Magic numbers

[Crackedbycracku]

OK, so I'm new to the forum so I'm going to apologise for a) Asking dumb questions and b) generally doing it wrong.

All good?

So, I am looking to buy my first bike and due to budget constraints it's probably going to be second hand.

Due to others on the forum describing the GN250 with words like 'learner friendly', 'forgiving' and my personal favourite 'crash survivable' it is well on the list. But I am open to options.

So I say this http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=471393585 on TradeMe.

Now if I saw a 2004 car with only 2,700 kms my first thought would be 'clocked' and my second would be 'move on, nothing to buy here'. With cars over 10 years and 100,000 kms you just keep walking or there are very special reasons such as it is a restored classic or you want a project or whatever.

But I know bikes are different, I don't know much but I know that.

So, what are the magic numbers with bikes? When to you have to ask "Has the x, y, z been replaced?" and what is the x, y, z anyway? Is there a number over which you should just keep walking?

Is the a bike version of the AA check you get for cars?

Anyway, thanks for the help in getting on two wheels.

Jack

[Kickaha]

Bikes as with cars they way they've been looked after is far more important than age or mileage, there is no magic number

[FJRider]

And ... there ARE vehicles around that are a lot older than 2004 with around 2500 km's on it.

[Fast Eddie]

lol over 10 years old with 100,000 walk away? you must be loaded..

im running my sisters car with 220,000 on the clock and planning to keep it going til 300,000 if I can (free ride)

yea iv owned plenty of bikes with 70,000 + japenese from the 80's.. they are fine.

GN's are very crash survivable, mrs crashed hers recently and nothing broke apart from an indicator lens which we just taped back on.

[GrayWolf]

So, I am looking to buy my first bike and due to budget constraints it's probably going to be second hand.
Due to others on the forum describing the GN250 with words like 'learner friendly', 'forgiving' and my personal favourite 'crash survivable' it is well on the list. But I am open to option.
Now if I saw a 2004 car with only 2,700 kms my first thought would be 'clocked' and my second would be 'move on, nothing to buy here'. With cars over 10 years and 100,000 kms you just keep walking or there are very special reasons such as it is a restored classic or you want a project or whatever.
So, what are the magic numbers with bikes? When to you have to ask
Is the a bike version of the AA check you get for cars?
Jack

Hi Jack and welcome to the (Z00) KB, and to biking...
among the barracking and general BS here you'll also get a lot of good advice, and often from different perspectives on any topic.
GN's are a fantastic first bike for the reasons you mention, another good similar option is the SR250 yamaha in the S/hand arena. IF a cheap one the Yam Scorpio is set to replace the GN as the 'go to' easy to learn machine. If the GN has a weakness it IS it's low power which you can outgrow quickly. My advice FWIW is avoid the older high performance 250's regardless of being indestructable?? etc etc, they are high performance 'fragile' engines that are often poorly maintained and or highly abused mechanicaly. REGARDLESS of how many will say they thrash them day after day,<<< and there's the point, abused day after day and even the best of mechanical designs will in the end succumb to wear, tear and stresses.
The Ginny will certainly see you 'right' for the first 6-9 months, by then you may want to step up, and as LAMS should be operating by the end of the year, your options then will be improved.
Many bikes are 'cosseted' and have low K's, what you'd need to look for is the obvious signs the milage ISNT in keeping with the bikes 'demeanour'.. are the bar grips worn/polished, are the footpeg rubbers looking 'old', are the tyres OEM? and look low milage? does the seat look and feel (padding) in keeping with the stated milage?
My partners GN is an early 90's model with 47k on the clock, and looks right for that usage. If you are unsure the AA do an inspection service, it will cost you obviously, but it'll give a general peace of mind if its the bike you decide to buy...
Hope this helps
GW

[Spazman727]

I would steer clear of an AA check, go for one at a bike shop that has been recommended or you know (you probably wont know one yet).

This website has some useful tips for things to check out.
http://www.clarity.net/~adam/buying-bike.html

It would be an idea to decide what you want in a bike. Obviously you will want something that looks nice to you, but also take into consideration how easy something is to control, parts availability, seating style. Lots of stuff to consider.

Feel free to ask questions, you won't learn otherwise.

Good luck with finding a bike.

[Oblivion]

Mileage is nothing under a good careful owner. Its the maintenance that you should look at. If you had a bike that had 12,000ks, but hadn't even had an oil change or a service, there's no telling what kinds of problems that you'd have with it. So you'd walk away. If you had a carefully looked after one with 40,000ks, then it would be a different story.

Maintenance records are a sign of a well looked after motorcycle.

[winston]

i recken that if you can, find the money to by new. Then you know you have a good bike and thas not been trashed and hs always had the oil chenged and shit.

[Subike]

good points made by meany re low mileage bikes,
Not wanting to buck the trend of the advice given out already.
A low mileage older bike could be a great buy,

But there is also the Older age, low mileage bike that because it has never been used very much at all
Can be a maintenance trap.
"5 year old 250, done 2500 miles, one careful owner, always garaged"
could equate to a bike that has only ever gone 2k's to the shop and back, has glazed bores,
tires look new as, but are as hard as plastic,
Brakes that have never bedded in , never been hot, and the fluid has absorbed so much moisture its become almost glue.

Or it could be a bike that was ridden solely on sundays for a pootle around the park,
Its longest trips were the days its owner got their learners, restricted, learner compliance stuff.
The rest of the time its sat in the corner while the owner rode their hog.

If in doubt as to the purchase of any ride,
Try to find a person who has ridden for a while, and get them to take a look at it.
Could save you a heap of money, and also help you get a real gem.

As for buying new, well thats a good start for anything, as long as you are buying something well recommended with known reliability.

[winston]

As for buying new, well thats a good start for anything, as long as you are buying something well recommended with known reliability.

yea I think buy a good brand, i don think the china brands a good choice

[Subike]

yea I think buy a good brand, i don think the china brands a good choice

that depends upon weather it is a copy of a good bike
or a cheap rip off of a good bike
Or just a rip off full stop
plenty to choose from , research is always your friend.
Just because it says Made in Japan opps Korea, oh Taiwan, no, ahh, China, does not mean its bad.
be a bugger if it was made in Italy or, wow, Britain!

[Crackedbycracku]

thanks for all the replies and advice. I think as this will be my first bike I'm going to save the pennies and buy new.

thanks again

[tbs]

thanks for all the replies and advice. I think as this will be my first bike I'm going to save the pennies and buy new.

thanks again

That sounds like a great way to lose a chunk of change on your first bike. I used to think like that, but I bought a 2008 model Ninja with 5000km on it. It had already lost a couple of thousand value even though it was mint condition, and then I sold it a year later at 12000km with some scrapes down the side. I lost about $1,500 but did sell it within a couple of days of listing.

Buying new: Yes, it is shiny, but it stands a very good chance of not being shiny for long. It has a warranty, but if you buy a bike just out of warranty that has had any bugs sorted out, then your chances of spending money to fix it are slim. And even if it does need work, it is highly unlikely to cost as much as buying new in the first place. Also, LAMS is on it's way, and you really can't be sure what that is going to do to the market value of your new bike. You will almost certainly want to upgrade when you get tired of the low power of your learner bike, so save your money for that. I used to think differently. I told my myself I'd be happy with the 250 for several years, but I spent most of my learner and restricted period browsing Trademe listings yearning for the day I could get a real bike.

Everyone is different, and everyone wants different things from their riding, but I can't think of any compelling reason to buy a new 250 when the market is absolutely flooded with decent low mileage models for so much less. Just make sure it has been serviced.

[DODO``]

thanks for all the replies and advice. I think as this will be my first bike I'm going to save the pennies and buy new.

thanks again

I was thinking like you too, and DID buy my first bike hyosung rt250r brand spanking new. :facepalm:
Couple of years and couple of bikes later ,, I thought,, 'oh God.. why did I waste all that money'

you really dont need to buy new,,, especially for your first bike which you will not only drop it couple times (if you are unlucky) but also grow out of fairly quickly. buy 2nd hand. if unsure get mechanical check done, and save that money to buy better gears and you can thank me later.
having a look at lots lots and lots of bike would get you into perspective. which is easy if you tour around couple of bike dealers.

just as very very very rough rule of thumb Id say the numbers on the bikes x 2 is equivalent numbers on cars.. (based on when things starts to go wrong )
but thats just my opinion and not all bikes are like that (just like cars).
Bike has lot less parts compared to cars therefore less things to go wrong and much easier to keep them in tip top condition for long time, as long as its been serviced properly. my bike is on 54,000km mark, which in my theory 100,000km car equivalent. but its been serviced really well (tonns of invoices and service history) and it rides like new.

I'd say there are no magic numbers when it comes to bikes. Usually from what Ive seen and learnt,, the bikers are more 'awake' in therms of mechanics (maybe because it has direct relation with safety) whether they fix it themselves or take it to shops,, than people in cars (aka "cages"). Ive seen some bad examples but usually its not,, if not sure get it checked by who knows ;)
to answer your xyz question, -correct me if im wrong- usually the chains and sprockets are the first thing to be replaced. other than oil change, battery, tyres and carb..
:bleh::bleh:

[Crackedbycracku]

OK, so my initial plan was buying a new GN125 from the Barron for $2000 riding it for 12 months and then selling it for $1500. But I'm smart enough to know that I won't be the only one thinking of this.

Basically the bike is to get me to work in Wellington and then get me home again. But I saw The Long Way Round and dream to...

So, buying a quality used 250 may well be the go. Problem here is I don't know a lot about bike and I don't have any friends, yet, who ride. Is there an advantage to buying from a dealer in terms of service history and mechanical check?

Is it rude to ask a seller on TradeMe: Do you have the service history? I can't see the point to go look a the bike if they don't.

Looking at bikes I often see rust on the exhaust, is this just normal and easily to fix or a sign of a badly maintained bike?

I think I know the answer to this but should I consider the Arrow Samurai 200?

Oh, and anybody know where to buy a Yamaha in Wellington? Maidstone Yamaha have a site which is either broken or useless and don't seem interested in answering my emails. Sadly, they are also the only listed Yamaha dealer in the Wellington area.

[DODO``]

OK, so my initial plan was buying a new GN125 from the Barron for $2000 riding it for 12 months and then selling it for $1500. But I'm smart enough to know that I won't be the only one thinking of this.

Basically the bike is to get me to work in Wellington and then get me home again. But I saw The Long Way Round and dream to...

So, buying a quality used 250 may well be the go. Problem here is I don't know a lot about bike and I don't have any friends, yet, who ride. Is there an advantage to buying from a dealer in terms of service history and mechanical check?

Is it rude to ask a seller on TradeMe: Do you have the service history? I can't see the point to go look a the bike if they don't.

Looking at bikes I often see rust on the exhaust, is this just normal and easily to fix or a sign of a badly maintained bike?

I think I know the answer to this but should I consider the Arrow Samurai 200?

Oh, and anybody know where to buy a Yamaha in Wellington? Maidstone Yamaha have a site which is either broken or useless and don't seem interested in answering my emails. Sadly, they are also the only listed Yamaha dealer in the Wellington area.

Oh I love long way around and long way down haha just watched the whole thing again not too long ago!
Personally I wouldn't buy one from the dealer unless the deal is real good or rare bike because the price difference is quite significant.
yeah sure they have been properly maintained so on and so forth, but its not hard to find the private sales with properly maintained bikes.
if no one around you can help just do AA, not the best option but if its the only one do it for your peace of mind.
and its not rude, in fact you SHOULD ask for service history. if they mumble or don't have them , then id walk away haha
surface rust on exhaust is not uncommon, if exhaust is rusted thu, you sould really start worrying about and check if the chassis got any rust.
surface rust on exhaust is not hard to fix, no biggy, just tedious light sanding and polishing with treatment should get rid of them, then after that the exhaust would need constant polish.. or just replace them.. but many dont seem to bother about the exhaust surface rust. same as car really, you just dont see it in cars because its under the car.
as to where to buy,? Trademe man.. :Punk:

[FJRider]

Looking at bikes I often see rust on the exhaust, is this just normal and easily to fix or a sign of a badly maintained bike?

Oh, and anybody know where to buy a Yamaha in Wellington? Maidstone Yamaha have a site which is either broken or useless and don't seem interested in answering my emails. Sadly, they are also the only listed Yamaha dealer in the Wellington area.

You live in Wellington ... figure it out ....

Suzuki shops ARE allowed to sell Yamahas ... look around all the bike shops.

[ducatilover]

thanks for all the replies and advice. I think as this will be my first bike I'm going to save the pennies and buy new.

thanks again

You'll lose huge chunks of money on a new bike that's no better than an "old" bike.
On a well cared for bike, kms are irrelevant really.
I've had some very high km bikes and cars and that doesn't have any effect on my maintenance costs, I'm currently driving a BMW with 295,000km, most people would run a mile, because most people are idiots.
I agree with Subike's posts, I'm not a fan of uber low KM motors, I had an uber low KM GN (2004 model) and my current '88 GN hack goes far better.