So who's going to do it first?

[onearmedbandit]

And by that I mean who's going to get to those two, words fail me, sub-species on 60 Minutes tonight. Honestly, these guys can not be allowed to walk the streets flaunting it like they do. Yes I realise there are worse crimes out there, but I'm ranting about this as it was just on TV. Somehow, something needs to happen to these two guys, not suggesting anything in particular, I'll leave that up to fate. And blaming it on mushies, bullshit. I've done my share (and a few others shares as well) of mushies and those guys weren't on anything other than the euphoric feeling they get when the only two active brain cells they've got create an 'idea'. Sick, just fucking sick. The Chinese guys are just as bad, very scary regarding the footage at the end of the video, filming young girls on the streets.

Time shit like this was dealt with more seriously.

[Waylander]

And by that I mean who's going to get to those two, words fail me, sub-species on 60 Minutes tonight. Honestly, these guys can not be allowed to walk the streets flaunting it like they do. Yes I realise there are worse crimes out there, but I'm ranting about this as it was just on TV. Somehow, something needs to happen to these two guys, not suggesting anything in particular, I'll leave that up to fate. And blaming it on mushies, bullshit. I've done my share (and a few others shares as well) of mushies and those guys weren't on anything other than the euphoric feeling they get when the only two active brain cells they've got create an 'idea'. Sick, just fucking sick. The Chinese guys are just as bad, very scary regarding the footage at the end of the video, filming young girls on the streets.

Time shit like this was dealt with more seriously.
Have it in my head to ride the 30 mins to Huntly with some glue and a lighter of my own. Seen enough of those two dickheads to be able to recognize them on the street so no worries about getting the wrong guys.

Make an example out of them then others will be less inclined to do that shit.

[SixPackBack]

And by that I mean who's going to get to those two, words fail me, sub-species on 60 Minutes tonight. Honestly, these guys can not be allowed to walk the streets flaunting it like they do. Yes I realise there are worse crimes out there, but I'm ranting about this as it was just on TV. Somehow, something needs to happen to these two guys, not suggesting anything in particular, I'll leave that up to fate. And blaming it on mushies, bullshit. I've done my share (and a few others shares as well) of mushies and those guys weren't on anything other than the euphoric feeling they get when the only two active brain cells they've got create an 'idea'. Sick, just fucking sick. The Chinese guys are just as bad, very scary regarding the footage at the end of the video, filming young girls on the streets.

Time shit like this was dealt with more seriously.

pointless post most of us will not have a clue what the fuck your talking about

[bugjuice]

care to enlighten those who just missed it?
is it those kids who set the cat on fire?

[Waylander]

care to enlighten those who just missed it?
is it those kids who set the cat on fire?
Bingo....

10 digits.

[bugjuice]

Bingo....

10 digits.
b-i-ngo b-i-ngo b-i-ngo, and bingo was his flameo

find their tiny testies, and set fire to them. The finish them off.

[Jay widda 150]

petrol and ploy never goes a miss with this kind :yes:

[Hitcher]

Animal abuse is unforgiveable. But vigilante justice achieves nothing and is also unforgiveable. Remember that there are worse crimes being committed against PEOPLE at this very moment in lounge rooms and bedrooms all over New Zealand. You just don't know about those. Yet.

[onearmedbandit]

Animal abuse is unforgiveable. But vigilante justice achieves nothing and is also unforgiveable. Remember that there are worse crimes being committed against PEOPLE at this very moment in lounge rooms and bedrooms all over New Zealand. You just don't know about those. Yet.




Hitcher. I did say in my original post that I do realise there are worse crimes being committed, and while your comment may not have have been directed at me I'm sure everyone else here realises that as well. However, most convicted offenders don't go flaunting themselves in front of the camera and therein lies the main issue, to myself anyway. I of course feel more disgust towards offences against children and women and those in society who are weaker, but most offenders of this nature know their shame. These two think it is some kind of joke.

You may also note that I said this type of shit needs to be take more seriously. For those that did see it (sorry for the referenceless post earlier) you would have seen the link between acts like this and more serious crimes later in life. We don't want these two becoming the guys who may be on the front page of our newspapers charged with murder or rape in the future. It needs to be dealt with now.

Yes your right, vigilante justice does not acheive anything, other than maybe a deterent to those who might consider the same actions. But I know that can not be the answer now, they will be sentenced (lightly no doubt, a point was made that jail looked unlikely) and sent back into society, reformed or (more likely) not.

[Motoracer]

Hitcher. I did say in my original post that I do realise there are worse crimes being committed, and while your comment may not have have been directed at me I'm sure everyone else here realises that as well. However, most convicted offenders don't go flaunting themselves in front of the camera and therein lies the main issue, to myself anyway. I of course feel more disgust towards offences against children and women and those in society who are weaker, but most offenders of this nature know their shame. These two think it is some kind of joke.

You may also note that I said this type of shit needs to be take more seriously. For those that did see it (sorry for the referenceless post earlier) you would have seen the link between acts like this and more serious crimes later in life. We don't want these two becoming the guys who may be on the front page of our newspapers charged with murder or rape in the future. It needs to be dealt with now.

Yes your right, vigilante justice does not acheive anything, other than maybe a deterent to those who might consider the same actions. But I know that can not be the answer now, they will be sentenced (lightly no doubt, a point was made that jail looked unlikely) and sent back into society, reformed or (more likely) not.

Fuken good post man! I'm fully with you on this.

[T.I.E]

Animal abuse is unforgiveable. But vigilante justice achieves nothing and is also unforgiveable. Remember that there are worse crimes being committed against PEOPLE at this very moment in lounge rooms and bedrooms all over New Zealand. You just don't know about those. Yet.

well what we do KNOW is those two idiots are doing what they are doing. and the biggest crime of all is not doing anything about it.
if vigilate justice is the only way to do anything about it, as the law will not then so be it.

excuse me for the ranting but i'd give more of my time and help to any animal, than alot of humans out there.

your not a theif untill you have been caught.
so same for a vigilante

[Hitcher]

I suspect we're in danger of vehemently agreeing with each other...

[SuperDave]

Where's the justice when those two are allowed to carry on as usual? If it takes a member of the public to teach those two a lesson then it's really a shame, as that was the job of the judge. It's bullshit how our Police spend time and money in investigating crimes to bring the perpetrators to court only to have them receive a slap on the hand.

[Teflon]

What i saw was two little boys acting hard.

They will end up in jail. Looking at the size of them, they wont last long.

[Dafe]

Hitcher. I did say in my original post that I do realise there are worse crimes being committed, and while your comment may not have have been directed at me I'm sure everyone else here realises that as well. However, most convicted offenders don't go flaunting themselves in front of the camera and therein lies the main issue, to myself anyway. I of course feel more disgust towards offences against children and women and those in society who are weaker, but most offenders of this nature know their shame. These two think it is some kind of joke.

You may also note that I said this type of shit needs to be take more seriously. For those that did see it (sorry for the referenceless post earlier) you would have seen the link between acts like this and more serious crimes later in life. We don't want these two becoming the guys who may be on the front page of our newspapers charged with murder or rape in the future. It needs to be dealt with now.

Yes your right, vigilante justice does not acheive anything, other than maybe a deterent to those who might consider the same actions. But I know that can not be the answer now, they will be sentenced (lightly no doubt, a point was made that jail looked unlikely) and sent back into society, reformed or (more likely) not.
I struggle to agree with your post. I personally don't care what they do to humans later on in life. After all, humans are responsible for these childrens neglected upbringings, and humans are also responsible for not enforcing strongly enough against such behaviours and against such neglected upbringings.
I am, believe it or not, primarily concerned for the helpless animals that have no idea what torturous things are being done to them and that have no chance for survival when taken by these people.
Personally I'm a person that likes to hear it when a hunter is accidently shot. Because I do not call hunting sport, I call it murder. It's acceptable entertainment in many peoples eyes, but I think it's plain cruelty too.
I would absolutely love to see even odds in the hunting arena. A 50/50 chance of survival on a hunters behalf would be just perfect. Then you have a sport!
Humans have far too much disrespect for animals lives and just because their lives aren't as complex as our own, they're a better option for death? I think thats bullshit.
I agree with livestock for meat and survival etc, but am totally against anything else, e.g. hunting for fun.

And as for those two little wankers, Lucky for them they're not in my neighbourhood.

[scumdog]

Dafe, you need to get a life mate.

When I shoot an animal it's instant lights-out, one minute it's standing there thinking of its next mouthful of grass then BANG, a bullet through the neck or head, drop where they stand, never knew what hit them.

Farmed animals? harrassed and chased into the truck, chased out of the truck, pushed and harrassed up the race, zapped with electric prods (cattle)locked into a clamp, zapped witha gajillion volts then has its throat cut.

Which death do you think is less traumatic??

[Dafe]

Hey Scumdog, I've seen poorly shot aims go pretty horrifically wrong, If every person in the world had your self acclaimed perfect shot, then for sure this wouldn't happen. I was at Taylor Prestons Slaughter House just last week, the bolts they used there are as instant as your bullet will ever get!
They're positioned exactly right to provide an instant death, just like your every aimed shot.
By the way, I have a 300 metre range Military Marksmanship rating, I've fired a shot or two in my time. Your accuracy sounds well above any league I've ever come across.
Also, I'm not gonna suggest you get a life, because I don't know what you do day in day out, but your obviously a better man than me though.

And to answer your question: It wasn't the goat that had a side of its stomach and guts blown out.

[scumdog]

Hey Scumdog, I've seen poorly shot aims go pretty horrifically wrong, If every person in the world had your self acclaimed perfect shot, then for sure this wouldn't happen. I was at Taylor Prestons Slaughter House just last week, the bolts they used there are as instant as your bullet will ever get!
They're positioned exactly right to provide an instant death, just like your every aimed shot.
By the way, I have a 300 metre range Military Marksmanship rating, I've fired a shot or time in my time. Your accuracy sounds well above any league I've ever come across.
Also, I'm not gonna suggest you get a life, because I don't know what you do day in day out. You're obviously a better man than me though.

Not skiting but did 24 years in the freezing works industry, those supposed "humane killers" are not exactly that when a cow moves its head at the last second and gets it through the eye - or a bull with an extra thick skull takes 5 or 6 hits before going down.
Theres more but I hope I've made my point.
BTW most animals I shoot are less than 100 yards away so a miss is pretty rare and can''t recall losing a wounded animal - and it's been a loooong time since I had to use a second shot..

And I'm certainly not in the same league as these two pathetic excuses for a human.

[gamgee]

i like the kiss of the dragon style, fly kick a snooker ball into each of there foreheads!

[Dafe]

No problem mate, I don't call 24 years in a freezing works - Skiting.

I ain't got anything against you at all. Just intrigues me off when people tell me to get a life and they know nothing of me.

[scumdog]

No problem mate, I don't call 24 years in a freezing works - Skiting.

I ain't got anything against you at all. Just intrigues me off when people tell me to get a life and they know nothing of me.

Yeah, sorry mate, probably wrong expression, meant to indicate to you that hunting is not about cruelty (well not for me) and also have had a few run ins with anti-hunting types telling me how evil it was to hunt - while filling their face with KFC and Maccas burgers.

Peace.

[Jay widda 150]

a happy ending was all that was needed. and here ladies and gents we have one :clap:

on ya guys but can someone tell me where i can go small bore rifling in welly? any clubs? i could never kill an animal but clay targets better be careful

[Dafe]

Sure, Check out the link: http://www.wcsrc.wellington.net.nz/

I only have an air rifle now, A few cans have been known to get a hammering now and then.

[rfc85]

I did not watch the program but saw the story on the news when they were caught, this are sick people, and I agree with a lot of what has been said here ,but in the end its the justice system that will give them a smack on the hand ie community service or some such bullshit. We need to look at the way "justice" is delivered in this country-fuckem put them on a chain gang in orange overalls for 6 months and see how happy the little fucks are then

[Dafe]

Sounds like a good idea, Only 6 months going 24 months I reackon.

[magnum]

dont tell me those little cunts got away with what they did to that cat? :mad:

[Ms Piggy]

And by that I mean who's going to get to those two, words fail me, sub-species on 60 Minutes tonight. Honestly, these guys can not be allowed to walk the streets flaunting it like they do. Yes I realise there are worse crimes out there, but I'm ranting about this as it was just on TV. Somehow, something needs to happen to these two guys, not suggesting anything in particular, I'll leave that up to fate. And blaming it on mushies, bullshit. I've done my share (and a few others shares as well) of mushies and those guys weren't on anything other than the euphoric feeling they get when the only two active brain cells they've got create an 'idea'. Sick, just fucking sick. The Chinese guys are just as bad, very scary regarding the footage at the end of the video, filming young girls on the streets.

Time shit like this was dealt with more seriously.
It was pretty disturbing stuff alright! :oi-grr: :oi-grr: :oi-grr: Bob Kerridge (the head of the SPCA) has been trying to get tougher convictions for these sorts of crimes for years. I had to turn down the volume when they played the security tape. I think the part I found most disturbing was that the boy they interviewed, of having killed the cats, had no remorse.

I did find it interesting that o/s they somethime use animal welfare agencies in association with justice & social service agencies to check out house holds. B/c of course there is a link between people who are cruel to animals and commit violent crime.

[Lou Girardin]

It's significant that Nigel Latta was sickened by what he saw. He's dealt with most of the worst examples of humanity we've produced in NZ in the last few years.
As for Hitchers implication that cruelty to animals is not as bad as it is to humans, the fact is that most serial killers started practicing on animals. There is a direct link between boths types of psycopathic behaviour.
I, for one, would be pleased to see those two sub-humans subject to some vigilante justice. Kneecapping for a start, keep them from moving around. Maybe a swim in the Waikato.

[Drunken Monkey]

...I ain't got anything against you at all. Just intrigues me off when people tell me to get a life and they know nothing of me.

It intrigues you that people make a judgemental statement about you after you make a judgemental statement about people that hunt?
That's intriguing.

[Lias]

Personally I fail to see what the hell the fuss is about.

Should they have killed the cats? No.. But they are only cats.. If it was HUMAN BEING's they'd done it to I could understand all the angst, but it was only a stupid animal.

To my mind what they did is no different from little kids burning ants with a magnifying glasses, or pulling the wings off butterflies..

[ManDownUnder]

Something good did come of it though - it gave me a chance to sit with my 5 1/2 year old little man and talk about what they were doing to animals (we flicked channels and missed the graphic bits - I assume they were aired)...

And funnily enough the whole "but Dad - you shoot animals sometimes" came up and it gave me a chance to talk through the hunter's ethic, clean kill, respect for the animal, only take what you need to (for meat, or for pest control)... etc.

Was actually a bloody good night because of that.

As for the little critters on the TV (the human ones, not the innocents), they deserve a punishment they won't enjoy, the people filming deserve exactly the same, and the idiots buying copies of it deserve exactly the same. They're all all indulging in the same crime either directly or by proxy, and it's nauseating.
I'm not a fan of vigilante justice - I think scumdog summed it up well in his first post on the subject, but I AM a fan of effective punishment. If those caught and proven guilty are not permanent residents I suggest this activity would make their applications extremely difficult - like IMPOSSIBLE

[Lou Girardin]

Personally I fail to see what the hell the fuss is about.

Should they have killed the cats? No.. But they are only cats.. If it was HUMAN BEING's they'd done it to I could understand all the angst, but it was only a stupid animal.

To my mind what they did is no different from little kids burning ants with a magnifying glasses, or pulling the wings off butterflies..

This better be a piss take or you're not much better than them.

[ManDownUnder]

This better be a piss take or you're not much better than them.

Agreed....

[onearmedbandit]

This better be a piss take or you're not much better than them.

Also agreed.

[ManDownUnder]

Personally I fail to see what the hell the fuss is about.

Should they have killed the cats? No.. But they are only cats.. If it was HUMAN BEING's they'd done it to I could understand all the angst, but it was only a stupid animal.

To my mind what they did is no different from little kids burning ants with a magnifying glasses, or pulling the wings off butterflies..

Actually - tell you what. I don't understand why you think like that (unless it were just a piss take). Help me out on this one... 'coz I really can't relate to it.

[Drunken Monkey]

He does, in a slightly unorthodox manner, raise an important question - where do you draw the line?

How do you define that its ok to stomp on spiders in the bathroom, but not kittens?

Most of us make a fairly quick and subconscious judgement on where to draw the line. It's not uncommon to find people who won't even kill insects. Does this make them better humans than others?

[ManDownUnder]

He does, in a slightly unorthodox manner, raise an important question - where do you draw the line?

How do you define that its ok to stomp on spiders in the bathroom, but not kittens?

Most of us make a fairly quick and subconscious judgement on where to draw the line. It's not uncommon to find people who won't even kill insects. Does this make them better humans than others?

For me it's all about a humane kill, and the necessity of the kill (for meat or pest control).

If it's done to injure or simply inflict pain on the animal then it's no go (and that includes singeing ants and pulling wings off butterflies).

If it's quick and painless and necessary then all fine with me

MDU

[Lias]

It's not a piss take.

Why is squishing a cockroach, or pouring salt on a slug acceptable, but burning cats isnt? There is no good reason other than the fact that western society declares that cats are "more worthy" than slugs.

Sure the cats suffered, but when it all comes down to it, it's only a bloody cat. It doesnt freaking matter that it suffered. Yet some of you people are advocating beating the crap out of human beings because of it.. You going to go beat the crap out of any koreans who like to eat cat next?

To my mind, unless you are all raving vegans, your just being hypocrites by saying its okay to kill one kind of animal and not another.

[Lias]

If it's done to injure or simply inflict pain on the animal then it's no go (and that includes singeing ants and pulling wings off butterflies).

How about hunting for sport (not meat)

Shall we send all the trophy hunters to jail?

[Eurygnomes]

where do you draw the line?How do you define that its ok to stomp on spiders in the bathroom, but not kittens?

Well, it figures in the same way as hunting for pest control doesn't it? I mean, to some, spiders/cockroaches et al are pests. Consequently, one heel of one shoe will put an end to their lives. I'm of that camp (mainly because I can't handle the idea that after releasing them, they'll have clung to the inside of the jar and crawl up my arm ...argh!!) personally.

I've also had to put down kittens (humanely, using drugs) because they've been unwanted, or their owners are unable to take them back to the UK because of the expense. Does that make ME (delivering the drugs) or THEM (shouldn't have kept the cat/kitten) bad peoples? And what about when you see a cat run over (squished back) but not dead...I feel an obligation to kill it then.

On the other hand, burning ants/pulling wings off butterflies (or any other flighted living critter) is pretty much one of the signs of a mind that's developing into one similar to the psychological profile of a serial killer. Or at least, that's what forensic anthropology/psychology teaches us. And despite having killed small fluffy innocent cats & dogs, I dont' consider myself on the path to murder.

Unless we're talkign mother-in-laws here! :) (jk)

So are these two BOTH the same though? Is one leading the other astray? Does one need more 'rehabilitation' than the other? Methinks this is highly likely. Sociopaths don't tend to socialise/congregate...do they? So perhaps peer pressure is a factor in at least one of these lads problems. The other...well...I think increased surveillance on him, his area (how many have pets/small children go missing) and his future development wouldn't go amiss. Probably cost too much though...

[Lias]

This video may be educational for some of you.

*edit* Attached video instead of link

[ManDownUnder]

It's not a piss take.

Why is squishing a cockroach, or pouring salt on a slug acceptable, but burning cats isnt? There is no good reason other than the fact that western society declares that cats are "more worthy" than slugs.

Sure the cats suffered, but when it all comes down to it, it's only a bloody cat. It doesnt freaking matter that it suffered. Yet some of you people are advocating beating the crap out of human beings because of it.. You going to go beat the crap out of any koreans who like to eat cat next?

To my mind, unless you are all raving vegans, your just being hypocrites by saying its okay to kill one kind of animal and not another.

Fair enough.

Squishing a coachroach is fine with me - kill it quick, because it's a pest.

Pouring salt on a slug is just chidish. Why do that inslead of squishing it. The same result but SLOWER... The obvious thought is that it's to inflict pain, at which point I ask the question - WHY?

People who get their jollies doing that won't like me as company.

Hurting cats before they die... pointless. From the cat's perspective it's unnecessary pain before lights out. Sure it's dead in the end, but to go out of your way to inflict pain is pshychopathic.

Korean's eating cat is fine with me. Kill 'em cleanly, treat 'em well and cook 'em - no worries here.

My concern is with the comment "it does't freaking matter that it suffered".

Why not? If suffering doesn't matter, why would you mind if I stole things from you (suffering economically), harrassed you (suffered mentally/emotionally) or just stubbed out ciggies on your arm?

It doesn't matter surely?

[ManDownUnder]

This video may be educational for some of you. (Website is NSFW!)

http://www.stilemedia.com/?v=kitty.wmv

broken link... can you load the vid onto the site?

[Lias]

Why not? If suffering doesn't matter, why would you mind if I stole things from you (suffering economically), harrassed you (suffered mentally/emotionally) or just stubbed out ciggies on your arm?

It doesn't matter surely?

Do you worry about a potatoes suffering when you peel its skin off? Of course not, its just a potatoe.

I feel the same way about animals.. If it's not a sentient human being, its feelings are irrelevant. As long as it doesn't harm any humans, I could really care less how they use the cats for entertainment. If they burnt the cats, buttraped the cats after wrapping em in ducttape, or sat there an rubbed them till they purred, all they are doing is using a natural resource for their enjoyment..

Would I run out and burn some cats like that? No, because I wouldnt get any enjoyment out of it.. But if others enjoy it, then what the helll.. ITS ONLY A CAT..

[Beemer]

Sure the cats suffered, but when it all comes down to it, it's only a bloody cat. It doesnt freaking matter that it suffered. Yet some of you people are advocating beating the crap out of human beings because of it...

You are a sick prick and if you truly feel this way, you should fuck off and not become involved in this thread. The person who started it was unhappy about the lack of remorse and the lack of punishment for the culprits and you're obviously not an animal lover so your comments aren't helping.

I think it was someone from the SPCA who said once that the people who scared him the most were those who were indifferent to animals. He said if they have strong feelings one way or another - whether it is hate or love - that is normal, but the worst cases of torture have usually been carried out by those who are indifferent to animals. Basically, they don't care what happens to them and will not intervene if they see them being tortured and will often join in without any thought of the consequences.

Cats and dogs have been domesticated animals for centuries and you can't compare them to slugs and spiders. That kind of reasoning is like condoning bullying "because they're only kids, they don't mean it". Yes, they do! Normal kids don't go around kicking kittens to death or strangling them, they may pull their tail or chase them, but they do it out of a misguided sense of "kitty wants to play" and not "I want to hurt kitty".

I hope someone does beat the crap out of these kids because next time it won't be a cat they torture, it will be a human. But on the other hand, if the 'human' they torture happens to be YOU, well, I say let them go for it. Tosser!

[ManDownUnder]

This video may be educational for some of you.

*edit* Attached video instead of link

How did they kill that kitten?

The main problems I have with that video are the emotive manner in which it's put together (cute kittens, opening shot, kitten dying and having it's head roughly hacked off while it's legs are still thrashing, all to the sound of Bohemian Rhapsody)

It should be a single clean kill (not two shots or shocks whatever the hell it was) and head removed with a single stroke - clever style.

Cleaning cooking and serving the thing isn't something I'd like to be involved in either personally, but that's because I see cats as lap wrmers, not food.

LiasTZ - How did they kill it?
MDU

[skidz]

What i saw was two little boys acting hard.

They will end up in jail. Looking at the size of them, they wont last long.
Nah! they'll be someones little pussy inside and it'll be a different sort of sticky stuff they'll get.

[Lias]

Anyone who advocates violence against people because of an animal is the sick fuck.

[ManDownUnder]

Do you worry about a potatoes suffering when you peel its skin off? Of course not, its just a potatoe.

I feel the same way about animals.. If it's not a sentient human being, its feelings are irrelevant. As long as it doesn't harm any humans, I could really care less how they use the cats for entertainment. If they burnt the cats, buttraped the cats after wrapping em in ducttape, or sat there an rubbed them till they purred, all they are doing is using a natural resource for their enjoyment..

Would I run out and burn some cats like that? No, because I wouldnt get any enjoyment out of it.. But if others enjoy it, then what the helll.. ITS ONLY A CAT..

ok - that's answered all the questions I have, except the one asking how they killed the cat. I can't agree with anything you say there. I have to admit I was educated - but I learned more about you than what's going on in the world.

And I feel sorry for you.

Can I also ask you remove the video as it possibly contains "offensive material" that would get the website in trouble?

MDU

[Phurrball]

Do you worry about a potatoes suffering when you peel its skin off? Of course not, its just a potatoe.

I feel the same way about animals.. If it's not a sentient human being, its feelings are irrelevant. As long as it doesn't harm any humans, I could really care less how they use the cats for entertainment. If they burnt the cats, buttraped the cats after wrapping em in ducttape, or sat there an rubbed them till they purred, all they are doing is using a natural resource for their enjoyment..

Would I run out and burn some cats like that? No, because I wouldnt get any enjoyment out of it.. But if others enjoy it, then what the helll.. ITS ONLY A CAT..

There is a major flaw in your argument.

There is a substantial difference between a potatoe and a cat, and for that matter a 'simple' animal like a jellyfish. It comes down to the structure of the nervous system of a cat, which is almost identical in form, function, and operation to that of a human. This follows for other mammals and 'complex' animals too.

At a genetic and functional level you are so similar to a cat , it's not funny[Why mice etc are used in scientific models]. Bear that in mind next time you see a cat suffering. It is feeling pain in a biological and functional sense in exactly the same way as you would were you set alight. This is objective scientific fact. You are not similar to a potatoe. It does not have a nervous system like you. Nor does my example of the jellyfish, which has a 'simple' nervous system based on a neural 'net' and perhaps represents a middle ground in response to stimulus that would produce pain in a 'higher' organism this fact leads to 'line in the sand' arguments re cockroaches etc.

These organisms do not feel pain as you do. A cat will.

A just society is measured by how it treats its most vulnerable, and also its most despised members. This is why people who commit unspeakable acts against other humans are treated [at least in theory] humanely when they are punished by society [Let's not get too far into this debate either].

Animals can't speak for themselves. As we are sentient human beings, and armed as we are with knowledge of our close similarity to animals, it is our duty to speak for them in the same breath as we do for the most vulnerable humans.


Anyone who advocates violence against people because of an animal is the sick fuck.

I agree, again for the reasons above [re treatment of the nastiest members of society]. I also see where you are going with the utility argument. There could be debate about the utility of hunting or vivisection for example. But there is arguably demonstrable human utility to these activities, whether or not you personally think it is justified.
There is NO demonstrable utility in causing unnecessary pain to animals when we know they feel pain in the same way as we do.

You are dead wrong about the irrelevancy of the feelings of any non sentient animal. This argument could be taken down a dangerous line: does a profoundly intellectually disabled human differ from an animal in this sentience-based calculus? Hmmm…

Think very carefully about where the label 'sick fcuk' additionally belongs. I'd stick it on subscribers to your argument personally:nono: .

[/rant]

For the record: I think I have enough scientific study under my belt to make these claims. If anyone can add detail to them [like homology data of the human genome with respect to animal genomes] be my guest. I am also a pro-vivisection vegetarian without too many ethical objections to personal hunting and fishing. You could say I have complex ethics…Oh, and I like cats if you hadn't guessed from my avatar.

[Waylander]

Anyone who advocates violence against people because of an animal is the sick fuck.
Mate have you missed it then? All the references on here that cruelty to animals is just a step on the road to being a serial killer. Doesn't mean it can't be avoided. Ok so you say finding these two and teaching them a lesson is a bad idea. What would you suggest doing then? How would you show these two thick skulled fucktards that hurting things is wrong?

[onearmedbandit]

Anyone who advocates violence against people because of an animal is the sick fuck.


Whatever. Attack a defenseless animal when I'm around and you can call me a sick fuck, but I'll be dealing with it in the manner that most others will do as well. In all honesty, you should look in the mirror a bit more closely, you might be scared of what you actually see.

[ManDownUnder]

Whatever. Attack a defenseless animal when I'm around and you can call me a sick fuck, but I'll be dealing with it in the manner that most others will do as well. In all honesty, you should look in the mirror a bit more closely, you might be scared of what you actually see.

I suspect the mirror test won't be too successful here... the video posted was intended to educate a few of us...

If you haven't seen it - only do so if you have a strong stomach. I go shooting, I am used to seeing the death of small animals - and it horrified me....

I agree strongly with your comments about defending the defenseless however.

Nice one
MDU

[Lou Girardin]

I take it back LiasTZ, you are as bad as them. Keep your sick filth off this site.
You obviously are as lacking in empathy as the oxygen thieves featured on TV.
Congratulations, you're the first KB'er to truly piss me off.

[Waylander]

I take it back LiasTZ, you are as bad as them. Keep your sick filth off this site.
You obviously are as lacking in empathy as the oxygen thieves featured on TV.
Congratulations, you're the first KB'er to truly piss me off.
Keep it cool mate, he's not as bad as it seems. He's actually a cool cunt in person.

[ManDownUnder]

Keep it cool mate, he's not as bad as it seems. He's actually a cool cunt in person.

I have to admit I'm inclined to agree with Lou. The only thing I know of LiasTZ is the postings in KB. It takes a bit to get my pulse up... but this thread sure did.

NOTHING is forgiveable about inflicting pain on animals. Leave 'em be, or kill them for meat/pest control etc.

Without respect for others, you don't deserve respect from others.

I find alcohol, money, kids and animals are two very good indicators of a person's personality.

Too much alcohol or money - their true self starts to emerge.

Kids and animals generally have a good intuitive sense of who's ok and who's not, but beyond that the way kids and animals are treated by people in power is a VERY good indicator of the true self.

I think this thread has spoken for itself.

MDU

[onearmedbandit]

Keep it cool mate, he's not as bad as it seems. He's actually a cool cunt in person.


I seriously doubt that, very seriously.

[Sniper]

Hey Scumdog, I've seen poorly shot aims go pretty horrifically wrong, If every person in the world had your self acclaimed perfect shot, then for sure this wouldn't happen. I was at Taylor Prestons Slaughter House just last week, the bolts they used there are as instant as your bullet will ever get!
They're positioned exactly right to provide an instant death, just like your every aimed shot.
By the way, I have a 300 metre range Military Marksmanship rating, I've fired a shot or two in my time. Your accuracy sounds well above any league I've ever come across.


I dont know Dafe. I have a Snipers badge and skilled shots up to and including 1000yards. Im sure Scumdog could be in the bracket of good shot, just like you could with practice

[Sniper]

or pouring salt on a slug acceptable

Because burning kittens is bloody horrible and pouring salt on slugs is funny

[Waylander]

I seriously doubt that, very seriously.
It is true though, despite all this. Still disagree with him about it but he isn't one who would go out and do cruel things to animals just for fun. I have met him and that's why this is a surprise for me. I still doubt he will actually do anything harmfull to an animal.

[Lias]

Whatever. Attack a defenseless animal when I'm around and you can call me a sick fuck, but I'll be dealing with it in the manner that most others will do as well.
I have no interest in attacking animals.. It doesnt interest or excite me, but on the flipside it doesnt upset or revolt me.. If other people want to hurt animals it doesnt phase me in the slightest, because an animal is pretty much unimportant to me.

If you haven't seen it - only do so if you have a strong stomach. I go shooting, I am used to seeing the death of small animals - and it horrified me....
Its because you have some sort of emotional attachment to the cat because your buy into the western society brainwashing that says cats are small furry animals to be loved and hugged, and not a foodstuff. I've never brought into that whole "some animals are for eating and some are for cuddling" thing, and all that video makes me wonder is if cat tastes good.

Because burning kittens is bloody horrible and pouring salt on slugs is funny
See, I just dont get either of them.. I dont find pouring salt on slugs funny, but by the same token I dont find burning kittens to be horrible.

He's actually a cool cunt in person.
Shush you'll ruin my reputation :whistle:

[ManDownUnder]

Its because you have some sort of emotional attachment to the cat because your buy into the western society brainwashing that says cats are small furry animals to be loved and hugged, and not a foodstuff. I've never brought into that whole "some animals are for eating and some are for cuddling" thing, and all that video makes me wonder is if cat tastes good.


No - the reason I didn't think it was appropriate is as I said - the cat wasn't dead before they proceeded to start sawing it's head off.

It's not an appropriate thing to do to any animal. Cows (which I eat) or cats (which I cuddle).

FYI I am also curious about other cultures and what they eat - have eaten some cute animals, some domesticated ones, and some wild ones.

What I eat doesn't worry me (too much) they way they're treated and killed does.

Big time

[Lias]

They smack it over the head a few times to stun it, then hack its head off.
Crude, but not all that dissimilar to what happens when an animal goes to a abotoir.

Hell when I lived on the farm the animals didnt even get the whack on the head.. they just got their throats slit.

[onearmedbandit]

I feel this thread is going a little off track. My initial post was regarding these two low-lifes who committed a heinous attack on two trapped animals (a crime) then not only showing no remorse, flaunted themselves in front of the camera. What will they do next? What will be done to stop them. Do not forget the main issue of this thread. A cowardly attack by two fuckwits who will mostly go unpunished.

[Phurrball]

I have no interest in attacking animals.. It doesnt interest or excite me, but on the flipside it doesnt upset or revolt me.. If other people want to hurt animals it doesnt phase me in the slightest, because an animal is pretty much unimportant to me.

Its because you have some sort of emotional attachment to the cat because your buy into the western society brainwashing that says cats are small furry animals to be loved and hugged, and not a foodstuff. I've never brought into that whole "some animals are for eating and some are for cuddling" thing, and all that video makes me wonder is if cat tastes good.

See, I just dont get either of them.. I dont find pouring salt on slugs funny, but by the same token I dont find burning kittens to be horrible.

Shush you'll ruin my reputation :whistle:

Try answering my criticisms...while I agree with your point re food/cuddling animals [I don't eat them personally], that has nothing to do with an act that is clearly painful to a creature that is at a scientific level a close cousin of ours. Don't come back with a subjective argument. I would no more accept someone burning a living cow than a cat, and nor should we be putting salt on slugs.

I am asuming that you agree that burning humans is horrible, so by analogy you are forced to concede that because kittens feel pain similarly to ourselves, burning kittens is horrible too...bottom line.

[Wolf]

FYI I am also curious about other cultures and what they eat - have eaten some cute animals, some domesticated ones, and some wild ones.

What I eat doesn't worry me (too much) they way they're treated and killed does.

Big time
I've eaten rabbit - quite like it - and kept rabbits as pets. I wouldn't eat the pet ones, no qualms about eating a wild rabbit or the "domestic" (unnamed) ones Colvin used to breed for food.

Would not eat cat, dog or horse because of my own personal feelings about them, have friends whom I know eat dog.

Pork - prefer wild as domestic pork tastes like shit. Cattle, sheep, goat are all fine by me - unless it was my pet. Venison - now we're talking! I love venison. Have not tried ostrich or emu but would have no qualms, never even thought about kangaroo as a food stuff until this post, would probably have an open mind on that. Would also like a pet ostrich or emu because they sound like fun, I know people who keep them as pets.

I eat animals and birds of various types. I also "love animals" and have had a lot of different pets over the years. I would not countenance cruelty or inhumanity to any animal.

Yep, I've killed animals - possums, rats and rabbits for pest control - and would happily hunt for food if time permitted. I have also killed various pets out of humanity - "euthanased" or "put them down" when they have been too ill or injured to survive in comfort. I once took a dog of mine to the vet to be euthanased and the dog was so stressed out by the situation and took so long to die of an OD, struggling and fighting the vet, the next dog I had to put down I shot to spare it going through that.

I also shot a dog that was a great companion for five years and that I loved as part of the family - because she bit my young son on the face, just missing his eye, and I could not trust her not to do it again. I loved that dog, and the final act of love I performed was to make sure she died swiftly without pain.

All the times I have killed an animal I have striven to ensure the end was quick and painless. On the few occasions when my aim has been off and the first shot was not sufficient, I have felt like shit because I caused unnecessary suffering to another living creature - and that includes possums, by the way.

I'm a good shot (and when it comes to dispatching a sick or wounded animal the range is commonly called "point blank" anyway) and I work to be sure of kills.

I would not condone violence against those two boys, remorseless as they were, but I would like to see them removed from our society.

Apparently, most of the world's serial killers had a history of cruelty to animals and obsession with fire, they also felt there was no wrong in causing suffering and death - which means those boys are prime canditates to be voted Most Likely to Become a Sicko Serial Killer. I'd like to see them incarcerated for the rest of their natural lives because I don't want them roaming around out there.

[Phurrball]

I feel this thread is going a little off track. My initial post was regarding these two low-lifes who committed a heinous attack on two trapped animals (a crime) then not only showing no remorse, flaunted themselves in front of the camera. What will they do next? What will be done to stop them. Do not forget the main issue of this thread. A cowardly attack by two fuckwits who will mostly go unpunished.

Unfortunately the law is precedent based. I'm pretty sure that there was a custodial sentence handed down for animal creulty a while back [Can anyone help me out here?] Only stronger rules on the books, or stronger judicial application of the current rules will send a message at the level of the justice system.

If nothing else, this will stay with the little farkers. No one likes kiddy fiddlers either, and this sort of crime seems to engender similar revulsion at a societal level.

I'm assuming they're juvenile...sadly, otherwise when they step out of line again, such a conviction would become relevant in sentencing.

[Ixion]

No - the reason I didn't think it was appropriate is as I said - the cat wasn't dead before they proceeded to start sawing it's head off.

It's not an appropriate thing to do to any animal. Cows (which I eat) or cats (which I cuddle).

FYI I am also curious about other cultures and what they eat - have eaten some cute animals, some domesticated ones, and some wild ones.

What I eat doesn't worry me (too much) they way they're treated and killed does.

Big time

Dog - OK
Ostrich - big disappointment
Kangaroo - good
Snake - OK -
Rabbit - nothing odd about him, tastes good
Hare - like rabbit
Rat - Might have been OK , but I threw up.
Snail - Sort of OK I guess but I wasn't keen
Pukeko - Vile
Sparrow - OK I guess hardly worth it
Birds Nest . Can't see what the fuss is about
"Thousand year old egg" - Utterly vile
Possum. OK

Never tried cat.

[ManDownUnder]

Dog - OK
Ostrich - big disappointment
Kangaroo - good
Snake - OK -
Rabbit - nothing odd about him, tastes good
Hare - like rabbit
Rat - Might have been OK , but I threw up.
Snail - Sort of OK I guess but I wasn't keen
Pukeko - Vile
Sparrow - OK I guess hardly worth it
Birds Nest . Can't see what the fuss is about
"Thousand year old egg" - Utterly vile
Possum. OK

Never tried cat.

Horse - coarse tender meat, tastes like they smell
Crocodile, quite nice
Ostrich - very nice (maybe the way it was cooked)
Snake, like chicken
Pigs balls - avoided... as soon as I knew what they were something in me refused to go there

[Wolf]

Warning: :Offtopic:



Snail - Sort of OK I guess but I wasn't keen

Sparrow - OK I guess hardly worth it
Birds Nest . Can't see what the fuss is about

Possum. OK

Snail - like eating rubber smothered in garlic butter, nothing to write home about - and the French reckon they know how to cook! Cordon Blurgh! Next time I'll put the garlic butter on bread and at least be able to chew it up in under a week.

Sparrow - WTF? I thought quail was a waste of time and effort. If the bird's smaller than a standard Tegel chicken it's not worth pissing about with. Chicken, duck and turkey are all fine, never tried Mutton Bird - have an open mind about it.

Birds Nest - never tried it. One of those many "delicacies" that rose out of famine times - when people were beginning to broil up roofing tiles in desperation for something edible. Later on when the famine is gone, the mega-rich all race out and make a delicacy of something that until recently only the ultra-poor were desperate enough to eat.

Possum - not on your nelly! Tuberculosis, Brucilosis and Leptospirosis to name but a few. My survival manual recommends autopsying the possum and checking its liver prior to attempting to eat it. As I don't have a clue what healthy and diseased livers look like, I'll be the bugger shambling around the forest looking for lots of rotting tree stumps - huhu grubs look like a safer option. Fuck it, I'd go vegetarian and eat bracken if need be.

Certain bits of animals are out of the question for me too - liver, kidney, heart, any form of offal - tripes especially and don't bother stuffing offal with grain and calling it haggis - only way I'll eat animal intestine is as the (thin) skin of a sausage.

Yeah, I know the contents of commercial sausages and mince leave a lot to be desired, but they're usually well "diluted" with stuff that doesn't taste/smell like a rendering-down works.

[Lou Girardin]

Escargot. Mmmmmmmmmm!

[Sniper]

No-one tried Springbok, Warthog, Kudu or Anteater or Porcupine or Meerkat?

(My folks made me eat it when we were bush in SA)

[ManDownUnder]

Escargot. Mmmmmmmmmm!

Would that be
"Mmmmmmmmmm!" interesting
or "Mmmmmmmmmm!" I'm thinking
or "Mmmmmmmmmm!" I have three dozen please

oh and make sure the wine keeps flowing

[Wolf]

Would that be
"Mmmmmmmmmm!" interesting
or "Mmmmmmmmmm!" I'm thinking
or "Mmmmmmmmmm!" I have three dozen please

oh and make sure the wine keeps flowing
Perhaps "Mmmmmmmm, garlic - too bad about the tasteless rubbery mass it's on." :devil2:

[Wolf]

No-one tried Springbok, Warthog, Kudu or Anteater or Porcupine or Meerkat?

(My folks made me eat it when we were bush in SA)
Porcupine? Bags I don't skin it, pluck it, whatever it is you do in order to make it safe enough to approach.

You didn't get milk-and-cow's-blood?

[Lou Girardin]

That's Mmmmmmmmmmore. Another Escarpment Pinot Noir too please.
Droooooool, what's time's dinner?

[ManDownUnder]

That's Mmmmmmmmmmore. Another Escarpment Pinot Noir too please.
Droooooool, what's time's dinner?

In France???

About now (that'd be 3:00am at the mo - yeah - they start late)
MDU

[scumdog]

It's not a piss take.

To my mind, unless you are all raving vegans, your just being hypocrites by saying its okay to kill one kind of animal and not another.


Listen up, I'll type this sloowwly so you know what I'm trying to say:

It's not the killing per se, it is the manner of doing it.
If these bozos (sorry to all other bozos for putting them in the same catagory) had simply shot the cats through the swede with a .22 I for one wouldn't have much of a problem with what bozo1 and bozo2 did.

Do you see what I'm saying??

[Wolf]

That's Mmmmmmmmmmore. Another Escarpment Pinot Noir too please.
Droooooool, what's time's dinner?
Ugh, French wine - it makes warthog and porcupine sound appetising. :devil2:

Gimme a Gewurtztramminer or Reisling any day over that French stuff.

[Hitcher]

And some animal abusers, even when convicted don't get that they may have done something wrong. MAF busted a Northland dairy farmer for animal abuse -- several hundred head of cattle starving in a sea of mud. Many were in such poor condition they had to be put down by vets. The rest were taken away to better grazing land. Despite being done by the Courts for two separate animal welfare offences and being investigated for one that never got to Court, this guy is unrepentent and has found a willing ear in a couple of farming newspapers that should know better.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/index.cfm?ObjectID=10115444

[Wolf]

And then we got our dog taken to the pound because we had been out three days in a row and each day put the dog outside on a chain with access to food and water and shelter, came home each afternoon/evening/night, fed the dog, brought it inside to sleep etc - except the third day when we came home to find the dog impounded. The animal control officer said "Oh, we thought you'd gone away on holiday and just left it there because we went past a couple of times over the last three days and it was outside."

Where did they expect us to put it? On the roof?

Cost us a fortune to get it out of the pound.

Then people seriously torture animals and pretty-much get away with it.

[Lou Girardin]

Ugh, French wine - it makes warthog and porcupine sound appetising. :devil2:

Gimme a Gewurtztramminer or Reisling any day over that French stuff.

It's one of Martinboroughs finest.

[Phurrball]

Dog - OK
Ostrich - big disappointment
Kangaroo - good
Snake - OK -
Rabbit - nothing odd about him, tastes good
Hare - like rabbit
Rat - Might have been OK , but I threw up.
Snail - Sort of OK I guess but I wasn't keen
Pukeko - Vile
Sparrow - OK I guess hardly worth it
Birds Nest . Can't see what the fuss is about
"Thousand year old egg" - Utterly vile
Possum. OK

Never tried cat.

Oh my! :gob:I'll stick with vegetarianism I think - it's a 'get out of jail' free card to avoid eating strange creatures...that said, [just so you can all laugh at me] I'm pretty sure that you're more likely to be poisoned by plants.

[Disregarding foodbourne illness for a moment...Mmmm, African 'bush meat', strange and curious viruses...:yes:]

People can choose to eat any animals they like if they are comfortable with that decision. If you haven't thought about it, or are in denial about how your tasty snack arrived on your plate/sharpened wooden stake etc, perhaps you should rethink your snacking decision.

If you wanna eat such delicacies, then be my guest...but Chicken...now THAT'S a dodgy meat on so many levels...

(A little levity is welcome after such a heavy thread on animal abusing scum - even if it's off topic. In spite of my 'academic' ramblings, I could not be responsible for my actions if I caught a farker abusing a helpless animal.)

[spudchucka]

I'm assuming they're juvenile...sadly, otherwise when they step out of line again, such a conviction would become relevant in sentencing.
They aren't juvies because the court would have suppressed their identities if they were under 17.

[spudchucka]

Keep it cool mate, he's not as bad as it seems. He's actually a cool cunt in person.
Dissagree. The video he posted is sick and obviously indicates that he has a sick mind.

[ManDownUnder]

Dissagree. The video he posted is sick and obviously indicates that he has a sick mind.

Agree - although I'd temper that with the fact it is posted as an educational film.

I looked - I learned something, but I'm curious to understand what lessons I was supposed to learn.

What I did learn was that Spuddy and I (and Lou and scumdog and... dare I speak for you guys) share a similar perspective. And it's not an activity we'd engage in or support.

If you're going to kill something - have a reason to do it, and do it humanely.

Pretty damned simple really
MDU
PS - For those of you that know me well - it takes a lot to get my temper up - that film did it in about 20 seconds. I had to watch it 4 or 5 times to try and get objective about it.

[Lou Girardin]

MDU, Spud, Scumdog and me. :grouphug:
Is this a PDA?
Or something sicker than the Huntly twins?

[ManDownUnder]

MDU, Spud, Scumdog and me. :grouphug:
Is this a PDA?
Or something sicker than the Huntly twins?

err - lets just stick to having a beer.

I'm also very carefully walking around any topics involving the words eating and pussy.

[spudchucka]

MDU, Spud, Scumdog and me. :grouphug:
Is this a PDA?
Or something sicker than the Huntly twins?
Depends if you or MDU are trying to dry root scummies or my leg while we are having that virtual hug.

[ManDownUnder]

Depends if you or MDU are trying to dry root scummies or my leg while we are having that virtual hug.

not rootin' ... DRINKIN!

[scumdog]

MDU, Spud, Scumdog and me. :grouphug:
Is this a PDA?
Or something sicker than the Huntly twins?

Nah, it shows that when it comes to the important stuff in life we are on the same wave-length, - despite aguing to death about minor stuff we don't agree on. :yes:

[Ixion]

Oh my! :gob:I'll stick with vegetarianism I think - it's a 'get out of jail' free card to avoid eating strange creatures...that said, [just so you can all laugh at me] I'm pretty sure that you're more likely to be poisoned by plants.

[Disregarding foodbourne illness for a moment...Mmmm, African 'bush meat', strange and curious viruses...:yes:]

People can choose to eat any animals they like if they are comfortable with that decision. If you haven't thought about it, or are in denial about how your tasty snack arrived on your plate/sharpened wooden stake etc, perhaps you should rethink your snacking decision.

If you wanna eat such delicacies, then be my guest...but Chicken...now THAT'S a dodgy meat on so many levels...

(A little levity is welcome after such a heavy thread on animal abusing scum - even if it's off topic. In spite of my 'academic' ramblings, I could not be responsible for my actions if I caught a farker abusing a helpless animal.)


I've killed and butchered my own tucker in the past, though most of those were restaurant issue. No illusions where my lamb chop comes from.

But that's a different matter to torturing or killing something just for the sake of inflicting pain.

Like Mr Scumdog said, a quick clean kill, and then into the pot is one thing. Setting fire to kittens is another.

'Tis a question of motive.

[Lou Girardin]

Depends if you or MDU are trying to dry root scummies or my leg while we are having that virtual hug.

That's a mighty big assumption about who's rooting what there Spuddy.

[Lou Girardin]

not rootin' ... DRINKIN!

Drinkin' his leg?
My God, you're a sick puppy.

[ManDownUnder]

Drinkin' his leg?
My God, you're a sick puppy.

I'm tired - my brain hurts and you dish up THIS!

Bastard (I got a fucken good laugh out of it though... cheers!)
MDU

[spudchucka]

That's a mighty big assumption about who's rooting what there Spuddy.
Well the little smilie hug thing you posted seems to have five huggers, you only named four. I want to know who the fifth phantom hugger is and what his or her motives are before I buy into this lovey dovey hugging crap.

[Waylander]

Well the little smilie hug thing you posted seems to have five huggers, you only named four. I want to know who the fifth phantom hugger is and what his or her motives are before I buy into this lovey dovey hugging crap.
WINJA....:rofl::rofl:

[Beemer]

How pathetic our judges are - tonight's news featured those rugby players who shot at fur seals for 'fun'. Each fined $2000 and also the rugby union plans to punish them as well.

Sorry, but is there any difference between what they did and what those other tossers did to the cats? Buggered if I can see it.

[scumdog]

How pathetic our judges are - tonight's news featured those rugby players who shot at fur seals for 'fun'. Each fined $2000 and also the rugby union plans to punish them as well.

Sorry, but is there any difference between what they did and what those other tossers did to the cats? Buggered if I can see it.

I guess the difference is the cat burners did it KNOWING it would cause intense pain and suffering.
Still hate what the seal shooters did.

[spudchucka]

How pathetic our judges are - tonight's news featured those rugby players who shot at fur seals for 'fun'. Each fined $2000 and also the rugby union plans to punish them as well.

Sorry, but is there any difference between what they did and what those other tossers did to the cats? Buggered if I can see it.
The seal was shot and most likely died a quick death. The cats were made to suffer terribly and died an agonising prolonged death. However, the seals are protected by law, ferral cats aren't, (other than the general provention of cruelty legislation), so it will be interesting to see whether the sentencing judge takes into account the suffering those pieces of shit caused.

[Wolf]

Like Mr Scumdog said, a quick clean kill, and then into the pot is one thing. Setting fire to kittens is another.

'Tis a question of motive.
And how much discomfort is inflicted.

If they had, as Scumdog mentioned, blown the kittens brains out with a .22, I would have seen it as pointless and stupid. The fact they saw fit to torture the animals to death, I find sickening.

I went out hunting with a guy once who, after sighting in his rifle on a small target ad a decent range, saw fit to shoot a kingfisher (several times the size of the target) at about half the range - just for the hell of it. I was not sickened, but I did think he was a retard of some description and I never went hunting with him again. He went after the kingfisher's mate and got seriously pissed with me when I discharged my 7.62x54R Mosin-Nagant rifle into the ground and scared the bird away (the Mosin-Nagant made .303s sound like .22s)

Oh, diddums.

Another guy I went hunting with - pest destruction: rabbits and hares - was a different matter. There were three of us on the back of the ute, me with a 16-shot semi, another with a 10-shot semi and this guy with a 10-shot lever action. The driver had stopped the ute and was aiming the spotlight. We picked up a baby hare in the sights and all of us opened fire, the hare went into evasion mode and was zig-zagging all over the show while the three of us tried desperately to get a proper lead and hit it despite the fact the driver was having difficulty keeping the light on it. We all emptied our mags and the guy with the lever action yelled "guns up" - mine already was as it was empty and it was pointless aiming it anywhere else.

He then jumps off the back of the ute and dives for the baby hare which by this stage is tired and moving very slowly, can't outrun even a human. He grabs it and brings it back, inspecting it in the light - we hadn't hit it with a single shot. That little bugger had zig-zagged out of the way of 36 bullets.

I was thinking "we can't kill it, it won. If he kills it I'll be pissed."

"It's earned the right to live," he says and shoves it down the front of his Swandri, "I've got a couple of kids at home that'll love it."

So we rode around the farm with this baby hare cuddled up inside his Swanny, looking for more rabbits and hares. End result, the hare lived but was no longer damaging crops and grazing on the farm - mission achieved albeit not the way we had planned.

Him, I'd hunt with again - he knows when to concede that the animal won.

[Ixion]

And how much discomfort is inflicted.

...

True. Though them as hunt for a feed are generally knidly in their despatch. Which makes sense, because meat from an animal that's been highly stressed pre death is tough and not nice to eat.

[Beemer]

"It's earned the right to live," he says and shoves it down the front of his Swandri, "I've got a couple of kids at home that'll love it."

So we rode around the farm with this baby hare cuddled up inside his Swanny, looking for more rabbits and hares. End result, the hare lived but was no longer damaging crops and grazing on the farm - mission achieved albeit not the way we had planned.

Him, I'd hunt with again - he knows when to concede that the animal won.

I was reading that and thinking "oh no, how could he kill that poor wee bunny now" - but you restored my faith in humanity! So I'm a big softy, too bad, at least I'm not likely to turn into a bunny boiler if things go wrong...

I'm not 100% sure of the background to the fur seal shooting as I missed the beginning of the item and it was a month or so ago when it happened, but they (including an ex-All Black) were shooting at the seals from a boat - not for culling purposes or anything, just to take pot shots. I know at least one died, not sure if any others were injured. One small consolation, the boat they were on sank last week after hitting rocks. One for the fur seals!

Yes, I totally agree with clean killing - it's the deliberate cruelty I abhor. While not the kind of person to go hunting myself, I don't have a problem with hunters who kill for the meat - and I'm not a vegetarian. Mind you, if I had to kill it myself, I probably would be!

[ManDownUnder]

He went after the kingfisher's mate and got seriously pissed with me when I discharged my 7.62x54R Mosin-Nagant rifle into the ground and scared the bird away (the Mosin-Nagant made .303s sound like .22s)


:clap: :rofl: :clap: :rofl: :clap:


"It's earned the right to live," he says and shoves it down the front of his Swandri, "I've got a couple of kids at home that'll love it."

So we rode around the farm with this baby hare cuddled up inside his Swanny, looking for more rabbits and hares. End result, the hare lived but was no longer damaging crops and grazing on the farm - mission achieved albeit not the way we had planned.

Him, I'd hunt with again - he knows when to concede that the animal won.

That wasn't in Lumsden was it? I know a guy there that'd do that (Head of the local Pest Destruction Board).

[ManDownUnder]

WINJA....:rofl::rofl:

There's a two word saying I'd offer as a comeback to that - the second word is "off"

MDU

[Wolf]

That wasn't in Lumsden was it? I know a guy there that'd do that (Head of the local Pest Destruction Board).
Rukuhia area, just outside Hamilscum. Still can't believe that three guys with thirty six rounds of ammo between them all managed to miss with every single shot - obviously as the hare was slowing we were getting less accurate. Judging by the fact the guy jumped off the ute and grabbed it, it was pretty much reduced to a walk by the time we ran out of ammo.

[Phurrball]

And how much discomfort is inflicted.

If they had, as Scumdog mentioned, blown the kittens brains out with a .22, I would have seen it as pointless and stupid. The fact they saw fit to torture the animals to death, I find sickening.

[...snip...]

Him, I'd hunt with again - he knows when to concede that the animal won.

Wolf, you hit the nail on the head and get the distinction between cruelty and mere stupidity (where Ixion's question of motive comes in) just right.

[On second thoughts, perhaps 'hit the target' is a more appropriate metaphor]

I have no moral qualms with ethical hunting of that nature.It is an entirely justified and defensible practise IMHO. Not all vegetarians are tree huggers with their heads in the clouds - it comes down to respecting the different choices of others, so long as they don't unjustifiably impinge on your legitimate freedoms or the legitimate rights of animals. The more activist vegans etc who carry some forms various direct action seem to struggle with the bigger picture. Some loopy once stole deer blood from an undergraduate immunology lab I was involved with! That was silly. I saw the blood collected; the deer was no more harmed than you or I having a blood test, and the same deer had to be bled again. A nett loss for that particiular animal's rights.

That said I have similar respect for dedicated über-vegans who can actually walk-the-walk, as well as talk-the-talk...

I just try and be an informed middle ground walker, without being a fence sitter.

[Disclaimer to any syntax/word choice pedants - I'm tired today. You get the general idea:yes:.]

[Phurrball]

Oh, BTW, where has LiasTZ gone?

[Wolf]

Oh, BTW, where has LiasTZ gone?
Outside for a cigarette break

[spudchucka]

Oh, BTW, where has LiasTZ gone?
Seems he's a little put out by some of the comments on his pussy video and has started handing out the red rep.

I stand by my comments though, anyone that thinks the slaughter, gutting and BBQ'ing of kittens should be videod for entertainment, in the way it was in that video, is SICK.

[Lou Girardin]

Seems he's a little put out by some of the comments on his pussy video and has started handing out the red rep.

I stand by my comments though, anyone that thinks the slaughter, gutting and BBQ'ing of kittens should be videod for entertainment, in the way it was in that video, is SICK.

Red rep my arse. He's lucky I don't set Clyde the killer Burmese on his sorry butt.

[Lias]

Seems he's a little put out by some of the comments on his pussy video and has started handing out the red rep.

You gave me red bling for posting it. I returned the favour *shrug* I didnt start handing it out, you did. :weird:

Oh, BTW, where has LiasTZ gone?
/wave

[ManDownUnder]

Red rep my arse. He's lucky I don't set Clyde the killer Burmese on his sorry butt.

Kinda like Footrot Flats' Horse?

[Lou Girardin]

Kinda like Footrot Flats' Horse?

Yeah, but smaller and with killers eyes.

[Beemer]

[QUOTE=spudchucka]Seems he's a little put out by some of the comments on his pussy video and has started handing out the red rep.QUOTE]


Yeah, I got red rep for being a "stupid animal lover". I'm just glad he didn't put in any commas...

[Phurrball]

[QUOTE=spudchucka]Seems he's a little put out by some of the comments on his pussy video and has started handing out the red rep.QUOTE]

Yeah, I got red rep for being a "stupid animal lover". I'm just glad he didn't put in any commas...

:rofl: THAT would have been an 'Eats, shoots and leaves' moment! :killingme:


Seems he's a little put out by some of the comments on his pussy video and has started handing out the red rep.

I stand by my comments though, anyone that thinks the slaughter, gutting and BBQ'ing of kittens should be videod for entertainment, in the way it was in that video, is SICK.

On to the serious stuff...

I haven't viewed the video. I don't want to. I don't need to be reminded just how sick some people are. I don't need to get wound up and angry on a Friday afternoon - I am picking up a 'new' lawnmower today, and I look forward to using it merrily in the weekend without knowing the details of what the sick farks in the video did to that cat.

What I have to say now is important. Without going into too much detail, I'm pretty sure that the video referred may fall foul of the FILMS, VIDEOS, AND PUBLICATIONS CLASSIFICATION ACT 1993.

There are some pretty heavy penalties available under this act. I think the idea of the act is that 'publication' is tacit approval of the illegal/sick acts portrayed in the 'publication'.

This may leave Kiwibiker open to legal liability, and also may leave LiasTZ open to liability under the same act. Unless LiasTZ has legal advice to the contrary, if I was him, I'd be pulling the file from this site (if he hasn't already done so), and deleting it from my hard drive ASAP.

(Probably also a good idea for anyone who downloaded it - although I'm sure most deleted it immediately anyway after one watch due to its sick nature.)

There is a bit of smut and filth peddled on this site from time to time, but i'm pretty sure it does not fall into the objectionable category.

This is a public forum, it pays to remember that when we put up anything potentially 'dodgy'

[Disclaimer - I ain't trying to be a killjoy - I appreciate dubious humour and smut as much as the next bloke. But there IS a line in the sand, and I suggest this video probably crosses it.]

Stop reading now if you want to skip the legalese...

Here's some of the most relevant bits of the act (See <a href="http://www.legislation.govt.nz/browse_vw.asp?content-set=pal_statutes">the legislation</a> for yourself – click the wee plus by ‘F’ on the left to find it.)

FILMS, VIDEOS, AND PUBLICATIONS CLASSIFICATION ACT 1993

``Film'' means a cinematograph film, a video recording, and any other material record of visual moving images that is capable of being used for the subsequent display of those images; and includes any part of any film, and any copy or part of a copy of the whole or any part of a film:

``Video recording'' means any disc, magnetic tape, or solid state recording device containing information by the use of which one or more series of visual images may be produced electronically and shown as a moving picture:

``Publication'' means—
…
[(d)a thing (including, but not limited to, a disc, or an electronic or computer file) on which is recorded or stored information that, by the use of a computer or other electronic device, is capable of being reproduced or shown as 1 or more (or a combination of 1 or more) images, representations, signs, statements, or words:]
…

3.Meaning of ``objectionable''—

(1)For the purposes of this Act, a publication is objectionable if it describes, depicts, expresses, or otherwise deals with matters such as sex, horror, crime, cruelty, or violence in such a manner that the availability of the publication is likely to be injurious to the public good.
…

(2)A publication shall be deemed to be objectionable for the purposes of this Act if the publication promotes or supports, or tends to promote or support,—
…

(f)Acts of torture or the infliction of extreme violence or extreme cruelty.
…

/rant. Back to the law books I'm supposed to be reading. :yes:

Enjoy your weekend everybody.

[spudchucka]

You gave me red bling for posting it. I returned the favour *shrug* I didnt start handing it out, you did. :weird:

/wave
So you are a sick prick and childish too.

[ManDownUnder]

...

(1)For the purposes of this Act, a publication is objectionable if it describes, depicts, expresses, or otherwise deals with matters such as sex, horror, crime, cruelty, or violence in such a manner that the availability of the publication is likely to be injurious to the public good.
…

(2)A publication shall be deemed to be objectionable for the purposes of this Act if the publication promotes or supports, or tends to promote or support,—
…

(f)Acts of torture or the infliction of extreme violence or extreme cruelty.
…

/rant. Back to the law books I'm supposed to be reading. :yes:

Enjoy your weekend everybody.

I for one did view it - multiple times as mentioned.

Cruelty to an animal is depicted and I'll happily tell that to anyone. I'm not sure if what I saw is the "extreme cruelty" side of things, I can imagine doing something a lot worse (the cat did die within 20 seconds of the first blow to the head), but I'd still rank it towards that end of the spectrum.

LiasTZ - did you pull that video yet. I gotta admit I haven't checked.

[edit] nope - still there - Iasked Admins to take a look and pull it off if needed
MDU

[Lias]

I already spoke to phurrball in PM's re this.

I'm not totally unfamiliar with the FVP Act, and I dont believe the video is in breach of it. The video's simply more shocking because its a cat (not an animal we associate with beign slaughtered and cooked). Think of it this way.. If it was a chicken having its head chopped off and being plucked instead of a cat having its head chopped off and being defurred, no-one would even be raising an eyebrow over it. :whocares:


(2) A publication shall be deemed to be objectionable for the purposes
of this Act if the publication promotes or supports, or tends to promote
or support,---
(a) The exploitation of children, or young persons, or both, for
sexual purposes; or
(b) The use of violence or coercion to compel any person to
participate in, or submit to, sexual conduct; or
(c) Sexual conduct with or upon the body of a dead person; or
(d) The use of urine or excrement in association with degrading or
dehumanising conduct or sexual conduct; or
(e) Bestiality; or
(f) Acts of torture or the infliction of extreme violence or extreme
cruelty.

IANAL, but I've never heard of 3.2.f being interpreted in any way OTHER in a sexual sense (IE Extreme BDSM, sexual torture etc), which hardly applies in this sense.

[ManDownUnder]

I already spoke to phurrball in PM's re this.

I'm not totally unfamiliar with the FVP Act, and I dont believe the video is in breach of it. The video's simply more shocking because its a cat (not an animal we associate with beign slaughtered and cooked). Think of it this way.. If it was a chicken having its head chopped off and being plucked instead of a cat having its head chopped off and being defurred, no-one would even be raising an eyebrow over it. :whocares:



IANAL, but I've never heard of 3.2.f being interpreted in any way OTHER in a sexual sense (IE Extreme BDSM, sexual torture etc), which hardly applies in this sense.

Good - so long and the Admins know about it - that's all good by me. Cheers

Re the cat v chicken - I disagree but for reasons already stated. I don't want to get drawn into the same argument again
MDU

[manuboy]

The advanced lifeforms that are out there, observing us (and peacefully too, until we took the piss in the first Dr Who episode and countless startrek episodes / b-grade movies since) are probably having a similar debate right now.

So what? They're only humans! They won't suffer - they can't feel anything! The only have 1 brain and a puny little nervious system.

But i reckon when they come to play cowboys and indians with us LaisTZ, you'll be the first to go so, so thanks, you probably bought the rest of us a little time. Hope the anal Annihilator is good for u..

p.s Got a guild wars handle?

[Phurrball]

I already spoke to phurrball in PM's re this.

I'm not totally unfamiliar with the FVP Act, and I dont believe the video is in breach of it. The video's simply more shocking because its a cat (not an animal we associate with beign slaughtered and cooked). Think of it this way.. If it was a chicken having its head chopped off and being plucked instead of a cat having its head chopped off and being defurred, no-one would even be raising an eyebrow over it. :whocares:



IANAL, but I've never heard of 3.2.f being interpreted in any way OTHER in a sexual sense (IE Extreme BDSM, sexual torture etc), which hardly applies in this sense.

By way of reply to LiasTZ,

Firstly, I take it that you agree, as per the s2 interpretation section of the Act, that you have 'published' the material in question for the purposes of the act by uploading it to the KB server.

You're probably quite right in terms of precedent; a noscitur a sociis interpretation may support your assertion too (colouring para. (f) of the subsection in light of paras (a) to (e)).

That said the statutory drafting is dysjunctive, ie any of, or more than one of s3(2) paras. (a) to (f) import a deemed categorisation of objectionable. The wording of para. (f) is clear on the face of it - I have not looked to case law WRT how this paragraph has been interpreted. Classification of material as objectionable can be as a result of s3(2)'s deeming provision, or by the mandatory considerations outlined in s3(3) and (4). s3(1) sets out a more general scope to the meaning of objectionable as follows:

"(1)For the purposes of this Act, a publication is objectionable if it describes, depicts, expresses, or otherwise deals with matters such as sex, horror, crime, cruelty, or violence in such a manner that the availability of the publication is likely to be injurious to the public good."

The overall weighing approach is then applied in s2(3) and (4).

You may be right that the video you have posted may fail the deeming test in s3(2)(f), but the other routes exist, and in light of the mandatory considerations in subs. (3) and (4) of section 3, you would be skating on fairly thin legal ice.

WRT your point that we should not discriminate between cats and the so-called 'traditional' food animals. I agree. I eat neither. That’s my personal viewpoint. By the same token, if people want to, they can eat any animal they like, so long as it is humanely treated!

You have failed to make that point, or any useful point, by posting that particular video. I would be having exactly the same argument if a sheep/pig/dog/chicken/naked mole rat were portrayed.

At issue here are:

1) If the reports in this thread are correct, the cat is not treated humanely; this cruelty, and the 'publication' of the video in this public site may lead to legal liability.

2) This is an inappropriate medium for posting such material, because of the scope of the audience.

Either way you are on very dodgy ground posting such material.

Don't bring the site into disrepute.

[See also MDU's post above.]

P.S. I'll forgive you for not citing statutes correctly

...but please...

LEARN TO USE APOSTROPHES CORRECTLY! [You manage sometimes, that only make it a more egregious sin!]

The offending video is gone.

[Phurrball]

The advanced lifeforms that are out there, observing us (and peacefully too, until we took the piss in the first Dr Who episode and countless startrek episodes / b-grade movies since) are probably having a similar debate right now.

So what? They're only humans! They won't suffer - they can't feel anything! The only have 1 brain and a puny little nervious system.

But i reckon when they come to play cowboys and indians with us LaisTZ, you'll be the first to go so, so thanks, you probably bought the rest of us a little time. Hope the anal Annihilator is good for u..

p.s Got a guild wars handle?

:devil: Now THAT is a brilliant take on it... :rofl:

Take a bow for succinctly summing it up Manuboy!:killingme:

[Lias]

But i reckon when they come to play cowboys and indians with us LaisTZ, you'll be the first to go so, so thanks, you probably bought the rest of us a little time. Hope the anal Annihilator is good for u..


That reminded me of this sound file for some reason.
http://www.audiocomedy.net/fakeads/sodomizer.shtml


p.s Got a guild wars handle?

Nope.. Was looking at it but like pretty much every other MMORPG released recently it just wasnt good enough to lure me away from EQ.

[spudchucka]

I saw last night that the two winners who torched the cats were both sentenced to nine months. Their only reaction was to pull faces and flash the gangsta man hand signals at the camera. Really staunch guys, you the men!

I'm hoping that there will be some large, smelly inmate that treats their bottoms like pussies and gives them both a nice dose of anal herpes to remind them of what they did for the rest of their miserable lives.

[Lias]

One got 9 months and the other got more I thought.. 2+ years?

[Lias]

http://www.stuff.co.nz/stuff/0,2106,3395666a11,00.html


Two Huntly teenagers who burnt three cats to death were jailed yesterday. Wirimu Karena, student, and Sahn Papa, sawmill worker, both 18, earlier admitted aggravated cruelty to the cats.

Karena also pleaded guilty to a other charges, including burglary, possession of cannabis, unlawfully interfering with a motor vehicle, receiving, possession of a cannabis pipe and theft committed while on bail.

Karena was jailed for a total of two years and Papa for nine months.

The cruelty incident happened in April, when the pair poured solvent over the cats and set them alight after finding them in council traps in Huntly.

Images of the incident caught on a security camera showed the pair rushing from the scene as a fireball engulfed the cats.

In Huntly District Court yesterday the pair gave the fingers to media as they were led away to start their sentences.

Judge Arthur Tompkins said there was an element of revenge and pre-meditation involved in the cat killings as Papa had recognised the cages they were in as belonging to a Waikato District Council animal control officer whom he suspected of shooting a friend's dog.
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Papa's lawyer Bruce Hesketh said Papa came from a broken family and was more of a follower than a leader and described the incident as "foolish and nasty".

Karena's lawyer Ted Walsh said there had been gang connections in Karena's upbringing and he had been living rough at the time of the offences.

Judge Tompkins ordered both to attend alcohol and drug counselling for six months after they are released.

2 years for the ringleader, 9 months for the other.. But if they are "gang associated" then they will probably be looked after inside I guess.

[Death 'N' Taxes]

Don't know whether this has been posted before - did a search on "Dog" and didn't find anything. But forgive me if it has.

A few weeks ago, there was an article on the news about a dog that had been mistreated. An elderly woman had taken in a boarder. Eventually both the boarder and her dog went missing.

The boarder called the woman and demanded money for the dog's return.
Anyway, the dog was eventually returned.

However, the dog had freezer burns on its back from where it had been kept, chucks of fur had been ripped out and skin sliced off with a razor, its feet had been sliced with a razor, AND HOLE HAD BEEN DRILLED INTO ITS NECK AND OIL/GREASE PUMPED INTO IT!!!!

The dog had to be put down. The who did it had done a similar thing at his previous residence where two cats went missing, one then returning with a broken jaw.

The Police were interviewed in respect of the complaint that was laid and told the reporter that they were too busy. Among the reasons listed were:

- Too many rapes - (fair enough)
- Too many murders - (again fair enough)
- Too many burglaries - (mmmm - ok)

But the kicker was - TOO MANY SPEEDERS!!!! OMFG!
They know who this fucker is, and if he is capable of such cruelty to animals - Could that not just be the start????

Anyway, that is my rant - been around the site for a while - met a few of you guys on rides - don't post much unless I have something really useful to say or something really winds me up - this is one of those things.

[spudchucka]

One got 9 months and the other got more I thought.. 2+ years?
I guess that was because of the other charges he was facing.


Karena also pleaded guilty to a other charges, including burglary, possession of cannabis, unlawfully interfering with a motor vehicle, receiving, possession of a cannabis pipe and theft committed while on bail.

[spudchucka]

The Police were interviewed in respect of the complaint that was laid and told the reporter that they were too busy. Among the reasons listed were:

- Too many rapes - (fair enough)
- Too many murders - (again fair enough)
- Too many burglaries - (mmmm - ok)

But the kicker was - TOO MANY SPEEDERS!!!! OMFG!
They know who this fucker is, and if he is capable of such cruelty to animals - Could that not just be the start????
What a load of absolute bullshit!

[Death 'N' Taxes]

What a load of absolute bullshit!


I hope you are refering to the reasons given and not the factual accuracy of my statement.

I guess to be totally accurate - the regional a commander actually said something along the lines of:

"Our resources are currently stretched with homocides, rapes, burglaries and speeders. And is my job to prioritise the investigations"

[Beemer]

And from today's news, even more proof there are some very sick people out there. Another reason why I'd hate to be a cop.

Policeman's family cat ripped in half
01 September 2005

Huntly policeman Blair Donaldson found his dead cat ripped in half and dumped in the police station car park.


The pet Persian cat was a Christmas present for his children but was buried before they could find out about its violent death.

Senior Sergeant Donaldson found the mutilated cat two days before two Huntly youths were jailed for burning two cats to death in Huntly in April.

Mr Donaldson investigated the incident but said today he did not know if the youths were associated with the violent death of his family pet.

"It is one of the downsides of being a cop."

It is not the first time Mr Donaldson and his family have had to endure attacks on their family pets.

A year ago his wife's five-year-old golden palomino horse was attacked by someone who used a knife to cut it under its front left leg. The show horse survived but the attack ended its days in the ring.

"It was wrecked for showing. It is part and parcel of being in the police."

Mr Donaldson said his children were devastated by the death of their Persian cat. The family's other cat was now kept inside.

He said the way the cat died showed a "pretty sick mind".

"It was very sad to see Patsy treated like that."

He said it was not an accident or a dog attack.

"I am gutted, quite honestly."

Mr Donaldson said he and his wife did not know where it would end.

"We have got a couple of horses. Hello, what are we going to do when we end up in the paddock and find a scene from the Godfather or something."

In the Godfather movie a horse was killed and decapitated and the head was left in a bed.

Mr Donaldson said he would not quit the police as a result of the attacks on their pets.

"Never let the bastards win," he said.

In the Huntly District Court yesterday Wirimu Karena, student, and Sahn Papa, sawmill worker, both 18, were jailed after earlier admitting aggravated cruelty to the cats.

Karena also pleaded guilty to a other charges, including burglary, possession of cannabis, unlawfully interfering with a motor vehicle, receiving, possession of a cannabis pipe and theft committed while on bail.

Karena was jailed for a total of two years and Papa for nine months.

The cruelty incident happened in April when the pair poured solvent over the cats and set them alight after finding them in council traps in Huntly.

[spudchucka]

I hope you are refering to the reasons given and not the factual accuracy of my statement.

I guess to be totally accurate - the regional a commander actually said something along the lines of:

"Our resources are currently stretched with homocides, rapes, burglaries and speeders. And is my job to prioritise the investigations"
Show me some facts or post the full story. If the police couldn't find the resources to deal with the situation themselves it would have at least been reported to the SPCA, who are the first line of enquiry in animal cruelty offences anyway.

[spudchucka]

It is part and parcel of being in the police
No its fucken not!

[Death 'N' Taxes]

Show me some facts or post the full story. If the police couldn't find the resources to deal with the situation themselves it would have at least been reported to the SPCA, who are the first line of enquiry in animal cruelty offences anyway.


The story was reported on Nightline a few weeks back. I am more ramped up about the offender anyway.
But one of the reasons given was unacceptable.

I haven't seen the story in print so can't quote it here.
But as I said - I don't post bullshit - I don't waste my time or yours.

Whether the first line of enquiry is the SPCA (as is the IRD with tax evasion cases) to make such a statement is unacceptable.

Don't take this as an all out personal attack on the Police and its members - as I fully support the Police, especially given that my partner works alongside you guys everyday.

[Beemer]

Originally Posted by Beemer
It is part and parcel of being in the police

No its fucken not!

Um, excuse ME, spudchucka, I personally did not post that statement, it was in the middle of the item I copied from Stuff. I abhor what has been done to this cop's pet and don't agree that it should be "part and parcel of being in the police". No one should have to put up with this kind of shit.

I had actually just given you some rep for your comment about what you hope happens to the two cat killing criminals when they get to jail. Therefore could you please refrain from posting in this manner as it implies that I was the one who made this statement when in fact I wasn't.

I'd give you red bling for that but it would just be petty.

[spudchucka]

The story was reported on Nightline a few weeks back. I am more ramped up about the offender anyway.
But one of the reasons given was unacceptable.

I haven't seen the story in print so can't quote it here.
But as I said - I don't post bullshit - I don't waste my time or yours.

Whether the first line of enquiry is the SPCA (as is the IRD with tax evasion cases) to make such a statement is unacceptable.

Don't take this as an all out personal attack on the Police and its members - as I fully support the Police, especially given that my partner works alongside you guys everyday.
Fair enough. I find it quite unbelievable that the cops would do nothing. At the very least the case would have been refered to SPCA as there is a sound working relationship between the two agencies. Perhaps the district commander has simply used a poor choice of words in his explanation. I can't imagine anyone getting upset if he simply said, "We didn't have the resources at the time to deal with the matter and it was refered directly to the SPCA".

[spudchucka]

Originally Posted by Beemer
It is part and parcel of being in the police


Um, excuse ME, spudchucka, I personally did not post that statement, it was in the middle of the item I copied from Stuff. I abhor what has been done to this cop's pet and don't agree that it should be "part and parcel of being in the police". No one should have to put up with this kind of shit.

I had actually just given you some rep for your comment about what you hope happens to the two cat killing criminals when they get to jail. Therefore could you please refrain from posting in this manner as it implies that I was the one who made this statement when in fact I wasn't.

I'd give you red bling for that but it would just be petty.
Anyone that bothered to read the post would know you didn't make the statement. But I apologise profusely if I didn't post back in a manner that was suitable to you.

EDIT: The offending post has been edited to remove any reference to your good self.

[Death 'N' Taxes]

Fair enough. I find it quite unbelievable that the cops would do nothing. At the very least the case would have been refered to SPCA as there is a sound working relationship between the two agencies. Perhaps the district commander has simply used a poor choice of words in his explanation. I can't imagine anyone getting upset if he simply said, "We didn't have the resources at the time to deal with the matter and it was refered directly to the SPCA".

I agree. Perhaps just a poor choice of words.

Either these cruelty cases are becoming more and more common, or they are merely in the media spotlight at the moment.

Here's hoping they are not going to become more and more common.

[Beemer]

Anyone that bothered to read the post would know you didn't make the statement. But I apologise profusely if I didn't post back in a manner that was suitable to you.

EDIT: The offending post has been edited to remove any reference to your good self.

I'll let you off then - just this once! :nono:

I hate animal cruelty and would feel the same even if the tortured animal belonged to an enemy. Cops have to deal with enough shit in their working lives without being harrassed like this in their private lives. Where does it stop - they start with his animals and then move on to his wife and kids? Scum, total scum.

[spudchucka]

Its been proven in research that the worst violent offenders, including sadistic serial killers began their criminal lives by abusing animals. Animal cruelty is a clear indicator of future violent offending against people and the offenders should be despatched from the planet.

[Motoracer]

Man... I didn't see the original 60mins doco but I just saw the little clip on the news where they just waved their fingers and their dumb hand signs with no remorse at all.. That pissed me off so much...

When they get out of prision 9 months later, I wouldn't be surprised one single bit, if they commited murder at some point in their lives. Dumb pricks deserve to be lit on fire themselves.

[Motoracer]

Its been proven in research that the worst violent offenders, including sadistic serial killers began their criminal lives by abusing animals. Animal cruelty is a clear indicator of future violent offending against people and the offenders should be despatched from the planet.

A fuken men to that!!

[Pixie]

I saw last night that the two winners who torched the cats were both sentenced to nine months. Their only reaction was to pull faces and flash the gangsta man hand signals at the camera. Really staunch guys, you the men!

I'm hoping that there will be some large, smelly inmate that treats their bottoms like pussies and gives them both a nice dose of anal herpes to remind them of what they did for the rest of their miserable lives.
What is that hand sign,anyway?
W for Onanist?

[Ixion]

Don't like wankers who do shit to beasts that can't fight back. Go try and do it to a tiger, then I might admit that you had balls (now, the tiger's got em)

[Motu]

Grrrrrr! (http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/story.cfm?c_id=1&ObjectID=10343580)

Another one today,had his puppy for half an hour and kicked it to death,I feel kinda deflated,sad....sigh.

[Wolf]

Grrrrrr! (http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/story.cfm?c_id=1&ObjectID=10343580)

Another one today,had his puppy for half an hour and kicked it to death,I feel kinda deflated,sad....sigh.
He was probably trying to "harden it up" so it will be a tough vicious guard dog that will attack anyone who comes on the property - until someone treats it kindly for once and it'll let them empty out the house and happily follow them up the road...

Fucking retard needs more than three years inside.

[ManDownUnder]

What is that hand sign,anyway?
W for Onanist?


no no no - W for "Winston" - although onanism isn't to be rules out by any means...

[spudchucka]

What is that hand sign,anyway?
W for Onanist?
Could also be W for frotteur.

[Lou Girardin]

Perhaps their fingers are like that due to too much chlorine in the gene pool.

[Beemer]

Perhaps their fingers are like that due to too much chlorine in the gene pool.

I somehow think these guys got into the gene pool while the lifeguard wasn't looking.

[scumdog]

I somehow think these guys got into the gene pool while the lifeguard wasn't looking.

Or leap into it when the sign said "empty".

[Yokai]

EDIT: Sorry - I just read the thing about the puppy... Who teaches these people respect? F*** me that's sick. I mean... UGH. That guy needs some serious punishment - That's way too bad.

The below was meant as a slightly humorous post btw.


Animal abuse is unforgiveable. But vigilante justice achieves nothing and is also unforgiveable. Remember that there are worse crimes being committed against PEOPLE at this very moment in lounge rooms and bedrooms all over New Zealand. You just don't know about those. Yet.

But you and me Hitcher ain't nothing but mammals ... I wonder if we could claim animal abuse if we couldn't get an assault charge to stick....

[Lias]

Fuck me and its happened AGAIN. If you guys are right then we have a shitload of young serial killers growing up here in NZ.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/stuff/0,2106,3397732a10,00.html

Cat horrifically tortured to death in Nelson
02 September 2005

A Nelson family's cat was tied to a dog, strangled and dragged to death in what has been described as one of the worst cases of animal cruelty reported in the region.

Tasman District Council's animal control officer Phil Bergman was called late on Wednesday after a large dog was found wandering with the dead cat tied to its lead. The cat had one front leg tied under its chin and had been tied to the dog's lead by its neck.

Mr Bergman said the act was among the worst animal cruelty incidents he had seen. The cat had not been mauled by the dog and there was no way its death could have been an accident.

"The poor thing was doomed. It looked like it had been dragged by a car," he said. "Some people just don't like cats and do crazy things, but this has been done for sick kicks."

The dog's owner and the family who owned the cat, seven-year-old Mischief, were both "shattered", he said.

"This poor cat only had three legs anyway. Its owners were a family with young kids, and it was a much loved family pet.

"I don't know what would possess someone to do that for a cheap thrill. Cruelty to animals is rare in this neck of woods. It makes me sick to my stomach."

Mr Bergman had contacted police.

"This cannot go unpunished," he said.