What does KB think i should do to this prick? [Archive]

haydes55

2nd May 2012, 18:41

I'm on TUNA's side here, he wasn't in a race and the car driver clearly broke the rules and agreement and as a result caused harm to other track users. Firstly the organisers should have a plan in place (a clause in the indemnity form/contract signed to ride on the day). Get a good read of this and chase the organisers up to uphold their responsibilities to ensure a safe environment for you to use the track. We all know the "Motorsport is dangerous and you do so at your own risk", however it is negligent of an organiser to allow cars and motorbikes on the track together (knowing full well the consequences are likely to end in the situation that actually arose). I know at speedway the rules are all vehicles must travel the same direction around the track, no vehicle classes are allowed to mix etc. So even though it is dangerous there are rules to minimise obvious risks.

In your situation the car driver breached rules (which should of been mentioned in a briefing?), so should face a penalty from the organising body, which could be a fine, ban etc.

Did you get track day cover from your insurer?

D3ADLYTuna

2nd May 2012, 18:42

Syzygy

...

Asher

2nd May 2012, 18:43

Normally if there was a crash on a track i would say too bad and suck it up.
But since this was a training day and where he broke the rules of the day i feel like he should have some responsibility in this, especially since he hurt you quite badly.

Str8 Jacket

2nd May 2012, 18:44

Also the waiver only indemnifies AMCC which i have no problem with as i dont have a disagreement with them,
I also had insurance. I just wanted the guy to pay my excess. $1500
If he wont do that then im sure i can get him for property damage and the cost.

Why? The reason you sign an indemnity is because you accept the risk you take by going out on the track. The guy doesn't have to pay you anything.

Crasherfromwayback

2nd May 2012, 18:46

Nothing positive to say,
Don't say anything at all...

Well you should've said that when you started the thread!

D3ADLYTuna

2nd May 2012, 18:47

ZERO cars...

Katman

2nd May 2012, 18:48

98tls

2nd May 2012, 18:49

1st up i would do whatever it takes to have a face to face with the guy and go armed with a list of what this has cost you,never know he might man up and come across with some $,if he wont then i guess the next thing is legal advice i guess.Good luck eh for my money all things considered he should stump up some cash.

haydes55

2nd May 2012, 18:50

lmao fail I just re-read the first post the crash happened at the ford corner, not in a ford :facepalm: I am talented at reading aren't I haha

Crasherfromwayback

2nd May 2012, 18:52

About your injuries...they're never fun.

But you need to harden up and take it on the chin. Not in the butt.

tigertim20

2nd May 2012, 18:57

So.
After having my bike written off by a cunt trying to undertake me on ford corner on puke track 2 sundays ago i have been to be re examined today.

Secondary analysis. Broken scaphoid bone. Broken fibula. And rotator cuff sprain. Fibre glass cast. More pain killers. Both arms re suspended. Leg in Velcro splint. $150 cost after acc subsidy. Wondering whether I should take the cunt to court seeing as he won't even give me his details for insurance or pay my excess and he effectively disabled me with his own stupidity. I reckon that's worth compensation and what ever else I can get.

This guy has not made any effort to contact me, has not given me his details or anything and is trying to ignore the situation. :facepalm:

What he has done is; Break the AMCC ART day rules by undertaking on a corner:angry:
While doing it got caught on camera with the cameraman agreeing to eye witness for me:shifty:
Admit fault to me in front of several other riders and 2 ambulance staff:facepalm:
Knows he is at fault as was spoken to by the clerk of the course on the day:shit:
Cause severe pain, damage and loss to me and my health and financial wellbeing.:angry:
Not bothered to do anything and has told a friend of mine that its my responsibility on the track for my excess when i clearly did nothing wrong.:angry:

SO!

All you legal know it alls or preferably actual lawyers,
Where do i stand with this information and witnesses,
What can i take the cunt to court for and what can i expect in return for doing so.

Other suggestions or biker gatherings willing to help would be much appreciated.

Kinda sore yet somehow still typing with both arms slung.
Tuna
you would have signed a waiver.
you went fast on a track, and the numbers fell on you. shit happens. heal up and get over it. move on.
I dont see how you have any recourse whatsoever against the other person.
You have ACC to cover injury, your own insurance to cover bike damage, and you signed a waiver to make sure the organisers arent responsible.

these are the risks you accepted before going on the track.

Virago

2nd May 2012, 18:59

...I dont have the guys details at all therefore i cant contact him

So how are you going to take him to court, blah blah?

Get his contact details, and have a talk to him. Save all the fantasies about court action / revenge etc for another day.

flyingcrocodile46

2nd May 2012, 19:00

Sorry for your trauma and loss but no point in complaining about what has been said (as harsh as some of it is), you did ask for it.

For my 2 cents, I'd suggest you write the experience off and accept that shit does and will happen. Even when on a training day you have to accept that occasionally someone is going to fuck up and you may end up paying the cost. If you have tried to talk to him about it and he doesn't want to know (and it really was his fault), then he is a cunt for not helping out some (you have to accept some blame for not having stayed out of his way whether you think it's appropriate or not).

Forget it and start making positive plans for replacing/fixing your bike so its better than new. Good luck.

Madness

2nd May 2012, 19:03

sil3nt

2nd May 2012, 19:07

I like how most people here just seem to skip over what deadly tuna writes and they make up their own story of what happened and what he wants :jerry:

bogan

2nd May 2012, 19:09

I reckon you should come on here and bawl your eyes out.

Fucking cagers.

:lol: It's the kb regulars that makes threads like this worth reading!

He broke the rules, not the law, so I'm guessing there is no legal obligation for him to pay your excess. Certainly a dick move from him, but unless he is a good cunt, I don't see anything happening; and I certainly see less chance of that if you come with an antagonistic attitude.

D3ADLYTuna

2nd May 2012, 19:11

:whocares:

NinjaNanna

2nd May 2012, 19:14

I like how most people here just seem to skip over what deadly tuna writes and they make up their own story of what happened and what he wants :jerry:

typical KB Hey...

I'd be pissed off to if at an ART day I got taken out by an idiot undertaking. Its rider training - not a race - no excuses for undertaking.

Madness

2nd May 2012, 19:15

Are your insurers interested in recovering their costs from the other rider?

mossy1200

2nd May 2012, 19:17

Im no lawyer but wouldnt it be that if an insurance company will cover an accident repair on a training day that if someone else has caused the accident that their insurance should pay and they become liable for the repair if they are uninsured. I just dont understand that if an insurance company will cover track damage where the difference between track and road is during a training day.

As far as lost earnings and injury thats what acc is for so we cant sue each other and need liability insurance etc or am I wrong?

D3ADLYTuna

2nd May 2012, 19:18

:woohoo:
10char

unstuck

2nd May 2012, 19:22

Find said cunt. Video yourself stabbing said cunt to death with a pencil, then post it on here. Nothing exciting happens on here :Punk:

mossy1200

2nd May 2012, 19:25

Have not recently conversed with them, they may just want to establish im not a fault then waive the excess but either way, he should not be doing what he has.

Agree but ALMOST all road accidents are caused by someone not doing what they should be doing. eg drive to fast, drive while tired, not looking properly, simply not following the rules, poor habits or unsafe vehicles. Then theres the odd animal strike, falling tree that Katman might not have avoided etc.

Crasherfromwayback

2nd May 2012, 19:38

typical KB Hey...

I'd be pissed off to if at an ART day I got taken out by an idiot undertaking. Its rider training - not a race - no excuses for undertaking.

Think about this. What if you accidently got into a corner too hot. Easy enough to do. Insted of ramming the sorry cunt in front of you up the arse you try and go inside. You tuck the front trying your best and skittle him.

I saw a guy by the name of Valentino Rossi do this last year.

It happens. It's a retard of a mistake at any level...but it's life.

D3ADLYTuna

2nd May 2012, 19:42

I like Rossi...

Pussy

2nd May 2012, 19:43

If it was just a "trackday", I would say it was bad luck. On the same token, I too would be fucken ropeable if it happened to me on a training day. No place for red mist on training days.

Sharry

2nd May 2012, 19:44

I do not have ANY contact details for the guy as i did not have a chance to get them before i got taken off in the ambulance.
It was explicitly explained that passing is the sole responsibility of the passer, not anybody else.
I didnt see or hear him coming as you are told not to worry about what is behind you on the training day for above said reason.
I also do not have any complaint against the organiser at all, and i have no idea where some of these people got that notion.
I know accidents happen but you have to consider what he saw when he came up behind me.

Would ANY of you continue trying to undertake on an apex when you can see the rider in front of you is tightening his line and you know you will hit him... Racers excluded.

I completly agree with you Tuna, Passing was his responsability and he was clearly undertaking while you where inches away frrom the riple strip, tightening your line and unaware of his presence.
Passing is the responsability of the passer!!
ART day is a training day NOT a race day.

AllanB

2nd May 2012, 19:48

Did you really say 'I didn't see him'! Classic.

You said you had a video of the incident.

Forward it to your insurer and let them do their job.

Mercury

2nd May 2012, 19:55

It's interesting that most people here think it's OK to maim some one with impunity all because he was on a track. Would we still say "harden up!" if DEADLYTuna was killed? What part of rider training lets you destroy other peoples property with no available recourse? Just being on a track doesn't absolve you of responsibility for your actions.

Perhaps I have the wrong end of the stick but it seems like the OP got shafted.

D3ADLYTuna

2nd May 2012, 19:55

No homo

10 char

AllanB

2nd May 2012, 20:00

i said i had photographic evidence...

Good enough - use that to prove to your insured that you were not in fault.

Scan and post this evidence on KB mate - might sort out a few posts!

jrandom

2nd May 2012, 20:12

Waaa

That's racing (tm)

98tls

2nd May 2012, 20:12

Good enough - use that to prove to your insured that you were not in fault.

Scan and post this evidence on KB mate - might sort out a few posts!

Amen to that,all this bullshit re "suck it up" is pathetic,if indeed the thread starters telling it as it was then the dipshit should front up with some $ and walk away at least retaining some self respect,if hes not prepared to then he should at least front up to a smack in the mouth.Fuck all the legal beagle bullshit whatever happened to simple decency.

haydes55

2nd May 2012, 20:14

Anyone who thinks the organisers should "take responsibility" need to wake up & realise that if they are expected to cover eventualities such as Tuna's then track days would cost something like $5,000 per person.

The other rider is likely a supreme fuckwit. Thems the breaks, pardon the pun.

Sorry for your pain.

What I meant was the organisers set rules to ensure participants were behaving as safely as possible. When a rider has breached these rules the organisers should be responsible to enforce their rules.

This would take time for the organisers not cost. In fact they could fine the guilty party and earn money. SNZ fines competitors if they cause crashes through stupidity at big events. I'm sure track day organisers could have the same power through MNZ?

98tls

2nd May 2012, 20:15

That's racing (tm)

Bullshit mate,its just a lack of fronting up and sorting out your fuck up,never did anyone any harm in the past.

Madness

2nd May 2012, 20:15

What I meant was the organisers set rules to ensure participants were behaving as safely as possible. When a rider has breached these rules the organisers should be responsible to enforce their rules.

This would take time for the organisers not cost. In fact they could fine the guilty party and earn money. SNZ fines competitors if they cause crashes through stupidity at big events. I'm sure track day organisers could have the same power through MNZ?

:facepalm:

Crasherfromwayback

2nd May 2012, 20:16

Amen to that,all this bullshit re "suck it up" is pathetic,if indeed the thread starters telling it as it was then the dipshit should front up with some $ and walk away at least retaining some self respect,if hes not prepared to then he should at least front up to a smack in the mouth.Fuck all the legal beagle bullshit whatever happened to simple decency.

Mistakes are made mate. It's what makes us human.

Kickaha

2nd May 2012, 20:16

whatever happened to simple decency.

It fucked off with its mate"personal responsibility" years ago

Crasherfromwayback

2nd May 2012, 20:17

Bullshit mate,its just a lack of fronting up and sorting out your fuck up,never did anyone any harm in the past.

What if Stoner had punched Rossi in the face last year?

haydes55

2nd May 2012, 20:17

:facepalm:

? Is it stupid of me to think that an organiser can tell people rules then act when someone breaks the rules?

Maha

2nd May 2012, 20:17

Save it for the track!

Kickaha

2nd May 2012, 20:18

? Is it stupid of me to think that an organiser can tell people rules then act when someone breaks the rules?

They probably can but chances are they'll be pretty limited in what they can do

Madness

2nd May 2012, 20:18

...whatever happened to simple decency.

I've often wondered that myself. It appears to have disappeared a long time ago, just like Georgie Pie.

Pussy

2nd May 2012, 20:21

What if Stoner had punched Rossi in the face last year?

That would be a valid remark if the day was a raceday or a garden variety track day.
In this case it was a training day. Someone's head would be rolling if they did it to me.

Madness

2nd May 2012, 20:22

? Is it stupid of me to think that an organiser can tell people rules then act when someone breaks the rules?

Naive perhaps. They would enforce such action under what jurisdiction? If a club fines a member that member has the option to say "fuck you" and not come back. This was an ART day and as such participants indemnify the organisers but the participants don't necessarily have to agree to abide by the organisers rules.

haydes55

2nd May 2012, 20:23

They probably can but chances are they'll be pretty limited in what they can do

They can fine, ban and suspend riders. In terms of compensation/reparations the organisers would most likely have no power. Still worth talking to them to get ahold of the other riders details (they will have if he registered to ride the track day).

What is written in the waver/contract/form you signed?

jrandom

2nd May 2012, 20:24

There are two flavours of input on this thread:

A. ZOMG LET'S BEAT THE CUNT UP AND MAKE HIM PAY

B. *shrug* nothin' to be done, suck it up and move on

The 'A' posts are sympathetic but pointless. Nobody's going to beat the cunt up, and he's not going to pay.

The 'B' posts are callous but correct.

I don't think there's much of a middle ground to be found, unfortunately.

Stand by now for a further seventeen pages of alternating As and Bs.

98tls

2nd May 2012, 20:25

Mistakes are made mate. It's what makes us human.

I hear you mate but its what we do after making a mistake that defines what sort of human being we are,wasnt that long ago that the right thing was done generally,these days if there a way out its generally taken.Dont mind me :laugh:i just prefer the old way.

jrandom

2nd May 2012, 20:26

Someone's head would be rolling if they did it to me.

What are you actually saying? That you'd find the guy and physically assault him? You wouldn't actually do that, on account of not being completely stupid.

And you couldn't sue him for personal injury, cos of the ACC laws. This isn't the USA.

So... what, exactly, would the 'rolling head' constitute?

short-circuit

2nd May 2012, 20:27

Madness

2nd May 2012, 20:28

Pretty hard to smack the cunt with both arms in slings. Just saying.

short-circuit

2nd May 2012, 20:28

What are you actually saying? That you'd find the guy and physically assault him? You wouldn't actually do that, on account of not being completely stupid.

And you couldn't sue him for personal injury, cos of the ACC laws. This isn't the USA.

So... what, exactly, would the 'rolling head' constitute?

Plus the fact that both the OP's arms are in plaster makes that option kinda difficult

Edit: beat me to it

Kickaha

2nd May 2012, 20:28

They can fine, ban and suspend riders. In terms of compensation/reparations the organisers would most likely have no power. Still worth talking to them to get ahold of the other riders details (they will have if he registered to ride the track day).

What is written in the waver/contract/form you signed?

You seem to be assuming the rider is a MNZ licence holder?

I doubt they can fine or suspend anyone if he isn't, the organisers may be able to ban him from attending further ART days but that would be about it

Crasherfromwayback

2nd May 2012, 20:28

That would be a valid remark if the day was a raceday or a garden variety track day.
In this case it was a training day. Someone's head would be rolling if they did it to me.

And fair enough if you take matters into your own hands there and then. But to me John, if you venture out onto a race track...you've gotta be prepared to encounter fuckwits. At any level other than National level. Luckily...by then, most of the cunts have their shit sorted out.

Red mist knows no rules. Mistakes (especially by amateurs) do happen. Ride with them at your own peril.

SMOKEU

2nd May 2012, 20:28

The at fault party should still pay for any financial losses incurred by the victim. If you fuck someone else and/or their property up due to negligence or stupidity, then you should have to pay. It's as simple as that. Being on a race track shouldn't make any difference. It's called personal responsibility, and judging by some of the posts here it's a quality that is sadly lacking in this world.

haydes55

2nd May 2012, 20:30

Naive perhaps. They would enforce such action under what jurisdiction? If a club fines a member that member has the option to say "fuck you" and not come back. This was an ART day and as such participants indemnify the organisers but the participants don't necessarily have to agree to abide by the organisers rules.

I am a bit naive to the rules for an ART day, is a day licence required (MNZ licence)? At any point has the rider agreed to a contract/clause that says if he/she breaches rules then he/she must pay a fine? If so they are in a legally binding contract to pay a fine which MNZ could send to Baycorp to collect.

Punishing the stupid rider but still no reparation.

Hard to give legal advice to anyone without seeing what has been signed.

I do see where you are coming from, MNZ probably wouldn't bother going to Baycorp and the rider might just never do anything MNZ affiliated again. Or he could want to do another MNZ event and pay the fine, the thing is there is still that power and they should use it.

Madness

2nd May 2012, 20:31

... the organisers may be able to ban him from attending further ART days but that would be about it

Pretty pointless if his bike's toast as well.

I can't help but draw a comparison to indoor go-karting. You pays your money, sign a disclaimer and then if you fuck up they tell you to fuck off. End of.

98tls

2nd May 2012, 20:32

jrandom

2nd May 2012, 20:32

I am a bit naive to the rules for an ART day, is a day licence required (MNZ licence)? At any point has the rider agreed to a contract/clause that says if he/she breaches rules then he/she must pay a fine?

I seriously doubt it.

Crasherfromwayback

2nd May 2012, 20:33

I hear you mate but its what we do after making a mistake that defines what sort of human being we are,wasnt that long ago that the right thing was done generally,these days if there a way out its generally taken.Dont mind me :laugh:i just prefer the old way.

Look...I hear you too. And the other peeps here. But I may yet loose a foot due to some other cunts amateurish mistake. Yes I was racing, so it's different. But whilst racing, I also think it's fair to assume that the other racers should be a lil better skilled than the average wanna be jockey. Do I wanna go him? Nope. If I wanted to be safe and sound, without injury...I'd take up knitting with a flexible, soft (and blunt) needles.

Move on. Nothing to see here.

98tls

2nd May 2012, 20:35

HenryDorsetCase

2nd May 2012, 20:35

i was on closed circuit track for the purpose of learning, being an advanced rider training day. I dont have the guys details at all therefore i cant contact him

what did the liability waiver say that you signed prior to commencing?

unstuck

2nd May 2012, 20:38

just like Georgie Pie.

Mmmmm, Georgie pie. Bring back Georgie pie.:drool:

Kickaha

2nd May 2012, 20:38

what did the liability waiver say that you signed prior to commencing?

http://www.amcc.org.nz/uploads/richassets/Entry%20Form%20April%202012.pdf

DISCLAIMER OF LIABILITY
1. I am aware that the sport of Motorcycling might:
a. Cause me injury, serious or otherwise.
b. Damage my property.
2. I wish to take part in this training day despite the above risks.
3. Neither I, nor anyone associated or connected with me, will make any claim against you or your officers, employees or agents in respect of:
a. Any injury suffered by me; or
b. Any damage to any of my property
regardless of how the injury or damage occurs.
4. I will indemnify you against all claims, damages or losses (including costs), which you incur as the direct or indirect result of any injury to me or
damage, to my property.
5. I am physically fit and there is no health or other reason why I should not participate in Motorcycle Training.
6. I am aware that this disclaimer will not affect any legal obligations you have to me, which you cannot contract out of under New Zealand law.
7. I agree that in this disclaimer "my property" includes any property owned by me or in my possession or under my control.
8. I agree that this disclaimer will be binding on my family, my heirs, my legal assigns and my administrators and executors.

Looks like they just use the standard one used for race meetings

gatch

2nd May 2012, 20:39

what did the liability waiver say that you signed prior to commencing?

Does the form you sign say you are liable for damages in an incident, or words to that effect ?

If it does, then go hard, get your moneys, or show the insurance company the waiver and the evidence, or something.

If not, then stink.

And I hope you heal up ok..

Hitcher

2nd May 2012, 20:39

Nothing positive to say,
Don't say anything at all...

Good luck with that. Other posters have clearly outlined your likelihood of success, as will your insurance company and also a lawyer, if you want to spend some cash getting legal advice.

A word of positive advice? Continue behaving as you are in public online forums and you may have to add a bruised personal reputation to whatever other ailments afflict you.

SMOKEU

2nd May 2012, 20:39

Sweet,somebody go grab ladyboy Clark its time to pay the piper...

Which part of taking responsibility for one's actions do you find disconcerting?

FJRider

2nd May 2012, 20:40

Well you should've said that when you started the thread!

Wouldn't matter even if he DID say that ... some of make a habit of not saying positive things ... but we do it in the nicest way possible ... sometimes ...

St_Gabriel

2nd May 2012, 20:45

once again,

Nothing positive to say,
Don't say anything at all...

Proton? (Couldnt say Neutron though at OP request)

haydes55

2nd May 2012, 20:46

http://www.amcc.org.nz/uploads/richassets/Entry%20Form%20April%202012.pdf

DISCLAIMER OF LIABILITY
1. I am aware that the sport of Motorcycling might:
a. Cause me injury, serious or otherwise.
b. Damage my property.
2. I wish to take part in this training day despite the above risks.
3. Neither I, nor anyone associated or connected with me, will make any claim against you or your officers, employees or agents in respect of:
a. Any injury suffered by me; or
b. Any damage to any of my property
regardless of how the injury or damage occurs.
4. I will indemnify you against all claims, damages or losses (including costs), which you incur as the direct or indirect result of any injury to me or
damage, to my property.
5. I am physically fit and there is no health or other reason why I should not participate in Motorcycle Training.
6. I am aware that this disclaimer will not affect any legal obligations you have to me, which you cannot contract out of under New Zealand law.
7. I agree that in this disclaimer "my property" includes any property owned by me or in my possession or under my control.
8. I agree that this disclaimer will be binding on my family, my heirs, my legal assigns and my administrators and executors.

Looks like they just use the standard one used for race meetings

Organisers aren't liable for any damages, however that doesn't say anything to do with 2 people having a dispute. Nowhere in that waver does it say you cannot take legal action against another individual.

Ender EnZed

2nd May 2012, 20:49

if you venture out onto a race track...you've gotta be prepared to encounter fuckwits. At any level other than National level.

I understand what you're saying, but this is a point that has been entirely absent from every one of the countless voices that frequently and vocally encourage everyone of every skill level to get out on a track because "Trackdays save lives". The message would be a lot less appealing if it included the disclaimer that "If someone else fucks your bike up and puts you in hospital then you should accept that you've been fucked in the arse and do nothing about it because it was on a track."

98tls

2nd May 2012, 20:52

I understand what you're saying, but this is a point that has been entirely absent from every one of the countless voices that frequently and vocally encourage everyone of every skill level to get out on a track because "Trackdays save lives". The message would be a lot less appealing if it included the disclaimer that "If someone else fucks your bike up and puts you in hospital then you should accept that you've been fucked in the arse and do nothing about it because it was on a track."

Finally.....

short-circuit

2nd May 2012, 20:56

Sweet,somebody go grab ladyboy Clark its time to pay the piper...

The National party was invited to comment about X but for the past 4 years have declined to be interviewed...

Crasherfromwayback

2nd May 2012, 20:57

I understand what you're saying, but this is a point that has been entirely absent from every one of the countless voices that frequently and vocally encourage everyone of every skill level to get out on a track because "Trackdays save lives". ]"

That's why you'll see me saying if you want to go fast, go to a race track. But join a club. Get a cheap race bike. Learn some race craft. And do it on a bike you're fully prepared to throw in the rubbish bin. Other that that. Get some private tuition from some cunt that know's what they're doing. Away from the red misted crowds with too much testosterone and not enough skill.

Pussy

2nd May 2012, 21:00

unstuck

2nd May 2012, 21:01

I still reckon stabbing the cunt with a pencil is the best idea.:Punk:

Subike

2nd May 2012, 21:10

That's why you'll see me saying if you want to go fast, go to a race track. But join a club. Get a cheap race bike. Learn some race craft. And do it on a bike you're fully prepared to throw in the rubbish bin. Other that that. Get some private tuition from some cunt that know's what they're doing. Away from the red misted crowds with too much testosterone and not enough skill.

is this not what the OP did?

Went to an advanced rider training day to get advance skills for riding to ensure that he was a safer rider on the road gain knowledge as to how to avoid muppets that just want to be muppets do it in a safe environment under professional supervision from experience motorcycle riders under the belief that he was being trained not rammed off the fucking track buy sum cunt with an ego the size of the hulk that couldn't pilot a zandupp on a Sunday after noon to the local whore house for a $1 fuck!

I would not want to go get rider training from the provider of this ART event if this is the possible result, fuck that.

haydes55

2nd May 2012, 21:15

sum cunt with an ego the size of the hulk that couldn't pilot a zandupp on a Sunday after noon to the local whore house for a $1 fuck!

Creative! Sounds like it's happened to you aswell?

98tls

2nd May 2012, 21:17

The National party was invited to comment about X but for the past 4 years have declined to be interviewed...

"comment":laugh:what the fuck is there left to say?.

caseye

2nd May 2012, 21:20

Am I reading this right?
Indemnity signed, OK,no going the Training day organisiers.No worries and quite right too.
Organisers say, "no undertaking" "idiot" undertakes, for whatever reason, damage is done.
OP.Put this in the hands of the people who said, yes, you are insured while attending a Rider training day. I am and if I wasn't I wouldn't be there.Too may idiots!
Let them do what they do, fix your bike and claim any damages ( excess) from him and or his insurance company.
While this occurred on a race track, it was under the auspices of a "rider training day" and for all intents and purposes it is covered by exactly the same set of rules as if it occurred on the open road.
To all of you out there who were so quick to say, "suck it up"
I know most of you, one way or another, like me you're all pretty much in it for the love of the ride and most of you are actually decent people (OK some of ya's are absolute nut jobs, I still love's youses though) you would not sit still and allow this to happen to yourself or someone you knew and do nothing about it.
So for once put aside the bloody stupid , ONLY ON KB bs and tell it like it is.
here it is from me.
I'd find out this persons details, I'd approach them on a personal level and ask for them to do the right thing.
Failing that, I'd go to my insurance co who do cover me(FULLY) at a rider training day and at a track day and put it in their hands in the full knowledge that they will fix my bike and go the other guy for any excess as he was clearly in the wrong.
I'm not sure I'd have come here telling anyone who would listen that the other person was a big C and wasn't doing this or that, but, he would, one way or another be paying.

Crasherfromwayback

2nd May 2012, 21:26

But I would expect to see some ettiquette at a training day.

I would too John. Doesn't mean you're always gonna get it. We have road rules in NZ (most countires do). We're expected to stick to them. If some dozzy prick failed to give way and hit the side of your car...would you get out of your car and smash him in the face? Because I think you're saying that if you were the OP...you would've done that at Puke no?

is this not what the OP did?

Went to an advanced rider training day to get advance skills for riding to ensure that he was a safer rider on the road gain knowledge as to how to avoid muppets that just want to be muppets do it in a safe environment under professional supervision from experience motorcycle riders under the belief that he was being trained not rammed off the fucking track buy sum cunt with an ego the size of the hulk that couldn't pilot a zandupp on a Sunday after noon to the local whore house for a $1 fuck!

I would not want to go get rider training from the provider of this ART event if this is the possible result, fuck that.

Were you there mate? Are you saying you saw what happened? Or are you simply taking what the OP has said as gospel 100%?

Years ago, at Levels raceway, I was following the late great Robert Holden. His Ducati shit it's self, and dumped oil everywhere. I was trying to catch a draft from him at the time. Come the corner...when I hit the picks...the front tyre being covered in oil didn't want to play ball. I near put it down when it locked up. When I recovered from that nasty front end slide, I was to the inside of Robert. I had no way of scrubbing off anymore speed with an oil soaked front tyre, so I sat it upright and shot through the inside of him and onto the grass.

He thought I'd simply left my braking way too late, and shook his fist at me and gave me the finger. I went over to tell him what had happened afterward, as I was fucking spewing about that, then his reaction. But he didn't know the full story when he shook his fist at me.

Maybe the OP doesn't know the full story yet either. Doubt you do either.

Ender EnZed

2nd May 2012, 21:26

So... what, exactly, would the 'rolling head' constitute?

I'd piss on his barbecue.

short-circuit

2nd May 2012, 21:33

Were you there mate? Are you saying you saw what happened? Or are you simply taking what the OP has said as gospel 100%?

Years ago, at Levels raceway, I was following the late great Robert Holden. His Ducati shit it's self, and dumped oil everywhere. I was trying to catch a draft from him at the time. Come the corner...when I hit the picks...the front tyre being covered in oil didn't want to play ball. I near put it down when it locked up. When I recovered from that nasty front end slide, I was to the inside of Robert. I had no way of scrubbing off anymore speed with an oil soaked front tyre, so I sat it upright and shot through the inside of him and onto the grass.

He thought I'd simply left my braking way too late, and shook his fist at me and gave me the finger. I went over to tell him what had happened afterward, as I was fucking spewing about that, then his reaction. But he didn't know the full story when he shook his fist at me.

Maybe the OP doesn't know the full story yet either. Doubt you do either.

Cool story bro...but not quite good enough for me to upload the relevant meme

Kornholio

2nd May 2012, 21:34

About your injuries...they're never fun.

But you need to harden up and take it on the chin. Not in the butt.

Yes

That's racing (tm)

... and Yes

Mate, if you were doing a defensive driving course and got taken out I'd be pissed... You were doing an 'advanced rider training' day so there was bound to be some over 100kph speeds which can be 'dangerous' ... It's a racetrack, suck it up and come back twice as fast

Steve Gauge

2nd May 2012, 21:35

out of interest what was he riding and what did his bike end up looking like

Ender EnZed

2nd May 2012, 21:44

Mate, if you were doing a defensive driving course and got taken out I'd be pissed... You were doing an 'advanced rider training' day so there was bound to be some over 100kph speeds which can be 'dangerous' ... It's a racetrack, suck it up and come back twice as fast

Lolwut? It was a fucking training day. On a track. Is it really so outrageous that Mr Johnny Motorcycle, who can't afford to lose his bike, should wish to attend such an event? Are such events in fact not suitable for someone who spends all that they can on their bike but still need it to get to work on Monday?

D3ADLYTuna

2nd May 2012, 21:47

more than 10 char

Kornholio

2nd May 2012, 21:48

Lolwut? It was a fucking training day. On a track. Is it really so outrageous that Mr Johnny Motorcycle, who can't afford to lose his bike, should wish to attend such an event? Are such events in fact not suitable for someone who spends all that they can on their bike but still need it to get to work on Monday?

Well he shouldn't take his commute to a fucken race track then... Was he there to learn how to split lanes on his way to work quicker or was he there to learn how to flog his bike around a track and expect the unexpected...

jrandom

2nd May 2012, 21:54

I did not post what you quoted.

Boils down to it, though.

ACC will patch you up, and your insurance will patch your bike up. If you didn't have insurance, now you know why it's a good idea.

Forget about the other guy. Resenting him for his fuckup will get you precisely nowhere.

To be honest, you sound like a whiny girl's blouse. Also, the fact that you couldn't work out on your own that there's nothing to be done but get on with life makes you come across as dumb.

I'm sure you're actually very stoic and manly and quite intelligent, so you might want to rethink your approach to posting on the forum.

sil3nt

2nd May 2012, 22:05

I like how crasher keeps referring to racing incidents when this particular incident has nothing to do with racing.

gixerracer

2nd May 2012, 22:06

Lol, we shall see people.
I'm asking for constructive ideas not people saying its my fault. I went to puke to ride and learn just like everyone else.
It was stated no undertaking,
The guy was hardly going faster than me, he just did a stupid thing.
If he wanted to race he should be in group 4 where people can do what they like...
If your going to flame or abuse me then stop typing and go waste your lives elsewhere.
If you have a good comment then hit me.

Cant see anyone saying it was your fault. This has happened many many times and it sucks but there is nothing you can do really. Try saying you crashed on the road and claim insurance:facepalm::innocent:

jrandom

2nd May 2012, 22:06

I like how crasher keeps referring to racing incidents when this particular incident has nothing to do with racing.

If your stories were as cool as Pete's, you'd keep referring to racing incidents too.

Kornholio

2nd May 2012, 22:09

Try saying you crashed on the road and claim insurance:facepalm::innocent:
I have heard that works... <_<

D3ADLYTuna

2nd May 2012, 22:10

Heres pics. i held my line, i just apexed late. no problem with that.

263058263059263060263061

Ender EnZed

2nd May 2012, 22:11

Well he shouldn't take his commute to a fucken race track then... Was he there to learn how to split lanes on his way to work quicker or was he there to learn how to flog his bike around a track and expect the unexpected...

One of the commonly asserted advantages (and even disadvantages) of tracks is that you don't have anything like the number of unexpected hazards that you do on the road. There are no sheep, tractors pulling out, cars on your side of the road, trucks dumping diesel and such like.

you might want to rethink your approach to posting on the forum.

Pffft, sure he's done a shit job of it but he raises a valid and underdiscussed point. You've espoused the values of track days on plenty of occassions but I've never seen you advise a potential track dayee that they are in fact risking their pride and joy to the recklessness of other attendees. Surely this should be a matter of consideration if you consider it par for the course for all track based events?

Madness

2nd May 2012, 22:12

I like how crasher keeps referring to racing incidents when this particular incident has nothing to do with racing.

Except it occurred on a race track. Likely also at speeds higher than the prescribed open road speed limit. I could understand the grievance if this was a basic handling course in a carpark going around cones but it wasn't. I could understand the grievance if there was damage or consequnces that are still somehow avoidable but they're not, the damage is done.

Give the cunt a chance anyways. There's every chance they'll learn of this soon-to-be-epic thread, at which time they'll either man up, or emigrate to Australia. AMCC should have a contact number for him.

TOTO

2nd May 2012, 22:14

DISCLAIMER OF LIABILITY
1. I am aware that the sport of Motorcycling might:
a. Cause me injury, serious or otherwise.
b. Damage my property.
2. I wish to take part in this training day despite the above risks.
3. Neither I, nor anyone associated or connected with me, will make any claim against you or your officers, employees or agents in respect of:
a. Any injury suffered by me; or
b. Any damage to any of my property
regardless of how the injury or damage occurs.
4. I will indemnify you against all claims, damages or losses (including costs), which you incur as the direct or indirect result of any injury to me or
damage, to my property.
5. I am physically fit and there is no health or other reason why I should not participate in Motorcycle Training.
6. I am aware that this disclaimer will not affect any legal obligations you have to me, which you cannot contract out of under New Zealand law.
7. I agree that in this disclaimer "my property" includes any property owned by me or in my possession or under my control.
8. I agree that this disclaimer will be binding on my family, my heirs, my legal assigns and my administrators and executors.
9. I accept that stripping and re-assembly for Technical Checks are at my cost.
10. I consent to the details contained in this form being held by Auckland Motorcycle Club Inc. for the purpose of the promotion and benefit of the training
day concerned, and Motorcycling in general. I acknowledge my right to access and correction of this information. This consent is given in accordance
with the Privacy Act 1993.
11. Drug and alcohol policy: MNZ supports the FIM/IOC charter on drugs in sport. MNZ uses the services of the New Zealand Sports Drug Agency
(NZSDA) to professionally carry out the testing. I acknowledge by signing this form I may be subjected to a drug/alcohol test at any time. I agree to
such testing. I further agree that my name can be published by MNZ as having taken part in a drug/alcohol test together with the results of that testing.

You signed it. Stop winging.

jrandom

2nd May 2012, 22:18

Here are the pictures of what happened

I got a better one!

<img src="http://i46.tinypic.com/qrdxyq.jpg"/>

... sorry, why'd you crash, again?

the rider ADMITTED FAULT

Excellent, that'll make the cops' job a lot easier.

Oh, no, wait, you were on a racetrack.

I've never seen you advise a potential track dayee that they are in fact risking their pride and joy to the recklessness of other attendees.

Still a hell of a lot safer than riding on the road.

The OP snapped a coupla wee bones and has his arm in a sling. Beats going under a logging truck or hitting a power pole with your spine.

Ender EnZed

2nd May 2012, 22:20

You signed it. Stop winging.

He agreed that AMCC wasn't responsible, not that he was happy to be fucked in the arse by all and and sundry without complaint.

gixerracer

2nd May 2012, 22:23

Berries

2nd May 2012, 22:23

I know most of you, one way or another, like me.
Wrong thread for that kind of post.

Kornholio

2nd May 2012, 22:24

I got a better one!

... sorry, why'd you crash, again?

.

Off topic, but that is my desktop pic... 2 guys I know well going hammer and tongs around Paeroa :)

Back to the slanging off...

Ender EnZed

2nd May 2012, 22:24

Still a hell of a lot safer than riding on the road.

The OP snapped a coupla wee bones and has his arm in a sling. Beats going under a logging truck or hitting a power pole with your spine.

The odds may be better but it appears that the stakes are in fact much higher. Don't get me wrong, none of this will put me off taking my bikes on the track or a nuclear propelled submarine, but if what you've suggested is in fact as much the case as that track days can improve your skills then I think it should be more widely known.

jrandom

2nd May 2012, 22:25

Off topic, but that is my desktop pic... 2 guys I know well going hammer and tongs around Paeroa :)

And just for the record, #71 finished in front.

:sunny:

Ender EnZed

2nd May 2012, 22:26

So when Rossi/Ducati crashed and knocked off Stoner/Honda should Ducati pay Honda for the cost of fixing the bike???????????????????

If it was on a fucking AMCC training day being ridden by a couple of nubs then YES, that is exactly what should happen.

jrandom

2nd May 2012, 22:26

The odds may be better but it appears that the stakes are in fact much higher.

You do realise that people bin and write their bikes off on the road too, right?

Madness

2nd May 2012, 22:27

He agreed that AMCC wasn't responsible, not that he was happy to be fucked in the arse by all and and sundry without complaint.

The first bit kind of sets the scene for the event though. All care, no responsibility.

DISCLAIMER OF LIABILITY
1. I am aware that the sport of Motorcycling might:
a. Cause me injury, serious or otherwise.
b. Damage my property.
2. I wish to take part in this training day despite the above risks.

SMOKEU

2nd May 2012, 22:30

So when Rossi/Ducati crashed and knocked off Stoner/Honda should Ducati pay Honda for the cost of fixing the bike???????????????????

The at fault party should pay. Maybe I should "accidentely" push your bike over and then see what attitude you have.

Kornholio

2nd May 2012, 22:30

If it was on a fucking AMCC training day being ridden by a couple of nubs then YES, that is exactly what should happen.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_oRrOZC9jH_c/SyIac1FGswI/AAAAAAAAD4c/0RZhRN0Aw9o/s400/computer.JPG

Crasherfromwayback

2nd May 2012, 22:32

Cool story bro...but not quite good enough for me to upload the relevant meme

You just upset you don't have any?

Ender EnZed

2nd May 2012, 22:32

The first bit kind of sets the scene for the event though. All care, no responsibility.

DISCLAIMER OF LIABILITY
1. I am aware that the sport of Motorcycling might:
a. Cause me injury, serious or otherwise.
b. Damage my property.
2. I wish to take part in this training day despite the above risks.

He signed that off to AMCC, not every other participent.

You do realise that people bin and write their bikes off on the road too, right?

I do. You do realise that if I got hit by an old lady on the road whose insurance policy had lapsed then I could expect to either get paid by her directly or follow some court process and collect money from her, right?

jrandom

2nd May 2012, 22:34

You do realise that if I got hit by an old lady on the road whose insurance policy had lapsed then I could expect to either get paid by her directly or follow some court process and collect money from her, right?

You didn't sign a disclaimer before leaving your garage that morning that you accepted that what you were doing might result in injury or equipment damage and that that would be your problem if it happened, though, did you?

flyingcrocodile46

2nd May 2012, 22:35

Unfuckingbelieveable.:facepalm:

You roll the dice you take your chances. It ain't cool to blame the others at the table if you luck out. :no:

Nobody seems to be considering that maybe the other guy had no malicious or mischievous intent. That he didn't set out to undertake on purpose and that he simply misjudged things :shit: (as CFWB said).

Think about this. What if you accidently got into a corner too hot. Easy enough to do. Insted of ramming the sorry cunt in front of you up the arse you try and go inside. You tuck the front trying your best and skittle him.

I saw a guy by the name of Valentino Rossi do this last year.

It happens. It's a retard of a mistake at any level...but it's life.

If insurance has paid out the OP then he may (injuries aside) have come out as well or better than the other 'accident' victim :yes:

So what are we talking about then? persecuting the other victim because he didn't come off as bad. Maybe the other victim was braking in reasonable time to overtake the OP on the inside before the corner and the OP is a nonce and braked way too early then fucked up by turning in early and cutting across the other victims line?

We shouldn't be too quick to pass judgement based on only one side of the OP's :violin: story.

Kornholio

2nd May 2012, 22:35

The at fault party should pay. Maybe I should "accidentely" push your bike over and then see what attitude you have.

Maybe you should... I dare ye ;)

Mind you he knocks it over himself enough without you helpin him :D

jrandom

2nd May 2012, 22:36

Maybe the other victim was braking in reasonable time to overtake the OP on the inside before the corner and the OP is a nonce and braked way too early then fucked up by turning in early and cutting across the other victims line?

... oh, yeah, that too.

:sunny:

Ender EnZed

2nd May 2012, 22:40

Quoted Embedded Image Removed

You didn't sign a disclaimer before leaving your garage that morning that you accepted that what you were doing might result in injury or equipment damage and that that would be your problem if it happened, though, did you?

There is a culture in New Zealand motorcyling that suggests all track days are to be undertaken willing because they will improve the rider who undertakes them's skill. I don't think that we should accept what may well be the status quo that having your bike destroyed on such an event is fine because it was on a race track.

No one has signed up to this.

Baaaaahaaaaasa. Fuck VBulletin. That's all.

TOTO

2nd May 2012, 22:40

He agreed that AMCC wasn't responsible, not that he was happy to be fucked in the arse by all and and sundry without complaint.

That wouldn't happen on a Hyosung !

SPP

2nd May 2012, 22:41

The organisers of ART take safety VERY seriously and are very quick to pull up dangerous riding.
I fully understand that the OP feels hard done by but I hope it doesn’t put him off ART (or any other track days).

I hope the OP has a speedy recovery and gets out again. Bales are softer than ditches.

...Were you there mate? Are you saying you saw what happened? Or are you simply taking what the OP has said as gospel 100%?..Maybe the OP doesn't know the full story yet either...

Ah, another side of the story perhaps? relative speed and line choice through a very quick corner could have played a part in the incident. Just sayin

Madness

2nd May 2012, 22:41

He signed that off to AMCC, not every other participent.

Correct, so what. Every other participant on the race track that day also (presumably) signed the same document. Therefore, everyone on the track acknowledged in writing that what they were doing could potentially cause them injury (serious or otherwise) or damage their property. Despite this imminent risk, both the OP and every other participant still wanted to participate in the activity.

Call me stupid but I don't remember signing anything like this when I got my Drivers Licence. Nor do I sign anythink like this when I pay my rego, jump on the bike or into the car for a pootle on the road..

:msn-wink:

Flip

2nd May 2012, 22:48

[QUOTE=Kornholio;1130315728]pic

There is a culture in New Zealand motorcyling that suggests all track days are to be undertaken willing because they will improve the rider who undertakes them's skill. I don't think that we should accept what may well be the status quo that having your bike destroyed on such an event is fine because it was on a race track.

No one has signed up to this.

I also believe that track days result in a false sense of security, espcially with many young sports bike riders, with serious consequences.
Just because your bike can do 250 kph doesent mean you mind can keep up.

D3ADLYTuna

2nd May 2012, 22:50

:sunny::violin::done:

Kornholio

2nd May 2012, 22:57

[IMG]man-boobs.jpg[IMG]

.

Oh charming, several cows were harmed in the making of your leathers by the looks.... less pies ow

scracha

2nd May 2012, 23:18

It's a race track....a closed circuit. When two bikes come together, nobody is LEGALLY "at fault" because there's no "road code". Trackday organisers' "no passing up inside" aren't law.. Different if they'd done it deliberately (assualt). Same as ANY OTHER SPORT. I don't claim damages when I get a rough tackle on the pitch or my shirt gets ripped. Can't see you having a shit show in hell of proving the other party were negligent either. Ever heard of an insurance company successfully claiming from a 3rd party at a trackday? Neither have I. Still...rather than relying on KB bush lawyers....why don't you visit a lawyer.

>1. I am aware that the sport of Motorcycling might:
>a. Cause me injury, serious or otherwise.
>b. Damage my property.
>2. I wish to take part in this training day despite the above risks.
Nuff said. You're not the first to be taken out at a trackday and you won't be the last. The other party made a mistake. I'm sure they feel bad about it. Whether they were showing off, went beyond their abilities or "took a wrong line" is irrelevant.

Yes, it's no unreasonable to expect to go to a trackday and not get taken out. But nothing is perfect.

Fucked if I'm going to get 3rd party insurance for trackdays or racing. And no, for fear of repercussions (like crazy bastards doing physical violence), then no, I wouldn't have given you my name either. You ride an expensive bike at the track, then get comprehensive insurance. You take your commuting bike to a trackday, then get comprehensive insurance. You value your income and do trackdays, then get medical and loss of earnings insurance. You get taken out by an idiot at the track? The best you should expect is help fixing up your bike and an apology. Get over it. Don't agree with the above, don't do trackdays. Simple eh?

What happens on the track, stays on the track.

TOTO

2nd May 2012, 23:19

I was not riding in the slow or medium group. I was riding in the fast group, one down from race group as i could not get insurance in the race group
and it was my first time on puke. I think that alot of people on here seem to assume for what ever reason that im new to riding or i dont have the skills to ride fast.

You were in the "fast group" coz you had a gixer 750 and your ego told you that because you have a fast shiny bike you are much better than those losers in group 2.

By the same logic applied to my personal skill judgement currently bequeathed upon me i have no idea how SKILLED you people are either. For all i know, not that im assuming this, you could all have only logged road time and have ridden slow and braked early and dont ride correctly. I dont assume this, in the OP i asked for opinions on the situation, not judgement of my skills which none of you have seen by the sounds of it.

no you presented your emotional sobby story, with plenty of insults to the other rider, including in the title of the thread.
and no we do not ride our bikes. We in fact drive to work in a vans and have our bikes inside the vans.

I dont claim to be a racer, but at least i was out there going fast, having fun and learning from professionals, can you all say the same or do you just ride to work and go for a spin on the weekend with your mates to buy a beer...

YES we can say the same. and we also know the risks and have track bikes.

Im no wordsmith, but i got out there on what was suposed to be a day where i didnt have to worry about others behind me, and look what happened.

So in all your riding career no one told you bikes were dangerous ?

I seriously doubt it, unless your the next rossi or stoner then i hazard a guess that half the judgements passed down here are from lesser skill people with fatter fingers who spend too much time on KB and not enough time out riding.

your guess is as good as your storytelling

But in future i would suggest holding your judgement and assumptions till you know what your talking about, otherwise you just show your real personality.

If you ask for peoples opinion as per the thread name ie: " What does KB think i should do to this prick?" , then expect to hear what people really think. none of that politically correct cotton wool you are surrounded in you everyday life. If you want to hear only positive opinions then you are living in dreamland.

Have a glass of cold water, heal up, take the insurance money, buy a track bike and go back to the stuff you like.

Latte

2nd May 2012, 23:30

Pics make it look like you were staring at the camera man.

Just sayin is all... :innocent:

Jantar

2nd May 2012, 23:33

....................
Looking at those pics, he held his line and you moved in on him. Just look at the distance from your front tyre to the edge of the track in each pic. You should each accept the damage to your own bike and call it even.

Ender EnZed

2nd May 2012, 23:37

no you presented your emotional sobby story

As opposed to your emotional sob story where it's unacceptable for someone to be pissed off by another rider's fuckwittery.

Correct, so what. Every other participant on the race track that day also (presumably) signed the same document. Therefore, everyone on the track acknowledged in writing that what they were doing could potentially cause them injury (serious or otherwise) or damage their property.

What they signed was an agreement that AMCC wasn't responsible, why is that so hard to understand?

haydes55

2nd May 2012, 23:43

Here are the pictures of what happened and the aftermath.

Did the guy in hi-vis crash? If you wore a hi-vis you wouldn't of crashed! Riding 101

TOTO

2nd May 2012, 23:45

As opposed to your emotional sob story where it's unacceptable for someone to be pissed off by another rider's fuckwittery.

YES. There are 24 hour pharmacies open these days. They do sell Vagisil

flyingcrocodile46

2nd May 2012, 23:47

You were in the "fast group" coz you had a gixer 750 and your ego told you that because you have a fast shiny bike you are much better than those losers in group 2.

no you presented your emotional sobby story, with plenty of insults to the other rider, including in the title of the thread.
and no we do not ride our bikes. We in fact drive to work in a vans and have our bikes inside the vans.

YES we can say the same. and we also know the risks and have track bikes.

So in all your riding career no one told you bikes were dangerous ?

your guess is as good as your storytelling

If you ask for peoples opinion as per the thread name ie: " What does KB think i should do to this prick?" , then expect to hear what people really think. none of that politically correct cotton wool you are surrounded in you everyday life. If you want to hear only positive opinions then you are living in dreamland.

Have a glass of cold water, heal up, take the insurance money, buy a track bike and go back to the stuff you like.

Spot on.

The way he is reacting to the comments which he asked for :rolleyes: is making me start to think that he didn't really want anyone's real opinion at all, and that his posting was only because he really wanted everyone to make him feel better by saying what a bad bad man the other rider is and that his little bruised pee pee will be just as big (if not bigger) than it always was :rolleyes:.

I actually felt sorry for him at the start of the thread. Now I just think he is a whiny arse cry baby.

flyingcrocodile46

2nd May 2012, 23:52

Looking at those pics, he held his line and you moved in on him. Just look at the distance from your front tyre to the edge of the track in each pic. You should each accept the damage to you own bike and call it even.

Well! there ya go, just as I suspected.

Maybe the other victim was braking in reasonable time to overtake the OP on the inside before the corner and the OP is a nonce and braked way too early then fucked up by turning in early and cutting across the other victims line?
We shouldn't be too quick to pass judgement based on only one side of the OP's :violin: story.

Sounds like he and his principles need to write out a cheque to pay for the repairs to the real victims bike so he can live with himself. After all he wouldn't want to be a low lif cunt who causes loss and suffering to an innocent biker. :no:

Ender EnZed

2nd May 2012, 23:56

Spot on.

The way he is reacting to the comments which he asked for :rolleyes: is making me start to think that he didn't really want anyone's real opinion at all, and that his posting was only because he really wanted everyone to make him feel better by saying what a bad bad man the other rider is and that his little bruised pee pee will be just as big (if not bigger) than it always was :rolleyes:.

I actually felt sorry for him at the start of the thread. Now I just think he is a whiny arse cry baby.

What a load of wank that responds to the weakest point you can find to disagree with.

YES. There are 24 hour pharmacies open these days. They do sell Vagisil

So you'd be happy for me to nail your missus or your mate and her/his bike in the arse out of this world should they dare take a bike on your race track? Despite it being under the auspicious of your advice that track days are a good idea for everyone?

flyingcrocodile46

2nd May 2012, 23:59

What a load of wank that responds to the weakest point you can find to disagree with.

So you'd be happy for me to nail your missus or your mate and her/his bike in the arse out of this world should they dare take a bike on your race track? Despite it being under the auspicious of your advice that track days are a good idea for everyone?

Can you re-write that so it makes sense.

Ender EnZed

3rd May 2012, 00:01

Can you re-write that so it makes sense.

Not readily. Get more specific and I'll have a go.

scracha

3rd May 2012, 00:05

So you'd be happy for me to nail your missus or your mate and her/his bike in the arse out of this world should they dare take a bike on your race track? Despite it being under the auspicious of your advice that track days are a good idea for everyone?

Happy, unfortunate, legal, risk, accident. Look them up as you're getting them a bit confused and jumbled up.

By your logic Valentino Rossi should be on death row.

flyingcrocodile46

3rd May 2012, 00:09

Not readily. Get more specific and I'll have a go.

Ok. Your sentence composition doesn't make any sense. I think it is broken.

jonbuoy

3rd May 2012, 00:14

Right, and yet for some reason the OP is the one who is secretly at fault, by default on KB?

I laid out what happened. I was not riding in the slow or medium group. I was riding in the fast group, one down from race group as i could not get insurance in the race group
and it was my first time on puke. I think that alot of people on here seem to assume for what ever reason that im new to riding or i dont have the skills to ride fast.

for your information i was following the racing line as shown to me by a current title holder racer (not to be named)

By the same logic applied to my personal skill judgement currently bequeathed upon me i have no idea how SKILLED you people are either. For all i know, not that im assuming this, you could all have only logged road time and have ridden slow and braked early and dont ride correctly. I dont assume this, in the OP i asked for opinions on the situation, not judgement of my skills which none of you have seen by the sounds of it.

I dont claim to be a racer, but at least i was out there going fast, having fun and learning from professionals, can you all say the same or do you just ride to work and go for a spin on the weekend with your mates to buy a beer...

Im no wordsmith, but i got out there on what was suposed to be a day where i didnt have to worry about others behind me, and look what happened.
I don't condone ART days, nor the amcc, i appreciate that they are out there with pro's helping others to develop skills.

I went along to develop my skills, I was not the fastest there, but i was by no means slow, and how many of you, BAR RACERS, can say you went out on a new unknown track and went hard to your 100% from the first few laps.
I seriously doubt it, unless your the next rossi or stoner then i hazard a guess that half the judgements passed down here are from lesser skill people with fatter fingers who spend too much time on KB and not enough time out riding.

Its only a guess. and im not pointing fingers cause i dont know anyone on here bar one or two of you,
But in future i would suggest holding your judgement and assumptions till you know what your talking about, otherwise you just show your real personality.

Perhaps KB is why nobody is decent anymore haha.

I had a bit of sympathy in the beginning, not so much now. Maybe a 100% balls out on an unfamiliar track wasn´t such a good idea after all, you didn´t catch a glimpse of that bike in your peripheral vision? There is a reason you tape up lights and wear full leathers on the track. If people start suing each other left right and centre over trackdays there won´t be any trackdays.

Ender EnZed

3rd May 2012, 00:15

Happy, unfortunate, legal, risk, accident. Look them up as you're getting them a bit confused and jumbled up.

By your logic Valentino Rossi should be on death row.

Valentino Rossi hasn't destroyed anyone's motorcycle on a low key traing day that is obviously aimed at increasing road skills rather than pushing as hard as posible.

I fully intend to enter clubmans racing in the next three years. I will not bitch if someone hits me. Being hit on a commercially run training day simply isn't the same thing! I just can't see why this so hard to understand, this is a fucking BHS at higher speed.

The only way that a training day on a track is any different is if somehow they are reserved for the elite and those plebs how don't already know how to ride should just stay the fuck off them. I don't think that's the intention, I don't think the OP deserves a ribbing.

Ender EnZed

3rd May 2012, 00:23

Maybe a 100% balls out on an unfamiliar track wasn´t such a good idea after all, you didn´t catch a glimpse of that bike in your peripheral vision? There is a reason you tape up lights and wear full leathers on the track.

I struggle to see what your point is here. For what purpose did he tape his lights and mirrors up? Should he have been dwadling and looking behind him for faster riders?

Ok. Your sentence composition doesn't make any sense. I think it is broken.

Highlight your concerns and I'll do my best to address them.

Happy, unfortunate, legal, risk, accident. Look them up as you're getting them a bit confused and jumbled up.

By your logic Valentino Rossi should be on death row.

Do you suppose that Valetino Rossi rides exclusive on training days amongst those who could could'nt keep his exhaust plume in sight? I don't think he does so I think that the concerns that are relevant to this thread are ones that have anything to do with him.

flyingcrocodile46

3rd May 2012, 00:25

I can't believe that crashes occur on training days. I mean WTF?

The riders should know how to control their bikes in these sorts of situations before they get on the track with other riders on a rider training day FFS. :facepalm: What are these rider training people thinking?

flyingcrocodile46

3rd May 2012, 00:30

Highlight your concerns and I'll do my best to address them.

Do you suppose that Valetino Rossi rides exclusive on training days amongst those who could could'nt keep his exhaust plume in sight? I don't think he does so I think that the concerns that are relevant to this thread are ones that have anything to do with him.

Why don't we warm up with a simpler challenge first. ^

Do you actually read what you type?

Ender EnZed

3rd May 2012, 00:33

Do you actually read what you type?

Ever so occassionallly. Would you like to argue with me or would you rather make vague statements that have airs of diminishing what I've said?

scracha

3rd May 2012, 00:34

Valentino Rossi hasn't destroyed anyone's motorcycle on a low key traing day that is obviously aimed at increasing road skills rather than pushing as hard as posible.

Bollocks. The OP was in the fast group (a.k.a. the wannabe racers group) 250 odd clicks on Pukekohe back straight isn't going to improve your road skills.

I fully intend to enter clubmans racing in the next three years. I will not bitch if someone hits me. Being hit on a commercially run training day simply isn't the same thing! I just can't see why this so hard to understand, this is a fucking BHS at higher speed.

Nope. This is a TRACKDAY. Read my earlier post.

The only way that a training day on a track is any different is if somehow they are reserved for the elite

Bzzzt. Wrong. A training day on the road or publically accessible place has to adhere to the road rules.

and those plebs how don't already know how to ride should just stay the fuck off them. I don't think that's the intention, I don't think the OP deserves a ribbing.
And I'm sure it wasn't the other guy's intention to knock him off. The OP didn't deserve to get knocked off. That said:

Anyone who goes out in the fast (or medium) group on a motorcycle trackday believing that it's safer than a trip to Woolworths is delusional.

Anyone participating in ANY sport seeking damages against other participants for accidental damage is also delusional.

Consider your logic. Because you're saying that I'd need 3rd party insurance to play soccer, rugby, netball, tennis, horseriding, cycling or any number of other sports. Don't confuse this with emotion or right or wrong. I'm currently in pain and struggling to work (and sleep) due to another soccer player. Should I expect him to pay my medical bills and loss of earnings? No.

I seriously hope AMCC DO NOT give out the other guy's name without some form of legal order being issued. Otherwise I'll be attending trackdays with a false name.

Again, read my earlier post. If you don't want to get hurt in a sport....don't play it. If you don't want to lose money from playing a sport, insure yourself. Personal responsibility is accepting that sometimes other people do stupid things and that shit happens.

flyingcrocodile46

3rd May 2012, 00:39

You're a troll. You name a thread "What does KB think i should do to this prick?" and promptly start stroking it for all its worth. FFS dude, you don't need to be clairvoyant to guess what people are going to say.

flyingcrocodile46

3rd May 2012, 00:42

Ever so occassionallly. Would you like to argue with me or would you rather make vague statements that have airs of diminishing what I've said?

Say it again?

Ender EnZed

3rd May 2012, 00:52

Bollocks. The OP was in the fast group (a.k.a. the wannabe racers group) 250 odd clicks on Pukekohe back straight isn't going to improve your road skills.

I have read your quote,

Nope. This is a TRACKDAY. Read my earlier post.

Listen to my words. I. Think. That. Being. Hit. By. Some. Cunt. On. A. Training. Day. Is. A. Bit. Rough.

Is this specific view point so outrageously out of line with what you understand to be portrayed to the vast maority of new road riders who hope to better themselves after getting a bike and coming on here?

Bzzzt. Wrong. A training day on the road or publically accessible place has to adhere to the road rules.

On the road, I have significant means for recourse should I think that another rider has wronged me, it seems I don't on the track.

And I'm sure it wasn't the other guy's intention to knock him off. The OP didn't deserve to get knocked off. That said:

Anyone who goes out in the fast (or medium) group on a motorcycle trackday believing that it's safer than a trip to Woolworths is delusional.

Anyone participating in ANY sport seeking damages against other participants for accidental damage is also delusional.

So the average rider has simply no place on the track and he should keep it clear for you to race on?

Consider your logic. Because you're saying that I'd need 3rd party insurance to play soccer, rugby, netball, tennis, horseriding, cycling or any number of other sports. Don't confuse this with emotion or right or wrong. I'm currently in pain and struggling to work (and sleep) due to another soccer player. Should I expect him to pay my medical bills and loss of earnings? No.

You consider my logic, I'm not playing a fucking sport when I attend a trackday! I FULLY EXPECT IN THE FUTURE TO PARTICIPATE IN CLUBMANS RACING, it may well be the case that you rub me in passing, I'll walk up to you after and slap you with the beer I'm handing you. None of this means that I think it's ok for you to knock my old man off the track because he wants to give it a go.

TOTO

3rd May 2012, 00:59

So you'd be happy for me to nail your missus or your mate and her/his bike in the arse out of this world should they dare take a bike on your race track? Despite it being under the auspicious of your advice that track days are a good idea for everyone?

She knows the dangers of riding a bike and has chosen to live with the consequenses. Thats what a grown up person does. Not got on public forum and winge about it...and then winge some more that people gave their vies when asked for them.

You'd probably sue BMW if you think that their motorbike seats gave you an erection...

Ender EnZed

3rd May 2012, 01:07

She knows the dangers of riding a bike and has chosen to live with the consequenses. Thats what a grown up person does. Not got on public forum and winge about it...and then winge some more that people gave their vies when asked for them.

You'd probably sue BMW if you think that their motorbike seats gave you an erection...

You give me an erection...

TOTO

3rd May 2012, 01:10

Listen to my words. I. Think. That. Being. Hit. By. Some. Cunt. On. A. Training. Day. Is. A. Bit. Rough.

You. Have. Not. Done. One. Of. Those.

So you have no idea what you are talking about.

Group 1 and 2 usually get the most tuition and basics,
group 3 gets supervised.
Group 4 - advanced/racer practice

Every time there are people in group 3 on gsxr750, hayabusas, blackbirds and so on, that have signed up in that particular group purely because they think they are hot stuff. And they are NOT. Sux to be back on earth from cloud 9 if you drop your bike, but it is reality. There are risks. People accept them and move on.

TOTO

3rd May 2012, 01:11

You give me an erection...

I know

you too... :love:

FJRider

3rd May 2012, 01:24

so by attending and paying for a course i went on a track to learn and develop skills, not race, yet its still my fault when another try hard know it all thinks he can pass on the inside as im apexing. I seriously doubt that will stand.

It never supprises me how many times that "It wasn't my fault ... what can I do" line crops up in this site. On the open road or the street/public place ... you may have a leg to stand on. BUT ... It was a closed track, for paying riders. Therefore no rules or laws under the Transport act (or any that may interest the Police) would apply.

Even if the rules of the track, on the track-day were broken ... and ... if any (or no) action was taken (and enforced [or not]) by the track-day officials ... I very much doubt if they would be legally obliged to reveal any information on the other party, on privacy grounds. Any more than you would like them to reveal your details, if anybody asked (for any reason).

Your excess is $1500 ... and you chose to do a track day with the bike, being aware there was some risk of damage. The risk and blame rests on your shoulders, for being there.

Your Insurance company may assist with an attempt to recoup any loss you may have re: your excess. But they may not be interested if you hadn't notified them you were going to do a track-day (DID you notify them ... ???). But speak with THEM first. They may also offer advice as to your next course(s) of action. (after you pay the excess of course)

scracha

3rd May 2012, 01:50

Listen to my words. I. Think. That. Being. Hit. By. Some. Cunt. On. A. Training. Day. Is. A. Bit. Rough.

And where did I say it wasn't?

Is this specific view point so outrageously out of line with what you understand to be portrayed to the vast maority of new road riders who hope to better themselves after getting a bike and coming on here?

No to it being a bit rough. Yes, to the point of view about other riding paying up. I used to be in that category too when a mate's missus got taken out by an idiot.....then someone kindly explained it to me.

Anyone who goes out in the fast (or medium) group on a motorcycle trackday believing that it's safer than a trip to Woolworths is delusional.

Anyone participating in ANY sport seeking damages against other participants for accidental damage is also delusional.

So the average rider has simply no place on the track and he should keep it clear for you to race on?

For some reason you're implying I go out on trackdays (actually, you're using the word "race" for some reason) to deliberately knock other people off and ignore people who are on "my line". Where exactly did I say or even indicate that? "Average" rider having no place in fast group...hmm.....let us think about that.

You consider my logic, I'm not playing a fucking sport when I attend a trackday! I FULLY EXPECT IN THE FUTURE TO PARTICIPATE IN CLUBMANS RACING, it may well be the case that you rub me in passing, I'll walk up to you after and slap you with the beer I'm handing you..
I've got bad news for you. You are participating in a sport.
SPORT: a. Physical activity that is governed by a set of rules or customs and often engaged in competitively. b. A particular form of this activity

But regardless, lets replace the word "sport" with "activity" (shh...we'll make believe that it's not a dangerous activity) or even "training activity". In my case, say my neck/shoulder was initially injured in a soccer "training exercise", largely caused by the actions of a player on my own team. I won't bother sending him a bill. He does feel bad about it. I've accepted that soccer training can cause injuries.

None of this means that I think it's ok for you to knock my old man off the track because he wants to give it a go
Again, I've never ever said it's acceptable to knock someone off in a trackday. I've never even said it's acceptable to knock someone off in racing. That said, if shit happens in either case, I won't (and HAVEN'T) gone looking for damages and I'm well aware that a we slip on my behalf could have someone in hospital (or worse).

So to surmise.

It sucks to be knocked off a bike on a trackday.
Seeking damages from a trackday woopsie is a waste of time

Are we arguing about anything?

Ender EnZed

3rd May 2012, 02:16

Are we arguing about anything?

Only about whether he should stfu or not. I probably wouldln't.

jonbuoy

3rd May 2012, 02:37

I struggle to see what your point is here. For what purpose did he tape his lights and mirrors up? Should he have been dwadling and looking behind him for faster riders?

Highlight your concerns and I'll do my best to address them.

Do you suppose that Valetino Rossi rides exclusive on training days amongst those who could could'nt keep his exhaust plume in sight? I don't think he does so I think that the concerns that are relevant to this thread are ones that have anything to do with him.

Because riding on a track there is probably a higher chance of binning than on the road. Lets face it no one rides in the fast group because they want to improve their defensive riding techniques. Why do you think some insurance companies won't cover you for trackdays racing or not.

DEATH_INC.

3rd May 2012, 07:00

Looking at the pics I can't understand what happened. All 3 bikes are on their own lines, no-one is braking and there is plenty of room? Got any pics of the point of contact?

rachprice

3rd May 2012, 07:03

What they signed was an agreement that AMCC wasn't responsible, why is that so hard to understand?

I think you find that the bit about AMCC is a sepreate section of the clause, that is why they are numbered

DISCLAIMER OF LIABILITY
1. I am aware that the sport of Motorcycling might:
a. Cause me injury, serious or otherwise.
b. Damage my property.
2. I wish to take part in this training day despite the above risks.
3. Neither I, nor anyone associated or connected with me, will make any claim against you or your officers, employees or agents in respect of:
a. Any injury suffered by me; or
b. Any damage to any of my property
regardless of how the injury or damage occurs.
4. I will indemnify you against all claims, damages or losses (including costs), which you incur as the direct or indirect result of any injury to me or
damage, to my property.
5. I am physically fit and there is no health or other reason why I should not participate in Motorcycle Training.
6. I am aware that this disclaimer will not affect any legal obligations you have to me, which you cannot contract out of under New Zealand law.
7. I agree that in this disclaimer "my property" includes any property owned by me or in my possession or under my control.
8. I agree that this disclaimer will be binding on my family, my heirs, my legal assigns and my administrators and executors.
9. I accept that stripping and re-assembly for Technical Checks are at my cost.
10. I consent to the details contained in this form being held by Auckland Motorcycle Club Inc. for the purpose of the promotion and benefit of the training
day concerned, and Motorcycling in general. I acknowledge my right to access and correction of this information. This consent is given in accordance
with the Privacy Act 1993.
11. Drug and alcohol policy: MNZ supports the FIM/IOC charter on drugs in sport. MNZ uses the services of the New Zealand Sports Drug Agency
(NZSDA) to professionally carry out the testing. I acknowledge by signing this form I may be subjected to a drug/alcohol test at any time. I agree to
such testing. I further agree that my name can be published by MNZ as having taken part in a drug/alcohol test together with the results of that testing

I struggle to see what your point is here. For what purpose did he tape his lights and mirrors up? Should he have been dwadling and looking behind him for faster riders?

If he was genuinely 'training' for the road then he wouldn't need to tape up his mirrors and go in the fast group

So the average rider has simply no place on the track and he should keep it clear for you to race on?

You consider my logic, I'm not playing a fucking sport when I attend a trackday! I FULLY EXPECT IN THE FUTURE TO PARTICIPATE IN CLUBMANS RACING, it may well be the case that you rub me in passing, I'll walk up to you after and slap you with the beer I'm handing you. None of this means that I think it's ok for you to knock my old man off the track because he wants to give it a go.

Did you actually read what he wrote? He never said RACE, he was in the fast group

I still think he needs to suck it up and move on, I don't think anyone is denying it is a shitty situation and that he has a right to be angry, nor that the other guy COULD have been completely at fault, but that doesn't mean you need to throw a hissy fit and try and take legal action on someone also participating in a dangerous activity.
I honestly think if you are going to get so fucking precious about it, maybe motorcycling isn't for you

PrincessBandit

3rd May 2012, 07:25

"What should I do to this prick?" Hmmm. Pretty much the majority of aggro being espoused here has been influenced by the title of the OP, and coupled with the fact that KB is never going to be the fount of reason, common sense or sympathy nothing posted here has been surprising.

Advice to tuna - sift out the worthwhile posts (of which there actually are a number) and get over the remainder of them. It sounds like you need to put your energy into recovering rather than adding to your woes with increased blood pressure on top of everything else.

What you're asking about (the personal "revenge" mode - see your thread title) has nothing to do at all with anything other than red mist and the desire to "make the prick pay". If it wasn't, you'd simply get on with following up with your insurance company to get the bike sorted out and dear old ACC to take care of your physical injuries.

Crasherfromwayback

3rd May 2012, 07:48

We shouldn't be too quick to pass judgement based on only one side of the OP's :violin: story.

Correct!!!

Crasherfromwayback

3rd May 2012, 08:21

Cool story bro...but not quite good enough for me to upload the relevant meme

I like how crasher keeps referring to racing incidents when this particular incident has nothing to do with racing.

Sorry. My point wasn't about racing. What I was trying to point out was...if someone as good as Robert Holden has no fucking idea what's going on directly behind him on a racetrack...I doubt the OP can expect to.

That help?

nodrog

3rd May 2012, 08:24

How about you go faster, or move down to the learner group so shitty old hondas arent queing up to get past you?

P.S. it was me that hit you, you can contact me here to talk about it 0800111757

avgas

3rd May 2012, 08:38

http://static.graphicflash.com/myfbcovers/images/covers/2011/09/25/4aa128d0c964012e8edc7f93b3e77c75/60-Hahahaha-facebook-cover.png

sinfull

3rd May 2012, 08:39

How about you go faster, or move down to the learner group so shitty old hondas arent queing up to get past you?

P.S. it was me that hit you, you can contact me here to talk about it 0800111757

Put a louder exhaust on yr bike, going by them photos, it looks to me he tipped it in on ya and cut ya off !

Maido

3rd May 2012, 08:40

*Eagerly awaits Godwins law to kick in and end thread.
FYI: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law

nodrog

3rd May 2012, 08:47

Put a louder exhaust on yr bike, going by them photos, it looks to me he tipped it in on ya and cut ya off !

I think he saw his tampon that fell out on the previous lap, and was heading into the infield to pick it up.

Katman

3rd May 2012, 08:51

My guess was to ask a public forum/ the bike community, as they are always helpful and friendly and will put u straight,

There's your mistake right there.

P.S. Judging by the photos, I'd be fucked off too and it's precisely why the 1100 ain't ever going to do a trackday.

nodrog

3rd May 2012, 08:55

P.S. I'd be fucked off too and it's precisely why the 1100 ain't ever going to do a trackday.

Keep it on the road Rossi :sunny:

Kickaha

3rd May 2012, 08:56

it's precisely why the 1100 ain't ever going to do a trackday.
I thought that was just because you're a soft cunt who can't ride for shit

Katman

3rd May 2012, 09:01

I thought that was just because you're a soft cunt who can't ride for shit

That too. :motu:

HenryDorsetCase

3rd May 2012, 09:15

Did you actually read what he wrote? He never said RACE, he was in the fast group

I still think he needs to suck it up and move on, I don't think anyone is denying it is a shitty situation and that he has a right to be angry, nor that the other guy COULD have been completely at fault but that doesn't mean you need to throw a hissy fit and try and taken legal action out of someone also participating in a dangerous activity.
I honestly think if you are going to get so fucking precious about it, maybe motorcycling isn't for you

I agree with this. the indemnity is probably between the two parties that signed it, rather than participants.

But in the civil action between rider a and rider b, (where B is the claimant) I think rider B has a long row to hoe to get over the "reasonably foreseeable" hurdle. That is, Rider A (or theri insurer) will argue that Rider B knew or must have known that due to the nature of the activity, its location and all other relevant factors, rider B knew that there was a reasonably foreseeable prospect of damage. Ergo, no liability on Rider A if they were acting reasonably IN THE CONTEXT. Given the context is a free for all in the fast group on a trackday, rider b is fucked and burned and should, as you put it, suck it up and move on. I can't believe this shit has gone on for 13 pages.

Just as an aside, I have fallen off on a trackday (ran out of talent) and did a fairly substantial amount of damage (money wise: the thing was perfectly rideable and I rode from Timaru to Christchurch on it) but cosmetic damage was to bike and gear. It turns out it is way cheaper to buy a cheap ex racebike and thrash that on trackdays than it is to fall off your streetbike even once. Something to think about.

HenryDorsetCase

3rd May 2012, 09:18

Being hit on a commercially run training day simply isn't the same thing! I just can't see why this so hard to understand, this is a fucking BHS at higher speed.

The only way that a training day on a track is any different is if somehow they are reserved for the elite and those plebs how don't already know how to ride should just stay the fuck off them. I don't think that's the intention, I don't think the OP deserves a ribbing.

Actually, no, it isn't. But whatever, you have your opinion. You're wrong, but there you go.

Brett

3rd May 2012, 09:34

Ok, apparently this has gotten out of hand. There are some very valid points here, and some very invalid too.
I wasn't aware that you receive warnings for posting a thread in the wrong area, Not like i spend all my time on here being a
keyboard warrior or moderating a site. Guess somebody didn't agree with what i had to say... Speaks to character.

Lol this whole thing was more of a, Do i actually have a foot to stand on down this path? But some helpful ideas nonetheless, i don't pretend to know all the laws and the can and cannot do's.
My guess was to ask a public forum/ the bike community, as they are always helpful and friendly and will put u straight, but if people didn't make it through the OP entirely i asked for preferably professional
Opinion's, not joe public's point of view. Though i realise my mistake now haha.

Seems to me that people think i have doctored the story to garner sympathy.
This is how I see the situation. The only thing that i cannot guarantee as the truth is why the guy was there to hit me.
Maybe he over corrected, others have made other suggestions, i don't claim to know why he was there, but as stated earlier in the
thread I still was not at fault in the accident and in the end im happy with the guy paying my excess.

Expecting to come out of casts only to find out you have 2 broken bones and a shoulder injury doesn't sit well with me so I had some emotional attachment to the OP.

Here are the pictures of what happened and the aftermath.

Please note, the rider ADMITTED FAULT to me at the ambulance with witnesses. Other witnesses reported what happened to the clerk of the course and he was reprimanded, to what extent
i do not know.

263058263059263060263061

(Mods - inserted pics left in for the benefit of those later in this thread...saves time trolling back through the pages).

I am sorry, but looking at those pics...the undertaking rider is definitely in the wrong. It wasn't a race meet where riders are more experienced with having other bikes in close quarters and having to take more evasive action to avoid scraps, it was a training track day...and that is quite an aggressive move to be pulling there. If it was me taken out, I would have been pissed. (Especially given the clear no undertaking rules. Looking at the vectors of those lines, I don't see how the undertaking rider couldn't see a coming collision. The rider in fluro (track mentor?) might be able to provide some valuable info too.

That said, it was a trackday on a closed race track, you might not have a whole lot of luck holding the other rider to account mate. You come, you ride/race, your risk seems to be the general consensus...however that other rider doesn't deserve to get off scott free.

nodrog

3rd May 2012, 09:52

I went to paintball once, and some cunt shot me, can I whinge in here or do I have to start my own thread?

Fast Eddie

3rd May 2012, 09:55

when I go to a track, I go to do this! ...

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/BhsTmiK7Q2M" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

flyingcrocodile46

3rd May 2012, 10:09

when I go to a track, I go to do this! ...

Fuck! That is some gay shit.

[edit]
<dl class="userstats"><dt>Bike 1997 Honda Fartbleed,
</dt><dt>Location Dunedin

Say no more

:laugh:
</dt></dl>

D3ADLYTuna

3rd May 2012, 10:49

You were in the "fast group" coz you had a gixer 750 and your ego told you that because you have a fast shiny bike you are much better than those losers in group 2.

Every time there are people in group 3 on gsxr750, hayabusas, blackbirds and so on, that have signed up in that particular group purely because they think they are hot stuff. And they are NOT. Sux to be back on earth from cloud 9 if you drop your bike, but it is reality. There are risks. People accept them and move on.

Your condescension makes me laugh,
I went in the fast group to challenge myself and learn, i did not judge the other groups.

I will not be bothering with any pursuit of anything regarding this, Nor did i plan to, though i worded it like i did.

I would like the guy, if he actually is on here to PM me contact details.
I have no malice, I was angry that i had broken bones, these things happen.
It was on the track, I had insurance.

My policy wording leads me to believe that on the track if i can prove innocence then they just waive my excess and my premiums do not go up.
As opposed to getting the other involved party to pay.

Nodrog: If it was you that hit me, I apologise for this thread and any comments made in anger.

The others;

This was fun and all, but we are all grown ups, condescension nor judgement does no good.

Onwards and upwards.

Hopefully your track bike sustained suitably less damage than mine,

I approached this situation at the wrong time, in the wrong place, in the wrong manner.

Also for that guys benefit....

Someone in here is a nazi...

Crasherfromwayback

3rd May 2012, 10:58

The others;

Onwards and upwards.

Hopefully your track bike sustained suitably less damage than mine,

I approached this situation at the wrong time, in the wrong place, in the wrong manner.

.

All good then! Heal up quick!

Pete

nodrog

3rd May 2012, 10:59

....I would like the guy, if he actually is on here to PM me contact details......

Nodrog: If it was you that hit me, I apologise for this thread and any comments made in anger........

I posted my phone number for you to ring me.

NinjaNanna

3rd May 2012, 11:03

Looking at the pics I can't understand what happened. All 3 bikes are on their own lines, no-one is braking and there is plenty of room? Got any pics of the point of contact?

actually the inside bike looks like he has clutch in and front brake on trying to get the fuck out of trouble.

Asher

3rd May 2012, 11:29

I think this thread has done a good job of raising the issue of liability on tracks.

Race meets and track days are pretty obviously no liability situations, except for possibly intentional damage.
To me training days are different, i think everyone there has a responsibility to insure their actions do not cause damage to others and their property and if they do they should liable for at least some of the costs.

Did the guy that hit the OP know that you had insurance? He may believe that as you are covered by that and acc there is little he needs to do.

SVboy

3rd May 2012, 11:38

Your condescension makes me laugh,
I went in the fast group to challenge myself and learn, i did not judge the other groups.

I will not be bothering with any pursuit of anything regarding this, Nor did i plan to, though i worded it like i did.

I would like the guy, if he actually is on here to PM me contact details.
I have no malice, I was angry that i had broken bones, these things happen.
It was on the track, I had insurance.

My policy wording leads me to believe that on the track if i can prove innocence then they just waive my excess and my premiums do not go up.
As opposed to getting the other involved party to pay.

Nodrog: If it was you that hit me, I apologise for this thread and any comments made in anger.

The others;

This was fun and all, but we are all grown ups, condescension nor judgement does no good.

Onwards and upwards.

Hopefully your track bike sustained suitably less damage than mine,

I approached this situation at the wrong time, in the wrong place, in the wrong manner.

Also for that guys benefit....

Someone in here is a nazi...

Now this is the way to move forward, well done. If all goes well with your recovery and your insurance, this may be an opportunity to buy your bike off the insurance company at a cheap price and convert it to an awesome trackbike, while still having the means to purchase another road bike.

D3ADLYTuna

3rd May 2012, 11:43

I suggest everyone re read the OP,

p.s. It may have been edited.

unstuck

3rd May 2012, 12:03

FUCK, so no one is getting stabbed with a pencil.:angry:

flyingcrocodile46

3rd May 2012, 12:07

I will not be bothering with any pursuit of anything regarding this, Nor did i plan to, though i worded it like i did.

I would like the guy, if he actually is on here to PM me contact details.
I have no malice, I was angry that i had broken bones, these things happen.
It was on the track, I had insurance.

Onwards and upwards.

I approached this situation at the wrong time, in the wrong place, in the wrong manner.

Good shit. You got there.

Now this is the way to move forward, well done. If all goes well with your recovery and your insurance, this may be an opportunity to buy your bike off the insurance company at a cheap price and convert it to an awesome trackbike, while still having the means to purchase another road bike.
This is bloody good advice

DEATH_INC.

3rd May 2012, 12:17

actually the inside bike looks like he has clutch in and front brake on trying to get the fuck out of trouble.
Nope, zoom in fella, the brake lever is in front of his fingers, and tho you can't see it clearly, the clutch looks the same...

Flip

3rd May 2012, 12:17

I would have thought it’s your insurance companies responsibility to chase up the other rider. If they decide to go him and you have come to another settlement without their knowledge they may find any case they take against him seriously compromised.

You are bloddy lucky your insurance company is paying for your bike.

NinjaNanna

3rd May 2012, 12:22

Nope, zoom in fella, the brake lever is in front of his fingers, and tho you can't see it clearly, the clutch looks the same...

hmmm so it is. Bloody good camera that one.

D3ADLYTuna

3rd May 2012, 12:22

I would call him but my arms in casts is hard enough reaching a keyboard, let alone holding a phone to my ear. plus it would be rather awkward. lol.
I'm leaving this with insurance.

Katman

3rd May 2012, 12:40

Crasherfromwayback

3rd May 2012, 12:43

It would seem to me that training day and trackday organisers have a specific reason for stipulating no undertaking on corners.

Doesn't surprise me though that the general consensus appears to be "Rules? Fuck the rules - we're motorcyclists".

The thing is...what if some cunt swoops around the outside of you and cuts in real close? A lot of newbies freak and lift the bike up which is just as bad if not worse.

Swoop

3rd May 2012, 12:48

I'm not "some cunt".
AND I'll go around the outside if I wish!:blip:

WHAT WOULD HITLER DO?

There. Godwin's law.

Can we PD this thread now please?

nodrog

3rd May 2012, 12:51

We have sorted it, we are going on a date next thursday :love:

Katman

3rd May 2012, 12:54

The thing is...what if some cunt swoops around the outside of you and cuts in real close? A lot of newbies freak and lift the bike up which is just as bad if not worse.

While there may not be a rule against it (and considering this was in fact a training day) one would hope that anyone swooping around the outside would have the consideration to not cut in real close.

:killingme Hold on - what was I thinking?

unstuck

3rd May 2012, 13:00

Crasherfromwayback

3rd May 2012, 13:03

:killingme Hold on - what was I thinking?

Exactly!!!

SMOKEU

3rd May 2012, 13:06

WHAT WOULD HITLER DO?

Put them on the trains and send them to the camps.

imdying

3rd May 2012, 13:15

Yup, teach them to concentrate :yes:

Kickaha

3rd May 2012, 13:19

when I go to a track, I go to do this! ...
Not only is your taste in bikes crap your taste in music is to

Flip

3rd May 2012, 14:21

We have sorted it, we are going on a date next thursday :love:

Don't get plastered.

nodrog

3rd May 2012, 14:24

Don't get plastered.

Hopefully my front wheel isnt the only thing I get to stick up his inside.

Flip

3rd May 2012, 14:36

Hopefully my front wheel isnt the only thing I get to stick up his inside.

Make sure you have good rubber.

Katman

3rd May 2012, 14:39

Make sure you have good rubber.

Have you never heard of latex braking? (sic)

D3ADLYTuna

3rd May 2012, 14:55

So, i guess people at KB have a sick sense of humour...
It's a pity cause i was just about ready to forget...
:blink:

flyingcrocodile46

3rd May 2012, 15:00

So, i guess people at KB have a sick sense of humour...
It's a pity cause i was just about ready to forget...
:blink:

LMAO Stop taking your self so seriously. Nobody else does.

Crasherfromwayback

3rd May 2012, 15:15

Have you never heard of latex braking?

Or knobbies. Ribbed for...

Zedder

3rd May 2012, 15:24

So, i guess people at KB have a sick sense of humour...
It's a pity cause i was just about ready to forget...
:blink:

The Tribe has spoken. Move on.

Fast Eddie

3rd May 2012, 15:34

Fuck! That is some gay shit.

[edit]
<dl class="userstats"><dt>Bike 1997 Honda Fartbleed Fireblade,
</dt><dt>Location Dunedin

Say no more

:laugh:
</dt></dl>

oh dear..you can do better than that I'm sure.. Fartbleed? probably the gayest thing I've seen apart from me on my bike in the reflection of glass.

Fast Eddie

3rd May 2012, 15:37

Not only is your taste in bikes crap your taste in music is to

you know what you can do..

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/6ul-cZyuYq4" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Fast Eddie

3rd May 2012, 15:43

Someone in here is a nazi...

ah! ya got me..

Flip

3rd May 2012, 16:08

Have you never heard of latex braking?

If it does he will really be in the crap.

SMOKEU

3rd May 2012, 17:10

So, i guess people at KB have a sick sense of humour...
It's a pity cause i was just about ready to forget...
:blink:

They weren't joking.

AD345

3rd May 2012, 17:33

Outstanding thread

Every reason for not going to any type of track based activity, unless you want to race, all in one place.

I do believe I may have my first bookmarked thread

jrandom

3rd May 2012, 18:00

Every reason for not going to any type of track based activity, unless you want to race, all in one place.

... there are reasons other than 'you might crash'?

AD345

3rd May 2012, 18:28

... there are reasons other than 'you might crash'?

Evidently.

PrincessBandit

3rd May 2012, 22:57

Have you never heard of latex braking?

Or knobbies. Ribbed for...

Not to mention "breaking"...

Drew

4th May 2012, 16:33

I'm well gutted to find this thread after all the stink had died down. I'd really like to have a bigger audience when I call the thread starter a FUCKIN RETARD!

What a bloody joke. You signed a waver that says explicitly, that you have no right to chase for damages should something happen to you or your bike, against the club OR other riders.

You're not even meant to go onto the pit road before you have signed that since it's part of the race track.

Suck it up, and stay away from tracks if you can't hack it...COCK!

FJRider

4th May 2012, 16:53

sil3nt

4th May 2012, 17:11

Bassmatt

4th May 2012, 17:27

How many of the posters bagging the op have moaned in other threads about the lack of personal responsibility these days....just not if your on a track eh?

flyingcrocodile46

4th May 2012, 17:44

How many of the posters bagging the op have moaned in other threads about the lack of personal responsibility these days....just not if your on a track eh?

From reading all the posts I think if he is too precious to have been satisfied with the appropriate sympathy and the general concensus in the first half a dozen posts in respect to accountability then who gives a fuck.

Katman

4th May 2012, 18:00

You signed a waver that says explicitly, that you have no right to chase for damages should something happen to you or your bike, against the club OR other riders.

I think you're wrong Drew.

The Singing Chef

4th May 2012, 18:06

I think your wrong Drew.

I see what you did there...

Katman

4th May 2012, 18:14

I see what you did there...

Ummm no, I think you did that.

FJRider

4th May 2012, 18:17

I thought the waiver you sign only applies to the organisation running it? You don't sign a waiver saying you won't pursue costs against someone who crashes into you.

Waivers are seldom worth the paper they're printed on. You have the option of taking privat legal action against anybody you consider has wronged you. Such is life in a free country. (although that part of life is seldom free)

Madness

4th May 2012, 18:25

How many of the posters bagging the op have moaned in other threads about the lack of personal responsibility these days....just not if your on a track eh?
Riding on a race track simultaneously with other riders, having already signed a copy of the document below (in particular clauses 1 & 2) surely is different to a social ride on the road. That said, the other rider would be a good cunt if they at least contributed towards the insurance excess and non-funded medical costs. The thing is the OP started this thread, complete with catchy, un-editable title before having made attempts to contact the other rider to discuss his situation calmly & rationally. He's not going to be happy when he stumbles across this little gem of a thread.

Perhaps trackday (and training days, same thing ffs) specific insurance should cover 3rd party for situations such as this and events such as this, open to the general public should require evidence of insurance for nominated groups?

I think you're wrong Drew.

You're right. Again.

http://www.amcc.org.nz/uploads/richassets/Entry%20Form%20April%202012.pdf
DISCLAIMER OF LIABILITY
1. I am aware that the sport of Motorcycling might:
a. Cause me injury, serious or otherwise.
b. Damage my property.
2. I wish to take part in this training day despite the above risks.
3. Neither I, nor anyone associated or connected with me, will make any claim against you or your officers, employees or agents in respect of:
a. Any injury suffered by me; or
b. Any damage to any of my property
regardless of how the injury or damage occurs.
4. I will indemnify you against all claims, damages or losses (including costs), which you incur as the direct or indirect result of any injury to me or
damage, to my property.
5. I am physically fit and there is no health or other reason why I should not participate in Motorcycle Training.
6. I am aware that this disclaimer will not affect any legal obligations you have to me, which you cannot contract out of under New Zealand law.
7. I agree that in this disclaimer "my property" includes any property owned by me or in my possession or under my control.
8. I agree that this disclaimer will be binding on my family, my heirs, my legal assigns and my administrators and executors.

Katman

4th May 2012, 18:41

You're right. Again.

I feel special. :love:

Kickaha

4th May 2012, 19:15

I feel special. :love:

Is that because it happens so rarely?

scracha

4th May 2012, 19:17

That said, the other rider would be a good cunt if they at least contributed towards the insurance excess and non-funded medical costs.
Nope. Sets a bad precedence. Worried about injuries on the track, then get your own insurance and pay your own excess.

Perhaps trackday (and training days, same thing ffs) specific insurance should cover 3rd party for situations such as this and events such as this, open to the general public should require evidence of insurance for nominated groups?

What a great idea. Can all the cotton wool clad whiners fuck off and arrange their own "compulsory 3rd party insurance required" trackday. Obviously every bike will need front and rear facing cameras, and marshalls will have to stop filming and spend a bit of time writing out witness statements when the inevitable happens.

Don't bother coming to a regular trackday to impose your "laws" and stop the rest of us from enjoying ourselves.

Madness

4th May 2012, 19:22

What a great idea. Can all the cotton wool clad whiners fuck off and arrange their own "compulsory 3rd party insurance required" trackday. Obviously every bike will need front and rear facing cameras, and marshalls will have to stop filming and spend a bit of time writing out witness statements when the inevitable happens.

Don't bother coming to a regular trackday to impose your "laws" and stop the rest of us from enjoying ourselves.

You got it. If you want to bring open road expectations into an environment that doesn't operate under the same set of rules don't go waaaah-ing when the shit hits the fan. It does seem however from the number of supporters of the OP's stance that a fully-covered "special" group at training days & track days could work. Not worried, don't bother & contnue as usual in the regular groups.

Drew

4th May 2012, 21:08

Haven't read the last few pages so perhaps this has been covered.

I thought the waiver you sign only applies to the organisation running it? You don't sign a waiver saying you won't pursue costs against someone who crashes into you.

Also have to say my mind changed a bit when he said he was in the fast group and I saw the photos. A little spatial awareness could have avoided the accident by the looks of it.The specific disclaimer they signed that day is worded differently to the last one I signed, but the gist is the same. "I take the risk of my own accord".

How many of the posters bagging the op have moaned in other threads about the lack of personal responsibility these days....just not if your on a track eh?The OP is taking no responsibility at all. What's your point again?

I think you're wrong Drew.I think you need to read the waver. It's very clear, the reason for that is to avoid any need for investigations, where the organisers might be asked to provide all sorts of impossible evidence, for no good reason.

This crash involved two guys, who will both have their own version of events. The dude who hit the thread starter may very well have felt shit about it, and taken responsibility at the time, but who's to say that after the fact he didn't give it some thought and conclude that they both played a part in it?

Katman

4th May 2012, 21:24

I think you need to read the waver. It's very clear, the reason for that is to avoid any need for investigations, where the organisers might be asked to provide all sorts of impossible evidence, for no good reason.

This crash involved two guys, who will both have their own version of events. The dude who hit the thread starter may very well have felt shit about it, and taken responsibility at the time, but who's to say that after the fact he didn't give it some thought and conclude that they both played a part in it?

Come on Drew, you're brighter than that.

The waiver absolves the organisers of any grief from on-track altercations.

It doesn't extend to the other plebs sharing the track with you.

Open eyes time.