a bit of a laugh...It is easily the best horse Ive ever seen.

[Stylo]

It is easily the best horse Ive ever seen.

Agreed, but is that the before or after shot ?

This thread is all about Horsepower , No ?

[Jay GTI]

This thread is all about Horsepower , No ?

That horse has more powers than you can ever imagine....

[flyingcr250]

That horse has more powers than you can ever imagine....

That horse was the best thing to happen to this thread. :laugh:

[t595]

Since the topic is horsepower,do you think this one would smoke a 450?,hahahahaha256539

I heard suzuki gave the rmz a fresh new look for 2012. Wonder who will follow suit?

[Stylo]

Hang on to your hat ...




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gX9BgU2U4GI&feature=related

[CHOPPA]

I remember reading and hearing stories about the huge rocks and crap that the old 500s would chew up and spit out over any poor sap silly enough to follow one closely. Apparently racing them was as much as about being able to handle being beaten up by the roost of the guy in front as much as handling the bike...

Haha I remember the roost that used to come off Richard Adamsons 'factory' honda xr650 haha fuck that used to hurt on tracks like patetonga and whangarei caves tracks

[scott411]

Haha I remember the roost that used to come off Richard Adamsons 'factory' honda xr650 haha fuck that used to hurt on tracks like patetonga and whangarei caves tracks

riding in teh open class at patetonga even against 450's hurts like nothing else, i only ever raced 125's at waipu but remember it being pretty bad as well,

[CHOPPA]

riding in teh open class at patetonga even against 450's hurts like nothing else, i only ever raced 125's at waipu but remember it being pretty bad as well,

Yeah its crazy its like riding flat out into a hail of paint ball fire! My arms and neck would be littered with bruises and welts but if you wanted to pass there was no other way

[Crasherfromwayback]

Yeah its crazy its like riding flat out into a hail of paint ball fire! My arms and neck would be littered with bruises and welts but if you wanted to pass there was no other way

I did Hare scramble years ago in Waitarere Forest on my KX500. Through the tight sections and trees the lil bikes got away on me, but come the open sections which were gravel roads I got some serious payback! No one wanted to come near me. :Punk:

[Pornstar]

riding in teh open class at patetonga even against 450's hurts like nothing else, i only ever raced 125's at waipu but remember it being pretty bad as well,Was that Waipu cave? and the start was right next to the cave entrance? mint area.

[CHOPPA]

Was that Waipu cave? and the start was right next to the cave entrance? mint area.

Yup thats the one

[Pornstar]

Ahh, I raced there once in 97, nearly missed my race after following some tourists into the cave and at the end they all turned thier lights off to look at the glow worms, meaning me and my mate had to wait in the pitch with them.:pinch:

[CHOPPA]

Ahh, I raced there once in 97, nearly missed my race after following some tourists into the cave and at the end they all turned thier lights off to look at the glow worms, meaning me and my mate had to wait in the pitch with them.:pinch:

haha yeah I was a pretty young fella back then so we would all be scampering around in the caves. What event were you at? We were at every major event there from 96 to 03

[Stylo]

I did Hare scramble years ago in Waitarere Forest on my KX500. Through the tight sections and trees the lil bikes got away on me, but come the open sections which were gravel roads I got some serious payback! No one wanted to come near me. :Punk:

Been there mate, good that the KX500's are super stable on the gravel and the fast top gear sections ( Baja 9 years in a row ? ), but not so good in the tight stuff but still a lot of fun. Must admit the standard gearing on a KX5 leaves the clutch groaning a few times going up some of the techcnical stuff in a taller gear which is why I always change the gearbox oil after every 4 - 5 hours to keep the clutch fresh and I've never had a problem.


You might see my '04 Bike on trademe soon , still a puppy at 45 hours only, don't use it much anymore ...

[CHOPPA]

Been there mate, good that the KX500's are super stable on the gravel and the fast top gear sections ( Baja 9 years in a row ? ), but not so good in the tight stuff but still a lot of fun. Must admit the standard gearing on a KX5 leaves the clutch groaning a few times going up some of the techcnical stuff in a taller gear which is why I always change the gearbox oil after every 4 - 5 hours to keep the clutch fresh and I've never had a problem.


You might see my '04 Bike on trademe soon , still a puppy at 45 hours only, don't use it much anymore ...

You have a CR5 as well dont you? I tried doing woodhill on my kx5 fuck that was a nightmare. It had warped steels so the clutch wouldnt fully disengage, it was a mission! I pulled the pin when I tried to wheely over a log popped the clutch and the back wheel just sunk into the earth so it was basically stood straight up, it pissed fuel all over my balls because the cap had fallen off due to someone else topping it up. I sold it after that ride haha

[scott411]

Been there mate, good that the KX500's are super stable on the gravel and the fast top gear sections ( Baja 9 years in a row ? ), but not so good in the tight stuff but still a lot of fun. Must admit the standard gearing on a KX5 leaves the clutch groaning a few times going up some of the techcnical stuff in a taller gear which is why I always change the gearbox oil after every 4 - 5 hours to keep the clutch fresh and I've never had a problem.


You might see my '04 Bike on trademe soon , still a puppy at 45 hours only, don't use it much anymore ...

shows how awesomely fit Darren Capill was in 96 to lead the tarawera 100 for 99.5 miles, only to run out of gas within 100 metres of the finish line,

[Pornstar]

haha yeah I was a pretty young fella back then so we would all be scampering around in the caves. What event were you at? We were at every major event there from 96 to 03was some series round i think, was towards the end of 97, i remember the long kick ass up hill drag section.

[Stylo]

You have a CR5 as well dont you? I tried doing woodhill on my kx5 fuck that was a nightmare. It had warped steels so the clutch wouldnt fully disengage, it was a mission! I pulled the pin when I tried to wheely over a log popped the clutch and the back wheel just sunk into the earth so it was basically stood straight up, it pissed fuel all over my balls because the cap had fallen off due to someone else topping it up. I sold it after that ride haha

Have'nt heard of a clutch problem with the KX like you'rs had , the tight stuff is ok through the woods on the 500 in my experience but they definitely like it when you hit the more open ground and thats when you have a lot more fun, and they start cooling down a little .

Still got the CR5 and still a zero hour Bike, started it up yesterday ...two kicks