NordieBoy
22nd July 2005, 21:46
On the Yahoo Gilera list a while ago Romolo Ciancamerla posted for the first time and I asked him what the reasoning was behind the Nordie...
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Re: [gilera] Reasoning behind the Nordwest
(Romolo Ciancamerla, Tue Nov 23 11:25:07 2004)
Hi Fran
that's the story of Nordwest's development:
We were in the spring of 90, and after finished launching the 90 season line up, me (at the time Frame and Body Development Manager of Gilera) and my boss Federico Martini (Gilera R&D General Manager, arrived since 1 year from Bimota, where he became famous for his YB1) every night, after 20:00 and after finished daily jobs, met together to discuss what to do in the future.
In Martini's office, in front of the bigger hashtray ever made (we both were impressive smokers, at that time!) and under a deep smoking fog, we was discussing the possibility to enlarge the use of our big single; the RC600C project was already been launched, to refresh the lucky image of previous RC and Luciano Marabese (the famous italian designer who signed all the Gileras of that time) already finished the style design (project name was Cobra, because the front face of RC600C remember such snake shape with the two
round eyes and Luciano always liked to find wild animals ispiration for his job!) and RC600C was the only model requested by Marketing Dept.; but Martini was not satisfied and he was pushing to have more chances.
I was recently coming back from a short vacation in Corse Island: there I saw some of the first French Supermotard and immediately I was choked by this idea; so I suggested Federico why not use such idea to prepare a production vehicle on Cobra's base.
I always liked this concept, which in fact Gilera already proposed in the middle 80's (do anyone remember the Fast Bike 125??); but that concept was not well understood by customers, which in that period was preferring or any time more radical race replica or OnOff with ParisDakar smelling; that was in fact Marketing Dept reply, which at first offer of the Nordie idea was quite cool. We replied that Nordie concept was more radical than Fast Bike, with using more "road warrior" idea than Fast Bike and so on; we finally succeded on going on only because we said: "With Nordie will be easy to touch the ground also for a Pigmy!" (well, in fact one of the trouble with RC600 was that if you are Mickael Jordan....OK.....if not better to be equipped with a ladder!!) and after a commitment on a very low investment budget to develop it.
Then we started, according to that "Brief" and:
-All plastics were same as RC600C
-The front squared headlight was already developped because at that time for the French version of RC600 the double headlight was forbidden.......so no investment and new and more suitable face for Nordie!!!!
-Front mud guard taken out by SP02.....oooops! no invest and good image!
-Front Marzocchi UpSide Down fork just longer than Saturno Piuma ( Wohw....we need to pay someting for new triple clamps!!)
-Front caliper: just make a right hand side version of the SP02 Grimeca one (Uffff.......for free.....thanks Grimeca!!!)
-Rear shock: easy........just shorter that Boge's RC600 one an with appropriate setting
-Frame and rear brake system: don't touch........RC600!!!!
-Rear Arm: some minor adjustment versus RC 600 one.......again no invest...hurra!!
-Front and rear Wheels: Uurghh!! We must completely redesign for the 120/60 and 160/60 tyres!!! But Grimeca gave us big discount on investment fee because me and Federico were so enthusiastic in request it that they cannot avoid to bargain!!!
Ladies and Gentlemen......Nordie is served!!!!!!!
Please, do not imagine we was so funny to develop bikes......but understand me, it was hard to succed with that background!
Well, on the bike setting we work hard to achieve the best handling performances from a frame which was conceived for off road (and with that impressive wheel travel!); and due that on the road the sliding driving
which is today used for supermotards is not so suitable, we work hard on geometry and suspension setting to achieve good control but fast cornering; one of the problem was that to give fast reaction to front we had to
countermeasure big tendency to "close the handlebar", technically speaking though understeer at low speed.......finally with appropriate triple clamp offset we reduced it (even if, to be perfect, it should be
improved.......isn't it Nordie riders???? but frame geometry was untouchable, as I told before!!!) to acceptable level.
The image that we was on the good way was given us on the evening, when the testing riders comes in from the daily road testing........even from down the full face helmets you could feel the large smiles they had.....Yeah! another funny day!!!!
It becomes an usual evening matter to discuss how many hypersport bike rider they got frustrated during that day; anyone who rides a Nordie can understand it, I suppose.......Imagine the cornering roads close to Arcore
and around Como lake, imagine 2 vehicles, which was of course masked and so with an orrible aspect, that even after trying to double rotate the throttle of their "so much over 100HP" machine, after couple of corners they could just only hardly see the Nordie's tail light from far (if even flashing, because where they need to put the hardest bracking, Scwantz's style at Hockeneim, the riders of that strange and nasty bike just take out a gear and go) and you may easily understand the frustration of that poor riders!!!!! I guess that Nordie road testing development caused the highest quantity of motorcycle riding retirement than ever, and surely if you go around Como Lake roads, still on the deep of some of its gorges you may find some hyperpowered motorcycle trown away after such shameful caning.
Oops, I forgot to say that the two testing riders, responsible for Nordie road test development, were both of them very good riders on Italian Sport Production races (one of them won the Italian championship on Superbike
class!); that's to complete the picture!!!
So, I hope to have covered your question on Nordie development; In fact RC600C comes first, but if it comes from a pure marketing discussion, Nordie comes out from a flashing idea and it was pushed just from motorcyclist passionated, as all of the Nordie development team were.
If anymore detail you want to know, at next contact!!!.
CIAO
CIANCA
------------------------------------------
I wasn't expecting that much to tell the truth :D
-------------------------------------------------------
Re: [gilera] Reasoning behind the Nordwest
(Romolo Ciancamerla, Tue Nov 23 11:25:07 2004)
Hi Fran
that's the story of Nordwest's development:
We were in the spring of 90, and after finished launching the 90 season line up, me (at the time Frame and Body Development Manager of Gilera) and my boss Federico Martini (Gilera R&D General Manager, arrived since 1 year from Bimota, where he became famous for his YB1) every night, after 20:00 and after finished daily jobs, met together to discuss what to do in the future.
In Martini's office, in front of the bigger hashtray ever made (we both were impressive smokers, at that time!) and under a deep smoking fog, we was discussing the possibility to enlarge the use of our big single; the RC600C project was already been launched, to refresh the lucky image of previous RC and Luciano Marabese (the famous italian designer who signed all the Gileras of that time) already finished the style design (project name was Cobra, because the front face of RC600C remember such snake shape with the two
round eyes and Luciano always liked to find wild animals ispiration for his job!) and RC600C was the only model requested by Marketing Dept.; but Martini was not satisfied and he was pushing to have more chances.
I was recently coming back from a short vacation in Corse Island: there I saw some of the first French Supermotard and immediately I was choked by this idea; so I suggested Federico why not use such idea to prepare a production vehicle on Cobra's base.
I always liked this concept, which in fact Gilera already proposed in the middle 80's (do anyone remember the Fast Bike 125??); but that concept was not well understood by customers, which in that period was preferring or any time more radical race replica or OnOff with ParisDakar smelling; that was in fact Marketing Dept reply, which at first offer of the Nordie idea was quite cool. We replied that Nordie concept was more radical than Fast Bike, with using more "road warrior" idea than Fast Bike and so on; we finally succeded on going on only because we said: "With Nordie will be easy to touch the ground also for a Pigmy!" (well, in fact one of the trouble with RC600 was that if you are Mickael Jordan....OK.....if not better to be equipped with a ladder!!) and after a commitment on a very low investment budget to develop it.
Then we started, according to that "Brief" and:
-All plastics were same as RC600C
-The front squared headlight was already developped because at that time for the French version of RC600 the double headlight was forbidden.......so no investment and new and more suitable face for Nordie!!!!
-Front mud guard taken out by SP02.....oooops! no invest and good image!
-Front Marzocchi UpSide Down fork just longer than Saturno Piuma ( Wohw....we need to pay someting for new triple clamps!!)
-Front caliper: just make a right hand side version of the SP02 Grimeca one (Uffff.......for free.....thanks Grimeca!!!)
-Rear shock: easy........just shorter that Boge's RC600 one an with appropriate setting
-Frame and rear brake system: don't touch........RC600!!!!
-Rear Arm: some minor adjustment versus RC 600 one.......again no invest...hurra!!
-Front and rear Wheels: Uurghh!! We must completely redesign for the 120/60 and 160/60 tyres!!! But Grimeca gave us big discount on investment fee because me and Federico were so enthusiastic in request it that they cannot avoid to bargain!!!
Ladies and Gentlemen......Nordie is served!!!!!!!
Please, do not imagine we was so funny to develop bikes......but understand me, it was hard to succed with that background!
Well, on the bike setting we work hard to achieve the best handling performances from a frame which was conceived for off road (and with that impressive wheel travel!); and due that on the road the sliding driving
which is today used for supermotards is not so suitable, we work hard on geometry and suspension setting to achieve good control but fast cornering; one of the problem was that to give fast reaction to front we had to
countermeasure big tendency to "close the handlebar", technically speaking though understeer at low speed.......finally with appropriate triple clamp offset we reduced it (even if, to be perfect, it should be
improved.......isn't it Nordie riders???? but frame geometry was untouchable, as I told before!!!) to acceptable level.
The image that we was on the good way was given us on the evening, when the testing riders comes in from the daily road testing........even from down the full face helmets you could feel the large smiles they had.....Yeah! another funny day!!!!
It becomes an usual evening matter to discuss how many hypersport bike rider they got frustrated during that day; anyone who rides a Nordie can understand it, I suppose.......Imagine the cornering roads close to Arcore
and around Como lake, imagine 2 vehicles, which was of course masked and so with an orrible aspect, that even after trying to double rotate the throttle of their "so much over 100HP" machine, after couple of corners they could just only hardly see the Nordie's tail light from far (if even flashing, because where they need to put the hardest bracking, Scwantz's style at Hockeneim, the riders of that strange and nasty bike just take out a gear and go) and you may easily understand the frustration of that poor riders!!!!! I guess that Nordie road testing development caused the highest quantity of motorcycle riding retirement than ever, and surely if you go around Como Lake roads, still on the deep of some of its gorges you may find some hyperpowered motorcycle trown away after such shameful caning.
Oops, I forgot to say that the two testing riders, responsible for Nordie road test development, were both of them very good riders on Italian Sport Production races (one of them won the Italian championship on Superbike
class!); that's to complete the picture!!!
So, I hope to have covered your question on Nordie development; In fact RC600C comes first, but if it comes from a pure marketing discussion, Nordie comes out from a flashing idea and it was pushed just from motorcyclist passionated, as all of the Nordie development team were.
If anymore detail you want to know, at next contact!!!.
CIAO
CIANCA
------------------------------------------
I wasn't expecting that much to tell the truth :D