CB450 for a first bike?

[chinny]

Hi all,

Wondering if an old '70s honda cb450 would be suitable to learn on?
Love the style of old 60's-70's Hondas as well as their (general) reputation for reliability.
I suspect a cb450 would be too tall, heavy and powerful but i remain optimistic about adapting to it.

A bit of background:
I'm about 170cm (just under 5' 7") and 63kg.
I've done a bit of riding already - about 10 or so hours on a late '60s honda S90.

The S90 was nice to ride although lacked braking power (drum brakes). I'm sure i would want something more powerful in the future though as it would max out around 60/70mph.. .
Plus i don't think its owner would let me have it :)

Appreciate any thoughts or suggestions.
Cheers

P.S. Newbie here - good to be here!

[HenryDorsetCase]

If it doesnt work out i will buy it off you.

Welcome

[spanner spinner]

good power spread, easy to ride, and should be LAMS approved sounds like a great first bike.

[ducatilover]

Can't think of many bikes I'd rather learn on/look at than an old CB.
Excellent machines, not too potent for a learner (not potent at all really) and not exactly heavy for an old bike.

[JimO]

doubt it would be to tall, most old bikes are small compared to new ones

[Coolz]

Probably slow by todays standards, they gave the 650 Triumphs a good run for their money back in the day. They rev to 10k, not to bad for an old twin, and had a distinctive howl. You could lift the front wheel in the lower gears if you tried. Front brake was drum, if I rember rightly, and handling was pretty average. Not what I'd recommend for someone whos riding experiance can be counted in hours. A CB250 would be more suitable.

[Paul in NZ]

Um - it depends.... The 350 was by far a better bike than the 450 with its quirky valve gear. You can make a 450 really fly and they will handle if the frame is braced and decent suspension supplied BUT they are a lot taller and stock handle like a wheelbarrow... Those early CB brakes were not up to much either...

The 350 is way more common as well so presumably better supported parts wise.

Frankly - to learn on a later twin from the Jap makers would be easier and a lot cheaper to ride. CB's are all 'collectable' now and going for stupid money.

If you simply MUST have a classic honda the CB400F (the 4) is a brill bike still.

[Paul in NZ]

Probably slow by todays standards, they gave the 650 Triumphs a good run for their money back in the day. They rev to 10k, not to bad for an old twin, and had a distinctive howl. You could lift the front wheel in the lower gears if you tried. Front brake was drum, if I rember rightly, and handling was pretty average. Not what I'd recommend for someone whos riding experiance can be counted in hours. A CB250 would be more suitable.

Only the early ones (black bombers etc) had drums. Most 450's you find here are the later K series with the horrid disk with floating caliper.... A decent 650 twin will still clean one up in every dept except oil leaks and reliability...

[avgas]

Not what I'd recommend for someone whos riding experiance can be counted in hours. A CB250 would be more suitable.
What he said.
Basic rule I use is do a minimum 50 hours on something then you can add 10hp.

If you want classic style get a CB/GB250 or put another 100 hours on the C90 and get a GB400.

[SMOKEU]

If you want classic style get a CB/GB250 or put another 100 hours on the C90 and get a GB400.

A GB400 isn't exactly what I'd call quick. A decent 4 cylinder 250 will kill one in terms of straight line acceleration.

[GrayWolf]

A GB400 isn't exactly what I'd call quick. A decent 4 cylinder 250 will kill one in terms of straight line acceleration.

Ignore advice like this, period. Buy the bike YOU want, for the reason YOU want it. The GB 400/500 is a good wee bike. Doesnt rev to 20k, has good road manners and if well maintained will OUTLAST any 4cyl 250.


Um - it depends.... The 350 was by far a better bike than the 450 with its quirky valve gear. You can make a 450 really fly and they will handle if the frame is braced and decent suspension supplied BUT they are a lot taller and stock handle like a wheelbarrow... Those early CB brakes were not up to much either...

They were also released as a 500 in Europe. The 'torsion bar' valve gear is/was a bit suspect. It was supposed to have been improved during the model's life. The odd one I've seen in tardme, has fetched quite high prices, but it is a 'classic' now.

The 350 is way more common as well so presumably better supported parts wise.

Frankly - to learn on a later twin from the Jap makers would be easier and a lot cheaper to ride. CB's are all 'collectable' now and going for stupid money.

If you simply MUST have a classic honda the CB400F (the 4) is a brill bike still.

I would also add the CB350/4 to that suggestion, not as pretty but basically the same motor. A good nick CB400/450 twin is not to be 'sneezed' at really. They were a little quicker than the RD/GT/KH 250's of the late 70's.

[avgas]

A GB400 isn't exactly what I'd call quick. A decent 4 cylinder 250 will kill one in terms of straight line acceleration.
@150kph is quick enough to kill someone. Also you might want to check the hp of a gb400.

GB400 = 30hp
CBR250 = 23hp

Supposedly it had twice the torque (BS i say). Good thing they had shit forks, only 5 gears, crap tires, and saggy shocks.........

But regardless I have seen people "step up" to a GB400 only to end up on their arse because they are not used to short sharp power delivery range on skinny tires. Same with people who "step up" into a 400 dirt bike after spending ages on a 125 smokers.
Twist, slip and slide.
Its funny to watch.

[HenryDorsetCase]

If you simply MUST have a classic honda the CB400F (the 4) is a brill bike still.

buy one from David Silver: He's doing a "batch resto" of 50 to get a mini production line, savings on stuff like paint and powdercoat etc.

www.davidsilverspares.co.uk

on their farcebook page too.

[Paul in NZ]

Avoid the CB500 (last version of the 450 twin as its horrid - the 500/4 is very good)

All the old hondas run the cam directly in the head. If the oils not been changed then its expensive to repair

[Edbear]

Welcome to KB where everyone has a valid opinion! ;)

Your market is wide open and classics can be very good value. You've got also the Suzuki 400's in twins and fours and the 450 twins, all of which are bullet-proof.

More modern would be the GSX500 twin, a great all-rounder and utterly reliable and can be either fairing or naked. My second bike was a '73 Suzuki T500 two smoker and it was a fabulous bike in its day!

If you want sports you could try to find an RF400 Suzuki but most people tend to hang on to them. The 350 Goose is also a great bike!

So many bikes, so little time! :(

[SMOKEU]

@150kph is quick enough to kill someone. Also you might want to check the hp of a gb400.

GB400 = 30hp
CBR250 = 23hp



The 4 cylinder CBR250 is around 40 - 45bhp. As for the dangers, plenty of people get pwned on push bikes.

[ducatilover]

All the old hondas run the cam directly in the head. If the oils not been changed then its expensive to repair
YOu'd want to machine the journals out to run needle bearings, yes? I was considering that for the 250/300, but I got a new head :2thumbsup

[Paul in NZ]

YOu'd want to machine the journals out to run needle bearings, yes? I was considering that for the 250/300, but I got a new head :2thumbsup

Not always that easy. Needs to be line bored often through the side of the head and cam bearings are below the surface.

[ducatilover]

Not always that easy. Needs to be line bored often through the side of the head and cam bearings are below the surface.
Sand paper and high hopes then? :lol:

[chinny]

Thanks for the feedback - appreciate the advice.
i'm leaning towards missing out on the CB450 and looking for a smaller bike. Coolz made a good point and i don't exactly rate my skills highly (for now). Unfortunately old hondas are a bit rare and expensive. So i may be waiting a while.
I know someone with a GB400 - probably comparable in size and weight. Might be able to use it to get a feel for what i'd be in for.

Who are the old school honda guys around here?

[GrayWolf]

Thanks for the feedback - appreciate the advice.
i'm leaning towards missing out on the CB450 and looking for a smaller bike. Coolz made a good point and i don't exactly rate my skills highly (for now). Unfortunately old hondas are a bit rare and expensive. So i may be waiting a while.
I know someone with a GB400 - probably comparable in size and weight. Might be able to use it to get a feel for what i'd be in for.

Who are the old school honda guys around here?

getting dear but the old (early 70's) K series 350 twins are pretty good, apart from the mentioned cam possible issues. The CB360J was ok (ish).. the 350/400 4's are good wee bikes and I've seen the odd 350 pop up on here at a reasonable price. CB400/450? again if well maintained they'll give good service, but so will any of the 400cc twins of that era, so dont look past the GSX400/450 or kwacka KZ400/2 or the J400/4.. as said even either version of the XS 400... just dont expect them to out flog a 'modern' sprot 240/4...

[gammaguy]

Not always that easy. Needs to be line bored often through the side of the head and cam bearings are below the surface.

used to do those all the time in my workshop

we machined them out and fitted brass bushes

oil holes in the bushes and presto a replaceable plain bearing.

[dangerous]

Thanks for the feedback - appreciate the advice.
i'm leaning towards missing out on the CB450 and looking for a smaller bike. Coolz made a good point and i don't exactly rate my skills highly (for now). Unfortunately old hondas are a bit rare and expensive. So i may be waiting a while.
I know someone with a GB400 - probably comparable in size and weight. Might be able to use it to get a feel for what i'd be in for.

Who are the old school honda guys around here?

hehe... bloody hell people...
Ok chinny, you like the old CB then I expect you will have the resepct for it, go for it how cool is that? learn on a CB450 or GB dont mater in my book its a beter choice than a GN.

I wasnt riding in the 70's so cant claim to know a hole lot on the 450 twin othere than it was the odd ball being the only engine with DOHC correct me if I am wrong.
He who said they powered whellie Id like to see that done by accedent a learner will have to be rather dumb to atempt that, same as if a GB was to put ya on your arse, the rider again would have to do something dumb, these bikes would be a lot more forgiving than the GN or cbr.

[Coolz]

A quick calculation shows they wouldn't make the lams list anyway.

[chinny]

getting dear but the old (early 70's) K series 350 twins are pretty good, apart from the mentioned cam possible issues. The CB360J was ok (ish).. the 350/400 4's are good wee bikes and I've seen the odd 350 pop up on here at a reasonable price. CB400/450? again if well maintained they'll give good service, but so will any of the 400cc twins of that era, so dont look past the GSX400/450 or kwacka KZ400/2 or the J400/4.. as said even either version of the XS 400... just dont expect them to out flog a 'modern' sprot 240/4...

I heard the 4's were a bit less reliable/figitty as you essentially have another set of carbs etc to tune?
Yea theres a couple of 350 2's on TM at the mo, but still asking more than i think is reasonable.
Thanks for the info, but i think i'll look at smaller bikes as i expect the CB450 would catch me out. I've had a couple shaky moments on the S90, and i would expect a 450 to do be less forgiving.

Appreciate the encouragement to give it a shot, but safety should always be top of the list.

Coolz - the CB450 is listed on the LAMS list. Even the 550 is LAMS approved.

btw - on the S90 i accidentally managed to get the front wheel off the ground...Was having trouble with the idle speed and stalled it a couple of times prior. So on that occasion gave it heaps of revs and let the clutch out too quick..
I dread to think what a 450 would do.

A quick comparison of weights :
S90 ~ 90kg
CB450 ~ 180kg i.e. 2x the weight.

People have dropped lighter bikes, so chances of dropping the CB450 appear high considering my size.
Looks like i'll be searching TM for a while to come...

[Akzle]

Hi all,

Wondering if an old '70s honda cb450 would be suitable to learn on?

yes.
do enjoy.

[ducatilover]

I've had heavier bikes and I'm a sub-60kg wimp.

If I was starting out on a wicked looking classic like that, I'd be hunting for a CB400/4.
Absolutely beautiful bikes.

Don't worry so much about the weight, 180kg isn't heavy and with a low seat height it's not an issue.
Power most certainly isn't an issue either, they're all pretty...beige in terms of top end power. Infact, most things that are LAMS legal are a bit beige

Find one, buy one.
Hell, I started out on a GPZ400R and didn't die

[GrayWolf]

I heard the 4's were a bit less reliable/figitty as you essentially have another set of carbs etc to tune?
Yea theres a couple of 350 2's on TM at the mo, but still asking more than i think is reasonable.
Thanks for the info, but i think i'll look at smaller bikes as i expect the CB450 would catch me out. I've had a couple shaky moments on the S90, and i would expect a 450 to do be less forgiving.

Appreciate the encouragement to give it a shot, but safety should always be top of the list.

Coolz - the CB450 is listed on the LAMS list. Even the 550 is LAMS approved.

btw - on the S90 i accidentally managed to get the front wheel off the ground...Was having trouble with the idle speed and stalled it a couple of times prior. So on that occasion gave it heaps of revs and let the clutch out too quick..
I dread to think what a 450 would do.

A quick comparison of weights :
S90 ~ 90kg
CB450 ~ 180kg i.e. 2x the weight.

People have dropped lighter bikes, so chances of dropping the CB450 appear high considering my size.
Looks like i'll be searching TM for a while to come...

Dont confuse the two CB450's around.
There was the early 70's one and the later CB400/CB450 based on the 250/400N (superdream) bikes of the mid/late 70's. They are a different kettle of fish to the early 70's twin cam CB450/500 twins.
I understand your careful approach, and laud you for it. As a dumbass Loony Plater from the 70's, the RD,s S1's, GT's etc were the weapon of choice for the discerning :nya: hooligan. The CB400 etc were only very slightly quicker on top end or acceleration, just had better 'grunt' due to the extra 150cc. With the modern basic handling course and I believe a lot of tutors also run a 'now get on the road and ride' basic course.. you'll have more knowledge than we ever did when riding on the road...

We didnt see the 350/4 in England, but the 400/4 'supersports' were abundant. As long as oil changes are/were done regular, (and most that were'nt are long dead) Honda had a reputation of building 'strong' engines.. you can read that as low tuned, or take your preference... but I can assure you I saw many a 400/4 thrashed without mercy day in and out.. passed from hoon to hoon, and they survived the abuse quite outstandingly. Probably the XS400 twin would be the 'least thrashable resistant' of the era, GSX 400/450 are pretty solid.
The 250/350/400 2T's of the day are getting quite pricey, so the 4T 2/4's are a good bargain... I saw Coleman's very recently on tardme out a very nice gsx400 trade in, very cheaply.

[Coolz]

The 450 does make the lams list. My maths are as bad as my memory. It's been 40 years since I rode a CB450, I guess I was more easily impressed back then. It was certainly friskier than the British single I had been riding. Memory is a funny thing... now where did I put that transistor radio?.it must nearly be time for The Goon Show.

[cheshirecat]

Who are the old school honda guys around here?
There's one here. Always wanted a CB450, unique bike in its day. Believe it had a twin leading shoe front brake which were pretty good providing one detuned them in the wet as they grabed a bit. I've had a CB400f which was a bit under whelming until a Yoshi cam was installed and transformed it in to CB500 killer (until the rider also Yoshed it). I think with all classics be prepared to spend some time on them and lumps of unpredictable fustration. Every ride will be an adventure, you'll stand out from the crowd and gain lots of new friends including your local bike mechanic. I helped a friend get a CB500 4 on the road and we never had a dull moment, including Boyles Kawasaki, who figured in much of its ongoing sagas. At one point 24 people (Bikers) were involved getting it back from Carterton after a prang including two policemen (who ensured the bike shop stayed open), and a group of dedicated bikers who insisted in bump starting it UP the Rimutukas. Honda classics won't be expensive to maintain/fix by current Ducati standards, parts will be cheap (detective work will be necessary) and working on them is easy compared to todays watchlike complexity.
Older classics make great restored cafe racers and seem to be a new trend. You'll gain enough adventures to write a book and I still think owning a 70/80's classic is a sort of rite of passage.
Follow your dreams

Good luck

[chinny]

Will try and sit on a similar sized bike to get a feel (GB400). After more research it seems like the CB450 isn't out of my reach or height. Seat height approx 80cm - will have me on my toes, but manageable i think. Thanks for nudge Ducatilover.

Not worried about power for now, i'm sure almost any bike with a clutch will be more than enough. I'm not looking to race around or get my knee down.

Cheshirecat - sounds like you hit the nail on the head regarding old hondas! I've spent few moments stranded on the side of the road with an S90 refusing to start. Had to push it back home a couple of times too (it goes to Bolye's too for fixing). A labour of love type thing by the sounds of it :)
Thanks - will keep looking for that 'right' honda to ride around Mt Taranaki with.

Will post if i end up getting one.

now...back to the Olympics.

[BurningPlastic]

One thing to watch out for with LAMS coming in is the modification/non-standard replacement parts clause - just be careful with older bikes as they're much more likely to have had non-standard parts used simply due to the increasing cost/difficulty of finding useable condition original spares by now.

Given that we don't yet know how rigidly they're going to apply the regs, it's something to keep in mind...

[dangerous]

One thing to watch out for with LAMS coming in is the modification/non-standard replacement parts clause - just be careful with older bikes as they're much more likely to have had non-standard parts used simply due to the increasing cost/difficulty of finding useable condition original spares by now.

Given that we don't yet know how rigidly they're going to apply the regs, it's something to keep in mind...I think you will find that is a non event, unless its turboed, big bored camed carb changed, basicly if it needs to be vined then yes it will void the LAMs.

[ducatilover]

I think you will find that is a non event, unless its turboed, big bored camed carb changed, basicly if it needs to be vined then yes it will void the LAMs.

I'll test this theory then.
I have a big bore/cammed/exhaust and soon to be F/S carbed bike. I'll see if that gets a notice for being LAMS illegal :2thumbsup

[Edbear]

I'll test this theory then.
I have a big bore/cammed/exhaust and soon to be F/S carbed bike. I'll see if that gets a notice for being LAMS illegal :2thumbsup

But so heavily disguised as a dunga it will probably go unnoticed... :whistle:

[ducatilover]

But so heavily disguised as a dunga it will probably go unnoticed... :whistle:

Heavily? ;) It is a dunger mate:banana:

[Bonez]

Personnally if I was on my learners now I'd be going for a GB400(loved the one I had), naked Hyobag 250 or naked GS500. If you reall really want an old and heavy Honda you cant go past a CX500 :). Que- Dangerous- The first Honda with that hard to define "character" the Euro/yank nuts use to rant on about. Well they still do... Having owned a CB550/4 for a few decades I can asure you they are a peice of piss to maintain. No harder than a twin really, just get a a manual and go for it.

[dangerous]

If you reall really want an old and heavy Honda you cant go past a CX500 :). Que- Dangerous- was my 4th bike at about 17, droped it every two weeks trying to turn it around, was also my 6th 7th and 8th bike's... ohhh sorry ya didnt want a life story did ya?

[chinny]

Personnally if I was on my learners now I'd be going for a GB400(loved the one I had), naked Hyobag 250 or naked GS500. If you reall really want an old and heavy Honda you cant go past a CX500 :). Que- Dangerous- The first Honda with that hard to define "character" the Euro/yank nuts use to rant on about. Well they still do... Having owned a CB550/4 for a few decades I can asure you they are a peice of piss to maintain. No harder than a twin really, just get a a manual and go for it.

"Character" - I guess that's one way to describe the plastic maggot :p
Would love a CBxxx/4 if i could find one at a decent price. Looks like everyone wants an old honda nowadays. Might just have to persuade the S90 owner to do a swap or buy him another bike...too bad it doesn't crank past 60mph.

[BMWST?]

cb 450 has heaps more character than cx500 and or cb 500/550 imho.It was THE honda to have before the CB750 came out

[Stylo]

cb 450 has heaps more character than cx500 and or cb 500/550 imho.It was THE honda to have before the CB750 came out

Showing my age here, I had a '72 CB450 when I was 16 - used to ride it to school and show off to the girls with my straight through 2 into one pipe that barked flames out on the over-run due to no back pressure. Great memories though it could never quite stay with my friends T500 Suzuki except in the twisties ...

[Oakie]

A mate of mine had one about 1980. Fell off it running from a cop one evening. Silly boy.

[rastuscat]

You can learn a lot about handling skills on a heavier bike. You have to.

My first was a CB250N. Saw one the other day, memories flooded back. Rode it Orkers to Invergiggle and back. Think I wouldn't do THAT again.

You could do a lot worse than a CB.

[Voltaire]

All my bikes are over 30 years old, If I was learning I get something more modern with electronic ignition and disc brakes that work, that way you can ride with more confidence and maybe do a bit of touring.
My BMW R65 falls into the LAMS bracket, I always saw them as an also ran to the larger ones but I find it a quite good all rounder....sure it has no sheer power but its not bad....and 370 kms on 20 litres.
But hey a 450 would be a bit of fun, I had a 500/4 in the early 80's and I toured the SI 2 up with it....good times....when cars were a loooooot slower.:Punk:

[BRAD BRASCO]

Go ride them! But a GB will be less of a hassle, as they are slightly newer than the CB450s.
More of a package ready to go, but not mega fast. The old CB's may need a fiddle here and there.
Even have a look at an old CB360 - there's been a few on trademe lately.
All nice bikes, your on the right track, I like your style :stoogie:

[GrayWolf]

A few suggestions

but I'll say this again, dont confuse the 'later' CB450's with the original black bomber, or the CB450 of the 1970's... the later bikes based on the 250/400 super dream motors are a different beast. http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/motorbikes/motorbikes/classic-vintage/auction-501141072.htm

OR these

http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/motorbikes/motorbikes/classic-vintage/auction-480055744.htm
http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/motorbikes/motorbikes/classic-vintage/auction-506797664.htm
http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/motorbikes/motorbikes/cruiser/auction-427513151.htm
http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/motorbikes/motorbikes/tourers/auction-506116051.htm
http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/motorbikes/motorbikes/classic-vintage/auction-503372149.htm
http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/motorbikes/motorbikes/cruiser/auction-459107671.htm
http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/motorbikes/motorbikes/sports/auction-505175739.htm

[Sable]

My vote's on a GB400

[Oakie]

The 400/4 (last of those earlier TM ads.) I had one before the Bandit. Good honest bike.

[ktm84mxc]

The only reason you'd want to buy a CB450 as it's Honda's first model with Double over head cams , nice but heavy and handled like a wheelbarrow.
This was the bike featured in the Movie- The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo , that's my kinda CB450 black cut down a real Mods/Cafe racer.

[Bonez]

"Character" - I guess that's one way to describe the plastic maggot :p
Would love a CBxxx/4 if i could find one at a decent price. Looks like everyone wants an old honda nowadays. Might just have to persuade the S90 owner to do a swap or buy him another bike...too bad it doesn't crank past 60mph.The ol jap shitters are still good buying compared with so called "exotic" kit bar R series Bemmers. I have a luv hate relationship with my CX which is quite hard to explain. If the bloody thing died on the side of the road tomorrow I wouldn't have any problem tossing it in a ditch. Damn thing will still find its way home though dammit.

[BMWST?]

The only reason you'd want to buy a CB450 as it's Honda's first model with Double over head cams , nice but heavy and handled like a wheelbarrow.
This was the bike featured in the Movie- The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo , that's my kinda CB450 black cut down a real Mods/Cafe racer.

i think that was a cb350... but yes the cb450 dohc and torsion bar valve springs my brother had one

268734

[chinny]

A few suggestions

but I'll say this again, dont confuse the 'later' CB450's with the original black bomber, or the CB450 of the 1970's... the later bikes based on the 250/400 super dream motors are a different beast. http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/motorbikes/motorbikes/classic-vintage/auction-501141072.htm

OR these

http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/motorbikes/motorbikes/classic-vintage/auction-480055744.htm
http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/motorbikes/motorbikes/classic-vintage/auction-506797664.htm
http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/motorbikes/motorbikes/cruiser/auction-427513151.htm
http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/motorbikes/motorbikes/tourers/auction-506116051.htm
http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/motorbikes/motorbikes/classic-vintage/auction-503372149.htm
http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/motorbikes/motorbikes/cruiser/auction-459107671.htm
http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/motorbikes/motorbikes/sports/auction-505175739.htm

Yea i gotcha - i was talking about all early 70's or earlier hondas.
If anyone's interested, the Cb450 i was considering was this one:
http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=500507039
I thought the sell price was cheap (3510) considering the work done on it. Only this that didn't look so original was the handlebars.
Didn't feel it was right for me though.
Might have to get something else in the meantime to ease my urge to ride :sweatdrop
Probably something cheap that i wouldn't mind ruining by riding in the rain.

[GrayWolf]

Yea i gotcha - i was talking about all early 70's or earlier hondas.
If anyone's interested, the Cb450 i was considering was this one:
http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=500507039
I thought the sell price was cheap (3510) considering the work done on it. Only this that didn't look so original was the handlebars.
Didn't feel it was right for me though.
Might have to get something else in the meantime to ease my urge to ride :sweatdrop
Probably something cheap that i wouldn't mind ruining by riding in the rain.

Seriously, I would go for the 450 nighthawk, they are not a bad machine.