Free tyres!

[Eurotred (NZ) Ltd]

Hello all,

We are the NZ distributor for Bridgestone motorcycle tyres, and we have a new product being launched next month - the new S20 Hypersport. These are born out of MotoGP development for "peak handling performance" in all road or track conditions. The marketing material we have on these is impressive, and includes such superlatives as "exceptional, confident, improved and superb".

But, are they? We need your help to decide! We are offering a set of free S20 tyres to 2 respected, professional and objective KB members, who can provide us (through this forum) with objective and honest reviews of the tyres please. Hopefully they're as good as we think they will be!

We are taking nominations for these 2 KB members from now until the end of March. Whoever gets the most nominations / votes will get a free set fitted at their local Bridgestone stockist at the end of April when the shipment arrives. Here's the fine print:

- 1 rider from North Island, 1 from South Island (different road conditions etc.)
- the product is a hypersport high-end road and track tyre (think new BT016 PRO), so those with GN250s will unfortunately not qualify
- the nominated riders agree to provide honest and objective reviews of the tyres on KB in different intervals (eg. brand new, 2,000km, 5,000km)
- the nominated riders agree to have their image and review extracts potentially used in advertising

Please let me know of any other questions. Ideally people would not nominate themselves?

If I have posted this in the incorrect forum area, or if this content/competition is not suitable for KB, I apologise in advance. Otherwise we look forward to receiving nominations and getting the real skinny on the new S20s.

[kiwifruit]

What a great offer :cool:

[slofox]

I could use some free tyres! But I can't nominate myself...damn. Oh well, never mind...I got me some 016Pro's on hold anyhoo...

[BigAl]

I nominate Slofox as he is always buying tyres:first:

[placidfemme]

I nominate DMNTD, with the amount of bikes this guy has owned and how he rides I would say he has given you a bit of business thus far

[release_the_bees]

I nominate DMNTD, with the amount of bikes this guy has owned and how he rides I would say he has given you a bit of business thus far

Sounds like a good candidate to me.

[yod]

NZsarge (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/member.php/10731-NZsarge) will give 'em a good workout!

[bucket boy]

I nominate DMNTD, with the amount of bikes this guy has owned and how he rides I would say he has given you a bit of business thus far

He would probaly bin the bike before the tyres are worn out.

[Phreak]

I nominate Grant` (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/member.php/17535-Grant), he'll give them a proper work out!!!

Also I know he'd love to give a very descriptive write-up on their performance. He'll use any excuse to go out for a ride!

:)

[SMOKEU]

I would nominate myself if I knew how to ride properly.

[placidfemme]

He would probaly bin the bike before the tyres are worn out.

You take that back!!! :mad: We all know he will bin it before they are even fitted!

[DEATH_INC.]

I'd be keen, but 5000 k's from a sports tyre???? You'd have to be kidding...

[Timmeh:P]

I am nominating Grant` as well... With his preditor he would give em a good old workout. :headbang:

If I could, I would nominate myself and chuck em on the Daytona... The last set of BT016's I had on my Striple were awesome!

[nzspokes]

Another for Grant.

Im to much of a pussy for great tyres.

[English Kiwi]

I am nominating Grant` as well... With his preditor he would give em a good old workout. :headbang:

If I could, I would nominate myself and chuck em on the Daytona... The last set of BT016's I had on my Striple were awesome!

I would nominate Grant and/or Toto! Both could give them a good write up! :yes:

but...prob can't nominate both of them :scooter:

I could do with some new tyres on my lil bike...but poor lil 250 prob wouldn't cut it! 3 months till I can get my full though!!! :banana:

[Pex Adams]

Give'em to Drew - lets see if they can do a 1.15 around Manfield on a stock RF900!!!

[Newbi]

I nominate Grant` too.

[Bikemad]

that geezer Gremlin seems to put in a lot of miles.......

[Grant`]

Thanks for that votes guys, I can defnitely guarantee racking up the k's and also differeing surface conditions living in Northland, but also attending a number of track days.

But seen as I can't vote for myself, i would also put in a vote for Gremlin with the amount of k's he does and also being such a intrepid writer in his blogs would give them a good honest review.

Cheers G

[mossy1200]

- the nominated riders agree to provide honest and objective reviews of the tyres on KB in different intervals (eg. brand new, 2,000km, 5,000km)

Havent seen anyone nominated that will get 5tho from tyres yet.
May need reports at 1k - 2k - 2.2k -2.3k.

[Fast Eddie]

feel free to nominate me for the south island. i run my tyres to the wire so can even let you know how they go when they get there ;)

[Grant`]

- the nominated riders agree to provide honest and objective reviews of the tyres on KB in different intervals (eg. brand new, 2,000km, 5,000km)

Havent seen anyone nominated that will get 5tho from tyres yet.
May need reports at 1k - 2k - 2.2k -2.3k.

I have gotten 17,000 out of a set of PR2's and I have a set of PR3's on around 8k that are just waiting for winter to roll around again (which should also be good for another 5-10k depending on usage) so I can definitely get some good life out of tyres and thats going on the track also with the Road 3's.

But depends on quality really.

[yod]

I have gotten 17,000 out of a set of PR2's and I have a set of PR3's on around 8k that are just waiting for winter to roll around again (which should also be good for another 5-10k depending on usage) so I can definitely get some good life out of tyres and thats going on the track also with the Road 3's.

But depends on quality really.

Indeed. I can't get more than 12k out of a PR2 rear and only 10k from a front.

[sil3nt]

Ah a popularity contest. This will go well.

I nominate slofox. He does good write ups and hes already buying your products!

[nathanwhite]

Another one for Grant.

Whats he at? 20something at least I think.

[mossy1200]

Ill nominate Drew then and if he gets 4000 plus with a 1.15 at Manfeild on his rf ill start buying them.im luck to get 4k from pr2s without getting on the track on my road bike.

[pritch]

I'd like to nominate Sensei. He tends to test the rubber up to the limit.

If I may be permitted to nominate two: Drew.
If he hasn't done so already, it really is about time he had a matching set of tyres. :whistle:

[BigAl]

Ah a popularity contest. This will go well.

I nominate slofox. He does good write ups and hes already buying your products!

Might I add he also works in a beer & wine shop, might be some sponsors products..... If you get my drift:cool:

[st00ji]

im sure drew would give anyone his honest and unvarnished opinion to anyone that asked for it.

also last time i saw him (a long time ago to be fair) he was riding like a mental.

so thats two ticks?

[Gremlin]

that geezer Gremlin seems to put in a lot of miles.......
Yup... except these are sports tyres, so won't fit the BMW, which is a 19" front, 17" rear. If he timed it right however, I could probably finish the review in a month (if the tyres fitted obviously) :lol:


I have gotten 17,000 out of a set of PR2's and I have a set of PR3's on around 8k that are just waiting for winter to roll around again (which should also be good for another 5-10k depending on usage) so I can definitely get some good life out of tyres and thats going on the track also with the Road 3's.
You aggressive bugger. 24k from a PR2 on the Hornet front here, but the rear will probably only get 18-20k...

[nodrog]

The testing station nominates me.

[Madness]

The testing station nominates me.

But they won't fit on your Hog, ow.

I enjoy reading Hitchers tyre reviews. He's not a believer in sports tyres for road riding though so maybe you could convert him, a popular practice here on KB lately :innocent:

[Geeen]

Another one for Mr Slofox. He can tell us egzakery how many trips to Raggers they can do:lol:

[slofox]

Another one for Mr Slofox. He can tell us egzakery how many trips to Raggers they can do:lol:

22 minutes per trip...:whistle:

[Geeen]

22 minutes per trip...:whistle:

So Tyre updates every hour then?? :2thumbsup

[slofox]

So Tyre updates every hour then?? :2thumbsup

Every hour and six minutes actually...

[SMOKEU]

I nominate onearmedbandit.

[MIXONE]

Another vote for Drew.Anybody that can punt a RF like that will definately give the rubber a good workout.

[Hitcher]

I enjoy reading Hitchers tyre reviews. He's not a believer in sports tyres for road riding though so maybe you could convert him, a popular practice here on KB lately

Hitcher's not a Bridgestone fan either, particularly of their so-called sports tourers. About the best fate that could befall those is making a mountain out of them and setting them alight.

[caspernz]

Hitcher.

As for getting 5000 clicks from a sporty tyre...ok.

[Hitcher]

93% of people who ride motorcycles on the road will derive no material benefit from using "sports" tyres. A quality sports touring tyre will perform the arse off a sports tyre in all but the most demanding conditions, and it will last more than twice as long.

The only reason sports tyres sell is Small Penis Syndrome from riders who believe that their already small willy will shrink away to absolute nothingness if their mates spot anything other than a sports tyre on their motorcycle. I guess if riders want to waste their hard-earned cash, then buying unsuitable tyres for their bikes is as good a place to start as any other.

Giving away every second set of sports tyres is one way of balancing the economic game. I am presuming that this is not the intent of Bridgestone's New Zealand agent.

[cs363]

93% of people who ride motorcycles on the road will derive no material benefit from using "sports" tyres. A quality sports touring tyre will perform the arse off a sports tyre in all but the most demanding conditions, and it will last more than twice as long.

The only reason sports tyres sell is Small Penis Syndrome from riders who believe that their already small willy will shrink away to absolute nothingness if their mates spot anything other than a sports tyre on their motorcycle. I guess if riders want to waste their hard-earned cash, then buying unsuitable tyres for their bikes is as good a place to start as any other.

Giving away every second set of sports tyres is one way of balancing the economic game. I am presuming that this is not the intent of Bridgestone's New Zealand agent.

Couldn't agree more. :niceone:

[Marmoot]

I nominate Katman

[mossy1200]

93% of people who ride motorcycles on the road will derive no material benefit from using "sports" tyres.


2% will crash prior to the tyre wearing out anyway.
3% ride like they stole it till they get caught.
2% will run on open track days.

Above comments not fact based and may contain no truth.

[caspernz]

93% of people who ride motorcycles on the road will derive no material benefit from using "sports" tyres. A quality sports touring tyre will perform the arse off a sports tyre in all but the most demanding conditions, and it will last more than twice as long.

The only reason sports tyres sell is Small Penis Syndrome from riders who believe that their already small willy will shrink away to absolute nothingness if their mates spot anything other than a sports tyre on their motorcycle. I guess if riders want to waste their hard-earned cash, then buying unsuitable tyres for their bikes is as good a place to start as any other.

Giving away every second set of sports tyres is one way of balancing the economic game. I am presuming that this is not the intent of Bridgestone's New Zealand agent.

Yeah, I largely agree. When the Power Pures first came out I wanted to try them for the supposed light carcass construction. Compared to the Pilot Road 2s at the time the difference in 'feel' and 'flickability' was significant. So for me I run a set or two of Pures during summer and then a set of Pilot Road 3s over winter.

I have an XR6 Falcon as well, so does that qualify me for BCSD as well? As in Big Car Small Dick...:rolleyes:

[Hitcher]

Rather than giving a set away, a better test would be for the same rider to test these tyres against a "benchmark" set on the same bike, same road in the same conditions. That "benchmark" set could be a sports touring tyre or the opposition's comparable sports rubber. The road could be Stratford to Taumarunui, or in the South Island, Balclutha to Invercargill via Owaka. The choice of bike is academic.

The second half of the test could be to see how many km it took to wear a set out, again compared to comparable tyres. If the test bike was a Suzuki Bandit 1250 (or equivalent), I would be very surprised if 5,000km was possible.

[caspernz]

Fair call Mr Hitcher. How about two identical bikes on a racetrack, two riders swapping bikes at set intervals? Wouldn't take long to see how the new tyres fare against the competition...

[Pussy]

If the new ones are anywhere near as good as the BT 016, I will be buying them.
The BT 016 is my tyre of choice on the sem fiddy.

[Pussy]

I nominate Movistar.
Paul would give an honest no bullshit objective opinion.


Edit: You won't find Paul doing the "Look at me!!", either.

[Hitcher]

Fair call Mr Hitcher. How about two identical bikes on a racetrack, two riders swapping bikes at set intervals? Wouldn't take long to see how the new tyres fare against the competition...

I wouldn't use a race track. That's where sports tyres are designed to be at their best. They get nice and hot and ridden on lovely even surfaces at speeds in excess of 104kmh. A comparison with a sports touring tyre in those conditions could be a bit unfair.

And in any comparative test, the tyres should be blind tested -- riders shouldn't know what tyres are on their bikes.

[mossy1200]

I wouldn't use a race track. That's where sports tyres are designed to be at their best. They get nice and hot and ridden on lovely even surfaces at speeds in excess of 104kmh. A comparison with a sports touring tyre in those conditions could be a bit unfair.

And in any comparative test, the tyres should be blind tested -- riders shouldn't know what tyres are on their bikes.

im not sure blindfolding riders is a good idea

[Kickaha]

They aren't talking about "testing tyres" they're talking about someone using them and giving an review on them

[caspernz]

They aren't talking about "testing tyres" they're talking about someone using them and giving an review on them

Fair call, so feel free to nominate me. Tyres will be worn out in a couple of months and I can string words together...

[Hitcher]

They aren't talking about "testing tyres" they're talking about someone using them and giving an review on them

I understand that. The "objective professional" riders chosen for this "test" will inevitably make a comparison with other tyres they've ridden before. These may well be the shit-hottest sports tyres ever made. But any "test" that doesn't offer some sort of scientific comparison is largely meaningless.

[mossy1200]

Nomy me i need 2 fronts and one rear.
Ill make tractor bike push them for approx (rear 3500km ,front 1 at front 6000 and front 2 at back 20000km approx).Review (straight up)avaliable every 1mm wear on rear.

[Kickaha]

I understand that. The "objective professional" riders chosen for this "test" will inevitably make a comparison with other tyres they've ridden before. These may well be the shit-hottest sports tyres ever made. But any "test" that doesn't offer some sort of scientific comparison is largely meaningless.

Good job it isn't a test then

[scracha]

respected, professional and objective KB members,

Drew it is then.

[Kickaha]

Drew it is then.

They'll be well fucked finding a member that qualifies on one of those let alone all three

[ducatilover]

I nominate Drew for north island testing.
Onearmedbandit for south.

I would also like a video of Drew beating the shit out of that poor RF that he should let me have. :2thumbsup

[Big Dave]

GI Joe. <tenchars> </tenchars>

[Katman]

I nominate Katman

What the fuck are radials?

[steve_t]

+1 for local boy, Slofox :2thumbsup

[St_Gabriel]

And another vote for Slofox.

[AllanB]

No one has asked the most important question. Do they have a really cool tread pattern?

[Conquiztador]

No one has asked the most important question. Do they have a really cool tread pattern?

And white walls!!!

[cowboyz]

Ill vote for banditrider. He rides in anything ALL the time. Real world performance and he is litterate. If they only last 5k then you will have your report in 3 weeks :)

[yod]

Ill vote for banditrider. He rides in anything ALL the time. Real world performance and he is litterate. If they only last 5k then you will have your report in 3 weeks :)

i'll second that, he's an ideal candidate

[ducatilover]

Ill vote for banditrider. He rides in anything ALL the time. Real world performance and he is litterate. If they only last 5k then you will have your report in 3 weeks :)
If I change my vote to you, can I ride your 9?

[jrandom]

I nominate Drew for north island testing.
Onearmedbandit for south.

Hopefully their motorcycle riding is the common factor that qualifies them.

:sweatdrop


93% of people who ride motorcycles on the road will derive no material benefit from using "sports" tyres. A quality sports touring tyre will perform the arse off a sports tyre in all but the most demanding conditions, and it will last more than twice as long.

The only reason sports tyres sell is Small Penis Syndrome from riders who believe that their already small willy will shrink away to absolute nothingness if their mates spot anything other than a sports tyre on their motorcycle.

Oh dear.

Hitcher, you are wrong. The fallacy of your post lies in those words 'all but the most demanding conditions'.

Also 'more than twice as long'. (But not in reference to small penises.)

To address.

'Demanding conditions': Rather than generalise, or start the argument about how what works on the racetrack in the wet and the dry does also work on the road, I'll just tell you about the time that I exited a corner on SH16, throttled on, and my rear Pilot Road 2 went gently sideways. In fourth gear. On a GSX1400, not on some hyperbike. It wasn't anything wrong with the road surface. The tyre was simply overwhelmed.

It is possible and, in fact, usual, to ride within the performance envelope of 'sport touring' tyres. However, it is undeniable that they offer less traction, wet and dry. The tradeoff of less traction for more life is their raison d'être. My argument in favour of 'sport' tyres (and by this I mean tyres that work well in the rain, not cut slicks like Super Corsas, etc) is that on a motorcycle, at any time, one could find oneself needing to step outside the performance envelope of 'sport touring' tyres to stay alive.

Ride on them gently, by all means, but you have no metal cage around you and no airbags, and every day you go out on them, you'll be rolling the dice and hoping that you don't encounter a situation that your reflexes and your machine can handle safely, but that your tyres cannot.

For this reason, I'll always put the stickiest tyres I can find (once again, taking wet as well as dry performance into consideration) on all of my bikes.

It's a simple question of safety. Penises don't enter into it. And I shall continue advising any n00b who asks to follow the same path. I believe your condemnation of it to be irresponsible.

'More than twice as long': Simply incorrect. Once again, with the Pilot Power vs Pilot Road comparison, on the same bike, being ridden similarly (ie, gently), I've found that PPs will give you 8,000km where PRs will give you 10-12,000km. The difference is not that great. I'd welcome comments from anyone who's performed the same experiment on their bike.

(I hope you're not trying to compare wear rates on tyres being used at completely different paces, ie, fast and loose versus gentle touring. That would be unworthy of you. I expect a more precise approach to discussion. Sport tyres allow you to ride faster safely and consequently wear them out more quickly if you wish, but that's hardly a drawback.)

[pritch]

the performance envelope of 'sport touring' tyres. However, it is undeniable that they offer less traction, wet and dry.



I don't always agree with Hitcher, and in this instance while his tone was perhaps deliberately provocative, his remarks re grip and tyre life are generally not too wide of the mark. Most riders peobably don't need all of the grip sports tyres offer and the ST tyres definitely last longer.

Your statement above, however, is demonstrably incorrect. The major manufacturers put their best wet weather technology into sport touring tyres. Feel free to visit their websites and check that out.

Perhaps their market research indicates that sport bike riders stay home if it looks like it might rain?

[jrandom]

Most riders peobably don't need all of the grip sports tyres offer

This 'probably don't need...' attitude is precisely what I was trying to address with my post above.

I am strongly opposed to it. It's not about penis size and going fast; sometimes, it's just about being able to safely stop and turn in a way you didn't expect you'd need to.


The major manufacturers put their best wet weather technology into sport touring tyres...

Perhaps their market research indicates that sport bike riders stay home if it looks like it might rain?

We might be running into an issue of definition here. (It's been pointed out to me that the tyres this thread is about are the flavour I specifically excluded from my post, namely cut racing slicks that aren't designed for use in the wet.)

My position is that the stickiest tyres across all road conditions are always the best choice. I won't try to label any particular model of tyre that I haven't tried myself 'sport' or 'touring', but if a manufacturer offers two flavours of tyre, both designed for all-conditions road use, I believe that a rider is foolish to choose the longer-life lower-stickiness option.

[Kornholio]

I nominate DMNTD, with the amount of bikes this guy has owned and how he rides I would say he has given you a bit of business thus far

Unfortunately the bike spends more time on the road than the tires do... If it was testing crash bungs, he would be ideal Neil :sunny::sweatdrop

[jrandom]

These are born out of MotoGP development for "peak handling performance" in all road or track conditions.

Do you expect them to perform well in the rain?


- the product is a hypersport high-end road and track tyre (think new BT016 PRO), so those with GN250s will unfortunately not qualify

What sizes is it available in? Only for 17" rims, I suppose?

(No, I'm not thinking of putting them on the Harley.)

[Kornholio]

Drew it is then.

Yep, 1 more for Drew and onearmedbandit for the south island .... I would like to know they are being 'tested' properly :bash:

[mossy1200]

I dont believe top end sport tyres grip any better than top end sport tour tyres unless your prepaired to run 30 pounds (hot) in them and get them above 70 degrees in temp.So you need to speed and get 2000km life expectancy to make them worth while unless you like the look of almost no grooves in your rubber for :wings: factor.

Your just as likely to fail on a sport tyre running at under 70degrees as a touring tyre at normal operating temp.

[jrandom]

I dont believe top end sport tyres grip any better than top end sport tour tyres... Your just as likely to fail on a sport tyre running at under 70degrees as a touring tyre at normal operating temp.

That's very tyre dependent. Some 'sport' tyres warm up very quickly.

Again, it's about choosing a tyre that's appropriate. And you're talking about cut racing slicks again. Those are generally inappropriate for the road because they work poorly in the wet due to lack of tread. (And sometimes due to temperature issues, as you say; Super Corsas being the worst offenders IMHO.)

[Pussy]

I'm prepared to run sports tyres instead of sport/touring jobbies for the extra adhesion.
Don't last as long? Probably. Stick better? IMHO, definitely. I have a real aversion to road rash....

[mossy1200]

That's very tyre dependent. Some 'sport' tyres warm up very quickly.

Again, it's about choosing a tyre that's appropriate. And you're talking about cut racing slicks again. Those are generally inappropriate for the road because they work poorly in the wet due to lack of tread. (And sometimes due to temperature issues, as you say; Super Corsas being the worst offenders IMHO.)


http://www.bridgestone.eu/press/press-releases/2011/bridgestone-launches-battlax-hyper-sport-s20-motorcycle-tyre


Ok i withdraw some of what i said because even though claimed tyre is track suitable its really only a sports version of battlax and not Super Corsa killing treaded race tyre that f2 will want to race on.

[mossy1200]

I'm prepared to run sports tyres instead of sport/touring jobbies for the extra adhesion.
Don't last as long? Probably. Stick better? IMHO, definitely. I have a real aversion to road rash....

And you never speed and dont search the tightest winding road judging performance by knee scraper wear?

[pritch]

I am familiar with the expression, "Better to have more tyre than you need, than to need more tyre than you have.' And I don't disagree with that at all.

The best advice I've come across though is different.
"The more honest you are with yourself as to how you will use your tyres, the better service you will get from them."

The guy who buys sports rubber because he thinks he's the next Valentino Rossi but rides like a nana is just wasting money. These guys do exist.

If I was planning on a track day I would change to a sports tyre. Since I'm not currently planning on a track day, I use ST tyres because they will give me all the grip I need, better grip than a sports tyre in the wet, and they'll last longer.

Some of the fastest riders I know use ST rubber without problems. I think perhaps you don't realise just how good the latest ST products from Metzeler, Pirelli, Dunlop, and Michelin are.

Just realised I omitted Bridgestone from that list. A Freudian slip perhaps? I threw my last set of BT 020s away early because they felt lethal in the wet.

[jrandom]

better grip than a sports tyre in the wet

We may be talking at cross-purposes, then. I wouldn't put a tyre on my bike that didn't work well in the wet, either. In fact I'd probably choose wet performance over dry performance.

I wrote my post with the Pilot Road vs Pilot Power question in mind. In that particular instance, there's never a good reason to choose the Roads. But other manufacturers undoubtedly offer different tradeoffs. And, for that matter, Powers are what I'd call 'sport touring'.

Wet grip is paramount.


I threw my last set of BT 020s away early because they felt lethal in the wet.

I did exactly the same. BT020s are dangerous.

[jrandom]

Getting back to the OP, I see the website claims "Bridgestone tests show that the S20 wet grip is even better than the BT-016 Pro, already the established standard in the wet. Results also show the high stability that comes from improved grip, with easy control in heavy rain conditions."

Based on that, they sound like a pretty good choice.

[mossy1200]

A premium sport tyre inspired by Bridgestone’s MotoGP technology

Bridgestone has strengthened its motorcycle tyre line-up with the launch of a premium sport tyre: the Battlax Hyper Sport S20 for riders of high-powered machines from 600 to 1300 cc. Using the “S” (= Sport) symbol for the first time on a Battlax tyre, the premium S20 completes Bridgestone’s Hyper Sport product line-up that includes the Battlax BT-016 Pro and BT-016 amongst other sport specialists for road and track.

MotGP technology = black and fits onto rim
Using the “S” = we think it sticks more than standard battlax


Immediate grip

The new compound with Silica Rich and Bridgestone’s proprietary NanoPro-TechTM polymer, which reduces heat build-up during tyre rotation, provides improved grip in the wet and at low temperatures. This gives confident grip right from the start during warm-up, without sacrificing mileage performance on front or rear.

The triple-layer compound (3LC) with an optimized segmentation of soft and harder compound has been applied on front and rear, improving dry grip as well as giving high stability in cornering and good mileage.


NanoPro-TechTM polymer = now we have you with big words



Conclusion S20 = sports tour tyre in the style of Pirr 2ct not track dry condition comp orientated sports tyre

[Hitcher]

I threw my last set of BT 020s away early because they felt lethal in the wet.

The 021s were little better than the 020s. I had 020s as OEMs on a ZRX1200R, ST1300 and an FJR1300T. My current steed had 021s as its OEM rubber. Podgy and lardarse on the handling stakes, skittery in the dry and disturbingly ambiguous in the wet. The rears outlast the fronts. Hence my reluctance, fuelled by online tyre reviews, to avoid the 023s. Meanwhile Bridgestone's competitors in the sports touring tyre market have had a considerable lead on them since 2007, a gap that Bridgestone hasn't closed even to that point. Meanwhile other manufacturers have since 2008 moved even further ahead with such tyres as the Avon Storm Ultra, Conti Road Attack 2 and 2 GT, Dunlop with the Roadsmart and now the Roadsmart 2, Metzeler with the Z8, Michelin with the Pilot Road 2 and PR3, Pirelli with the Angel, and so on.

[Hitcher]

Ill vote for banditrider. He rides in anything ALL the time. Real world performance and he is litterate. If they only last 5k then you will have your report in 3 weeks :)

Sounds like a good choice. A Connie should be a good test mule too.

[BMWST?]

Yeah, I largely agree. When the Power Pures first came out I wanted to try them for the supposed light carcass construction. Compared to the Pilot Road 2s at the time the difference in 'feel' and 'flickability' was significant. So for me I run a set or two of Pures during summer and then a set of Pilot Road 3s over winter.

I have an XR6 Falcon as well, so does that qualify me for BCSD as well? As in Big Car Small Dick...:rolleyes:

xr6....no only xr6 turbo or xr8 will qualify

[mossy1200]

The 021s were little better than the 020s. I had 020s as OEMs on a ZRX1200R, ST1300 and an FJR1300T. My current steed had 021s as its OEM rubber. Podgy and lardarse on the handling stakes, skittery in the dry and disturbingly ambiguous in the wet. The rears outlast the fronts. Hence my reluctance, fuelled by online tyre reviews, to avoid the 023s. Meanwhile Bridgestone's competitors in the sports touring tyre market have had a considerable lead on them since 2007, a gap that Bridgestone hasn't closed even to that point. Meanwhile other manufacturers have since 2008 moved even further ahead with such tyres as the Avon Storm Ultra, Conti Road Attack 2 and 2 GT, Dunlop with the Roadsmart and now the Roadsmart 2, Metzeler with the Z8, Michelin with the Pilot Road 2 and PR3, Pirelli with the Angel, and so on.


BT-020 and S20 hypersport are 2 different tyres

OE zzr1400 GSXR1000 CBR1000rr 2012 models.

[Hitcher]

It is possible and, in fact, usual, to ride within the performance envelope of 'sport touring' tyres. However, it is undeniable that they offer less traction, wet and dry. The tradeoff of less traction for more life is their raison d'être. My argument in favour of 'sport' tyres (and by this I mean tyres that work well in the rain, not cut slicks like Super Corsas, etc) is that on a motorcycle, at any time, one could find oneself needing to step outside the performance envelope of 'sport touring' tyres to stay alive.

My mother once said "Hitcher, don't argue on the Internet!"

I have had some experience with sports tyres (a set of Qualifiers on an Aprilia Shiver, and a set of Diablo Rossos on a GSX1250FA). In both cases they went well when they were well warmed up. The Qualifiers suited the Shiver very well, with nice sharp handling and even grip around the curvature of the tyre. But the Avon Storms that replaced them were just as good in those terms.

The Rossos didn't suit the Suzuki. Even when they were really hot, they didn't feel any better in terms of their handling than the Z8s they replaced. When only warm they were very heavy on the steering stakes and uncertain handling in the wet, if the Waioeka Gorge in a thunderstorm is a good test.

I stand by my view that most riders, on the road, are unlikely to get a sports tyre's temperature to a point where it will materially outperform a sports tourer in the same conditions.

"Yes Mum, I hear you."

[jrandom]

I stand by my view that most riders, on the road, are unlikely to get a sports tyre's temperature to a point where it will materially outperform a sports tourer in the same conditions.

I offer you the Pilot Power 2CT and, quite possibly, the new Bridgestones that this thread is about as counter-examples that do in fact heat up quickly without being thrashed, and offer real performance benefits over longer-life tyres in all conditions.

[jrandom]

Of course, this is all somewhat academic for me. With a Scorpio and a Sportster, Metzeler Lasertecs are pretty much my only reasonably sticky option. I do wish tyre manufacturers would make a bigger assortment of sticky rubber to fit non-sportbike wheels, but I guess it wouldn't be commercially viable.

HD put 17" rims on the XR1200 for good reason.

[AllanB]

I've just sold off a pair of very low km Pilot Powers as I did not like the aggressive nature of the front profile when cornering - my preference is to be the one in control, not the tyre dropping it in! Just a personal thing, my preference is for neutral steering tyres. They did grip well!

Now I'm on a new set of Conti Road Attack 2's. I must say I am so far very very impressed and as I am more comfortable with the steering I am quicker on these than the sport PP.


Yet another factor to consider when purchasing tyres.

[jrandom]

I like tyres with a nice slow turn-in, so that I can provide large, clumsy inputs without unsettling the bike as much.

gZKhoFbL7Fo

[AllanB]

Bastard! U saying I'm ready for a Harley? Ah - was he happy with the result. LOL Chances are he removed the car tyre as it was not a officially licensed HD product .....



Thinking of this thread I have noticed the majority of sports bikes I see now tend to be running sport touring tyres .......
I suspect they have worked out that they stick just as well as the hyper tyres in the dry, better in the wet and last longer.

[p.dath]

I nominate OutForADuck (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/member.php/8709-OutForADuck) from the north island (Auckland). He is the best and most experienced rider that I know, and will be sure to give them a good pasting and an honest review.

He also gives a lot of his time helping out other riders such as at AMCC ART days and a NASS.

[BoristheBiter]

If the new ones are anywhere near as good as the BT 016, I will be buying them.
The BT 016 is my tyre of choice on the sem fiddy.

After having three stets of 016 I now have the pros's on and the only difference I can feel is in the wet.
The old ones always felt a little nervous in the wet but these definitely feel a lot better.
As for the track I will know next week after two days at Taupo.


I nominate OutForADuck (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/member.php/8709-OutForADuck) from the north island (Auckland). He is the best and most experienced rider that I know, and will be sure to give them a good pasting and an honest review.

Perhaps on this street fighter ...

+1 for Duck.

[Ocean1]

I wrote my post with the Pilot Road vs Pilot Power question in mind. In that particular instance, there's never a good reason to choose the Roads. But other manufacturers undoubtedly offer different tradeoffs. And, for that matter, Powers are what I'd call 'sport touring'.

Wet grip is paramount.


I offer you the Pilot Power 2CT and, quite possibly, the new Bridgestones that this thread is about as counter-examples that do in fact heat up quickly without being thrashed, and offer real performance benefits over longer-life tyres in all conditions.

Compound on the side of the PR and PP2CT rear is identical. Profile looks and feels the same, tread is slightly different. The only difference I've seen in performance is the PR squirms slightly more when upright and, on anything with a bit of torque lasts 'prox twice as long.

[XP@]

I could put 1000km's a week on them for you. Every week until they were no more.

But I think you may have trouble fitting them to my Translap :-( Unless you could provide them attached to another bike...

However if you have any dual sport style rubber you can fit to a Transalp I would gladly put it through its paces.

[jrandom]

Profile looks and feels the same

Have you been smoking crack, sir?

<img src="http://i39.tinypic.com/1zp0jva.jpg"/> <img src="http://i40.tinypic.com/29e3g55.jpg"/>


on anything with a bit of torque lasts 'prox twice as long.

I've already posted the mileage results I got from my best attempt at a fair back-to-back comparison on a GSX1400. I'd be extraordinarily surprised if you had results that contradicted them. I suspect you of having formed that impression without having consciously gathered data.

[Ocean1]

I've already posted the mileage results I got from my best attempt at a fair back-to-back comparison on a GSX1400. I'd be extraordinarily surprised if you had results that contradicted them. I suspect you of having formed that impression without having consciously gathered data.

Oh yeah, the profile's quite different eh?

Until you put them on and inflate them.

Didn't read your writeup, will later but I got 11K from PR2CT rear on the XB12 and just under 6 from the PP. Notably it was the middle of the PP that went, quite early, I persevered with it for another 1K after that.

[ducatilover]

I've just sold off a pair of very low km Pilot Powers as I did not like the aggressive nature of the front profile when cornering - my preference is to be the one in control, not the tyre dropping it in! Just a personal thing, my preference is for neutral steering tyres. They did grip well!

To each their own eh? I love the way my PP 2cts are, supposedly over the top for a fat porky bike, but I think they tip in nicely and have made the bike uber stable and no more wheelspin :laugh: although some twat had put a 150 on the rear instead of a 160... I love how they are in the wet too, but having said that I don't ride that fast.

[Hitcher]

Perhaps others should heed my Mum's words of warning.

[cs363]

Perhaps others should heed my Mum's words of warning.

Unlikely.....tyre threads are like chain cleaning/lubing and 'what engine oil should I use?' threads...

[Hitcher]

Except on Facebook. People there can be too fucking nice. It's just not right.

[Spazman727]

Im gonna say Slofox, he seems like the right sort of guy for this, not that I've met him however.

[SPP]

I don’t really know these people but could be convinced with a good report from:

North Island:

OutForADuck
Kiwifruit
Drew
DMNTD
Grant’


South Island:

Onearmedbandit
Quickbuck


... otherwise I'm buying Dunlop Q2s again; phenomenal tyres wet or dry, road or track.

[cs363]

Facebook. It's just not right.

There, fixed that for you :)

[steve_t]

Perhaps others should heed my Mum's words of warning.

I must have missed those wise words. I'm guessing you're not referring to "Don't be a fool, wrap your tool"? :corn:

[JayRacer37]

First of all, I apologise for the quote festival I am having below. Secondly, I will add right from the beginning (so there is no confusion or doubt) that I work for the importer and original post maker (Eurotred NZ) and therefore any comment's may have a bias. :innocent:


I dont believe top end sport tyres grip any better than top end sport tour tyres unless your prepaired to run 30 pounds (hot) in them and get them above 70 degrees in temp.So you need to speed and get 2000km life expectancy to make them worth while unless you like the look of almost no grooves in your rubber for :wings: factor.

Your just as likely to fail on a sport tyre running at under 70degrees as a touring tyre at normal operating temp.

Mossy, I would agree with you on the above point entirely, on the proviso you are referring to race DOT approved tyres (Pirelli SuperCorsa Pro, Bridgestone R10, Metzeler Racetec, Michelin Power One, Dunlop D211 GP Racer). These are indeed no better (and in many cases, worse) for ROAD use. They are designed for racing, and nothing but - cold use, wet grip and longevity have no place in the designs of these tyres, and they are not designed to provide grip below about 70deg. HOWEVER - a sports tyre (Bridgestone S20 (as being given away in this thread) Michelin Pilot Power 2CT, Continental Sport Attack, Dunlop Qualifier etc) are designed for road use, and in that have a lower temp window (say, 20-100deg) for use, they are designed including elements like Silica (for wet weather and cold condition riding) and then with Bridgestone elements like RC-polymer to control the temprature effects of Silica. These tyres are designed for Sport's bikes in road use. This means profiles that are made to suit bikes like that.


That's very tyre dependent. Some 'sport' tyres warm up very quickly.

Again, it's about choosing a tyre that's appropriate. And you're talking about cut racing slicks again. Those are generally inappropriate for the road because they work poorly in the wet due to lack of tread. (And sometimes due to temperature issues, as you say; Super Corsas being the worst offenders IMHO.)

Jrandom, agreed - as above, a DOT race tyre is not really appropriate for the road, and SuperCorsa's fall under that. a Sports tyre however, is road appropriate.


http://www.bridgestone.eu/press/press-releases/2011/bridgestone-launches-battlax-hyper-sport-s20-motorcycle-tyre


Ok i withdraw some of what i said because even though claimed tyre is track suitable its really only a sports version of battlax and not Super Corsa killing treaded race tyre that f2 will want to race on.

Yes, S20 is a development of BT016-PRO - a sport's road tyre. R10 is Bridgestone's DOT race tyre for 600 Supersport racing/F2.


We may be talking at cross-purposes, then. I wouldn't put a tyre on my bike that didn't work well in the wet, either. In fact I'd probably choose wet performance over dry performance.

I wrote my post with the Pilot Road vs Pilot Power question in mind. In that particular instance, there's never a good reason to choose the Roads. But other manufacturers undoubtedly offer different tradeoffs. And, for that matter, Powers are what I'd call 'sport touring'.

Wet grip is paramount.

I did exactly the same. BT020s are dangerous.

S20's could be for you then - in this particular market segment the Bridgestone's are renoun for their wet performance, and S20 is aiming to improve on that.


The 021s were little better than the 020s. I had 020s as OEMs on a ZRX1200R, ST1300 and an FJR1300T. My current steed had 021s as its OEM rubber. Podgy and lardarse on the handling stakes, skittery in the dry and disturbingly ambiguous in the wet. The rears outlast the fronts. Hence my reluctance, fuelled by online tyre reviews, to avoid the 023s. Meanwhile Bridgestone's competitors in the sports touring tyre market have had a considerable lead on them since 2007, a gap that Bridgestone hasn't closed even to that point. Meanwhile other manufacturers have since 2008 moved even further ahead with such tyres as the Avon Storm Ultra, Conti Road Attack 2 and 2 GT, Dunlop with the Roadsmart and now the Roadsmart 2, Metzeler with the Z8, Michelin with the Pilot Road 2 and PR3, Pirelli with the Angel, and so on.

Hitcher, I have to disagree with you here.

The first part of your post refering to OEM tyres is accurate. OEM tyres are usually, to put it bluntly, shit. This applies to all OEM tyres, not just Bridgestone, but Dunlop, Michelin, etc. There are many reasons for this which I won't go into her but the main one is cost to the manufacturers. My point is that a BT021 or BT023 OEM tyre (on a new bike) is not the same tyre or quality you will buy through a shop - the constuction and compound is different and almost always better.


The Rossos didn't suit the Suzuki. Even when they were really hot, they didn't feel any better in terms of their handling than the Z8s they replaced. When only warm they were very heavy on the steering stakes and uncertain handling in the wet, if the Waioeka Gorge in a thunderstorm is a good test.

I stand by my view that most riders, on the road, are unlikely to get a sports tyre's temperature to a point where it will materially outperform a sports tourer in the same conditions.

The Rosso's are a step further away towards race use than S20 Hitcher, they are similar to Bridgestone BT003-RS, or Michelin Power Pure - these are designed with trackdays and fast, dry road riding in mind.

I disagree with the second paragraph in that a sport's tyre for road use (as mentioned near the start of my reply) is a different animal to a race tyre that is road legal.


I offer you the Pilot Power 2CT and, quite possibly, the new Bridgestones that this thread is about as counter-examples that do in fact heat up quickly without being thrashed, and offer real performance benefits over longer-life tyres in all conditions.

Correct - these are examples of sport's road tyres, that do as designed what most race tyres cannot. Because of this they are often a better road choice for Sport's Bikes than Full Sports touring tyres (Bridgestone BT023, Conti Road Attack, Michelin Pilot Road 3).

Hope I haven't bored any of you to tears...

[nodrog]

.... massive wall of text ...

So can I have some free tyres or what? :sunny:

[JayRacer37]

To clarify on my essay above, tyre catogories seem to be the main issue here. Below are the catagories as I see them;

Sport-Touring
These tyres are designed for potentially heavier bikes (FJR1300, Bandit's etc). They are made for lower temprature applications (0deg to 80deg - ish). They include elements in the construction of the tyre to suit wet and cold weather riding (Silica). The profile is probably flatter than a sportier tyre and give very neutral feedback to the rider (they don't tip in rapidly, you will have to work a bit more to lean them).

Common tyre's in NZ in this catagory are; (I have only listed current model tyres to save confusion, and there are certainly models I have missed)

Bridgestone BT023
Michelin Pilot Road 3
Pirelli Angel ST
Metzeler Z8
Continental Road Attack 2

Sport's/Hypersports
These tyres are designed for sports bikes (600's and 1000's, and similar) that are used on the road. They would also be appropriate for bike's like Hayabusa/Blackbird, or naked or touring bikes that are ridden a little harder. They will usually have elements like Silica to give them better wet performance, in the case of some brands (Bridgestone being the one I am familiar with) have other additional elements like RC-polymer, which stops the Silica bleeding out of the tyre at higher temprature. This gives them a wider useful temprature corridor (say, 15deg-100deg - ish). They will likely have a slightly more agressive profile that makes the bike turn in quicker than a sport-touring tyre. They are still designed to be very competent in the wet and cold, and should give reasonable milage.

Common tyre's in NZ in this category are; (I have only listed current model tyres to save confusion, and there are certainly models I have missed)

Bridgestone BT016-PRO and S20, as featured in this thread
Continental Sport Attack
Michelin Pilot Power 2CT
Dunlop Qualifier (I think)
Pirelli Diablo Rosso II

Trackday - also think fast road use
These tyre's are made for very fast road use, and trackdays. There profiles probably mimic the full DOT race tyres, but the compounding is made so they don't require a warmer to get to the correct opperating tempratures. The temp corridors for these are likely 50deg-120deg. Because of this they won't be very friendly in the wet (no Silica) and they won't last as long (softer compuond, not as hard wearing).

Common tyre's in NZ in this category are; (I have only listed current model tyres to save confusion, and there are certainly models I have missed)

Bridgestone BT003-RS
Metzeler Racetec K3 compound
Michelin Pilot Pure
Continental Race attack Street
Pirelli Diablo Rosso Corsa

DOT race tyre
These are all about the laptime. Road legal but only because the class of racing specifies they must be. They are designed for warmers, and won't get warm enough without them. (temp corridor 80deg plus) They are not designed for wet grip, or milage. The profiles are ultra-agressive for racing, a potentially bad mix when the tyres are run without warmers, the feedback will be minimal.

Common tyre's in NZ in this category are; (I have only listed current model tyres to save confusion, and there are certainly models I have missed)

Bridgestone R10
Continental Race Attack
Michelin Power One
Metzeler Racetec
Pirelli Supercorsa Pro
Dunlop D211 GP racer (I think)


The tyre's Eurotred (NZ) are giving away to two guys to test are S20. They are designed for road use, up to and including the odd trackday, also for wet road use. For real world use on most sports bikes, they should be the best tyre avalible - this is what Eurotred (NZ) is trying to find out with this promotion!

Cheers Guys - pardon my spelling, I can't use a spell check on this PC :shutup:

[JayRacer37]

So can I have some free tyres or what? :sunny:

Depends if you get nominated or not! :yes:

[kiwifruit]

Jay for P.M

[BigAl]

Well, that clears that up then!

[Paul in NZ]

I'm guessing that some new rubber for my old (1980) Moto Guzzi is out of the question then? You know - narrow 18" wheels?

[mossy1200]

Depends if you get nominated or not! :yes:

Quickest way to kill a thread is with all the correct answers. Now what do we do? Thanks Jay ,going to need kick a ball around the park..Thread killer:angry:

[Hitcher]

Hope I haven't bored any of you to tears...

Tough call. I'm really struggling with your revelation that OEM tyres are different to the same models bought through a shop.

This is an arrangement that seems detrimental to the reputations of both the manufacturers of the tyres and the motorcycles to which those tyres are fitted. It's a revelation that also presumes that there would be some labelling distinction, so that manufacturers could distinguish between tyres in the event of a warranty claim being made. But perhaps they choose to swallow any and all losses on the basis that having been disenchanted by a suboptimal experience with OEM tyres, a rider will replace with the same model tyre when the OEMs wear out. It's also an arrangement, if indeed it is true, that paints a particularly bad picture of a tyre manufacturer's desire to make a sale at any cost.

In my case Mr Kawasaki, Mr Honda, Mr Yamaha and Mr Suzuki's decision to fit their steeds with OEM Bridgestones has resulted in a statistically repeatable trend of associating Mr Bridgestone's "sports touring" tyres with shit handling. That is why, like some professional tyre reviewers, I now subscribe to a view that the best fate for 020s, 021s and probably 023s, is to push them into a big pile and set them alight.

Thanks to your revelation I now know that I should get documentary evidence from Mr Bridgestone, on the unlikely event that I am ever tempted to try a set of his tyres, that the tyres I am about to buy are of a superior standard to those that may be fitted as OEMs.

[steve_t]

Tough call. I'm really struggling with your revelation that OEM tyres are different to the same models bought through a shop.

This is an arrangement that seems detrimental to the reputations of both the manufacturers of the tyres and the motorcycles to which those tyres are fitted. It's a revelation that also presumes that there would be some labelling distinction, so that manufacturers could distinguish between tyres in the event of a warranty claim being made. But perhaps they choose to swallow any and all losses on the basis that having been disenchanted by a suboptimal experience with OEM tyres, a rider will replace with the same model tyre when the OEMs wear out. It's also an arrangement, if indeed it is true, that paints a particularly bad picture of a tyre manufacturer's desire to make a sale at any cost.

In my case Mr Kawasaki, Mr Honda, Mr Yamaha and Mr Suzuki's decision to fit their steeds with OEM Bridgestones has resulted in a statistically repeatable trend of associating Mr Bridgestone's "sports touring" tyres with shit handling. That is why, like some professional tyre reviewers, I now subscribe to a view that the best fate for 020s, 021s and probably 023s, is to push them into a big pile and set them alight.

Thanks to your revelation I now know that I should get documentary evidence from Mr Bridgestone, on the unlikely event that I am ever tempted to try a set of his tyres, that the tyres I am about to buy are of a superior standard to those that may be fitted as OEMs.

Agree. What's the deal with that anyway? The BT-016s that came with the bike are totally shithouse compared to the replacement ones I got. I only got them because I'd read that the bought ones were better than the stock ones, even though they're the 'same' model.

[Hitcher]

Quickest way to kill a thread is with all the correct answers.

In that case, I think that this thread is still alive.

[jrandom]

Tough call. I'm really struggling with your revelation that OEM tyres are different to the same models bought through a shop.

I'm astonished that this is news to you. It was common knowledge when I was hanging out on uk.rec.motorcycles ten years ago and BT010s were the tyre du jour.

I agree that it makes no apparent commercial sense.

[Pussy]

Hitcher.... surely you jest?
The OEM BT 016 tyres ARE labelled differently.
On the 08-10 sem fiddy, for instance, the OEM rear BT016 was only two compound, not three as in the over-the-counter ones.
OEM tyres are often made lighter, or to a manufacturer spec.
Anyway... I digress... I WILL be trying the new ones.

[mossy1200]

I'm astonished that this is news to you. It was common knowledge when I was hanging out on uk.rec.motorcycles ten years ago and BT010s were the tyre du jour.

I agree that it makes no apparent commercial sense.

When i got my bmwr1200s it had Pilot Power2cts on it and they seemed to be as good as the next set I got.Is the quality differences brand specific?
Everyone has so many differnt opinions that the only review on these tyres ill trust is Drews review now due to the fact I know how he will treat them.If not ill make my next set 2cts again as they last me ok 4-5k rear 8k front and out perform my road riding leaving me spare for surprises.

[Hitcher]

Hitcher.... surely you jest?

No, I don't. This is all news to me. Call me old fashioned but I believe that anything I buy should be how it's labelled. My GSX1250FA isn't a 650 nor is it a Honda, or is it? What other standards do OEM tyres not comply with if they are discernibly different to off-the-rack models with the same name? I am sure that New Zealand legislation relating to the sale of goods doesn't have this nonsense in mind and that there are measures that could be drawn on to protect consumers. There is a labelling issue, not to mention a marketing rort here that should be exposed. Not to mention another reason not to trust Mr Bridgestone.

[Pussy]

No, I don't. This is all news to me. Call me old fashioned but I believe that anything I buy should be how it's labelled. My GSX1250FA isn't a 650 nor is it a Honda, or is it? What other standards do OEM tyres not comply with if they are discernibly different to off-the-rack models with the same name? I am sure that New Zealand legislation relating to the sale of goods doesn't have this nonsense in mind and that there are measures that could be drawn on to protect consumers. There is a labelling issue, not to mention a marketing rort here that should be exposed. Not to mention another reason not to trust Mr Bridgestone.

It's not just Mr Bridgestone... ALL of the Winnie Mandela necklace manufacturers do it.
It is even done to the extent on some tyres to have a noticeably different tread pattern.

[mossy1200]

No, I don't. This is all news to me. Call me old fashioned but I believe that anything I buy should be how it's labelled. My GSX1250FA isn't a 650 nor is it a Honda, or is it? What other standards do OEM tyres not comply with if they are discernibly different to off-the-rack models with the same name? I am sure that New Zealand legislation relating to the sale of goods doesn't have this nonsense in mind and that there are measures that could be drawn on to protect consumers. There is a labelling issue, not to mention a marketing rort here that should be exposed. Not to mention another reason not to trust Mr Bridgestone.


well said.
Why would Bridgestone want to load lower grade tyres onto new bikes anyway?That says try these you will hate them and never shop Bridgestone again.

[Kickaha]

No, I don't. This is all news to me. Call me old fashioned but I believe that anything I buy should be how it's labelled. My GSX1250FA isn't a 650 nor is it a Honda, or is it? What other standards do OEM tyres not comply with if they are discernibly different to off-the-rack models with the same name? I am sure that New Zealand legislation relating to the sale of goods doesn't have this nonsense in mind and that there are measures that could be drawn on to protect consumers.There is a labelling issue, not to mention a marketing rort here that should be exposed.
You're deaming as Pussy stated they are labelled differently

Not to mention another reason not to trust Mr Bridgestone.
Surely you're not dumb enough to think they are the only company that does it?

[JayRacer37]

No, I don't. This is all news to me. Call me old fashioned but I believe that anything I buy should be how it's labelled. My GSX1250FA isn't a 650 nor is it a Honda, or is it? What other standards do OEM tyres not comply with if they are discernibly different to off-the-rack models with the same name? I am sure that New Zealand legislation relating to the sale of goods doesn't have this nonsense in mind and that there are measures that could be drawn on to protect consumers. There is a labelling issue, not to mention a marketing rort here that should be exposed. Not to mention another reason not to trust Mr Bridgestone.

One of the larger issue's with OEM tyre's are that they need to perform to very different levels and standards. For example, TUV testing in Germany has a high speed/load test that means that the tyre must maintain a huge amount of temperature, far higher than you would ever experience or generate in normal use. Because of this, that tyre is not good without that load - it doesn't get hot enough to work under most normal riding. As far as off the rack with the same name, that is incorrect, what you get on a CBRZXR1RR is a BT016 F or W or whatever the designation is, what you get on the rack is a BT016 (no further designation). There is no labelling issue. As far as a 'marketing rort' go, I think you are barking up the wrong tree - you are missing the realities that surround mass produced motorcycles - same as your 1250's suspension is awful compared to what you could buy from Ohlins. Also, if you 'Don't trust Mr Bridgestone' on that basis, I suggest you find a tyre manufacturer who doesn't appear on any major brands new Motorcycles, as this OEM spec tyre goes for every tyre manufacturer I am aware of.

[Kickaha]

well said.
Why would Bridgestone want to load lower grade tyres onto new bikes anyway?That says try these you will hate them and never shop Bridgestone again.

It isn't Bridgestone, it is the Bike manufacturer

[JayRacer37]

well said.
Why would Bridgestone want to load lower grade tyres onto new bikes anyway?That says try these you will hate them and never shop Bridgestone again.

It's not that they want to, it's that the tyre must work in a different way for some markets and approvals. Referring again to TUV in Germany, in some cases you can't run anything but the approved tyres - a BMW S1000RR for example can only run on Conti Sport Attack in its special S1000RR construction, Metzeler Racetec K3 INTERACT in S1000RR flavor, and Bridgestone BT016 S1000RR.

[Hitcher]

All of this "oh and by the way everybody knows that OEMs are different to off the racks" has actually got me really steamed.

Are these new S20s being fitted to any bikes as OEM? If yes, are they are a "genuine" S20 or a Shit 20 invented by Bridgestone to get market penetration? If yes, what guarantee does a tyre purchaser have that they're being sold an S20 or a Shit 20?

This flippant revelation actually begs more questions, for me at least, then it answers.

[Hitcher]

It isn't Bridgestone, it is the Bike manufacturer

They're both complicit in this deception. The double standard is still a double standard.

[Pussy]

All of this "oh and by the way everybody knows that OEMs are different to off the racks" has actually got me really steamed.

Are these new S20s being fitted to any bikes as OEM? If yes, are they are a "genuine" S20 or a Shit 20 invented by Bridgestone to get market penetration? If yes, what guarantee does a tyre purchaser have that they're being sold an S20 or a Shit 20?

This flippant revelation actually begs more questions, for me at least, then it answers.

The new gixxer 1000 has S20s.
Bridgestone are NOT doing a shifty. They are supplying what Suzuki have specfied they want.
I actually preferred the OEM BT 014s on my sem fiddy to the over-the-counter ones.
As previously mentioned, the OEM BT016 on the 08-10m sem fiddy was two compound rear, whilst the retail ones are three.

[mossy1200]

OHHH FORK it all next you will be telling me the best Nike are made in Japan but the one we are born with are made in China.

[Hitcher]

One of the larger issue's with OEM tyre's are that they need to perform to very different levels and standards. For example, TUV testing in Germany has a high speed/load test that means that the tyre must maintain a huge amount of temperature, far higher than you would ever experience or generate in normal use. Because of this, that tyre is not good without that load - it doesn't get hot enough to work under most normal riding. As far as off the rack with the same name, that is incorrect, what you get on a CBRZXR1RR is a BT016 F or W or whatever the designation is, what you get on the rack is a BT016 (no further designation). There is no labelling issue. As far as a 'marketing rort' go, I think you are barking up the wrong tree - you are missing the realities that surround mass produced motorcycles - same as your 1250's suspension is awful compared to what you could buy from Ohlins. Also, if you 'Don't trust Mr Bridgestone' on that basis, I suggest you find a tyre manufacturer who doesn't appear on any major brands new Motorcycles, as this OEM spec tyre goes for every tyre manufacturer I am aware of.

So tyre reviews published by internationally recognised reviewers are a waste of time then? I've never read a review that mentions whether a tyre is an F or a W, only good for German conditions, or whatever. If there are such differences, then why aren't these widely promoted or acknowledged in point of sale labelling?

Yes, my bike's suspension is not as good as Mr Ohlin's fine product. But Mr Suzuki has the good sense not to imply that it does. If Mr Bridgestone makes a tyre with the equivalent of a standard Bandit and a tyre with exactly the same designation as a Bandit with Ohlins, then why is that kept secret, or at least not fully disclosed to purchasers? I know which one I'd buy, particularly if the retail price was the same.

[Hitcher]

Bridgestone are NOT doing a shifty. They are supplying what Suzuki have specfied they want.

But a shifty is being done. People are being led to believe that what they're buying off the rack is the same as what's fitted as OEM.

[Pussy]

You won't find many genuine OEM tyres available for sale in NZ.
When say the new S20 is reviewed in magazines, they will be the over-the-counter ones.
Seriously, it's NOT deception. I thought it was common knowledge that OEMs can be quite different to garden variety tyres.


Edit: I'm looking forward to trying the S20s.
Even when I changed to BT016s after Metzler M3s, I felt like I had "got my bike back".

[JayRacer37]

All of this "oh and by the way everybody knows that OEMs are different to off the racks" has actually got me really steamed.

Are these new S20s being fitted to any bikes as OEM? If yes, are they are a "genuine" S20 or a Shit 20 invented by Bridgestone to get market penetration? If yes, what guarantee does a tyre purchaser have that they're being sold an S20 or a Shit 20?

This flippant revelation actually begs more questions, for me at least, then it answers.

Yes, S20 is currently on GSXR1000L2, the as yet unreleased new ZX14 and another model I can't recall off the top of my head sorry. The tyres on these bikes will all have their own specific constructions, and all will vary from a standard 'on the rack' tyre, for better or worse. The tyre purchaser can tell the difference because his manual will say 'BT016W' and so will the sticker on the tyre. The standard 'off the rack' tyre will not have that letter or designation. It has nothing to do with market penetration, more that Kawasaki want a cheaper tyre as they are buying many thousands of them, that also must do more than the top speed of the ZX14, for longer than a ZX14 can run on a tank, with well more load than a ZX14 is designed to have. This means a ZX14 can be sold into all world markets. We are lucky enough that we haven't be legislated out of having a better product for our use with 'aftermarket' tyres.

As an aside story, Bridgestone have a large share of the Japanese OEM tyre market as it was agreed in the 60's that the established bike makers would buy Bridgestone's tyres on the proviso they didn't release the bike they had been working on - Honda et al were scared of it.

[Pussy]

But a shifty is being done. People are being led to believe that what they're buying off the rack is the same as what's fitted as OEM.

Not being a smartarse... but I thought it was common knowledge about the difference.
There is no deception on the part of the manufacturers.

Hey Jay... gimme a set at cost to try! :)

[JayRacer37]

So tyre reviews published by internationally recognised reviewers are a waste of time then? I've never read a review that mentions whether a tyre is an F or a W, only good for German conditions, or whatever. If there are such differences, then why aren't these widely promoted or acknowledged in point of sale labelling?

Yes, my bike's suspension is not as good as Mr Ohlin's fine product. But Mr Suzuki has the good sense not to imply that it does. If Mr Bridgestone makes a tyre with the equivalent of a standard Bandit and a tyre with exactly the same designation as a Bandit with Ohlins, then why is that kept secret, or at least not fully disclosed to purchasers? I know which one I'd buy, particularly if the retail price was the same.

As Pussy has said no they arn't - they will be reviewing aftermarket tyres. And if you buy a tyre it will be an off the shelf tyre, unless you specify that you want the OEM tyre for your bike.

Mr Suzuki also don't advertise 'Not as good as Ohlin's' though do they? Using Ohlin's as an example again, the forks in a Aprilia RSV4 Factory are not as good as the off the shelf ones, and can do with an upgrade from Mr Taylor if you want the best from them...

[mossy1200]

Not being a smartarse... but I thought it was common knowledge about the difference.
There is no deception on the part of the manufacturers.

Hey Jay... gimme a set at cost to try! :)

Have bought 4 new big bikes and i didnt know and why would I know if i wasnt told.
They dont run big adds saying they have 2 standards oem and shelf stock.
if they need make tyres that will do 300 for a 45mins without bursting to sell in some countries why give that tyre S20 in the name at all.Why not call it a new name and explain in the handbook the reason why.

[Conquiztador]

As Pussy has said no they arn't - they will be reviewing aftermarket tyres. And if you buy a tyre it will be an off the shelf tyre, unless you specify that you want the OEM tyre for your bike.

Mr Suzuki also don't advertise 'Not as good as Ohlin's' though do they? Using Ohlin's as an example again, the forks in a Aprilia RSV4 Factory are not as good as the off the shelf ones, and can do with an upgrade from Mr Taylor if you want the best from them...

I am 100% with Mr Hitcher in this discussion. I had no idea that new bikes were fitted with a cheaper lesser quality tyre that to the "not in the know" pleb looked exactley the same as it's identical twin that has different genes. But as I never purchased a new bike this has never become a worry of mine.

Re the Ohlins suspension comparison, it is flawed: None of the bikes that are sold as new with suspension that is not up to the Ohlin standard has Ohlin shocks. I bet you that if the bike had Ohlin shocks when coming off the showroom floor there would be no question what the quality is.

And I also parrot the statement earlier that questions the logic in fitting a tyre that will perform not as good as the real thing. It might be the first time the bike buyer has trialled this make and model of tyre. And if he/she is anything like me and the tyre gives concerns, he/she will not buy a second one but change manufacturer.

[Pussy]

I bet you that if the bike had Ohlin shocks when coming off the showroom floor there would be no question what the quality is.



You'll lose that bet, then.
The Ohlins forks on say an 03 RSVR have what looks like cast iron pistons in them, don't use the bending shimstack mid-valve, nor do they have top out springs. They are VERY different to over-the-counter ones.

[Conquiztador]

You'll lose that bet, then.
The Ohlins forks on say an 03 RSVR have what looks like cast iron pistons in them, don't use the bending shimstack mid-valve, nor do they have top out springs. They are VERY different to over-the-counter ones.

You have just destroyed my trust in even the most reputable manufacturers products! Now I know why I since very small have always dismantled anything I get just so I can have a look what is inside.

[p.dath]

Tough call. I'm really struggling with your revelation that OEM tyres are different to the same models bought through a shop.

I'm with Hitcher. This is news to new that "similarly" labelled tyres can be quite different. I can understand why bike manufacturers might do it - price.

But to me this seems a very damaging thing to the tyre manufacturers brand. I understand it represents a lot of sales, but the potential damage to the brand ...

[Ocean1]

Re the Ohlins suspension comparison, it is flawed: None of the bikes that are sold as new with suspension that is not up to the Ohlin standard has Ohlin shocks. I bet you that if the bike had Ohlin shocks when coming off the showroom floor there would be no question what the quality is.

Many bikes come with Ohlins suspension fitted, brand new. If you buy aftermarket Ohlins they'll be spec'd for you, the roads you ride and how you ride them. In both cases I suggest you'd know exactly what you're buying.


I can understand why bike manufacturers might do it - price...

Best cost is a factor in everything anyone buys, it's not a factor only in the supply of low quality items. In this case I can sympathise with bike manufacturers, there's probably thousands of standards worldwide their products have to comply with. A tyre that meets all of them isn't likely to be one an individual would choose as a replacement. I, for one would rather wet performance wasn't sacrificed in order that the tyre meets some ill-considered EU requirement for extreem load carrying capacity.

[BoristheBiter]

Yes, S20 is currently on GSXR1000L2, the as yet unreleased new ZX14 and another model I can't recall off the top of my head sorry. The tyres on these bikes will all have their own specific constructions, and all will vary from a standard 'on the rack' tyre, for better or worse. The tyre purchaser can tell the difference because his manual will say 'BT016W' and so will the sticker on the tyre. The standard 'off the rack' tyre will not have that letter or designation. It has nothing to do with market penetration, more that Kawasaki want a cheaper tyre as they are buying many thousands of them, that also must do more than the top speed of the ZX14, for longer than a ZX14 can run on a tank, with well more load than a ZX14 is designed to have. This means a ZX14 can be sold into all world markets. We are lucky enough that we haven't be legislated out of having a better product for our use with 'aftermarket' tyres.

As an aside story, Bridgestone have a large share of the Japanese OEM tyre market as it was agreed in the 60's that the established bike makers would buy Bridgestone's tyres on the proviso they didn't release the bike they had been working on - Honda et al were scared of it.

It seems that there are a lot on here, I am one of them, that had no idea that they aren't the same tyres.
I have over the the last few years purchased 3 gixxers, at no time was i told that these are not the same as off the shelf and in fact on the one I am riding now there was even a discussion about them.

I have looked through both my owners and service manual and all I can find is what the tyre sizes are, not whats on them.

I guess the real reason they do it is the price as i guess that a mass produced inferior tyre is cheaper that a proper one.

[scracha]

When they bringing out an 18" front for my hypersports tedium?

[nodrog]

yeah, what would the guy that sells tyres for a living know.

The 2 brand new bikes that I have owned have displayed some weird shit on their OEM tyres -

A K6 GSXR1000 which the front and rear tyres wore out at the same time and were completly rooted at 1500k's. And an 2009 ZX6R which did the same, except for lasting to about 2000k's.

Any off the shelf sets I have had, the front tyre outlasts the rear at aproximatly 1 front to 2 rears.

Or maybe it was just the shit bridgestones both bikes came out with?

oh, it looks like Jay isnt the only one talking shit, better tell these guys they are wrong too.


The original-equipment tires ordered by the manufacturers are mere shadows of their aftermarket siblings, hobbled by less rubber and lighter construction.

[JayRacer37]

I am 100% with Mr Hitcher in this discussion. I had no idea that new bikes were fitted with a cheaper lesser quality tyre that to the "not in the know" pleb looked exactley the same as it's identical twin that has different genes. But as I never purchased a new bike this has never become a worry of mine.

And I also parrot the statement earlier that questions the logic in fitting a tyre that will perform not as good as the real thing. It might be the first time the bike buyer has trialled this make and model of tyre. And if he/she is anything like me and the tyre gives concerns, he/she will not buy a second one but change manufacturer.


I'm with Hitcher. This is news to new that "similarly" labelled tyres can be quite different. I can understand why bike manufacturers might do it - price.

But to me this seems a very damaging thing to the tyre manufacturers brand. I understand it represents a lot of sales, but the potential damage to the brand ...

It's not something we like either, nor is it something we can control. The OEM tyres are avalible - but we choose to (in the majority of cases) not carry them as the consumer get's a better tyre in the full aftermarket, in most Hypersport's applications.


yeah, what would the guy that sells tyres for a living know.

The 2 brand new bikes that I have owned have displayed some weird shit on their OEM tyres -

A K6 GSXR1000 which the front and rear tyres wore out at the same time and were completly rooted at 1500k's. And an 2009 ZX6R which did the same, except for lasting to about 2000k's.

oh, it looks like Jay isnt the only one talking shit, better tell these guys they are wrong too.

Yeah man, I'm full of it! :shutup:

[Bassmatt]

One of the larger issue's with OEM tyre's are that they need to perform to very different levels and standards. For example, TUV testing in Germany has a high speed/load test that means that the tyre must maintain a huge amount of temperature, far higher than you would ever experience or generate in normal use. Because of this, that tyre is not good without that load - it doesn't get hot enough to work under most normal riding. .

Not sure I understand this....if I am in a country where the oem tyre is necessary to meet a standard does that mean I wont be able to purchase the non oem tyre in that country? Why fit them at all then if the bike owner cant replace with the same model? (from a marketing point of view)


You'll lose that bet, then.
The Ohlins forks on say an 03 RSVR have what looks like cast iron pistons in them, don't use the bending shimstack mid-valve, nor do they have top out springs. They are VERY different to over-the-counter ones.

I would bet the shock on the RSVR doesnt have an equivalent over the counter model with the same model number like the tyres do. (?)

[SimJen]

I thought this was common knowledge! If you read international bike magazines and tests on new tyres they often talk about the various fitments and slightly different types available to different manufacturers.
Car tyres can have the same variations with the newer generations of the more track biased road legal tyres fitted to M3's/GT3's etc.

[JayRacer37]

Not sure I understand this....if I am in a country where the oem tyre is necessary to meet a standard does that mean I wont be able to purchase the non oem tyre in that country? Why fit them at all then if the bike owner cant replace with the same model? (from a marketing point of view)

You'll lose that bet, then.
The Ohlins forks on say an 03 RSVR have what looks like cast iron pistons in them, don't use the bending shimstack mid-valve, nor do they have top out springs. They are VERY different to over-the-counter ones.

I would bet the shock on the RSVR doesnt have an equivalent over the counter model with the same model number like the tyres do. (?)

It can mean that yes, my understanding is in some EU countries you have a choice of 'approved' tyre's to remain legal for their WOF.

Also, they tyre's do not have the same number - they are labeled and marked with a designation as a particular OEM tyre.

[nodrog]

Yeah man, I'm full of it! :shutup:

Obviously :laugh:

Now can I have some free tyres? :wari:

[Bassmatt]

It can mean that yes, my understanding is in some EU countries you have a choice of 'approved' tyre's to remain legal for their WOF.

It seems the general feeling is oem tyres are shit compared to non oem but in some countries you can only use the oem? Lucky them :facepalm:

Also, they tyre's do not have the same number - they are labeled and marked with a designation as a particular OEM tyre.

So you have said, although I didnt notice any different designation on my oem 021s and non oem. Not saying it wasnt there but its certainly not obvious if you are not looking for it.

[p.dath]

Not that I can see myself being able to afford a "new" motorbike in the next decade; but I have to say after this eye opening conversation I'd be tempted to negotiate with the dealer having the OEM tyres removed and replaced with "off the shelf" versions.

[SimJen]

good luck with that, think of it more like buying a new printer for your pc. The little ink cartridges are tiny compared to the ones you buy, but noone seems to care!
I have no problem with it, it seems to be standard practice anyway.
To keep the bikes at the correct price bracket, Im sure there are plenty of other areas that are skimped on too! We'd be surprised!
Most people on a brand new bike will take a few thousand km's to run it in/get to grips with it anyway.
Once thats done, many put on a different brand tyre, so really doesn't make much difference to the end consumer.

[mossy1200]

yeah, what would the guy that sells tyres for a living know.

The 2 brand new bikes that I have owned have displayed some weird shit on their OEM tyres -

A K6 GSXR1000 which the front and rear tyres wore out at the same time and were completly rooted at 1500k's. And an 2009 ZX6R which did the same, except for lasting to about 2000k's.

Any off the shelf sets I have had, the front tyre outlasts the rear at aproximatly 1 front to 2 rears.

Or maybe it was just the shit bridgestones both bikes came out with?

oh, it looks like Jay isnt the only one talking shit, better tell these guys they are wrong too.

In 1999 I bought a new rsv1000 and the rear needed replaced at first service.I cant remember the tyre type but it may have been sportmax.

[Kickaha]

A K6 GSXR1000 which the front and rear tyres wore out at the same time and were completly rooted at 1500k's. And an 2009 ZX6R which did the same, except for lasting to about 2000k's.
Fuck you sound like you're hard on gear

I'd be tempted to negotiate with the dealer having the OEM tyres removed and replaced with "off the shelf" versions.
If I could afford a new bike I would be telling the dealer what tyres I wanted on it when I took delivery, it's a fairly common thing with cars I can't see why people wouldn't do it with bikes

[JayRacer37]

So you have said, although I didnt notice any different designation on my oem 021s and non oem. Not saying it wasnt there but its certainly not obvious if you are not looking for it.

Yeah, you probably aren't always going to notice a difference, and sometimes the difference is slight. In other instances the difference can be massive. The main class that the OEM and aftermarket tyres are significantly different in is probably sports/hypersport's tyres.



If I could afford a new bike I would be telling the dealer what tyres I wanted on it when I took delivery, it's a fairly common thing with cars I can't see why people wouldn't do it with bikes

Yeah, I am with you Kick - it could be well worth the negotiation with the dealer.

[Gremlin]

but I have to say after this eye opening conversation I'd be tempted to negotiate with the dealer having the OEM tyres removed and replaced with "off the shelf" versions.
Yep, dealers have done this before. Not normally too much of an issue as they're all new.

[pritch]

I had previously read that Dunlop did their sales a lot of damage with some sub-standard OEM fitments.
People who had sufered the cheapo OE Dunlops would buy something else when it came time for replacement. Anything else.

The Sportsmart and Roadsmart tyres have received such good reviews that they may repair the damage. Or not.

Having experienced the Bridgestone 020s fitted as OE on my VFR I can understand this.
There is still no way I am going to risk $600 plus on a brand with which I had a bad experience.
There are several other brands with which I haven't had a problem so my dollars go to one of those

[Conquiztador]

I had previously read that Dunlop did their sales a lot of damage with some sub-standard OEM fitments.
People who had sufered the cheapo OE Dunlops would buy something else when it came time for replacement. Anything else.

The Sportsmart and Roadsmart tyres have received such good reviews that they may repair the damage. Or not.

Having experienced the Bridgestone 020s fitted as OE on my VFR I can understand this.
There is still no way I am going to risk $600 plus on a brand with which I had a bad experience.
There are several other brands with which I haven't had a problem so my dollars go to one of those

Totally agree and I function the same. In THIS (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php/125681-Got-a-Pirelli-Sport-Demon-as-back-tyre-and-I-am-very-disappointed) thread I talk re being recommended a Pirelli Sport Demon, so I got one but was very disappointed. And as a result will not use Pirelli again. Hmmm... perhaps it was a left over OEM tyre that someone had replaced on a new bike??? Nahh...

[mossy1200]

Leading tire companies are doing their part for the enviroment recycling used rubber into oem budget tyres.

[Pussy]

Quite honestly... OEM tyres aren't necessarily shite... they are just often a bit different to the generic ones.
While every one else is packing a sad, I'll go enjoy a set of over-the-counter S20s when they become available.

[slofox]

I had previously read that Dunlop did their sales a lot of damage with some sub-standard OEM fitments.


Dunlop certainly lost me as a potential tyre customer after experiencing the OEM tyres on the SV I bought new. When they finally wore out and I replaced them with Michelin PR2's, the contrast was prodigious. I have not even contemplated buying Dunlop since.

[mossy1200]

Dunlop certainly lost me as a potential tyre customer after experiencing the OEM tyres on the SV I bought new. When they finally wore out and I replaced them with Michelin PR2's, the contrast was prodigious. I have not even contemplated buying Dunlop since.
You like pr2s im about to pull mine off and replace with the new conti sport when they arrive.If you want a spare 120 front done 2000km cheap let me know.

[pritch]

OEM tyres aren't necessarily shite...

John, The key word is "necessarily".

I was not unhappy with the BT45s or whatever fitted to the 919 and was not wildly unhappy with the 020s that replaced them. Although the front did seem to scallop prematurely and they weren't *that* great in the wet.

The OEM 020s on the VFR were another matter, after a particularly wet trip to the KB Turangi gathering I tossed them, they were scary. Was much happier on the Metzeler replacements.

Something may lead me to try Bridgestones again in future, but right now I can't imagine what that might be.

[slofox]

You like pr2s im about to pull mine off and replace with the new conti sport when they arrive.If you want a spare 120 front done 2000km cheap let me know.

Don't have that bike any more mossy but thanks for the offer anyway.

Currently running BT016's and have a set of 016 Pro's waiting for next change - in about 1500km or so.

[JayRacer37]

Here is some info I have compiled on OEM Vs. Aftermarket tyres, based on a 190/55x17 BT016-PRO and a 190/55x17 BT016 BMW S1000RR OEM spec.

Tyre weight's are different, the BMW S1000RR OEM tyre weigh's 6.35KG, and the aftermarket PRO weigh's slightly more at 6.95KG. The tread depth in the BMW tyre is also a bit shallower - 1mm approximate different. Squeezing the carcasses (pushing down on the crown of the tyre) the BMW tyre feels firmer, and doesn't give as easily. When pushing the compound in with a fingernail, the rubber on the aftermarket tyre is easier to leave a mark in, feels a bit 'softer'. The profile looks a little flatter on the BMW, taller in the crown on the aftermarket. The labeling on the tyre differs, with a 'W' designating the difference on the sticker, also on the sidewall behind the 'BT016' mark, where the aftermarket has 'PRO'. Also on the sidewall is the 'RAZ' marking that is the official difference, 'RSZ' is the aftermarket.

I have some photo's but arn't clever enough to upload now, will try again tomorrow :)

[steve_t]

So the OEM tyres being different must come purely down to cost, right?

[SimJen]

So the OEM tyres being different must come purely down to cost, right?

Not always, I've read in magazines that depending on the bike and specific speed ratings etc, they can differ.

[Kickaha]

Here is some info I have compiled on OEM Vs. Aftermarket tyres, based on a 190/55x17 BT016-PRO and a 190/55x17 BT016 BMW S1000RR OEM spec.

Tyre weight's are different, the BMW S1000RR OEM tyre weigh's 6.35KG, and the aftermarket PRO weigh's slightly more at 6.95KG. The tread depth in the BMW tyre is also a bit shallower - 1mm approximate different. Squeezing the carcasses (pushing down on the crown of the tyre) the BMW tyre feels firmer, and doesn't give as easily. When pushing the compound in with a fingernail, the rubber on the aftermarket tyre is easier to leave a mark in, feels a bit 'softer'. The profile looks a little flatter on the BMW, taller in the crown on the aftermarket. The labeling on the tyre differs, with a 'W' designating the difference on the sticker, also on the sidewall behind the 'BT016' mark, where the aftermarket has 'PRO'. Also on the sidewall is the 'RAZ' marking that is the official difference, 'RSZ' is the aftermarket.

Is there any difference in load and speed ratings?

[Hitcher]

Here is some info I have compiled on OEM Vs. Aftermarket tyres, based on a 190/55x17 BT016-PRO and a 190/55x17 BT016 BMW S1000RR OEM spec.

Tyre weight's are different, the BMW S1000RR OEM tyre weigh's 6.35KG, and the aftermarket PRO weigh's slightly more at 6.95KG. The tread depth in the BMW tyre is also a bit shallower - 1mm approximate different. Squeezing the carcasses (pushing down on the crown of the tyre) the BMW tyre feels firmer, and doesn't give as easily. When pushing the compound in with a fingernail, the rubber on the aftermarket tyre is easier to leave a mark in, feels a bit 'softer'. The profile looks a little flatter on the BMW, taller in the crown on the aftermarket. The labeling on the tyre differs, with a 'W' designating the difference on the sticker, also on the sidewall behind the 'BT016' mark, where the aftermarket has 'PRO'. Also on the sidewall is the 'RAZ' marking that is the official difference, 'RSZ' is the aftermarket.

I have some photo's but arn't clever enough to upload now, will try again tomorrow :)

So apart from being "BT016s" they have nothing in common?

[Conquiztador]

So apart from being "BT016s" they have nothing in common?

They are both black?

[Kickaha]

They are both black?

Should be both round as well

[mossy1200]

They are both black?

Nope the OEM is grey cause you cant get heat into it unless you burn them.

[Hitcher]

Should be both round as well

One will be round, the other will be orthogonal.

[Big Dave]

That ornithology is for the birds.

[JayRacer37]

Is there any difference in load and speed ratings?

No, same load and speed ratings.


So apart from being "BT016s" they have nothing in common?

Tread pattern?


Should be both round as well

Yep, nailed that one Kick

[Eurotred (NZ) Ltd]

Here are the results so far at the halfway mark :niceone:

NORTH ISLAND:

Drew - 10 votes
Slofox - 6 votes
Grant - 6 votes
Banditrider - 3 votes
Outforaduck - 2 votes
Dmntd - 2 votes
Hitcher - 2 votes
Gijoe - 1 vote
Nzsarge - 1 vote
Katman - 1 vote
Movistar - 1 vote
Sensei - 1 vote

SOUTH ISLAND:

Onearmedbandit - 4 votes

C'mon guys only 15 more days to get your votes in :cool:

[Scuba_Steve]

Fast Eddie for SI (gotta have at-least 1 more contender there)
Slofox for NI ("Grumpy old bastard" :lol:)

[Conquiztador]

Well, sadly I can not give any names. Being an antisocial bastard I know nobody. But I recon you should be looking for someone who has time to ride and also needs tyres. So to give them to someone who is well off and able to buy their own as they see fit might not be the plan. Find sumone who LOVES to ride and will do the K's but perhaps is not in a financial situation to have all the bling.

Well, that is my view anyhow.

But 10/10 for offering a set of free tyres to someone!

[Hitcher]

That ornithology is for the birds.

When you said you mounted birds I thought you were a taxidermist.

[JayRacer37]

I was lucky enough to have a ride on the 2012 GSX-R1000 at Taupo racetrack on Saturday, fitted with the new Bridgestone S20 (in the GSX-R1000 OEM spec). Very capable bike (significantly better in many ways than my K7) but I was astounded at how well the tyres coped. We did 10 or so laps after the bike had been out the majority of the day, and they tyres wern't phased by the heat - performance was consistant from halfway though lap one till the end of the session, which I was suprised at as the temprature of the day was pretty good, and we wern't mucking about. Very impressive for a road sports tyre.

[Eurotred (NZ) Ltd]

C'mon guys & girls get your votes in not long to go now :niceone:

[JayRacer37]

Follow the link below to see an onboard lap with Jeremy McWilliams on an S1000RR at Portmiao at the internation launch of the Bridgestone S20.

http://www.visordown.com/motorcycle-news-videos/jeremy-mcwilliams-bridgestone-s20-onboard-lap/20313.html

Also at the bottom of the text on that page is a link to their first review, or see here;

http://www.visordown.com/features/bridgestone-battlax-s20-review/20314.html

[steve_t]

I was lucky enough to have a ride on the 2012 GSX-R1000 at Taupo racetrack on Saturday, fitted with the new Bridgestone S20 (in the GSX-R1000 OEM spec). Very capable bike (significantly better in many ways than my K7) but I was astounded at how well the tyres coped. We did 10 or so laps after the bike had been out the majority of the day, and they tyres wern't phased by the heat - performance was consistant from halfway though lap one till the end of the session, which I was suprised at as the temprature of the day was pretty good, and we wern't mucking about. Very impressive for a road sports tyre.

What did you think about the new 'face' on the gixxer? :gob:

[JayRacer37]

What did you think about the new 'face' on the gixxer? :gob:

I thought it was identical to the 'old' one...?

[JayRacer37]

For those of you who are wondering what bikes the S20 is going to fit, here is a list of avalible sizes;

FRONT

130/70x16
110/70x17
120/60x17
120/70x17

REAR

150/60x17
160/60x17
170/60x17
180/55x17
190/50x17
190/55x17
200/50x17

So we should be able to fit most modernish bikes with these.

[The Singing Chef]

I vote OutforaDuck, he will put them to good use and is also doing a track day coming up soon.

[steve_t]

I thought it was identical to the 'old' one...?

Oh, it is too :innocent: Yuck

[White trash]

93% of people who ride motorcycles on the road will derive no material benefit from using "sports" tyres. A quality sports touring tyre will perform the arse off a sports tyre in all but the most demanding conditions, and it will last more than twice as long.

The only reason sports tyres sell is Small Penis Syndrome from riders who believe that their already small willy will shrink away to absolute nothingness if their mates spot anything other than a sports tyre on their motorcycle. I guess if riders want to waste their hard-earned cash, then buying unsuitable tyres for their bikes is as good a place to start as any other.

Giving away every second set of sports tyres is one way of balancing the economic game. I am presuming that this is not the intent of Bridgestone's New Zealand agent.

So you're suggesting that riders of GSXR1000s and the like are better off with a sports touring tyre, they just don't know it? Really?

[White trash]

I was lucky enough to have a ride on the 2012 GSX-R1000 at Taupo racetrack on Saturday, fitted with the new Bridgestone S20 (in the GSX-R1000 OEM spec). Very capable bike (significantly better in many ways than my K7) but I was astounded at how well the tyres coped. We did 10 or so laps after the bike had been out the majority of the day, and they tyres wern't phased by the heat - performance was consistant from halfway though lap one till the end of the session, which I was suprised at as the temprature of the day was pretty good, and we wern't mucking about. Very impressive for a road sports tyre.

I can't wait to spend some time on the L2. I was really impressed by the 016's fitted to the GSXR750 and L1 Thou', both road going and track work so the S20 should be another step up I imagine. The 1000 could quite easily overpower the grip but it always let go really predictably. On the 750 it was really amazing how well the 016 would hook up and the stability from the front was awesome.

[Kickaha]

So you're suggesting that riders of GSXR1000s and the like are better off with a sports touring tyre, they just don't know it? Really?

You're saying they are all using the bike as it should be and aren't just posing on the latest and greatest?

[Ocean1]

You're saying they are all using the bike as it should be and aren't just posing on the latest and greatest?

Isn't the way they should be used up to the guy who stumped up with the price?


So many questions. So few answers.

[mossy1200]

You're saying they are all using the bike as it should be and aren't just posing on the latest and greatest?

Possible that you wouldnt need a touring tyre.You most likely come off using it the way it should be on the average NZ road before a sports tyre wore out.
Everyone picks a tyre they like even though a new hypa sports bike and the tyre have more abilty than they do.
Ill admit I like the tyre tread patterns on sports tyres.Must be a small part of me thats honda ghey.

[Madness]

190/55x17

:scooter: Thank you

[JayRacer37]

I can't wait to spend some time on the L2. I was really impressed by the 016's fitted to the GSXR750 and L1 Thou', both road going and track work so the S20 should be another step up I imagine. The 1000 could quite easily overpower the grip but it always let go really predictably. On the 750 it was really amazing how well the 016 would hook up and the stability from the front was awesome.

Yup, that predictably compared to my K7 was there in droves, enjoyed the tyres too. One of those sessions on track where everything seems to click and you just go out and see how fast you can go.

[Hitcher]

So you're suggesting that riders of GSXR1000s and the like are better off with a sports touring tyre, they just don't know it? Really?

But what is it they really know? The OEM rubber, as outlined earlier, is nothing like what they're likely to have available to replace it. They will presume that because the bike was originally fitted with "sports" tyres, then that's what they should aim to replace them with. But there's more, or should be more, to tyre choice then that, surely? Particularly how they generally ride their motorcycle, not by how short their dong is?

If they're riding the bike on the road, commuting, going with the flow, with just a bit of scratching, and they're interested in good wet and dry performance, not to mention tyre longevity, then yes.

If they're doing a bit of track riding, wheelies, stoppies, fine weather death-rush stuff to the Fush in Martinborough and home again over the hill, then no.

[Grant`]

So has this been annouced yet?

[nodrog]

So has this been annouced yet?

Yep I won, thanks for voting Guys!

[Eurotred (NZ) Ltd]

The final votes have been counted and we have two very deserving winners,

For the North Island the winner with 10 votes is Drew

For the South Island the winner with 4 votes is Onearmedbandit

We will be in touch with the winners soon to arrange collection and fitting of tyres, thanks to everyone who has taken part and we look forward to running another competion in the future.

[onearmedbandit]

Well I didn't even know I'd been nominated until I received a PM about it this morning. Thanks to everyone who voted for me, I look forward to putting some miles on these tyres and seeing how they compare to my previous rubber.

I've typically been a Michelin rider, although have also spent time on Dunlops, Pirelli and Metzler, so this will be my first real proper test of Bridgestone. Therefore I won't be comparing them to previous generation Bridgestones, but up against the likes of Pilot Pures, N-Tecs, Rennsports and Diablo's. I've got a track day coming up on the 31st of May where I'll be mentoring some newer riders, I'll definitely put some hard laps on them there too.

[moon]

keen as to test these tyres for ya mate, got a madness KTM 525exc supermotard, that'll put them through there paces. look forward to hearing from ya soon.
cheers Jensen

[Coldrider]

keen as to test these tyres for ya mate, got a madness KTM 525exc supermotard, that'll put them through there paces. look forward to hearing from ya soon.
cheers Jensenhave you enclosed your cheque for 6hundy?

[moon]

can i nominate myself for these tyres, got a madness KTM Motard, and be keen to try them out

[sil3nt]

Are you serious? This is almost a year old.

[Gremlin]

can i nominate myself for these tyres, got a madness KTM Motard, and be keen to try them out
:facepalm:


Are you serious? This is almost a year old.
As has been said... yep, it's almost a year old, and even if this was current, you couldn't nominate yourself. Winners were announced ages ago.

Go buy some in the shop...

[Madness]

So, I found this thing on the internet where they were giving away free tyres so I joined up and nominated myself. Damn, there was like 14 pages of these dudes all hitting this guy up for free tyres. He must have a shitload of tyres.

[Coldrider]

So, I found this thing on the internet where they were giving away free tyres so I joined up and nominated myself. Damn, there was like 14 pages of these dudes all hitting this guy up for free tyres. He must have a shitload of tyres.they'll be obsolete soon enough.

[Kornholio]

Did I win?